Troll Shadowknight Deity

[SkullThrone]

Hey all, To the people heading this server up, thank you so much for it, appreciate it.. really brings me back to the old days of Rallos Zek, when I started a DE Necromancer so long ago in '99, and found DoTs and pet get kill and you don't get loot on players, so I just made a wizard and and old SK and tore into everyone haha. Was an epic monk present for the Kerafyrm kill, but was branded PK by then and I couldn't FD down to the bottom when they were fighting to try to mess up the raid :P Trick is to FD and get up when the wraiths are casting, fun to go PVP once in awhile when I was on RZ for a little funsies, but this is really great, less hassle and more teamwork. Besides I kinda put that behind me long ago but anyways..Oh ya! thanks for the ole skeleton models!


** My question is about a Troll Shadowknight - there are two deities, Cazic Thule and Innoruuk - are there any specific reasons to go with one over the other? I think its just items that are deity based, able to be used by that particular religion, but I'm not sure which to choose - on an aesthetic note I would probably go with Innoruuk just as an act of blasphemy in the face of the faceless Troll creator, Cazic Thule, but I'm unsure..I know it would not maketh me a pawn to the ruuk! I always had an affinity for the Plane of Hate though - Fear was great too, but what reason would I go with either deity? Just items or quests? Faction doesn't matter probably- they are both as evil, and one accepts the other just as well everywhere - but if its items, anyone have a list for the Troll Shadowknight deity specific items and/or quests, if there are some? Here's some lore I found and pasted:

Lore:
Grimgash ordered a keep built around the cave. Thus began the order now called the Shadowknights of Night Keep. The newly initiated troll shadowknights
under Warlord Grimgash were sent into this cavern to receive a vision from Cazic Thule thus setting the path of their destiny. Through the guidance of the
visions granted by The Eyes of Cazic Thule, the shadowknights of Night Keep led several successful campains against the Frogloks of Guk. The eyes revealed
to Cazic's faithful trolls the hiding places of the Frogloks and the Frogloks advances on Grobb before they came to pass. As the years passed and the swamps
rose beneath Grobb, water and sludge began to swallow The Eyes of Cazic Thule. The shadowknights of Night Keep tried to keep the swamp at bay but
eventually the cavern became submerged beneath Grobb, The Eyes of Cazic Thule lost to the new generations of Shadowknights. Without the influence of
The Eyes of Cazic Thule, the Teir'Dal of Neriak found it easier to persuade young trolls into the service of Innoruuk, and Night Keep became an army divided
between two Gods. It is whispered in the shadows of Night Keep that should one of Cazics faithful reach The Eyes of Cazic Thule beneath the waters and
sludge of the swamp and survive, they shall become the mightiest of all shadowknights and shall lead Grobb in victories unparalleled by the great warlords of days gone by.


Thanks for da read, maybe somewun knoes abut dis stuff - me iz bekoming trol...slowlee melting into trol form...Rawr!

[Lazortag]

I always wondered why you couldn't change your religion in Everquest. In real life I can change my religion. I think if you're agnostic and you go on an Inny raid, your religion should automatically change.

[Reiker]

How does killing a god make you any less agnostic?

[ryuut1]

Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable

says google.

so if you killed him, now you know. and that's half the battle.

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f23/Rbless/rat-hunter-gi-joe.jpg

[ShadowWulf]

Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable

says google.

so if you killed him, now you know. and that's half the battle.

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f23/Rbless/rat-hunter-gi-joe.jpg

And now he's dead, so atheism would be the next logical step =)

[Reiker]

Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable

says google. [/IMG]

You cherrypicked a defintion.

someone who is doubtful or noncommittal about something

[ryuut1]

You cherrypicked a defintion.

someone who is doubtful or noncommittal about something

haha, you're arguing it further, whatta douche =P

did you atleast like the picture

[ryuut1]

And now he's dead, so atheism would be the next logical step =)

How does killing a god make you any less agnostic?

was the question at hand

[Lazortag]

It's not so much "killing" a God as confirming the existence of one. I think this was pretty obvious?

[ryuut1]

unless someone took it super serial, and said "THIS IS NO GOD I HAFT KILLED HIM!!1"

[Malrubius]

Agnosticism (the religious view) means that you CANNOT prove nor disprove the existence of God (or a god).

So if you killed one, you probably just proved that one did exist. :D

[Virtuosos]

to be a god, you must be immortal....

god is unkillable

you killed a mob people consider a god

thus the mob you killed is only an idol // an imposter

therefore, god either exists still or never existed to begin with...only an idea a monster turned into a lifestyle
:D

[Azazel]

The religion you follow in everquest is a more of a pledge of allegiance rather than a epistemological judgement.

[Lazortag]

The religion you follow in everquest is a more of a pledge of allegiance rather than a epistemological judgement.

That's not entirely true - when you select "Agnostic" upon creating a character, it says something like "Agnostics will not commit to the existence or non-existence of any deity". When you actually see Innoruuk, CT, etc, shouldn't that confirm their existence?

[Erasong]

to be a god, you must be immortal....

god is unkillable

you killed a mob people consider a god

thus the mob you killed is only an idol // an imposter

therefore, god either exists still or never existed to begin with...only an idea a monster turned into a lifestyle
:D

that fucker respawns every week. god status achieved. even in the fucking lore they admit to being defeated and sent back to heal. PoTime?

[SkullThrone]

o.m.g.

didn't know it would go dis far..well I didn't really get an answer at all :( but its ok, torture and pain only go so far compared to the wraths of the prince of hate and his so-called "creative" force. Undeath is a haunting reminder of his embellishments! I've noticed sometimes in life certain things I hate I don't directly turn into them, but the aversions and anathema seem to want to become neutral with me somehow, and materialize as something in the future that I deal with...so you eat that hate, I guess hate could be what you ate, easily overpowered with loathing and so it trickles down - hopefully in this case, "you are what you eat" doesn't hold true hehehe. Bah me no eat hate me eat hummies I guess Imma go with the wraths of FEAR!


This was interesting...
http://www.en.metaportal.ru/releases/manuals/releases_manual_12277

To Quote from the writing that Vladimir Tonkov did above:


"The very notion of religiousness is likewise easily defined. Religiousness is an unsubstantiated acceptance of a particular way of spiritual fulfillment accompanied by refusal from any forms of free search in this area. That is exactly why the adepts and adherents of any of the world religions frequently provide absolutely inconceivable eccentricities, irrationalities and contradictions as facts and evidence.
What does evidence have to do with it all? If a person wants to research his own spiritual qualities, then just let him do so, and if he does not, even facts will not be facts for him and more so if they are unsubstantiated and aggressively imposed. A person can well be spiritual, but ignorant and antireligious at the same time, especially if we consider that religion is a social-psychological system, and yet not primordial at that."

"Therefore, according to the beliefs held by the world religions, considering that the overwhelming majority of humanity are adherents thereof, and while leaving room for the special group of believers, i.e. atheists, being in fact even stronger believers than those attending cathedrals and prayer houses, spirituality is a special collection of qualities acquired by the beings having something conventionally called the “spirit” in their psycho-physiological structures."

"Following the above it is easy to make a conclusion that spirituality is a personal peculiar feature intrinsic of every being or “creature” (you choose, so as to avoid any argument), and religiousness is just a public claim of a group of persons (either big or small) to know the ways to attain spirituality."




I hope yer satisfied, now go med up..the flies always come together when the thoughts gather and then, spread apart in every direction when they scatter away..ever notice that? :P


**I Didn't want this thread to be a big thing on individual belief, I jus want'd ta kno what items are specific to a deity (or if you have some kind of list, would be nice - or a way to find them cuz I can't) or if there is a real difference in faction standing and if there are quests that relate to a certain deity that are worth doing :/

Still, a few neat answers, but thanks tho...

[nalkin]

^ are you skelator by chance comrade?

[Azazel]

That's not entirely true - when you select "Agnostic" upon creating a character, it says something like "Agnostics will not commit to the existence or non-existence of any deity". When you actually see Innoruuk, CT, etc, shouldn't that confirm their existence?

Yeah I put that down to the devs not thinking things through, if your going to be agnostic about Innoruk then you might as well not commit to the existence or non-existence of an_orc_pawn.

[ryuut1]

i think that the asshat who wanted to be the naysayer just got served by you fine people.

[Estu]

The religion you follow in everquest is a more of a pledge of allegiance rather than a epistemological judgement.

This. Despite the 'agnostic' description.

[Bodeanicus]

to be a god, you must be immortal....

god is unkillable

you killed a mob people consider a god

thus the mob you killed is only an idol // an imposter

therefore, god either exists still or never existed to begin with...only an idea a monster turned into a lifestyle
:D

Uh, no. The Greek and Norse gods could certainly be killed. They just didn't die of old age. ;)

[Lill-Leif]

god is unkillable

I'm interested in this passage. Does the large religions today Christian/Islam/Judaism state that their God can't be killed? What does the bible say for example? (I only read the abstract ;)

[Omnimorph]

Nietzsche says God is dead, and we killed him.

I looted the corpse. 3pp and a rusty longsword.

[internalprime8]

On topic, Cazic Thule is way cooler and the sum'bitch created Trolls. Why would you want to worship some pansy imp? Might as well follow Erollisi Marr imo...

[Wenai]

Worshipping Cazic-Thule made it easier to quest Greenmist.

[SkullThrone]

Yeh I'm goin with Cazic-Thule, as a proper Troll should. His eye gazes through the veils of opposition and overwrought aggression to make pain for the enemy! I guess there were no items that came along in classic that were deity related, maybe sol ro quests, but ah it don't matter, thanks for the tells.