Game Mechanics: Rogue hide

[WolfsongReborn]

Yeah, rogue hide is definitely strange here. I remember it's benefit being that damn near nothing could see through it other than very specific mobs and dragons. That's what made it so valuable on raid CR's and whatnot. Here it just seems a combo of invis and invisundead and subject to being seen by any that can see through those.

Then again, I don't remember it being quite so uselessly slow.

[Fjolvar]

Bump - I've been on strike from playing EQ because my rogue hide is gimped. Please fix this GMs.


Actually I've been really busy and can't play. I just want this fixed >: (

[Mud]

To the top.

[Garg]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Both pve and pvp will be patched, but it's important to test potential bugs on the beta server beforehand.

For the love of kittens please let this be updated in the upcoming patch!

[bulbousaur]

I didn't see anything about this in the patch notes.

[4WOFURY]

/cry

[Droog007]

I'm glad that this didn't go through. You guys are asking for too much and you're justifying it with silly posts from the adolescents of yesteryear. Posts, I might add, which can be interpreted very differently than your wishful thinking is allowing you to.

In this thread, post after post people are crying about sneak/hide being worse than regular invis - completely disregarding the power of sneak and invis+ivu (which should not stack at all in spell form, BTW). I think you've also got people getting mixed up with how AWESOME Shroud of Stealth was, and how much time they spent in old world zones AFTER AA's were implemented.

1. A Pre-SoS hidden rogue has the benefit of invis and ivu. Period. Sneak is where the magic happens. I believe sneak was not 100% infallible though - certain animals seemed to possess senses that made them immune to sneak. I recall making a remark about it once in /gu when a canine mob with its back to me was scowling. And then there are the gifted bats in Guk. This was one of the coolest things about EverQuest... lots of things had sound reasoning behind them, even in a fantasy world ruled by a RNG. Maybe these animals with their extra sensory powers is the reason Invisibility to Animals was ever even developed - ever think of that? Hmm?
2. I have a hard time believing that there are separate flags on mobs for see invis and see hide. If there is - to which Kanras has alluded - I can only guess that in this case "hide" was short for "shroud of stealth" (which, I feel it's important to note, became synonymous with "rogue hide" after AA's dropped, so crucial was the skill).
3. Finally, Cecily is posting about undead mobs seeing through regular invis and proposing it as evidence for this fantasy.... one example in many of the aforementioned wishful interpretations. OK, this is probably unfair - in this particular post, Cecily is talking specifically about which mobs can see what in PoH, which I also agree is wrong on P99. SOME liches and SOME banshees should see through hide (as easily as they see through IVU), but not all of them - and that might be it. Most other mobs are either live (and do not see invis) or undead (and do not see through IVU) - but ONLY a rogue should be able to be invis to both of the latter.

All that said - I do think that there are certain zones in P99 that are more difficult to navigate as a rogue than they were on EQC. Probably just need to tone down the chance of a mob spawning with the innate ability to see invis. And another note - I don't think mobs ever casted see invis on themselves or others, but they DID turn to face their target when they casted a buff on a buddy (very important for sneakers)

[Droog007]

Originally Posted by Droog007 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...lots of things had sound reasoning behind them...

See what I did there? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[4WOFURY]

I'm assuming you didn't review any of the factual evidence posted by extremely knowledgable players pre-PoP, such as certain mobs in SolDungA/B seeing thorough invisibility but not hide (kobolds and goblins), as well as the mobs in PoHate that saw through invis/ivu but not hide, and the ones that did see through hide.

Sure, some of the things people posted were originally posted by inexperienced people, but the evidence others and I have posted can not be ignored because of those posts.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by 4WOFURY [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm assuming you didn't review any of the factual evidence posted by extremely knowledgable players pre-PoP, such as certain mobs in SolDungA/B seeing thorough invisibility but not hide (kobolds and goblins), as well as the mobs in PoHate that saw through invis/ivu but not hide, and the ones that did see through hide.

Sure, some of the things people posted were originally posted by inexperienced people, but the evidence others and I have posted can not be ignored because of those posts.

by pre-PoP do you mean Luclin aka the introduction of AAs aka what that guy is talking about.....