Beware the gnome Whukes

[kylok]

Whukes a gnome wizard just kill stole Hadden at 4:52 am PST. Beware of this little guy and any fishy earrings he may be selling. Very frustrating to sit at that camp for 6 hours to have someone log in and blast him while I'm beating on him.

[Rhambuk]

Oh the joys of hadden, at least hopefully here the gm's will enforce a camping rule. On live, my server CT at least, it was basically fte of course this was pre fraps so there was no way to prove anything.

[whukes]

Wow my very own drama thread!

[Flamewraith]

That's some weak shit man. Very rude, I hope karma rips you a new ass.

[LiQuid]

Screens and/or logs and I will render a verdict.

[whukes]

Love that you get one side of a story and it's lynch the gnome time! I've been sitting at Hadden since 6/29 @ 8AM EST. Fell asleep at the keyboard after getting nothing but Fishing Poles for 4 kills. Now some AFK dude sitting on the island sees Hadden pop, doesn't engage for 2 solid minutes, and I'm the bad guy.

[Ektar]

edit before rnf

people be like wow what how did he edit in rnf?

[Ele]

The only thing common to both sides of the story is Hadden. lol

[Flamewraith]

Aight then lets see some pics or logs from either side. Should clear it up really fast.

[whukes]

Aight then lets see some pics or logs from either side. Should clear it up really fast.

Ok P99 detective just calm down. What do you need to see from my logs, me engaging Hadden and kylok doing nothing except for attacking Axe Broadsmith after Hadden dies?

Actually, who the fuck are you to demand logs from me? Get your own damn logs.

[Flamewraith]

Ok P99 detective just calm down. What do you need to see from my logs, me engaging Hadden and kylok doing nothing except for attacking Axe Broadsmith after Hadden dies?

Actually, who the fuck are you to demand logs from me? Get your own damn logs.

Yes from this I can see that you are clearly innocent. I dare you to try that approach at court. "What the fuck do you mean you want to see the pictures I have of the crime? Go fuck yourself, better yet, go get your own pictures." You are truly a genius and polite, there is no way that a shit head such as yourself would steal something from someone below you. Some people's kids.

[t0lkien]

Ok P99 detective just calm down. What do you need to see from my logs, me engaging Hadden and kylok doing nothing except for attacking Axe Broadsmith after Hadden dies?

Actually, who the fuck are you to demand logs from me? Get your own damn logs.

Your Honour, as you can hear for yourself, such contrition and humility could hardly be the work of guilt. The Defense rests.

[Flamewraith]

Your Honour, as you can hear for yourself, such contrition and humility could hardly be the work of guilt. The Defense rests.

I lol'd

[whukes]

Yes from this I can see that you are clearly innocent. I dare you to try that approach at court. "What the fuck do you mean you want to see the pictures I have of the crime? Go fuck yourself, better yet, go get your own pictures." You are truly a genius and polite, there is no way that a shit head such as yourself would steal something from someone below you. Some people's kids.

Am I reading this correctly? It's rather early so I just want to be clear. You are comparing a video game to a criminal trial? Are you out of your damn mind? And who the fuck takes pictures of themselves committing crimes?

You want logs, issue a subpoena.

[LiQuid]

Ok P99 detective just calm down. What do you need to see from my logs, me engaging Hadden and kylok doing nothing except for attacking Axe Broadsmith after Hadden dies?

Actually, who the fuck are you to demand logs from me? Get your own damn logs.
Screens and logs just make it more entertaining for us, the loyal readers of forum drama. You don't owe us anything, but you sounded super excited about your first drama thread, I figured you would want to make the most of it!

For those of us of us that do fashion ourselves as Junior Detectives, logs and screens help establish a non-afk presence at the camp both before the time of the pop and at the time of the kill. GMs are pretty good at figuring this kinda thing out since they have better logs than either of you could keep, but it's still fun to get involved. :D

[Flamewraith]

Am I reading this correctly? It's rather early so I just want to be clear. You are comparing a video game to a criminal trial? Are you out of your damn mind? And who the fuck takes pictures of themselves committing crimes?

You want logs, issue a subpoena.

What I'm getting at is that you are going about proving your innocence the wrong way. You got defensive that people were prosecuting you, but when asked for evidence of innocence you instead exploded and pushed everything away. There is no point in talking to you, I literally think you're an immature idiot. Hopefully a GM will log on and reimburse the other guy and punish you for being a dumb shit.

[whukes]

Screens and logs just make it more entertaining for us, the loyal readers of forum drama. You don't owe us anything, but you sounded super excited about your first drama thread, I figured you would want to make the most of it!

For those of us of us that do fashion ourselves as Junior Detectives, logs and screens help establish a non-afk presence at the camp both before the time of the pop and at the time of the kill. GMs are pretty good at figuring this kinda thing out since they have better logs than either of you could keep, but it's still fun to get involved. :D

I like your style. Here's what I have. Not sure wtf this tells you except that I am out of food and drink. I highlighted the other dude in bold.

[Sun Jun 30 07:42:21 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:42:21 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:42:21 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:07 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:07 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:07 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:53 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:53 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:43:53 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:44:39 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:44:39 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:44:39 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:45:25 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:45:25 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:45:25 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:11 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:11 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:11 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:28 2013] Rephas begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:57 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:57 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:46:57 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:47:43 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:47:43 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:47:43 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:47:48 2013] Rephas begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:27 2013] Rephas begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:35 2013] Rephas begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:16 2013] You begin casting Enstill.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden says, 'Ah.. Though you appear so puny, I'm sure your flesh will make good bait!'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden's feet adhere to the ground.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:24 2013] Axe Broadsmith says 'Defend yourself!!'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:25 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 249 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:25 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] Katanagatari says, 'Err'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:28 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:30 2013] Katanagatari says, 'This is my camp'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:31 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 249 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:31 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:32 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:37 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 61 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:37 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] Katanagatari tells you, 'hey'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:41 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:41 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:41 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:41 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:44 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 249 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:44 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:46 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Your faction standing with AntoniusBayle got worse.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Your faction standing with CircleofUnseenHands got better.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Your faction standing with CoalitionofTradeFolk got worse.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Your faction standing with GuardsofQeynos got worse.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Your faction standing with MerchantsofQeynos got worse.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] You gain experience!!
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:47 2013] Hadden says 'Arrrhhh.. The Merchants of Qeynos.. are many.. and powerful.. ..you won't get away.. with.. this.. hor.. orr.. rible.. .. ..'

[LiQuid]

Ok, so from what I see, since the other guy, Katanawhatever didn't do anything other that say it was his camp here is what I assume happened.

Katanadude parked in Qhills however many hours ago expecting he could AFK camp while checking in every now and then and probably tabbed out to watch cat videos on Youtube.

Lil Wizard rolled up or logged in when he know Hadden was going to pop, watched the other guy not engage for an unspecified amount of time then went to work.

Katuaagfogiahrg hears someone nuking, tabs back over and curses his luck as Hadden popped when he was in the middle of watching Mittens romp in an empty box. He proceeds to make a limp claim to the camp and then comes here to tell us about how he was KS'd even tho he made no attempt to engage the mob at any time because he was beaten to it even tho he had allegedly been sitting there for 6 hours.

Anybody have anything to clarify or add to this?

[whukes]

What I'm getting at is that you are going about proving your innocence the wrong way. You got defensive that people were prosecuting you, but when asked for evidence of innocence you instead exploded and pushed everything away. There is no point in talking to you, I literally think you're an immature idiot. Hopefully a GM will log on and reimburse the other guy and punish you for being a dumb shit.

Ok buddy. You pulled out your jump to conclusions mat and hoped karma would rip me a new ass. I think you should edit that to say asshole instead of ass. If you ripped my ass, a new hole would appear but not two entirely new butt cheeks. And I think we can both agree that an ass is an asshole + cheeks not just the hole.

Just my opinion though.

[whukes]

Ok, so from what I see, since the other guy, Katanawhatever didn't do anything other that say it was his camp here is what I assume happened.

Katanadude parked in Qhills however many hours ago expecting he could AFK camp while checking in every now and then and probably tabbed out to watch cat videos on Youtube.

Lil Wizard rolled up or logged in when he know Hadden was going to pop, watched the other guy not engage for an unspecified amount of time then went to work.

Katuaagfogiahrg hears someone nuking, tabs back over and curses his luck as Hadden popped when he was in the middle of watching Mittens romp in an empty box. He proceeds to make a limp claim to the camp and then comes here to tell us about how he was KS'd even tho he made no attempt to engage the mob at any time because he was beaten to it even tho he had allegedly been sitting there for 6 hours.

Anybody have anything to clarify or add to this?

Now this is some fine detective work.

[Flamewraith]

Just my opinion though.

Lol like I could possibly care less about your opinion. You may be innocent, but you're still a cunt.

[whukes]

Lol like I could possibly care less about your opinion. You may be innocent, but you're still a cunt.

Is your ass ok? Karma get ya?

[Samoht]

he's not innocent. mob was camped. camp was stolen. KS.

[Flamewraith]

Is your ass ok? Karma get ya?

That was pretty weak. I think you would fit in better with r99.

[Flamewraith]

he's not innocent. mob was camped. camp was stolen. KS.

Unfortunately for this situation AFK camping is not legal. However if OP can prove that he was not AFK camping he could still be reimbursed.

[whukes]

That was pretty weak. I think you would fit in better with r99.

Might be right.

A thread with 3 pages, at least I'm famous now.

[t0lkien]

Because it's not easy to edit logs. People often make mistakes though. Check out the "thirsty", "hungry", "out of food and drink" notifications. They always appear together, and in that order, and every 46 seconds. Now notice the bolded "out of food and drink" at the bottom. Where are the "thirsty" and "hungry" notifications that must have preceded it?

Is it possible they were deleted inadvertently along with other stuff? If so, what was deleted?

Your Honour, the Prosecution submits item #1:

[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:48:30 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:49:16 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:02 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:35 2013] Rephas begins to cast a spell.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are thirsty.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are hungry.
[Sun Jun 30 07:50:48 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:16 2013] You begin casting Enstill.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden says, 'Ah.. Though you appear so puny, I'm sure your flesh will make good bait!'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden's feet adhere to the ground.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:20 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:21 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:24 2013] Axe Broadsmith says 'Defend yourself!!'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:25 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 249 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:25 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] Katanagatari says, 'Err'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:27 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:28 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:30 2013] Katanagatari says, 'This is my camp'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:31 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 249 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:31 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:32 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:33 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You are out of food and drink.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You begin casting Inferno Shock.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:34 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:37 2013] Hadden was hit by non-melee for 61 points of damage.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:37 2013] Hadden's skin ignites.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:39 2013] You haven't recovered yet...
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:40 2013] Katanagatari tells you, 'hey'

[whukes]

Sorry dude log has not been modified in any way. I'm leaving now. You detectives keep at it though.

[LiQuid]

Because it's not easy to edit logs. People often make mistakes though. Check out the "thirsty", "hungry", "out of food and drink" notifications. They always appear together, and in that order, and every 46 seconds. Now notice the bolded "out of food and drink" at the bottom. Where are the "thirsty" and "hungry" notifications that must have preceded it?

Is it possible they were deleted inadvertently along with other stuff? If so, what was deleted?

Your Honour, the Prosecution submits item #1:

The plot thickens!!!

Srsly, it's so thick!!!

[webrunner5]

I don't care what he says. I don't like Gnomes let alone Gnome Wizards. :eek::eek: Hell I don't like any Wizards.

[Reguiy]

Was it legal to come KS Hadden? Probably. Was it a scumbag move? Definitely.

[whukes]

Was it legal to come KS Hadden? Probably. Was it a scumbag move? Definitely.

It was absolutely a scumbag move. I'll take the surname scumbag as penance.

[Reguiy]

It was absolutely a scumbag move. I'll take the surname scumbag as penance.

That's the difference between me and you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP4BKP4pmIg

[Frieza_Prexus]

You are comparing a video game to a criminal trial?

This is the court of public opinion, and unlike real court, opinions and hastily drawn conclusions are admissible from anyone and everyone. Your objections are overruled and your butthurt is hereby admitted into evidence.

And who the fuck takes pictures of themselves committing crimes?

You'd be surprised.

[Reguiy]

. Your objections are overruled and your butthurt is hereby admitted into evidence .

HAHAHAHA.

[kylok]

So.. I am the fabled Katanadude in all of this. What Whukes is leaving out are two key things which unfortunately I don't have logs or fraps for (never had someone KS me before - go figure). Whukes had indeed been there a while- I came about around... i wanna say 9ish pm Pacific to the Hadden camp, sent him a tell to see if he was afk or not, and promptly waited about 20 to 30 minutes for him to respond. He did eventually respond saying that he'd been there awhile and was indeed camping Hadden. I asked if I could hang out and he said sure. Time passes and at 10:52 pm pacific (I wrote the time down in the /note window) Hadden spawns - he kills him (told me that no earring dropped) then /tells me hes going to log and get some sleep and from what I can tell he does exactly that. Fast forward 5.5 hours and I notice that Whukes is back. So I /wave to him but got no response, figuring he was making breakfast or something. So I continue watching shitty cartoons on TV until I do indeed hear the ominous sounds of spell casting going on (I'm also surprised that Hadden didn't attack me as I am an iksar and was standing practically ontop of him). At this point I engage the mob, take everything in and send this pesky gnome a few tells explaining the camp situation (very articulately as you can see from his logs /yawn) but a monk had little hope of out dpsing a wizard on Hadden. I do find it cute that he neglected to put in the part of his log where, after the faction hit he gets a tell from me saying something to the effect of "I didn't sit here at this camp for 6 hours to be KSed". End of the story, I know I tend to ramble, he runs up, loots the mob, gates and promptly /quits. And that's when I made this thread, after /reporting him /petitioning the situation and making a thread in the server issues -> reports section. Hopefully this clarifies some things - if I can be believed with no proof of my own =/ /log on!

P.S. edit - he was also sitting across the water by the tree and the boat, which is probably why there's only his spell casting and my tells in his log

[LiQuid]

He abandoned the camp to get some sleep. The camp was yours.

But you got caught with your pants down, afk camping. You were even there for the prior kill and new the time of death. Why were you watching cartoons when you knew he was going to pop?

What he did was dirtbaggy. He knew you had the camp and still FTE raced you (even tho you were AFK) to get the mob, but you were by your own admission watching cartoons instead of your mobs spawn location, so your rights to the camp are probably forfeit in the eyes of a GM.

[Joeyo1471]

Leave Whukes alone. I played with him today, he's a good player and certainly doesn't deserve this.
Plus, you were AFK. Clearly. Like LiQuid said, caught with your pants down.

[t0lkien]

Nah, it was a scumbag move, and as someone said people are never sneaky in just one area of their lives. Forewarned is forearmed IMO.

[kylok]

Watching cartoons while sitting at your computer is not afk camping? As I was at my keyboard.. while watching cartoons.... But anyway this is besides the point. Regardless of the outcome I said my piece and the server has been informed on this incident. That's all I wanted to accomplish in this thread.

[Flamewraith]

Nah, it was a scumbag move, and as someone said people are never sneaky in just one area of their lives. Forewarned is forearmed IMO.

I agree, and just by this guys explosive six year old attitude it is obvious that he is a shady selfish prick. Just my opinion though.

[Rhambuk]

I feel for whukes here....

the entire server is jumping on this guys face because the op claims he ksd him.

well fuck rogean ks'd me 3 years ago, wheres the hate thread about him?

seriously you people....

[whukes]

I have gotten more tells and group offers because of this thread then I have the entire time I have played P99.

Flamewraith, I sent you a tell in game, but you really need to get over to EC. There have been 2 scammers called out in shout and we really need a detective in zone ASAP.

[Flamewraith]

I have gotten more tells and group offers because of this thread then I have the entire time I have played P99.

Flamewraith, I sent you a tell in game, but you really need to get over to EC. There have been 2 scammers called out in shout and we really need a detective in zone ASAP.

Added you to ignore as soon as you messaged me. I have a child sister and that's all the elementary school immaturity I need. Also I don't associate with low lifes. You qualify as a low life.

[LiQuid]

Watching cartoons while sitting at your computer is not afk camping? As I was at my keyboard.. while watching cartoons.... But anyway this is besides the point. Regardless of the outcome I said my piece and the server has been informed on this incident. That's all I wanted to accomplish in this thread.

Did you make an attempt to engage the mob when he popped? You said the only reason you looked over from your cartoons is because you heard casting. AFAIK there's no hard server rule on the amount of time a passerby needs to give you to engage a freshly popped mob that you are camping. It's going to be subjective and up to the GM if they choose to reimburse you but the facts are: he was a dirtbag and you were asleep at the wheel.

[whukes]

Added you to ignore as soon as you messaged me. I have a child sister and that's all the elementary school immaturity I need. Also I don't associate with low lifes. You qualify as a low life.

Ouch. You could of at least given me some ice for that wicked burn you just gave me.

[Ambrotos]

You can be at a camp and not respond to someone, as long as you are clearing the placeholder/camp. It's defined in the rules.

Fast forward 5.5 hours and I notice that Whukes is back. So I /wave to him but got no response, figuring he was making breakfast or something. So I continue watching shitty cartoons on TV until I do indeed hear the ominous sounds of spell casting going on (I'm also surprised that Hadden didn't attack me as I am an iksar and was standing practically ontop of him).

AFK camping is camping with your pet killing stuff for you while you're afk.

Facts:
Whukes was there
Haden Spawned: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:23
Whukes engaged 07:51:30* Used enstill, 2 second cast time* (I know his logs say differently, this is why we never accept player logs for any petitions)
Katanagatari engaged 07:51:36 ( a full 7 seconds or so after Whukes did)

Conclusion of what the logs show? Katanagatari either helping or trying to ks Whukes, due to the time difference of spawn time/engagement time.

Whukes walks away with earring.

[Rooj]

lol, can we get more posts like this Ambrotos? <3 felt like watching a sports show

[kylok]

I admit I was not attentively watching my comp screen when the mob popped. As soon as I noticed the mob I engaged it - although considering I was inches away from the screen I seriously doubt much time had passed between his pop and my turning auto attack on. And as I stated previously I'm very kos to Hadden and was standing close enough to be attacked if he was up for more than a few seconds. Really I'm just disappointed that a fellow player cares enough about a 3k earring to break server rules and risk his reputation.

edit - thank you green post! I will be much more attentive in the future.

edit edit - just for my own curiosity do the logs show when I entered Qeynos Hills and when Whukes logged into Qeynos hills?

[LiQuid]

You can be at a camp and not respond to someone, as long as you are clearing the placeholder/camp. It's defined in the rules.



AFK camping is camping with your pet killing stuff for you while you're afk.

Facts:
Whukes was there
Haden Spawned: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:23
Whukes engaged 07:51:30* Used enstill, 2 second cast time* (I know his logs say differently, this is why we never accept player logs for any petitions)
Katanagatari engaged 07:51:36 ( a full 7 seconds or so after Whukes did)

Conclusion of what the logs show? Katanagatari either helping or trying to ks Whukes, due to the time difference of spawn time/engagement time.

Whukes walks away with earring.

Do your logs show Kata being in the zone for 6 hours while Whukes was only logged in for a half hour? Wouldn't that show that Kata was camping whereas Whukes just timed the spawn and showed up for the kill?

I once had a GM rule against my confirmed (by GM logs) FTE and award loot to another player, I assume this is because of a subjective analysis that the other player was "camping" the mob and I had just recently zoned in and found him up.

[Rhambuk]

Whukes walks away with earring.

Cheers ambro!

I hope the rest of you can get off your high horse and apologize to whukes now.

The mangnome did nothing wrong but since the op throws out an accusation the community is ready to lynch him..

Since ambro's logs show differently are all of you whukes haters going to switch sides and start bashing the op for being a kser? laughable....

[Ambrotos]

Hold on. brb

[Reguiy]

Haden Spawned: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:23
Whukes engaged 07:51:30* Used enstill, 2 second cast time* (I know his logs say differently, this is why we never accept player logs for any petitions)
Katanagatari engaged 07:51:36 ( a full 7 seconds or so after Whukes did)

Conclusion of what the logs show? Katanagatari either helping or trying to ks Whukes, due to the time difference of spawn time/engagement time.

Whukes walks away with earring.

So since Katan waited 7 seconds to engage he forfeited his camp? Serious question.

[Flamewraith]

I admit I was not attentively watching my comp screen when the mob popped. As soon as I noticed the mob I engaged it - although considering I was inches away from the screen I seriously doubt much time had passed between his pop and my turning auto attack on. And as I stated previously I'm very kos to Hadden and was standing close enough to be attacked if he was up for more than a few seconds. Really I'm just disappointed that a fellow player cares enough about a 3k earring to break server rules and risk his reputation.

edit - thank you green post! I will be much more attentive in the future.

edit edit - just for my own curiosity do the logs show when I entered Qeynos Hills and when Whukes logged into Qeynos hills?

Unfortunately you will meet people like Whukes everywhere you go. Where there are humans, there are leeches. Just keep your head up and make sure you never wind up like one of them. If you ever need help with anything shoot me a tell and I'll see what I can do for ya!

[LiQuid]

He didn't break server rules, you did. You actively engaged a npc he already engaged in hopes to get the kill. You decided to do what you wanted to, without regards as to what was going on. Accordion to the logs he engaged ~8 seconds before you if you include his root spell.

You stated he was there before you. He engaged the npc almost as soon as he spawned, you engaged spawn someone was was killing.

But Whukes logged off for 5.5 hours while the other guy stayed at the camp, therefore Kata was there first...

[LiQuid]

This is getting interesting. Real time GM'ing in progress.

[kylok]

Was just reading the camps defined post and it states " How you pull the camp is up to you, as long as you are able to engage the mobs very shortly after they are spawned. " by this statement I had control of this camp and had not crossed beyond the very shortly after spawn window. I ask for clarification to know if I should not bother being courteous to my fellow players and employ Whukes tactic at other camps.

[TarukShmaruk]

So since Katan waited 7 seconds to engage he forfeited his camp? Serious question.

This is what I'm wondering.

If Katan is there the entire time and Whukes just logs in and tags first does he get kill?

With a long camp like Hadden it's pretty understandable that it would take 7 seconds to engage if you've been there the whole time.

[whukes]

Since Hadden is the PH for Hadden, can you tell who killed him on his previous spawn as well?

[Frieza_Prexus]

I admit I was not attentively watching my comp screen when the mob popped. As soon as I noticed the mob I engaged it - although considering I was inches away from the screen I seriously doubt much time had passed between his pop and my turning auto attack on. And as I stated previously I'm very kos to Hadden and was standing close enough to be attacked if he was up for more than a few seconds. Really I'm just disappointed that a fellow player cares enough about a 3k earring to break server rules and risk his reputation.

edit - thank you green post! I will be much more attentive in the future.

edit edit - just for my own curiosity do the logs show when I entered Qeynos Hills and when Whukes logged into Qeynos hills?

Unfortunately for you, there's not much to be gained by posting without much substantive proof. Unless the other party comes here and incriminates themselves (which happens on occasion), it just devolves into a "he said she said"

Your best bet is to acquire a copy of FRAPS and continually run it using the loop buffer. (The loop buffer records on a closed loop of 30ish seconds and when you hit the record button it'll save the video from the prior 30 seconds of the "buffer" in addition to whatever you're filming from that point on.

If you want some additional discussion regarding camps and what it takes to hold/lose a camp I have a few posts here which provide citations to past GM decisions and GM posts.

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=896698&postcount=4
http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=896693&postcount=5
http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=912542&postcount=11
http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=896783&postcount=19

[t0lkien]

This is still nonsense, GM approval or no (and really, they can only adjudicate based on their logs; and it's their server so it is what it is).

Moral of the story: never assume Whukes is playing fair. That's a pretty expensive earring IMO.

[Ambrotos]

If you look at the log times you can see a difference of 12 seconds.

Engaged: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:30
**[Sun Jun 30 07:51:16 2013] You begin casting Enstill.
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden says, 'Ah.. Though you appear so puny, I'm sure your flesh will make good bait!'
[Sun Jun 30 07:51:18 2013] Hadden's feet adhere to the ground.

Kat did attack but it was afterwards 8ish seconds after the other guy engaged. He attacked ~23 seconds after it spawned.

Can he lose the camp while not being there while it spawns? It all depends and this is the worst camp to deal with. You have a npc with less than 1200 hps mid lvl 20s can kill quickly.

If you read what he says, he was looking away when it spawned. Maybe he looked at the screen due to spells going off, or what not. One person was there ready, the other not.

Shitty? Very. Toss up and can anything be done? No. The only thing I see is one person attacking after the other. He admitted he wasn't paying attention and just attacked. So what people are asking is does a semi afk person get the camp after 23ish seconds before he engaged after a spawn?

It wasn't just 6 seconds. It was from when the npc spawned, to his engaged time and that was 23 seconds. Big difference than 6 seconds.

[LiQuid]

If this ruling goes in favor of Whukes my new blanket policy for all camps is to hand them off to others while I go get some sleep then come back and race them for FTE to claim I have the camp back. :D

[kylok]

You can be at a camp and not respond to someone, as long as you are clearing the placeholder/camp. It's defined in the rules.

Facts:
Whukes was there
Haden Spawned: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:23
Whukes engaged 07:51:30* Used enstill, 2 second cast time* (I know his logs say differently, this is why we never accept player logs for any petitions)
Katanagatari engaged 07:51:36 ( a full 7 seconds or so after Whukes did)


I see 13 seconds between my engagement of Hadden and Hadden's spawn. Thanks for looking into this Ambrotos it is very appreciated and enlightening.

[Reguiy]

Cheers ambro!

I hope the rest of you can get off your high horse and apologize to whukes now.

The mangnome did nothing wrong but since the op throws out an accusation the community is ready to lynch him..

Since ambro's logs show differently are all of you whukes haters going to switch sides and start bashing the op for being a kser? laughable....

This thread turned into a witch-hunt when Whukes responded in an offensive and childish manner. Also, whether or not Whukes was in the right or wrong (technically), it's still BM to do what he did, considering the OP was clearly there for much longer. Whereas whukes was logging in when he thought Hadden would be up soon. BTW! Ambros just said those were FACTS. He didn't judge who was in the right or wrong :)

[Frieza_Prexus]

If this ruling goes in favor of Whukes my new blanket policy for all camps is to hand them off to others while I go get some sleep then come back and race them for FTE to claim I have the camp back. :D

Keep in mind this ruling has almost no precedential value. The decision maker is clearly lamenting the lack of facts, and in this case the only option was a presumption that FTE carries it. Had the OP provided an acceptable form of evidence for his case, the presumption of FTE winning would have been defeated.

This situation is limited to its facts and likely would have no impact upon future scenarios that did not fit this exact fact pattern.

[Flamewraith]

This is a sad day for all honest people. Like I said Kylok shoot me a tell if you ever need help with anything. I'm sorry you had to experience this side of the server, just know that not everyone is like that. :p

[LiQuid]

So it doesn't matter that Kata was there first, FTE > owning the camp for Hadden?

[t0lkien]

Keep in mind this ruling has almost no precedential value. The decision maker is clearly lamenting the lack of facts, and in this case the only option was a presumption that FTE carries it. Had the OP provided an acceptable form of evidence for his case, the presumption of FTE winning would have been defeated.

This situation is limited to its facts and likely would have no impact upon future scenarios that did not fit this exact fact pattern.

... except where those scenarios carry a lack of hard evidence beyond server logs (as is almost certain unless a GM happens to wander past at the time), in which case FTE and firepower carries the day.

Got it.

[Ambrotos]

The only real hard stance in posted rules about camps is this. I'll talk to Sirken so we can clean stuff up. With Velious coming up, there are a lot of out door static spawns, ec etc, People will lawyer it to death.

Camping a mob is a privelege, not a right. If someone wants the privelege of having sole claim to a mob, they have to make the sacrifice of whatever else they could be doing with themselves. Claim to a camp is a considerable advantage, it comes with a cost. Choose wisely.
Being at a hotly contested camp and being afk 20+ seconds after he spawns, I consider it FFA if other people are waiting.

Like I said, we go by server logs and not people's logs. This is absolute times the server has.
Spawned: Sun Jun 30, 2013; 07:51:23
.........................................Engage Time... Delay time after FTE.........Engaged Total
2 Katanagatari 35 Monk.........07:51:36.... 6sec.............................23seconds

[LiQuid]

Keep in mind this ruling has almost no precedential value. The decision maker is clearly lamenting the lack of facts, and in this case the only option was a presumption that FTE carries it. Had the OP provided an acceptable form of evidence for his case, the presumption of FTE winning would have been defeated.

This situation is limited to its facts and likely would have no impact upon future scenarios that did not fit this exact fact pattern.

So it can't be proven that the monk was there for 6 hours and the wizard was there for 30 minutes? Can't GM's see when a character was on or offline?

Edit: Oh, never mind, I guess it doesn't matter. Grats Whukes. LOL.

[kylok]

$37 for fraps to prove what happened - guess that's the price you pay for evidence.

[TarukShmaruk]

So it doesn't matter that Kata was there first, FTE > owning the camp for Hadden?

Doesn't this basically apply to anything then?

You're camping ancient cyclops clearing PHs for hours, go AFK to piss for 30 seconds while I come in and FTE the cyclops and grats me right?

I just want to get the rules straight here - I think the logs can show if the OP was there the whole time while the gnome wasn't.

[LiQuid]

Doesn't this basically apply to anything then?

You're camping ancient cyclops clearing PHs for hours, go AFK to piss for 30 seconds while I come in and FTE the cyclops and grats me right?

I just want to get the rules straight here - I think the logs can show if the OP was there the whole time while the gnome wasn't.

This is good stuff. Daddy needs a new pair of shoes, time to go FTE some cyclopes. Your claim to AC camp is meaningless now, gonna get on my wiz and t-flux his butt.

[Ambrotos]

It's very simple. If you want a camp, be active at it. Engaging a NPC 23 seconds after it spawns while knowing other people are there is a sure sign of " Hey I don't wait it".

It doesn't matter if he was there for 5.5 hours or not, if he is afk after the npc spawns, the it is open for anyone.

[Reguiy]

Yankees win! Yankees win!

[Reapin]

Whukes a gnome wizard just kill stole Hadden at 4:52 am PST. Beware of this little guy and any fishy earrings he may be selling. Very frustrating to sit at that camp for 6 hours to have someone log in and blast him while I'm beating on him.

Saw him in EC today, his Surname is Scumbag lol

[Flamewraith]

It's very simple. If you want a camp, be active at it. Engaging a NPC 23 seconds after it spawns while knowing other people are there is a sure sign of " Hey I don't wait it".

It doesn't matter if he was there for 5.5 hours or not, if he is afk after the npc spawns, the it is open for anyone.

I'm sorry but 23 seconds is not a lot of time, especially at a strung out camp like Hadden. I know you're just working with what you have, but this is so disappointing. It's so obvious that the wiz is scum.

[Swish]

TL;DR?

http://i.minus.com/ibl1WwR8826YBF.gif

[Ambrotos]

This is good stuff. Daddy needs a new pair of shoes, time to go FTE some cyclopes. Your claim to AC camp is meaningless now, gonna get on my wiz and t-flux his butt.

5. Outdoor pathing mobs are not campable unless you are sitting at the spawn point and able to engage it instantly. Outdoor mobs on fast respawn such as HG and spectres, if you cannot engage immediately you do not hold the camp. Please try and share with fellow players in these instances.

Read the rules, most of them are there and easy to read. If AC is running around and you aren't there on it, it's FFA. That's the risk you run camping it in SoRo and not OOT.

[Frieza_Prexus]

... except where those scenarios carry a lack of hard evidence beyond server logs (as is almost certain unless a GM happens to wander past at the time), in which case FTE and firepower carries the day.

Got it.

I don't know what's saved server-side versus what is not. Obviously if there were evidence available to support the OP's claim the decision should be merited in his favor. However, Ambrotos' post seems to indicate that no evidence is available that would sufficiently support his claim.

Short of Whukes incriminating himself, yes there's only so much that can be done. Now, say he comes in here with a guilty attitude and a ton of butthurt (like I noted back on page 2) then yeah, a GM might be within his rights to say "you're either guilty as hell, or just very very rude, so I'm awarding the kill to the other guy."

However, that would again limit the ruling to this exact scenario. Short of proper facts being available do we WANT the rule to be "there is no rule?" If there's no evidence available the only standard is FTE. At the very least, that provides a reasonable way to measure an otherwise immeasurable situation and it gives notice to everyone exactly what measures they need to take to protect themselves.

So it can't be proven that the monk was there for 6 hours and the wizard was there for 30 minutes? Can't GM's see when a character was on or offline?

I would think the server logs are detailed enough to show that, but Ambrotos' posts seem to say otherwise. If it can be proved that the OP was wrong, absolutely he should be compensated. However, it looks like it can't be proven. In that case, the only reasonable response is to measure what CAN be measured. Here, that would be FTE.

I'm sorry but 23 seconds is not a lot of time, especially at a strung out camp like Hadden. I know you're just working with what you have, but this is so disappointing. It's so obvious that the wiz is scum.

"5. Outdoor pathing mobs are not campable unless you are sitting at the spawn point and able to engage it instantly. Outdoor mobs on fast respawn such as HG and spectres, if you cannot engage immediately you do not hold the camp. Please try and share with fellow players in these instances. "

Read the rules, most of them are there and easy to read. If AC is running around and you aren't there on it, it's FFA. That's the risk you run camping it in SoRo and not OOT.

This isn't quite as broad as it might appear. Note that this is for outdoor pathing mobs only. Hadden is not a pather, and you have similar, equally, authoritative GM posts that say this:

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=837655&postcount=13

With a spawn timer as long as Tranix, best bet is to give them a few minutes to engage.

There's no "you must wait X minutes" rule, but we'll use our best judgement given the encounter logs and player statements should an issue arise in that area.

Bottom line: don't be a greedy jerk. But also don't squat AFK in a camp hoping to hold it.

End result is that you should be given a reasonable amount of time to engage. That time can extend the longer a mob's spawn window is. For outdoor pathers the standard is "immediately engage" which is probably 15 seconds or so. The standard for all other mobs appears to be "reasonable amount of time" which is probably closer to 2-3 minutes depending upon the mob and the difficulty of the surrounding environment. (See: Discussing Ephi's use of "a few minutes" and what that means. (http://www.project1999.org/forums/showpost.php?p=912542&postcount=11))

[Ambrotos]

I don't know what's saved server-side versus what is not. Obviously if there were evidence available to support the OP's claim the decision should be merited in his favor. However, Ambrotos' post seems to indicate that no evidence is available that would sufficiently support his claim.

Short of Whukes incriminating himself, yes there's only so much that can be done. Now, say he comes in here with a guilty attitude and a ton of butthurt (like I noted back on page 2) then yeah, a GM might be within his rights to say "you're either guilty as hell, or just very very rude, so I'm awarding the kill to the other guy."

However, that would again limit the ruling to this exact scenario. Short of proper facts being available do we WANT the rule to be "there is no rule?" If there's no evidence available the only standard is FTE. At the very least, that provides a reasonable way to measure an otherwise immeasurable situation and it gives notice to everyone exactly what measures they need to take to protect themselves.



I would think the server logs are detailed enough to show that, but Ambrotos' posts seem to say otherwise. If it can be proved that the OP was wrong, absolutely he should be compensated. However, it looks like it can't be proven. In that case, the only reasonable response is to measure what CAN be measured. Here, that would be FTE.


Camping a mob is a privelege, not a right. If someone wants the privelege of having sole claim to a mob, they have to make the sacrifice of whatever else they could be doing with themselves. Claim to a camp is a considerable advantage, it comes with a cost. Choose wisely.

TL;DR
Want it? Be there when it spawns to kill it.

[TarukShmaruk]

TL;DR
Want it? Be there when it spawns to kill it.

Ok. Thanks for clearing this up.

edit: does Hadden even path?

[kylok]

It's looking like the decision has been made, which is fine with me. Since Whukes logged after killing Hadden I've been able to retain the camp. Although it seems that there is no evidence that I could submit to prove that I had the camp. Server logs say he engaged before me, which is true, doesn't sound like a 6 hour video of me sitting at Hadden would do much beyond prove that I sat for 6 hours but missed a 30 second window. I will keep this kind of thing in mind when camping in the future (I also have Fraps now). Good luck to everyone on their current and future camps.

Would also like to thank Ambrotos again for his speedy and attentive responses on this issue.

[LiQuid]

After all is said and done Kata is a dummy for not being vigilant after he 1. KNEW Hadden was about to spawn and 2. saw Whukes back from his restful night of sleep.

I guess the valuable lesson learned here should be never to give anybody the benefit of the doubt that they aren't going to be a turdburglar.

Good luck on the next Hadden pop Kata. Make sure you get there a nice, early 30-45 seconds or so before he pops and hope whoever is there "camping" him is really into his cartoons.

[Danth]

I agree, 20 seconds is not a long time in a multi-hour camp, or even in an ordinary ~20 minute dungeon respawn wait for that matter. It is unreasonable to expect someone to give a computer 100% attention over a multi-hour session, and requiring it (at a cost of otherwise losing the camp) merely promotes unhealthy behavior. EQ is a game designed with lengthy sessions in mind and the rules ought to account for that. However, I don't make the rules. As such, I can merely ask for clarification:

If 20 seconds is too slow, than what's the permissible reaction time?

If the answer is "instant", then effectively every last camp boils down to FTE due to things like network lag and discrepancies between the local log and server log.

This question is not academic; as the GM's already know, come Velious and its likely high population, people WILL be fighting over camps. Clarification now may prevent some problems later.

Danth

[liveitup1216]

TL;DR?

http://i.minus.com/ibl1WwR8826YBF.gif

i love your gifs, but this one has made me laugh more than any p99 post ever.

[t0lkien]

... as I said, FTE and firepower. Sounds a lot to me like KSing, but there you.

[kylok]

Quick Fraps question - I have the buffer loop set to 30 seconds but my test video didn't have the 30 seconds from the buffer. Did I do something wrong here?

[liveitup1216]

Forget fraps you just need a stopwatch, if its up longer than 15 seconds feel free to kill it. The world's your oyster.

[Danth]

Fraps wouldn't even help you here. Nobody's questioning the things a 30-second video would show: Both of you were present at the time. One guy engages a few seconds after mob spawns, the other person engages ~20 seconds after spawn.

Danth

[TarukShmaruk]

... as I said, FTE and firepower. Sounds a lot to me like KSing, but there you.

I think you pointed out that the reputation hit alone makes for an expensive FB earring.

[Reguiy]

I just wanna be the first to say, this thread is fucking win. I'd like to thank all the contributors.

[Rhambuk]

such a pointless witch hunt.

I hope this thread doesn't tarnish your name too much whukes, though it seems that was the entire point of this post since the op had no claim to hadden and is just pissy he didn't get the tag because he was busy watching cartoons.

just my opinion, if a dispute is brought to public forums gm's should just wash their hands of it. If people want to handle things the way they are supposed to be handled, petitions etc great, the moment they bring it to public forums trying to slander a player because theyre upset they obviously don't care about the issue they're just mad they were beaten and want to ruin the guys rep.

Whukes /friending you as soon as I log in, hell i might give you some cash for being an UPSTANDING member.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Quick Fraps question - I have the buffer loop set to 30 seconds but my test video didn't have the 30 seconds from the buffer. Did I do something wrong here?

You have to hold down the "record button" until the numbers go purple.

For example, my record key is F10. (Be sure to disable whatever F10 does when you're in EQ so that it only records and doesn't issue a command to EQ). I have my buffer set to 40 seconds. When I fire up FRAPS I get the yellow "standby" numbers. I hit F10 and hold it down. The numbers will briefly turn red and then purple. Once they turn purple you can release the key.

The buffer is then engaged. When you want to record video simply hit F10 (or whatever key you set) and the numbers will turn red to indicate it's recording. You will then have the previous 30 seconds + whatever you continue to record. To turn off recording just his F10 (or whatever) again and the numbers will go yellow. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Note that free/trial versions CANNOT use the buffer.

... as I said, FTE and firepower. Sounds a lot to me like KSing, but there you.

It absolutely is borderline KSing/dickmovery, but there's not much else that can be done by the decision makers short of useful evidence being offered.

[TarukShmaruk]

such a pointless witch hunt.

I hope this thread doesn't tarnish your name too much whukes, though it seems that was the entire point of this post since the op had no claim to hadden and is just pissy he didn't get the tag because he was busy watching cartoons.

just my opinion, if a dispute is brought to public forums gm's should just wash their hands of it. If people want to handle things the way they are supposed to be handled, petitions etc great, the moment they bring it to public forums trying to slander a player because theyre upset they obviously don't care about the issue they're just mad they were beaten and want to ruin the guys rep.

Whukes /friending you as soon as I log in, hell i might give you some cash for being an UPSTANDING member.

Let's be clear here - the rules may say that camping a spawn that is outdoors doesn't give you enforceable rights to that spawn, and that FTE aplies, but Whukes knew he was being a giant twat and basically stealing the spawn.

OP is justified in being upset. Any normal person would be, and nobody is going to go "lol dangit well played sir i was looking away for 20 seconds, congrats". Tarnished reputations is a justified consequence after acting like a prick - whether you technically broke the rules or not.

As would anyone else in similar circumstances. This may fall into general etiquette, but if someone is camping the AC and clearing PHs for hours and you get FTE you're being a shitface, and you're going to make some enemies, and your reputation may suffer.

[t0lkien]

such a pointless witch hunt.

I hope this thread doesn't tarnish your name too much whukes, though it seems that was the entire point of this post since the op had no claim to hadden and is just pissy he didn't get the tag because he was busy watching cartoons.

just my opinion, if a dispute is brought to public forums gm's should just wash their hands of it. If people want to handle things the way they are supposed to be handled, petitions etc great, the moment they bring it to public forums trying to slander a player because theyre upset they obviously don't care about the issue they're just mad they were beaten and want to ruin the guys rep.

Whukes /friending you as soon as I log in, hell i might give you some cash for being an UPSTANDING member.

Welcome to the power of community. Thanks for the heads up on your ingame ethic, btw.

[webrunner5]

kylok should have let this go through the GM's. If he does not have good real proof then well you learned a hard lesson. This ends up as both parties looking stupid as far as I can tell. Waste of a thread. :eek: kylok will look like a ass if he is wrong.

[Reguiy]

Was it legal to come KS Hadden? Probably. Was it a scumbag move? Definitely.

[kylok]

Lesson learned, though from what I can tell letting it go through the GMs wouldn't have done me much good.

Thanks for the fraps info Frieza I've got it working now.

[Danth]

...Now some AFK dude sitting on the island sees Hadden pop, doesn't engage for 2 solid minutes, and I'm the bad guy.

I suspect that had this person actually waited the "2 solid minutes," then this unfortunate thread wouldn't exist. Ambrotos' log shows a delay between spawn and engage of a mere few seconds.

-------------------------------------

Discussing the 20 second delay from the second attacker is perhaps off the mark. The other person engaged after ~7 seconds or so and that was deemed having waited long enough. I don't much care about these two guys or Hadden's earring, but I do care about whether or not every last camp on P1999 is in fact a mere question of FTE.

Danth

[LiQuid]

Ok, so from what I see, since the other guy, Katanawhatever didn't do anything other that say it was his camp here is what I assume happened.

Katanadude parked in Qhills however many hours ago expecting he could AFK camp while checking in every now and then and probably tabbed out to watch cat videos on Youtube.

Lil Wizard rolled up or logged in when he know Hadden was going to pop, watched the other guy not engage for an unspecified amount of time then went to work.

Katuaagfogiahrg hears someone nuking, tabs back over and curses his luck as Hadden popped when he was in the middle of watching Mittens romp in an empty box. He proceeds to make a limp claim to the camp and then comes here to tell us about how he was KS'd even tho he made no attempt to engage the mob at any time because he was beaten to it even tho he had allegedly been sitting there for 6 hours.

Anybody have anything to clarify or add to this?
If we're quote bumping our own genius now, I had this shit detective'd on very little evidence on page one.

[A1551]

ruling doesn't make a lotta sense -- it's basically saying "forget holding a camp its all FTE" -- how can you argue that 20ish seconds is an "adequate" amount of time to give someone? Especially considering the server logs showed the wizzie basically started casting on hadden within 5 seconds of him spawning(!!!). He jumped the spawn clear as day, didn't even pretend to give the (admittedly alleged) camp holder a chance to engage.

Gonna have a lotta douchebaggery going on out there using this as a justification. That's the real tragedy here!

To the OP -- turn on autologging (/log on I believe). Not because it'll prove anything, but because you can use it to go back and see exactly, to the second, when a spawn died, and then you can set a timer, to the second, for when itll pop again. Then you can be there, sitting at your computer ready to engage the second it spawns. With something like hadden, there is really no excuse not to jump the spawn the second he is up if it is your camp and thus avoid issues like this. It sounds like you're over it, anyway!

[kylok]

I am very much "over it" however, I am still sitting at this camp waiting for an earring lol.

[t0lkien]

I am very much "over it" however, I am still sitting at this camp waiting for an earring lol.

Coming over to FTE and mess up your day ;)

[LiQuid]

I'm down for a Hadden poopsock

[Sidelle]

such a pointless witch hunt.

I hope this thread doesn't tarnish your name too much whukes, though it seems that was the entire point of this post since the op had no claim to hadden and is just pissy he didn't get the tag because he was busy watching cartoons.

just my opinion, if a dispute is brought to public forums gm's should just wash their hands of it. If people want to handle things the way they are supposed to be handled, petitions etc great, the moment they bring it to public forums trying to slander a player because theyre upset they obviously don't care about the issue they're just mad they were beaten and want to ruin the guys rep.

Whukes /friending you as soon as I log in, hell i might give you some cash for being an UPSTANDING member.

Yeah we get it. You like Whukes. Why not offer a nice BJ along with that friending and plat while you're at it. As someone else already posted, there was no witch hunt until he started acting like a twat on the forum. From his first post I could tell he was an asshole.

Plus, I have never met a gnome I liked. Hey, do you play a gnome too? :) Just wondering.

[Flamewraith]

Yeah we get it. You like Whukes.

My thoughts exactly.

[kylok]

Hadden's gonna spawn at 4:52:44 pm pacific - everyone come have a party! I'll fraps the video and post it for funs =D

[sonbrodersen]

Hadden's gonna spawn at 4:52:44 pm pacific - everyone come have a party! I'll fraps the video and post it for funs =D

Goodluck!

[LiQuid]

I would really appreciate it if Whukes came in and gloated a little bit before this thread wraps up. Somebody get him on the horn.

[Reguiy]

Hadden's gonna spawn at 4:52:44 pm pacific - everyone come have a party! I'll fraps the video and post it for funs =D

I like to party.

[LiQuid]

I like to party.

I like to party.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y2nPHYpmXc

[t0lkien]

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h162/t0lkien/deliverability-experts-bid-adieu-to-the-bat-phone_zpsa5c7c634.jpg

[liveitup1216]

My name is Rod and I like to party.

[liveitup1216]

Also WTB port to WK/NK.

[Treefall]

And threads like this are the reason there is NPC tagging and instances in modern games.

[liveitup1216]

And threads like this are the reason there is NPC tagging and instances in modern games.

And people still try to KS rare spawns, what's your point?

[t0lkien]

And threads like this are the reason there is NPC tagging and instances in modern games.

And reasoning like that is why proverbs like "throwing the baby out with the bathwater" were coined. You lose (much) more than you gain by removing all chance of griefing. The community will deal with this aptly, I'd say.

[Reguiy]

I would really appreciate it if Whukes came in and gloated a little bit before this thread wraps up. Somebody get him on the horn.

Maybe he'll make the party in Qhills?

[fuark]

I'm still curious about the pathing thing. Does an outdoor mob have to path for it to essentially be FTE? Hadden isn't a pather, and neither is the OOT AC. But if Hadden is FTE then it's all outdoor mobs, not just pathers?

Also are all dungeon camps FTE?

If I go to the OOT AC and engage 6 seconds after it spawns even though someone else is there and it's obvious he's camping it, that's cool right?

If I'm in Droga and Soothersayer spawns, someone is obviously camping him but perhaps goes to answer the door, I can just wait 6 seconds, FTE him, and that's cool too?

Genuinely curious. I currently wait about 10 minutes to engage a mob where someone is already at a camp. Can I move my 10 minutes to 6 seconds?

[Lemiddar]

And who the fuck takes pictures of themselves committing crimes?


Unrelated: Is sodomy still illegal anywhere?

[whukes]

Unrelated: Is sodomy still illegal anywhere?

You sir are a genius.

[webrunner5]

whukes I think I would give up posting in this thread. You have come off like some KS dickhead here and I don't give a crap about what you say. Don't care what GM's say you are someone I don't care to know in game or in RL.

[Rezonation]

And who the fuck takes pictures of themselves committing crimes?

Aaron Hernandez

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr06/2013/6/27/10/enhanced-buzz-19111-1372342644-5.jpg

[Gadwen]

I'm still curious about the pathing thing. Does an outdoor mob have to path for it to essentially be FTE? Hadden isn't a pather, and neither is the OOT AC. But if Hadden is FTE then it's all outdoor mobs, not just pathers?

Also are all dungeon camps FTE?

If I go to the OOT AC and engage 6 seconds after it spawns even though someone else is there and it's obvious he's camping it, that's cool right?

If I'm in Droga and Soothersayer spawns, someone is obviously camping him but perhaps goes to answer the door, I can just wait 6 seconds, FTE him, and that's cool too?

Genuinely curious. I currently wait about 10 minutes to engage a mob where someone is already at a camp. Can I move my 10 minutes to 6 seconds?

All outdoor mobs are FTE I guess, if the GMs can get the logs and say that this kill was legit I don't see how anyone can claim any camp. Assuming of course that the story is true and the one guy logged back in and the other was already there, which IMO makes it pretty damn obvious who had the camp.

No wait time required, FTE on every mob. We should turn every decent camp into a poopsocking shit fest on this server.

[Flamewraith]

Like I said, this is a sad day for the honest.

[India]

Some GM's (we've seen a few on this server) have always found it impossible to admit their initial call was incorrect. When that happens, you get bad decisions like this one.

[RevengeofGio]

Sometimes the community should override a GMs decision. In this case (sorry Rham) Whukes was a bit of a dick; anyone who doesn't see that is probably a bit sociopathic themselves or very young.

Is it against the rules? Ehhh? No.... but OJ was found not guilty also. It sets a really bad precedent for camps though since it all comes down to FTE.

Kinda like lending money to friends....

If you want a drop decide what's more important the drop or making friends.... If you want the drop more then tag the mob first the GMs apparently are cool with it.

[Ele]

Sometimes the community should override a GMs decision. In this case (sorry Rham) Whukes was a bit of a dick; anyone who doesn't see that is probably a bit sociopathic themselves or very young.

Is it against the rules? Ehhh? No.... but OJ was found not guilty also. It sets a really bad precedent for camps though since it all comes down to FTE.

Kinda like lending money to friends....

If you want a drop decide what's more important the drop or making friends.... If you want the drop more then tag the mob first the GMs apparently are cool with it.

Not guilty does not equal innocent. ;)

[Flamewraith]

I honestly cannot tell if it was a bad call by ambro or if the lack of proof + luck made this a valid kill. It's so obvious who the real victim here is and it's sad that a KSing asshole gets to walk (although it looks like his rep took a blow to the balls) it still just sucks.

[Ambrotos]

It is a contested spawn that is very low level. If you want it, be active and ready to kill it when it spawns. If it is up after it spawns and not engaged due to people being afk then it does become free for anyone. It isn't a FTE issue, the issue is being afk when it spawns.

As for bad decisions, it's a situation that has been ruled this way by the very GM countless times you love India. Camping a mob is a privelege, not a right. If someone wants the privelege of having sole claim to a mob, they have to make the sacrifice of whatever else they could be doing with themselves. Claim to a camp is a considerable advantage, it comes with a cost. Choose wisely.


If the staff comes out and says " you must engage very quickly" then people will ask is how quick is quickly, how many seconds? Then you will get people to argue over a 1-2 second window. So it has been you have to be active and ready to kill when it spawns. If you can't do it, then it's open.

Do I think it's a dick move that the wizard attacked 6 seconds or shortly afterwards? Sure. Yet it turns out the guy was afk while it spawned and admitted so. When all else fails, fall back on how it was ruled in the past and coherent to the rule set. Don't be afk at a camp when the named is ready to spawn at any time.

This sets no bad precedent. This has been the rule on the server the past 3 years. It's people over acting and twisting things around to a what if situation. There are camp rights. Read the rules and it spells it out, almost clearly heh but could be better. Yet being afk at a camp forfeits the camp.

[this user was banned]

Love that you get one side of a story and it's lynch the gnome time! I've been sitting at Hadden since 6/29 @ 8AM EST. Fell asleep at the keyboard after getting nothing but Fishing Poles for 4 kills. Now some AFK dude sitting on the island sees Hadden pop, doesn't engage for 2 solid minutes, and I'm the bad guy.

oh please, that's what everyone says

[Flamewraith]

It is a contested spawn that is very low level. If you want it, be active and ready to kill it when it spawns. If it is up after it spawns and not engaged due to people being afk then it does become free for anyone. It isn't a FTE issue, the issue is being afk when it spawns.

As for bad decisions, it's a situation that has been ruled this way by the very GM countless times you love India.


If the staff comes out and says " you must engage very quickly" then people will ask is how quick is quickly, how many seconds? Then you will get people to argue over a 1-2 second window. So it has been you have to be active and ready to kill when it spawns. If you can't do it, then it's open.

Do I think it's a dick move that the wizard attacked 6 seconds or shortly afterwards? Sure. Yet it turns out the guy was afk while it spawned and admitted so. When all else fails, fall back on how it was ruled in the past and coherent to the rule set. Don't be afk at a camp when the named is ready to spawn at any time.

This sets no bad precedent. This has been the rule on the server the past 3 years. It's people over acting and twisting things around to a what if situation. There are camp rights. Read the rules and it spells it out, almost clearly heh but could be better. Yet being afk at a camp forfeits the camp.

What if he hadn't been afk? I'm not talking about this specific camp when I give an example, but sometimes when I am camping a mob and I see it spawn I prepare myself for the fight instead of just blindly charging it. What if while he was mentally preparing himself, someone else jumps the mob because it had been up for 7 seconds? How could you prove that you weren't afk? Would the loot go to you?

[Stinkum]

It's people over acting and twisting things around to a what if situation.

What if...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg/300px-Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg

[xCry0x]

This thread is honestly confusing because it basically hints that everything is FTE which conflicts with: http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653

specifically:
2. Just because you know the timer a mob's spawn does NOT mean you are entitled to the camp. Examples include Ishva mal, Estrella, and Undertow. I have seen too many threads about ishva mal in particular where there is a person there at the camp and someone comes and either KS's the spawn or charms the mob to bring it somewhere else etc claiming it was theirs due to it being on timer. If you are trying to timer a spawn and you arrive and someone else is there, too bad, you should have been there earlier.

Now I do not know if that post was made with any authority but what it says always made sense.

This thread contradicts everything I have understood, if 30 seconds is enough time to justify losing the spawn then this server basically caters to afk lvl 60s vs active groups camping things. If you are are level ~30 mage and camping hadden, he spawns, you are 40m I would think the logical scenario would be you med to full and then take him down.

Is this just for outdoor mobs?

When I camp NG in seb on enchanter I basically kill the 3 bugs, /q to drop pet, log back in, afk at safe spot until I see bugs begin to repop. Then I wait for the krup roamer to path back, I mez it, tash it, charm it.. then I go calm the bugs and then slow pull when the pet is un-mezzed. That process can take a few mins and it sounds like someone else could basically just walk up and kill the bugs since I took longer than 2 seconds to engage them all.

Now should someone be able to afk indefinitely and kill the thing whenever they are done watching their movie? No.. but at the same time it is hard to say a definite time frame. In the example of a level 30 camping hadden it could take 1-2 mins to get enough mana. In the case of me camping NG the krup can take more than a couple of minutes to path, another min for mez to end etc.

[Nirgon]

Let's randomize this for 24 hours after the 6 hour window

Oh wait that's a terrible idea that caters to people who live on disability

[Ambrotos]

If he wasn't afk for 20+ seconds after it spawned he would attacked and killed it. If the wizard would have engaged while he was, then the wizard would be actively engaging in kill stealing. That is the answer.

Be ready to kill what you want. If you are at a camp with other spawns you have to kill, but you are keeping it clear of the place holder/named the camp is yours without worry of someone taking it. This is the key difference of this spawn and group/highly contested npcs. There is no place holder, so you have to be ready to kill it shortly after it spawns.
If you can't keep a area clear of the place holder/named, then you aren't able to hold the camp. The simple fact that people are abusing the invs mechanic and just solo pulling npcs needs to be addressed by the staff to consider that exploiting/bannable offense since it has been addressed it is broken and waiting for a patch to go in.

Camping a mob is a privilege, not a right. If someone wants the privilege of having sole claim to a mob, they have to make the sacrifice of whatever else they could be doing with themselves. Claim to a camp is a considerable advantage, it comes with a cost. Choose wisely.

[Flamewraith]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg/300px-Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg

Yeah you're right, that's why I said I wasn't talking about this exact scenario at the start of the question, it just bugs me that this was such a gross breach of justice.

[Flamewraith]

If he wasn't afk for 20+ seconds after it spawned he would attacked and killed it. If the wizard would have engaged while he was, then the wizard would be actively engaging in kill stealing. That is the answer.

Be ready to kill what you want. If you are at a camp with other spawns you have to kill, but you are keeping it clear of the place holder/named the camp is yours without worry of someone taking it. This is the key difference of this spawn and group/highly contested npcs. There is no place holder, so you have to be ready to kill it shortly after it spawns.
If you can't keep a area clear of the place holder/named, then you aren't able to hold the camp. The simple fact that people are abusing the invs mechanic and just solo pulling npcs needs to be addressed by the staff to consider that exploiting/bannable offense since it has been addressed it is broken and waiting for a patch to go in.

Ambros I know you're just doing your volunteer job and I respect you for it, but this is wrong. I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm saying this situation is wrong. There is no point in beating it any further, what's done is done, but this didn't end right I think.

[Nirgon]

If you're "actively camping something" you need to be "actively camping it" or it's not yours.

Threw Ambrodawg a bone and saved him some wrist.

However, the rules do permit you to haunt him across Norrath and curse his name or discredit him.

[Ambrotos]

This thread is honestly confusing because it basically hints that everything is FTE which conflicts with: http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653

specifically:


Now I do not know if that post was made with any authority but what it says always made sense.

This thread contradicts everything I have understood, if 30 seconds is enough time to justify losing the spawn then this server basically caters to afk lvl 60s vs active groups camping things. If you are are level ~30 mage and camping hadden, he spawns, you are 40m I would think the logical scenario would be you med to full and then take him down.

Is this just for outdoor mobs?

When I camp NG in seb on enchanter I basically kill the 3 bugs, /q to drop pet, log back in, afk at safe spot until I see bugs begin to repop. Then I wait for the krup roamer to path back, I mez it, tash it, charm it.. then I go calm the bugs and then slow pull when the pet is un-mezzed. That process can take a few mins and it sounds like someone else could basically just walk up and kill the bugs since I took longer than 2 seconds to engage them all.

Now should someone be able to afk indefinitely and kill the thing whenever they are done watching their movie? No.. but at the same time it is hard to say a definite time frame. In the example of a level 30 camping hadden it could take 1-2 mins to get enough mana. In the case of me camping NG the krup can take more than a couple of minutes to path, another min for mez to end etc.



If you are are level ~30 mage and camping hadden, he spawns, you are 40m I would think the logical scenario would be you med to full and then take him down.
First off you won't be 40 mana camping Hadden. This is the key part of when I say people try and twist everything around.

This thread contradicts everything I have understood, if 30 seconds is enough time to justify losing the spawn then this server basically caters to afk lvl 60s vs active groups camping things.

Where did I say being afk and level 60 gives you the right to the camp. If you read what I have posted, you must be active and ready to engage your single npc you don't have clear to get. How does being active ready to kill, equal being level 60 and afk?


When I camp NG in seb on enchanter I basically kill the 3 bugs, /q to drop pet, log back in, afk at safe spot until I see bugs begin to repop. Then I wait for the krup roamer to path back, I mez it, tash it, charm it.. then I go calm the bugs and then slow pull when the pet is un-mezzed. That process can take a few mins and it sounds like someone else could basically just walk up and kill the bugs since I took longer than 2 seconds to engage them all.

Once again, you answered your own question. You are actively engaged at your camp. Where is the comparison?

[thugcruncher]

So it has been you have to be active and ready to kill when it spawns. If you can't do it, then it's open.

Can this be the new banner? If I had a copper for every time I've had my mobs ks'd following this simple rule (if its popped and non engaged, it's not camped) I'd have a rod of annihilation or some shit.

I don't care what the camp rules were on your server, I don't care about what you think a camp is or entails. If you aren't killing it, or aren't seconds from killing it, it's not camped.

[Ambrotos]

Take abstract posts and clip them together to specifically mean anything you want to kill is fair game? No. Apply the situations to what the situation is.

[Nirgon]

People idling at camps and saying it belongs to them is bull shit. I fully support the judgement in this thread.

[xCry0x]

First off you won't be 40 mana camping Hadden. This is the key part of when I say people try and twist everything around.



Where did I say being afk and level 60 gives you the right to the camp. If you read what I have posted, you must be active and ready to engage your single npc you don't have clear to get. How does being active ready to kill, equal being level 60 and afk?




Once again, you answered your own question. You are actively engaged at your camp. Where is the comparison?

How am I twisting anything? The precedent set here is that it is FTE.

In the example of a mage, Hadden spawns, I summon my pet, I cast my self buff on myself, maybe cast pet buff? Probably down to 50m. If I am camping a mob in my level range I probably want to get full mana first.

2 mid lvl 20s are camping him to try to get lucky and make some money.. he spawns, they buff, they med, they engage.

Or shit, I am on my cleric at level 28 camping hadden, I buff myself and am sure as hell going to get full mana given how much mana my nukes use.

My second statement comes in at this point, a level 60 could be afk there and as soon as the mob spawns they nuke and loot without any need to prep.

Now with me at NG, I literally sit and wait for the krup to path - how is that more engaged than the guy who doesn't attack the spawn within 20 seconds?

The bottom line is that outdoor targets are FTE, does this apply to dungeons also?

If so, I need to go get a group together to go sit on fungi king camp because NOBODY ever does and it would be pretty damn easy to FTE a mob when the people 'camping' it are sitting afk in the tube room or timing pathers to invis pull.

I am not trying to twist anything around I just want to understand what the server rules are on this...

-edit-

read some of the other posts on this page, looks like FTE it is.

[RevengeofGio]

People idling at camps and saying it belongs to them is bull shit. I fully support the judgement in this thread.

The question is.... is 30 seconds idling?

20 seconds?

5 seconds?

[Stinkum]

How am I twisting anything? The precedent set here is that it is FTE.

In the example of a mage, Hadden spawns, I summon my pet, I cast my self buff on myself, maybe cast pet buff? Probably down to 50m. If I am camping a mob in my level range I probably want to get full mana first.

2 mid lvl 20s are camping him to try to get lucky and make some money.. he spawns, they buff, they med, they engage.

Or shit, I am on my cleric at level 28 camping hadden, I buff myself and am sure as hell going to get full mana given how much mana my nukes use.

My second statement comes in at this point, a level 60 could be afk there and as soon as the mob spawns they nuke and loot without any need to prep.

Now with me at NG, I literally sit and wait for the krup to path - how is that more engaged than the guy who doesn't attack the spawn within 20 seconds?

The bottom line is that outdoor targets are FTE, does this apply to dungeons also?

If so, I need to go get a group together to go sit on fungi king camp because NOBODY ever does and it would be pretty damn easy to FTE a mob when the people 'camping' it are sitting afk in the tube room or timing pathers to invis pull.

I am not trying to twist anything around I just want to understand what the server rules are on this...

Calm the hell down, kid.

He was pretty clear what the rules are, and responded to you several times when you were being a smart-ass and twisting things around.

If this honestly bothers you that much, find another server to play on.

[Nirgon]

How about 20 seconds, 30 seconds, 2 minutes, my "best friend showed up", my "kid wanted something", I was "only gone an hour"

It spawns, you are actively camping it, you're fine.

You aren't? Well, sorry you alt tabbed back to whatever fascinating shit you were doing or left the game otherwise when it popped and you missed it.

[RevengeofGio]

How about 20 seconds, 30 seconds, 2 minutes, my "best friend showed up", my "kid wanted something", I was "only gone an hour"

It spawns, you are actively camping it, you're fine.

You aren't? Well, sorry you alt tabbed back to whatever fascinating shit you were doing or left the game otherwise when it popped and you missed it.

You're dodging the question a bit...

Basically do you have to tag on spawn? I mean let's say you were camping x spawn:

1) You buffed then medded a bit then planned on pulling but I tag it first.. is it mine?

2) You wait a couple seconds for whatever reason and I tag it... is it mine?


I guess what I'm trying to get at is that the way this decision is phrased it could easily be made that it all comes down to FTE (which is the way you're saying it).

[Nirgon]

Being mad about something like this is normal though

[xCry0x]

Calm the hell down, kid.

He was pretty clear what the rules are, and responded to you several times when you were being a smart-ass and twisting things around.

If this honestly bothers you that much, find another server to play on.

Troll more.

[Droog007]

2 full minutes <> 7 seconds. The fact that Whukes lied about this part means that he knows full well he was being a greedy douche. And isn't that the overarching rule here (don't be a douche)?

To me, that's at least as bad as Katanamogimbo being inattentive to his camp. Reverse deciszh pls.

[Vaildez]

The courteous thing to do would be to give the person a couple min to engage if they are obviously sitting there waiting for the spawn.

[Nirgon]

It would be courteous to not go around calling everyone that I see "dumb".

But there's no rules against doing it.

That's the difference and I think points out what's happening here.

[Stinkum]

This thread is a great example of why a GM shouldn't publicly litigate a camp dispute.

Even though Ambrotos' ruling was clear, you still get the peanut gallery of entitled children like xCry0x rule-lawyering with their "What if ____" and "Let's say _____."

[xCry0x]

You're dodging the question a bit...

Basically do you have to tag on spawn? I mean let's say you were camping x spawn:

1) You buffed then medded a bit then planned on pulling but I tag it first.. is it mine?

2) You wait a couple seconds for whatever reason and I tag it... is it mine?


I guess what I'm trying to get at is that the way this decision is phrased it could easily be made that it all comes down to FTE (which is the way you're saying it).

Exactly, either call it FTE or define a time frame.

Saying that 'what ifs' aren't fair is itself not fair when the ruling uses ambiguous terms.

I know myself and the people I play with would generally wait, probably even send a afk check tell.

I know others would run in and engage without thinking twice.

This was demonstrated in the context of this thread.. so to each their own.

I am just glad I don't care enough about this game to stop me from getting up to take a shit while camping a mob or to get up and say hi to my Fiance when she gets home.

[Splorf22]

Ambrotos I understand your problem. On the one hand we have guys that are afk for 20 seconds and people are ninjaing their mobs. On the other hand we have people that wipe and call camps from the zone in.

But for a long (8 hours?) spawn like Hadden it seems to me like the person there should at least get a few minutes. This ruling makes it sound like I can walk into any XP camp and take their named if they don't tag it first.

[xCry0x]

deleted

don't need to feed the troll.

[Droog007]

Pure wisdom, as usual

Ambrotos wants less rules lawyering, but is applying a rule where a simple judgement call places the OP in the right. Just go with your gut... it's much harder to build a case against.

[Widan]

This is a very simple fix. See #1 on this thread (http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653) in the Library subforum:

1. Going forward, if you intend to hold or claim a camp, your group must retain presence at that camp. If you have no competition in the zone, you are more than welcome to hold as many as you like. The moment another party wants to claim a camp and you are "farming" multiple, you must decide which camp you want and forfeit the ones someone else is interested in. We still expect players to use the courtesy camp check before zerging a room. If there is a full spawn of mobs in a camp room up I think that would be considered not camped. How you pull the camp is up to you, as long as you are able to engage the mobs very shortly after they are spawned.

Instead of this bolded part put an actual time frame in there to clear up any confusion. I vote for 2 minutes to engage, 30 seconds is not very reasonable.

[liveitup1216]

This thread should be moved to the casters subforum to encourage more wizard creation.

[India]

As for bad decisions, it's a situation that has been ruled this way by the very GM countless times you love India.


Sirken?!?! Say it isn't so :(

[Xadion]

Napoleon syndrome

I don't know what this thread is about...


but now I want some ice cream.

[Ambrotos]

Ambrotos I understand your problem. On the one hand we have guys that are afk for 20 seconds and people are ninjaing their mobs. On the other hand we have people that wipe and call camps from the zone in.

But for a long (8 hours?) spawn like Hadden it seems to me like the person there should at least get a few minutes. This ruling makes it sound like I can walk into any XP camp and take their named if they don't tag it first.

Then you would be wrong and didn't read anything that I posted. Don't nitpick somethings to apply them to a situation you want them to be. Read the camp guidelines again. This applies to this camp since there is nothing to clear, you must remain active and be ready to engage as it spawns. If you are afk, then it is fair game. Where in any post did I say anything about a exp group spot this applies to. It is well defined as to what a group/clearing exp spot.