suggestion - instanced TOV

[Bolix]

I think it would be great if, once Velious gets fully released and sorted, we could have an instanced Temple of Veeshan zone (thinking in particular of NToV)

Pros;
1. more fun for more people
ToV will be the top end raid target for every guild on the server. Everyone would love to raid in it. Say for the sake of argument 12 guilds raid capable of ToV, 1 week respawn, full rotation. This means 4 guilds a month get to raid it, then wait another 3 months before you raid it again. A guild will only get to raid NTOV 4 times a year. If it is fully competitive, then maybe 2 or 3 guilds are raiding it lots more, but the less competitive guilds probably won't even see it once a year.
NToV raids are great fun, make it realistically accessible to 600 people, not 60 people.

2. Drastically reduce petitionquest and lawyerquest
Read the rants and flames board, or even the raid board. It is full of people complaining about contested spawns, new rule sets. GMs I am sure are so bored of hearing about "he pulled but stalled, they trained, the tracker engaged etc.) NToV will be the same, but on steroids. Instanced and immediately this is no longer an issue.

3. Reduce the need for poopsocking
I don't think anyone really enjoys tracking for 16 hours of the spawn window and then coh-ducking to get the FTE.

4. allow for a nice work life balance
Most of the player base are adults with families and jobs. I want to raid NTOV, but I can't log in at 3am on a Tuesday morning to do it because that is when it spawned. My eq life and family life would be so much better if i can plan a 4 hour raid at a convenient time.

Cons
1. Not classic
100% true, it would not be classic. Having said that, on classic servers we would maybe only have between 2 and 5 guilds who would raid NToV. On this server, we have 12+. Our server demography is already not classic.

2. Lots of work for developers
This is maybe the biggest objection of all. Would require lots of work from the developers who are already doing so much work for us for free. I don't have a counter argument to this, just a plea to the developers to try and find the time to do this.

3. not competitive
NToV is the peak raiding zone, so it should be experienced only by the peak players who put in the extra work. Although I admire the dedication and skill of those top players, I think it is a little elitest if the top zone is only accessible by 60 rather than 600 players. The server is there for all of us, not just those in the top guilds. In addition, we can have peak players getting the benefits of their skill and dedication on the non-instanced peak mobs / zones (sleepers tomb, open world dragons, Kael, etc.)

How would it work?
Here is where I run out of ideas. Perhaps each of the 'top' raiding guilds would have their own instance of TOV? With one "open" ToV as well (the open one would allow for the top guilds to race / be competitive for this).

I speak as a casual raider. I would love to be able to raid NToV. I am sure that lots of the other casual raiders feel the same. So I am humbly requesting the developers to consider if this is possible.

Thanks

[Secrets]

no; not classic being the biggest reason against it.

there's plenty of other eqemu servers that cater to what you want.

[Life617]

Its better to think outside the box, people tend to say "not classic" with someting they don't agree with to sweep it under the rug. I cant imagine implementing something like this as being easy.

Also if there werent so many greedy people you probably wouldnt have even had to make this thread. I tend to see the 1% as the people who use the phrase "not classic"

Sometimes you just gotta move on though.

[Daldaen]

I have no interest in ToV content. However I do have interest in Kael, DN, WW, PoGrowth, Icewell, GD, Skyshrine, WL... can you instance those too?

See the issue?

Instancing - Though it was one of the best additions to the game for the reasons you list - Will never occur on this server ever due to neckbeards who would have a heart-attack and aformentioned not classic.

[Tuljin]

Fresh red server

[Blitzers]

Instances suck no no no

[Danth]

I don't like the suggestion because it caters to high-end raiders without addressing the weakness of the rest of the game. If you want to fix EQ, fix it for everybody.

Presently such a suggestion isn't going to get much traction. The folks running the server could put their collective foot down and force the raid guilds to play nice anytime they wanted to, if they so wished--no codebase change required. That they elect not to do so indicates that the server is operating as they want it to. As Daldaen mentions, you'd also have a lot of screaming and gnashing of teeth from those sad folks who derive their entire life's value from feeling like they have more pixels than other players on eq-emulator.

Danth

[Safon]

Fuck off with instancing suggestions

[Swish]

Fresh red server

with item loot

[Tiggles]

Didn't read any of your post.

But go away you casual scum.

[jcr4990]

No way dude. Batphones and FTE macro keyboard spamming 4 lyfe! Shits classic right gais?!? Who's with me?!

[Safon]

No way dude. Batphones and FTE macro keyboard spamming 4 lyfe! Shits classic right gais?!? Who's with me?!

If you don't like it, leave

[fastboy21]

It's a good idea, except for p99. Instances end game zones fly in the face of p99 ethos.

Now...the big question. Will waking the sleeper be allowed to permanently change the server. There was once real hints from staff that this was being very seriously looked at by the devs.

[HeallunRumblebelly]

red99 will basically be instanced ToV. Holocaust will be the only guild in there. It has what you want.

[Erydan Ouragan]

Not only ToV, but every dungeon should be instanced, along with planes.

[Veleria]

Do you know what game this is?

[iruinedyourday]

Not only ToV, but every dungeon should be instanced, along with planes.

http://giant.gfycat.com/BlackElatedHarpyeagle.gif

[Nuggie]

I'm a casual scum.

No thanks.

See other server comments. A lot of people play here because it's a classic server. Compare it to the pop of the easy servers. Evidence shows people like it hard.

[JackFlash]

..Evidence shows people like it hard.


/thread

[Bolix]

I do take the point that it isn't "classic".
But, we have:

FTE broadcasts
raid mob lock-outs for guilds
division into Class C and Class R raid mobs / guilds
GM enforced raid bans for breach of these raiding rules


None of these measures are classic. They have all been introduced to help improve the raid scene. If we can have these non-classic measures, then I would suggest it is also feasible to have the non-classic instancing.

With regards to picking and chosing instancing, or making everything instanced.
I know that this would completely change the entire raid scene. That was why I only suggested ToV as an instanced raiding environment. I suggested this as it is (arguably) the top end raid zone. I am not suggesting that anything else be instanced, only ToV.

In response to the comment that I should simply go to another server. Well, I really like this server, and I think the team running it are doing a great job. I don't want to leave! I just want a chance for me personally, (and for all the other guilds who aren't hardcore raiders) to raid in ToV.

[Pint]

This thread is dumb and you should feel bad

[Synthlol]

Why are there constantly suggestions to make p99 more like all the other EQ EMU servers that nobody plays on?

[Neno]

only classic features like variance on this server please.

[Rararboker]

This thread is dumb and you should feel bad

[Giovanni]

Frustrated with variance, mob rotations, and dkp on blue?

Holocaust is giving epics to level 1 recruits on red: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjUE7-QwjaI&feature=youtu.be

Apply now and enjoy Velious without waiting in line for mobs on blue: http://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164414

http://cdn1.theodysseyonline.com/files/2014/12/07/6355350964814109101061990564_sbucks.jpg

[MaksimMazor]

I just want a chance for me personally, (and for all the other guilds who aren't hardcore raiders) to raid in ToV.

No

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/60529240.jpg

[fadetree]

This server is not here to be enjoyable, it's here to be as classic as possible. Enjoying it is up to you.

[Nirgon]

lol tov on blue

no1 pull the shitty dragon cuz you'll get leap frogged and lose the good one

That is if you can get a cobalt scar key or even out of North Ro on launch... week

[Ryndar]

I do take the point that it isn't "classic".
But, we have:

FTE broadcasts
raid mob lock-outs for guilds
division into Class C and Class R raid mobs / guilds
GM enforced raid bans for breach of these raiding rules


None of these measures are classic. They have all been introduced to help improve the raid scene. If we can have these non-classic measures, then I would suggest it is also feasible to have the non-classic instancing.

With regards to picking and chosing instancing, or making everything instanced.
I know that this would completely change the entire raid scene. That was why I only suggested ToV as an instanced raiding environment. I suggested this as it is (arguably) the top end raid zone. I am not suggesting that anything else be instanced, only ToV.

In response to the comment that I should simply go to another server. Well, I really like this server, and I think the team running it are doing a great job. I don't want to leave! I just want a chance for me personally, (and for all the other guilds who aren't hardcore raiders) to raid in ToV.

Let's be honest; if the year was 2000, and this was a live server, most of the hardcore raid guilds would be perma-banned.

[Atmas]

In response to the comment that I should simply go to another server. Well, I really like this server, and I think the team running it are doing a great job. I don't want to leave! I just want a chance for me personally, (and for all the other guilds who aren't hardcore raiders) to raid in ToV.

I'm not trying to be an elite snob or anything but you have to understand that ToV was not a casual raider zone. The content there was not pushover content until probably end gear PoP. The zone takes a long time to crawl through, and will take a significant raid force. You should take that into consideration if you really do indeed want to experience it.

Edit: Yes this is a troll. But for anyone else who has this opinion legitimately my point is true.

[indiscriminate_hater]

A+ troll thread, even fooled Tiggles

[Secrets]

imo

http://i.imgur.com/L4X8VTz.png

[LordRayken]

I want to play classic Orcs, classic Frogloks ( with the old Guk models ) and I want a new classic themed Archer class.

Please.

[blondeattk]

This server is not here to be enjoyable.

thats SO true!

[maskedmelon]

Instances are awful...Accordingly, i do not favor this proposal. However given any expectation of consideration for implementation is naught more than delusion, my contribution in this post is largely irrelevant ^^

If we would like to continue our theorycraft though, i propose a limited number of semi-persistent instance-like shards (say 2-4) for raid zones a la the late VsoH ^^

[Azlani]

I do take the point that it isn't "classic".

FTE broadcasts
raid mob lock-outs for guilds
division into Class C and Class R raid mobs / guilds
GM enforced raid bans for breach of these raiding rules


None of these measures are classic.

FTE broadcasts are new as far as I know, but the rest are most certainly classic.

Different servers had different rules. For example, Terris Thule had a rule where the first raid force assembled in zone with a stated intention of taking a target gets first crack (so we called our targets), and the others had to move along. FTE broadcasts are in reaction to the lack of such an engage rule here, really, and is no different from a natural progression that might have been seen in classic era if a server wanted these chaotic engage rules.

To a large part, server rules beyond the play nice policies were player created. GMs on some servers most certainly enforced bans/suspensions for breaking those agreements.

Similarly, some servers DID have raid tiers to prevent the weaker guilds for just getting in the way of stuff they had no shot at, although it was more of a "you have to kill this before you can contend for that" type of thing.

Some servers DID have lock-outs. I'm talking along the lines of if another guild shows up going for the same target, and you killed it last, you automatically pass. Others servers had rotations, formal raiding alliances, and even periodic mobs reserved for server-wide pickup raids.

[Nirgon]

It is going to be horrible with leap frogging, insane lag due to # of players, idiots from other lesser guilds training shit that aoe's with huge assist radius etc

Let alone if someone clears all the Lord/Lady dragons then another guild snipes Vulak after the fact

Luckily red won't have this problem

[Daldaen]

It is going to be horrible with leap frogging, insane lag due to # of players, idiots from other lesser guilds training shit that aoe's with huge assist radius etc

Let alone if someone clears all the Lord/Lady dragons then another guild snipes Vulak after the fact

Luckily red won't have this problem

Because only enough population for 1 zerg guild.

[JayN]

how can this not be in RnF

[Eliseus]

I do take the point that it isn't "classic".
But, we have:

FTE broadcasts
raid mob lock-outs for guilds
division into Class C and Class R raid mobs / guilds
GM enforced raid bans for breach of these raiding rules


None of these measures are classic. They have all been introduced to help improve the raid scene. If we can have these non-classic measures, then I would suggest it is also feasible to have the non-classic instancing.

With regards to picking and chosing instancing, or making everything instanced.
I know that this would completely change the entire raid scene. That was why I only suggested ToV as an instanced raiding environment. I suggested this as it is (arguably) the top end raid zone. I am not suggesting that anything else be instanced, only ToV.

In response to the comment that I should simply go to another server. Well, I really like this server, and I think the team running it are doing a great job. I don't want to leave! I just want a chance for me personally, (and for all the other guilds who aren't hardcore raiders) to raid in ToV.

All classic actually. GM intervention was common among most servers in the raiding scene. Said intervention exists here.

Though I completely disagree with instanced content since it completely runes the immersion of the classic experience, it's not unrealistic to assume if amount of pop that battled for end game here existed on live during this period that intervention from the devs would of possibly been along similar lines, well, granted that doing things like instanced content wasn't out of their realm of knowledge and code at the time. That I can't say.

Anyways, back to the ignorant not classic spam.

Not classic!

[Bolix]

All classic actually. GM intervention was common among most servers in the raiding scene. Said intervention exists here.



I can only speak from my experience of one server (Rallos zek) on live. We had 5 or 6 guilds who were reasonably good about rotations. We had a pretty good record of making agreements about mobs and sharing, and respecting which guild was there in force. However, this was all by player agreement. I am struggling to think of anytime that a GM was involved in regulating this system.
Now we have 10+ guilds who are all capable of raiding high end mobs. Unlike VP which requires keys (a natural bottle neck) TOV is open to everyone at the start. So you could potentially have 10 guilds waiting for a NTOV dragon to spawn and then charging it, with all the (accidental or otherwise) training of other mobs.

In terms of "classic", my experience of NTOV was great. We gathered our forces, COHed to arry, figured out how to kill him (maybe wiping once or twice on the way). Then we had 3 or 4 hours of crawling round killing big dragons. The challenge was the mobs, not the other players (I still look back with disappointment at the time we wiped to Lord Koi-Doken at 1%!).

My guess is that the p1999 experience of NTOV won't be the same. It will be: single dragon in NTOV spawns, 10 guilds will have been poopsocking it, log in and 1 minute later its dead.
I know that lots of people are vociferously opposed to instancing of anything. I just think that it would be a way to improve the game for the majority (and I did laugh at the "its not here to be enjoyable!" quote).

On live, they are having a huge debate about instancing all raid content on one of their new progression servers. Although on live, they don't have GMs who are committed to the server and who do a great job at cutting out all the crap that they have on live.

TLDR: We have lots of non-classic GM interventions to make raiding less toxic. Instancing is a (major) non-classic change which would make raiding more enjoyable for the majority. i would love instanced TOV

[Nirgon]

have fun on blue

[skipdog]

Fuck off with instancing suggestions