Anyone here a Muslim? If so question for you...

[Peatree]

If so I'd love an answer to this simple yes or no question. "Can a Muslim peacefully co-exist w/ someone of a different faith - yes or no?"

Me as a Christian I can answer that as a resounding "Yes". However, I have asked it countless times to other Muslims and I never get a straight yes or no answer. It's always some sort of rabble.

I'm certain I am about to get all sorts of interesting responses here, so let the debate begin.

Merry Christmas all! :D

[Priceline]

I was technically part of the Bahá'í (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%AD_Faith) faith until I turned 18, born into it. They could definitely coexist as these folks are mostly hippies and lesbians who jumped on board when it became popular in the 70's.

Did you ever have those assemblies in junior/high school where these teens would dress all in black, with drug/sex type slogans on their backs, and this girl in the middle would act out this scene of getting pushed around and tormented by them.. all while "Total Eclipse of the Heart" was blasting? Those were usually Bahá'í youth groups doing those.

I would argue "Christians" could not though because the majority that I've met are more pushy then vegans.

[Peatree]

I do agree that some Christians and all Vegans are pushy, however, typically neither will cut your head off if you do not "convert" to their particular diet.

[Priceline]

most muslim's wouldn't do that either, just the crazies.

opinions incoming!

[loramin]

There is no one "Muslim" faith: Islam, like Christianity, has many different variations. Asking what Muslims believe is like asking "what do Christians think about ___?"

Unless you ask something really basic (ie. "was Jesus the son of God") you'll get a different answer from a Mormon than from an Episcopalian than from a Lutheran than from a Catholic than from a ...

[Glenzig_]

troll topic is troll

people can't get along. kids dont get along. people are big kids. sometimes an adult needs to spank the kids.

religion isnt important. people's disturbed minds will always find a way to create conflict... and that wont change if you pray away the gay

i pray you find the truth

[Buzzed Killer]

If so I'd love an answer to this simple yes or no question. "Can a Muslim peacefully co-exist w/ someone of a different faith - yes or no?"

If you asked that same question 1000 years ago about your own faith, the answer would be absolutely not.


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades (Normally don't site wiki, buts its ez ATM)

A lot more brainwashing has happened since though.

[Glenzig_]

oh wow what a student of history! so smart he joined the enlisted ranks of the slaves and now drops science on an elf sim board!!!

ROR here hateraid this is what i have planned for you buddy

http://www.amazon.com/Master-Series-Stainless-Urethral-Stretcher/dp/B00FGAOH3A/ref=pd_sim_sbs_bt_1/187-0695827-7845326?ie=UTF8&refRID=0N65BWRQNQHQT8RQS45C

This exquisitely excruciating piece will spread you open and leave you completely at their mercy. Designed to be inserted into the urethra, the two rounded spreader arms are suspended from a threaded bar. Twist the center nuts open as far as you think you can stand to get started. Then, as you tighten down the outer wing nuts, the arms will be pulled further and further apart, forcibly dilating your urethral opening. Measurements: Head ring measures 1.25 inches in diameter, spreader arms measure 1.25 inches in length and 0.11 inches in diameter, arms spread to a maximum width of 1.04 inches. Material: Stainless steel.

[katrik]

I think you're confusing extremists with the religion as a whole. Islamic state/Al'Qaeda do not represent the faith justly at all. Don't hate culture, don't confuse it with extremism. My humble faggot opinion.

[KagatobLuvsAnimu]

There is no one "Muslim" faith: Islam, like Christianity, has many different variations. Asking what Muslims believe is like asking "what do Christians think about ___?"

Unless you ask something really basic (ie. "was Jesus the son of God") you'll get a different answer from a Mormon than from an Episcopalian than from a Lutheran than from a Catholic than from a ...

What this guy said.

[myriverse]

I do agree that some Christians and all Vegans are pushy, however, typically neither will cut your head off if you do not "convert" to their particular diet.
Yeah, not so much in this century.

But guess what? 99% of Muslims don't either.

[Dillian]

Ouch Glenzig just ouch. but i rofled at it. im surprised super spigger aka hateraid hasnt responded yet.

[Sidelle]

If so I'd love an answer to this simple yes or no question. "Can a Muslim peacefully co-exist w/ someone of a different faith - yes or no?"

Me as a Christian I can answer that as a resounding "Yes". However, I have asked it countless times to other Muslims and I never get a straight yes or no answer. It's always some sort of rabble.

I'm certain I am about to get all sorts of interesting responses here, so let the debate begin.

Merry Christmas all! :D
I think it's possible, BUT.... keep what happened during the Bosnian War (https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~bonne20s/causes.html) in mind. The Serbs (Orthodox Christians) and Bosniaks (Muslims) were friends and neighbors to each other, from the smallest villages to the bigger cities -- but that changed literally overnight when the Serbs turned on the Bosniaks. It ended with the worst genocide since the Holocaust in WWII. Concentration camps, rape camps, mass executions, mass graves... all of it. It was really awful to read the accounts of Bosniak survivors, who were so completely shocked as they were forced to witness their Serbian "friends & neighbors" systematically rape and murder their loved ones.

Hmm, maybe it's not all that possible after all...

Did you ever have those assemblies in junior/high school where these teens would dress all in black, with drug/sex type slogans on their backs, and this girl in the middle would act out this scene of getting pushed around and tormented by them.. all while "Total Eclipse of the Heart" was blasting? Those were usually Bahá'í youth groups doing those.
^^^LOL

[Swish]

Bosnian muslims have been the beneficiaries of a lot of foreign investment from places like Saudi Arabia and Iran over the last 10 years or so to build some decadent looking mosques... they're doing okay. There'll always be an undercurrent of hated there though.

The Serbs main problems at the moment is that there are an ever growing amount of Albanians crossing the border and living in Serbia.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dearborn,_Michigan

No mass violence, YET! :P

[Sidelle]

Bosnian muslims have been the beneficiaries of a lot of foreign investment from places like Saudi Arabia and Iran over the last 10 years or so to build some decadent looking mosques... they're doing okay. There'll always be an undercurrent of hated there though.

The Serbs main problems at the moment is that there are an ever growing amount of Albanians crossing the border and living in Serbia.
I should have mentioned above that I've only just scratched the surface -- i.e. total noob about this subject. Back when it happened I never heard much about it (didn't care about politics or watching the news, other countries and their conflicts, etc) so now I'm trying to learn more about it on my own. I haven't quite gotten to the years since the conflict ended but it's good that they're doing reasonably well now.

[skootr]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dearborn,_Michigan

No mass violence, YET! :P

Dearbornistan, what a shithole that place has turned into.

[wwoneo]

I can't speak for the people who believe in the Muslim faith. However, the Quran does in several places preach death to the infidels. You can google it yourself to find exact verses and phrasing (Infidels are people who are not Muslim).

[loramin]

I can't speak for the people who believe in the Muslim faith. However, the Quran does in several places preach death to the infidels. You can google it yourself to find exact verses and phrasing (Infidels are people who are not Muslim).

The bible preaches death to rebellious teenagers (Deuteronomy 21:18-21) ... but I doubt you'll find a Christian pastor who's rounding up the town to stone Billy to death for partying too hard.

Point being: you can't (as illogically as this sounds) judge a faith based solely on its religious text(s).

[Priceline]

never read the Bible myself but doesn't the old testament have like 1000 things you're supposed to stone people for? from cutting your hair to eating fish on a Saturday, etc..

[Misto]

The bible preaches death to rebellious teenagers (Deuteronomy 21:18-21) ... but I doubt you'll find a Christian pastor who's rounding up the town to stone Billy to death for partying too hard.

Point being: you can't (as illogically as this sounds) judge a faith based solely on its religious text(s).

I can, if they act on it.

Which they do.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/ec/22/ac/ec22ac53e7981dc7d5ad53de4131ddf6.jpg

[loramin]

I can, if they act on it.

Which they do.


So then you're judging them on their actions, not on their holy text, right? ;)

/ruleslawyer

[Bbobo_]

naw

if you wave a flag and claim a set
you better know what ur reppin

ur ignorance is not my problem unless u tell me im wrong because of ur opinion (which is what religion is, opinion)

put up a banner take what comes

saying you are ANY religion means "I have not thought critically enough about these issues" .. 100% i can assume that about anyone claiming to be religous.. either they wont or CANT think for themselves

[mgellan]

Point being: you can't (as illogically as this sounds) judge a faith based solely on its religious text(s).

Most sensible people cherry pick from their religious texts and ignore things that violate the secular moral principles that are codified in laws to avoid running afoul of the society they live in. So, despite the bat-shit crazy stuff in their books, they generally behave themselves UNLESS put in a situation where they can get away with it, whereupon they start acting in accordance with their book eg Saudi Arabia, Iran etc.

If Evangelical Christians manage to turn their country into a Theocracy, I'm pretty sure we'd see stonings of adulterers and homosexuals in the streets of the USA.

But Merry Christmas anyway, I'll enjoy my completely secular holiday this week :)

Regards,
Mg

[falendar]

They can if they choose, if you are going by text, the old testament was succeeded by the new and that's how Christians are now allowed to eat pork wear polyester ect ( yes polyester was banned in the OT) . but the Qur'an never has this so extremists still rely on the kill all who will not convert text. I am religious but I refuse to follow a book written by man because it will inevitably have been corrupted by the writer. the bible and Qur'an both are written by man and in both instances can be proven to have parts written to benefit the writer.

[Dillian]

I can, if they act on it.

Which they do.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/ec/22/ac/ec22ac53e7981dc7d5ad53de4131ddf6.jpg

Is that danny devito on the left? He just kinda looks like he is trance or something lol, also what is red all over his shirt. Maybe he had a stroke and is bleeding from the ear.

[Tasslehofp99]

Is that danny devito on the left? He just kinda looks like he is trance or something lol, also what is red all over his shirt. Maybe he had a stroke and is bleeding from the ear.

lol if you haven't seen that show, you're missing out!

It is danny DeVito, though.

[Patriam1066]

I should have mentioned above that I've only just scratched the surface -- i.e. total noob about this subject. Back when it happened I never heard much about it (didn't care about politics or watching the news, other countries and their conflicts, etc) so now I'm trying to learn more about it on my own. I haven't quite gotten to the years since the conflict ended but it's good that they're doing reasonably well now.

Bosnians enjoyed a priveleged status, along with Albanians, in the ottoman millet system. Anyway, Bosnians, Albanians, and Crimean Tatars enslaved millions of Christian Slavs over the centuries. The Serbs took vengeance and all of a sudden they were the evil ones.

Doesn't excuse it, just saying it's not as simplistic as "Serbs evil Bosnians victims"...
Wver wonder how seemingly modern nations like France and Germany could fight WW2? I get it, Germany was nationalistic and in dire economic straits, but you can't simply create pervasive hatred like the Nazis did without something inherent in the culture. Same thing in the Balkans. The Catholics, Serbs, and muslims had been treating each other like shit for centuries... That doesn't end because Tito says so

As for you Peatree, merry Christmas. My father was raised muslim and he isn't violent, but he also is a lapsed Shia at best... I can only speak for iran, but anyone in that country that is an actual devout Muslim is looked upon with suspicion by the rest of the population (the majority), since Islam is looked upon as a tool of repression. I don't think nearly all muslims are evil. But of all the religions I would choose to belong to, I thibk islam would be the last, behind anime worship and cannibalism

Finally, Baha'is aren't hippies dude. The religion started as a revival of faith in God during a period when Shia Iran was becoming influenced by secular (relatively) britain. Maybe america Baha'is are that way, but I assure you the founding populations aren't. We're conservative... I voted Romney

[Sidelle]

Bosnians enjoyed a priveleged status, along with Albanians, in the ottoman millet system. Anyway, Bosnians, Albanians, and Crimean Tatars enslaved millions of Christian Slavs over the centuries. The Serbs took vengeance and all of a sudden they were the evil ones.

I'm having a real problem with the idea of any group committing systematic and vengeful acts of mass rape and genocide against their historical enemies because of enslavement and horrible treatment that happened centuries ago. Rhetorically speaking, by that logic, is it now acceptable or reasonable if native americans and black people started raping and slaughtering white people in the USA to avenge their ancestors? (I know you wouldn't think that way, just so you know. I've read enough of your posts regarding religion and faith to know better.)

In my opinion, nothing could possibly make that level of violence acceptable or justifiable. I mean holy shit -- the horror that human beings are capable of inflicting on each other is just incredible...

If I ever lose my compassion or humanity to the point where I don't even blink an eye at the idea of committing the kind of genocidal violence that I've been reading about, I just wouldn't see any point in continuing to live anymore. I still don't know if I believe in God or not, but if he does exist I don't understand how he hasn't given up and wiped us all out by now.

[myriverse]

The Serbs took vengeance and all of a sudden they were the evil ones.
Vengeance is always evil. All ways.

[Patriam1066]

I'm having a real problem with the idea of any group committing systematic and vengeful acts of mass rape and genocide against their historical enemies because of enslavement and horrible treatment that happened centuries ago. Rhetorically speaking, by that logic, is it now acceptable or reasonable if native americans and black people started raping and slaughtering white people in the USA to avenge their ancestors? (I know you wouldn't think that way, just so you know. I've read enough of your posts regarding religion and faith to know better.)

In my opinion, nothing could possibly make that level of violence acceptable or justifiable. I mean holy shit -- the horror that human beings are capable of inflicting on each other is just incredible...

If I ever lose my compassion or humanity to the point where I don't even blink an eye at the idea of committing the kind of genocidal violence that I've been reading about, I just wouldn't see any point in continuing to live anymore. I still don't know if I believe in God or not, but if he does exist I don't understand how he hasn't given up and wiped us all out by now.

Vengeance is always evil. All ways.

I Don't disagree with these sentiments. But islam is a force that isn't easy to fight back against since the Islamic world is so repressed that their only form of expression is violent extremism. I'm not condoning it... I've never done anything violent to anyone other than get into fights in high school like 4 times. I'm simply saying I wish you guys spent more time fighting Islam than you did trying to condemn the crusaders and Serbs, who are minor blips compared to systematic oppression by muslims against christians, women, Baha'is, jews, Hindus, Zoroastrians, Yazidis, and literally EVERYONE else they've come into contact with.

I am not going to become violent or lack sympathy for the Bosnians. But to be completely honest, I have way more compassion for the Serbs, armenians, Copts, Assyrians, and the Persians, whose only crime was being in the path of barbarians.

[Patriam1066]

(I know you wouldn't think that way, just so you know. I've read enough of your posts regarding religion and faith to know better.)



I know too many muslims personally to judge them all, to condemn them all, and most importantly, I understand that they are the ones most oppressed by their religion. Since I've made many of those posts, my family had our home (my grandfather died) taken by local authorities in Esfahan because my father married a Baha'i.

The house means nothing to me, but after being with my entire family over the Christmas holiday, I can see real pain caused by something as banal and asinine as this. Islam is hurting people just to hurt them. There is absolutely no reason for this form of nihilism.

I'll get over it in a month, but right now I'm more or less venting. Id delete my first post in the thread because I honestly don't agree with it, but that Would be a chicken shit thing to do and I am so mad at Iran right now that if I had my Quran on me, I'd use it as toilet paper, which is totally out of character for me.

Oh well, maybe one day people will get better. Until then, indulge me in my cathartic rage.

[Sidelle]

I know too many muslims personally to judge them all, to condemn them all, and most importantly, I understand that they are the ones most oppressed by their religion. Since I've made many of those posts, my family had our home (my grandfather died) taken by local authorities in Esfahan because my father married a Baha'i.

The house means nothing to me, but after being with my entire family over the Christmas holiday, I can see real pain caused by something as banal and asinine as this. Islam is hurting people just to hurt them. There is absolutely no reason for this form of nihilism.

I'll get over it in a month, but right now I'm more or less venting. Id delete my first post in the thread because I honestly don't agree with it, but that Would be a chicken shit thing to do and I am so mad at Iran right now that if I had my Quran on me, I'd use it as toilet paper, which is totally out of character for me.

Oh well, maybe one day people will get better. Until then, indulge me in my cathartic rage.
My condolences about the loss of your grandfather and for the injustice of what your family is going through.

Hearing about that reminds me just how fortunate I am to have been born in this country and to avoid taking it for granted in the future any more than I already have in the past.

[Glenzig]

They can if they choose, if you are going by text, the old testament was succeeded by the new and that's how Christians are now allowed to eat pork wear polyester ect ( yes polyester was banned in the OT) . but the Qur'an never has this so extremists still rely on the kill all who will not convert text. I am religious but I refuse to follow a book written by man because it will inevitably have been corrupted by the writer. the bible and Qur'an both are written by man and in both instances can be proven to have parts written to benefit the writer.

But all books are written by men. So you just don't believe anything?

[Rararboker]

But not all books try to explain something they can't understand or grasp.

[Malice_Mizer]

The bible preaches death to rebellious teenagers (Deuteronomy 21:18-21) ... but I doubt you'll find a Christian pastor who's rounding up the town to stone Billy to death for partying too hard.

Point being: you can't (as illogically as this sounds) judge a faith based solely on its religious text(s).

Except Christians interpret and involve themselves with the Old Testament in a very unique way. Christians do not follow the Old Law to the letter. Christ Himself overturned many conventionally-held beliefs about the Law, such as divorce proceedings, "eye for an eye" justice practices, dietary restrictions, etc. The message of Jesus was that he came to fulfill the law and hand down the primary commandments of humanity, specifically to love God and love your neighbor. This is why Orthodox institutions such as the Catholic Church preach against things such as capital punishment; such a gruesome fate is explicitly supported and commanded in the Old Testament, but you have to read the Old Testament in light of the revelations in the New Testament, which changes literally everything.

So, you can quote from the Old Testament all kinds of things that the early Christian leaders deemed unacceptable with the advent of Christ. Christians don't follow it to the letter. Not to mention that many Christian denominations (namely more Orthodox ones, usually not Protestants) interpret a large portion of the Old Testament as allegory and mythological/symbolic morality tales, or to reveal deeper, symbolic truths. There is an entire genre of exegesis (especially in Catholicism) of how to properly interpret the "dark passages" of the Old Testament (such as the one you mentioned), because they were difficult to reconcile with Christ for early Church leaders.

The Quran (and Hadith) on the other hand, is the authoritative Scripture of Islam that is both a religious and political/governing document. Islam is not some sort of belief system that is apart from otherwise "secular life." Islam was designed to be a whole system: governance, law, spirituality, family relations, etc. I could quote an endless number of lines from the Quran that are explicit orders of how to conduct yourself that modern audiences would find appalling. I mean, a vast majority of the document itself is vengeful, bitter raging against people. You can cite history where Christians acted in un-Christian ways all you'd like, but I challenge you to find a passage in the New Testament that obligated them to do so. You'll find that the exact opposite is true. Martyrdom in Christianity is to willingly and passively die at the hands of persecutors for sticking to what you believe in. Martyrdom in Islam is to kill yourself in pursuit of killing others for a political purpose. Christian history is full of wretched sinners, obviously. But you can't blame the source text for that.

[Glenzig]

But not all books try to explain something they can't understand or grasp.

No not all books. But that wasn't the reasoning put forward either.

[Brutal_X]

all religions are the spawnn of ignorance. no single religion is better, nor worse than the other. I mean, if you don't follow gods rules and "sin" you are sent to a place of eternal fire and suffering. Similarly, if you were not deemed fit in Hitler's eyes (jewish, gay, gypsy) etc., you were sent to be a slave, be gassed, or be burned. I guess the difference is that god loves you for the individual you are. sleep well padawan.

[Tradesonred]

I think it's possible, BUT.... keep what happened during the Bosnian War (https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~bonne20s/causes.html) in mind. The Serbs (Orthodox Christians) and Bosniaks (Muslims) were friends and neighbors to each other, from the smallest villages to the bigger cities -- but that changed literally overnight when the Serbs turned on the Bosniaks. It ended with the worst genocide since the Holocaust in WWII. Concentration camps, rape camps, mass executions, mass graves... all of it. It was really awful to read the accounts of Bosniak survivors, who were so completely shocked as they were forced to witness their Serbian "friends & neighbors" systematically rape and murder their loved ones.

Hmm, maybe it's not all that possible after all...


^^^LOL

Rwanda... jesus girl

oh right thugs (any black person) doesnt count

[Mandalore93]

None of the major powerhouse religions are really better or worse mechanically than the others. Everyone cherry picks whatever they need to justify their actions. At the end of the day however, I don't think religion is genuinely the issue the reason for the start of violence. It just makes dehumanizing the enemy a lot easier when you can shout that they're infidels while hacking them down. Islam is a bit behind the times due to a variety of reasons mainly the lack of a secular power binding religion like it did in the west as well as general instability in the region.

[Doors]

Even if religion didn't exist in any way shape or form human beings would still find excuses to kill each other. It's human nature to want to destroy not only ourselves but other people as well.

[Slathar]

"It can't rain all the time."

- The Crow

[Doors]

Movie so goog.

[quido]

We'd be doing humanity a favor by executing anyone who believes wholeheartedly in any established religion.

[myriverse]

We'd be doing humanity a favor by executing anyone who believes wholeheartedly in any established religion.
That kind of talk is just as bad as the religion.

[Doors]

We'd be doing humanity a favor by executing anyone who believes wholeheartedly in any established religion.

Yeah false, you sound like a religious extremist with a statement like this. That's there take on most things. Unless this is clever troll attempt.

[quido]

It's a strange loving god that stakes salvation on believing in him on bad evidence.

Why do some people swallow the bad evidence and some don't?

I think it's a mental defect meriting death for the sake of humanity's progress.

Pras

[Ennewi]

We'd be doing humanity a favor by executing anyone who believes wholeheartedly in any established religion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTX5dTCCOj4

[Ennewi]

They can if they choose, if you are going by text, the old testament was succeeded by the new and that's how Christians are now allowed to eat pork wear polyester ect ( yes polyester was banned in the OT) . but the Qur'an never has this so extremists still rely on the kill all who will not convert text. I am religious but I refuse to follow a book written by man because it will inevitably have been corrupted by the writer. the bible and Qur'an both are written by man and in both instances can be proven to have parts written to benefit the writer.

But all books are written by men. So you just don't believe anything?

I think what he means is, as with any information, one must always consider the source, be it a news outlet or a historical text or the back of a cereal box. Bias is inherent, as are motives. And considering that Muhammad, Jeshua and Siddhartha were all said to be illiterate, the source is sketchy at best. That said, the actual etymology behind what is written down, in respect to the Abrahamic religions at least, shares a common, unmistakable theme that gets lost in translation and, to a greater extent, interpretation.

Though dated, this documentary (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILPnG3kjO1k) pretty much answers the OP's question with the same resounding "yes"...at least in theory, in practice it's all going to (holy) shit. Good luck finding a copy of that documentary btw, can't even remember the title of it but do remember watching the whole thing in a Religious Perspectives course, which makes me an expert on the subject obviously :p.

[Slathar]

LOL NERDS ARGUING ABOUT CAZIC THULE VERSUS MITHANIEL MARR HURRRRRRRRR SHUT UP AND HAVE A BURRITO LOL




NEXT

[jarshale]

It's a strange loving god that stakes salvation on believing in him on bad evidence.

Why do some people swallow the bad evidence and some don't?

I think it's a mental defect meriting death for the sake of humanity's progress.

Pras

[radditsu]

most muslim's wouldn't do that either, just the crazies.

opinions incoming!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB3uVARNhmM

[Glenzig]

I think what he means is, as with any information, one must always consider the source, be it a news outlet or a historical text or the back of a cereal box. Bias is inherent, as are motives. And considering that Muhammad, Jeshua and Siddhartha were all said to be illiterate, the source is sketchy at best. That said, the actual etymology behind what is written down, in respect to the Abrahamic religions at least, shares a common, unmistakable theme that gets lost in translation and, to a greater extent, interpretation.

Though dated, this documentary (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILPnG3kjO1k) pretty much answers the OP's question with the same resounding "yes"...at least in theory, in practice it's all going to (holy) shit. Good luck finding a copy of that documentary btw, can't even remember the title of it but do remember watching the whole thing in a Religious Perspectives course, which makes me an expert on the subject obviously :p.

Yeah that's pretty much my point though. Bias will always exist. So if the basis for non belief in something is that men with bias wrote it, then there is nothing that can be believed or trusted.

[Sidelle]

Rwanda... jesus girl

oh right thugs (any black person) doesnt count
Lol what? I was using the Bosnian War as a devil's advocate example of fairly recent Christian-on-Muslim genocide. What happened in Rwanda doesn't really have a place in that particular argument, wouldn't you agree?

Sweetie, take a deep breath and unclench your bunghole. Lol

[Mandalore93]

Would someone please explain to me the logical basis to consider one's own religion superior to that of others? I am legitimately asking as I don't understand how that works. Is it based on statistics regarding education, wealth, and happiness? A view of one's own holy book being superior to another?

[Patriam1066]

Would someone please explain to me the logical basis to consider one's own religion superior to that of others? I am legitimately asking as I don't understand how that works. Is it based on statistics regarding education, wealth, and happiness? A view of one's own holy book being superior to another?

Depends what you value. But I don't think my religion is superior. I just think my mother is a good enough example to follow. I've read the Avesta, some Upanishads, the bible, and I like all of those in addition to the Kitab (Baha'i holy book)... I just don't feel a compelling reason to convert.
I've also read the quran and Old Testament, and think they're garbage. In addition, chinese religion focuses on obeying authority, which I don't respect. But I don't care what people believe tbh

Superiority never comes into it. I'm q Baha'i, if other people are different things, I really don't give a damn

[loramin]

Would someone please explain to me the logical basis to consider one's own religion superior to that of others? I am legitimately asking as I don't understand how that works. Is it based on statistics regarding education, wealth, and happiness? A view of one's own holy book being superior to another?

Your god was taught to you as the right one from an early age, and any spiritual experiences you've had since have always been in the context of that god. Other gods are just claims of other people with experiences you've never had.

So in other words the experience you've had is always superior to the experience had by others that they describe to you. Nothing logical about it, just human nature.

[maskedmelon]

then there is nothing that can be believed or trusted.

This ^^ One can only be reasonably certain of one's own instantaneous existence. All else, including one's past and future, must be accepted with varying degrees of associated uncertainty. Welcome to the reasoned world of a skeptic <3.


On topic though and to nobody in particular:

I think the fundamental difference people continue to ignore (though it has been pointed out many times) is the foundation upon which these religions stand. The teachings of Christ promote peace & acceptance. The crusades are example of the danger of empowering any institution absolutely. Doing so will necessarily attract those who wish to wield that power whether they agree with the principles of the institution or not.

The Qur'an teaches intolerance. Read it. That is a problem because even though many or even most muslims do not violently enforce intolerance, it is still a fundamental cornerstone of their religion. If you have not practiced a religion from birth (let alone not at all) you cannot understand the magnitude of this problem (for the rest of us). As already indicated in this thread, the Qur'an is not just a book of faith, it is a system of governance and while killing another muslim is sin, killing a non-muslim is not. Read it. That is a problem.

As for the old testament, well with regards to Christianity that is checked by the new testament or the teachings for Christ for which Christianity is named. So if as a Christian you are relying on the old testament to preach intolerances that were clearly overturned in the new testament, then your doing it wrong.

I'm agnostic, so no horse in this race, I just get sick and tired of the knee-jerk "Islam is a religion of peace" nonsense when people haven't read a verse of the damned book. Islam is a threat to the civilized world. It boasts the most robust self-defense and most powerful/seductive expansion mechanisms of any religion, with 100% intolerance of alternative systems.

[Ennewi]

The crusades are example of the danger of empowering any institution absolutely. Doing so will necessarily attract those who wish to wield that power whether they agree with the principles of the institution or not.

Agreed, as far as Charlemagne is concerned, but iirc the Crusades were more a violent response to an equally violent Muslim expansion over a handful of centuries leading up to then. This would support the claim that "Islam is a threat to the civilized world" except that mankind, in general, is a threat to itself and few, if any, are civilized.

I just get sick and tired of the knee-jerk "Islam is a religion of peace" nonsense when people haven't read a verse of the damned book. Islam is a threat to the civilized world. It boasts the most robust self-defense and most powerful/seductive expansion mechanisms of any religion, with 100% intolerance of alternative systems.

Is that you, Bill Maher? Don't make me dig through storage for old college notebooks just to "win" an internet debate. So not worth. If you really think that though, email the PhD below saying as much. Should be an interesting exchange.
Religion 102-H01: Introduction to World Religions (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCsQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Freligiousst%2Fr%2Fdownload%2F1959 52&ei=YiGlVO32DIObgwSL74LABw&usg=AFQjCNHlzzBLLkGKFXCQKHOAJyT4BY7Olw&sig2=pBq1mr5ZITfywAY-_Zw)

No horse in the race either, but it's infinitely more fun to bet on a Seabiscuit, in this case that just happens to be Islam, apparently. Tomorrow it will be Atheism or Socialism or...banana.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7m1h0Hf5uMs

[Swish]

Islam is a threat to the civilized world. It boasts the most robust self-defense and most powerful/seductive expansion mechanisms of any religion, with 100% intolerance of alternative systems.

Pretty much my thoughts. Always testing the boundaries of tolerant liberal societies - and ending them where possible.