Is EverQuest Next just another Duke Nukem Forever?

[Lagaidh]

EQN is really beginning to feel familiar to this ol' game vet.

It'll release; twelve years past relevancy.

I never understand it when an entity has a product, for which customers hopefully wait and clamor, that the entity simply cannot seem to guide to market. It must be frustrating to the teams working on the product. (Rhetorical. I understand, it drives me insane and drove me from programming as a profession...)

Reminds me of watching a world-champion boxer who turns 38, sees the opportunity to deck his opponent in round 1, but can't pull the trigger. The brain said do it, the body stayed where it was.

There is a bright silver lining in this grumpy overture: Project 1999. Look where I get to wax derpy over video games: Project 1999 forum.

Reach into your PayPal accounts folks. You'd be surprised how little you notice it if you set up a monthly payment.

P.S. - Wouldn't it have been really, really weird to see an online community step in and resurrect a franchise like Duke Nukem?

P.S.S. - "Duke Nukem" is phonetically ugly to me.

P.S.S.S. - "Dilapidated Elephant Pickle" is phonetically hilarious to me.

P.S^4 - I'm surprised to be writing this much sober.

[rayeatts]

Didn't they cancel it completely? I thought that's what I read.

[Spyder73]

https://www.landmarkthegame.com/news/landmark-everquest-next-eqn-producer-letter-june-2015

Producer's Letter: June 2015
06/05/2015
Tweet
Greetings!

I wanted to take a few minutes (and words!) to recap what’s happened over the past few weeks and give everyone an update on what to expect moving forward!

So, what’s been going on with team? The month of May was pretty much all about the big character and claim wipe, and then fixing issues that were introduced or discovered immediately afterward. Things have mostly settled down and the team is hot on the heels of the remaining high priority bugs. As soon as we get them fixed, we’ll get them out as soon as we can.

As the team has wrapped up the various pieces related to the wipe and the bugs associated with it, we have been shifting our focus and resources over to work on the highest priority tasks and systems that will be used in EverQuest Next. While we do this, we’re working in areas with high amounts of creative risk. This means that while we know what we want to do, we know it will take an unknown amount of iteration, tweaking and sometimes drastic direction changes to get these in game and working the way they need to. Because of this, we simply cannot commit to any dates, because until we get much closer, even our best estimates are educated (but still fairly wild) guesses.

This also does mean that any features that are Landmark-only are lower in priority and will have to wait until we have time to come back to them. So, as we shift our focus and development to EQN, it just doesn’t make sense to continue with the Blueprint, since the goal of that has always been to provide short term, concrete plans of what you could expect and when, and that isn’t something we can reliably estimate at this point. When we have a better idea of timing on the various pieces, we will make sure to let everyone know.

This does *not* mean that the team isn’t hard at work on things that will eventually make it into your hands. We *absolutely* are! Essentially, as we develop tasks and systems that are in a state fit for Landmark, we will get them into the game with an update. We still want and need your feedback on what we’re making in order to make sure both Landmark and EverQuest Next are as amazing as we all want them to be. You can fully expect updates and hotfixes to Landmark as we continue with this development process; they are simply going to be on a less regular schedule than you guys have been accustomed to over the past year or so.

Landmark and the player community are very important to us and will continue to be essential in the development of EverQuest Next, exactly as we’ve promised from the very beginning. In fact, here’s a quick peek at how we’re using some of the amazing creations you all have made as we build EverQuest Next.

Qeynos Preview

This is only the first small glimpse of what’s to come and I look forward to seeing how everything comes together as EverQuest Next continues to take shape over the rest of the year and beyond. Also, before anyone asks, I want to clarify that although we are shifting our primary focus to EverQuest Next, this does not mean the game will be coming out this year.

We WILL be continuing with the Workshops, so keep an eye out for those! And when we have a bigger update, we’ll also schedule a Landmark Live to get together and chat like we have in the past! More fun times are definitely ahead!

Whenever we have information to share, we’ll continue to keep everyone up to date on the forums, twitter, reddit, Facebook and any of the other usual means of communication. Make sure to check in regularly to find out what’s going on with the games and with the entire team (both the employees AND the community)!

Terry “Fairan” Michaels
Senior Producer – Landmark and EverQuest Next

[Gilder]

Comparing it to Duke Nukem is pretty spot on. I was once excited for EQ Next to the point I would regularly check for news updates.

Now I don't even care anymore.

[dafier]

Now I don't even care anymore.

^^^

[Troxx]

Now I don't even care anymore.

Verant/Sony's biggest mistake was putting their primary game on the backburner and wasting resources on everquest spin-offs. Part of the reason EQ live sucked so much in it's later years was that they barely put any effort into the game ... and the players noticed it.

EQ2?

EQ next?

Fuck it.

[Rararboker]

I was excited for EQN once. It also had a brief mention of how EQ was f2p so I went to get my old account. Played for a few weeks but it felt off. Then a friend found p99 and showed it to me. Now I don't care about EQN. Long live p99!

[Charlievox]

EQNext is sounding more and more like EQNever

[redhorse]

EQNext is like a reincarnation of Vanguard. Vanguard was supposed to be the new EQ1 in spirit. The fact that Vanguard shut down before EQNext even got off the ground seems telling of its future.

EQ2 was and is a good game. It just unfortunately dropped like 6 months before WoW launched. And then instead of trying to do EQ better, it just kept trying to copy WoW.

[Valerik]

Put your faith in Pantheon (https://www.pantheonmmo.com/).

[redhorse]

This was my desktop background for like 3 years. Remembering those times still depresses me. So much hope for the future, crushed under the realization of the disappointing reality. Kind of like Obama.

6812

[thufir]

EQNext is like a reincarnation of Vanguard. Vanguard was supposed to be the new EQ1 in spirit. The fact that Vanguard shut down before EQNext even got off the ground seems telling of its future.

I loved Vanguard, actually. I got into it later, after it became playable. There were a lot of bugs but all the workarounds were well-known by the time I got into it. It was really a fantastic game; if there's ever a VGemu I'm off to that, baby.

It did release way too early and was basically unplayable when it was. Bad decision, that.

[Ennewi]

EQNext is sounding more and more like EQNever

EQNixed

[Issar]

From my point of view, it appears that Daybreak has the same communication issues that SOE had. In a time where community management (through site forums, social media, and whatever other outlet) really matters to the gaming community as a whole, they have stifled their managers. This has resulted into a fair amount of backlash from would be fans. Every six months, SOE/DB throws a shout out to say "hi guys, we're working on it." This also includes SOE Live, where they reveal some grandiose plans and a few screen shots. We keep expecting to hear more, but never do. This seems to infuriate some of the fan base, and others just forget about it and become indifferent.

I don't know if it was an attempt to save money on staffing, prevent leaks or what, but instead of being even remotely open to communication about Next, SOE banked on Landmark to satiate the fans. This works, but only for a small percentage of fans. I think there are a lot of people who have little to no interest in making buildings. The majority of EQ fans are RPG/MMORPG players, who are way more into building characters than walls. The builders were playing Sim City when the RPG fans were playing EQ. So, the would be Next fans are left with nothing. Dave Georgeson stated that by playing Landmark, we were essentially playing Next. Though, Landmark has virtually two percent of the features promised for Next. Landmark's vast choice of races includes humans, /end list. Landmark's gear comes in a whopping 4 sets, three of which do not fit in high fantasy in any way. Half of the player designed buildings in Next are far from lore appropriate. Simply put, there's no EQ in Landmark.

The reality is that little or no Next gameplay information is ever provided through the Landmark channels. There is no Next channel for communication. The official EQN site is dominated by Landmark. And Daybreak has canceled SOE Live, so what information was provided from the event has been cut off. In the eyes of the MMORPG community, Next has essentially ceased to exist. Regardless of reality, that is the perception. As the saying goes, "perception is reality." You can look no farther than the earlier posts in this forum and see the truth in that saying.

I don't know if Day Break is just trying to be secretive and hope to deliver a huge reveal at some point, expecting to bring in all the fans or not. If that's the case, it's the wrong approach. Gone are the days for such a tactic. It's nearly 2016, twitter, fansites, Facebook, and more social media tools are visited by the billions. They are quite simply the best form of advertising for this market, period. By withholding information, they lessen their momentum and quite possibly lessen their fan base. If they utilized their tools in social media and delivered cookie crumbs on a regular basis, they would pick up new fans rather than dropping old ones. It only takes a trickle to start a torrent in social media.

If you contrast Day Break's methods with the likes of City State and Mark Jacobs, it's easy to see the variance. City State, by constantly communicating through various channels, keeps their fans interested, draws in new fans, and constantly sports a positive vibe throughout their community. Long time EQ fans believe that EQN has ceased production. It's hard to bring in new fans when the old ones believe the game is dead.

[Gilder]

Long time EQ fans believe that EQN has ceased production.It's hard to bring in new fans when the old ones believe the game is dead.

This sentiment alone leads me to believe it will get scrapped. Your post was nicely written.

[iruinedyourday]

hehe I can tell you its at the very least, another piece of crap video game im not going to play keke

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

A dead franchise.

But I would like to see someone do a Wii port of classic eq. Would be cool. Have to sit down to med, stand up to cast, etc. Plus, it would be fun to watch vids of people bard kiting, running in figure eights around their living rooms while playing air guitar.

[Sillyturtle]

I remember wanting to get into Vanguard so much. Sadly, my computer was a potato and couldn't run it and money was very tight for me back then.

I lived through the Journeys with Jaye blogposts where she detailed, in brilliant style and flare, her adventures through the game.

Tried to look them up the other day. Think they're gone for good.

[Sillyturtle]

Yay for web archives! Found some archived pages. https://web.archive.org/web/20060615000000*/http://www.journeyswithjaye.com

[Lagaidh]

Kind of like Obama

Ha!

For some reason I hear The Platters' I'll Never Love Again with the words "I'll never vote again."

Must be the schizophrenia.

[Pyrion]

EQNext is already a long time in development. BUT: They never ever said anything about a release or even alpha date, so no promises broken so far. It's a really ambitious game on many levels, doing things no MMO has done before. Combine that with the company troubles (no sony anymore) and it's only natural that the game needs a lot of time.

I am sceptical if they can pull off a fun game. I fear that it will be dumbed down with a meaningless death mechanism like most other modern MMOs. But at the same time they have some grand ideas and technologies, so i will wait and see.

[Lagaidh]

EQNixed

Ah. New Zealander?

/tee hee!

[Sancta]

Put your faith in Pantheon (https://www.pantheonmmo.com/).

Only MMO I'm holding out for, basically Brad Mcquaid created a company to deliver EQ1 in a new skin, keeping in line with old philosophies and bringing GOOD modern advancements/ideas. Anyone liking 1999-2001 EQ1 would like Pantheon.

[Alenon]

Didn't vanguard release early due to lack of funding? I hope we don't get something similar here. I loved vanguard as the true "eq 2", but the release made it just unplayable, too buggy as well as how hard it was on current pc's. Don't think I lasted 2 months

[Gilder]

Wow, Pantheon looks incredible! never knew about it until this thread.

[JboxCSU]

Yeah, didn't know about Pantheon. Looks awesome.

[Renem]

Camelot Unchained (http://camelotunchained.com/v2/) is another one I have high hopes for. I threw some money at them to kick them off. It's closer to completion than Pantheon and I'm eager to see what they put out. It's basically the same story as Pantheon only for DAoC instead of EQ.

[Sillyturtle]

Only MMO I'm holding out for, basically Brad Mcquaid created a company to deliver EQ1 in a new skin, keeping in line with old philosophies and bringing GOOD modern advancements/ideas. Anyone liking 1999-2001 EQ1 would like Pantheon.

Considering it hasn't even entered Beta yet I don't see how anyone can make that sort of statement with any credibility.

I can understand you WANTING it to be like that, but you simply can't make that statement based on what they say the game will be and what the website shows.

I can list a dozen MMO's that said one thing and delivered something completely different.

And as far as Camelot Unchained goes? I've personally spoken with Mark Jacobs about it and I absolutely believe the game is going to flop hard.

I've played Dark Age of Camelot since 2002 to present day and Camelot Unchained is going to be nothing like it except for the fact there's three factions. There's ZERO PvE. A modern day MMO will not survive without the money the subscriptions from all the people who like to PvE and Raid brings in. Carebears, whatever you want to call them.

I asked Mark what there was to do if I didn't want to RvR (that's PvP). His reply was, and I quote, "If you don't want to RvR, you can engage in the Crafting system we're implementing. If you don't want to craft, you can get involved in the Housing system. If those don't appeal to you, this game isn't for you."

So unless all you want to do is kill people, you're going to have a bad time in Camelot Unchained. And no matter what anyone, even the most die hard RvR fanatics from DAoC tell you, without people to PvE and PAY FOR THE GAME, DArk Age of Camelot would not exist today.

[eisley]

DAoC was the best game

[Zlain]

EQLandmark "Come build shit in our game so we can use it to make another game and give you no monetary compensation for it. On the contrary, you will be paying US to play it!."

http://camelotunchained.com/v2/

[thufir]

Didn't vanguard release early due to lack of funding? I hope we don't get something similar here. I loved vanguard as the true "eq 2", but the release made it just unplayable, too buggy as well as how hard it was on current pc's. Don't think I lasted 2 months

Yeah, it was basically unplayable when released, and that was a real shame because several months later they fixed all the major bugs and it just became awesome. It was everything eq had always wanted to be.

And now it's gone too. The sadness is real.

[maskedmelon]

Yeah, it was basically unplayable when released, and that was a real shame because several months later they fixed all the major bugs and it just became awesome. It was everything eq had always wanted to be.

And now it's gone too. The sadness is real.

There's an emulator in the works. I played from beta 'til sunset with a couple breaks here and there, but absolutely loved the game. Can't wait for the emu! ^^v

[thufir]

There's an emulator in the works. I played from beta 'til sunset with a couple breaks here and there, but absolutely loved the game. Can't wait for the emu! ^^v

That's what I heard too! I just hope the emu actually goes live and doesn't become another vaporware project. But if it does get released I am so going there. Consider v2007!

[fastboy21]

Wow, Pantheon looks incredible! never knew about it until this thread.

^^^
Is that you, Brad?

[Allaanna]

Do you think a Vanguard emu can even survive? P1999 has a nostalgia to it, its almost like playing Atari because it is one of the first MMORPG games to be realized. Vanguard wont have that going for it, it is too obscure and didn't have the lifespan of EQ1.

On Pantheon, the game looks like it is going to be amazing. I am supporting that game and really interested to see where it ends up. In addition, I have some real ties to EQ classic and hope too see Brad succeed hard in the face of all the doubters. EQ classic has a certain magic to it, and if Brad can do it a second time and re-realize that experience, he will make what no other MMO can right now.

As for Camelot Unchained. I have been watching the progression of that game. I am not sure it will be the game for me, but some people will play it. I enjoy some PvE with my PvP, and I enjoy difficulty, progression, and meaningful risk vs. reward. I don't know that Camelot will provide enough PvE outside of "the depths" to be meaningful, and that will close a certain crowd off, which is okay.

The thing about both of these MMO games is, they are targeting a niche among MMORPG players. They will both do well in their arenas, and will likely attract their own playerbase distinctly. Niche MMORPG's are probably the future, and even Brad said as much in an interview I seen. I expect that he is right, and if games like CU and Pantheon stop catering to the masses and just design a game for their crowd, they will deliver an amazing experience where it will be appreciated. The problem right now is that everyone is trying to be the next WOW with 10 million subs, but that isn't going to happen.

[Sancta]

Considering it hasn't even entered Beta yet I don't see how anyone can make that sort of statement with any credibility.

I can understand you WANTING it to be like that, but you simply can't make that statement based on what they say the game will be and what the website shows.

I can list a dozen MMO's that said one thing and delivered something completely different.




I agree, when an MMO says "different" it usually means WoW-Clone with a new skin.

but here are the features and things Brad and his company are really wanting to do. If you read that, all you will think is EQ1 with improvements.

As always, time will tell.



http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/game_features/

http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/

http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/game_tenets/

[fastboy21]

the bottom line is that MMOs as a segment of the gaming industry aren't expanding like it used to.

the new games all claim to be "next generation" and different (they've been using this language now for YEARS when publicizing new games). At release, none of them have lived up to this. They hold attention for a short period and then they fade with their player-base to the next game. Rinse and repeat again and again for the last decade of MMO gaming.

There are a few exceptions that exist categorically on their own outside of this model (EVE online, for example)...but, for the most part the holy grail of the MMO genre has been to build an authentically different game. Nobody has found it yet. Most new MMOs provide a change in scenery with an upgrade in graphics and very little else.

As money has dried up in the MMO genre so to has gone the era of big AAA titles spending millions of dollars and years of development to bring a product to market. They just aren't successful. The money is better invested in other segments of the gaming industry.

Only a few companies are still chasing the AAA MMO dream (i.e. "the WOW killer").

EQN is looking less and less likely to be anything at all, much less live up to the hype of all the new promises it has made in its nebulous leaks of information. Advanced AI? Dynamic gaming world? etc.

The truth is I will plunk down $65 to play an EQN title when it comes out even if it is horrible. I just love the game setting to much to ignore it. Same with anything Brad releases. But, my expectations are very limited. They are all long shots, but I'd give slightly better odds to Brad to actually make something innovative over anyone else out there right now (including Daybreak/EQN).

[Champion_Standing]

It seemed like they immediately just gave up on EQN when they thought they were looking at some potential new mincraft like cash generator with Landmark. Didn't they even change the branding from Everquest Landmark to just Landmark pretty quickly?

[Axlrose]

Depending upon your view, the gamer has changed over the years. Back in ~my~ day, I thought nothing of sitting in front of a computer, "camping" mobs to get a new glitter piece. But today's (younger) gamer wants instant gratification and they want it _now_.

Build a game to cater to those that can plunk down long stretches of time and it will bomb. Build a game that is twitchy and sprinkles rewards left, right, and center the moment you log into it, and it will fade it obscurity when the next "big" game is released.

[Kyden]

Elderlands is a modern 2D MMO that I have high hopes for. Its from the same creator as Dransik. The game world is unique and takes alot of aspects from the early ultima series. The only thing is its been in development for more than 10 years, so progress is slow but still moving.

[SCB]

I agree, when an MMO says "different" it usually means WoW-Clone with a new skin.

but here are the features and things Brad and his company are really wanting to do. If you read that, all you will think is EQ1 with improvements.

As always, time will tell.



http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/game_features/

http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/

http://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/game_tenets/

This really does sound like exactly what I'd want in an MMO.