Enc stuns no longer overlap - Goodbye Chardok AE

[Gimp]

Test it if ya want, but the stun effects from one stun no longer carry over to the next casted one.

[Nisei]

rekt

[Fame]

lol

[Pint]

gg

[Red_Psyphon]

nice

[Tann]

http://i.imgur.com/3qKyWOR.gif

[Ele]

Test it if ya want, but the stun effects from one stun no longer carry over to the next casted one.

Should have let them find out on their own. :D

[Gimp]

Not sure how long this will stay though, unclassic as far as I know.

I use two stuns a ton in places like HS and Seb as well.

[Tann]

cant make a wasted gif whilst at work but:

http://i.imgur.com/bAYqX95.jpg

^^^ WASTED

[Reguiy]

lolllll

[jcr4990]

I'm all for killing Chardok AE. Sucks that they have to make un-classic nerfs to Enc class though. There's gotta be a better way? Why don't they just ban Chardok AE like they banned Casino's? Anyone caught doing it = ban

[khanable]

I want to believe

But

Doesn't sound classic

:(

[sulpher01]

Thats a pretty dumb way of fixing it... poor enchs

[Nisei]

Thats a pretty dumb way of fixing it... poor enchs

RIP IN PEACE ENCHANTERS

[Byrjun]

Was there a discussion thread on this change at all, like on the bug forum?

[Gimp]

Don't think so.

Just tested again in two different zones, they definitely don't stack.

[Man0warr]

This really hurts enchanter soloing as well.

Most likely an unintentional change from some other fix - enchanter stuns stacking has always worked on Live and still does.

[Faiding]

Probably a bug. Otherwise this is a permanent solution for a temporary problem and/or really stupid.

Edit: and not at all classic

[Gaxx]

Aaahahahhaha

[kinuven]

unintended effects of this?

Haynar: Made some spell stacking more classic, for refreshing identical spells. The old spell will be faded first, and new spell will be put into lowest slot.

[khanable]

OP try casting in order of level and see if that works

[Gimp]

unintended effects of this?

Haynar: Made some spell stacking more classic, for refreshing identical spells. The old spell will be faded first, and new spell will be put into lowest slot.

Yep, that looks like it may have borked enc stuns.

[chillingu69]

Could just be on the velious server? And not on blue. Idk tho, not familiar with the chardok thing too well.

[Gimp]

OP try casting in order of level and see if that works

Didn't work

[Skittlez]

This really hurts enchanter soloing as well.

Most likely an unintentional change from some other fix - enchanter stuns stacking has always worked on Live and still does.

How does this hurt enchanter soloing? I don't ever use my stuns. I am only level 30 though.

[Gimp]

How does this hurt enchanter soloing? I don't ever use my stuns. I am only level 30 though.

Stuns are our second most useful spells, behind mezzes. I don't know how you're 30 and don't have Color Shift memmed 100% of the time.

[Raev]

I don't see why them failing to stack would affect soloing though unless you can't mez a stunned mob or something.

[Skittlez]

Stuns are our second most useful spells, behind mezzes. I don't know how you're 30 and don't have Color Shift memmed 100% of the time.

Honestly I never feel like I have spare room for that spell. Right now I use Sanity Warp/Chaos Flux/enstill/beguile/mez, calm, or enthrall/clarity/invis/ with one empty spot thaat I rotate depending on situation. Oh wait no, I usually use Tash, sorry Clarity is my rotating spell.

What exactly do you use Color Shift so much for?

[Nisei]

Honestly I never feel like I have spare room for that spell. Right now I use Sanity Warp/Chaos Flux/enstill/beguile/mez, calm, or enthrall/clarity/invis/ with one empty spot thaat I rotate depending on situation.

What exactly do you use Color Shift so much for?

its k just reroll

[Domisk]

Ok, from what I remember stun always would land and override the previous stun as in a 2 sec would override an 8 sec stun and vice versa. The only time I would see a stun immunity was in PVP, there was a small timer that you could not be stunned again. Here is as far back as I can find relevant information about the subject so far concerning PVE.

http://www.elitegamerslounge.com/home/soearchive/viewtopic.php?f=164&t=56604


The bottom poster says what I remember.

[Gimp]

Two nukes memmed?

Why?

[Skittlez]

its k just reroll

Mind you the only xp'ing I do on my enchanter is soloing. Charming Iksar Exiles atm to be specific. I do not see how a AE stun is useful in a similar scenario.

Once in a blue moon I will group up and use my stuns and just pull all the CC out. Charming, going pure offensive. Never realized that was wrong?

[Skittlez]

Two nukes memmed?

Why?

I have them both up to save mana depending on the mobs life after I break charm. Saves a lot of mana and time. One I use when below 12%, and the other when they are below 25%.

[Gimp]

My lineup off the top of my head:

Theft of thought
AE Mez
Charm
Bedlam/Calm/Skew/other buffs and shit
Tash/AE tash depending on situation
Color slant
Entrance/Mesmerize
Fetter

[Gimp]

Stuns are very useful for charm breaks, calm crit resists, Mez resists, and a ton of other situations.

[khanable]

unintended effects of this?

Haynar: Made some spell stacking more classic, for refreshing identical spells. The old spell will be faded first, and new spell will be put into lowest slot.

Sounds like it.

Bug report it dawgs

[Nisei]

I cringe every time I see Enchanters dealing with charm breaks using Mez or Root as their first defense. Sooooo baaaaad.

[Raev]

Mind you the only xp'ing I do on my enchanter is soloing. Charming Iksar Exiles atm to be specific. I do not see how a AE stun is useful in a similar scenario.

Color skew casts in 1.5 seconds, while mez and root cast in 2.5 Therefore you will take significantly less damage with stun+mez/root than with mez/root directly.

[Gimp]

Skew is 2.0, slant and shift are 1.5 (I'm fairly sure). I know skew is a slightly longer cast.

[Xaleban]

How can you be a chanter and not have some form of the stun line up? It always annoys me when I see chanters who use Mez on a charm break. You can just stun/tash/charm without ever getting hit and send pet right back to DPSing instead of waiting for Mez to wear off. My normal spell line when soloing is usually...

Tash
Stun
Charm
Mez
AoE mez
ToT
Bedlam
Self buff slot (C/E/Rune/etc)

[iruinedyourday]

guys all enchanters should have enthrall in slot 1 cus secrets.

[Nisei]

How can you be a chanter and not have some form of the stun line up? It always annoys me when I see chanters who use Mez on a charm break. You can just stun/tash/charm without ever getting hit and send pet right back to DPSing instead of waiting for Mez to wear off. My normal spell line when soloing is usually...

Tash
Stun
Charm
Mez
AoE mez
ToT
Bedlam
Self buff slot (C/E/Rune/etc)
I always loved having a static duo partner in a Cleric since 28. As soon as Charm broke, he was on the ball with his stuns every time.

[maurilax]

I just duck cast boltrans waiting for breaks. yolo

[Widan]

This doesn't affect enchanter soloing at all.

[Raev]

Skew is 2.0, slant and shift are 1.5 (I'm fairly sure). I know skew is a slightly longer cast.

err you are right, skew is the 44th one. I'm thinking of shift maybe, or whatever the L20 one is.

[Pint]

In hindsight its kind of a bummer that you tipped everyone off instead of letting the first ae grp tear each other apart pointing fingers in every direction possible

[Haynar]

Oh man. Did I break Chardok AE again? Wasn't totally intentional. Was something I kind of didn't check.

However. I know where its broke and how to accomplish what I was trying.

H

[mwatt]

I'd not cry. Chardok has become an abomination.

[Pheer]

Oh man. Did I break Chardok AE again? Wasn't totally intentional. Was something I kind of didn't check.

However. I know where its broke and how to accomplish what I was trying.

H

dont you dare do it haynar

stop

dont





no










plz

[khanable]

Oh man. Did I break Chardok AE again? Wasn't totally intentional. Was something I kind of didn't check.

However. I know where its broke and how to accomplish what I was trying.

H

take your time

:D

[Domisk]

Bug report was sent.

[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Level 20 skew with GCD works for most situations.

[Malrubius]

Does this mean Chardok is available for normal players again? :)

[Nisei]

Does this mean Chardok is available for normal players again? :)

Nice signature, what year is that from?

[Malrubius]

Nice signature, what year is that from?
Thx, late 2001 or very early 2002.

[iruinedyourday]

Thx, late 2001 or very early 2002.

it is one of the best sigs and especially sig avatar combo, that ive ever seen :)

[Malrubius]

it is one of the best sigs and especially sig avatar combo, that ive ever seen :)

I owe it all to Kleat and the others like him in EC tunnel every day. Well, not today...or yesterday. Or the day before that. Or the day before that either. ;)

[Byrjun]

Does this mean Chardok is available for normal players again? :)

People always say this when Chardok AE topics come up, and you have all the people posting saying they're glad Chardok AE is "nerfed" ... I don't get it. If someone is AEing in Chardok it's not affecting you. Remember how many groups went and exped in Chardok the last time AE was broken? Zero. Over like 2 weeks and not a single group in the zone.

In fact Chardok is available for you to go play in right now. It's been clearly stated that a group can't monopolize an entire zone. If you bring a group into Chardok you have every right to exp wherever you want. If you get trained by the AE group, GMs should rule in your favor given the stated camp rules of the server and other past comments made about that exact situation.

I play a shaman and I have absolutely no stock in Chardok AE but I don't get the mentality of wishing that people can't do things that they enjoy doing in a game if it doesn't negatively affect you.

[Gaxx]

Oh man. Did I break Chardok AE again? Wasn't totally intentional. Was something I kind of didn't check.

However. I know where its broke and how to accomplish what I was trying.

H

Don't lie. This was done on purpose and was intended to stay that way. Thanks Haynar.

Also please wait until the next patch 6 months from now to fix this so all the Chardok AoE poopsock monopolizers are butthurt about it for as long as possible, thanks!!!!

[Faron]

WTS SoS 15k SBS 10k Golem Tear ring 5k pst thx

[Dany]

Back in 1999, computers could handle AoE chardok pulls like today? Back then I didn't even know AoE chardok was possible, hence why I'm asking.

Maybe it was possible to chain chanter stuns, but could the computers handle that many mobs? That's what I'd like to know...

[sumguy]

This is good news. Now those nerds have to play honestly and real chardok groups can start up again.

[Gaxx]

Back in 1999, computers could handle AoE chardok pulls like today? Back then I didn't even know AoE chardok was possible, hence why I'm asking.

I could maybe have been possible to chain chanter stuns, but could the computers handle that many mobs? That's what I'd like to know...

Only thing I remember people AEing back in the day was Sebilis and it wasn't nearly as many mobs as they do now in Chardok

[Dany]

Only thing I remember people AEing back in the day was Sebilis and it wasn't nearly as many mobs as they do now in Chardok

Maybe that's why they've nerfed it? :confused:

[fuark]

real chardok groups can start up again.

Even on live no one "group" exped in Chardok. It was empty 24/7, at least on Tarew Marr. The zone is simply boring and the best drops are in Seb.

[douglas1999]

If someone is AEing in Chardok it's not affecting you.

This assumes that chardok AE groups have zero negative impact on the high end scene of the server (read: mass producing level 60's at rates unheard of in kunark era). I personally think it does actively affect the rest of the players on the server, at least any who already or plan to eventually participate in high end content. Guilds having access to fully geared level 60's in these numbers fundamentally changes the way the high end game is played.

[vid]

I remember grouping stuff on Lanys, but yeah it was almost always a ghost town.

[cyryllis]

While chardok AE might not have been popular back around this era on live, plenty of other ae grouping was done and this unintentional mishap will be corrected by Haynar like he said, putting stuns back to classic functionality.

[Gaxx]

This assumes that chardok AE groups have zero negative impact on the high end scene of the server (read: mass producing level 60's at rates unheard of in kunark era). I personally think it does actively affect the rest of the players on the server, at least any who already or plan to eventually participate in high end content. Guilds having access to fully geared level 60's in these numbers fundamentally changes the way the high end game is played.

This guy gets it. Chardok sucks balls as a zone in general but just because it would be empty without AoE groups doesn't mean it doesn't have a negative impact on the server.

[Aviann]

Any idea if this is effecting only the enchanter stuns since they are in what would be the same possible line of spells?

Cleric and paladin stuns specifically? I've yet to get a chance to simply walk out and try it before bedtime yet.

[Man0warr]

This assumes that chardok AE groups have zero negative impact on the high end scene of the server (read: mass producing level 60's at rates unheard of in kunark era). I personally think it does actively affect the rest of the players on the server, at least any who already or plan to eventually participate in high end content. Guilds having access to fully geared level 60's in these numbers fundamentally changes the way the high end game is played.

Maybe - but the damage is already done years ago. There is already thousands of 60 characters at this point.

[Trelaboon]

This will make Royals night more interesting for sure. And yes, I wish I'd stocked up on SoS and SBS lol

[webrunner5]

Even on live no one "group" exped in Chardok. It was empty 24/7, at least on Tarew Marr. The zone is simply boring and the best drops are in Seb.

Pretty much what I remember. :D And that was on Torvo.

[Swish]

Duo'ed on my cleric with an enchanter a couple of years back, was great times. Looking forward to grouping in there.

[fishingme]

Oh man. Did I break Chardok AE again? Wasn't totally intentional. Was something I kind of didn't check.

However. I know where its broke and how to accomplish what I was trying.

H

have you fixed raptor run speed in TD yet?

[khanable]

have you fixed raptor run speed in TD yet?

read patch notes

[fishingme]

read patch notes

Nice! Must of skipped over that part yesterday, thanks! Unfortunately I all ready went through the pain of quadding through greens to get my wizzy to 60 haha

[WolfsongReborn]

I was an extremely active player back during the Vanilla, Kunark and Velious days on Lanys up until Luclin's end. I remember guilds raiding chardok but something like these endless AOE groups really would have stood out and I simply don't remember them ever happening on Classic eq.

Luclin yes. There were constantly groups AoE'ing this one spot day and night, but I don't recall this really ever going on in Chardok.

[Nirgon]

Fungus grove got aoe'd is probably what you're thinking of. Threads were found proving Chardok should be doable.

But the threads suggest 20-30 mobs at a time, which I also remember. Here? Yeah its more than 30-40, don't know exact count on typical pull.

Then again our puller in Seb for aoe on live basically just pulled as much as he could into the zone out house... and I'm sure it was more than 30 mobs with the fore warning of "no illlis if possible".

[Bboboo]

Just because it didn't happen doesn't mean it wasn't possible.

[Erati]

Fungus grove got aoe'd is probably what you're thinking of. Threads were found proving Chardok should be doable.

But the threads suggest 20-30 mobs at a time, which I also remember. Here? Yeah its more than 30-40, don't know exact count on typical pull.

Then again our puller in Seb for aoe on live basically just pulled as much as he could into the zone out house... and I'm sure it was more than 30 mobs with the fore warning of "no illlis if possible".

AE groups in Seb during Velious was how I got tru 59 on my wiz

that level was so brutal I had quit for a while bc my bar stopped moving :(

however AE killing in Seb brought me back and I probably had more fun doing that than all my leveling adventures combined lol

[Velerin]

AE groups are fun. AE groups are classic. Pulling 100+ mobs with 6 out of group level 60s to plvl full groups in a big pp making machine is not classic.
Part of the problem was slower machines, but also the number was regulated by what 2 sub 60 enchanters (trying to get exp) could lock down.

[Bill Tetley]

finally!

[Velerin]

Since in p99 chardok groups the puller, cleric, and encs are not in the exp group, is it really KSing if a random wizard death squad come ins and nukes them down? There's one for the lawyers.

[Faiding]

Since in p99 chardok groups the puller, cleric, and encs are not in the exp group, is it really KSing if a random wizard death squad come ins and nukes them down? There's one for the lawyers.

There's an implied contract between the groups involved in the pulling/killing that create an informal organization that, in game terms, puts them in the same "group". Same concept as a raid.

Hard to enforce, but yes it would be KSing.

Lawyered.

[Ele]

There's an implied contract between the groups involved in the pulling/killing that create an informal organization that, in game terms, puts them in the same "group". Same concept as a raid.

Hard to enforce, but yes it would be KSing.

Lawyered.

My clients, wizard1, wizard2, and wizard3, collectively "wizards", were on a frolic in Chardok, the seedy lair of the sarnaks! The wizards were minding their own business when suddenly dozens, nay, hundreds of sarnaks rampaged through the zone attacking the gentle folks gathering at the entrance. Seeing these fine people in danger, my clients jumped in to rescue them doing the only thing they know how, blasting the shit out of stuff.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, my clients were doing nothing more than being good Samaritans using the only tools at their disposal. They can't be held responsible for gaining the experience points, as they saved these people's lives. You must acquit them of all charges.

[Erati]

My clients, wizard1, wizard2, and wizard3, collectively "wizards", were on a frolic in Chardok, the seedy lair of the sarnaks! The wizards were minding their own business when suddenly dozens, nay, hundreds of sarnaks rampaged through the zone attacking the gentle folks gathering at the entrance. Seeing these fine people in danger, my clients jumped in to rescue them doing the only thing they know how, blasting the shit out of stuff.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, my clients were doing nothing more than being good Samaritans using the only tools at their disposal. They can't be held responsible for gaining the experience points, as they saved these people's lives. You must acquit them of all charges.

If Jerry Seinfeld gets thrown into the slammer for not being a Good Samaritan, then these wizards absolutely cannot be punished for not being a Jerry Seinfeld.

[maahes]

AE groups are fun. AE groups are classic. Pulling 100+ mobs with 6 out of group level 60s to plvl full groups in a big pp making machine is not classic.
Part of the problem was slower machines, but also the number was regulated by what 2 sub 60 enchanters (trying to get exp) could lock down.

Wrong. Just cause you never reached that level, doesn't mean others didn't.

It is 100% classic.

[SamwiseRed]

http://i.imgur.com/CAepjyv.gif

[Man0warr]

Main reason the pulls were smaller on live during this time is no one raised their Chardok faction - so it was impossible to pull more than 30-40 mobs without dying (usually a warrior did it with disc, the rest of the group was 1 cleric 2 wiz 2 ench).

During Kunark, there was no reason to have Chardok faction except to make Royals CR easier.

Hindsight and better computers/servers make Chardok AE with 120 mobs possible, but the mechanics were always there.

[SamwiseRed]

Hayner vs AE Chardok groups
https://31.media.tumblr.com/66adbf352fb4151c171c5f2e2e2e319b/tumblr_inline_ndycbnvqSP1s82k0x.gif

[Thulack]

dont you dare do it haynar

stop

dont





no










plz

Wrong order. It's suppose to be:

No





plz





dont








stop!!

[toolshed]

This is awful guys.

Just in time for Christmas - when all these RMT guys are trying to buy presents for their children - you're going to remove their income stream??

Think of the children! Bring back Chardok AOE!

[zanderklocke]

Didn't Haynar already revert this change that stops Chardok AoE, or is this something else?

Haynar: Fixed AE stuns to allow better CC of NPCs. Kept stun lock prevention of PCs.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

if true, not classic at all. How am I supposed to knock out my essential AA's killing spawn after spawn of shrooms in Fungus Grove?

O wait, sorry. I forgot, on p99 ae grps are a RMT racket and strictly for gimps.

Still not classic

[Peacocky]

This is crazy, not that I care about AoE ... Nerfs scared players off ... Sony knows.

[Boilon]

WHATTTTT now we actually have to LEVEL our toons now? That's it I QUIT!

[Dany]

Didn't Haynar already revert this change that stops Chardok AoE, or is this something else?

Haynar: Fixed AE stuns to allow better CC of NPCs. Kept stun lock prevention of PCs.

I was wondering about that too, anyone know?

[Raev]

Just because it didn't happen doesn't mean it wasn't possible.

it wasn't possible for hardware reasons though, not wetware reasons

[teija]

Tried a pull earlier today, stuns seemed to be overlapping but resist rate seems to have been tweaked also to ensure more resists resulting in wipes.

[Ele]

Up the group to 5 enchanters! Can charge even more of a premium now.

[Peacocky]

And I thought P1999 was trying to be a true EQ classic?, now I am beginning to become suspicious since bard aoe mez is a joke in p1999. Also the hit rating and speed is so lame and for that it isn't anywhere near classic EQ.

Hmmm.

[mwatt]

While AOE grouping is not my thing, I have nothing against others doing it. However, in the case of Chardok it has became so commonplace that ordinary grouping is severely restricted. Certainly not the intent of the design of this interesting and fun zone.

Just because you CAN do something, doesn't mean you SHOULD.

[sox7d]

Wizards now officially declared most useless piece of shit class in MMO history. All pre-60 wizards now on suicide watch.

[Origin]

If Chardok AE gets nerfed, then nerf bard swarm kiting while you're at it. Same levels of gayness, same levels of zone disruption.

[Clark]

This really hurts enchanter soloing as well.

Most likely an unintentional change from some other fix - enchanter stuns stacking has always worked on Live and still does.

lvl 4 mez

[letsdance]

AE groups have the same issues as multiboxing.

[Dany]

If Chardok AE gets nerfed, then nerf bard swarm kiting while you're at it. Same levels of gayness, same levels of zone disruption.

Bard AoE isn't done in dungeons at least, less disrupting than a dungeons aka Chardok AoE.

And I don't think OT and BW is a smart choice to exp in with a group. If you're alone, it might be OK but you'll have enough mobs for people solo. If you're in a group, go in a dungeon with good zem.

I'm a bard and wouldn't mind even if they nerfed our AoEing. If it's what people want.