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  #101  
Old 10-11-2011, 02:19 PM
Autotune Autotune is offline
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Originally Posted by fishingme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
My point was that maybe the guilds shouldn't have fucked with each other so much and brought their shit to the forums/made GMs deal with it.
I was trying to explain things to you, but I couldn't do it without it turning into a RnF thread.

Therefore, I reply with this. You have no idea what you're talking about.
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  #102  
Old 10-11-2011, 02:43 PM
fishingme fishingme is offline
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Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I was trying to explain things to you, but I couldn't do it without it turning into a RnF thread.

Therefore, I reply with this. You have no idea what you're talking about.
Trying to explain, what? That rogean wasn't releasing VP because the guilds basically needed "punishment", nah man I understood that.
  #103  
Old 10-11-2011, 02:57 PM
falkun falkun is offline
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And what Autotune is alluding to, which Uthgaard put a bit more bluntly on page 7, is that its not the players (in sticking with Uthgaard's post, "players" are a "people", not a "person") that need to change, but rather how they are managed by leaders (server GMs, developers, etc.). As Uthgaard said, "People are a product of who is directly responsible for them." Within the rules as they are currently established, the "raiding clusterfuck" can legally happen. Even more strict than those rules, the two guilds most involved in the "raiding clusterfuck" provided a solution for VP, which was summarily shot down without alternatives or constructive criticism by the aforementioned leaders. Again, as Uthgaard said and I will restate, if the leaders want the "raiding clusterfuck" to stop, then they need to actively participate in changing the rule and server structure around which the "raiding clusterfuck" is allowed to exist, instead of ignoring ideas for change and sticking their heads in the sand.

If the leadership is doing it out of sheer punishment, its their server and they can do whatever they would like. But I have noticed the decline from peaks of 1000+ at peak hours to 600+ during those same times.

All that being said, I will also make my plug that this server is awesome, the leaders do a lot for this server, and I am loving my time here.
  #104  
Old 10-11-2011, 03:07 PM
fishingme fishingme is offline
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Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
And what Autotune is alluding to, which Uthgaard put a bit more bluntly on page 7, is that its not the players (in sticking with Uthgaard's post, "players" are a "people", not a "person") that need to change, but rather how they are managed by leaders (server GMs, developers, etc.). As Uthgaard said, "People are a product of who is directly responsible for them." Within the rules as they are currently established, the "raiding clusterfuck" can legally happen. Even more strict than those rules, the two guilds most involved in the "raiding clusterfuck" provided a solution for VP, which was summarily shot down without alternatives or constructive criticism by the aforementioned leaders. Again, as Uthgaard said and I will restate, if the leaders want the "raiding clusterfuck" to stop, then they need to actively participate in changing the rule and server structure around which the "raiding clusterfuck" is allowed to exist, instead of ignoring ideas for change and sticking their heads in the sand.

If the leadership is doing it out of sheer punishment, its their server and they can do whatever they would like. But I have noticed the decline from peaks of 1000+ at peak hours to 600+ during those same times.

All that being said, I will also make my plug that this server is awesome, the leaders do a lot for this server, and I am loving my time here.
I never read past page 2 because it was just going to be one of those threads again. What I was saying is that maybe they shouldn't have clusterfucked/douchebagged eachother and complained to volunteering guides so much in the first place. What I'm trying to say here is, to have made these raid proposals to eachother months ago before the forums/guides were too overwhelmed by them bitching.

edit: I mean, why act like children until something is held from you/you're somewhat disciplined and THEN work something out? Couldn't just do it beforehand?
  #105  
Old 10-11-2011, 03:28 PM
Dr4z3r Dr4z3r is offline
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Originally Posted by fishingme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I never read past page 2
You really should. Start here: http://www.project1999.org/forums/sh...8&postcount=61
  #106  
Old 10-11-2011, 04:06 PM
falkun falkun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishingme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I never read past page 2 because it was just going to be one of those threads again. What I was saying is that maybe they shouldn't have clusterfucked/douchebagged eachother and complained to volunteering guides so much in the first place. What I'm trying to say here is, to have made these raid proposals to eachother months ago before the forums/guides were too overwhelmed by them bitching.

edit: I mean, why act like children until something is held from you/you're somewhat disciplined and THEN work something out? Couldn't just do it beforehand?
You're right, people should not have clusterfucked each other in the first place. And persons can do that, but people cannot, as Uthgaard has already explained. One person can and will fuck the whole system for his own good at the expense of the people. That is society; the US economy should not have clusterfucked itself in the first place either, but it has. All you can do now is pick up the pieces and move forward. What you should/could/would have done is irrelevant, its only what you can do now that will create change.

To that end, a solution was proposed, and shot down. Like the NBA, we are at an impasse. However, beyond a short-sighted agreement over VP, a whole new Raiding Management Structure (TM) should be developed by the leadership, because it is that leadership (the RMS and the people enforcing it) that will govern the raiding scene going forward. Within the new RMS, all other methods of killing mobs, poopsocking, training, etc. that can occur, will occur. Rules will be established, followed, bent, pushed, prodded and outright broken. Persons will screw people over, as they have been doing under the current system. All that can be done is to address the current problem to the best of your ability. Like the hacker/security relationship, its a back and forth struggle that will not end.

Once upon a time, the current raid rules were an improvement over the old, now the new has become old, and a new new shall rise from the ashes. Change, the only constant.
  #107  
Old 10-11-2011, 04:26 PM
Szeth Szeth is offline
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Chances are VP isn't actually done. You've all just lost the game.
  #108  
Old 10-11-2011, 04:49 PM
fishingme fishingme is offline
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Originally Posted by Dr4z3r [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Nah, was responding to the OP with my first post
  #109  
Old 10-11-2011, 05:00 PM
Sorrow*qc Sorrow*qc is offline
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how about you guys get a life?
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  #110  
Old 10-11-2011, 05:12 PM
Phallax Phallax is offline
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Originally Posted by Daliant17447 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
One solution would be to just wipe the server clean and start back at square one.

Finish beta testing PvP mechanics, then announce a release date for P99 Blue/Red servers both going live simultaneously and advertise across all mmo communities to build hype. Consider the last 2 years as just a long drawn out beta.

This would:
-Allow the servers to progress on an accurate timeline because the first 2 years of content are already developed and tested
-Allow both servers to progress through the timeline at the same rate
-Allow the devs adequate time to work on epics and velious without outcry from the community about when it will be finished
-Help to spread the population between the servers so that both are able to sustain a healthy population
-Allow the server to have a more accurate economy without all the duped plat and items now that the necessary counter-measures are in place

Some of the most basic mechanics have taken the entire duration of classic to get tuned properly (FD, melee damage, charm duration, resist checks just to name a few). The intent of the project was to provide a classic server that played as closely to the original EQ as possible with content being released on a timeline accurate to how it was back on live. If the server were to restart it would be able deliver just that.

On the flip side, obviously you would have a lot of the player-base upset about losing their characters and feeling like the last 2 years have been a waste... but lets face it, that time was spent playing EQ so it has already been a waste. Its not like any payment was taken for services or any promise was made that protected characters.

You might lose some people do to rage quiting, but I think you would also gain a significant ammount of people drawn by the fact that it would be a clean start for everyone, and a lot of the people who have played here and quit would be back for stuff they missed the first time around like guise/manastone.

Just an idea... I know I for one would be pumped about losing my level 60 and multiple level 50+ characters and having to reroll with bronze and fine steel... but maybe i'm just crazy.
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