Hate recalc

[Cezar]

Greetings, I’m ok with recalculating hate but how a SK is supposed to keep aggro now?
I remember classic eq, SKs were using disease cloud! Now seem to have no effect just like all other spells, considering our taunt worth nothing I’m wondering what sks are good to now? Always good for snap aggro, now?

I think it’s a mistake what last patch introduced and I hope staff solve it soon!

For all other SKs, how you trying to ménage the lacking of threat? Any spell still effective?

[Jimjam]

You also have snare, ac and atk taps. Are none of them worth a thing?

[Ooloo]

Did these hate changes affect all warrior weapon procs (stuns\slows\debuffs) and aggro clickies? Cause wars depend on this big time. Are all tanks gonna be gimped now?

[Swish]

If SK's can't snap aggro anymore I'm probably never logging mine in again lol

[Cezar]

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If SK's can't snap aggro anymore I'm probably never logging mine in again lol

Yep, don’t know why they did this unclassic modify, why this nerf! SKs will be rares, it’s useless playing one now, we just become totally useless.

Was in a group with a bard 8 lvl lower then me that was snare/slow mob. Not a chance to get aggro, so sad, we were kings of aggro…

[sajbert]

I’m surprised I’ve seen little to no discussion on these changes and what they mean.

[Uthgaard]

All spell aggro has been reduced to the point that aggro management for casters is trivial. Spell aggro was too high before, but now it's way too little.

So pets and warriors can hold aggro like ubertanks, and casters don't need to worry about pulling aggro with heals, slows, or debuffs landing too soon.

But anyone like hyrbids, relying on spellcasts to gain aggro from other melees, is heavily underperforming right now. And these should be able to snap aggro. This was classic.

Some spell values for aggro might be more in line with each other now, but they're not in sync with melee threat or taunt values. So the system is out of balance.

I think there was some confusion about hate values being added to certain spells later (these were negative hate values added to offset an unintended increase to threat caused somewhere down the line). There are dev podcasts out there that explain why these were added. But spells with disease counters and debuffs always did generate significant hate, this is well documented, and they should be yielding more than they are currently.

An SK pet 15 levels under its caster should not be able to hold aggro securely from an that SK while they are spamming spells on a mob.

The weak shm pet should not instantly pick up slowed and maloed mobs with 3 dots ticking.

This is kind of a gamebreaking balance change.

[Uthgaard]

Dev interview with the guy who designed the eq spell system, goes in depth about spell aggro

osted @ Sat, Oct 20th 11:08 PM 2001 Score: Decent[3.03]
Hybrids easily outtaunt warriors if they have half a brain.

Rangers - Taunt, Flame Lick, Kick, Beg, Snare, Taunt. That mob'll be on you the whole fight.

SK - AC tap, Taunt, Beg, Disease Cloud, Disease Cloud, Taunt.

Paladin - Taunt, Stun, Beg, Root, Flash of Light, Stun, Taunt.

What can a warrior do?
Taunt, Kick, Beg... Taunt, Kick, Beg.

This is a very useful spell. And I'm not sure if many people know this, but this spell pisses MoBs off more then pretty much anything else you get. With disease cloud, a SK can out-taunt pretty much anyone in the game and live (sure wizards can use some huge DD spells, but will they live to tell about it?). Taunting is extremely important. It keeps the cleric alive, and if you want to see some real damage use this and taunt constantly while a rogue gets behind it and backstabs.


The other benifit is that it stops / slows regeneration, and lasts a LONG time. Very good when you think you're about to lose sight of a MOB somehow (like losing crocs in the Oasis water bug), and you don't want it to come back with 100% health later.


At higher levels this spell flies out, and 10 mana is reall insignificant =)


Submited by: Trev (High Lords of
On: 12/19/2000 7:13:44 AM

Heart Flutter This is a triple threat spell. It not only weakens your opponent and lowers their armor class but it also does damage over time.

Taunt mobs off casters : Use your flame lick spell, fast cast, MAJOR taunt, low mana cost... And reduces AC too, just my 2 p. I know that that is a low lvl spell, but believe me, i can agro kit any mob, even if there are 2 wizzies in group if i cast flame lick continuously. Snare is good too, but costs much and is slower, so in case of emergency, use flame lick, and never hesitate to root a mob who hates your caster and take a few secs to build hate : snare , flame lick X2, an arrow between each spell recovery, and a nuke to break the root, and if the mob is really more intelligent than his friends ( sometimes happens [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] ), then use taunt and cast again til h

Sinixtrax Pinewalker, 44 ranger on Vazaelle,
member of DROIT DIVIN

Posted @ Thu, Aug 30th 3:26 PM 2001

Date: Tue Aug 14 10:39:50 2001
Author: Stormfang
Subject: Re: Paladins

Creating aggro for me? NO problem: Snare. The beasties hate it. Flame Lick. They hate that just as bad. For some reason Flame Lick creates more hate than just about any other dot until you get into the Taunt. Lots of it. All the time. Journeyman's Walking Stick. Procs Tashani, which creates a HUGE amount of aggro. Really pisses em off.

Flame Lick. AKA: Instant Aggro. I hunted Slavers in Crushbone with a full group and
dropped this on one of the buggers. No amount of taunting from the warriors, pets beating on the thing, or cleric heals got the slaver off of me. My ranger has this too and for pulling it is awesome. Also try this: root the mob, drop Flame Lick and kite. By the time root breaks you have a very mad but
1/2 health target to melee. Submited by: Gabiael of Vallon ak On: 9/13/2000 9:52:30 AM

I really could keep going for days but at this point I don't think it's necessary

[Ooloo]

And to think I dropped 20k on a wavecrasher like two weeks ago lol... only reason it costs so much is cause the slow proc is supposed to be big aggro for a war

[long.liam]

Originally Posted by Uthgaard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All spell aggro has been reduced to the point that aggro management for casters is trivial. Spell aggro was too high before, but now it's way too little.

So pets and warriors can hold aggro like ubertanks, and casters don't need to worry about pulling aggro with heals, slows, or debuffs landing too soon.

But anyone like hyrbids, relying on spellcasts to gain aggro from other melees, is heavily underperforming right now. And these should be able to snap aggro. This was classic.

Some spell values for aggro might be more in line with each other now, but they're not in sync with melee threat or taunt values. So the system is out of balance.

I think there was some confusion about hate values being added to certain spells later (these were negative hate values added to offset an unintended increase to threat caused somewhere down the line). There are dev podcasts out there that explain why these were added. But spells with disease counters and debuffs always did generate significant hate, this is well documented, and they should be yielding more than they are currently.

An SK pet 15 levels under its caster should not be able to hold aggro securely from an that SK while they are spamming spells on a mob.

The weak shm pet should not instantly pick up slowed and maloed mobs with 3 dots ticking.

This is kind of a gamebreaking balance change.

I tested it with brother on the blue server. All Disease and poison counter hate has been removed. Only the damage from Dots produces any hate. The SPAs (SPell Affects) like Blind, Stun, Snare, slow etc.. All produced hate based off of Mob HP. It's the mobs/15 up to a Cap of 1200 for spells and 400 for proc/clickie. We tested this and found this to be true. My brother's 60 druid struggled to hold aggro on mistmoore mobs with Flamelick & Snare while powerleveling my level 25 paladin. However, on the 2 guards in Paineel, Guard Heridion and Guard Menbuknar, His snare or flamelick or any SPA produced 1200 hate per cast.