a question for the Atheists..

[myriverse]

Originally Posted by Raavak [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Whether or not you believe in Jesus, just look what he taught:

Love each other.
Let he who is without sin punish the sinner (i.e. no one).
Help people in need, no matter who they are.
etc.

Aren't those good messages?

What sucks is the people who take this and use it for their own goals (inquisitions, persecution, controlling knowledge & education, crusades, etc).

Forked tongue syndrome: he says this while expressing completely approval of punishing sinners, people in need, etc.

[dreama1]

First, what aggravates me is that 'god' is automatically assumed to be 'he', which already exposes the first fallacy of the very concept of religion - it's man made. There are over 4,200 different religions in the world. Most of them are mutually exclusive. Because of this, either one is right or all of them are wrong. Which makes more sense?

Second, you don't need religion to have moral values. This is a total farce. I won't indulge myself into the follies of atheist extremists that claim that there is a science of morality, i believe that morality is a wholly a social phenomenon, i.e., what someone finds right or wrong depends on their cultural background, time, place etc etc.. That is, it is not objective as people would like to believe.

Finally, there are three types of people.
1) people who believe in god in fear because they think they will go to hell (lol)
2) people who believe in god because they want to believe in it (gives them some purpose or meaning in life)
3) people who don't believe in god but would like to believe in it if there were good evidence to suggest that it does exist

[Rail]

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[Rail]

Originally Posted by Rail [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[IMG]X[/IMG]

^ fail.. try again:

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[Cecily]

If there was a god, we'd be able to edit RnF posts.

[Raavak]

Originally Posted by dreama1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

First, what aggravates me is that 'god' is automatically assumed to be 'he'

In Judeo-Christianity God has both male, female, and non-sexual personas. I think we use "he" because we are still a male centered society, though not as much as we were in the last 2000 years.

[Raavak]

Originally Posted by myriverse [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Forked tongue syndrome: he says this while expressing completely approval of punishing sinners, people in need, etc.

Where?

[Shaakglith12194]

Yeah just kinda hard to believe in a being that could stop all suffering, or even most suffering, who doesn't. It's like, if you were in charge of a bunch of teenagers and put them into an enclosed area with complete power over them, and they started beating, raping, stealing, and just generally fucking each other up, how fucked up is it that you just watch every atrocity? And it's supposed to be ok because they'll be punished when you let them out of the enclosed area? "I won't stop the rape or torture, 'cuz when they get out, they're gonna pay!" But it's their choice because you said they have "free will" to do what they want. It's all ok, because you'll reward some and punish others after the fact and if those people don't do a series of retarded things, you'll punish them just for the fun of it. Brilliant. What a swell guy that god is.

I loved how Old Testament christian god was all like "War! I will wreck thine enemies!!111 Kill, burn, rip the unborn children from the wombs of their mothers!" and New Testament god is all like, "Chill guys, like love and peace and shit. Forgiveness, man." Gettin' his feet washed by prostitutes, trying to make people forget all about the forced abortions and murder. Dude's priorities changed big time.

Here's some gems:
The people of Samaria must bear their guilt, because they have rebelled against their God. They will fall by the sword; their little ones will be dashed to the ground, their pregnant women ripped open. (Hosea 13:16)
At that time Menahem, starting out from Tirzah, attacked Tiphsah and everyone in the city and its vicinity, because they refused to open their gates. He sacked Tiphsah and ripped open all the pregnant women. (2 Kings 15:16)
Now go and attack Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them. But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child, ox and sheep, camel and donkey. (1 Samuel 15:3)
"Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." (Numbers 31:17-18)
"And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend in the siege and straitness, wherewith their enemies, and they that seek their lives, shall straiten them." (Jeremiah 19:9)
"Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished." (Isaiah 13:16)

Yeah, God said rape the women, kill the kids. Dude was so metal back in the day.

[Lune]

New Testament conveniently abrogates a lot of that hardcore Old Testament shit. I suspect it had something to do with cultural shifts within Christendom; all that ancient babble probably became distasteful and the new testament adapted all of it to "modern tastes".

You see a similar trend with both the Great Schism, and the Protestant Reformation... religious doctrine being redrawn along cultural lines in a way that is more tasteful to the flock.

[moklianne]

Originally Posted by dreama1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Finally, there are three types of people.
1) people who believe in god in fear because they think they will go to hell (lol)
2) people who believe in god because they want to believe in it (gives them some purpose or meaning in life)
3) people who don't believe in god but would like to believe in it if there were good evidence to suggest that it does exist

And when it comes down to it, aren't all of these functions of our own ego or even selfishness?

You want to be 'saved' so that you'll go to heaven. Its a somewhat selfish act.

I treat others the way I do because I expect that treatment from them in return. That should really be enough to be a decent human being in this world. No deity required.