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Cfullard
06-08-2015, 06:37 PM
Greetings.

My name is Lazintus, i'm a level 9 (Currently) Dark Elf cleric of Ministry of Hate (my 1 man guild). I'm an old school EQ player whose first server was actually the Vallon Zek server. I don't play on the red99 server because I personally don't find any appeal in the FFA PvP system. I mean no qualms to those that play there, I just don't see any fun it.

With that said there has been a snippets here and there of talk about a PvP Team server coming into the mix after Velious dropped. Now, I know it has not dropped as of yet but is this still a thing I can get my hopes up for? I would truly appreciate if one of the game devs took a second to give a solid yes or no to this. Not that I don't enjoy my little world on Blue99, I just would like to know if that's something I can look forward to in the future.

Thank you.

cmoore
06-08-2015, 06:45 PM
I would play the hell out of a team pvp server. Collecting elf tears in Liberation of the Underfoot was some of the most fun I've ever had in EQ.

Swish
06-08-2015, 06:48 PM
It's in the future someplace, it got benched so that the devs/staff could work on Velious.

Would love to see it too.

Evia
06-08-2015, 10:19 PM
I'd totally play on a teams pvp server! I'd love to see how they go about it. Either racial or deity or something completely different? I'd play it either way but I'd love to see them put a different spin on it then has been done before. Although I'm sure everyone would be eagerly waiting in the background to say "NOT CLASSIC!"

Troxx
06-08-2015, 11:19 PM
I would play the hell out of a team pvp server. Collecting elf tears in Liberation of the Underfoot was some of the most fun I've ever had in EQ.

I was in liberation of the underfoot in late 2000 to summer 2001

Lv 12 mage :p

I would totally play teams. If I remember correctly it was evils, humanoid (barb, hum, erudite), elves (not DE), and shorties.

In the end human races would arguably the best as you can cover all classes. Any other team has classes not available to them.

Evils have no Druids rangers or Paladins.
Shorties have no Rangers (hobbit ranger not classic), shamans, gnome sk???
Elves have no shaman sk necro
Humans can play it all.

That's mostly correct I think. For team pvp not a huge deal but raiding is a different matter.

I wouldn't touch red99 with a 10 foot pole.

To each their own.

cmoore
06-08-2015, 11:56 PM
I was in liberation of the underfoot in late 2000 to summer 2001

Lv 12 mage :p



The second coming of LotU?! Dare I dream?

Fleeimus Flaminbritches shall rise again!

Troxx
06-09-2015, 01:16 AM
No evil race bards
No short race bards
No short race monks

Any others I'm missing?

From a raw class power standpoint ...

Humans best
Shorties have no shaman buffs and only necros to fd pull. No bard songs.
Evils have no tracking but all fd classes. No bard songs.
Elves have no shaman buffs and NO fd innate classes.

Human > evil > shorties > elves PVE progression wise on such a server.



Sullon also had an interesting concept of good/evil/neutral based on race/diety combinations. I'm not sure how the teams broke down in terms of haves and have nots. Obviously good had no necros or sks and evil had no Paladins. Those wouldn't be game breaking from a PVE raiding standpoint.

Elves would be F''ked on a the racial pvp teams server. Pvp would be ok but PVE without fd pullers or shamans? Yikes!

Troxx
06-09-2015, 01:25 AM
Another thought - it'd be awesome on a racial pvp server if city guard faction was aligned by race. Not all npcs just guards. Humans kos at guards in Kaladim/Bb etc. shorties kos in gfay/felwithe.

Getting from one continent to the next would be a challenge by itself until you could port your crews over to invade.

Humans would have the home turf advantage with extra non kos areas east/west and middle antonica.

I bet most people would still choose evil. Evil races always more popular in PvP and RvR (warhammer) games.

Madbad
06-09-2015, 01:43 AM
we already have teams

Jibartik
06-09-2015, 02:42 AM
100 person battle inc, one team vs the other right now!

Jibartik
06-09-2015, 03:08 AM
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/25736152/EQ/teamsbattle.JPG

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/25736152/EQ/2.JPG

dcbone86
06-09-2015, 03:42 AM
Former VZ player checking in. Played with raid guild Red Pheonix as main pull, sk/eru. Quit shortly after PoP (ruined game for me).

IIRC it was riddled with immy healing and xteams, making you wish it was just red anyway. Very few guilds were pure - Dark Defiant Warriors (evil) and Illuminate (elf) is all I remember.

Clark
06-09-2015, 05:26 AM
It's in the future someplace, it got benched so that the devs/staff could work on Velious.

Would love to see it too.

iruinedyourday
06-09-2015, 05:27 AM
I wonder if Re99 is actually going to be Teams99 and when they merge it will allow you to choose your characters moving to Red or Blue

http://cdn.meme.am/images/300x/4661679.jpg

Deckk
06-09-2015, 08:03 AM
How would you do teams?

Evil (Dark Elves, Trolls, Iksars, Ogres, Necros & SKs) vs. Barbs, Dwarves, Wood Elves, High Elves, Halflings, Half Elves, Humans, Paladins)?
That's a bit lop sided...

Elves (Wood, Half, High) vs. Shorts (Halfling, Gnome, Dwarves) vs. Evils (Trolls, Ogres, Dark Elves, Iksar) vs. Humanoids (Barbs, Human, Erudite)?

A lot more interesting...

All have access to Enchanters.
All but elves have access to necros.
All have access to Magician.
All have access to Wizard.
All have access to Cleric.
Only Evils don't have access to druid.
elves/shorts don't have access to shaman.
elves/shorts don't have access to Monk.
All have access to rogues.
Shorts and evils don't have access to bards.
Shorts and evils don't have access to rangers.
All have access to warriors.
Only evils don't have access to paladins.
Shorts/Elves don't have access to SKs.

The shorts are at a major disadvantage here... As are the elves. The best team is the humanoid team...

Butcherblock Alliance (Dwarves, Humans, Halflings) vs. Faydwer's Followers (Wood Elves, High Elves, Gnomes) vs. Plague Legion (Dark Elves, Trolls, Ogres, Iksar) vs. Leftovers (Erudite, Barbarian, Half Elves)

Halflings don't fit well with the first group due to location... But the boat ties dwarves and humans.

All have access to Enchanters.
All have access to Necros.
All have access to Magician.
All have access to Wizard.
All have access to Cleric.
Only Evils don't have access to druid.
Faydwer/BB don't have access to Shaman.
Faydwer/BB don't have access to Monk.
All have access to rogues.
Only evils don't have access to bards.
Only evils don't have access to rangers.
All have access to warriors.
Only evils don't have access to paladins.
Only Faydwer don't have access to SKs.

Actually, the only team with access to everything is the leftover team.

Having said all of this... I'd be SO in for teams PvP.

Cfullard
06-09-2015, 04:11 PM
The original Vallon Zek server was set up as the following. Mind you, these teams are with Vel so there will be races missing.

Purple : Dwarves, Halflings, Gnomes
Yellow : Half Elves, High Elves, Wood Elves
Blue : Humans, Barbarians, Erudites
Orange : Dark Elves, Ogres, Trolls, Iksar

Some things that would be need to be changed for this to work. No healing, buffing outside of your own team. That, right there, was what killed the entire concept of teams pvp because everybody wanted blue server raiding and such and they said we couldn't raid without certain classes. Bullcrap on that, by the way, elves on Vallon Zek did end game raiding without all the classes available, so it's possible.

Renquist_VZ
06-09-2015, 04:26 PM
Orrrrrr

you could be a real rebel and play in a guild that used all four teams. That way everyone hates you.

Torrent vs VZ

Deckk
06-09-2015, 05:30 PM
What would really even the playing field are vah shir and frogloks. Could go three teams of 5.

Wood elves, high elves, frogloks, dwarves, gnomes

Human, barbarian, erudite, halfling, half elf

Troll, ogre, dark elves, iksar, vah shir.

Jimjam
06-09-2015, 05:34 PM
How about Gnomes vs Else?

Swish
06-09-2015, 06:01 PM
What would really even the playing field are vah shir and frogloks. Could go three teams of 5.

Wood elves, high elves, frogloks, dwarves, gnomes

Human, barbarian, erudite, halfling, half elf

Troll, ogre, dark elves, iksar, vah shir.

I'd put the frogloks on the evil team - fuckers raided Grobb and took over :p

Vah Shir were always fairly tolerated weren't they? Swap the two, but a sound idea :)

Deckk
06-09-2015, 06:24 PM
I separated the two of them like a referee in a prize fight. The dark elves, ogres and trolls teamed together to make the frogs move from Grobb to the new Guk. I don't see them functioning as a well oiled machine.

Rararboker
06-09-2015, 06:26 PM
Split teams by deity worship. Then everyone has bards.

Deckk
06-09-2015, 06:39 PM
They all have a bard with the way I set it up too. In fact, they all have everything I think. The evils may not have ranger/druid off the top of my head...

Vexenu
06-09-2015, 07:06 PM
https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120312

My effort post from awhile back remains the most popular suggested teams server ruleset (probably because it addresses all the balance problems noted so far in this thread, as well as many more based on experience with classic SZ and Red '99).

Cfullard
06-11-2015, 02:41 PM
Orrrrrr

you could be a real rebel and play in a guild that used all four teams. That way everyone hates you.

Torrent vs VZ

Any guild that uses immortal healers and calls themselves a PvP guild makes me giggle. Taking your 60 druid to Crushbone and powerleveling a level 10 or so alt in a fungi while he griefs the entire zone but is not PvP, that's just sad. That's pretty much the entirety of what I saw with crossteam guilds, somebody immortal healing somebody else while the defender / aggressor who was getting immortal buffed / healed thought he was pwning noobs.

Lock buffs / heals on the Team PvP server to team specific only. Make it a true teams PvP server.

Cfullard
06-11-2015, 03:07 PM
https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120312

My effort post from awhile back remains the most popular suggested teams server ruleset (probably because it addresses all the balance problems noted so far in this thread, as well as many more based on experience with classic SZ and Red '99).

Don't take this as anything other then what it is, words. The teams rule-set they set down with TZ / VZ actually was not meant to be fair. In all honesty, it was made so each team had a niche that brought them to the table. Evils couldn't get druids or bards or rangers / paladins but good teams could get pretty much everything until you broke it down by teams. Elves couldn't get monks or shamans but had access to pretty much everything else. Shorts could not get bards but had the highest majority of druids on it. Humans had absolutely everything, they were the most balanced of the teams as given except they were spread out from one starting point to another.

All the arguments I have seen for this have been from a raiding perspective. You don't NEED X class to group up and level. You don't NEED a class to do anything in this game. Illuvitae proved that on Vallon Zek by doing end game content with all elves. Does it make it easier? Oh yes, tons easier. However it's not a game breaking scenario to be missing certain classes like, ok here's a class people said YOU CAN'T DO PLANES WITHOUT IT: Bard. Bards we're quite literally the class that people said you needed in groups, monks being a close second. It can be done, and if you didn't have the class you would find ways to do it.

When you're making a teams PvP server then you're making a server where balance is not going to matter worth a flip. If you want' balance, go to red where you can have any race/class combo together to do whatever content you want and thump your chest and say you did it on a PvP server. By all means, go right ahead. I on the other hand would love to raid lower gun which is generally evil controlled with my purist elven guild while we fought our way down to assassin JUST to hold that camp against undead frogs and the hordes of evil.

Forget balance, give me VZ / TZ ruleset.

Speedi
06-11-2015, 03:11 PM
I would play a Teams PvP server, even if only to corpse camp Swish. :D

odiecat99
06-11-2015, 03:16 PM
It's in the future someplace, it got benched so that the devs/staff could work on Velious.

Would love to see it too.

love your sig.. as usual.. love all your sigs..

Kek

Mulek
06-11-2015, 03:22 PM
I'll believe it when I see it.

Daldaen
06-11-2015, 03:23 PM
Classic VZ/TZ teams. Cause that's all that was classic.

If mid Velious they want to switch to SZ teams, feel free.

One Tin Soldier
06-11-2015, 05:09 PM
A thought occurred to me while reading this thread. I probably shouldn't even post this because I doubt if it will be well received but, oh well.

It seems that team balance problems only really exist because of lacking classes for raiding. Sooo...why not refocus a PvP servers' endgame to PvP instead of PvE raiding?

How? Just clear the loot tables on all raid content. It's still there to kill but doesn't drop anything. Now it doesn't matter if you're missing classes because that content is "just for fun".

Then encourage home city raids by putting the good loot there. So the teams have to "raid" each others cities. Have some key NPC who has to be killed (like the King in Kaladim) and after killing him there will be a long timer to wait out (maybe 15 minutes or more) and then a loot chest or something pops up. Anyone of an opposing team who is still there to click on it when it pops gets some random loot.

The long timer allows the defending team time to mount a counter-offensive to push the invaders out before they get their phat lewts.

Thoughts? Comments? Burn me at the stake? Or just not classic?

Coridan
06-11-2015, 06:02 PM
I'm all for, but do Sullon Zek rules instead of VZ/TZ. The epic battles between Neutral and Evil. It was great because you could actually control zone access. Got ruined with Nexus Scions and doubly ruined with PoK.

Also, all teams get most classes (with the exception of Paladins/Shadowknights/Rangers/Druids/Necromancers). You can have evil Bards at least (Rallos Zek), Good (Quelious), Neutral (Veeshan) and Evil (Cazic-Thule) Monks. Good and Neutral Paladins/Rangers/Druids and then evil Shadowknights/Necromancers.

Cfullard
06-13-2015, 06:51 PM
The problem I have with Sullon Zek rules are that it helps Evil a lot more then it does Good. Those epic good vs evil fights you remember were probably good vs neutrals because the population numbers literally went Evils, Neutrals, Goods from high to low. Being good faction on that server was absolutely miserable, especially if you were not in one of the 'good' faction guilds. Not getting into a good faction guild meant very little grouping and a lot of soloing. When I went evil, and then neutral to try the factions out it was exactly like playing on Vallon Zek or Tallon Zek. I saw very, very little in the way of slowdown and Evils controlled at the very least about 65% of the server and zones. Neutrals controlled around 37% and 3% goods was very... fluctuating. I would HATE to see this move to a SZ ruleset, not because I disliked it but because it was absolutely awful if you weren't an evil or neutral player.

Visual
06-15-2015, 12:32 PM
Still waiting for this. Believe the ETA was spring of 2014 :p

Daldaen
06-15-2015, 01:07 PM
Sullon Zek was released Mid Velious.

If anything they should launch the server with legacy items removed and Kunark/Velious released to emulate classic SZ.

Or just go for classic VZ/TZ teams.