Do not allow gnoll fangs to drop if killed by a level 18 and above

[Pinolian]

Can we just have this silliness stopped? Why cant a level 7 go into Black burrow and have a good time, expecting to have a few mobs to kill? Instead we have to contend with level 18 plus peeps wiping the zone in search of the gnoll fang. Or higher level folks grouping with their buddies and wiping the zone, letting the lower level person loot.

This isn't Live where people don't care about the community any longer. Making people log because there is nothing to kill can't be described as community friendly behavior.

Just nerf the damn things so that they don't drop if a level 19 or higher was on the hate list at the time of death.. or to be a bit more friendly, dont let it drop if the level 19 made the kill.

if (mob is blue) && (Character.Level > 18) then
Fang.DropChance = 15
Else
Fang.DropChance = 0
End if

Every day I am in BB its the same crap, and its tiresome

If its been said before, sorry. I am just aggravated by it.

Yeah I know I can fight somewhere else. Yeah I know I can log on a different guy. but the point is, why should I have to? If there are 7 people in the entire zone, there should be mobs to kill, I would hope.

[Heebee]

Not classic - thank you, come again.

[Swish]

They nerfed the bard mail quest (used to be able to get a full level at L1, and with more cash).

They nerfed the scorpion pincer quest a couple of days after Kunark launched. I'm not convinced it was ever that broken during Kunark but I can't find prof :(

Why not nerf the BB fang quest? Give the zone back to the lowbies.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

They nerfed the bard mail quest (used to be able to get a full level at L1, and with more cash).

They nerfed the scorpion pincer quest a couple of days after Kunark launched. I'm not convinced it was ever that broken during Kunark but I can't find prof :(

Why not nerf the BB fang quest? Give the zone back to the lowbies.

Dat sig is killing me lol

[Daldaen]

Just increase spawn rate to 30 seconds on all gnolls. Then everyone can play in the zone.

[Rec]

Taking away the exp is one thing but people should always be able to get the faction hits from the turn ins

[Kellek]

-shrug-

I'd be ok if they nerfed all those high XP hand-ins. Belts, shoulderpads, gnollfangs, lightstones, etc. Maybe only allow a character to do a quest/hand-in once. Get rid of all the MQ sellers.

Sure it's neat to get a full level by handing in 4-5 items to an NPC, but I'd be happier if it was set up to give you a piece of useful gear, or some good money.

But that's not classic. :D

[Pinolian]

Want faction hits? Heal a lowbie. Kill a gnoll that is past 50% if the player killing it does not have a DS. kill the level 13+ mobs in there that will give you exp.
I am saying take away the farming of gnoll teeth.. If mobs do not yield exp, do not let them drop.

Its crap to deal with level 22 douches farmin gnoll teeth.. yes level 22

[Daldaen]

FACTION
Quote
Reply
#Apr 21 2004 at 6:19 AMRating: Decent
Mubaris
14 posts
This is an amazing XP quest for level 5 up to level 12 or so.

Edited, Wed Apr 21 11:09:11 2004

its good till lvl 12
i started getting a little under a blue at 12
but if u have someone go into BB and slay those
dirty gnolls and you loot fangs, you can get from
level 1 to 12 in no time(just take an empty bag
need like 7-12 stacks,but they drop like flys(1 ever kill or 2))

at level 8, for every 4 fangs i turned in, i gained a full yellow xp bubble! i am going to gather as many as possible to see what the xp is like at level 9.


i hardly get any exp from this quest at level 9. to be honest i didnt get any noticable exp at level 6


Tegyene
Mystics

No exp?
Quote
Reply
#Jan 17 2002 at 10:27 PMRating: Decent
Zeepman
46 posts
Great for raising faction and selling stouts, but noticed almost no exp from this quest at level 6. :)


Zeeparga
Nameless

Sounds like level 12-20 getting good exp is a bug.

[myriverse]

Trivial loot code sucks.

[Swish]

-shrug-

I'd be ok if they nerfed all those high XP hand-ins. Belts, shoulderpads, gnollfangs, lightstones, etc. Maybe only allow a character to do a quest/hand-in once. Get rid of all the MQ sellers.

Orc scalps are up to 20pp each in EC lately, its crazy :/

[casdegere]

Sounds like level 12-20 getting good exp is a bug.

After 12, it is slowing down. It's mainly laziness. People don't want to level, group, xp, grind anymore. Fangs, Scalps and Belts oh my!

For the lowbies complaining though, lots of places else to go. Obviously, you're in BB for the same reason, the fangs. I know I am and faction, as a Dark Elf.

"Certain" people are kind of funny. They believe that what they 'see' is theirs. *cough* Heebie *cough* Or that a certain area is theirs. This is the case in High Hold Keep as well when actually, its FTT (first to tag) as long as you're not training or making it unpleasant for others. The only camps are named mobs that drop quest or special loot items. It all seems pretty plain and easy to me, BB and HHK are not these kinds of places yet people are VERY belligerent when you want to partake as well. The HHK basement is large, used to be 4-5 different groups down there at once. (I know, it's amazing, that many people being cooperative and kind to one another.)

People use tactics like AOE, root and proximity agro also. There was even a Bard that went through, Jboy I think his name was. That...was very annoying. Especially since if people are fighting and get down in health, mobs will peel off and kill them. And he AOE kited them so it took them a while to die.

Bottomline, if you're getting frustrated, move on, lots of zones to XP and have fun in. If you're not having fun, it's up to you to make it fun for yourself. Other people can be rude and obnoxious but you're the one staying there and taking it. If they are KSing or training you, 'Petition'. That does work if talking to them doesn't.

[Pinolian]

< trivial loot code sucks >

So does A level 22 douche wiping the zone taking exp away from those of us who could actually get it from the mobs they are killing. Wiping the zone so that there is noting to kill my level.

Things is, its not an anomaly.. ITS DAILY. Daily you will find someone 17 + not engaging mobs that will give exp, but instead laying waste to any gnoll that moves looking for fangs, and actually avoiding commanders etc.

Why not just FIX IT? I know I can go somewhere else. But I should not have to. That is the point. Telling someone to go somewhere else just encourages the douchebags to keep doing it. I mean I could get my druid buddy to AOE the whole place all day long until I get fangs enough to leave.. but is that what is right?

This is why you have rules friend. This is why there are laws against things. Anyone can justify their behavior if there are no laws set. And if there are no laws set, people will do anything.

So fix it with 6 lines of code. jeez

[lecompte]

Pinolian: Do what higher level people do, find a camp and stick to it. Anyone kills mobs in your camp, talk to them/report them.

[fadetree]

Do you guys not understand the 'classic' restriction? I'm not trying to be a jerk, but there are so many posts saying 'change this - change that' I get the feeling that people don't really understand the deal with this server...they are not going to make arbitrary changes that were not part of the legit timeline.

I might be wrong, of course, but that's my understanding of what this server is supposed to be for - duplication of classic eq even down to the stupid and annoying things.

[Fawqueue]

< trivial loot code sucks >

So does A level 22 douche wiping the zone taking exp away from those of us who could actually get it from the mobs they are killing. Wiping the zone so that there is noting to kill my level.


But just think...in like 15 levels YOU can be the douche!

[Daldaen]

Dunno the posts I linked indicated that post 12 you need 100 fangs to get each level. Yet on this server you can get a level off 20-30 fangs.

[fadetree]

OK, now *that* might be actionable. But they aren't going to make them not drop or implement trivial loot.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Gnoll fangs are literally the only redeeming feature of that shit zone. Without the fangs the experience is terribad and you make zero (0) cash there except for the odd time a cracked staff drops.

If you don't get fangs, you don't get xp. If you don't get xp, dungeon isn't worth it. Find a new dungeon or go hunt outside. Bandits in wk need a good raping too y'know.

[Pinolian]

hahahah love blue threads

Go back to your penis size comparison server, thanks.

[fadetree]

Gnoll fangs are literally the only redeeming feature of that shit zone. Without the fangs the experience is terribad and you make zero (0) cash there except for the odd time a cracked staff drops.

If you don't get fangs, you don't get xp. If you don't get xp, dungeon isn't worth it. Find a new dungeon or go hunt outside. Bandits in wk need a good raping too y'know.


Plus they have sashes, which is an excellent exp/cash quest in itself.

[Pinolian]

Yes bandit sashes are great for all but evil races

Or the light stone/GLS quests in NK/Sro

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Yes bandit sashes are great for all but evil races

Or the light stone/GLS quests in NK/Sro

That's another good point. EQ let's you do whatever (within reason) you want. You can log on and do literally nothing for an entire session or you can max out and try to squeeze in as much xp as possible. The world is your oyster. With that said though, how many evil characters are xp'ing in BB?? I remember BB being nearly exclusive to HUM, ERU, BAR and HEF, now it appears to be overrun with evils.

You start where your race/class starts - if everyone in the world is running to 1 dungeon to get xp, why would anyone assume there would even be scraps left? Want a high level version of this? Go to KC during prime time.

TL;DR: people travelling across the world to get xp in the same place. You're not getting scraps.

[baalzy]

Yes bandit sashes are great for all but evil races

Or the light stone/GLS quests in NK/Sro

I turned in 9-10 lightstones and 1 GLS on my 22 druid and got 16% in SRo. It's not bad, especially since the GLS = like 9p too

[Champion_Standing]

Trivial loot code is awesome and should be implemented immediately.

fixed and agree

[oblexsis]

You do realize that even with the trivial loot code it wont stop people from wiping out the zone for faction . Probably make it even worse .

[Frug]

Do you guys not understand the 'classic' restriction? I'm not trying to be a jerk, but there are so many posts saying 'change this - change that' I get the feeling that people don't really understand the deal with this server...they are not going to make arbitrary changes that were not part of the legit timeline.

I might be wrong, of course, but that's my understanding of what this server is supposed to be for - duplication of classic eq even down to the stupid and annoying things.

...right down to the stupid and annoying players. (But yes, I agree - just being snarky.)

[Frug]

huge

The fact you feel the need to mention it speaks volumes otherwise.

[Kekephee]

-shrug-

I'd be ok if they nerfed all those high XP hand-ins. Belts, shoulderpads, gnollfangs, lightstones, etc. Maybe only allow a character to do a quest/hand-in once. Get rid of all the MQ sellers.

Sure it's neat to get a full level by handing in 4-5 items to an NPC, but I'd be happier if it was set up to give you a piece of useful gear, or some good money.

But that's not classic. :D

I personally believe that the whole point of the gnoll fang quest, CB belts, etc. is to teach new players how to grind. It's a behavioral reinforcement to solidify habits that will get you to 60. Imagine it's the year 1999, Everquest has just come out for the first time, and there's a shitload of 15 year olds who got what they thought was going to be like a Baldur's Gate or Diablo kind of game, log in, make a character, and start running around all over the place looking for mobs. Great, but when they get to around level 10 and the game begins transitioning into a dungeon camping game, someone needs to help them understand that there are no longer places like EFP or Misty Thicket where you can run all over the zone until you find a bat or a skeleton. They need to understand that what you're supposed to be doing in this game is to sit down in a single room in a dungeon and kill everything that spawns in or around it for 10 hours. Creating a significant, repeatable quest turnin item that drops at a static camp encourages people to sit down at it and repeatedly kill spawns.

It seems archaic now, because 15 years later who doesn't understand how to grind exp? But if you think about it, WoW players really still don't. At least, the ones who didn't go from EQ to WoW when it came out. That sad, sad generation of teenagers whose sole mmo experience has been "click the LFR button, get auto-queued and zoned into a raid, rush through the halls of the zone for 20 minutes without speaking a word to anyone, click "get item," equip your new loot"

[Leeyuuduu]

Why not just FIX IT?

So fix it with 6 lines of code. jeez

Fix what? Nothing is broken!! Yes let's just change everything that a low level player finds inconvenient or frustrating, that sounds like it'll be great for the server. :rolleyes: P1999 would turn into Live in six months or less.

How about setting up a camp, and then reporting people who steal your shit? (A valid strategy according to PNP)

[Champion_Standing]

Sounds like level 12-20 getting good exp is a bug.

Post a bug thread then.

[BigHurb]

what you want the way to level up without risk taken out? what about all the people who exploited this quest to get higher level ... server so dirty

[BigHurb]

Fix what? Nothing is broken!! Yes let's just change everything that a low level player finds inconvenient or frustrating, that sounds like it'll be great for the server. :rolleyes: P1999 would turn into Live in six months or less.

How about setting up a camp, and then reporting people who steal your shit? (A valid strategy according to PNP)

the funny part: he is correct and this is game breaking and has been in for ... ever

[Leeyuuduu]

Level 15s camping gnoll fangs
GAME BREAKING EXPLOIT CONFIRMED!!!11!!one!!

Seriously though, no, it's not game-breaking. 1200+ people at prime-time does not suggest a broken game. You guys throw this word around so carelessly that it will end up harming the server one day. The fact that we, 15 years later, can still complain about BB being too camped suggests that whatever problems exist are minor compared to the whole, and that the game is not "broken".

My honest suggestion is to take it all in stride, find a nice group of people, gain 4-5 levels, and never look back.

[JPMorgan]

Not classic - thank you, come again.

[JPMorgan]

-shrug-

I'd be ok if they nerfed all those high XP hand-ins. Belts, shoulderpads, gnollfangs, lightstones, etc. Maybe only allow a character to do a quest/hand-in once. Get rid of all the MQ sellers.

Sure it's neat to get a full level by handing in 4-5 items to an NPC, but I'd be happier if it was set up to give you a piece of useful gear, or some good money.

But that's not classic. :D

This would be a mistake. As a new player, these items can't be beat for getting funded for gear and spells. I hate seeing people in EC spamming macros asking for donations when all they have to do is save the above items and $$$. Ya, I got lucky and had a few items gifted to me. But, I've spent a lot of time farming turn ins and I've had a blast being able to moderately twink myself.

[BigHurb]

YOU MO THER FUCKERS ARE GOING TO JAIL FOR WAT U DID~!!

[daasgoot]

you can have BB solo on P99RED.. go there

[Pinolian]

Go post about the red server, dude. Why dont you keep your nose out?

Level 22 douches farming all gnolls in a lowbie dungeon is ridiculous; keeping a lowbie from xping and playing the game is ridiculous.

whoever does this ... Your logic is flawed and reasons for doing so are indefensible

The only logic I have seen here "I can because no one tells me I can't" or "I can, because I always could"

I say make it so you can't, so these dbags will move on.. instead of pushing lowbies out of the dungeon they are meant to be in.

[daasgoot]

Go post about the red server, dude. Why dont you keep your nose out?

Level 22 douches farming all gnolls in a lowbie dungeon is ridiculous; keeping a lowbie from xping and playing the game is ridiculous.

whoever does this ... Your logic is flawed and reasons for doing so are indefensible

The only logic I have seen here "I can because no one tells me I can't" or "I can, because I always could"

I say make it so you can't, so these dbags will move on.. instead of pushing lowbies out of the dungeon they are meant to be in.

WoW is an easy game, and blizzard protects the little kids feelings so their parents keep paying the monthly.. maybe you can give that a shot?

[loramin]

Not classic - thank you, come again.

What part of level 22s dominating Blackburrow is classic? I certainly don't remember that on live.

I'm with the bug crowd: if fangs had been that good for level 22s, we would have had level 22s dominating Blackburrow on live too. We didn't though, which makes me think that the fang experience for higher-level characters is too good here.

[Tongpow]

tl;dr, welcome to the server.

[daasgoot]

What part of level 22s dominating Blackburrow is classic? I certainly don't remember that on live.

I'm with the bug crowd: if fangs had been that good for level 22s, we would have had level 22s dominating Blackburrow on live too. We didn't though, which makes me think that the fang experience is too good here.

I have done Black Burrow gnoll fangs many times (collect fangs from lvl 4-12, then turn all of them in at once).. The exp from turn in falls off pretty hard in the late teens.

at level 22, your time would be much better spent grinding DB's solo or in a group.

But that's not my decision to make, its his/hers.

[Yonkec]

WoW is an easy game, and blizzard protects the little kids feelings so their parents keep paying the monthly.. maybe you can give that a shot?

/thread

[mtb tripper]

If you have a problem with too many folks in blackburrow or not being able to loot fangs, join on the red server and send me a pm, I will try to help you out however I can.

[fadetree]

If the xp level per fang is too high, file a bug report with supporting documentation. If you think people are being douches and breaking a PnP policy item, then report them. Otherwise you are out of luck, so go somewhere else. They are not going to make a non-classical change because someone is irritating someone else.

[Nikon]

If you think that the gnoll fang turn-in is not representative of the classic experience, find evidence of your suspicion and make a petition/bug post on the forums about it presenting your case. That's how things get changed around here. I can confidently say that the devs will not 'allow gnoll fangs to drop if killed by a level 18 and above' as it would set a precedent that would be cited for other similar issues. You are not the first one to bring this up.

While it seems like the end of the world right now and can be frustrating, you won't be there forever.

[Pinolian]

I played EQ 2 weeks into live. had over 300 days played, over 100 on 2 other twinks. Dont give me any WoW shit. I don't need EASY. I am here playing because I don't want EASY. Easy is boring. I had a corpse poof once, ran from BB to Freeport with no Sow, dieing once to a gnoll reaver in EK and again to a gnoll in HP. I looted my Jboots from Drelzna. I knew necros who quit their characters becauser of the dot bug. Take WoW and shove it up your ...

I just want an opportunity to enjoy the dungeon at level 7, dude. every time I have been here (I have been on this server for little over a month) its always the same shit. BB is where I took my sorry half elf ranger through the grind. I would like to do it again and enjoy it without level 19+ jerks raping the zone for the EASY Button.

I would like to make it clear, I could give a flying F.. about gnoll fangs. Its the fact there is not shit to kill because of the level 19+'s clearing the zone who do care about gnoll fangs that I am here voicing an opinion. I never knew of the quest on live when I was in BB. I was too busy killin shit to worry about the quest in everquest.

[daasgoot]

Too many people want dragon kill rights?

Nerf drops so nobody wants dragon kill rights..

eazy squeezy.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

I played EQ 2 weeks into live. had over 300 days played, over 100 on 2 other twinks. Dont give me any WoW shit. I don't need EASY. I am here playing because I don't want EASY. Easy is boring. I had a corpse poof once, ran from BB to Freeport with no Sow, dieing once to a gnoll reaver in EK and again to a gnoll in HP. I looted my Jboots from Drelzna. I knew necros who quit their characters becauser of the dot bug. Take WoW and shove it up your ...

I just want an opportunity to enjoy the dungeon at level 7, dude. every time I have been here (I have been on this server for little over a month) its always the same shit. BB is where I took my sorry half elf ranger through the grind. I would like to do it again and enjoy it without level 19+ jerks raping the zone for the EASY Button.

You're getting pretty bent out of shape here pal. I think you're forgetting how many people used this dungeon back in the day.

35-40 level 6-14's = 15-20 level 6-19.

It was a scrape back then and it's a scrape now.

[Yonkec]

Pino you seem to not be grasping the reality of the situation. What you are bitching against IS classic EQ. Either you don't want classic EQ, or you forgot what classic EQ is, regardless of your claims to fame there.

I fight every day for a camp spot in zones with 30+ people in them. Don't bitch to us about a little competition, either embrace it or go find some instances elsewhere.

If you find Blackburrow so offensive you better /q and run away right now before you hit MM or KC.

[Nikon]

I just want an opportunity to enjoy the dungeon at level 7, dude. every time I have been here (I have been on this server for little over a month) its always the same shit. BB is where I took my sorry half elf ranger through the grind. I would like to do it again and enjoy it without level 19+ jerks raping the zone for the EASY Button.

Honestly, this is not live. Things are different here. Very similar game but different community. You're going to be very disappointed if you try to hold on too tight your original EQ experience and expect to replicate it exactly here. People here know a lot more than people did back in the day. They know how to streamline leveling and certain camps. Lots of people are on their 5th, 6th, or 7th character here and don't want to do the slo-mo grind from 1-20 again. It's just fact.

While that sounds like it sucks, it doesn't always. An example would be HHK goblins. Back on live the goblins could be broken up into multiple camps on some servers, but here goblins generally are done as one camp. In that case it's a benefit because otherwise you would have a crazy amount of downtime in that camp. I hope that there are other parts of the game that help to rekindle that old feeling for you other than just BB. Dungeons are generally very busy here, although I see zones like najena and soldunga mostly empty sometimes.

[Pinolian]

Dude I pulled Lower Guk. I pulled Sol B. I pulled KC. I pulled Sebilis. I pulled it all in 1999

I know all about competition for spawns. I know all about building enough aggro in your pull so some smart ass cant steal it as your running it back to your group. Which can be a bitch because you have that fine line between building aggro and doing too much damage and getting summoned. I know the game and how its played.

Its the fact that people are killing greens, making the dungeon a ghost town when, if fangs were implemented properly, it would not be an issue.

[fadetree]

Just for the record, I think Pinolian is 'right' in the sense that the gnoll fang quest isn't balanced properly. But thats of no account here, all that matters is : 'Is it classic?'

[daasgoot]

Dude I pulled Lower Guk. I pulled Sol B. I pulled KC. I pulled Sebilis. I pulled it all in 1999

I know all about competition for spawns. I know all about building enough aggro in your pull so some smart ass cant steal it as your running it back to your group. Which can be a bitch because you have that fine line between building aggro and doing too much damage and getting summoned. I know the game and how its played.

Its the fact that people are killing greens, making the dungeon a ghost town when, if fangs were implemented properly, it would not be an issue.

That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.

[Pinolian]

Thanks for the responses. Its obvious that this behavior is just generally accepted here. And if you cant hack it, you just move on. Which is what you will do in a week or so.. so its all just forgotten right?

I am just standing up for what I think is right, because the way it is now, it just looks and feels all wrong.

It makes no sense that a dungeon is relatively unplayable because characters too high for it are farming items for an XP quest turn in. Adding all of that up = broke.

Like I said thanks for the responses

[GlassMachine]

Honestly, this is not live. Things are different here. Very similar game but different community. You're going to be very disappointed if you try to hold on too tight your original EQ experience and expect to replicate it exactly here. People here know a lot more than people did back in the day. They know how to streamline leveling and certain camps. Lots of people are on their 5th, 6th, or 7th character here and don't want to do the slo-mo grind from 1-20 again. It's just fact.


Add to that the fact that there's only 1 server and almost no expansions so the number of zones to choose from is so much smaller than live.

It's just very crowded. Any zone with a good ZEM will probably be a frustrating place to play.

I just move to another zone. The exp you get from having a lot more mobs to choose from makes up for any loss in exp modifiers, considering there's more downtime when you're sharing the zone with lots of other people.

I have a handful of people I played when when I was level 5 on my friendslist, and although we all play a similar amount... I am a lot higher than them, even though I have race and class penalties, and I don't play in heavily populated zones. I suspect many of them sit around LFG a lot. Not certain, though.

[lecompte]

I see two very good (I apologize for my immodesty) suggestions listed below:

If you have a problem with too many folks in blackburrow or not being able to loot fangs, join on the red server and send me a pm, I will try to help you out however I can.

Pinolian: Do what higher level people do, find a camp and stick to it -- pull mobs from outside your camp as available. Anyone kills mobs in your camp (no one should) talk to them about it, and if that doesn't work, report them.

[Yonkec]

If this entire thread is based around the assumption that a certain quest is "classic" in reward, find evidence and submit it to the devs.

Otherwise learn, adapt, and grats on your claims of "being old school". Those boasts will get you very far here.

[Clark]

Not classic - thank you, come again.

[Pinolian]

Yonkec , I am not boasting. Rather I was refuting the accusation that I am essentially crying because I cant get a gnoll fang and that perhaps I would enjoy wow instead.

-Thanks

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Anyone remember camping the "ledge" with a 3-4 man group in 1999?

5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.
5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.
5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.

Shits vlassic

[Champion_Standing]

Gonna take my monk into CB and slaughter everything then tease all the newbies for not being able to handle a little "competition".

You people truly are children of god.

[qombi]

I personally believe that the whole point of the gnoll fang quest, CB belts, etc. is to teach new players how to grind. It's a behavioral reinforcement to solidify habits that will get you to 60. Imagine it's the year 1999, Everquest has just come out for the first time, and there's a shitload of 15 year olds who got what they thought was going to be like a Baldur's Gate or Diablo kind of game, log in, make a character, and start running around all over the place looking for mobs. Great, but when they get to around level 10 and the game begins transitioning into a dungeon camping game, someone needs to help them understand that there are no longer places like EFP or Misty Thicket where you can run all over the zone until you find a bat or a skeleton. They need to understand that what you're supposed to be doing in this game is to sit down in a single room in a dungeon and kill everything that spawns in or around it for 10 hours. Creating a significant, repeatable quest turnin item that drops at a static camp encourages people to sit down at it and repeatedly kill spawns.

It seems archaic now, because 15 years later who doesn't understand how to grind exp? But if you think about it, WoW players really still don't. At least, the ones who didn't go from EQ to WoW when it came out. That sad, sad generation of teenagers whose sole mmo experience has been "click the LFR button, get auto-queued and zoned into a raid, rush through the halls of the zone for 20 minutes without speaking a word to anyone, click "get item," equip your new loot"

Instance the dungeons like these. There I said it! Maybe something they could do after this server goes custom.

[Samoht Farstrider]

Anyone remember camping the "ledge" with a 3-4 man group in 1999?

5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.
5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.
5-6 spawns, 3-4 people.

Shits vlassic

We all thought we were uber being able to handle that ledge back in the days!

[gwideon]

Trivial loot code sucks.

/\/\/\/\

[rollin5k]

I remember the ledge, that's where the big dogs hang out slangin spiked collars. Trivial loot code would be so lame

[Jimjam]

I'm not condoning the behaviour but you're going to have to learn to deal with it. Today's level 22 hoarding gnoll fangs in bb is tomorrows level 59 farming haste belts in guk.

You might think the content is behind them, but many people will do whatever it takes to 'get ahead' even if it means putting the screw on the 'competition'.

If you are really unhappy with the gnoll fang situation, and want to improve the server for all, perhaps it is worth doing some research to argue the case that the xp reward is excessive and file a thread in the bug section of the forums?

[loramin]

If you are really unhappy with the gnoll fang situation, and want to improve the server for all, perhaps it is worth doing some research to argue the case that the xp reward is excessive and file a thread in the bug section of the forums?

[Bardalicious]

I can't imagine trying to group with OP post 20's if he's crying this loud over a few pixels in blackburrow. :o

Hope you're playing a solo class bro.

[Briscoe]

I'm amazed that someone is really clearing out Blackburrow for fangs at level 22. That is dreadfully slow experience. During off hours when the zone was empty, I would PBAE the entire zone in a single pull and then switch over to my alt to loot piles of fangs, and even doing it that way the experience slowed down by about level 15 and 16 to the point where I stopped doing it. I can't imagine how much of a waste of time it would be at 20+.

[Millburn]

This forum gets more and more toxic everyday.

[BigHurb]

I'm amazed that someone is really clearing out Blackburrow for fangs at level 22. That is dreadfully slow experience. During off hours when the zone was empty, I would PBAE the entire zone in a single pull and then switch over to my alt to loot piles of fangs, and even doing it that way the experience slowed down by about level 15 and 16 to the point where I stopped doing it. I can't imagine how much of a waste of time it would be at 20+.

naw, take a druid in and AOE whole zone, log in new char, loot , almost instant 20 .. then keep on keeping on til goblin ears and HHK

[Spoonerism]

Isn't it considered "zone disruption" if higher levels are pulling an entire zone and killing everything?

Just wonderin...

[rollin5k]

yea i believe it is

[lecompte]

Just so everyone knows, the OP gave up this thread a while ago.

[BarackObooma]

There is a thread like this every week or so. I replied in one about a month ago. Here's the link.
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140704&highlight=blackburrow

I did the math so if you want to use it as proof that the experience per fang turn in is not classic feel free to use this as a start. You need to figure out how to prove it was less than that in classic.

"I have calculated that each fang turn in is around 19,000-20,000 experience.

See the leveling chart at:
http://wiki.project1999.com/Experience#Experience_Requirement_by_Level

For a 22 Ranger it took exactly 100 fangs to go from 22 to 23 (1,387,000 x 1.4 = 1,941,800 experience needed to level – divided by 100 equates to the 19-20k per fang estimate).

When not many people are in the zone, it takes maybe 2-3 hours to do that. The higher your level the faster you kill so you really don’t slow down leveling unless there is a lot of competition.

For that same level 22 Ranger soloing level 20 mobs in an outdoor zone (75 ZEM), you’d get 30,000 experience per mob solo. You would need to solo (1,941,800 / 30k) approximately 65 mobs to level. This means you would need to kill each one every 2 minutes with no downtime to med/heal to get equitable experience. This is not likely.

So if I can level faster, with no down time and pretty much no chance of dying, why wouldn't I take that option?"

[BarackObooma]

Level & XP Needed To Level (without class/race mods)
1 1000
2 7,000
3 19,000
4 37,000
5 61,000
6 91,000
7 127,000
8 169,000
9 217,000
10 271,000
11 331,000
12 397,000
13 469,000
14 547,000
15 631,000
16 721,000
17 817,000
18 919,000
19 1,027,000
20 1,141,000
21 1,261,000
22 1,387,000
23 1,519,000
24 1,657,000
25 1,801,000
26 1,951,000
27 2,107,000
28 2,269,000
29 2,437,000
30 5,311,000
31 3,070,100
32 3,274,700
33 3,485,900
34 3,703,700
35 8,215,600
36 4,537,200
37 4,796,400
38 5,062,800
39 5,336,400
40 12,017,200
41 6,397,300
42 6,717,100
43 7,044,700
44 7,380,100
45 16,835,800
46 8,695,400
47 9,081,800
48 9,476,600
49 9,879,800
50 10,291,400
51 23,976,500
52 25,996,300
53 28,118,100
54 46,090,700
55 33,568,400
56 36,043,600
57 38,631,000
58 41,333,000
59 64,689,900
60 48,152,500

There's a post from 2001 where a Dwarf Paladin said he went from level 6 to 7 on one stack of fangs.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=2878

"this is an excellant quest for newbies in quenos...when you get to 5th lvl go to blackburrow and save the fangs (they stack)..and when your not busy or you go to quenoys to sell loot complete it.good exp i went from lvl 6 to lvl 7 with 1 stack (includes doing the moonstone part)

Daldane
9 pally Dwarf"


Level 6 would take 91,000 experience x 40% penalty = 127,400 experience needed. Divided by 20 fangs, that would mean each fang = 6370 experience which is less than 1/3 of what it currently is (19-20k each).

If you want to bug report this and use it as starter evidence (I'd recommend finding more examples), go for it. If they dropped the reward experience by 2/3, that place would be a ghost town.

[BarackObooma]

One problem with finding more evidence is Zam does not even have the gnoll fang quest for qeynos listed. It only has the Halas one.

[BigHurb]

the quest petered out by like, level 11 or so with diminishing returns.. it gets stuck at a certain point or decays every level block or never

[daasgoot]

There is a thread like this every week or so. I replied in one about a month ago. Here's the link.
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140704&highlight=blackburrow

I did the math so if you want to use it as proof that the experience per fang turn in is not classic feel free to use this as a start. You need to figure out how to prove it was less than that in classic.

"I have calculated that each fang turn in is around 19,000-20,000 experience.

See the leveling chart at:
http://wiki.project1999.com/Experience#Experience_Requirement_by_Level

For a 22 Ranger it took exactly 100 fangs to go from 22 to 23 (1,387,000 x 1.4 = 1,941,800 experience needed to level – divided by 100 equates to the 19-20k per fang estimate).

When not many people are in the zone, it takes maybe 2-3 hours to do that. The higher your level the faster you kill so you really don’t slow down leveling unless there is a lot of competition.

For that same level 22 Ranger soloing level 20 mobs in an outdoor zone (75 ZEM), you’d get 30,000 experience per mob solo. You would need to solo (1,941,800 / 30k) approximately 65 mobs to level. This means you would need to kill each one every 2 minutes with no downtime to med/heal to get equitable experience. This is not likely.

So if I can level faster, with no down time and pretty much no chance of dying, why wouldn't I take that option?"

2-3 hours to get 100 fangs? highly doubtful.. MAYBE if your the only one in the zone..

[jaybone]

sounds like a bunch of baby back bitches

[phacemeltar]

That sad, sad generation of teenagers whose sole mmo experience has been "click the LFR button, get auto-queued and zoned into a raid, rush through the halls of the zone for 20 minutes without speaking a word to anyone, click "get item," equip your new loot"

sad state of the world

[4WOFURY]

This thread makes me want to AoE BB...

[reppa]

I've been on this server for like 3 years and I've never seen any more then 2 people in BB. When did this become a thing? 1-5 newbie area 5-12 CB/gfay 12-24 unrest 24-40 mistmoore 41-51 CoM leveled like 8 chars never had an issue.

[Buellen]

fangs xp is nuts but boring as hell to farm them after level 14. No toon outside of some higher toon aoe everything will get every single mob. The higher level toons tend to clear in the back by clover room /green room as gnoll density is higher.

it helps if you know what spawns where. You can sit at a spwn point and just wait till mob pops and engage as soon it those. If the higher level toon those not have the timing right you will get some mobs.

Even in live you would hardly find lots of mob up because regular xp groups would pull from all over the zone.

[Buellen]

if you still don't have a lot of gnolls then move on and form a bandit group in west karana. Their is roughly 9 to 10 different bandits camps in this zone. Bandits all drop bronze weapons and can drop sashes which are dam fine xp and give you even more bronze weapons to sell.

[Quineloe]

C

if (mob is blue) && (Character.Level > 18) then
Fang.DropChance = 15
Else
Fang.DropChance = 0
End if

I find it highly amusing when people come up with their amateur code to solve their perceived problems. Do you think they just need to copypasta this and it would work? Or are you trying to insult them by suggesting they would need this hint?


and you even fucked up the code.

[thugcruncher]

Bluebie Bitches FO SHO
http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/HahaNice.gif

[Quineloe]

Honestly, this is not live. Things are different here. Very similar game but different community. You're going to be very disappointed if you try to hold on too tight your original EQ experience and expect to replicate it exactly here. People here know a lot more than people did back in the day. They know how to streamline leveling and certain camps. Lots of people are on their 5th, 6th, or 7th character here and don't want to do the slo-mo grind from 1-20 again. It's just fact.

While that sounds like it sucks, it doesn't always. An example would be HHK goblins. Back on live the goblins could be broken up into multiple camps on some servers, but here goblins generally are done as one camp. In that case it's a benefit because otherwise you would have a crazy amount of downtime in that camp. I hope that there are other parts of the game that help to rekindle that old feeling for you other than just BB. Dungeons are generally very busy here, although I see zones like najena and soldunga mostly empty sometimes.
If you're on your 7th character, why don't you know a level 60 druid at that point who would follow you around with SLN DS Regen and help you solo a dungeon in the middle of nowhere and get through levels 20-30 in three hours? If these players are such veterans, they should realize what they're doing there is a horribly inefficient waste of time.

[Tzeriel]

These forums are a terrible advertisement for the server. One of the worst forum communities in the history of gaming. It's just greedy people, epeen kids and those turds from red who spam every thread to try to get people into their garbage server.

[fadetree]

One of the worst forum communities in the history of gaming.? Not even close. You must not get out much.

[lecompte]

If you're on your 7th character, why don't you know a level 60 druid at that point who would follow you around with SLN DS Regen and help you solo a dungeon in the middle of nowhere and get through levels 20-30 in three hours? If these players are such veterans, they should realize what they're doing there is a horribly inefficient waste of time.

20-30 in three hours? I wanna meet that PLer. And he said levels 1-20. And he didn't say HE was on his 7th character. Just a lot of people are. And solo a dungeon in the middle of nowhere... Dungeons are, by definition and their ZEM, not the middle of nowhere. Kinda an oxymoron. And LASTLY. If I'm mooching from a friend, and it is going to make me level 3x faster than just leveling alone... I'm going to go with the leveling alone method cause I have more respect for other people's time than that.

These forums are a terrible advertisement for the server. One of the worst forum communities in the history of gaming. It's just greedy people, epeen kids and those turds from red who spam every thread to try to get people into their garbage server.

I think our forums have a lot of less than helpful folks on them but a lot in the Server Chat is due to people misposting that threads become like this one. The OP wanted to RANT not to get constructive advice. People offered constructive advice and when that was thrown in their faces, folks realized the real nature of the thread, and that is what it became.

[Quineloe]

20-30 in three hours? I wanna meet that PLer. And he said levels 1-20.

Try not doing it in Unrest, competing with 20 players for spawns..

1-20 is even less of an issue with a 60 druid PLing.

[Messianic]

Why cant a level 7 go into Black burrow and have a good time, expecting to have a few mobs to kill?

This is pretty much what classic was. Instead of a bunch of newbies or pseudo twinks, we have odd behavior by bottom feeders. Same result.

[Frug]

I've been on this server for like 3 years and I've never seen any more then 2 people in BB. When did this become a thing? 1-5 newbie area 5-12 CB/gfay 12-24 unrest 24-40 mistmoore 41-51 CoM leveled like 8 chars never had an issue.

For the last couple months at least it has averaged 11-15 people in BB during US nighttime hours and weekend days.

[lecompte]

For the last couple months at least it has averaged 11-15 people in BB during US nighttime hours and weekend days.

Explains why they can't find any mobs :). BB can sustain a a group of 11s and a group of 6s and that is about it.

[daasgoot]

These forums are a terrible advertisement for the server. One of the worst forum communities in the history of gaming. It's just greedy people, epeen kids and those turds from red who spam every thread to try to get people into their garbage server.

Must not play Dota2

[Nikon]

This is pretty much what classic was. Instead of a bunch of newbies or pseudo twinks, we have odd behavior by bottom feeders. Same result.

Honestly, this is not live. Things are different here. Very similar game but different community. You're going to be very disappointed if you try to hold on too tight your original EQ experience and expect to replicate it exactly here.

I'm quoting myself here because I think this is a point that many people are overlooking or not taking to heart. P99 is emulating classic EQ the best way it can mechanically. That is what they have stated as their mission. At the end of the day, you can't emulate the classic community and play-styles. If you want to argue mechanics, such as the reward given for the gnoll fang quest, that's fine, but the burden of proof is on you, the individual or group that wants to enact the change. No matter how many threads are started about the subject, without evidence being submitted through the proper channels, it is not going to change because someone thinks they remember it being different.

If these players are such veterans, they should realize what they're doing there is a horribly inefficient waste of time.

I never said you had to be any level of intelligent in order to level multiple characters in EQ. Many people simply have more time than intelligence.

[Pinolian]

Nikon, I stopped commenting on this thread mainly because it felt like it was becoming something not representative of what I was trying to convey. That is, somehow people believed I was angry about not having my share of gnoll fangs because of people farming them. It's more about how the zone is farmed by people who should have moved on to the point where there isn't crap to kill for the folks that belong there.

That being said, I am not sure how to go about doing what you said, providing proof that it is broken now as compared to 1999. Am I looking for an archive of official patch notes or something conclusive like that?

[Quineloe]

There's an extensive guide on the forum about researching the history of classic EQ and digging through the very deepest section of the intarwebs. If you can find posts from 2000 stating exactly how many pixels of a bubble the gnoll trade in filled, you might be on to something.

[daasgoot]

Nikon, I stopped commenting on this thread mainly because it felt like it was becoming something not representative of what I was trying to convey. That is, somehow people believed I was angry about not having my share of gnoll fangs because of people farming them. It's more about how the zone is farmed by people who should have moved on to the point where there isn't crap to kill for the folks that belong there.

That being said, I am not sure how to go about doing what you said, providing proof that it is broken now as compared to 1999. Am I looking for an archive of official patch notes or something conclusive like that?

Say it is broken and giving too much exp.. why try to get it nerfed? lvl 1-20 sucks. You are a silly goose.

[lecompte]

a silly goose.

Anyone else hear that with a Mr. Slave accent?

[triad]

this is very similar to the us gov.. "we are unhappy with the actions of a few make more rule/laws because control makes me feel safe" ... fucking man up and go to a different camp.. it sucks but its way better then extra unnecessary rules because one person doesn't like that they cant get what they want

[daasgoot]

Anyone else hear that with a Mr. Slave accent?

*Raises Hand

[loramin]

Say it is broken and giving too much exp.. why try to get it nerfed? lvl 1-20 sucks. You are a silly goose.

Because this is a classic server. You might want the easiest server possible, and if so great: go play on EZ Server and have fun. The rest of us (and certainly all of the developers) want a server that emulates Classic Everquest as well as possible, and if that means making things harder we're all for it.

[loramin]

There's an extensive guide on the forum about researching the history of classic EQ

You wouldn't happen to have a link handy? I tried a bit of searching and couldn't find what you're talking about.

Personally I kind of think such a post should be stickied; might avoid a lot of posts in threads like this one.

[Quineloe]

Finding the already stickied thread on "How do I research" on your own is basically the first test on whether you should devote any time to this.

[Yonkec]

Finding the already stickied thread on "How do I research" on your own is basically the first test on whether you should devote any time to this.

Often in life one must admit defeat before they have even begun.

[loramin]

Thanks for that completely unhelpful response. Have you actually tried searching for that phrase here?

Search: Keyword(s): research
The following words are either very common, too long, or too short and were not included in your search: how, do, I

Surprise surprise, when you search for "research" alone, you get a whole lot of unhelpful results.

And yes, it is stickied in the bug thread but obviously there are a lot of people who could potentialy help the project that don't venture far from this main forum. Let's make it as hard as possible for them to contribute!

For everyone else's benefit the thread (that I still think should be stickied here in the main forum) is:
http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5570

[loramin]

And let me just say, it's people like you who negatively affect the community here. You've got multiple people in this thread expressing interest in doing research for the betterment of the community and your only response is belittle them for not knowing what you know. Might make you feel like a big man, but it doesn't get this server any closer to classic.

[Quineloe]

No, I am belittling you for refusing to search for even the most basic information yourself, the typical "letmegooglethatforyou" request, when the subject here is looking up information for yourself.

Ironically, if I use the forum search properly, that thread is the #1 result. How did you find it?

[Pinolian]

Say it is broken and giving too much exp.. why try to get it nerfed? lvl 1-20 sucks. You are a silly goose.

I dont want the exp nerfed. I have never said that.

I want level 18+ people who turn them in to get shit for exp so that they go the fuck away from the zone.

Actually what I suggested was that the fang not drop for level 18+ people. But that is probably a more complicated change.

Shaving exp at the turn in for folks who the zone is green for solves the problem, and fangs can be turned in for faction still, so faction hits are retained.

[loramin]

Ironically, if I use the forum search properly, that thread is the #1 result.

Right, because you knew exactly what you were looking for, and you knew to put it in quotes. My point was, for someone who didn't know that, finding the post was non-trivial. Rather than make everyone waste their time independently looking for this thread of your's, all it would have taken is six words from you.

It's really very simple. You could have responded to my post with:

It's stickied in the bug forum.

That would have actually taken less time/effort on your part, and it would have gotten me and anyone else interested to the resource so they could start researching and ultimately contributing to P99 ...

... or you could do what you did, and mock me for asking a person who clearly had the information I sought rather than wasting more time searching for it.

Going your route doesn't help the server or the community at all, but it gives you a nice feeling of superiority. Kudos.

[Quineloe]

You're assuming I knew where that was to begin with. I didn't.

Going your route doesn't help the server or the community at all,
Would the other route?
Will keep an eye out for your bug posts in the bug forum. Now that you know.

[loramin]

Will keep an eye out for your bug posts in the bug forum. Now that you know.

That sounds like a challenge (of the sort that does help the community) :D

Actually I've been meaning to file a bug about forest giants standing on their houses anyway. I'll leave the Gnoll Fang thing to Pinolian (or others) though; my Blackburrow days are far behind me.

[Nilasbik]

if (mob is blue) && (Character.Level > 18) then
Fang.DropChance = 15
Else
Fang.DropChance = 0
End if



I dont know if anyone else caught this and posted about it. I didnt take the time to read most of the thread. I just wanted to point out that this code would make it so that anyone under lvl18 wouldnt get any fang drops.

if mob is blue and character level is greater than 18 then you have a 15% chance to get fang else if you are not greater than 18 you have 0% chance to get fang drop... lol


Edit: Guess it was. still funny though!
I find it highly amusing when people come up with their amateur code to solve their perceived problems. Do you think they just need to copypasta this and it would work? Or are you trying to insult them by suggesting they would need this hint?


and you even fucked up the code.

[baalzy]

lol. Really should just be

if(mob is green)
Fang.DropChance = 0.

Why should those level 12s be allowed to kill the lvl 4-6 gnolls at the entrance?

[Quineloe]

That sounds like a challenge (of the sort that does help the community) :D

Actually I've been meaning to file a bug about forest giants standing on their houses anyway. I'll leave the Gnoll Fang thing to Pinolian (or others) though; my Blackburrow days are far behind me.

That's a global issue and has been reported on Sunday (=

[triad]

lol. Really should just be

if(mob is green)
Fang.DropChance = 0.

Why should those level 12s be allowed to kill the lvl 4-6 gnolls at the entrance?

because its my choice on how i wanna level .. I've never done the fangs beyond the ones i picked up wile grouping there but i reserve the right to go and collect some more if i so please .. the fact that people even find it a good idea to implement something to limit other people because it makes them uncomfortable is beyond stupid and is a prob here and irl .. bitching of the few affect the all

[Yonkec]

Holy hell, some of you suffer from late stage illusions of grandeur.

Where do you get off claiming that you alone have the right to hunt in Blackburrow, what level do you feel that others are no longer allowed to hunt for a quest item that....holy shit, gives them experience? Are we talking like a perma-ban from zoning into Blackburrow once you hit lvl 9? Maybe lvl 12? How about lvll 15? Perhaps you are feeling generous and will let anyone under level 18 kill mobs there? Where exactly do you draw the line on your douchebaggery? I am very curious to know this.

This is not your personal playground and you have no right to tell the rest of the server to GTFO of Blackburrow just because their character levels do not adhere to your personal preferences. Everyone has equal right to anything that is within their ability to camp and if you don't like that either man up and do something about it on P99 Red or go find another server that supports this level of childishness. You are going to have one chaffed asshole when you hit 60 and try to raid if this is your approach to the server.

[Champion_Standing]

Holy hell, some of you suffer from late stage illusions of grandeur.

Where do you get off claiming that you alone have the right to hunt in Blackburrow, what level do you feel that others are no longer allowed to hunt for a quest item that....holy shit, gives them experience? Are we talking like a perma-ban from zoning into Blackburrow once you hit lvl 9? Maybe lvl 12? How about lvll 15? Perhaps you are feeling generous and will let anyone under level 18 kill mobs there? Where exactly do you draw the line on your douchebaggery? I am very curious to know this.

This is not your personal playground and you have no right to tell the rest of the server to GTFO of Blackburrow just because their character levels do not adhere to your personal preferences. Everyone has equal right to anything that is within their ability to camp and if you don't like that either man up and do something about it on P99 Red or go find another server that supports this level of childishness.

Delusions is the word you are looking for there buddy.

Post made me LOL tho.

[Yonkec]

Delusions is the word you are looking for there buddy.

Post made me LOL tho.

Was a MTG reference(probably a poor one) but you are certainly correct ;)

[loramin]

Was a MTG reference(probably a poor one) but you are certainly correct ;)

"Illusions of Grandeur" is a Magic card (which I just added to my Zedruu commander deck). "Delusions of grandeur" is an English language phase, from which the Magic card took it's name.

[Argh]

The only reason Blackburrow has value as a leveling zone is because of the fangs. The exp from fangs are good enough to get you from 12-20. Why would anybody who can use the fangs (<20) not kill mobs who drop them?

They're grinding off fangs instead of blues.

[BarackObooma]

Pin,

As far as find information to be able to put in a bug report, I did plenty of the dirty work for you already. I showed earlier in the posting (and proved mathematically) how much experience gnoll fangs give now. I then found a 2001 post and did an experience comparison of then and now and found that based off that one example (and I said more is needed but you'll need to go look), the experience is 3x more now than it was then. If you can find a few more examples, you'd have a good arguement for a bug report.

I didn't hand that over because I agree with you though. Like Yonec, I do not feel anyone has the right to tell someone that is playing within the rules where they can/can't hunt. I think trying to implement non-classic code is ridiculous. I did it because if the experience per fang is not classic, it should be changed.

There will be times when lower level mobs drop something you need for yourself or another character. It could be bone chips for necros/SKs, quest items, tradeskill items, specific loot or even just faction from killing the mob.

Get used to camps you want to yourself being packed because deep down you know you want them for the exact same reason, they either give better than average experience or loot. I'm quite sure you aren't deleting your gnoll fangs. Qeynos Hills and Everfrost are on either side of blackburrow and you can level from 1-50+ in either one of them so don't give the BS excuse that anyone is preventing you from leveling.

[HawkMasterson1999]

I was turning in fangs not long ago and thinking to myself there is no way they gave this much exp on live. The quest wasn't worth doing anymore at lvl 12 as I remember it. Well now you can completely skip lvl 12 with a stack of fangs or is it less? People stay here till lvl 24 farming fangs because its better exp then anything else. Path of least resistance. Especially if you're a non-solo class who doesn't want to wait 3 hours for a group or sit 20 min between kills. I recently left BB on a lvl 12 alt, remembering from my live days that this was when bb slowed way down for exp. After an hour or 2 of bandits and wisps (even including quest turn ins) I calculated that blackburrow is still like 2x faster. At lvl 16 one fang is probably more than a solo kill on a yellow con. It is a jerk move to steal green mobs from the lowbies but the reward is just as good if not better (bc greens die fast).

[loramin]

I did plenty of the dirty work for you already. I showed earlier in the posting (and proved mathematically) how much experience gnoll fangs give now. I then found a 2001 post and did an experience comparison of then and now and found that based off that one example (and I said more is needed but you'll need to go look), the experience is 3x more now than it was then.

/applaud

[picklefixer]

I'm gonna post this in all the blackburrow posts.

I took my Iksar Necro there at lvl 4...after i trained meditate...killed gnolls till i was just a sliver away from lvl 12....got exactly 300 fangs.

Upon turn in, got all of lvl 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, and about 90% of lvl 20. Not too bad i guess.

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

[Potus]

I'm gonna post this in all the blackburrow posts.

I took my Iksar Necro there at lvl 4...after i trained meditate...killed gnolls till i was just a sliver away from lvl 12....got exactly 300 fangs.

Upon turn in, got all of lvl 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, and about 90% of lvl 20. Not too bad i guess.

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

Your fizzles are going to be so bad on the level 20 pet.

[HawkMasterson1999]

I see alot of people saying "well prove it or shut up". Is anyone here actually asserting that gnoll fang quest is giving the same reward it did on live? I think we all know OP.

[Briscoe]

...I would PBAE the entire zone in a single pull and then switch over to my alt to loot piles of fangs...

naw, take a druid in and AOE whole zone, log in new char, loot , almost instant 20

I guess you didn't read what I wrote. But independent of that, you either (a) have done this yourself and we have a disagreement as to what constitutes "almost instant," or (b) have not done this yourself and are overestimating how quickly it would actually take you to 20.

[Iumuno]

I see alot of people saying "well prove it or shut up". Is anyone here actually asserting that gnoll fang quest is giving the same reward it did on live? I think we all know OP.

I leveled 5 characters on live in western Antonica, and spent considerable time in Blackburrow on each. The xp reward on p1999 is entirely out of line with what is used to be on live. Your xp bar barely moved every turn in past level 8. From memory, farming fang from level 4 and on, I'd have to wait until I was halfway through 7 before turning in fangs and dinging level 8 - on multiple toons.

Favoring bottom feeding is invariably Bad. It brings the worst out of people - I really don't understand how the devs are allowing it to continue on.

[Potus]

Devs please put Tumpy Tonics back in the game, they were leet exp.

[Quineloe]

I see alot of people saying "well prove it or shut up". Is anyone here actually asserting that gnoll fang quest is giving the same reward it did on live? I think we all know OP.
This is because the devs won't change stuff on the server unless it's backed by real evidence. So if it really bothers you enough to dig through the deep intarwebs, go ahead. Most people who read this thread really don't care because they're past BB and should they ever start a new character, they'll probably get the PL treatment I mentioned earlier.

[fadetree]

For what it's worth, I also always started in Qeynos during live, and I distinctly remember the fangs getting to be fairly worthless around 13-14.

[drktmplr12]

1. figure out respawn time
2. figure out kill order
3. ?
4. profit.

no where in there does it say go to the forums and ask the devs to write code to compensate for your unwillingness to figure out how to beat the level 18 stomping on your playground.

[Pinolian]

Thank you for the help. I never said anyone was preventing me from leveling. My original post said that I could go somewhere else or log on a different character, plainly at the end of it. To me it was the principle of the fact that I, of the appropriate level, could not get a kill because people who theoretically should have moved on, were wiping the zone to farm an item to turn in for exp because that exp was greater and easier than what they could get elsewhere.

My original post had a lot of "moral" flavor in it. It was wrong in my opinion that the farming was occurring to begin with. Taking all that you can, because you can, is a pure dick move in my opinion. That really is a moral question that can be argued until we are all blue in the face. In order to be effective here, it is clear that people want black and white evidence, as opposed to what seems morally correct to another person. I know I hate it in RL when someone else's morals are shoved down my throat.

That being said, I do not want to nerf gnoll fangs completely. I just want them fixed so that they are no longer an attractive option to level with instead of actual exping once you reach a certain level. That level should probably be around 12 like other low level dungeon quests of the era. This behavior would be in line with other quests, such as the crushbone belt quest. And it would also curb slumming instead of actually encouraging it, as it does now.

On a side note. I had a friend killing greens last night for the karana bandit quest. 17 sashes later at level 22, he got 2 bubbles of exp and 120+ plat for the bronze weapons from the turn in and rawhide they dropped. There are other things that can be done besides gnoll fangs for safe exp and actual profit.





Pin,

As far as find information to be able to put in a bug report, I did plenty of the dirty work for you already. I showed earlier in the posting (and proved mathematically) how much experience gnoll fangs give now. I then found a 2001 post and did an experience comparison of then and now and found that based off that one example (and I said more is needed but you'll need to go look), the experience is 3x more now than it was then. If you can find a few more examples, you'd have a good arguement for a bug report.

I didn't hand that over because I agree with you though. Like Yonec, I do not feel anyone has the right to tell someone that is playing within the rules where they can/can't hunt. I think trying to implement non-classic code is ridiculous. I did it because if the experience per fang is not classic, it should be changed.

There will be times when lower level mobs drop something you need for yourself or another character. It could be bone chips for necros/SKs, quest items, tradeskill items, specific loot or even just faction from killing the mob.

Get used to camps you want to yourself being packed because deep down you know you want them for the exact same reason, they either give better than average experience or loot. I'm quite sure you aren't deleting your gnoll fangs. Qeynos Hills and Everfrost are on either side of blackburrow and you can level from 1-50+ in either one of them so don't give the BS excuse that anyone is preventing you from leveling.

[Messianic]

I'm gonna post this in all the blackburrow posts.

I took my Iksar Necro there at lvl 4...after i trained meditate...killed gnolls till i was just a sliver away from lvl 12....got exactly 300 fangs.

Upon turn in, got all of lvl 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, and about 90% of lvl 20. Not too bad i guess.

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

A+, great info

[daasgoot]

I'm gonna post this in all the blackburrow posts.

I took my Iksar Necro there at lvl 4...after i trained meditate...killed gnolls till i was just a sliver away from lvl 12....got exactly 300 fangs.

Upon turn in, got all of lvl 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, and about 90% of lvl 20. Not too bad i guess.

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

damn.. i have done this with 3 toons starting at lvl 4 outside BB. I have never got more than 200 fangs by the time im level 12. Still gets me to lvl 18-20 though depending on class/race

[baalzy]

Necro using pet is probably only getting 50% the xp from most kills cause the pets do a lot more dmg than spells at that level.

[Quineloe]

plus iksar necromancer isn't exactly a low exp combination

[Champion_Standing]

I would like the record to show that OP plays a ranger.

[baalzy]

iksar necro = 32% penalty.

[picklefixer]

Necro using pet is probably only getting 50% the xp from most kills cause the pets do a lot more dmg than spells at that level.

Really don't have much time to even cast spells before mob is dead...since i only roll lowbies with Brazier of Elemental Summoning.

and yet, i still cant get others to group up with me in BB :(

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

[Clark]

"Illusions of Grandeur" is a Magic card (which I just added to my Zedruu commander deck). "Delusions of grandeur" is an English language phase, from which the Magic card took it's name.

[Frug]

Really don't have much time to even cast spells before mob is dead...since i only roll lowbies with Brazier of Elemental Summoning.

and yet, i still cant get others to group up with me in BB :(

<Insert SweetAss Sig Here>
Mrtwig

I spent a few levels in BB, and there were RARELY any groups (I think I saw 1), and could never get a group myself. It's all FANGS FANGS FANGS!

[Velerin]

There's about ~12 low level gnoll spawns in Qeynos Hills that spawn over 3x faster than inside BB with the same percent to drop fangs (if not higher). Get sow and do that circuit for all your gnoll fang dreams.
You're welcome.

[Gnomebert]

this thread has inspired me to work on my steel warrior faction for hero bracer quest on my 60 wizard

[Azure]

You know whats funny - players mad that BB is populated by more than 1 or 2 low level preteen newbz. That its a happening zone with player drama and conflict.

U know what. I use to do on live. Back in 1999 motherfuckers. I would level up to 10. Kill snakes till 14, than go to EAST MOTEHRFUCKING KARANA.

Stop being bitches.

[Azure]

You also got lake rathe. And EVERFROST at 15+

[Azure]

Bandits in NK 2% exp per kill and the bronze/lewt is gr8 spawn rate is super high with a small group you can crank out mad exps... and get tons of plat$$

[Azure]

And faction with highpass at the same time.

Worlds your oyster yet you all have some kind of severe mental disease that requires you to level in some specific spot every alt you people make.

[Azure]

And holy fuck the gorge of Xorbb... yaw... thats a fun zone :P RV is like right fuckin there if your a scum melee who needs a bind

[LulzSect]

http://freedcomedy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/tranny.jpeg

[Azure]

Don't forget runneyeye!

[Champion_Standing]

You know whats funny - players mad that BB is populated by more than 1 or 2 low level preteen newbz. That its a happening zone with player drama and conflict.

U know what. I use to do on live. Back in 1999 motherfuckers. I would level up to 10. Kill snakes till 14, than go to EAST MOTEHRFUCKING KARANA.

Stop being bitches.

This ^

Plenty of bandits too, and they are hardly ever camped. There are a lot of alternatives for leveling, and while I do think that only a self absorbed douche would be clearing green gnolls in front of players that can exp off them, and only a super douche would suggest that it is a "competition" when one party has absolutely no means to compete against the other. It is also a sign that the zone has reached high enough douche saturation where leaving is more productive than staying.

[Baler]

I spent 4 hours trying to get gnoll scraps from a halfling. After this halfling left I took over the gnoll spawns outside BB. Here I am 14 hours of gnoll farming outside BB. Yes I've been playing for 18+ hours today/night. <3 evercrack. In the time that i've been farming, I have not left a scrap for anyone else, you may think this is wrong and imoral but this is the Grind.

I think people complain about this the most because it's the real first low level experience of spawn camping. There are plenty of higher level examples of this but because this is the first time lower level players find them selves in this situation they feel something is broken. When if fact nothing is broken, it's just a new experience.

Many good points have been made in this thread. One primarily i'd like to point out is there that there are plenty of other zones that you can gain decent exp in. Everyone runs across the world to this one spot and expects to get a fair share, it is just not realistic. Especially on a Era based EQ server.

Also I'd like to not that no one during my time farming these gnolls has said one word to me or asked me if they could have some

During the time I wrote this I lost two gnolls. *bleep*!

[Azure]

This ^

Plenty of bandits too, and they are hardly ever camped. There are a lot of alternatives for leveling, and while I do think that only a self absorbed douche would be clearing green gnolls in front of players that can exp off them, and only a super douche would suggest that it is a "competition" when one party has absolutely no means to compete against the other. It is also a sign that the zone has reached high enough douche saturation where leaving is more productive than staying.

Yeah, agree champ. It isn't nice, but it is what it is. and agree with the next poster up - its spawn camping. it is also what it is and it's EQ.