Rapid Roll Calling!

[Atennu]

So. Taking this out of rant and flames, because i want serious views on this, and my idea to not be derailed with other events of that thread.

Want a REAL suggestion. Let any guild call a roll call at ANY given point in the cycle to another guilds raid force. This roll call may only happen once every 2 hours, and is to be timestamped each time. If the guild who loses that roll call wishes to continue to try and camp the mob, they have to wait 1 hour to re-roll call the first guild.

24 ACTIVE People to call roll call. 24 ACTIVE to respond. 60 second window. Why 24 people? 4 groups should be enough to kill any target, having less could produce problems for certain fights. Rather then have different rules for different zones, make it all the maximum.

Doing so will enable ANY raid guild to walk in any zone, call for roll, and have the ability to sweep the camp away from them. It will discourage camping for long periods of time, because who wants to have 24 active people on all the time? Right now i bet everytime a mob spawns at 2-7 in the morning; less then 8 people are online at that time. Batphones, Twitters (lulz) whatever is the method to summoning a raid force is what gets everyones attention.

Now. If these rules are broken I think there needs to be a harsh punishment. Not a ban - that's too easy. If IB took a mob when it was not won by them via rollcall - then IB is out of any raid target for an entire week.

Take it as you will, but i think this is a solid system and i would like to thank Kira (Wrei) for bringing it up.

[Humerox]

In all seriousness, one of the better options I've seen.

I'd like to see this continue constructively, so Aeolwind doesn't have to lock the thread and move it to R&F.

[yaaaflow]

Not that I really have much input on this, but we (IB) dropped draco with 9 players a few months ago - now you want it to require 24 in zone just to claim him?

[azeth]

surface level sounds pretty good. i feel like it incorporates FFA elements into a manageable rulebook setting.

So what you're saying is - (?)

zone A has boss X

guild B has a camped toon and sees X spawn, batphones go off.

guild B is mobilizing, but has LESS THAN 24 people in A when guild C arrives with 24.

rolecall is done, B cannot provide 24 attendees, C is now entitled to X

correct?

[Skope]

The number, 24 in this case, would also see a slightly lesser chance of guilds claiming 2 targets at once, particularly if they plan to remain active. Having 48 people on at all times seems very unlikely to me.

I think being out of a raid target for a week isn't a sufficient enough of a deterrent. I'd propose a 2 week ban on all raid targets and a ban for the officer(s) in charge of the raid who's proven to be at fault for a period of a few days.

[guineapig]

Want a REAL suggestion. Let any guild call a roll call at ANY given point in the cycle to another guilds raid force. This roll call may only happen once every 2 hours, and is to be timestamped each time. If the guild who loses that roll call wishes to continue to try and camp the mob, they have to wait 1 hour to re-roll call the first guild.

^^^^^
I agree with this part right here!

If you don't have 15 at their computer 1 minute after role call then you get bumped to the back of the line. Regardless of whether or not the boss is up.

The reason why people claim they aren't burning out is because apparently they just go afk and don't play for days on end. If that's true than they have absolutely no rights to the target.

If you want the target, stay active. Nobody should be getting rewarded for watching TV all day/night long while their character sits motionless for hours or even days on end doing nothing.

[Atennu]

surface level sounds pretty good. i feel like it incorporates FFA elements into a manageable rulebook setting.

So what you're saying is - (?)

zone A has boss X

guild B has a camped toon and sees X spawn, batphones go off.

guild B is mobilizing, but has LESS THAN 24 people in A when guild C arrives with 24.

rolecall is done, B cannot provide 24 attendees, C is now entitled to X

correct?

Sort of. If Guild B has camped a mob uncontested when mob X spawns, then they have the claim on mob until guild C posts 30 min warning. Only if Guild C is in the same zone with Guild B when mob X spawns could they take the camp away from guild B.

----

The number required to sweep a mob away should be altered for what mob it is. Gods/dragons should be 24. Minis should be 15.

[Aadill]

Draconian and hard set with rules that aren't even applicable to the majority of the raid targets.

As stated, 24 is way too many and in my eyes would only promote even more inflated guild populations.

How are you going to prove an officer is in charge of the raid? Why does an officer have to be leading the raid? Why do you have to stop a set of raid leaders/officers as well as limit the rest of the group?

If you're not roll calling every 2 hours then you're missing on more opportunities to "sweep" camps out from others. There is a strategic element to it, of course, but it can easily be predicted and mitigated.

[Skope]

Then it can be done at random. With complete spontaneity it should force guilds to stay at their PC and remain active with a predetermined number, whatever that number is.

In hindsight I do agree about 24 being too high, even though it would deter from multiple target claims. I think certain targets can be easily downed with fewer numbers, such as inny/maestro/draco and even naggy.

To deter guilds from incessantly calling timers we can make it so each raid force may shout 4-5 timers per hour in a particular zone. These can be done at random intervals and can be spaced at however the guilds like.

[Aeolwind]

In all seriousness, one of the better options I've seen.

I'd like to see this continue constructively, so Aeolwind doesn't have to lock the thread and move it to R&F.

That would attain new levels of awesome.

[Aadill]

To deter guilds from incessantly calling timers we can make it so each raid force may shout 4-5 timers per hour in a particular zone. These can be done at random intervals and can be spaced at however the guilds like.

I cannot wait to see the photo albums of timestamped roll call images from that :p Maybe a lower number would seem appropriate.

[Skope]

Well, keep in mind that you'd need only 1 screenshot for proof. It's also far harder to timestamp the screenshot for one guild than it is for the other to /shout present. I don't think a number under 3 should be viable, though.

[Phallax]

I like this, 24 seems just right, always thought 15 was way to low and an odd number. If you think 24 is to high then it should be 18(3 full groups).

I like random roll call, not roll calling untill a boss spawns just gives guilds a chance to bat call the guild, a 60 sec window of random roll calls doesnt really give a huge chance for bat calls to work AS effective, although they can still work.

Good post

[Chicka]

I do hate the number, but I like the spirit of the suggestion: end camping by making it not worth it.

Throwing something in the ring to get booted around: how about winning a claim from a camping guild gives 12 hours grace to the winning guild where presence is not required to hold claim.

Edit: Why? Because then any guild - even those who have no intention of "camping" can disrupt camping behavior. They even have incentive to do so since they have 12 free hours where if the boss pops they get a cookie.

[azeth]

I do hate the number, but I like the spirit of the suggestion: end camping by making it not worth it.

Throwing something in the ring to get booted around: how about winning a claim from a camping guild gives 12 hours grace to the winning guild where presence is not required to hold claim.

Edit: Why? Because then any guild - even those who have no intention of "camping" can disrupt camping behavior. They even have incentive to do so since they have 12 free hours where if the boss pops they get a cookie.


I see what you did there, but personally I think given the amount of people impacted by a Raid Ruleset - the less moving parts the better.

[Chicka]

I see what you did there, but personally I think given the amount of people impacted by a Raid Ruleset - the less moving parts the better.

Yes me too: I'd love FTE, but its not going to happen. I think the point is the parts don't really have to move because nobody would camp under those circumstances. And actually, given the number of moving parts, and screenshots thereof, that are in effect RIGHT NOW, it is no more complicated.

[tuxqueot]

I, for one, think the roll call thing is a joke. Just this very second, while I was windowed out reading this thread, Dino spawned in front of me. I didn't engage right away so another mage took it right out from under me. And Dino has a 6 minute repop.

Now you're telling me if I am waiting for a spawn that has a FOUR DAY window I can't even window out to read a forum thread or go take a piss for fear of missing a 60 second window to respond to someone else's abitrary role call and costing my guild the spot?

OMG people, this is a GAME.

[Cormac]

I, for one, think the roll call thing is a joke. Just this very second, while I was windowed out reading this thread, Dino spawned in front of me. I didn't engage right away so another mage took it right out from under me. And Dino has a 6 minute repop.

Now you're telling me if I am waiting for a spawn that has a FOUR DAY window I can't even window out to read a forum thread or go take a piss for fear of missing a 60 second window to respond to someone else's abitrary role call and costing my guild the spot?

OMG people, this is a GAME.

What he said.

[Chicka]

I, for one, think the roll call thing is a joke. Just this very second, while I was windowed out reading this thread, Dino spawned in front of me. I didn't engage right away so another mage took it right out from under me. And Dino has a 6 minute repop.

Now you're telling me if I am waiting for a spawn that has a FOUR DAY window I can't even window out to read a forum thread or go take a piss for fear of missing a 60 second window to respond to someone else's abitrary role call and costing my guild the spot?

OMG people, this is a GAME.

Then why come here and vomit on a thread that's trying to come up with a way of discouraging camping raid mobs?

BTW, I think yer 6 minute spawn mob is safe from anything we discuss here - unless you want to keep bringing it up so we include it.

[Swiftsong_Lorekeeper]

I, for one, think the roll call thing is a joke. Just this very second, while I was windowed out reading this thread, Dino spawned in front of me. I didn't engage right away so another mage took it right out from under me. And Dino has a 6 minute repop.

Now you're telling me if I am waiting for a spawn that has a FOUR DAY window I can't even window out to read a forum thread or go take a piss for fear of missing a 60 second window to respond to someone else's abitrary role call and costing my guild the spot?

OMG people, this is a GAME.

/agree

Keep in my I'm only level 13 and will probably never be in a raiding guild other than a guild that does pickup raids or maybe schedules 1 a week (if that). This is the same road that EQ live went down and ended in the top guild with the players that had the best gear and all that crap making the decisions for the server. Why should the top guilds be able to set rules for every other guild on the server? Like tux said, it is just a game. Say that I am a member of x guild and we have the 15-24 players (whatever number everybody in this thread thinks is fair that is part of the top raiding guilds) and no one else can make it, or better yet no one else is high enough to raid. So guild x goes to zone y to kill z. My ENTIRE guild that is high enough to kill z is in the zone. A player or group or whatever comes into the zone from a high raiding guild. That guild calls roll call. Say just one of the members of my guild had to go do something (assuming the other 14-23 players have no life and can sit in front of their computer for as long as it takes from the time my guild zones in and claims the camp until that mob actually spawns). So since one less player than is required answers for roll call, my guild loses it's spot? I think this is retarded IMO. Thats like (for instance) apple comes out with the iphone 16 at 3am and while you are in line some other consumers make up a rule that you have to have a friend with you or you lose your spot. Your friend has to go to the bathroom at 2:30 because he/she is about to piss himself/herself and holy shit now its 2:32 and your friend is walking back to find that after they walked away that the person behind you called roll call and made you go to the end of the line and wait an extra 7 hours assuming you both stay there the whole time. Makes no sense does it? MMORPG=Massive Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game

If you want to make a fair rule, (we will use naggy for this example), make it where each guild can only have one kill/attempt and the guilds take turns killing the naggy. If there are no guilds that want to kill naggy other than yours then just go crazy and kill naggy till your heart is content. To keep arguments from stirring then make it where there are no assumptions on if guild 1 has killed naggy or not, make it where someone from guild 2 has to witness the other guild taking aggro naggy after guild 2 arrives in the zone where guild 1 has already claimed naggy. Whether or not guild 1 wipes that means guild 2 gets their go at it. How hard is it? Oh and throw in a timer where if naggy spawns and the guild doesn't aggro within 30 minutes, which is ample time to buff 15-24 players and med back up, then guild 2 wins the spawn.

Note: This is not intended as a rant, its intended as my perspective/suggestion.

[Olorin]

I like this, 24 seems just right, always thought 15 was way to low and an odd number. If you think 24 is to high then it should be 18(3 full groups).

I like random roll call, not roll calling untill a boss spawns just gives guilds a chance to bat call the guild, a 60 sec window of random roll calls doesnt really give a huge chance for bat calls to work AS effective, although they can still work.

Good post

First, 24 is way too high, most mobs (with the exception of maybe vox) can be taken with 2-3 groups. It also caters to the guilds with the most members -- infact, i have seen in the past the same guild camping 2-3 spawns simultaneously. Lets just do away with the whole poopsock and come up with a better solution.

As far as the roll call is concerned, its just ridiculous -- either do away with it completely (2nd guild just calls 30 minutes when they zone in) or make it at least 5 mins.

Lastly the whole time to engage needs to be looked at -- 20 mins to engage inny is fine for the big guilds, but lets make it fair for the smaller guilds as well. Its time to end the monopolies of certain guilds and gods/dragons, etc and let the rest of the server experience content too. All it would take is rules that everyone could live with. Maybe that would also help doing away with the intentional training, crashing of zones, and general asshattery that has been going on for months now.

[Wrei]

How is camping Dino even relevant to boss camp situation. You are camping Dino solo, as per the server rule if you cannot keep the spawns down or leave your camp someone can take it.

The random roll call is to DISCOURAGE camping ok? 60 sec is very generous, 5min? Please... if you can't randomly make roll call after 4 days of pooping why not try "not to camp"? The 24 number is just a number, the important thing here is any raid force of X number can come in and challenge X guild for their claim at any time etc... If you increased variance on top of that to make pooping almost at the constipated levels then you might, just might kill the camping concept altogether... which is what we all want right? Well except DA that is.

[h0tr0d (shaere)]

It's relevant because of the point he made. That 60 seconds might be too short. I go to the fridge, get a drink come back, missed a roll call.

[h0tr0d (shaere)]

Really, it requires impartial 3rd parties...any of those around?

[Wrei]

Then how about not camping? You don't have to answer roll calls, and you can roll call other guilds who still try to camp~ Oh wait... you must be the few who must really like camping.. This thread is about changing the current rules of poopsocking, not about trying to give the poopers every advantage they can get to retain their camp.

[h0tr0d (shaere)]

Keep it out of rants and flames! lol

[Troy]

If you think that the 60 seconds is too short, then either don't camp or bring extra people so that you can coordinate your AFK's such that you always have enough people active to answer the roll call. Everyone need not be present, just a minimum number of people (24 is proposed here, but I would also agree that it's a bit high. Perhaps stick with the current 15).

i.e. Bring 20 people to the zone so you can have up to 5 afk at any time and still hold your camp indefinitely.

This seems reasonable to me. Everyone has a chance to try for whatever camp(s) they want and there is a mechanism in place to keep your camp once it is yours, so the guilds with the most "talent and dedication" (read: unemployed and single with no other hobbies whatsoever :p) can still attempt to permacamp the whole world if they feel so inclined. They just might have to coordinate their AFK'ing a little better, but since they're so talented it shouldn't be an issue for them.

[whitebandit]

Everyone has a chance to try for whatever camp(s) they want and there is a mechanism in place to keep your camp once it is yours,

there ya go! now get to it.

[G13]

None of you realize the inevitable to conclusion to 5 raid mobs, most of which pop once a week, is camping

FFA with this small amount of content would = camping (Any guild worth their salt is going to mobilize well in advance of the spawn and be ready for when it actually spawns)

FTE = Camping (just have a bard sit on the spawn with AOE dmg song. Ready to get first dmg)

So fine, you want to have a random 24 roll call at any time to swoop the camp. You think the guild that's been there is gonna leave? Think again. They'll just wait until 3-4 AM, do a batphone and roll call you right back. It will be endless stream of roll calls, time stamps, and screen shots. Over and over, especially if you allow unlimited roll calls before a raid boss even spawns. It will lead to people being literally at their keyboards 24/7 for conceivably 5 days. Sounds like a good idea, but don't think for a second there aren't people that won't do it. There will be.

This is what's going to happen. Instead of one guild camping the mob, now there will be 2. Both will take turns roll calling the other. Unlimited and random you say? Every 5 minutes they are going to be roll calling each other.

Guild 1 "Roll Call"

Guild 2 fails. Waits a few hours to batphone. Keep in mind this can be happening before the mob's potential spawn window even opens. They roll call them back. If it's in the AM they can just do it again 5 minutes later to harass guild 1, purposely keeping them awake. Sounds like an awesome system and that the GMs won't get involved. Yea right.

I understand some of you think there is a way to stop camping 5 uninstanced mobs that literally spawn once a week but that is NOT going to happen. Welcome to outdated EQ raiding, circa 2010.

None of this content was designed for 2 guilds leapfrogging each other to get to mob and hit it first either. There is pretty much one straight shot to each dragon. The guild that engages the FGs first are at a huge disadvantage since the other guild can just walk right by them. Vox's lair? Same thing. One guild can just wait while the other clears the lair, get into the cubby hole, and engage at their leisure. It would be a mess.

Hate? Straight shot to Inny. Fear is the only zone where FFA might be applicable, but then not really, since one guild can just grief the other by instigating death touches over and over on purpose.

GL with that. This is a horrible idea and it would lead to a new era of hardcore camping. It wouldn't alleviate anything I can assure you.

[Icecometus]

To be honest I think it is gonna come down to each target being poopsocked by a different guild. Is there much of a difference between "camping" a spawn for 4 days and 7 days?

[Troy]

It's not harassing. If you're camping a mob, you need to be at your computer. Period. If you're AFK you have no right to anything.

[Spirell]

So. Taking this out of rant and flames, because i want serious views on this, and my idea to not be derailed with other events of that thread.

Want a REAL suggestion. Let any guild call a roll call at ANY given point in the cycle to another guilds raid force. This roll call may only happen once every 2 hours, and is to be timestamped each time. If the guild who loses that roll call wishes to continue to try and camp the mob, they have to wait 1 hour to re-roll call the first guild.

24 ACTIVE People to call roll call. 24 ACTIVE to respond. 60 second window. Why 24 people? 4 groups should be enough to kill any target, having less could produce problems for certain fights. Rather then have different rules for different zones, make it all the maximum.

Doing so will enable ANY raid guild to walk in any zone, call for roll, and have the ability to sweep the camp away from them. It will discourage camping for long periods of time, because who wants to have 24 active people on all the time? Right now i bet everytime a mob spawns at 2-7 in the morning; less then 8 people are online at that time. Batphones, Twitters (lulz) whatever is the method to summoning a raid force is what gets everyones attention.

Now. If these rules are broken I think there needs to be a harsh punishment. Not a ban - that's too easy. If IB took a mob when it was not won by them via rollcall - then IB is out of any raid target for an entire week.

Take it as you will, but i think this is a solid system and i would like to thank Kira (Wrei) for bringing it up.

How about just a simple if you are the second guild to show up, you issue a 30 min timer when you have 24 (or whatever, not picky on number) in zone and ready to go. This is how it was on multiple live servers I played on pre-instancing.

*edit: this assumes mob is up...

[rioisk]

I agree with this.

Make it less than every 2 hours though - make every 30 minutes anybody from any guild can call for a roll call. If 24 people from the camping guild don't respond within 1 minute then they are bumped to the back of the line. They can proceed to roll call after 30 minutes to the guild that took over the camp.


I'm of the opinion that if you are going to camp a raid mob - you need to be physically present at your computer in force.

[rioisk]

It's relevant because of the point he made. That 60 seconds might be too short. I go to the fridge, get a drink come back, missed a roll call.

That's why guilds should have more than 24 there at any one time and coordinate when people are AFK getting a drink as to always have 24 ready for a roll call.

I think the goal in all of these raid rule revisions is to stop guilds from afking with only a few people there to send out a raid alert text. I'm of the opinion that if you're going to camp a raid mob you need to physically be there at your computer waiting.

[G13]

It's not harassing. If you're camping a mob, you need to be at your computer. Period. If you're AFK you have no right to anything.

Please re read my original post

It's just another tactic a guild will use. Nothing more.

So a guild fails a roll call 3 days into a camp and potentially 2 days before a boss spawns. You think they are going to just leave? Not a chance. They will just roll call right back. So you want to limit it to every 30 minutes? Fine. I'll stick 30 in a zone and have them answer the roll call in shifts. 15 answering a 30 minute roll call every 4-5 hours. Then another 15. Hell, I'll even recruit more and stick 45 into the zone. 3 shifts for a few hours to answer the roll calls. Batphone the shift changes.

Trust me. It'll happen

[rioisk]

Man instancing in all modern mmorpgs makes sense now....

[Troy]

So? That's better than the current system where one has NO CHANCE to take over a camp from AFK'ers. And who says it will be every 30 minutes exactly? If I'm understanding correctly, the "challengers" can make a call at most every 30 minutes.

[G13]

So? That's better than the current system where one has NO CHANCE to take over a camp from AFK'ers. And who says it will be every 30 minutes exactly? If I'm understanding correctly, the "challengers" can make a call at most every 30 minutes.

You have a chance to take the spawn away from someone in the current system without camping anything. It has happened before. It will happen again.

So it isn't every 30 min? So what. What if it's 5 minutes? Fine. I'll just have my shifts of 15 at the ready, chilling in vent with a hotkey they push every 5 minutes when the other guild calls a roll call. But here's the thing, if you're going to make random unlimited roll calls, then the guild doing the roll calling every 5 minutes better damn well be at their keyboards too. In order for the roll call to be legit, the guild getting roll called can counter roll call, to make absolutely sure the guild calling them meets to raid requirements and has their force ready and at their keyboards. So GL with that.

Like I said before, it will lead to entirely new level of camping you people have never even dreamed of, and yes, it will happen.

Man instancing in all modern mmorpgs makes sense now....

Of course it does. Developers saw all these potential situations you people are dealing with now years ago. EQ had it's time, but it's a very flawed game at it's core.

[Troy]

I'm fine with that. If people are willing to completely destroy what's left of their lives to keep an EQ camp forever then more power to them, but I doubt anyone can keep it up forever.

[G13]

I'm fine with that. If people are willing to completely destroy what's left of their lives to keep an EQ camp forever then more power to them, but I doubt anyone can keep it up forever.

People have been doing it for 6 months+ already

This wouldnt honestly add much of a burden to a well organized guild

[Troy]

FWIW the ruleset that I am most in favor of is: no rules. Do whatever the hell you want and quit bitching. That would require the most talent, strategy, teamwork, whatever you want to call it. Camping is for lamers.

[G13]

FWIW the ruleset that I am most in favor of is: no rules. Do whatever the hell you want and quit bitching. That would require the most talent, strategy, teamwork, whatever you want to call it. Camping is for lamers.

Training, Kill stealing, griefing. There would be mass petitions every time a raid boss spawned. Just imagine what Abacab would be doing without any fear of reprisal? I know every little mob glitch myself. I could train a guild trying to killa boss without them even knowing who/what/where it came from, I assure you.

And you wouldn't stop camping either. The fact of the matter is, people that are against camping want to kill mobs, but they dont want to have to wait for them to spawn. Wow is that way ------>

[Troy]

EQ was that way on many servers too. Everyone knew exactly when mobs spawned so no one had to camp for them. That was classic for many people. Have people forgotten this?

[Hasbinbad]

EQ was that way on many servers too. Everyone knew exactly when mobs spawned so no one had to camp for them. That was classic for many people. Have people forgotten this?
No, it was just decided against.

[G13]

EQ was that way on many servers too. Everyone knew exactly when mobs spawned so no one had to camp for them. That was classic for many people. Have people forgotten this?

I don't disagree with you. Variance makes the camp worse than it should be. It has opened up can of worms because people believed that nobody would actually do it. Variance should be removed, but at this point it isn't going to stop camping either. It would also throw the concept of roll calling right out the window since guilds would know when a boss is gonna spawn and plan accordingly.

[Allizia]

==========
99 needs a server split or 2 to breed some healthy competition and community support for the high end guilds instead of half the server fighting each other over scraps. Do it now and let the other 2 servers catch up before Kunark and things would be drastically different. There is no other method that will make a difference, regardless of the ruleset it will be the same drama with different methods.
==========

I still stand by this as the only way to actually make a difference and foster both competition and some basic humanity between players.

It wouldn't use much more bandwidth since the player base won't likely change that much, and it's not like the server files are huge.

P1999 FFA - let the hardcore faceoff with likeminded competition
P1999 Rotation - let the casual mingle and still progress at their own pace
P1999 PVP - Racial team PVP - pew pew

[Spirell]

==========
99 needs a server split or 2 to breed some healthy competition and community support for the high end guilds instead of half the server fighting each other over scraps. Do it now and let the other 2 servers catch up before Kunark and things would be drastically different. There is no other method that will make a difference, regardless of the ruleset it will be the same drama with different methods.
==========

I still stand by this as the only way to actually make a difference and foster both competition and some basic humanity between players.

It wouldn't use much more bandwidth since the player base won't likely change that much, and it's not like the server files are huge.

P1999 FFA - let the hardcore faceoff with likeminded competition
P1999 rotation or camp server - Rotation or camping rules - let the casual mingle and still progress at their own pace
P1999 PVP - Racial team PVP - pew pew

So... how much are you donating a month to make this happen? I mean I can't imagine the server costs per month being cheap, and no way nilbog is going to foot the bill so people can "feel good". Nilbog or Rogean got a cost/month figure for us to mull over?

[Allizia]

So... how much are you donating a month to make this happen? I mean I can't imagine the server costs per month being cheap, and no way nilbog is going to foot the bill so people can "feel good". Nilbog or Rogean got a cost/month figure for us to mull over?

I'll donate a working kedge.path file I created if yall don't have that fixed yet =P just throw it in the map folder server side

seriously, I doubt donations would be an issue. It's a virtual server copy, 3 servers does not mean 3X cost

[Spirell]

I'll donate a working kedge.path file I created if yall don't have that fixed yet =P just throw it in the map folder server side

seriously, I doubt donations would be an issue. It's a virtual server copy, 3 servers does not mean 3X cost

Its not the files, its the hosting that I think costs them money... I could be wrong... but I think the server hositng as well as all the anti DOS stuff is the pricey thing here... P1999 is not run from a computer in someone's basement :P

[Wrei]

You have a chance to take the spawn away from someone in the current system without camping anything. It has happened before. It will happen again.

So it isn't every 30 min? So what. What if it's 5 minutes? Fine. I'll just have my shifts of 15 at the ready, chilling in vent with a hotkey they push every 5 minutes when the other guild calls a roll call. But here's the thing, if you're going to make random unlimited roll calls, then the guild doing the roll calling every 5 minutes better damn well be at their keyboards too. In order for the roll call to be legit, the guild getting roll called can counter roll call, to make absolutely sure the guild calling them meets to raid requirements and has their force ready and at their keyboards. So GL with that.

Like I said before, it will lead to entirely new level of camping you people have never even dreamed of, and yes, it will happen.



Of course it does. Developers saw all these potential situations you people are dealing with now years ago. EQ had it's time, but it's a very flawed game at it's core.

So in your mind, having 15 people afk for 3 days is the same as having 24 people "at their keyboard" and responding to roll calls every 30min in "shifts" on top of variance being increased (which it should). So instead of poopsocking while AFK for 3 days and responding to a roll call on a boss pop (current rules), your saying a guild will be able to keep 24 active people at their keyboard taking 30min shifts, for potentially 14 days on a boss? I know we shouldn't underestimated the length at which human retardation can go but I find that hard to believe. Even "if" they manage to man 24 people 24/7 for 14 days straight for the next 9 months (which i highly doubt), the constant pressure from outside guilds contesting them will eventually wear down that guild. At the very least it will stop them from camping multiple targets at the same time allowing for more targets to be available for the other raiding guilds.

It's 1 thing to ask someone to AFK online for a week, no one can be on their computer 24/7 pooping every 30min on call in "shifts" because that's just about the stupidest way they can spend their time while getting minimum reward. Guild size would need to increase to about 120 members to implement your "shifts" good luck convincing them of doing that shit and tell them it'll be 8 months if ever before they see their own god loot.