Game Mechanics: Necromancer Spell Threat

[Knightmare]

I have more work to do on this, however I did promise to make a post today with screenshots of my DoT's doing excessive amounts of threat even just with the 1st tick:

Bearing in mind my level is 21, my pet spell is the lvl 20 research spell. Every mob (but the last) is blue, light blue or green to me. Pet taunt was on. Most of these are done while solo over the a few pulls, another is in a group later that night.

Notice: I didn't go crazy trying to prove the point repeatedly, it would only make for more screenshots and more annoyance in game to me and my group [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]


Targeting my pet to establish that he is indeed Dark Blue, in case the damage dealt by it isn't clear.

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Mob is light blue, clearly below my pet, which is doing damage and taunting:

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Pet has done 15% damage to the mob, has been taunting and I have done nothing. As you can see here the very second Darkness lands, I have aggro.

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I had aggro until the mob was killed, more on that later.

Next up: Lesser Charbone, higher lvl than the last, same HP % (which means the pet actually had to do more damage than the last one. Same outcome:

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Another light blue, lower lvl than my pet. Iksar Bandit:

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Still not casting yet, and yes I'm a necro >.<

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Bandit is at 75% with pet taunting and the very second the spell lands, I have immediate and absolute aggro, again.

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And as before, I kept aggro the entire time, just from 1 Darkness spell, doing nothing but running after that:

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Overview of some of the details of that fight. Just to point out, I did nothing but cast 1 stupid Darkness spell the entire fight and run from then on:

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[Knightmare]

Pt 2:

Another Charbone, all I cast on this previously was lvl 4 Poison Bolt, waited until it was almost 1/2 dead (67%) and still got aggro the second Darkness was cast:

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How about a green? My pet should surely be able to hold aggro on a green, no?

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Green mob is at 69% and again, I get instant aggro until the mob dies...

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In Group: Goblin Brawler at 58% hp. The tank is the same lvl as me. Blue mob, instant Darkness aggro even still:

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Kept aggro until mob death. Scenery changes because I was not just standing next to it getting beat on:

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Again on a Sarnak, didn't get Darkness to land until 38% (only tried one other cast on this). Again, despite the damn thing being near dead, I got aggro:

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At this point, why bother even running. I mean really.

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I know there could be better info, and I don't have links to the old aggro tables. But I can say that it should be pretty clear that my current spell aggro is out of control. I cannot cast a DoT above my lvl 4 Poison Bolt without getting threat (I'll do some screenies of Heart Flutter and such later).

The point is, even if I wait until the mob is 1/2 dead, and have a group, with an even /con tank, I still get aggro from 1 dot. So, as of last night, I send pet, ghetto heal the tank, and lifetap when mob is 35%.

And I don't mean this as a rant or flame, my apologies if it comes off that way. You guys do a great job on this server and have your hands full, especially lately. However, this threat is out of control. Factor this in with the out of whack resist rate and really.. it makes it pointless to bother. Oftentimes I get resisted, when I don't, I get instant aggro.. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Striiker]

I am running into this issue as well. I know that my pet should be doing a better job of holding aggro. There wasn't this issue until a couple of months ago when the aggro for spells was adjusted some how and suddenly, I could no longer sit through any fights while my pet was attacking. Prior to that, it was as it should have been where I could let my pet get aggro and then cast a couple of DOTs and not get aggro or if I did, it was brief until my pet taunted and did more damage.
I'm running into this a lot too with my enchanter where I get aggro way too easy now. I will try to document what I am experiencing better than this but I wanted to post quickly in agreement with the OP

[Knightmare]

I'll work on the screenshots of other DoTs next like Heart Flutter and such. Those are more difficult to test as getting aggro without a snare makes kiting harder or more mana intensive.

Just another side note I didn't specifically mention above, I didn't take a bunch screenshots of the mob chasing me all over, just the second the spell landed and the mob turned to chase me and whatever I could safely get after that.

I didn't even think to test my Enchanter.. have to do that next. Thanks [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Yinaltin]

ya i miss the "old " pre patch days , too . my normal business nowadays is pull mob with snare , dot him , root him let pet hit until mob is dead . that means i have to use 100 extra mana on each mob (lvl 53 necro using paralysing earth)

[Knightmare]

Yeah which is kinda humorous cause we're supposedly the fear-kite class, not the root-rot class lol.

Then again, with the resists hosed it all kinda sucks >.<

[Grizlor]

Just aggro kite and sit for the med tick. If I can do it with SoW and no snare you can do it with snare :P

[Knightmare]

Aye. I don't mean to imply, nor was I saying, that the class is broken. It's not a question of whether we can kite or not. It's generally easy for 1 class to come in and tell another class that they're okay. A good counter-point would be if you got what was clearly too much aggro for every heal you cast. It doesn't mean you cannot heal, it does however diminish how effectively, and reduce your desirability in groups (so sue me, I'm a grouping Necro lol). Bad analogy perhaps as it wouldn't affect your solo ability.. but then I don't have plate and a buncha HP when things go wrong. It doesn't take more than a few hits and I'm down.

The point is that things are not in line with what they should be, nor with what's sensible. Also your point about kiting doesn't address the group situation, my group members rather I don't run around like a nut with the mob chasing me lol.

Nobody except perhaps a big DD/Heal cast too early should get instant aggro, least of all before even 1 tick of 11pts is done to a mob at 75%. That is out of line with all reason.

Edit: another thing to factor in, your SoW cannot be resisted. Darkness can, and with the current increased resist rates make life more painful under the current circumstances. It's not a matter of assuming we can kite like you can. Apples and oranges, so like I mentioned at the start, it's easy for you to come in and say we're okay because your class is okay.. we still function.. bit it's kinda messier than it oughta be [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Hakurou]

Throwing in my experience here. Bond of Death seems to produce heal agro. I sent my pet into a group of four mobs, cast Bond of Death onto the one my pet was tanking (and contrary to the usual instant agro the mob stayed on the pet) but the three other mobs came charging at me instantly after BoD landed and before even healing the first tick.

DoTs seem to generated full or at least excessive agro on cast in addition to the normal gradual buildup of agro with each tick and that's why necromancers currently have a very out of whack hate generation. DoTs like BoD and the Boil Blood line used to be rather low agro compared to poison and disease type DoTs.

[Ropethunder]

The necro snare line is a huge aggro getter. This is actually a GOOD thing for kiting at higher levels where mobs will eat your pet.