Catherins attempt at lawyering

[DetroitVelvetSmooth]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

you're an idiot, even if 2-3 guilds worked together with something like CT, TMO would just swoop in and kill it out from whatever guild(s) were chasing it, or Inny, or Maestro, or draco, or Fay, or Sev, etc etc etc

It's wasn't a lack of people/levels to kill the dragon, it was neve being afforded the opportunity because TMO was sooooo concerned with the "thrill of the hunt" and didn't even need the fucking loot.

<Tries to pull your tongue out of TMOs butthole> I can't, too far up there.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh yes call someone an idiot when they smack you with the truth. The problem was you weren't a guy people sought out and you didn't seek outside help. Your pride continuously got in the way.

you are literally clueless, I can't help you, your version of events are so skewed it's absurd

Originally Posted by DetroitVelvetSmooth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

<Tries to pull your tongue out of TMOs butthole> I can't, too far up there.

I feel like you're confused too

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

you are literally clueless, I can't help you, your version of events are so skewed it's absurd


I feel like you're confused too

Oh yes it's everyone elses version of events that are always skewed but your own.


"Nice Train, Thanks TMO"

Get out of your own way man.

[Juryiel]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh I never disagreed they weren't. However their are easy mobs. Like Draco/Maestro/Fay/Sev etc. You can do those mobs with limited numbers. Or you can team up with a guild like you guys do now on tougher spawns. You don't face any restrictions either that way to sharing lockouts.

Honestly the whole problem before was less guilds worked together before the raid changes. In this system now there is enough working together to get more done. If you guys had the same guild relations before you could have made a lot of changes without the GM's stepping in.

But the goal is not to get as many mobs taken away from class C. The goal is to have even smaller guilds be able to put together a force to do harder mobs than Dracon/Maestro/Sev by making it more convenient for them to gather their available forces through things like rotations or other such mechanics, without needing to have an available force 24/7 on-call. I don't see this as a competition of class R and class C, but as allowing more guilds to enjoy the various aspects of the game. So maybe rotations lead to less loot/kills for class R in general, but they prop up smaller guilds and allow them to go harder targets than they otherwise would be able to in an FFA system.

Basically, in my utopian EQ society, any guild capable of taking down a PVE target without outside player interference should have a reasonable number of shots at that target without having to be on-call 24/7 and hitting track for 16 hours. The specific ways to implement this obviously can vary but rotations are a small step in teh right direction.

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Juryiel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But the goal is not to get as many mobs taken away from class C. The goal is to have even smaller guilds be able to put together a force to do harder mobs than Dracon/Maestro/Sev by making it more convenient for them to gather their available forces through things like rotations or other such mechanics, without needing to have an available force 24/7 on-call. I don't see this as a competition of class R and class C, but as allowing more guilds to enjoy the various aspects of the game. So maybe rotations lead to less loot/kills for class R in general, but they prop up smaller guilds and allow them to go harder targets than they otherwise would be able to in an FFA system.

Basically, in my utopian EQ society, any guild capable of taking down a PVE target without outside player interference should have a reasonable number of shots at that target without having to be on-call 24/7 and hitting track for 16 hours. The specific ways to implement this obviously can vary but rotations are a small step in teh right direction.

That was never EQ. The variance was less in Classic, but you didn't have unlimited shots at mobs. Also I never said the system didn't help smaller guilds. I think it has it's moments in doing that. However, I also see those smaller guilds having to team up with other guilds to get those harder mobs killed. You could do that in the FFA system on repops is my point here. Trust me you have time 9 times out of 10 to send a tell and say "Hey let's team up on this mob".

[Juryiel]

Just to reply to myself:

For example, imagine all players agreed that even though class mobs become FFA after 6 hours, they would not go after them for 24 hours. I imagine class R might then try to come to an agreement to eliminate tracking within their class entirely. That would mean less mobs for the server in general, but probably a more enjoyable play experience for most people too. I don't know why these things are not prioritized by the server over +10Hp ore whatever :P

[Juryiel]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That was never EQ. The variance was less in Classic, but you didn't have unlimited shots at mobs. Also I never said the system didn't help smaller guilds. I think it has it's moments in doing that. However, I also see those smaller guilds having to team up with other guilds to get those harder mobs killed. You could do that in the FFA system on repops is my point here. Trust me you have time 9 times out of 10 to send a tell and say "Hey let's team up on this mob".

It was on my server. Not unlimited, but everything was rotated. You had to compete ONCE with the guild currently up for a mob rotation, to show you had a capable force, and most guilds whose turn it was would even let a new guild attempting to enter rotation try without competing unless it was cutting edge content. Then once you were on it, after the mob popped during yoru rotation turn it was left up until you had your peak raid window come up. If you failed, then it either went to the next guild or FFA, I forget. It was glorious.

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Juryiel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It was on my server. Not unlimited, but everything was rotated. You had to compete ONCE with the guild currently up for a mob rotation, to show you had a capable force, and most guilds whose turn it was would even let a new guild attempting to enter rotation try without competing unless it was cutting edge content. Then once you were on it, after the mob popped during yoru rotation turn it was left up until you had your peak raid window come up. If you failed, then it either went to the next guild or FFA, I forget. It was glorious.

I mean you just used this phrase. Right now on this server the cutting edge content is Kunark. I mean maybe you are thinking of a system that existed in PoP.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That was never EQ.

stagnating in a single expansion for 3+ years until there was 15 capable guilds wasn't classic either, nothing is classic any longer, it's the most tired excuse that people give

[Juryiel]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I mean you just used this phrase. Right now on this server the cutting edge content is Kunark. I mean maybe you are thinking of a system that existed in PoP.

Well the point is, while you may not get a free shot on cutting edge content, if you won the race ONCE on cutting edge content then you were on the rotation forever (until you failed twice I think). So if you once managed to kill a mob before the guild currently up did, you were on rotation.

Here's our Ettiquette I dug up (Note the person who posted it was a representative of the server's equivalent of TMO

Rotation Etiquette

- 24 hours from time of spawn to kill the mob (if they go beyond 24 hours, it is considered a "pass")

- Passing is acceptable. The next guild has 24 hours from time of notification to kill. Notification should include: a Pass in a chat channel (if applicable), an update on the Rotation Page, and an in-game /tell to the next guild in line.

Note: a Pass is when a guild skips their turn, and posts a "pass". Allowing another guild to attempt to enter the Rotation or losing a race on their Rotation turn, is NOT a Pass. They keep their place in the Rotation, and the new guild is entered before them.

- Tunare and CT are partial exceptions to the 24 hour rule.
- CT (Cazic Thule, the God, in Fear) depends on clearing Fear first. Fear may be scheduled, and the Rotation Guild has to wait for the scheduled Raid to be completed.
- Tunare depends on clearing PoG first. A guild has 24 hours from the time they enter PoG to kill Tunare.

- The zones of NToV and ST have their own rules, please see the applicable thread.

- The Elemental Planes have their own rules, please see the apllicable thread.

- Getting back onto a Rotation from Auto-Pass. A guild can only get back onto a Rotation in their original spot.

*** Additional note:

This was discussed but never formalized. But with the increased number of guilds on some Rotations, the following is suggested:

If a guild FAILS (not a Pass, not losing a race, not conceding, but failing to kill the mob) on two consequetive rotation turns, that they either ask to be removed from the Rotation, or put themselves on Autopass.

*** Additional note #2:

After a guild is on a Rotation (following the rules for entering said Rotation), they may, at their discretion, invite non-guild players on any subsequent kills.