This just leaves me absolutely speechless. I had no idea it was this bad.

[Skittlez]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brvhCnYvxQQ

[r00t]

http://scontent-b-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1.0-9/1601528_10152349002355281_822075295_n.jpg

[Lyra]

Just ignore it, it will go away. Your generation will be remembered for your lack of action. Oh wait...

[Skittlez]

I don't want my son to grow up in a world with no trees and forests. We are going to kill our selves off at this rate. Just how long will it be until the whole world is facing an epic drought??

[phacemeltar]

instead of blaming me, you should blame the landowners for turning everything into concrete

"How can you buy or sell the sky, the warmth of the land? The idea is strange to us. If we do not own the freshness of the air and the sparkle of the water, how can you buy them?

Every part of the Earth is sacred to my people. Every shining pine needle, every sandy shore, every mist in the dark woods, every clear and humming insect is holy in the memory and experience of my people. The sap which courses through the trees carries the memory and experience of my people. The sap which courses through the trees carries the memories of the red man.

The white man's dead forget the country of their birth when they go to walk among the stars. Our dead never forget this beautiful Earth, for it is the mother of the red man. We are part of the Earth and it is part of us. The perfumed flowers are our sisters, the deer, the horse, the great eagle, these are our brothers. The rocky crests, the juices in the meadows, the body heat of the pony, and the man, all belong to the same family.

So, when the Great Chief in Washington sends word that he wishes to buy our land, he asks much of us. The Great White Chief sends word he will reserve us a place so that we can live comfortably to ourselves. He will be our father and we will be his children. So we will consider your offer to buy land. But it will not be easy. For this land is sacred to us.

This shining water that moves in streams and rivers is not just water but the blood of our ancestors. If we sell you land, you must remember that it is sacred blood of our ancestors. If we sell you land, you must remember that it is sacred, and you must teach your children that it is sacred and that each ghostly reflection in the clear water of the lakes tells of events in the life of my people. The waters murmur is the voice of my father's father.

The rivers of our brothers they quench our thirst. The rivers carry our canoes and feed our children. If we sell you our land, you must remember to teach your children that the rivers are our brothers, and yours, and you must henceforth give the rivers the kindness that you would give my brother. We know that the white man does not understand our ways. One portion of land is the same to him as the next, for he is a stranger who comes in the night and takes from the land whatever he needs. The Earth is not his brother, but his enemy and when he has conquered it, he moves on. He leaves his father's graves behind, and he does not care. He kidnaps the Earth from his children, and he does not care.

BIRTHRIGHT

His father's grave, and his children's birthright are forgotten. He treats his mother, the Earth, and his brother, the same, as things to be bought, plundered, sold like sheep or bright beads. His appetite will devour the Earth and leave behind only a desert.

I do not know. Our ways are different from yours ways. The sight of your cities pains the eyes of the red man. But perhaps it is because the red man is a savage and does not understand.

There is no quiet place in the white man's cities. No place to hear the unfurling of leaves in spring, or the rustle of an insect's wings. But perhaps it is because I am a savage and do not understand. The clatter only seems to insult the ears. And what is there to life if a man cannot hear the lonely cry of a whippoorwill or the arguments of the frogs around a pond at night. I am a red man and do not understand. The Indian prefers the soft sound of the wind darting over the face of the pond, and the smell of the wind itself, cleansed by a midday rain, or scented with the pinon pine.

PRECIOUS

The air is precious to the red man, for all things share the same breath - the beast, the tree, the man, they all share the same breath. The white man does not seem to notice the air he breathes. Like a man dying for many days, he is numb to the stench. But if we sell you our land, you must remember that the air is precious to us, that the air shares its spirit with all the life it supports. The wind that gave our grandfather his first breath also receives his last sigh. And if we sell you our land, you must keep it apart and sacred, as a place where even the white man can go to taste the wind that is sweetened by the meadow's flowers.

So we will consider your offer to buy our land. If we decide to accept, I will make one condition - the white man must treat the beasts of this land as his brothers.

I am a savage and do not understand any other way. I have seen a thousand rotting buffaloes on the prairie, left by the white man who shot them from a passing train. I am a savage and do not understand how the smoking iron horse can be made more important than the buffalo that we kill only to stay alive.

What is man without the beasts? If all the beasts were gone, man would die from a great loneliness of the spirit. For whatever happens to the beasts, soon happens to man. All things are connected.

RESPECT

You must teach your children that the ground beneath their feet is the ashes of our grandfathers. So that they will respect the land, tell your children that the Earth is rich with the lives of our kin. Teach your children what we have taught our children, that the Earth is our mother. Whatever befalls the Earth befalls the sons of the Earth. If men spit upon the ground, they spit upon themselves.

This we know - the Earth does not belong to man - man belongs to the Earth. This we know. All things are connected like the blood which unites one family. All things are connected.

Whatever befalls the Earth - befalls the sons of the Earth. Man did not weave the web of life - he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web, he does to himself.

Even the white man, whose God walks and talks with him as friend to friend, cannot be exempt from the common destiny. We may be brothers after all. We shall see. One thing we know, which the white man may one day discover - Our God is the same God. You may think now that you own Him as you wish to own our land, but you cannot. He is the God of man, and His compassion is equal for red man and the white. The Earth is precious to Him, and to harm the Earth is to heap contempt on its creator. The whites too shall pass, perhaps sooner than all other tribes.

But in your perishing you will shine brightly, fired by the strength of the God who brought you to this land and for some special purpose gave you dominion over this land and over the red man. That destiny is a mystery to us, for we do not understand when the buffalo are slaughtered, the wild horses tamed, the secret corners of the forest heavy with scent of many men, and the view of the ripe hills blotted by talking wires. Where is the thicket? Gone. Where is the Eagle? Gone. The end of living and the beginning of survival".

Chief Seattle
1854

[Orruar]

Wasn't the Chief Seattle speech shown to be a fraud later? Like he never spoke those words?

[phacemeltar]

looks like it http://www.snopes.com/quotes/seattle.asp

i always liked the concept though

[Skittlez]

Wow, that is pretty nuts. So did someone just come up with that and say he said it?This is my first time to hear anything about this

[Sidelle]

Don't worry too much, guys. Cheer up. They have bold ideas already in the works to save the planet. No big deal as long as you're ok with mass human extermination on a global level. Oh dear, there's that word "global" again... it seems to be coming up a lot lately. Now I can see why some people want one world government. It would probably be much more convenient for them to pull this shit off, right?

So, this is an interesting article... I'll just leave it right here. I would like to note that I genuinely appreciated the author's attempt at softening it up in such a way that you almost don't notice the spooky shit.. Almost..

"Global Population Reduction: Confronting the Inevitable" - World Watch Institute

"Looking past the near-term concerns that have plagued population policy at the political level, it is increasingly apparent that the long-term sustainability of civilization will require not just a leveling-off of human numbers as projected over the coming half-century, but a colossal reduction in both population and consumption."-------> READ COMPLETE ARTICLE (http://www.worldwatch.org/node/563)

I definitely agree that overpopulation is the biggest threat to the environment. But holy shit! They would have to kill off billions of people, starting asap. Anyone else have an opinion on this?

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

(Ok. Now I need something in this post that makes me feel better... Ferrets wrestling in packing peanuts. Lol)

http://i.imgur.com/JaBRRur.gif

[Tune]

climate change bigger issue i would think

[phacemeltar]

if humans dug down instead of building skyscrapers, then we could have more surface area to produce oxygen/food. also, there are vast amounts of land that is yet uninhabited.

not to be too unrealistic, but according to the rate at which technology has developed, there is a good chance that off-world colonies will exist in the near-future.

i dont get this whole overpopulation mess. except about how humans are negatively impacting the livelihood of other species, that is a serious issue imo.

[Sidelle]

climate change bigger issue i would think

Overpopulation leads directly to negative climate changes. The article explains it better than I so here's a quote for you.

Clearly, assertions that the Earth might be able to support a population of 10, 15, or even 20 billion people for an indefinite period of time at a standard of living superior to the present are not only cruelly misleading but almost certainly false. Notwithstanding our current addiction to continued and uninterrupted economic growth, humanity must recognize that there are finite physical, biological, and ecological limits to the Earth's long-term sustainable carrying capacity. And to judge by the growing concerns about maintaining the quality, stability, and/or sustainability of the Earth's atmosphere, water, forests, croplands, fisheries, and so on, there is little if any doubt that many of these limits will soon be reached, if they haven't already been surpassed. Since at some point the damage stemming from the mutually reinforcing effects of excessive human reproduction and overconsumption of resources could well become irreversible, and because there is only one Earth with which to experiment, it would undoubtedly be better for our species to err on the side of prudence, exercising wherever possible a cautious and careful stewardship.

By the way, I am not quoting this creepy stuff in the article because I am on board with these kind of drastic actions to save the planet. I think it's horrifying. But it's starting to ring true that it's too late to fix it by recycling, buying a Prius, consuming less, smaller carbon footprint, etc. Especially if the population keeps growing at such an alarming rate because it will overwhelm those efforts. More people means more production means more greenhouse gases, which leads to climate changes...I think that's what I wanted to say. Lol... ok. I'm done. Stayed up wayyy too late. Forgive my post, I'm tired. Bye. :)

[Sidelle]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2048395/Earth-scraper-Architects-design-65-storey-building-300-metres-ground.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/12/article-2048395-0E5705F600000578-848_964x800.jpg

That's amazing. I like.

[Azure]

Global thermonuclear winter will have a long term sustained affect on global climate.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2048395/Earth-scraper-Architects-design-65-storey-building-300-metres-ground.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/12/article-2048395-0E5705F600000578-848_964x800.jpg

^^^ someone likes to play minecraft 2 damn much

[Glenzig]

I notice in all the articles espousing overpopulation as the main culprit to climate change, there is a phrase that goes unnoticed by most. "Standard of living". You do realize that humans can live without power plants, and cell phones and computers right?
Besides which. The standard of living they are actually referring to is not yours and mine, but the top 5%. I don't know about anyone else, but I've never exploited the earths natural resources to turn a profit. But yet we are the ones that are made to feel guilty. The finger is always pointed at "the consumer", and never at the manufacturer.

[Scikala]

I notice in all the articles espousing overpopulation as the main culprit to climate change, there is a phrase that goes unnoticed by most. "Standard of living". You do realize that humans can live without power plants, and cell phones and computers right?
Besides which. The standard of living they are actually referring to is not yours and mine, but the top 5%. I don't know about anyone else, but I've never exploited the earths natural resources to turn a profit. But yet we are the ones that are made to feel guilty. The finger is always pointed at "the consumer", and never at the manufacturer.

Obviously if we cared, we wouldnt buy the stuff..../s

[Azure]

Yet we have the technology for everyone to have a reasonable standard of living if the beucrats and lawyers would stay out of the mess and stop killing educated innovators who cut into the bottom line of their profits.

[r00t]

well I for one am NOT going stop using my phone to query google's server farms while driving my hotboxed tin can just cause of global warming alarmism

[this user was banned]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2048395/Earth-scraper-Architects-design-65-storey-building-300-metres-ground.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/12/article-2048395-0E5705F600000578-848_964x800.jpg

It looks like that takes up just as much of a footprint as a skyscraper and its only intent was to circumvent the height restrictions on buildings. Can we just kill off all the religious nutfucks that think it's god's will that the earth is fucked rather than take responsibility?

[r00t]

if we built the towers underground we'd still have freedom

[Glenzig]

Obviously if we cared, we wouldnt buy the stuff..../s

To a point that's true. But when it becomes mandatory to have a car in order to get to work. And a computer in order to accomplish that work, you're kinda stuck. The system is set up to force you to need the very things that are the worst for you. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Trust me I would love to be able to grow all of my own food and generate my own electricity. But you basically have to be independently wealthy to even start. And then you're labeled a terrorist for refusing to receive electricity from the power company. The way everything is set up, we're basically forced to live a backwards lifestyle to a certain extent.

[Glenzig]

if we built the towers underground we'd still have freedom

Yup, but building 7 would still be gone.

[moklianne]

It does make more logical sense to build down into the earth rather than build upward as long as earthquakes are nonexistent. Temperature is more stable. That alone is a huge boon in energy savings.

[moklianne]

To a point that's true. But when it becomes mandatory to have a car in order to get to work. And a computer in order to accomplish that work, you're kinda stuck. The system is set up to force you to need the very things that are the worst for you. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Trust me I would love to be able to grow all of my own food and generate my own electricity. But you basically have to be independently wealthy to even start. And then you're labeled a terrorist for refusing to receive electricity from the power company. The way everything is set up, we're basically forced to live a backwards lifestyle to a certain extent.

http://earthship.com/

[Ahldagor]

I notice in all the articles espousing overpopulation as the main culprit to climate change, there is a phrase that goes unnoticed by most. "Standard of living". You do realize that humans can live without power plants, and cell phones and computers right?
Besides which. The standard of living they are actually referring to is not yours and mine, but the top 5%. I don't know about anyone else, but I've never exploited the earths natural resources to turn a profit. But yet we are the ones that are made to feel guilty. The finger is always pointed at "the consumer", and never at the manufacturer.

that's capitalism. consumer was capitalized upon by a manufacturer selling them a product. the consumer capitalized upon manufacturers producing cheaper goods which satisfied their own cost-benefit analysis.

[Scikala]

To a point that's true. But when it becomes mandatory to have a car in order to get to work. And a computer in order to accomplish that work, you're kinda stuck. The system is set up to force you to need the very things that are the worst for you. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Trust me I would love to be able to grow all of my own food and generate my own electricity. But you basically have to be independently wealthy to even start. And then you're labeled a terrorist for refusing to receive electricity from the power company. The way everything is set up, we're basically forced to live a backwards lifestyle to a certain extent.

The /s at the end of what I said = Sarcasm.

I could do a lot of that stuff if I so chose, but it's gotten to the point where its too hard really unless you go completely off the grid in some cases.

The more society advances in general the less options we really have. I mean I could theoretically do my work from home, as we have a few people out of state, but they don't want us to, and therefor I have to keep my car, and all the expenses and waste that come with it.

[Ahldagor]

The /s at the end of what I said = Sarcasm.

I could do a lot of that stuff if I so chose, but it's gotten to the point where its too hard really unless you go completely off the grid in some cases.

The more society advances in general the less options we really have. I mean I could theoretically do my work from home, as we have a few people out of state, but they don't want us to, and therefor I have to keep my car, and all the expenses and waste that come with it.

appearances matter more now unfortunately. our computers enabled us to do that, but no one does it because there's not some giant, metallic penis making a shadow in a city skyline that people can point to. or some contemporary architecture designed building sprawled out in order to house an entire companies work force. or some start up city complete with shopping malls, neighborhoods, temples of all faiths, the entire middle america experience wrapped up and ready to go (Exxon is doing this with their global HQ 10mins from where i live and it's weird).