Green/Red99

[Fammaden]

Originally Posted by Lowlife [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some classic things are better left to memory, PVP servers being one of them.

[Squire]

Originally Posted by Osprey39 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, as I recall it was not. The three teams could definitely not group together as I remember I was always very nervous going to HHK to buy pet spells on my Good Team chanter because it was a Neutral Team stronghold. I could illusion to human and fool them visually but I frequently got tells asking if I wanted to group while there and I knew if they tried to invite me it would fail and the jig would be up.

I'm also pretty certain you could not form guilds with members from other teams either so that pretty much eliminated any kind of cross teaming.

That's pretty BA. 3 factions if definitely the way to go imho. As long as u can't heal/buff etc people from other factions, turn common tounge off etc

[walfreyydo]

The issue with teams pvp is that the "Dark" team never gets access to Druids, Bards or Rangers (ie: Track). How essential those three classes are to end-game progression, I am not 100% sure, but it seems that lacking Track in any form can be a huge problem, not to mention the additional benefits that Druids and Bards bring (buffs/songs).

On Tallon Zek a guild called "Pandemonium" decided to start breaking the team-based rules of the server and start a cross team guild for the ultimate goal of progression (and server domination). This resulted in all sorts of problems from OOR healers to a large gulf in gearing of their characters vs everyone else as they pushed through end-game faster than any other guild (by far).

In order to offset this threat and dominance, other guilds had to follow suit.

This would be my main concern for any future teams server - when one group decides to ignore the rules and cheat the system. Perhaps the development team can find a suitable workaround that can anticipate these sorts of issues.

Me personally, I am in favor of teams PvP as long as these issues can be addressed and anticipated appropriately.

Also, once they figure that out will need to figure out how to keep team Human from dominating the world. The best system is probably 2 teams (light vs dark) IMO - and this was essentially how it was on TZ, with some rare exceptions for pure race, pvp focused guilds (Human only, elf only).

[Lowlife]

Originally Posted by walfreyydo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The issue with teams pvp is that the "Dark" team never gets access to Druids, Bards or Rangers (ie: Track). How essential those three classes are to end-game progression, I am not 100% sure, but it seems that lacking Track in any form can be a huge problem, not to mention the additional benefits that Druids and Bards bring (buffs/songs).

On Tallon Zek a guild called "Pandemonium" decided to start breaking the team-based rules of the server and start a cross team guild for the ultimate goal of progression (and server domination). This resulted in all sorts of problems from OOR healers to a large gulf in gearing of their characters vs everyone else as they pushed through end-game faster than any other guild (by far).

In order to offset this threat and dominance, other guilds had to follow suit.

This would be my main concern for any future teams server - when one group decides to ignore the rules and cheat the system. Perhaps the development team can find a suitable workaround that can anticipate these sorts of issues.

Me personally, I am in favor of teams PvP as long as these issues can be addressed and anticipated appropriately.

Also, once they figure that out will need to figure out how to keep team Human from dominating the world. The best system is probably 2 teams (light vs dark) IMO - and this was essentially how it was on TZ, with some rare exceptions for pure race, pvp focused guilds (Human only, elf only).

It would be hard coded rather than unofficial "rules" to follow.

[Pootle]

Originally Posted by walfreyydo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, once they figure that out will need to figure out how to keep team Human from dominating the world. The best system is probably 2 teams (light vs dark) IMO - and this was essentially how it was on TZ, with some rare exceptions for pure race, pvp focused guilds (Human only, elf only).

i used to play on VallonZek, was 4 team, but while there were some pure team guilds, the majority of the server was Light-v-Dark.

Good times.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Originally Posted by Lowlife [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As this is not PvPcentric discussion but rather a server discussion I felt it best to be posted here.

From the Green Server page on the Project 1999 Wiki

"Blue = Beta
In many ways the Blue server can be thought of as being like a Beta Server for the Green Server. Thanks to Blue anything that the developers code is likely to be tested by hundreds, if not thousands of different players. However, precisely because it serves this purpose, Blue isn't a true realization of the Project's goal."

So if Blue=Beta I'd assert Red is definitely a beta as well. As a teams server doesn't seem to be on the table anytime soon will the red server receive the same opportunity to "recycle" as blue? Given the demand for Green seems to be massive I personally don't think the additional server giving players more options would be "wasteful".

How many of you would be interested in a fresh "Green"PvP server launching along side Green? Perhaps we can get some commentary from the staff on this regard.

blue = beta
red = alpha

or so I've heard

[Squire]

Originally Posted by indiscriminate_hater [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

blue = beta
red = alpha

or so I've heard

time2recycle red then fam

[Toomuch]

Cross teaming was not possible. The only way to buff/heal someone on another team was using group/ae buffs, AND dueling them (which was best to do in a non-pvp zone, like the bazaar, but could be done elsewhere if you wanted, it just nearly never happened, for obvious reasons). And even with that, the only "cross team" buffs that people ever really did was like KEI or POTG or some-such.

Now, it actually goes deeper than that, because of something else that WAS allowed - training.

Technically, training was only allowed against other teams, but competition was EXTREMELY fierce, and drama also ran high on a no-rules server, so even the weakest team (the "Good" team) ended up training themselves from time to time. This wouldn't have been all that bad if GM's actually hadn't given up on enforcing rules, because same team training would have been so short-lived it wouldn't be worth it, but without rule enforcement, and no way to root/snare/hurt your own team, it was just devastating.

There were also notorious hackers that did it for years and never got banned. I'm looking at YOU, Fetto and Gowenna (neutral team), your names are burned into my soul. I forgot the names of your 2x super-harmtouch evil toons, but at that point it was just more of the same from another angle, and faster, so whatever. Rant aside, people would instantly warp to you in a zone and manaburn/superharmtouch and then warp out, then rinse/repeat when the disc/ability was back up. You could petition them 10,000 times, and it didn't matter, almost nobody did anything about it, except for a few GM's who picked teams to <3 more than others (one certain GM was named Jamlamin - see sig below from a raid where he somehow got charmed, and I did not hesitate to Trueshot). I'm ranting again...

My point is, Sullon ruleset was amazing, we just needed a fair bit more rule enforcement, and the exact anti-hacking enforcement that P99 has already come up with and uses. And people have been clamoring for a pvp reset for ever...

My biggest gripe with Sullon was that they said they were going to try to do things to help the outnumbered & outmatched teams, and never did. You could loot coin and an "Insignia of (Name_of_Diety)" if the person you killed was within +-5 levels of you, and the idea was that the lowest population/progression team would get some really useful rewards and/or buff pots (some kind of "throw me a bone here" bonus), the middle population/progression team would get middle tier rewards, and the highest population/progression team would get lowest tier rewards. The only thing they ever implemented was summon corpse pots, across the board. Useful, yes, but it basically paid to jump on the bandwagon team. Lots of people jumped ship to do it, it was lame.

side note: they also had things coded so your account could only be aligned with 1 team, so to switch teams, you really had to go all in.

My next biggest gripe could be mitigated with a certain implementation of that reward system mentioned earlier. Due to the teams being diety restricted, the good and neutral teams had no Necromancers (no twitches or DMF) or SK's (not that big of a deal for pve, but SK's helped win pvp fights, or even derail trains to raids, VERY easily. Think: "here comes Mrmonk with 50 giants! Harmer and Badtouch, go take care of him!" and 2 button presses later, Mrmonk is "down and coined" to use the SZ terminology). So to slightly compensate, one of the random rewards for PVP insignias could be DMF pots, or possibly even single cast twitch pots, maybe only usable by Clerics, or maybe class specific mana pots, or something along those lines. And conversely, the evil team did not have any Paladins, Rangers, or Druids, and there could be pvp rewards for those classes' spells as well. IMO, this kind of thing makes Sullon ruleset so doable and desirable that it's just incredibly sad to not see it happen.

Edit: contrary to what was said above, Evil team did in fact have access to bards. There were a couple infamous ones on Sullon Zek - Pino comes to mind, and so does Nancy (male character), Jennifer (also male character, welcome to pvp servers), Darksong, Speedd (Kirban's bard when Kirban got banned for hacking, temporarily only somehow), and more.

[pink grapefruit]

i made this post on red forums but it's relevant so you guys paste

By now we know the teams server is probably never going to happen, but with the excitement over green happening I'm feeling nerdy, nostalgic, and a tiny bit hopeful. Maybe instead of a server wipe, red could just be ended for good. And then maybe a brand new server could start up? Anyway I want to nerd out a little and imagine how teams could work.

Deity based is cool af, and I like the SZ teams but it's kinda lame that classes are missing from all the teams: evils lack druid, paladiin, ranger; and goods/neuts lack necro, SK.

Fix:
Human and half elf druids/paladins/rangers can now worship Rallos Zek
Erudite, gnome, and human SKs/necros can now worship Sol Ro
Erudite, gnome, and human SKs/necros can now worship Quellious

This bends the lore a bit, particularly the peace-loving SKs; but a lot of things never made sense in the lore (like evil and good chars grouping together at all) and this leaves lore intact as much as possible while still allowing balance.

Also since evil team is OP, goods and neuts should be softcoded together like VZ teams, allowing them to group/guild together but still pvp each other. And some kinda IP block thing preventing people from creating chars on other factions would be necessary, if even possible.

*dreams nerdily*

[Jibartik]

I predict if green99 is extremely popular, purple99 will shortly follow. Or at the latest be what green99 becomes after it is complete, and then again and again. again and again and again.