Shrink not working in dungeons.

[ergo]

Every single zone classified as a dungeon should allow shrink to work.

Unrest
Mistmoore
Cazic Thule

to name a few. I have tried it and the spell fails in the places it is needed most.

I mean check Mistmoore any group with a large race would be required to stay outside. There are zero places inside the castle where a large race could stand up without shrink. You can't cast or attack ducking. Or you do honestly think the devs designed places to prevent Barbs,Trolls, and Ogres from going? Don't be silly. It makes zero sense.

Indoor/outdoor is a druid distinction for wolf form and lightning iirc, not a shaman shrink.

The ability to cast sow/wolf form requires the distinction, but shrink was designed for larger races to move around in tight spaces.


Please fix this for large races.

[ergo]

I am aware of how it works in p1999 and I am telling you it is wrong. Anyone that played a shaman pre-kunark would know this.

[evilkorn]

You can't make bug reports on what you think is true. Find a post that says my shaman shrunk everyone and we had a jolly romp through Castle Mistmoore, then make a bug report.

[Daldaen]

You can't make bug reports on what you think is true. Find a post that says my shaman shrunk everyone and we had a jolly romp through Castle Mistmoore, then make a bug report.

Well you can but they will not get the Devs to change anything until you provide posts.

I have quite a few posts where I remember how the mechanics worked but I can't find any quotes so they are in limbo until I can find evidence.

[Daldaen]

EQShaman Crucible 2000 (https://web.archive.org/web/20010215005640/http://www.eqforge.com/shaman/spells/level_19.htm)

Shrink

Reduces physical size. Cast in dungeons only. Note: On large races, this can be cast twice for greater effect.

Unfortunately it fails to elaborate on what "Dungeon" means.

[Daldaen]

EQCaster's Realm 2000 (https://web.archive.org/web/20011125032154/http://eq.castersrealm.com/spells/spelldescriptions.asp?Id=1111)

BLACKBURROW, By Warudin (1/28/2001)

This spell does work in blackburrow. I saw a barb shaman shrink himself yesterday, Oct 27, 2000. He also charmed the grizzly that goes through the zone and srank it. It was funny seeing him run around slaughtering stuff.
P.S. I am pretty positive that he was not useing a shrink potion

CRUSHBONE WORKED 4 ME, By Hotfox (1/28/2001)

I shrank all kinds of people in Crushbone. I had a blast with an Ogre friend of mine. It also worked in Blackburrow. I'm just trying to see where else it has worked. It won't work for me in Highkeep.

It's strange that this spell works (I have not tested this myself) in Clan Crush Bone or The Lost Temple of Cazic-Thule. If these have a dungeon flag, and won't allow binds but do allow shrinks, it's strange that Spirit of Wolf can be cast here (SoW works in the aforementioned zones). I may, however, see the logic. The sky is visible in both of these zones, correct? I'm pretty sure it is. It seems you can summon the Spirit of the Wolf in any zone where a sky is visible, regardless of the bind / shrink flag. As a side note, Shrink potions (Ant's Potion, trivial at 70 skill and requiring level 38 to trivialize, costing about 10pp to make) work outdoors, unlike this spell.

[Man0warr]

Pretty sure Shrink should work on any zone classified as a dungeon, even if it's also classified as outdoors. Dungeon doesn't mean indoors.

[Daldaen]

Pretty sure Shrink should work on any zone classified as a dungeon, even if it's also classified as outdoors. Dungeon doesn't mean indoors.

You being pretty sure is irrelevant.

I do have 3 quotes saying it was doable in some outdoor dungeons (Blackburrow, Crushbone and CazicThule).

It's up to the devs if they want to take that + the quote about being dungeon usable, to make the change to make it work in all outdoor flagged dungeons (KC, Mistmoore, Unrest, Cazic-Thule, Blackburrow, Crushbone... Think that's it?)

[Ele]

http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6418
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8126
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8776
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14090

[Man0warr]

Several of those posts have screenshots from classic Live of shrunken players in Outdoor Dungeons (Karnors, High Keep, Crushbone, etc), seems like enough evidence to me.

[Wrench]

shrink pots work everywhere so unfortunately its not

[Darkatar]

BLACKBURROW, By Warudin (1/28/2001)

This spell does work in blackburrow. I saw a barb shaman shrink himself yesterday, Oct 27, 2000. He also charmed the grizzly that goes through the zone and srank it. It was funny seeing him run around slaughtering stuff.
P.S. I am pretty positive that he was not useing a shrink potion

If he shrank his pet, isn't that proof that it was not a potion?

[ergo]

EQShaman Crucible 2000 (https://web.archive.org/web/20010215005640/http://www.eqforge.com/shaman/spells/level_19.htm)



Unfortunately it fails to elaborate on what "Dungeon" means.

I think common sense should tell anyone what a dungeons is. We all know the dungeon zones in Class/Kunark.

[Ele]

I was looking for something else and ran across this in an old spell parser documentation.

Eqcaster.com Same comment in the documentation in 2000 and 2001

https://web.archive.org/web/20010613163807/http://www.eqcaster.com/docs.htm

Indoor - Two types of spells are indicated here.

Indoor - Spells like 'Shrink' require that the user cast it in an indoor dungeon
Outdoor - Spells like 'Spirit of the Wolf' require the caster to be in an outside zone.

Found Velious 12/08/2000 Spdat.eff file here (https://web.archive.org/web/20030917235503/http://www.gch.com.tw/news/newsline.php?ch=news&cat=net&id=976503814): https://web.archive.org/web/20030917235503/http://www.gch.com.tw/news/newsline.php?ch=news&cat=net&id=976503814

Shrink is limited to indoor zones in the spell data, doesn't distinguish between dungeon and non-dungeon.

[Ele]

Could shrink in Butcherblock thorugh Classic->early-Kunark though? Doesn't make sense in light of comment from EQcaster.com since you could SoW in Butcher. Or maybe it didn't originally have the restriction?

https://web.archive.org/web/20010601034145/http://pub9.ezboard.com/fthespiritpouchrants.showMessage?topicID=2.topic

except for butcherblock. You can shrink there (oh, like THATS useful)

-huh?-

Yup, Apparently Butcherblock is considered and Indoor dungeon...comeplete with boat, ocean and all

[ergo]

Ele, the ability to sow has no baring on shrink working or not. They were never tied together at all. If shrink worked in Butcher, nobody cared/knew/mattered because the only places large races need to shrink to PLAY the game is dungeons.

[Man0warr]

Indoor/Outdoor has no bearing on if it's a dungeon or not.

Do you consider Mistmoore a dungeon? Because it's clearly outdoors. You should be able to both SoW and shrink there - they aren't mutually exclusive.

[Ele]

How do you guys explain away the indoor flag on Shrink?

Are zones capable of being flagged indoor and outdoor at the same time? Is there a hidden "dungeon" flag not displayed in the spell parse which overrides the outdoor flag?


March 21, 2000 Spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/ViOk8L2.png

September 19, 2000 spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/0IHAPOgh.png

April 4, 2001 spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/jzaxO72h.png




The Butcherblock thing is a one of anecdote, which I found amusing and copied here.

[ergo]

How do you guys explain away the indoor flag on Shrink?

Are zones capable of being flagged indoor and outdoor at the same time? Is there a hidden "dungeon" flag not displayed in the spell parse which overrides the outdoor flag?


March 21, 2000 Spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/ViOk8L2.png

September 19, 2000 spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/0IHAPOgh.png

April 4, 2001 spdat.eff

http://i.imgur.com/jzaxO72h.png




The Butcherblock thing is a one of anecdote, which I found amusing and copied here.


I dont know the coding of how the zones were distinguished, but I do know shrink worked in Unrest, MM, CT, CoM etc. How it was done by VI or coded is irrelevant vs the spell file because they did it.

Zonefiles, like most muds likely have flags you can turn on and off.

It would be better to have shrink work in every single zone if the devs of p99 cant figure it out than to have it not work in the places the spell was designed for.

[ergo]

Shameless bump

[shamanredux]

Shrink did not work in CT/HHK until later on. I'm not sure when, but they changed the flag on multiple zones to be indoor and outdoor. This allowed both SoW and shrink to be cast.

[ergo]

I assure you it worked at least in CT, MM, Unrest before Kunark. I dunno about highpass...

I simply do not believe that the zones where shrink was literally needed for ogres/trolls/barbs to move around would simply not work in those places with the worst trains etc.

Fattys that DIDN'T get shrunk and blocked zones were moved by GMs and guides. Potions were not required.

I did this as a guide several times pre kunark. CT was a common place for fatties to stand and mess with people trying to not die. We moved them (/summon player), shrank them(click bracers!) and gave people warnings if they failed to comply.

Just sayin. Shrink worked in unrest back when ghoul root would override sow. Yeah, that long ago...

[Brut]

Worked live, had shm, lost lvl19 one day pre-kunark and was all sorts of sadface since couldn't shrink myself in Crushbone after that.

People didn't care to cast it too much / type about it on websites enough for it to be common knowledge so you could dig up enough evidence to prove it today. It was one of those obvious things at the time that dungeon = shrink. So basically p99 bug forums have argued about this since 2010 with people going back and forth with the goof mantra "if u can sow in zone then u cant shrink cuz indoors and outdoors".

It has nothing to do with indoors and outdoors. It's about dungeons. Blackburrow is a dungeon. Crushbone is a dungeon. You could shrink in both 100%.

[Daldaen]

This begs to question. Are there indoor zones not flagged as dungeons where shrink does not work?

Like... Kael or Neriak which are cities. I know Kael you could shrink because corner tanking hinged on your ability to shrink.

[ergo]

Shameless bump again, please fix shrink.

[Arteker]

in my case my first shrink , was in mistmore in kunark , a iksar shaman there wich i partnered hard with , always shrink me because i used to get stuck alot in walls .and later on i remember, our war main tank shrinking pets with his cobalt bracer for shaman epic fights( unlike here, we used 5 magician pets for the fight due to fire pet prety much resisting the aoe).all this while kunark,expansion.

[ergo]

Still needs to be fixed. Not working as classic or even post classic. Just broke.

[Nirgon]

I reckons things like "town" and "dungeon" were also used to flag zones for default xp modifiers. Whether outdoor or indoor, something could be flagged as "dungeon" so that was a thing.

Highkeep was flagged as both, so it got a big double dip on xp mod.

[Taunto]

RE: I dont think so!
Quote
Reply
#Aug 19 2002 at 3:55 PMRating: Excellent
The One and Only overkongen
Scholar
42 posts
CT is considered a dungeon, even if its an outdoor zone. Thats why you can can sow and shrink in it. Try going to WC and cast shrink there - thats a nogo!

EDIT: Although it possible now, after VI's latest nerf on shrink. :)

Edited, Thu Oct 3 12:54:38 2002

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=898&p=1#m102978979373372

Thank you for your service to my bracer Nirgon.

This post is old, but maybe not old enough? There's another post the says it works anywhere outdoors later 2003 ish.

[Taunto]

feb 2001 shaman spell database entry for shrink, says works in dungeons

http://i.imgur.com/Vs2HTyo.png

http://web.archive.org/web/20010215005640/http://www.eqforge.com/shaman/spells/level_19.htm

[Taunto]

found spell comments from caster's realm, jackpot:

SPELL COMMENTS
BLACKBURROW, By Warudin (1/28/2001)

This spell does work in blackburrow. I saw a barb shaman shrink himself yesterday, Oct 27, 2000. He also charmed the grizzly that goes through the zone and srank it. It was funny seeing him run around slaughtering stuff.
P.S. I am pretty positive that he was not useing a shrink potion

FUNNY SPELL FOR FUN TIMES!, By Koldar of povar (1/28/2001)

This spell is great, when I went to a wedding in the temple of ro me and 3 shammy buddies where shrinking all the orges and trolls in the front so we could see, they were smaller then the gnomes there and the imps, and yes you do have to be grouped with the person you cast it on.
CRUSHBONE WORKED 4 ME, By Hotfox (1/28/2001)

I shrank all kinds of people in Crushbone. I had a blast with an Ogre friend of mine. It also worked in Blackburrow. I'm just trying to see where else it has worked. It won't work for me in Highkeep.
AYE, FOR CRUSHBONE, By Ssidney (1/28/2001)

It does work in crush bone, I once remember an ogre shammy that destroyed CB all by himself, as a little gnomish looking ogre..hehe very very amusing.
BLACKBURROW, By Garudan (1/28/2001)

Maybe this has been changed recently, but last time I checked this spell worked in Blackburrow - me and my ogre shaman buddy ran around taking down da trains as mini-shamen. As mentioned below, quite a sight. =)

http://web.archive.org/web/20011125032154/http://eq.castersrealm.com/spells/spelldescriptions.asp?Id=1111

LOOKING FORWARD TO THIS CHANGE M8S

[Taunto]

More comments:

CRUSHBONE, By Ugluk (1/28/2001)

Nope, doesnt work in Crushbone...
OTHER ZONES...., By Xunatos runeblaster (1/28/2001)

I have had a shaman cast this on me in Butcherblock. Yep, it worked.... funny thing is, Butcherblock can in no way be mistaken as any sort of dungeon. Just my two cents hehe.
, By Chumly (1/28/2001)

Yeah shrink works in Paw
ANOTHER NOTE ON A FUN THING TO DO..., By Rorgg (1/28/2001)

You can actually shrink pets with this. Yes, this includes charmed mobs. We've taken control of lizards in CT, then shrunk them twice to make mini-lizzies. Very amusing. And the dungeon label is weird. It works I know in CT, Permafrost, Unrest, Runnyeye, the Sols, Najena, and Guk. It should work in Mistmoore and Paw (haven't tried it). It does NOT work in Blackburrow, and I'm unsure about Crushbone. Any more data here would be helpful. --Rorgg 21st Mojo Shaman Bertoxx
DUNGEONS, By Staryx (1/28/2001)

The term dungeon is very iffy. Some places such as Unrest aren't really dungeons, but the spell can be cast there. I believe Crushbone is also one of these "dungeons".

http://web.archive.org/web/20020119160448/http://eq.castersrealm.com/spells/spelldescriptions.asp?Id=1111&Page=2

consensus seems to be yes to outdoor dungeons, and possibly no to highkeep (highkeep is wierd though, half dungeon half city as nirgon said).

[Taunto]

sorry if some of this was already posted... derp...

[ergo]

Dont worry about it Taunto, some of us really want it fixed.

[evilkorn]

http://www.eternal-flame.org/album/albumpage.php?pic=unrest2.jpg&path=eq/5/&caption=Here%2C+a+normal+sized+person+runs+through +the+group+of+tiny+EFs.

Shrink working in Unrest, not sure if this is how it works now but adds credibility to the dungeon shrink theme.

[ergo]

I want my shrink working like it should.

[ergo]

Shameless bump.

[ergo]

Please do the needful so shrink works as intended.

[Grimjaw]

Found Velious 12/08/2000 Spdat.eff file here (https://web.archive.org/web/20030917235503/http://www.gch.com.tw/news/newsline.php?ch=news&cat=net&id=976503814): https://web.archive.org/web/20030917235503/http://www.gch.com.tw/news/newsline.php?ch=news&cat=net&id=976503814

wow nice link!

I took it one further and found this:

https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.everquest.com.tw/download/patch/*

[Ele]

wow nice link!

I took it one further and found this:

https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.everquest.com.tw/download/patch/*

Epic

[ergo]

How much does this need evidence wise before the admins reply and say they are going to fix it?

[Grimjaw]

my guess is that someone has already started looking into the case, and they are probably trying to figure out the best way to implement the "Dungeon" flag. Since it seems to be a different flag than the indoor/outdoor flag.

[Luniz]

http://www.eternal-flame.org/album/albumpage.php?pic=unrest2.jpg&path=eq/5/&caption=Here%2C+a+normal+sized+person+runs+through +the+group+of+tiny+EFs.

Shrink working in Unrest, not sure if this is how it works now but adds credibility to the dungeon shrink theme.

http://www.eternal-flame.org/album/eq/5/unrest2.jpg

[Daldaen]

God that UI was so incredible.

[ergo]

Please do the needful~

[Daldaen]

If they can implement a Kunark dungeon flag for Kunark Evacs, I'm guessing a dungeon flag for shrink would be doable.

Would be nice to get a full list of dungeons that have an outdoor flag where this should work.

[Kowalski]

Just buy some Ant's potions and keep shamans in business. They have starving children at home.

[ergo]

Just buy some Ant's potions and keep shamans in business. They have starving children at home.

Or they could fix a known bug so that shamans with shrink can use the spell as it was designed.

[Darkatar]

Just buy some Ant's potions and keep shamans in business. They have starving children at home.

Pets don't drink potions.

[digush]

Which expansion was it that brought about shrink potions?