auction tracker on wiki

[fishingme]

So I've noticed that all of the items I've looked up the price for on the wiki are gone. Any info on this?

[Pringles]

Keep it gone IMO

[Econ]

Keep it gone IMO

+1

[fishingme]

this is a question thread, not a poll thread. Keep thread on track please.

[Estolcles]

THey're gone because the wiki is probably still having issues.

That and a large portion of the p99 crowd wanted it gone... so that might be why it's gone.

And that, my friends, is a good thing.

[crkhobbit]

Serious question: why do people want the tracker gone? Doesn't it help to insure fair market values?

As a newb who doesn't know values, it seems like a good thing.

[NegaStoat]

I was disgruntled as well, but ah well. It just means I have to keep a piece of notebook paper on the desk to manually track prices of items I give a crap about for my character. The tracker was a great time saver, but not the end of the world.

[Reguiy]

Serious question: why do people want the tracker gone? Doesn't it help to insure fair market values?

As a newb who doesn't know values, it seems like a good thing.

So EC traders can rip people off.

[Reguiy]

P.S. - http://ahungry.com/eqauctions is a good way to get a more accurate representation of prices. As the wiki only goes off by what people are selling it for, and this shows prices of buyers and sellers.

[kaev]

P.S. - http://ahungry.com/eqauctions is a good way to get a more accurate representation of prices. As the wiki only goes off by what people are selling it for, and this shows prices of buyers and sellers.

Neither is accurate, both are manipulated. There is no source for the actual prices items sell at, only people uploading logs of /auc chat.

That said, both are useful and the people who "want them gone" are mostly those who want to rip off people who don't spend hours every day watching auctions in EC. There are excellent words available to describe such people, but they tend to get threads moved to RnF when posted.

[Econ]

Neither is accurate, both are manipulated. There is no source for the actual prices items sell at, only people uploading logs of /auc chat.

That said, both are useful and the people who "want them gone" are mostly those who want to rip off people who don't spend hours every day watching auctions in EC. There are excellent words available to describe such people, but they tend to get threads moved to RnF when posted.

The auction tracker is a huge influence on the market, nothing on live every influenced prices are strongly as this does.
It is not such a bad thing, but when people base their buy/sells on the Average all time price*** then it becomes frustrating. It has logs of prices from 3 years ago in that average, and some people just don't get how the data reflects on the current market.
You are not entitled to know every price of every item on the market; not everyone had this information on live unless they camped the tunnel.

[Ajkuhuun]

not everyone had this information on live unless they camped the tunnel.

Not until Luclin that is.

Is it absolutely necessary? No, you're right. Is it helpful to those of us just starting and unfamiliar with the economy on p99? Absolutely.

As someone relatively new to the server the auction tracker has been an invaluable resource. Coming from live, where the prices have been so horribly inflated there's just no way to tell what would be a fair price here on P99, having something you can refer to for even what people have asked lately is great. The folks who camp the tunnel are still going to bring in plat by buying low and selling high (no amount of information can dissuade the need for quick plat if you need it), and by basically snowing someone who doesn't know about the tracker or doesn't bother checking it for every item. Of course not everyone who plays the tunnel makes their plat by cashing in on the ignorance of the buyer, many rake in the plat buying low/selling high or by selling items people don't want to put in the time to farm (tradeskills anyone?), but for those who do, I can see how the absence of the auction tracker would be a boon to business :P

[myriverse]

Serious question: why do people want the tracker gone? Doesn't it help to insure fair market values?

As a newb who doesn't know values, it seems like a good thing.
Yes, and that's why the crooks of the server want it gone.

[myriverse]

The auction tracker is a huge influence on the market, nothing on live every influenced prices are strongly as this does.
It is not such a bad thing, but when people base their buy/sells on the Average all time price*** then it becomes frustrating. It has logs of prices from 3 years ago in that average, and some people just don't get how the data reflects on the current market.
You are not entitled to know every price of every item on the market; not everyone had this information on live unless they camped the tunnel.
Nonsense. Live had price trackers, and everybody used them in the classic era.

[Lyra]

So EC traders can rip people off.

Yep

So if the majority of the server wants it gone, that does tell you something.

[kaev]

Yep

So if the majority of the server wants it gone, that does tell you something.

These empty claims about "the majority of the server" are worth exactly what goes into making them: nothing. A handful of forum posters (who could all be the same person) does not constitute "the majority of the server".

[Estu]

The 'recent changes' log in the P99 Wiki has the following entries by Ravhin:


(diff | hist) . . m Main Page‎; 10:40 . . (-43)‎ . . ‎Ravhin (Talk | contribs)‎ (disable auctiontracker temporarily)
(diff | hist) . . m Template:Itempage‎; 10:39 . . (-41)‎ . . ‎Ravhin (Talk | contribs)‎ (remove auctiontracker from items temporarily)

Key word: temporarily.

[xnolanx]

I was disgruntled as well, but ah well. It just means I have to keep a piece of notebook paper on the desk to manually track prices of items I give a crap about for my character. The tracker was a great time saver, but not the end of the world.

even better.. there's /note you can use and just keep it all recorded in your actual UI and not have to have an external piece of paper .. it's built into your client..

[Weekapaug]

So EC traders can rip people off.

[Weekapaug]

Yep

So if the majority of the server wants it gone, that does tell you something.

The last time I saw a poll on this, the people who voted to keep the tracker were about double those who wanted it gone.

The ONLY reason anyone would want an uninformed customer is so they can rip them off. Period.

Not everyone wants to spend their whole life in EC playing the trading game and they shouldn't be prone to getting ripped off because they don't sit in EC all the time.

[Ele]

How is it getting "ripped off" if you pay the price someone asks? Isn't that what the item is worth (at least) to you? If you think the price is too high, just don't buy it.

[webrunner5]

How is it getting "ripped off" if you pay the price someone asks? Isn't that what the item is worth (at least) to you? If you think the price is too high, just don't buy it.

And just how do you know the price is too high if you don't have a clue what the price is. Not everyone has been on here for 4 years. Your funny. Not everyone sits in EC Tunnel 12 hours a day.

[Ele]

And just how do you know the price is too high if you don't have a clue what the price is. Not everyone has been on here for 4 years. Your funny. Not everyone sits in EC Tunnel 12 hours a day.

How is the price high, if that is the price someone is willing to pay? Wouldn't that be the correct price?

[spoils]

webrunner5=communist.

this is murica...capitalism...free markets...like ele said...if u don't like the price, then don't buy it...eventually the seller will lower his price cause he wants to get rid of it...

prices will always find equilibrium. Otherwise we all should sell shit to vendors and let the vendors sell back to people...but let the GMs decide the flat prices for everything.

[Raavak]

I fail to see how knowing the "going rate" on an item equates to communism (or socialism - the correct term). The only real issue I have with the tracker is that it is based on public bids and not real buy/sell data. But it uses the best info you can really attain... Dow Jones posts up to the minute going rate of stocks... you think that's not capitalism?

[Weekapaug]

Prices do find equilibrium, with and without the tracker. That has nothing to do with this. The tracker doesn't set prices. Players do. The tracker just tracks them. That's it. You can get the same info that's on the tracker by sitting in EC and tracking it yourself. But not everyone wants to do that, and there's no good reason NOT to have a tracker.....Unless you are trying to rip people off.

I'm sorry, but it's just complete BS to actively want to take advantage of people who don't sit in EC all day every day by depriving them of info that can easily be tracked and has been.

[ansar]

+1

Prices do find equilibrium, with and without the tracker. That has nothing to do with this. The tracker doesn't set prices. Players do. The tracker just tracks them. That's it. You can get the same info that's on the tracker by sitting in EC and tracking it yourself. But not everyone wants to do that, and there's no good reason NOT to have a tracker.....Unless you are trying to rip people off.

I'm sorry, but it's just complete BS to actively want to take advantage of people who don't sit in EC all day every day by depriving them of info that can easily be tracked and has been.

[Wiery]

The 'recent changes' log in the P99 Wiki has the following entries by Ravhin:


(diff | hist) . . m Main Page‎; 10:40 . . (-43)‎ . . ‎Ravhin (Talk | contribs)‎ (disable auctiontracker temporarily)
(diff | hist) . . m Template:Itempage‎; 10:39 . . (-41)‎ . . ‎Ravhin (Talk | contribs)‎ (remove auctiontracker from items temporarily)

Key word: temporarily.

And this should be /endthread.

Off the topic, anyone that wants the feature gone, should probably rethink the definition of a wiki.

[Rastignac]

The price tracker clearly provides a useful and neutral service for players who don't want to get ripped off, as well as unprofessional sellers who want to know what they should ask for their items. By unprofessional I mean those players who like to actually spend time out in the world adventuring.

The backwoods economic arguments being put forth here are stupid. There's not a modern market in the world that doesn't track and publish sale prices.

The P1999 economy is peculiar for those coming from Live and esp for those who haven't played since the classic era (like me). I played on Tarrew Marr in the early days, so I might readily have paid a hefty sum for a sacrificial dagger or a SSoY. Those items aren't very valuable any more, and I'm glad the limited plat I spent 20+ hours farming at sisters wasn't scammed out of my pockets. Thanks auction tracker!

[Thulack]

How is it getting "ripped off" if you pay the price someone asks? Isn't that what the item is worth (at least) to you? If you think the price is too high, just don't buy it.

This. No one is forcing you to pay what people want for a item. If you want a item and are willing to pay 15k for it your gonna pay that no matter what the wiki says. The wiki should help keep track of what people charge not be used for people to set the prices. There is a difference.

[justin2090]

Sadly, auction tracker goes against the "classic" mindset. EC trading was a class in itself on live. That being said, I'm sure if Sony had an auction tracker they would of implemented it, and I don't see how it does anything but help the community.

[Weekapaug]

Sadly, auction tracker goes against the "classic" mindset. EC trading was a class in itself on live. That being said, I'm sure if Sony had an auction tracker they would of implemented it, and I don't see how it does anything but help the community.

Allas tracked prices. It was based on player input and wasn't all that accurate because prices differed from server to server and that feature wasn't always used on every item, but it was there. Entirely classic.

[Weekapaug]

This. No one is forcing you to pay what people want for a item. If you want a item and are willing to pay 15k for it your gonna pay that no matter what the wiki says. The wiki should help keep track of what people charge not be used for people to set the prices. There is a difference.

So, let's do away with a wiki feature that keeps players informed about the general going rates for a particular item so they are willing to pay more for them...So the item becomes worth more to them, simply because they are uneducated on what the item has generally been going for?

You are simply proving the point. You just want to rip people off, plain and simple. Even with the wiki, people are still willing to pay higher prices if they don't want to wait around or if they just happen to have the cash to spend. I did that the other night...Paid 100p more for an item that usually goes for 500p because I was tired of waiting for it to come up for sale. What you want is for the general player base to be uninformed, generally so they are always willing to pay more. There's your difference.

[Econ]

Why does everyone think the people that want the auction tracker gone are just trying to rip everyone off? Maybe we are trying to recreate our EC tunnel experience, I don't remember getting tells "wiki says that is worth X amount, so I will give you X amount" on live.
People rely on this information, because it has been handed to them for far too long.
It was not like this on Classic, stop fooling yourself.
Again, why do you feel you are entitled to know every price of every item without putting in ZERO effort to do so?
While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?

[Weekapaug]

Why does everyone think the people that want the auction tracker gone are just trying to rip everyone off? Maybe we are trying to recreate our EC tunnel experience, I don't remember getting tells "wiki says that is worth X amount, so I will give you X amount" on live.
People rely on this information, because it has been handed to them for far too long.
It was not like this on Classic, stop fooling yourself.
Again, why do you feel you are entitled to know every price of every item without putting in ZERO effort to do so?
While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?

You can get the same info by doing a PC, just as you could live. I'm assuming your "EC tunnel experience" was that of ripping uninformed players off. Why are you entitled to do that?

I mean seriously, you people are openly arguing not for something that isn't classic in the game, but for removing an OUT OF GAME WEBSITE FUNCTION that is nothing other than simple, easy to find information, for the express purpose of screwing people with inflated pricing. Listen to yourselves.

[justin2090]

Allas tracked prices. It was based on player input and wasn't all that accurate because prices differed from server to server and that feature wasn't always used on every item, but it was there. Entirely classic.

I don't remember getting tells "wiki says that is worth X amount, so I will give you X amount" on live.


And I don't remember getting tells that Allakazam said it was worth X amount either. Not classic.

[Econ]

You can get the same info by doing a PC, just as you could live. I'm assuming your "EC tunnel experience" was that of ripping uninformed players off. Why are you entitled to do that?

I mean seriously, you people are openly arguing not for something that isn't classic in the game, but for removing an OUT OF GAME WEBSITE FUNCTION that is nothing other than simple, easy to find information, for the express purpose of screwing people with inflated pricing. Listen to yourselves.

I don't rip anyone off, why do you keep saying this? Oh that's right, it is your ONLY argument.
Wether the tracker is up or not, I will still acquire massive amounts of platinum. This "OUT OF GAME WEBSITE FUNCTION" is hosted on p99 website. This is equal to Sony hosting it.
You just want your hand held, maybe you should try a different MMO.
Oh and while we are catering to casuals, how about that mob spawn tracker? I don't want to spend 8+ hrs camping Haden or whatever else, so can you please give me a wiki page where I can have all this data handed to me.

[Lyra]

Why does everyone think the people that want the auction tracker gone are just trying to rip everyone off? Maybe we are trying to recreate our EC tunnel experience, I don't remember getting tells "wiki says that is worth X amount, so I will give you X amount" on live.
People rely on this information, because it has been handed to them for far too long.
It was not like this on Classic, stop fooling yourself.
Again, why do you feel you are entitled to know every price of every item without putting in ZERO effort to do so?
While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?

As an economist (cough) you should know the only thing determining price is supply / demand. If someone sends you a tell offering the wiki price and you don't want to take that price, you tell them no. If they can't find it elsewhere cheaper, they may come back to you and pay your asking. THAT is how it works.

Maybe you should put everyone on /ignore that might send you a tell bringing you back to 2013. Reminds me of the movie "Somewhere in Time". While "back in time" in 1912, he discovers a penny in his pocket with a mint date of 1979 and is pulled back to current time. Time travel didn't work for him, and it won't work for you.

[justin2090]

Besides, friend A could sell friend B a fbss for 8k. Then friend B sell to friend C for 7k (etc etc). Now the price has dropped on wiki and they can buy all the ones selling for 7k, wait for market to go back up and sell for 12k. Using wiki to manipulate the price of something is not free market. Scammers gonna scam regardless.

[Econ]

We have multiple resources to check the market prices of items. The wiki is not the authority on it, but people think it is. Furthermore, due to inflation, people cannot figure out that the ALL TIME AVERAGE PRICE is wrong, and people fail to see more current data as relevant.
I am all for the wiki data when it is referenced correctly.
Also, you people have it all backwards.EC tunnel traders do not make platinum from selling to other players at higher than market prices. Regardless if the wiki is there or not, profits will still be made. I just wanted to recreate my EQ classic experience like you guys do, is that so wrong of me?

[myriverse]

Why does everyone think the people that want the auction tracker gone are just trying to rip everyone off? Maybe we are trying to recreate our EC tunnel experience, I don't remember getting tells "wiki says that is worth X amount, so I will give you X amount" on live.
People rely on this information, because it has been handed to them for far too long.
It was not like this on Classic, stop fooling yourself.
Again, why do you feel you are entitled to know every price of every item without putting in ZERO effort to do so?
While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?
Your experience is wrong. Instead of "wiki," it was "Alla's." People didn't bitch about it; they just didn't buy.

[Econ]

I can't believe you are comparing the inaccurate price tracker of Allakhazam that combined all server's prices into one, to the data mining auction tracker.
Makes me lol, did you ever play live in 2000? How many tells did you get in EC saying "well Alakhazam has it listed at X amount.."

[justin2090]

Your experience is wrong. Instead of "wiki," it was "Alla's." People didn't bitch about it; they just didn't buy.

I guess the only way to compromise on this is to make wiki have p99 blue and p99 red prices mixed together. That way no one will know an accurate price just like allakhazam! Classic!

oh and just make it really classic mix some prices in from the other servers on eqemu. Has to be really really really inaccurate to experience that full classic sensation.

[Ele]

Besides, friend A could sell friend B a fbss for 8k. Then friend B sell to friend C for 7k (etc etc). Now the price has dropped on wiki and they can buy all the ones selling for 7k, wait for market to go back up and sell for 12k. Using wiki to manipulate the price of something is not free market. Scammers gonna scam regardless.

The wiki doesn't pick up the price actually paid. Only the text that people include in their /auction line which gets parsed into the database, and only from log files that people happen to upload.

People can auction WTS XYZ 7000p all day long when they actually sold XYZ for 3500p, but the auction tracker will list the price as 7000p.

[justin2090]

The wiki doesn't pick up the price actually paid. Only the text that people include in their /auction line which gets parsed into the database, and only from log files that people happen to upload.

People can auction WTS XYZ 7000p all day long when they actually sold XYZ for 3500p, but the auction tracker will list the price as 7000p.

Well that just makes it even easier to manipulate and it would only take 1 person to do it. Next time I make an alt, the gear i need will be cheap =D ... jk i wouldn't do that but you get my point here.

[Buma]

I don't think they should take it down. A lot of new players coming here as well as old returning players who are unaware of the prices use this. It also saves the headache of asking people in /ooc what it's worth with a price check (PC). Please don't take it away, we need it. Otherwise people will start to get ripped off. Some guy was telling us on vent that the only reason they want it down is so prices go up and they can make more money off RMT, which I hope is not the case at all.

[Clark]

Keep it gone IMO

[justin2090]

I don't want it down either cause it saves me time and effort of sitting in ec all night learning prices. I'm just arguing that it isn't classic. And it's not.

[Swish]

Auction tracker, not classic.

Item linking, not classic. People should be typing in the stats on items...everyone wants the "classic" experience, amirite?

[NegaStoat]

I personally wouldn't rely on the wiki due to time drift of listed entries. Smart players should be asking guildmates their views on an item's price, noting the estimates down, and planning ahead for item slot purchases. But the impulse buyer is going to continue to shit up the chat with Price Checks on prime time in the zone.

So I guess I would want the wiki back just to avoid that stuff from cluttering up the chat. I already put casino peeps on ignore that advertise in /auction, but a lot of people won't use /ooc (which I can filter out) and do their stupid price checks in the /auction channel as well. It's even worse when people answer in it and then start holding arguments in that channel.

[Wiery]

The P99wiki didn't exist in 1999, therefore it should be removed!
The server hardware used for P99 didn't exist in 1999 and should now be removed!
Smartphones didn't exist in 1999, and so they should all be removed!

You should also realize that the argument to remove the tracker from the wiki is as ridiculous as the statements above. Even if it was removed, I'll just build standalone site for archiving the data, if for nothing else than to appease my apatite for tears.

[justin2090]

Auction tracker, not classic.

Item linking, not classic. People should be typing in the stats on items...everyone wants the "classic" experience, amirite?

Let's do it

[Weekapaug]

Auction tracker, not classic.

Item linking, not classic. People should be typing in the stats on items...everyone wants the "classic" experience, amirite?

The auction tracker isn't part of the actual game. You are arguing about whether an off-site website is classic or not. It has nothing to do with what is IN the actual game. There were plenty of ways to find out prices for things on a given server. Websites, guild websites, asking guildies, getting a PC in /ooc, asking friends, etc. etc. The point is not to make websites classic. The point is to make the server classic. Bards didn't AoE kite to the extent that they do here, either, but the mechanics were classic, so I guess we have to live with that. Even if they take the tracker off the wiki, there are other trackers, as we speak.

And it's not a matter of "everyone wants" things to be classic. That's the stated goal of the server, like it or not.

[myriverse]

The P99wiki didn't exist in 1999, therefore it should be removed!
The server hardware used for P99 didn't exist in 1999 and should now be removed!
Smartphones didn't exist in 1999, and so they should all be removed!

You should also realize that the argument to remove the tracker from the wiki is as ridiculous as the statements above. Even if it was removed, I'll just build standalone site for archiving the data, if for nothing else than to appease my apatite for tears.
Especially since we had numerous sites like Alla's that performed the exact same role that the Wiki pricetracker does. I used them all the time, in 1999-2000. That's how I knew I wasn't going to be ripped off.

And there already are standalone sites that archive the pricing data.

[Raavak]

Sadly, auction tracker goes against the "classic" mindset. EC trading was a class in itself on live. That being said, I'm sure if Sony had an auction tracker they would of implemented it, and I don't see how it does anything but help the community.There was auction trackers on Live. Allakazam Premium Service included one version. There were others.

[justin2090]

Pulled from the home page of P1999

"Relive the classic Everquest MMORPG Gaming Experience as it was in 1999 and onward. Project 1999 is a free to play Emulated Everquest Server giving Players the opportunity to experience Classic EQ Once again, currently in the Kunark expansion and a max level of 60, with the look and feel of the old interface and several modifications making game mechanics similar to how the game used to be. Project 1999 is the best and most popular classic Everquest experience."

Since it isn't part of the game mechanics. The wiki shall live another day.

[justin2090]

But it's still not classic. Apparently I was one of the few in this thread that was a tunnel rat on live. If allakhazam was accurate I would of used it but it wasn't. End of story.

[Econ]

I lived in the EC tunnel on live, and quit with the introduction of the Bazaar.
There was no outside influence for pricing as strong as the auction tracker. Doing PC's, asking friends, asking your guild was all very normal.
Allakhazam was not accurate at all, and no one checked it for item prices; I don't know what game you played, but I never once heard "Allakhazam says its worth X" in my 3 years of tunneling...not one single time.
All the arguments being made for the auction tracker is that it saves you guys time, and you are paranoid of being ripped of.
If you want to kill a raid boss, you track it. If you want to get top dollar and become an auction hero, you track item prices. This is just how the game was, and should be replicated as such.
If you want to trivialize the EC tunnel for convience, then where does it stop? Why not put a mob spawn tracker on the wiki, and track the last time each mob was last killed so I do not need to compete with trackers/more dedicated people?
EverQuest is an unforgiving game that you need to invest countless hours to achieve what you want. EC tunnel was no different on live and should be no different here. If you do not have the dedication to learn the market, why do you feel you deserve to be handed the information?

[justin2090]

If you want to trivialize the EC tunnel for convience, then where does it stop?

eff it just make a global trade channel. I wanna EC tunnel while I XP in Kunark.

[SCB]

Auction tracker was only ever of limited use, but it's more valuable than not having it. There are items I only ever camped after spending some bathroom time on my tablet skimming the wiki for stuff I could camp.

Anyone arguing against it on "shits classic" principles is arguing a fight they can't win. Shit like the tracker existed in classic too.

Bring it back as soon as possible.

[NegaStoat]

All the arguments being made for the auction tracker is that it saves you guys time, and you are paranoid of being ripped of.

Actually, I argued that the wiki tracker assisted in reducing to the "Price check on X" followed with "Lol at that price nub" argument bullcrap that follows with it being missing. So your sweeping argument there failed.

Moving on, back in 1999-2001 EQ had official forum boards as well as Allakhazam having boards with specific sub forums for each server. Numerous posts were listed over and over with price checks on items, they were referenced by players, and don't tell me otherwise in a feeble attempt to prove your point. It happened.

Furthermore, top guilds on each server had their own web pages and consistently had item sales as a sub forum for people to browse through, which again was a server specific source for doing a price check. Conveniently forgot about this happening as well?

Stating that people back in the old days had to spend countless hours to be informed on item prices is sheer bullcrap. The sources were there. And if the wiki isn't restored, we'll see a return of them in multiple formats.

[Econ]

Auction tracker was only ever of limited use, but it's more valuable than not having it. There are items I only ever camped after spending some bathroom time on my tablet skimming the wiki for stuff I could camp.

Anyone arguing against it on "shits classic" principles is arguing a fight they can't win. Shit like the tracker existed in classic too.

Bring it back as soon as possible.
Hate to tell you, but PC's are as classic as CC's are.

It never existed on classic. Just another entitled new-aged MMO player chiming in.
The reason you guys want auction tracker is:
1) You save time by not camping EC.
2) You are scared of being ripped off.
I have yet to see anything other then these.
Auction tracker never existed on live. Allakhazam's price lister was a comprehensive list that included ALL servers for each item, making it completely inaccurate.
You guys want the EC tunnel dumbed down, just admit it. It isn't your fault, you have had your hands held this long so I can see why you require it moreso.

[Econ]

I love how you guys compare a fucking data mining price tracker to Allakhazam's inaccurate comprehensive price list. Fucking hilarious how stupid you are.
Every counter argument is the same.. I hate to break it to you, Allakhazam did not have an accurate price list. Comparing guild message boards to the auction tracker is also laughable. If you cannot see how these differ then I feel sorry for you.

[SCB]

I love how you guys compare a fucking data mining price tracker to Allakhazam's inaccurate comprehensive price list. Fucking hilarious how stupid you are.

You're a fucking idiot, and I'm glad you demonstrated it the first time I read your post, so I don't have to read any more.

[webrunner5]

This is what is says at the bottom of Wiki.

"Note: This is a wiki for a reason. If you see something that's wrong or can be improved, don't ask that it be fixed, please just improve it. As they say on wikipedia, edit boldly.
[ Please note: The p99 wiki is an unofficial, community supported resource which may contain inaccuracies, and is not administered by the p99 developers." ]

The devs have NOTHING to do with it. And shut the hell up about being "CLASSIC" shit. If I hear that one more time on here I will puke.

If you just started on here you have no clue in hell what stuff cost. Just what you need to find out that you looted your ass off to pay 200 plat for a item that is really worth 100 plat to some Jew Bastard in the tunnel flipping shit. If we can not get new blood on here this server is dead. And if they get ripped off by Richgirl types guess what. The hell about your supply and demand stuff.

[NegaStoat]

You're a fucking idiot, and I'm glad you demonstrated it the first time I read your post, so I don't have to read any more.

Yup.

As stated above, the Wiki price tracker was a player-adjusted feature. GM's & Admins had no interaction with it. It took the place as a cleaner, easier to use price tracking source as opposed to a server specific forum board thread listing.

But hey, continue with the F bombs and name calling. It will add credibility to your view somehow.

[Econ]

This is what is says at the bottom of Wiki.

"Note: This is a wiki for a reason. If you see something that's wrong or can be improved, don't ask that it be fixed, please just improve it. As they say on wikipedia, edit boldly.
[ Please note: The p99 wiki is an unofficial, community supported resource which may contain inaccuracies, and is not administered by the p99 developers." ]

The devs have NOTHING to do with it. And shut the hell up about being "CLASSIC" shit. If I hear that one more time on here I will puke.

If you just started on here you have no clue in hell what stuff cost. Just what you need to find out that you looted your ass off to pay 200 plat for a item that is really worth 100 plat to some Jew Bastard in the tunnel flipping shit. If we can not get new blood on here this server is dead. And if they get ripped off by Richgirl types guess what. The hell about your supply and demand stuff.
You are full of misconceptions. First of all, EC traders do not make shitloads of plat by overcharging people. If we overcharge we quickly lose our business because people won't buy from us. We buy items for less than they are worth, and the seller knows this by checking the wiki. We then sell said items at the normal market rate. The wiki does not effect this, wether its on or off it is the same profits. People get tired of spending countless hours in EC so they dump them cheap. We don't rip everyone off and add it to our jew bank while discussing further ways to prey on the ill-informed; like the majority of the repliers may think.
My argument is soley that EC is a sub-game within EQ, and the wiki is giving you all the information you need to win it. The wiki interfers with the market more than it helps it, its like a communist big brother telling us what we can sell our loot for. This server is supposed to replicate classic, so why would you get mad when I compare it to Classic? Isn't that the point?
You people villanize EC traders, and think we are all about ripping people off; this is a very stupid generalization.

[Glasken]

+1

Prices do find equilibrium, with and without the tracker. That has nothing to do with this. The tracker doesn't set prices. Players do. The tracker just tracks them. That's it. You can get the same info that's on the tracker by sitting in EC and tracking it yourself. But not everyone wants to do that, and there's no good reason NOT to have a tracker.....Unless you are trying to rip people off.

I'm sorry, but it's just complete BS to actively want to take advantage of people who don't sit in EC all day every day by depriving them of info that can easily be tracked and has been.

[Weekapaug]

And what you fail to realize is that the wiki isn't the only tracker. When the wiki was down last week, people were using a different one that someone has up. And people were broadcasting the url in /ooc and /auction.

All you have to do is park a toon in EC, parse the log, and put the info on a website.

Jumping up and down crying about the wiki having an auction tracker is ridiculous, regardless of your argument against it. All removing the tracker will do is make people keep an extra tab up on their browser for the other one.

[Glasken]

Hate to tell you, but PC's are as classic as CC's are.

It never existed on classic. Just another entitled new-aged MMO player chiming in.
The reason you guys want auction tracker is:
1) You save time by not camping EC.
2) You are scared of being ripped off.
I have yet to see anything other then these.
Auction tracker never existed on live. Allakhazam's price lister was a comprehensive list that included ALL servers for each item, making it completely inaccurate.
You guys want the EC tunnel dumbed down, just admit it. It isn't your fault, you have had your hands held this long so I can see why you require it moreso.

I honestly cannot tell if you are serious about this or if you are just trolling for tears.

Alla was never the only site listing items and prices. As stated before, other third party sites and guild sites all had this info. Are price checks via guild and ooc classic? Absolutely! Not everyone knew about or took the time to check all resources available to them. But the sources did exist. The one you used most often depended on your server, the guild you were in ect.

The arguments for the wiki price tracker (or even the wiki itself) being removed are flawed in that they are not inherent to the game mechanics. They mimic the same kind of resources that were around back in the day. Even if the overly vocal minority who want the tracker permanently removed had their way, other sources would pop up in short order. There has already been a secondary auction tracker linked in this thread, one that has existed along with the wiki tracker for at least a year (more?).

This is a dead issue. Online resources about items were around in 1999. People used those online resources. Online resources about items are available today, specific to p99, and will be wether the wiki tracker lives or dies.

[loramin]

Can I just state a few points?

1) EC traders are just people playing a game, like the rest of us. They are not any more or less evil than the rest of us (although I'm pretty sure Econ is going to hell for that Jew comment ;))

2) Buyers and sellers in ANY market whatsoever benefit from having more information than their "opponent".

3) The people who spend the most time in EC will have better information than people who don't.

4) People who sell, by virtue of having to do that selling for extended periods of time in EC, spend more time there. Because of this and point #2, this means they will get better prices.

5) Any sort of price reference (ie. the wiki) has a mitigating effect on point #4, because it reduces the information disparity between people who spend different amounts of time in EC.

When you add all the above together there's one obvious conclusion to be made:

The wiki negates the advantage of people who spend time in EC.

Now you can totally argue:

A) That's a good thing, because Everquest is about using gear to adventure, so anything that makes it easier for people to get gear to adventure with is good

B) That's a bad thing, because Everquest is about whatever you want it to be, and for some people that's trading, so anything that makes spending more time in EC worthless is bad (how would you like it if someone could reduce the experience you get for spending X hours in EQ? well the wiki reduces the plat they can make from spending X hours).

It just comes down to whether you think an "EC sub-game" is a key part of Everquest. If you do then you probably want it to work like the rest of EQ (more time spent = you do better), and if you don't then you want everyone to get equal prices no matter how much time they spend.

There's nothing wrong with either opinion, so enough with the profanity and name-calling; no one is wrong, evil, or scamming anyone, we just have different ways of playing the same game.

[Glasken]

Can I just state a few points?

The wiki mitigates the advantage of people who spend time in EC.





Fixed.

This assumes the wiki is the only source for prices. It is not. Not by a long shot.

[Ravhin]

Holy arguments. The auctiontracker is only down due to technical issues, and I hope to put it back up as soon as I can get them resolved.

In the meantime, as has been pointed out by many, another great resource is: http://ahungry.com/eqauctions/

While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?

Interesting..

[Glasken]

Originally Posted by Econ
While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?

Interesting..


Shouldn't be too hard to write a site for this. Open to the community and have all the spawn locs being clickable with two options: currently spawned, and killed. Once the killed selection goes through, a timer starts. Lets make it with pretty colors too, lots of reds and greens. Yellows for currently engaged targets. Hell, lets get the names of the people loaded in there too. We can dynamically have bots in every zone /telling people for their locs every three seconds.


Or, you know. Just let the wiki argument die the death it was meant to have.

[tristantio]

As far as I know, the ahungry.com/eqauctions tracker is pretty accurate - it would also be relatively simple for me to disable public upload and limit who is allowed to upload to a few specific IPs/people (right now anyone who runs the log uploader from my site can do so in realtime).

I am going to be providing rav a static dump of data from my auction tracker to incorporate into the wiki, which should be helpful as I've been slacking in porting the data over manually ( new babies, very busy with RL :) )

Interest in my http://ahungry.com/eqauctions/ tracker seems to come and go, so it's been awhile since I did much with it - it would be pretty trivial to include a price average/median/mean listings of everyone who has ever uploaded different data to my server and the associated prices however.

[tristantio]

Also regarding a mob tracker - the codebase for auctions on my site (including the realtime log uploader) is done from data placed on the player's hard drive in their log file (by typing /log on or whatever in game).

I had considered a mob/player tracker in a similar manner, it would not be difficult for someone (or myself) to modify the log upload code (its open source and on my github and website) and use it for whatever you like.

(https://github.com/ahungry/eqAuction/blob/master/eqAuction.c)

[Splorf22]

I'm going to sneak into Elethia's home and take pictures of his television, car, cell phone, computer, and internet connection and then demand he 'go classic' and buy a horse and buggy.

[Splorf22]

Also Tristiano my advice would be some outlier removal algorithm first. As has been pointed out, anyone can auction any price for anything.

[tristantio]

Only the last 3 /auc's of any given player name are saved on my server, so they'd have to use a lot of alts to manipulate the /auc value of a price (if I do incorporate averages) - but I would likely use some type of outlier detection.

Rav, sent you a PM.

[justin2090]

And shut the hell up about being "CLASSIC" shit. If I hear that one more time on here I will puke.

Cuuuuuuhh lassic!!

[SCB]

While we are at it can we please implement a mob tracker, that tells us the last time every single mob was spawned?



Rav, sent you a PM.

Oh my god how mad would you be Econ? lol

[webrunner5]

Cuuuuuuhh lassic!!

Thanks, I just puked in my Corn Flakes. :eek: I feel much better now.

[webrunner5]

Cuuuuuuhh lassic!!

Well I guess I don't really feel better now that I think about it.

[Calabee]

WTS Bone Clasped Girdle -- 600k

[Ele]

I'm going to sneak into Elethia's home and take pictures of his television, car, cell phone, computer, and internet connection and then demand he 'go classic' and buy a horse and buggy.

lol, Titanium client of horse and buggies

http://i.imgur.com/Q4XnOb2.jpg





I'm not even arguing against the auction tracker, I like it personally (just wish it was more accurate), just people's perception of the "correct" price.