Game Mechanics: Lets Talks About Velious Binding Rules

[Ele]

Originally Posted by t3kn34k [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It sounds like you are more motivated by greed than an actual desire to see a classic change.

There are plenty of people in here refuting the bug report that are also motivated by reasons other than "classic."

I also notice that nearly all of your evidence is anecdotal not to mention from secondary and tertiary sources.

If you're going to post evidence, you better have proof from a primary source for the entire duration of the timeline since your asking for the staff to rebind a lot of players.
Shits classic. Deal with it.

Sometimes that is the only evidence available, since we do not have access to a perfect copy of the back-end code from 1999-2001 and the patch messages are also not always useful, since there are tons of classic changes there were never noted in the patch notes.

Dungeon binding was deemed unclassic in Kunark. The staff rebound people on Trak ledge and other locations. They also warned if people still had those bind locations that punishments would be handed out.

If we only used primary sources (original code, patch messages, packet sniffers, and developer letters), a lot of the server's classic content wouldn't be here.

I dont see proof that this was never classic, perhaps the bind restriction was implemented some time after launch during Velious.

Firepot bind was classic for a time and those were not reset.

If it was removed at some, then we should continue to examine when it was removed (that is if it was ever allowed in the first place) to prevent new binds after any potential restriction date as was implemented in Timorous Deep, while old binds remained.

[Daldaen]

What Ele said, more eloquently than myself.

Originally Posted by Colgate [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

pretty sure the entire point is that it was never possible to bind in temple of veeshan, therefore no one on p99 should be allowed to keep their bind

it's not like firepots at all because it was possible to bind at the firepots for a limited time on live

Basically this. Firepots were shown to be classic for a time. Whereas this has no real evidence to suggest it was ever doable.

[Joyelle]

Originally Posted by t3kn34k [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It sounds like you are more motivated by greed than an actual desire to see a classic change.

You must not know Daldaen. He LIVES for getting things back to classic even if it makes life more difficult in-game for himself or his friends/guildmates. I hardly believe this is motivated by greed. It's just Daldaen the Classhole.

[t3kn34k]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think it's been quite clearly shown binding in ToV during Velious wasn't a thing.

I don't think it has been clearly shown at all. All of the evidence posted in your OP is from very late Velious. Also much of it is speculative, (saying 'i bind over there' is different than saying 'you cant bind here')

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Find evidence to suggest otherwise.

You cant request a change by requesting evidence. I will definitely contribute to the search once all windows are complete, but heres the challenge. Prove that it was not classic for the entire duration of the timeline. Your wayback machine does not go back far enough, and also its a secondary source.

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Resetting binds is necessary if it was never a classic mechanic.

I would agree, but we need more evidence than what was presented.

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No Kunark dungeons are bindable, save CITY of Mist (note the city part). Likewise no Velious dungeons are bindable,

This is an inference, not facts. One set of data does not prove/disprove the other. Keep in mind that Velious is a faction based expansion. Many people see Kael as a dungeon zone, I call it home and bank there (and watch people fight while munching on a crunchy codain head). However I am KOS in Thurgadin. Where would someone on CoV faction call home?

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What's classic is no characters ever being able to bind in ToV. Bind outside behind Sontalak if you enjoy spending time in ToV. Shits classic...

Myself and others recall self-binding in ToV at least at the beginning of Velious.

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Players should NOT have ever been able to bind in these zones. It's a Pandora's box of problems, especially in ToV.

You seem to restate your main point a lot. Do your homework and prove it.

Originally Posted by Joyelle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's just Daldaen the Classhole.

Perhaps he is and i misspoke about his intentions. Sincere apologies. I am also an advocate for classic. If hes truly 'the classhole' he will heed what I am saying and do more research. Preferrably not more data from Dec 2001.

Originally Posted by Ele [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If it was removed at some, then we should continue to examine when it was removed (that is if it was ever allowed in the first place) to prevent new binds after any potential restriction date as was implemented in Timorous Deep, while old binds remained.

Pretty much this. I can only confirm what I and others recall from live and I wouldnt expect you to accept that as evidence. Keep searching until you have more data from early velious/launch.

[Daldaen]

January 5th, 2001 - Allakhazam

You cannot bind in the dungeon. I tried binding at entrance mirror on 1
last night. Might be able to bind others, just not self. Skyshrine works like
that.

Couldn't bind in ToFS dungeon 3 weeks into Velious. Safe to assume never was ToFS bindable.

More weird evidence for Skyshrine binding rules as Ele noted earlier!

[Scryll]

Originally Posted by t3kn34k [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Myself and others recall self-binding in ToV at least at the beginning of Velious.

Nope, never happend. You clearly do not remember how much freakin effort was put inn for mobilization around inside ToV on live, only place people could bind themself was at the entrance in WW. Statements like this indicates to me that you never were in ToV in the 2001 era, hell I don't recall being able to bind inside ever, and I quit in 2004.

On a different side, where is the evidence stating it was possible to bind inside ToV? I have not seen it, because there is none.

[diamondfist]

So interesting fact:
For the speculative references that are being posted... and they are just that. (Remember EQ was different the first time playing through in some aspects, and 90% of the players didnt see high end content, and of that 10% 95% of them played follow the leader, proven and the safest... even if safe was more inconvenient. Kind of like in velks no one dropped down the pit unless you had the required druid or wizard to evac/port because OT hammers weren't very well known... and thats just a group content example that a majority of the population had access to.

As per binding, my Halfling druid main, Merlian Windrider on Erollisi Marr made enough plat doing ports to buy 2 Manastones and this was all from 1 niche that no one else bothered capitalizing on... being bound @ ToV, and im not saying outside i was literally bound inside ToV, because It was much safer for me to do so then being outside, and it wasnt really a problem for me since i could port anywhere. Being bound inside wasnt a option for a non porter, if you wanted to kill dragons. If you bind inside you were trapped. (UNLESS YOU COULD PORT)

Many melees paid me a few hundred plat on almost a daily occurrence because peoples mindset was to bind elsewhere, and it was a death trap and hassle for most druids or wizards to go out to ToV, even the ones quading in CS. The small amount of people adventuring into ToV and the like left options few and fair between for rescue.



So the next time you link a player written post saying people "should bind outside" thats subjective to their opinion of what works, just a much as someone typing "you can't bind inside" is that really them saying its impossible, or you can't do it for your own sanity, and the posters fear of a backlash when you realize how hard it is to get out once you do.









Sidenote:
Also why can't level 1s zone into ToV? its not a plane, only planes had level caps on them, until around PoP? LDoN? when they went back and put a level cap on ToV to stop people from selling loot rights on gear there to low level alts in a effort to stop RMTing and stop people from sniping content from lower guilds. It was later worked around when they put in the campfire system in during TSS?, lvl 1s could then sneak back in.

[Man0warr]

Because Toop exploit teleporting level 1s to raid zones to train people. All zones have un-classic level restrictions right now.

There's more evidence of no dungeons being bindable the entirety of Velious than there is of being able to bind at any point. The evidence needs to be provided to keep it as it is - because right now it's mostly just an oversight by Nilbog.

[Skew]

I was one of the first few people on The Nameless to be bound INSIDE PoM when the zone was just a broken shell with nothing to do.
No one , not any class , could bind in ToV in the first 6 months or so of Velious. I dont know what happened after that as i quit to play DAoC.

This server picks and chooses whats classic. I just figured Rogean wanted people to bind in ToV /shrug NBD.
But if the argument is about classic , then binding in ToV wasnt classic.

[Ele]

Sidenote:
Also why can't level 1s zone into ToV? its not a plane, only planes had level caps on them, until around PoP? LDoN? when they went back and put a level cap on ToV to stop people from selling loot rights on gear there to low level alts in a effort to stop RMTing and stop people from sniping content from lower guilds. It was later worked around when they put in the campfire system in during TSS?, lvl 1s could then sneak back in.

Post in this thread, I reopened it for you. https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=176762