OoA timers

[Anichek]

Originally Posted by Drakakade [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anichek, you keep bringing in these other bits and pieces, which are not germane to the issue at this time.

Let me be clear: IF there was no YDYN agreement then BDA did nothing wrong, but if there was a YDYN agreement then possibly BDA did something wrong.

I have stated multiple times that BDA never entered into the YDYN agreement which was discussed post-Velious launch. I linked the thread earlier in a reply as well. We could not ratify an agreement that would exclude content from us as we do not hold a Sky day, which we volunteered/forfeited upon the launch of Velious.

[bktroost]

It also appears that there are two separate noble encounters mentioned in the above Ani posts. One happening at midnight and another during Cloki's scheduled kill? One in which it was abandoned and another where the owner of a day was moving to kill their Noble.

[Pan]

Ani, this is pretty embarrassing. You should at least try to get your stories straight before posting.

Originally Posted by Anichek [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you see a spot where BDA agreed in a new YDYN conversation, post-Velious launch?

[Wed Oct 07 15:59:34 2015] Cloki -> chest: so you're fucking the agreement?
[Wed Oct 07 16:00:27 2015] Chest -> Cloki: i'm not fucking anything. I'm telling you that we weren't aware that we were at the threshhold. Since it's been YDYN BDA hasn't seen a single noble at all, and I've already ported my raidforce up as I wasn't aware that it was already past the threshold

Chest is aware of the agreement and plays the card that he's not aware that there were 3 up as to why BDA is there. Further, he notes that BDA hasn't taken a shot at a Noble since Velious (invoking the agreement).

Originally Posted by Anichek [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am not privvy to the first Noble kill that BDA did (the Cloki v. Chest kill), but I was online and did approve the kill of Noble last night, and considered the YDYN situation before authorizing it.

And ran absolutely contrary to both the nature of the conversation that Chest and I had...as well as contradicted him directly:

[Wed Oct 07 16:00:51 2015] Chest -> Cloki: so we're already here, we're going to kill a noble under the YDYN crap, and then we won't kill another this week
[Wed Oct 07 16:01:42 2015] Chest -> Cloki: and then we won't kill another this week, and on any of the other dumb days of the weekwhere people aren't in sky feel free to kill a noble

Originally Posted by Anichek [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

3) Whomever holds the Wednesday YDYN spawn was not attempting to kill noble, therefore

Could well be that the timers weren't shared. Like they were in the past. Nor were guilds contacted when the thing popped. Like they were in the past.

Originally Posted by Anichek [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are there any other things I can clarify for you? I do not understand why a midnight kill on an abandoned Noble is an issue.

The midnight kill is a secondary issue. The primary is in the third post of the thread.
The midnight kill is an issue only because:

1. Chest said twice that BDA wasn't gonna kill another noble this week. Twice. So he lied to me twice, given the midnight kill.
2. BDA, contrary to the wont here, didn't share timers which becomes infinitely more important with only a 15 minute window. And BDA was the ONLY guild with timers, according to Chest. We knew there was one due on Wed (sometime after 6pm US EDT) because Xak saw an OoA pop yesterday.
[Wed Oct 07 15:57:55 2015] Chest -> Cloki: there hasn't been 3, because we're the only guild that's been killing nobles
It was entirely incumbent on BDA to post the timer, per how it's worked in the past.
3. In which timezone is 11:45-12:09? We posted times in EDT whereas Chest posted times in CST. That's something that we've never gotten straight.

I'm really astonished that this is coming from you, Ani.

That said, let's assign days to guilds that want to kill nobles.

[Drakakade]

Well, another small step forward.

First, AG (Nemce I think - put a sig in plz), I am not sure if there were 2 nobles or not - either Anichek, as guild relations officers, is unwilling to ask his guild or unable to ask his guild. Perhaps, Omni can confirm?

IF there was only 1 Noble and it sat up for 6 hours and BDA killed it at midnight, then that's a whole different kettle of fish, and I don't see any thing wrong with that.

IF there were 2 Nobles and IF Omni were moving towards killing their OoA as per the YDYN agreement which was in place under all the previous OoA agreements, well, then that's another issue.

Second, Anichek, I don't see post where BDA formally states that they opt out of a YDYN agreement - I only see a post from Chest saying, "YDYN is what I always wanted." I believe that every guild in the OoA agreement was operating under the aegis of the previous YDYN agreement that went with the previous OoA agreement.

However, if BDA thinks that YDYN no longer works (and it may not) then the nice thing to do would have to put up a post instead of creating all this drama with your arch-nemesis Omni, and wasting everyone's time trying to figure out who threw sand in whose face first.

Moreover, if you guys did kill Omni's Noble when they were mobilizing for it, then I think the right thing to do is apologize for a bad call and forfeit some a noble to Omni.

However, if said Noble sat up for 6 hours and BDA killed it then imo, there is nothing wrong with that. Any, kind of allocation agreement should have an "1 hour to engage" or it's FFA clause.

[Pan]

They killed it. Look at one of Ani's posts. He confirmed it. We also saw it die.

Furthermore, when a Noble rolls into the next day (after 15 mins in this case because the timers were not shared - which has been done in the past to avoid such things) and belongs to the next YDYN folks (in this case thursday). It's not loose. It's not FFA...at least not by precedent.

Drak, we were not mobilizing for it. We were already there and had a kill force in place. And watched them kill it.

[Ella`Ella]

Cloki,

You wanna team up for all Trak's going forward, split teeth 50/50 and lock down VP on BDA? Can split up VP loot either on a joint Loot Council or /ran for first pick.

[Anichek]

Originally Posted by Pan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ani, this is pretty embarrassing. You should at least try to get your stories straight before posting.


[Wed Oct 07 15:59:34 2015] Cloki -> chest: so you're fucking the agreement?
[Wed Oct 07 16:00:27 2015] Chest -> Cloki: i'm not fucking anything. I'm telling you that we weren't aware that we were at the threshhold. Since it's been YDYN BDA hasn't seen a single noble at all, and I've already ported my raidforce up as I wasn't aware that it was already past the threshold

Chest is aware of the agreement and plays the card that he's not aware that there were 3 up as to why BDA is there. Further, he notes that BDA hasn't taken a shot at a Noble since Velious (invoking the agreement).



And ran absolutely contrary to both the nature of the conversation that Chest and I had...as well as contradicted him directly:

[Wed Oct 07 16:00:51 2015] Chest -> Cloki: so we're already here, we're going to kill a noble under the YDYN crap, and then we won't kill another this week
[Wed Oct 07 16:01:42 2015] Chest -> Cloki: and then we won't kill another this week, and on any of the other dumb days of the weekwhere people aren't in sky feel free to kill a noble



Could well be that the timers weren't shared. Like they were in the past. Nor were guilds contacted when the thing popped. Like they were in the past.



The midnight kill is a secondary issue. The primary is in the third post of the thread.
The midnight kill is an issue only because:

1. Chest said twice that BDA wasn't gonna kill another noble this week. Twice. So he lied to me twice, given the midnight kill.
2. BDA, contrary to the wont here, didn't share timers which becomes infinitely more important with only a 15 minute window. And BDA was the ONLY guild with timers, according to Chest. We knew there was one due on Wed (sometime after 6pm US EDT) because Xak saw an OoA pop yesterday.
[Wed Oct 07 15:57:55 2015] Chest -> Cloki: there hasn't been 3, because we're the only guild that's been killing nobles
It was entirely incumbent on BDA to post the timer, per how it's worked in the past.
3. In which timezone is 11:45-12:09? We posted times in EDT whereas Chest posted times in CST. That's something that we've never gotten straight.

I'm really astonished that this is coming from you, Ani.

That said, let's assign days to guilds that want to kill nobles.

Sorry to disappoint. I'm posting from work and trying not to dive into a huge research post-war.

From what you posted:
- Chest acknowledges there was a YDYN in place. We don't have a day.
- I posted a timer which spurred conversation and screaming.
- I shall retreat to our Officer forums to discuss potential for a Noble Agreement, in conjunction with the OoA Agreement, and look forward to seeing what is brought to the table so we can all have some fun.

[Anichek]

Originally Posted by Drakakade [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

However, if BDA thinks that YDYN no longer works (and it may not) then the nice thing to do would have to put up a post instead of creating all this drama with your arch-nemesis Omni

Pretty sure Omni's not our arch-nemesis. We rarely cross paths with them.

Originally Posted by Drakakade [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

However, if said Noble sat up for 6 hours and BDA killed it then imo, there is nothing wrong with that. Any, kind of allocation agreement should have an "1 hour to engage" or it's FFA clause.

Like I said, I look forward to seeing what can happen. I whole-heartedly acknowledge that balancing the OoA agreement while finding a way to implement something for Nobles isn't going to be easy.

[bktroost]

Originally Posted by Ella`Ella [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Cloki,

You wanna team up for all Trak's going forward, split teeth 50/50 and lock down VP on BDA? Can split up VP loot either on a joint Loot Council or /ran for first pick.

This is not my race war, but any guild that causes a negative impact on the server must be accountable to that servers leadership, or in a mutual agreement violation, accountable to the larger body that agreement represents.

I think that if an outright and willful infraction was committed without that guild making personal apologies and recompense then you'll find many guilds interested in joint recourse. Without it we are back to IB and the nuclear meltdown of 2014.

[Sadad]

Originally Posted by bktroost [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is not my race war, but any guild that causes a negative impact on the server must be accountable to that servers leadership, or in a mutual agreement violation, accountable to the larger body that agreement represents.

I think that if an outright and willful infraction was committed without that guild making personal apologies and recompense then you'll find many guilds interested in joint recourse. Without it we are back to IB and the nuclear meltdown of 2014.

Uh, what? You really comparing BDA killing a noble in front of 6 Omni to the most efficient and ruthless RMT operation on the server?

This is pretty simple, fellas.

BDA agreed to not kill any OoAs.

BDA did not agree to YDYN post-Velious.

We didn't kill an OoA. We did kill a Noble.