Game Mechanics: Sneak pulling

[paulgiamatti]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On EQlive, I did some tests with sneak just now. I saw no reduction in aggro range, if sneak was up. If sneak was up, the indifferent mob I was behind, you could get right on top of them just about. And no aggro. They were indifferent.

No one's saying that the sneak ability should work any differently than it currently does - we're talking about sneak pulling social aggro mechanics specifically. So it would be a totally separate thing - a second special aggro radius that appears the instant your projectile hits a mob while you're sneaking. Your standard sneak wouldn't break, meaning you could throw that projectile standing right next to another mob without it noticing.

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I body pulled, and they did not hit me. No adds. With the one aggro'd pulled right over the top of one i was behind.

Yeah I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if sneak pulling on current EQ live works a lot like it does here - the thing you guys need to be asking as developers who want to make this a true recreation is if lots of testimonials pulled from period-correct message board posts is more legitimate than the way it currently works on live. This issue might be too complicated and ambiguous to really run with anything though, so it's totally understandable to go the EQ live route.

[paulgiamatti]

Originally Posted by Phantasm [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well thats unclear. Was he sneaking? Was it simply reduced mob aggro radius from sneak or a mob LoS check?

Hmm, actually on a second look he might not have been. It was posted in a thread where they were discussing sneak pulling though. Also, it was posted after they implemented the new aggro mechanic changes like lazy aggro, so that makes it even more unclear. I can only assume those changes affected sneak pulling in some way - I'd rather see the lazy aggro stuff get implemented on P99 first.

[Ikon]

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Basically this is sneak pulling from the front.

Normally any mob that you can hit that would normally be assisted will be well within the assist radius.

However with sneak the assist radius shrinks so that with skill you can pull mobs from the front that normally wouldn't be possible.

[paulgiamatti]

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So the mob's normal social assist still applies - there are just some line of sight checks going on when it's a sneak pull. It checks if the mob you tag is looking at you, and if that fails (meaning it's looking away and therefore a potentially successful sneak pull) then it checks for mobs within its normal social aggro radius. If mobs exist = true, then it performs another line of sight check between those mobs and you.

However, here's another potential mechanic, which would partially explain what you're describing:

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Even in that scenario, there would still be a line of sight check between you and the mob you're tagging, and if that check = true then it would use its normal social assist - the sneak tag would fail. In other words, the other mob that's looking at you would only stay put if the mob you're tagging is looking away.

[Ikon]

Originally Posted by paulgiamatti [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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So the mob's normal social assist still applies - there are just some line of sight checks going on when it's a sneak pull. It checks if the mob you tag is looking at you, and if that fails (meaning it's looking away and therefore a potentially successful sneak pull) then it checks for mobs within its normal social aggro radius. If mobs exist = true, then it performs another line of sight check between those mobs and you.

However, here's another potential mechanic, which would partially explain what you're describing:

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Even in that scenario, there would still be a line of sight check between you and the mob you're tagging, and if that check = true then it would use its normal social assist - the sneak tag would fail. In other words, the other mob that's looking at you would only stay put if the mob you're tagging is looking away.

I'm not sure exactly how it worked, what you say might have been how it worked sure.

There was a way to pull mobs with sneak when they were both looking at you, as described in the link I posted earlier. I was imagining it worked based on a radius centred aroun the player. As in if the PC had a radius of 100 and the mob was outside of that radius then it wouldnt matter if the extra mob was looking or not, it couldnt see you. If you tagged a mob at 99 and the other mob was at 101 the other mob would just stand there.

Thats just speculation though.

[Phantasm]

Find a straight line of low level mobs on a high level monk.
Make sure you can get only one to attack you with body aggro.
Find max distance sit aggro affects you.
Turn on sneak.
Repeat
If sneak reduces frontal proxyimity aggro then it should prove as T/F. I think it mostly has to do with level though. Maybe also dealing with server tick issue.

To solve if sneak affects the social radius of a tagged mob then do the same as above but with mobs lined up across from one another. Like the jail cell in KC(just lower level).

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by Phantasm [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Find a straight line of low level mobs on a high level monk.
Make sure you can get only one to attack you with body aggro.
Find max distance sit aggro affects you.
Turn on sneak.
Repeat
If sneak reduces frontal proxyimity aggro then it should prove as T/F. I think it mostly has to do with level though. Maybe also dealing with server tick issue.

To solve if sneak affects the social radius of a tagged mob then do the same as above but with mobs lined up across from one another. Like the jail cell in KC(just lower level).

Sneak does not reduce aggro radius on EQlive.

H

[Raev]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sneak does not reduce aggro radius on EQlive.

H

What experiments did you do, exactly, and what was the result?

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What experiments did you do, exactly, and what was the result?

Was waiting on ur detailed test plan.

[Raev]

No need for snark; I'm just curious because I remember reading Torven saying sneak didn't work at all on Live, so I'm wondering what the difference was.