Most Useful/Game Changing Epic

[Lojik]

Just curious as to people's opinions on which class epic is the most useful/game changing? I play a Shaman so I'd give a vote to shaman epic being a gamechanger, at least in terms of being able to solo. Wizard is great too if you have a manastone. Cleric epic obviously gets a lot of use too.

Feel free to disagree.

Crap forgot about Mage epic. #1?

[Ele]

Raw power - mage
most useful - cleric

Rogue doesn't count as a rogue this server with out epic :P

[t0lkien]

The Bard epic is a total game changer. It's one of the best IMO. Looking at the game from a whole though, I'd say the Cleric epic is the one that effects the entire dynamic of the endgame the most.

[Asap]

My vote is for mage epic. Pet is beastly and becomes a game changer and can pretty much duo anything with donals bp cleric.

Plus it's one of the rarest epics on P99

[astuce999]

If you work the problem backwards, which class took the longest time to «bag» their epic, bards win easily. Bards complained about being stuck with their epic for years!

'stuce

[Nephayres]

The necromancer epic is a real game changer, in the sense that it made me change games to Final Fantasy XI.

[t0lkien]

If you work the problem backwards, which class took the longest time to «bag» their epic, bards win easily. Bards complained about being stuck with their epic for years!

'stuce

Complaining about being stuck with something because it's too good to put down is the ultimate petulance, and I always felt as much. The top Bards really could be precious little princesses back then. The majority of Bards dreamed of winning the epic, and never achieved it.

Up to Velious, the Bard Epic is brilliant anyway :)

[Emphase]

I'd have to say Bard epic

[webrunner5]

When, and if ever, Velious comes out you will kiss a Cleric's ass for having a Epic. End of discussion. :p

[Asap]

The necromancer epic is a real game changer, in the sense that it made me change games to Final Fantasy XI.

lmao

[Lojik]

I'd have to say Bard epic
I'm not so familiar with the bard class or epic. It gives + to all instruments right? Or is the effect Dance of the blades awesome?

[quido]

Not only is that proc awesome, and not only is it a solid melee weapon you can use without having to worry about swapping an instrument, but what makes it REALLY badass imo is the fact that it provides a modifier for singing which was previously unattainable.

[Cecily]

Imagine a world without Ragebringers.

[fohkure]

Not only is that proc awesome, and not only is it a solid melee weapon you can use without having to worry about swapping an instrument, but what makes it REALLY badass imo is the fact that it provides a modifier for singing which was previously unattainable.

exactly, dat singing mod y0!

[zanderklocke]

Cleric is overall probably used to benefit the most amount of people.

However, I think the bard epic completely changes how the class plays. If I had my bard epic, I would be twisting a different set of songs in group due to the fact that now all songs can be made 1.8 times better, when in the past, some songs were not modified at all. On raids I would also be twisting different resist songs and melee fighting as opposed to just standing in the background with a drum.

Are there any other classes that change how they play based on their epic?

[Ganjar]

Big bad Mage air pet!!

[contemptor]

bard or mage, solo, cleric for others

[bloodmuffin]

Warrior epic, obviously.

[Tiggles]

Imagine a world without Ragebringers.

[mishurza]

bard epic is cool. mage epic is op. How much time does a CR take for a 40man raid when 0 clerics have epics? Back in the land of live where kunark wasnt a 2 year venture or whatever, it meant everything for your raid to have an epic cleric. I played on Veeshan, and Fires of Heaven dominated end game content with hardcore dedication and much secrecy. I remember farming ToV gear before my guild had an epic cleric and I remember wiping being a rather unpleasant timesink. I don't think this server fully appreciates the magnitude of how awesome this epic his because it has become so commonplace.

[Handull]

cleric epic is the biggest game changer for raiding

bard epic is the best single epic, useful for solo, group, and raid content

[webrunner5]

cleric epic is the biggest game changer for raiding

bard epic is the best single epic, useful for solo, group, and raid content

I would tend to agree with that statement. Would even add Cleric epic game changer even in a group. But the Bard with a epic in a group would sure help also no doubt.

I wonder how many Bard epic's even are in the game? I am hard pressed to remember seeing even one of them in the tunnel or grouped.

[Asap]

I wonder how many Bard epic's even are in the game? I am hard pressed to remember seeing even one of them in the tunnel or grouped.

Every bard in tmo, every bard alt in tmo, a couple in FE

[zanderklocke]

Couple rich characters with bard epics too. I only need the 3 dragon pieces, and that runs 350K+ from TMO.

In theory, there could be a lot of bard epics on the server. I mean I assume trakanon drops his guts fairly often, and at least 2-3 red dragon scales due to raid targets and Ragefire are entering the server a week. Not sure how many white dragon scales are entering the server a week, but I would guess at least 1, if not more.

I mean the trakanon guts, which are likely being stockpiled, are the only not reasonably affordable part to the bard epic.

[Kevynne]

powerful=Mage
useful= cleric
useless= necromancer
best overall= bard

iirc pally and sk epics were also terrible.
and ranger epics are the only good thing about that class imo

[Beaniron]

http://www.geocities.jp/hand01jp/Graphics/EQ000207.JPG

That is all.

[TarukShmaruk]

Couple rich characters with bard epics too. I only need the 3 dragon pieces, and that runs 350K+ from TMO.

In theory, there could be a lot of bard epics on the server. I mean I assume trakanon drops his guts fairly often, and at least 2-3 red dragon scales due to raid targets and Ragefire are entering the server a week. Not sure how many white dragon scales are entering the server a week, but I would guess at least 1, if not more.

I mean the trakanon guts, which are likely being stockpiled, are the only not reasonable affordable part to the bard epic.

Why don't you just ask if you can contribute some barding to TMO in return for looting the trak guts if nobody in guild needs them?

[zanderklocke]

Why don't you just ask if you can contribute some barding to TMO in return for looting the trak guts if nobody in guild needs them?

They sell the guts. There is no way they would give them to me for free (or for any barding activity) when they can sell them to people for 350K. Nothing I can offer, in my opinion, to TMO in terms of my bard-time would be valued at 350K.

I mean I guess I could ask to help them poopsock or something to earn them, but I would feel sort of insulting even asking that.

[Grahm]

The necromancer epic is a real game changer, in the sense that it made me change games to Final Fantasy XI.

This is golden.

[Rhambuk]

Imagine a world without Ragebringers.

So true, also one of the harder epics to bag.

[TarukShmaruk]

They sell the guts. There is no way they would give them to me for free (or for any barding activity) when they can sell them to people for 350K. Nothing I can offer, in my opinion, to TMO in terms of my bard-time would be valued at 350K.

I mean I guess I could ask to help them poopsock or something to earn them, but I would feel sort of insulting even asking that.

Yeah, that sucks. I guess you can wait until the undead bard thing.

I know your pain, though. I was in the exact same spot back in early 2002 and couldn't get my hands on a white dragonscale.

I actually lost the roll on one to some caster who wanted the cloak (before they changed it to the white dragon hide). Can't say I blamed him.

And the bard epic is just ridiculously good :/

[t0lkien]

I had to buy half my epic bits on live. Took me 18 months to get them all (30k for a White Scale I believe, as so many were lost to that stupid bloody cloak - that was a design mistake, to make an epic quest part also part of another fairly decent item). Luckily I found an area in Velious with busted pathing that allowed me to farm a reasonably sought after item, or I never would have gotten my epic. It took months of negotiating a fairly tenuous guild situation to get the final piece off Trak too. Ironically, the hardest bit off Phiny was denied me by a spawn jumper from the resident uber guild, and then a guy from that same guild gifted me an MQ on the same bit months later.

I don't hold out any hope for the epic on p1999 though. It sounds like it's all wrapped up by the top guilds, and I'm not really interested in poopsocking my way into digital uberness. Maybe if I can find a good place to camp and make some money...

[koros]

So true, also one of the harder epics to bag.

Ragebringer is one of the easiest epics to bag. Haste item and weapons as low as 13/20 will outdamage it.

The only easier epics to bag are Pal/SK (and sk effect is pretty cool)

[Cecily]

Ragebringer is one of the easiest epics to bag. Haste item and weapons as low as 13/20 will outdamage it.

That's really not how it works.

[koros]

Having played through this shit 13 years ago and bagged my ragebringer when some random raid drops in Velious outparsed it 1 month into the expansion... I'm pretty sure that's exactly how it works.

No one else is "bagging" their epic in Velious, except pally or SK.

[t0lkien]

Having played through this shit 13 years ago and bagged my ragebringer when some random raid drops in Velious outparsed it 1 month into the expansion... I'm pretty sure that's exactly how it works.

No one else is "bagging" their epic in Velious, except pally or SK.

Warrior?

[koros]

Eh I guess a SoD possibly puts out more aggro than epic, but I'm not even sure if that's the case.

I guess it depends on the semantics of how we define bagging. A caster is gonna have better stats on a primary and stop keeping it equipped 100% of the time, but mana free clickies stay in style.

Ragebringer just 100% loses its use with Velious raid gear.

[Kagatob]

Not only is that proc awesome, and not only is it a solid melee weapon you can use without having to worry about swapping an instrument, but what makes it REALLY badass imo is the fact that it provides a modifier for singing which was previously unattainable.

[Cecily]

Eh I guess a SoD possibly puts out more aggro than epic, but I'm not even sure if that's the case.

I guess it depends on the semantics of how we define bagging. A caster is gonna have better stats on a primary and stop keeping it equipped 100% of the time, but mana free clickies stay in style.

Ragebringer just 100% loses its use with Velious raid gear.

Let me explain it then. 40 atk. That's not replaceable in Velious. The weapon will always stay in offhand.

[koros]

Clearly you're the one not getting it. I already mentioned parses.

40 atk does not overcome the ratio deficit, especially with an offhand such as claw of lightning, baton of flame, etc.

[Widan]

That's pretty awesome actually for those of us who don't care about raiding. Hopefully the MQ price will plummet even more after Velious gets released!

[Skope]

That's pretty awesome actually for those of us who don't care about raiding. Hopefully the MQ price will plummet even more after Velious gets released!

Considerably. When velious gets released a lot of the bottlenecks are eased by making epic mobs triggered or spread out over several not-as-contested mobs all with a chance of dropping the item.

Mage, cleric, and bard epics are just as awesome in velious as they are in kunark. Fluffy is a badass and makes seemingly difficult mobs an incredibly easy duo with a cleric. I don't use my epic mage nearly enough as I should. She just sits there collecting dust :(

Shaman epic is great for soloing but there are some very good velious proc weps that you'll wield, only swapping to sham epic to stick your dot then back to proc.

He's also right about the ragebringer being bagged. It's probably the first epic that's going to be replaced, and for those with 41% belts it'll be even quicker.

[Aeolwind]

Clearly you're the one not getting it. I already mentioned parses.

40 atk does not overcome the ratio deficit, especially with an offhand such as claw of lightning, baton of flame, etc.

Mrylokar/Primal. I can't compare it to Salindrite though, never saw any parses.

[Rhambuk]

Mrylokar

Will vulak work properly on this server? Or was it changed into a broken ring event later on?

[webrunner5]

Mrylokar/Primal. I can't compare it to Salindrite though, never saw any parses.

Mrylokar's Dagger of Vengeance http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6887.

Ought to get the job done.

[Rhambuk]

but will vulak work properly here, the ring event was horribly screwed on live.

hmm, was it always a ring event or was it turned into a ring event later dont know why but for some reason i seem to remember someone mentioning this at some point.

[Calabee]

I wonder how many Bard epic's even are in the game? I am hard pressed to remember seeing even one of them in the tunnel or grouped.

I know im # 7 and first non tmo bard to get it~!

[quido]

How do you know you're #7?

[Beaniron]

Considerably. When velious gets released a lot of the bottlenecks are eased by making epic mobs triggered or spread out over several not-as-contested mobs all with a chance of dropping the item.

Mage, cleric, and bard epics are just as awesome in velious as they are in kunark. Fluffy is a badass and makes seemingly difficult mobs an incredibly easy duo with a cleric. I don't use my epic mage nearly enough as I should. She just sits there collecting dust :(

Shaman epic is great for soloing but there are some very good velious proc weps that you'll wield, only swapping to sham epic to stick your dot then back to proc.

He's also right about the ragebringer being bagged. It's probably the first epic that's going to be replaced, and for those with 41% belts it'll be even quicker.

Does the Pally epic become easier, like with shorter spawns or less contested mobs?

[Aeolwind]

Obviously the original version will be working at onset. There should be no doubt of that. We have him spawned now with the correct model. Stats aren't right, loot table doesn't exist (and it will be an ugly one to get right), etc. But he is up in all his gray glory.

Fun Fact!
The Ring Event/TOV changes were implemented due to exploitation. It followed the release of the Sleeper, but was unrelated.

[Rhambuk]

But he is up in all his gray glory.

Fun Fact!
The Ring Event/TOV changes were implemented due to exploitation.

Well thats good news!

I'm sure you can't divulge but are these exploitations going to be left in(classic) or fixxed prior to launch(preferably)

[Skope]

Does the Pally epic become easier, like with shorter spawns or less contested mobs?

Pally epic is already pretty easy. The issue is that the books are hogged by a couple of guilds. You can still buy them for cheap, though. It's only ~ 40k for the book. Not to mention there's a chance that all of the dragons drop half of it, so there should be loads of books floating around.

[Rhambuk]

there should be loads of books floating around.

there are more books than paladins on this server.

[Clark]

The necromancer epic is a real game changer, in the sense that it made me change games to Final Fantasy XI.

http://s7.postimg.org/ir9qxwxgb/goodjob9.jpg

[koros]

Mrylokar and baton of flame/salindrite/claw of lightning will all parse extremely close to each other for top dps. Swapping in primal for procs of course

[pasi]

Mrylo Dagger goes down to 12/16. Salindrite is 11/18 for a while. Tunare isn't itemized right away. Ragebringer is pretty good for a long time.

[falkun]

Bard epic is so rare on this server because Trakanon also regulates the VP key. Once that is no longer a factor (read: Velious and Undead Bard), many more bard epics will exist on the server. TMO does sell its excess guts for 250-350k a piece.

[xCry0x]

There are a lot of epics you don't see because the chars with epics are logged out at raid targets 24/7.


That said, as a Cleric I have to say Cleric epic is the most useful/game changing because it helps the entire raid as well as groups and even entire zones. Go to a zone like seb or kc and people are always asking for a cleric to click them, if the cleric had to blow 600 mana people would probably be less likely to pause their group to rez some random person.

10 sec cast time to cast a 600 mana spell with no recast timer.

vs.

7 sec cast time, 600 mana 15 sec recast

Other clerics have more mana than me but at 59 i sit at 3,200 mana. Without epic if a raid wiped I could not even rez a full group without a full med break.

In an exp group if someone died in a fight the entire group would have to stop while i medded to rez, blew all my mana on the rez and had to wait for mana before pulls could go on.

Yea bard epic is great, mage epic does great damage, but life is all around horrible without a cleric epic around.

1) Cleric
2) Bard


Everything else is hard to say. Mage is a great pet but it really only benefits the mage, it helps the raid the same way an epic helps a rogue, monk etc. It isn't like the mage pet runs around casting c2 on the raid and hasting the dps.

[Nirgon]

If your guild isn't prone to wiping? The rogue epic absolutely is crazy strong.

On these 20 seconds dragon fights, nothing compares to a duelist rogue blowing 4k into something.

The epic mage pet isn't quite hitting those numbers on these raid targets =).

[Cords]

I'm all for bard epic for the buff, Rogue for the straight up damage, and cleric's epic is a must.

[Karafa]

Ranger epic is super underrated, the haste + atk buff partnered with a slow makes them actually viable to solo shitty mobs!