Tips From Mage Players?

[Drakul]

I'm trying out the mage and I like it, but I'd like to learn the intricacies of the class.

1) How does chain summoning work? Do you wait for your pet to die, then cast another one? Do mages get root, and if so do you root first? Can you dismiss your pet while the spell is about to finish casting?

2) What are the pros/cons of each pet? So far I noticed fire seems to have a damage shield and earth roots.

3) Does playing a mage get harder at higher levels? I'm still only level 7 but since I got my pet at level 4 I feel like it's been even easier and faster than soloing with my necro... does it stay this easy?

4) Any other tips?

[rioisk]

1) Mages don't get root. In fact they're practically the only caster that doesn't get root. Mages lack any effect means of crowd control. Having said that, chain summoning works by starting to summon a pet before your first pet is about to die. You then hit the dismiss button right before you finish casting. It can take time to get just right. This method works to down difficult, non-summoning, single targets like Alli in OOT. In most cases though you won't be chain summoning pets to kill 1 mob. A more efficient method is to reclaim energy of your pet once it's health is low and resummoning.

2) Earth - high hp, low avoidance, shitty root, Water - average hp, average avoid, ice nuke Air - average-low hp, high avoidance, stuns Fire - low hp, average avoid, fire nuke, nice DS (better than yours). When soloing use fire pet in most cases. When grouping use air pet.

3) It stays about the same difficulty.

4) Mages solo most efficiently with single target blue con mobs. In most cases it's always less mana to reclaim energy on pet and recast than to heal him (not sure what level this becomes most efficient). Basically it's straightforwarding though......send in pet.....nuke may be once if you have to. Rinse. Repeat. Over and over and over.

[Walabaego]

That does pretty much sum it up. Researching can be a pain, but a few trusted high levels out there who sell spells if you go that route.

Also when chain summoning, remember that aggro will go directly to you when you dismiss pet for the new one being casted. (Or to a group member) Not a problem with 1 mob as pet will aggro quickly, but with more than one you'll have to do some Back off/Attacks until all of the mobs are on pet again. Kite around or stay still, whatever floats your boat :)

[Agecroft]

1) Mages don't get root. In fact they're practically the only caster that doesn't get root. Mages lack any effect means of crowd control. Having said that, chain summoning works by starting to summon a pet before your first pet is about to die. You then hit the dismiss button right before you finish casting. It can take time to get just right. This method works to down difficult, non-summoning, single targets like Alli in OOT. In most cases though you won't be chain summoning pets to kill 1 mob. A more efficient method is to reclaim energy of your pet once it's health is low and resummoning.

I played my Mage before the pet window so I got used to doing it this way: start casting the next pet and then type out /pet get lost; once the cast timer got down to almost nothing hit enter and the new pet would appear.

Works the same as above, just another method to consider.

[Eyry]

Here is a tip. If you want to level fast, don't group with people. We level fast enough soloing if you know where to go. Do not take pity on someone because they need a partner to level.

If you do not want to level faster and like the grouping aspect, that I can understand. If you want to group with someone to camp an item, i can understand that.

just my 2 cents.

[Jify]

Researching can be a pain, but a few trusted high levels out there who sell spells if you go that route.

Tells to Jify. If you have the components I'll do any combines for free. ;D

(201 Researching skill)

[Vyal]

Better to use the earth pet, depends if you mal before the pet roots, always watch for the msg that says its stuck in the ground then begin to resummon the new pet. Go away a split second before the spell finishes up. You'll get better at keeping the mob rooted during resummons.

My fav is to use a monk to pull to me once it's time to resummon the monk call grab agro if he needs to till the new pet gets it back monk fd..
Thats a method you could use the focus item to reclaim energy and keep chain petting all day. Clerics help now to :) Think I had maybe 9 kobolds and the king on my earth pet and the cleric could just cheal the only agro would be summon'd pets.

[krforrester]

Does anyone know if canni-pet works in p1999?

[Elissa]

4) Mages solo most efficiently with single target blue con mobs. In most cases it's always less mana to reclaim energy on pet and recast than to heal him (not sure what level this becomes most efficient). Basically it's straightforwarding though......send in pet.....nuke may be once if you have to. Rinse. Repeat. Over and over and over.

I'm confused... how is it more mana efficient to resummon pets than to just heal if it only takes ~1-2 heals at most (sometimes none) to kill something? Plus pet regen out of combat is pretty decent if necessary and I am medding anyway so its not like there's pointless downtime. Am I just too low to see this resummoning method be useful? (I'm SOON to be ~level 28).

[Reiker]

Does anyone know if canni-pet works in p1999?

It doesn't but it should.

I'm confused... how is it more mana efficient to resummon pets than to just heal if it only takes ~1-2 heals at most (sometimes none) to kill something? Plus pet regen out of combat is pretty decent if necessary and I am medding anyway so its not like there's pointless downtime. Am I just too low to see this resummoning method be useful? (I'm ~level 28)

I can't really give you an exact level, but eventually it becomes 100x more efficient to just reclaim/recast than to wait for a pet to regen or heal up a boatload of HP. It depends on the situation though, sometimes the downtime may outweigh the time it takes to get a high level pet if you already summoned one.

Also remember if you have to chain pet on a mob, never do anything that generates aggro, until you know for certain that you've cast the last pet you need to take the mob out, and then you can speed things up with nukes or what not.

[Kraftwerk]

Elissa let me try and give you a rundown on why it's so effective:

At higher levels the pet heal is for 200hp at cost of 100 mana. 2hp/1mana.
Summoning a pet will be about 600-1000 hp depending on level, mana cost being 170-200 (depending on spec). Use focus item to reclaim energy old near dead pet for, lowballing, 100 mana. So now you cast a new pet for, including reclaim mana, 70-100 mana. That is 600-1000hp/100 mana or 6 - 10 hp/1mana, much greater than 2hp/1mana with pet heal.

Using this process you have pet attack and kill, you use lvl 1 DD and reap benefits then med while pet kills. Keep going until pet goes below 15% then reclaim recast and effectively you never have to stop killing, your only limit is the number of mobs you can clear in a single cycle using high powered DDs at your own discretion.

[Insedeel]

It doesn't but it should.

Although I think I remember a dev saying that they remember pet canni, and plan to look into it, but needs to know what % the mana return was based on hps. The way it worked in the past was that you got a specific % of the pet's hps back as mana, and the level 49 earth pet had the most hps to mana cost ratio to summon of any of the pets through 60.

I remember the % was 10% of the pet's hps, but the proof of this was lost a long time ago (I tried finding it again, but haven't had any luck yet, but as soon as I find the proof, I plan on making a post in the bug reports section of the forum). The level 49 earth pet has around 3k hps unbuffed which at 10% of 3k is 300 mana returned for 200 mana cost to summon the pet. That may seem like a lot of mana, but it's not as much as some may think do to the fact that you won't be sitting and getting meditate mana, and it takes 9 seconds to summon a pet, so it's like 100 mana every tick and a half.

I can't really give you an exact level, but eventually it becomes 100x more efficient to just reclaim/recast than to wait for a pet to regen or heal up a boatload of HP. It depends on the situation though, sometimes the downtime may outweigh the time it takes to get a high level pet if you already summoned one.

Reiker is right about this. At your level (28) pet's cost a TON of mana in comparison to what you have for a mana pool, so for now it's going to be far more efficient to heal, or let the pet regen to full. Currently the level 24 pets cost 240 mana to summon, which at level 24 you should only have around 700+ mana depending on how much int gear you have. The pets also don't have that many hps at that level (around 6-800 hps) so your 150ish hp heal for 100 mana is pretty efficient. Your pet mana cost goes down to 200 starting at level 29 pets, and doesn't go any higher for mana cost until level 51+ (Kunark)

Now think about at level 49, say if you're using even your fire pet which has the least amount of hps of the level 49 pets. The level 49 fire pet has 2100 hps with pet focus. Say you've solod a few mobs, still have 70% mana, and are ready to continue, but your pet is down to 200 health. At 30hp/tick your pet would take 63 ticks to regen to full without heals. It would take about 9 heals to heal your pet to full (or 900 mana to heal it). Or you could reclaim the pet, get at least 100 mana back for reclaiming it, resummon a new pet for 100 mana (since you got 100 back from reclaim), rebuff burnout (150mana)

Long story short.

63 ticks (over 6 minutes) to regen on it's own

900 mana to heal the pet with pet heal

Or 250 total mana to reclaim, resummon a new pet and cast burnout

[Itchybottom]

I think a focused water pet is the best for soloing. I spend far less mana keeping it healed, than I would healing or chain summoning fire pets. Earth pets are pretty situational, and get hit too much. After the patch that changed pet DPS, I feel that around level 20, fire pet becomes less useful for a soloing mage. The incoming damage at, or around that level becomes too dangerous for the additional DS to really make that much of a difference. ~Level 29

Reclaim Energy is going to be too costly for me at end-game too, since I am going to rely on air pets, with two gnoll-hide lariats. But I'm probably playing "wrong."

[Eyry]

Level 29 is the transition level where you will start re-casting pets. It cost 100 mana to do a heal for 145 (which isnt much of anything at this level, maybe a bubble of health). And casting a new pet is only 200 mana. So its 2 heals = 200 for 2 bubs of health, or just resummon a pet with full health. Total cost of the compromise...1 malachite.

I think its worth it.

However, I enjoy summoning the highest DS pet for my level, giving him 2 swords and burnout II and watch him Quad. Very powerful pets.

[Insedeel]

I think a focused water pet is the best for soloing. I spend far less mana keeping it healed, than I would healing or chain summoning fire pets. Earth pets are pretty situational, and get hit too much. After the patch that changed pet DPS, I feel that around level 20, fire pet becomes less useful for a soloing mage. The incoming damage at, or around that level becomes too dangerous for the additional DS to really make that much of a difference. ~Level 29

Reclaim Energy is going to be too costly for me at end-game too, since I am going to rely on air pets, with two gnoll-hide lariats. But I'm probably playing "wrong."

There is no playing "wrong". Play however makes you have the most fun I say. There will always be theorycrafters out there that'll crunch everything down to exp/hour gain, but for some people it's not about getting the most exp in the fastest way possible. Every situation, camp, etc is going to be different.

I personally still use my fire pet at level 20, and even though it takes dmg quickly, it's actually to me the fastest exp because I have spots that I know I can get single pulls, and never need to worry about an add. With how much damage the DS does in return, I can kill mobs far faster, and with far less mana usage than any other pet do to the DS being pretty much like free manaless damage. If I plan on camping something that I have a good chance of adds though, I tend to use the water pet since it's the most well rounded.

Like my previous post stated, at level 29 it's still going to be the most efficient to do what you're doing now, pick your favorite pet and keep it healed. At high levels though the pets start having too many hps for it to be the most efficient to just try to heal your pet if efficiency is what you're going for.

[Vyal]

15k hp earth pets are fun to heal for 180hp a pop :P

[Drakul]

Thanks for the responses, this has been a big help. I've been able to solo some red mobs where I can't keep up with the heals by summoning 2-3 pets during the battle and waiting until the end to cast and DD spells to get full XP. I like the fire pet the best so far, but I might try the one with dodge soon.

[rioisk]

Thanks for the responses, this has been a big help. I've been able to solo some red mobs where I can't keep up with the heals by summoning 2-3 pets during the battle and waiting until the end to cast and DD spells to get full XP. I like the fire pet the best so far, but I might try the one with dodge soon.

What do you mean waiting until the end to cast and DD spells to get full XP? Just load your lvl 1 nuke. You only need to do 1pt of damage to receive full xp.

And yes, you should be able to solo red mobs in the method you just described but let me you tell you it's nowhere near as efficient to solo reds. Chain blue mobs and reclaim energy on pet when it has low health. Do 1pt of damage with lvl 1 nuke.

[Elissa]

Elissa let me try and give you a rundown on why it's so effective:

At higher levels the pet heal is for 200hp at cost of 100 mana. 2hp/1mana.
Summoning a pet will be about 600-1000 hp depending on level, mana cost being 170-200 (depending on spec). Use focus item to reclaim energy old near dead pet for, lowballing, 100 mana. So now you cast a new pet for, including reclaim mana, 70-100 mana. That is 600-1000hp/100 mana or 6 - 10 hp/1mana, much greater than 2hp/1mana with pet heal.

Using this process you have pet attack and kill, you use lvl 1 DD and reap benefits then med while pet kills. Keep going until pet goes below 15% then reclaim recast and effectively you never have to stop killing, your only limit is the number of mobs you can clear in a single cycle using high powered DDs at your own discretion.

Thanks for clearing this up, that definitely makes a lot more sense.

[Jify]

Imo.. Fire pet till 50. It's just awesome for anything that doesn't hit extremely hard. That DS shreds.

Now, those earth pets... Awesome for killing hard hitting mobs that you're required to chain pet for. Best efficiency pet.

At 50, the earth pet actually has about 3khp. Reclaiming, lets assume a low ball of 75 mana.

For 125 mana you're getting 3000hp.
For 100 mana, you could heal for 200hp.

So ya.. Go go pet chaining! :D

[Kraftwerk]

Earth pet does have:

Level 49 - Greater Conjuration: Earth
Type Pet Level Damage HP Root Damage Regeneration
Unfocused 41 56 3075 0 30 HP/tic
Minion of Earth 41 56 3075 0 30 HP/tic
Servant of Earth 42 58 3425 0 30 HP/tic


But Fire Pet, oh you're so lovely and only 1k less than Earth with:

Level 49 - Greater Conjuration: Fire
Type Pet Level Damage HP Spell Damage Damage Shield Damage Regeneration
Unfocused 41 56 1650 42 43 30 HP/tic
Minion of Fire 41 56 2100 42 43 30 HP/tic
Servant of Fire 42 58 2000 43 44 30 HP/tic

And I love the DS. But yea Earth has its uses.

[Kraftwerk]

Also by the way to any of the younger Mage players inquiring within this thread (And who might not have checked out the EQ resource thread in library) check out this website, it's quite useful:

http://www.xalmat.com/eqsummoners.com-old/eq1index.html

[guineapig]

15k hp earth pets are fun to heal for 180hp a pop :P

I want a 15,000 hitpoint earth pet!

[krforrester]

I know the purpose of the server is to keep it as classic as possible, but I would still really like to see pets persist through zoning and logging. I know it was added at some point in EQ live but I don't recall when.

Hey, I can dream can't I?

[Overcast]

I know the purpose of the server is to keep it as classic as possible, but I would still really like to see pets persist through zoning and logging. I know it was added at some point in EQ live but I don't recall when.

Hey, I can dream can't I?

It was added not long after Beastlords were in the game. I recall there were some issues with the overall design of the pet and it going 'poof' on zoning.

[Elissa]

I think a focused water pet is the best for soloing. I spend far less mana keeping it healed, than I would healing or chain summoning fire pets. Earth pets are pretty situational, and get hit too much. After the patch that changed pet DPS, I feel that around level 20, fire pet becomes less useful for a soloing mage. The incoming damage at, or around that level becomes too dangerous for the additional DS to really make that much of a difference. ~Level 29

Reclaim Energy is going to be too costly for me at end-game too, since I am going to rely on air pets, with two gnoll-hide lariats. But I'm probably playing "wrong."

The water pet is something I've never tried but it looks pretty beefy. The fire DS is really nice, but I wonder if (especially since as of yet I've only been able to procure the water focus) a focused water + my casted DS on it is going to be the best bet until I can score the Torch...

On a completely unrelated note, if I wanted to solo some evil eyes for some cool bracelets to replace my cloth ones, would the Air pet be the way to go? Or am I just dreaming about soloing evil eyes at level 29? I remember them being quite nasty.

[Qaedain]

I farmed evil eyes at level 30 for 2-3 hours using my Fire Pet. It worked fine.

[Kraftwerk]

Elissa what is your character name ingame?

[Elissa]

I farmed evil eyes at level 30 for 2-3 hours using my Fire Pet. It worked fine.

Oh so then it should be no problem once I am at that point. I was really worried I'd become the pet after they dispatched mine...

[guineapig]

I know the purpose of the server is to keep it as classic as possible, but I would still really like to see pets persist through zoning and logging. I know it was added at some point in EQ live but I don't recall when.

Hey, I can dream can't I?

Certainly you can!

Don't hold your breath though. Since it was not a feature through Velious, it will not see the light of day here.

[Sarkhan]

It was added not long after Beastlords were in the game. I recall there were some issues with the overall design of the pet and it going 'poof' on zoning.

I think they added pets zoning after beastlords because originally beastlord's pets were a "skill" and not a spell. They received spells that would lvl up their skill pet or something along those lines... Beastlord's pets were the only pets that did not die during zones, and the masses cried out the unfairness of that and then all pets were able to live through zones. . . There were a few issues with the beastlord "Skill" pets i think and they were changed to be just a normal summoned pet like all other pets. . . I could be wrong on several things here but it was a long time ago and my memory is foggy lol... Doesn't matter, we stopping at velious *cheers*

[Elissa]

So I've been hearing a lot about how people making a new character "shouldn't make a mage" because a) there's too many already and b) "mages get hella nerfed in Kunark."

Can anyone please shed some light on how mages get nerfed? I've really been enjoying playing mine as I get up towards mid-level range and I hear it only gets better... but what happens that makes us suck in Kunark? The major pull for mage for ME is the ability (eventually) to effectively solo (or at worst duo) interesting camps/mobs/items. Even now I find it fun to plunk around Najena and kill stuff by myself almost with impunity (unless you bind in a stupid place and get a death cycle :rolleyes:). I'd be sad to find out I won't be able to do that at all anymore once Kunark hits.

[rioisk]

Mobs get beefed up a bit in kunark and our pets don't scale as much in comparison. I think wizards start to really pull ahead of us with their DD spells as well.

Next we lose our sacred soloing fire pet to a class change as fire pet becomes a wizard class (with shitty HP/AC + runs out of mana instantly basically). Our air pet is a monk though which is pretty sick.

Our focus items don't affect pets in the 50's so unless you have elemental mastery staff you're going bare.

Melee equipment in kunark makes melee classes stronger in comparison. Right now pet DPS is way up there with melee classes.

Most higher-end mobs summon making it very difficult to solo high-end mobs.

[Insedeel]

Our air pet is a monk though which is pretty sick.

This is one of the rumors out there that still seems to come up a lot. Air pets are still classified as warrior, and have never been monks. They're still technically classified as a "warrior" despite their avoidance being closer to that of a monk. Necromancers on the other hand do get a pet in the 50s that is actually classified as a "monk".

[jeffd]

Lots of nice info in this thread, thanks folks.

Another question: when do mage pets start dual-wielding?

[Qaedain]

Level 24 with weapons, level 39 without.

[Bubbles]

Level 24 with weapons, level 39 without.

How about for necros?

[Qaedain]

I think it's 29/39.

[Overcast]

How about for necros?

According to these posts on Alla.... of course, it's just user posts..

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=440

You are correct. The level 29 pet does not dual wield on it's own though, you have to give it 2 1 handed weapons to use dual wield. Every pet after 29 will dual without giving it weapons.

That sounds 'right' - so it was 34 or 39 like Qaedain said - I forget.. Keep giving weapons to 39 and you should be safe.

[Reiker]

Mages still own in Kunark, don't listen to the propaganda.

[VincentVolaju]

Mages still own in Kunark, don't listen to the propaganda.

I was wondering about that, maybe you could explain a little better Reiker? Everyone I have talked to about Mages has always they get nerfed hard or just suck bad compared to other class's when Kunark comes. But I was wondering how? Like what could such a drastic change be in Kunark that would cause a Mage to not be good anymore? Do all there pets take dmg / hp cuts or something? And how come you say they still own when others say they dont?

Also, might be a newb question but doesnt summoning a pet take like 10 seconds or so? So when you guys are sayin reclaim then resummon to chain pets on a mob. After you reclaim, doesnt the mob rush you and beat the shit out of you while your trying to cast a 10sec long spell, and is constantly interrupting it?

[Qaedain]

The point is to /pet get lost less than a second before the new pet finishes summoning. The MOB never has time to close the distance.

[Reiker]

I was wondering about that, maybe you could explain a little better Reiker? Everyone I have talked to about Mages has always they get nerfed hard or just suck bad compared to other class's when Kunark comes. But I was wondering how? Like what could such a drastic change be in Kunark that would cause a Mage to not be good anymore? Do all there pets take dmg / hp cuts or something? And how come you say they still own when others say they dont?

Mages basically have one role (besides stuff like coth): deliver dps through pets and nukes. Their dps is still high end in Kunark, and they're still good at soloing. Very few classes can be considered "powerful" in classic, mages still keep trucking along as powerful in Kunark but share that slice of the pie with more classes. And if you're capable of completing your epic, you're one of the best classes in EQ again. The epic pet is ridiculous.

[VincentVolaju]

Reiker whats your ingame name?

[Bubbles]

Mages basically have one role (besides stuff like coth): deliver dps through pets and nukes. Their dps is still high end in Kunark, and they're still good at soloing. Very few classes can be considered "powerful" in classic, mages still keep trucking along as powerful in Kunark but share that slice of the pie with more classes. And if you're capable of completing your epic, you're one of the best classes in EQ again. The epic pet is ridiculous.

This cannot be bolded enough. A mage with the epic pet is downright silly. A mage with the epic pet grouped with a 39+ cleric is... hell on wheels.

[Insedeel]

This cannot be bolded enough. A mage with the epic pet is downright silly. A mage with the epic pet grouped with a 39+ cleric is... hell on wheels.

Aye, this isn't the most impressive example, but it's one that sticks out in my mind.. Was on my 56 druid at the time and had 2 level 55 mages ask if I wanted to go to seb chef camp, and I remember from in past groups, that was by no means an easy camp to break even with a full group. But both of the mages had their epic pets, and they really only needed a snarer (the small heals were just a bonus). Well needless to say... I gained more exp than I thought humanly possible in the few short hours we were there, and we were killing stuff at probably 2x the rate that any of my full groups (even well balanced groups) had EVER done.

Mage's definitely aren't the powerhouse they were in classic in kunark and velious without the epic pet, but they were still PLENTY powerful, and could still hold their own with the best in kunark and even in a lot of velious until the end-game velious. That's when gear started inflating to a huge degree and pets started lagging behind. It was even worse in luclin, and pets were on the course to the "dark ages" of pets, but in velious they were still good, and worth while. So fortunately with this server Mage's will always be useful, and hold their own, epic pet or not.

[krforrester]

Back in the early days of EQ, mages were really misunderstood. People just didn't recognize the value in having mage dps in a group.

Instead, people were always looking for the holy trinity (tank, chanty, cleric) followed up with backup healers such as a shammy, which also has slow, and/or a druid for ports and snare.

It was absolute hell getting or starting a group as a mage. Now, those all mage groups were absolutely devastating and tons of fun.

[Insedeel]

Back in the early days of EQ, mages were really misunderstood. People just didn't recognize the value in having mage dps in a group.

Instead, people were always looking for the holy trinity (tank, chanty, cleric) followed up with backup healers such as a shammy, which also has slow, and/or a druid for ports and snare.

It was absolute hell getting or starting a group as a mage. Now, those all mage groups were absolutely devastating and tons of fun.

Yep, some of my favorite groups back in the day were mage groups. I would set them up whether I was on my mage, or on my druid (as a druid, I just offered my heals, evac, snare to the group, and just invited 4 mages, and a necro for pulling). We'd just DESTROY everything in our path. Fun times.

[Vyal]

Kraft those numbers are off- way way off just have a cleric cheal any of your earth pets from 1%

[VincentVolaju]

I dunno anything about "Epics", to me "epic" means purple loots lol. The way everyone is talking though it sounds like every class has 1 "epic" spell or item or something? If thats the case, if this item/spell something that the player can get solo, or with a small group of friends? Or do you need to be in a big raid guild and wait in line for your turn to get it?

[azeth]

I dunno anything about "Epics", to me "epic" means purple loots lol. The way everyone is talking though it sounds like every class has 1 "epic" spell or item or something? If thats the case, if this item/spell something that the player can get solo, or with a small group of friends? Or do you need to be in a big raid guild and wait in line for your turn to get it?

each class has an epic "weapon"

the mage epic focuses an outrageously badass pet

[feanan]

they all seem to have parts you can solo or do with a group, but there is always a fight or two that would be considered a "raid"

for example, here's the mage one:
http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=760

involves raiding sky. nobody i know liked raiding sky back in the day, it was a multiday raid

i'm sure anyone not in one of the top guilds won't be seeing epics for quite awhile, so don't waste your time thinking about it :)

[krforrester]

I get dizzy just thinking of trying to get my epic again. Trying to get people to commit to a multiple day raid in Plane of Sky has got to be one of the most difficult things to do in EQ.