Charm Animal question

[Shaun421]

Is the Charm Animal line of spells useful at all for a Druid? I haven't done a serious amount of tooling around but it seems that no matter what I charm it breaks in less than 10 seconds. Even green mobs break charm.

I obviously don't expect it to work anywhere close to an enchanter, but does it work at all? I see that Druids get spells that are supposed to buff their pets, but I can't even keep something charmed long enough to finish casting the buff.

What am I missing?

[zt004]

What am I missing?

Charisma, maybe?

[karsten]

you need 200+ charisma to charm effectively, that also applies on this server to druids and necroes

[lyyfeleech]

They are correct. On this server cha seems to be the only thing that matters. I have purchased every piece of cha gear and can only get to 155ish. I cannot charm a light blue for more than single tick w/ 155 cha. Sucks that necros and druids have entire spell lines that are useless because of it, but I dont know if there is anything that can be done.

[Malrubius]

That's a bug, plain and simple.

Charisma does (and should, and always did) have a slight impact on Charm, Mez, and "a resisted Lull's aggro chance". BUT, for Charm and Mez, CHA is not as big of an impact as the mob's relative level, or, the mob's MR.

-Greens should very often stick around for the max duration.

-Light blues should generally stick around for awhile (no guarantees though).

-Dark blues can stick around for awhile, especially if their MR has been lowered. High CHA helps quite a bit here too and can make all the difference over time.

-Yellows will seldom stick around for long (or will outright resist the cast) unless you drop their MR through the floor (high level resist debuffs), *and*, have a very high (175+?) CHA.

-Low reds will generally just resist unless you crush their MR first, and, have near-max CHA. It *is* possible even here to get a full duration charm, because it has been done...it's just very rare.


To summarize, Charm resist and per-tick break chance rely on the following factors, in order of priority...
1 - Mob's level relative to the caster (hugely important).
2 - Mob's MR (very important).
3 - Caster's CHA (somewhat important).

I can provide old (public) posts from the original devs if it would help - although no implementation details (or hard numbers) were provided of course.

[Shaun421]

So is this a bug that the powers that be are aware of? And is this a bug that is potentially fixable? I'm not sure how high on the priority list this would be, just curious if it is fixable.

[guineapig]

From what I have heard you should have about 200 charisma to reliably charm on this server.

Haven't tried yet because I just haven't seen the need to charm anything while in exp groups and haven't bothered to purchase the appropriate gear.

[Hasbinbad]

CHA is not as big
*CObullshitUGH*

[Shaun421]

As a druid I don't really have any desire to try to charm anything in a group (especially if CHA really makes such a difference on this server). It would just be fun and helpful for soloing, or dicking around farming low level loot.

And it's the principle of the thing! I don't like having spells that are useless :mad:

[guineapig]

And it's the principle of the thing! I don't like having spells that are useless :mad:

Half of my class defining abilities are broken in one way or another...

Druid charm needs to wait in line :p

[Naerron]

i remember charming dire wolves and mammoths with my 55ish druid in WW all the time, had like 80 cha and it would almost always last max duration, i think the cha for charm really only affects chanters on live. not sure if this helps but i remember as a druid cha not mattering at all in terms of my charm. GL hope it gets fixed

[Witness]

just something to note. I started charm kiting the dwarfs at BB docks at level 28 as a bard with 163 charisma..as most know these mobs are level 35 and so they were dark red to me. I'd say my charm stuck for full time 50% of the time at that level. the other times it normally stuck for at least a tick or two. It definitely stuck long enough for me to level from 28-35 in a very very short time period.

EDIT: Something else to take into consideration, i died once and was bound at kaladim, decided to run over and try the dwarfs at the docks naked at level 45.. i have 110 base charisma and charm did not stick AT ALL, it would drop after 3-4 seconds if i was lucky. so level 28 with 163 charisma was way better on same exact mob level 45 with 110 charisma. gives you an idea how powerful charisma is.

[Scrooge]

Just fyi, charm was never meant to be a stable spell. Cha only lowers the variancy at which a mob can break free, but it doesn't eliminate that variancy entirely. I've had stuff break on me 20 seconds after (not very pleasant when it can tear you apart in under 10)...and this is with 224 cha mind you.

[Witness]

Just fyi, charm was never meant to be a stable spell. Cha only lowers the variancy at which a mob can break free, but it doesn't eliminate that variancy entirely. I've had stuff break on me 20 seconds after (not very pleasant when it can tear you apart in under 10)...and this is with 224 cha mind you.

I know, which is why I gave large sample sizes (level 28-35 for first, and I spent about 10 minutes trying to charm that dwarf when I was naked at level 45 and about 90% of the time charm didn't last longer then 3 seconds for second).

[Taluvill]

heh, glad i found this topic, i hope i can help = )

My druid is base of 75 Charisma, as should all druids be(i think), and i extensively charm monkeys in PoFear for our guild raids. not as much recently, but its a hell of a lotta fun. and its a very viable option, just carry around an obsidian shard, a staff of writhing, get it shaman buffed... ho - ly SHIT haha

My monkey owns in fear. You basically just have to think like an enchanter, always keeping the monkey snared, always recharming at like 5ish min duration, that type of thing, but its very viable and works out WONDERFULLY.

In full gear, vermiculated crown to boot, i sit at 164 cha. shamans or chanters buff me to 204 cha. if i dont have over 200 (i accidentally vendored a +5cha oppaline earring once. doh!) and im even sitting at 199 cha, it makes a HUGE difference. its like night and day, even on green con charms.

I went and was farming harpoons for myself and guildies in kedge the other night, went with a necro and a rogue. I charmed a fish and buffed it with everything,and basically sat back as my peircer raped everything,and the rogue basically just did work when the mob was below 50%. it was amazing.

biggest thing is to a) get over 200cha, and b) think like an enchanter that cant mez

Have fun dude. According to the verm crown, we were meant to charm haha :D

[Wikipedia2]

The spell does a check every tick (6 seconds) to see if it should break, based on some equation that factors in charisma, level difference, and the mobs MR. I am 80% sure charisma is "taken out" of the equation completely at 200.

Early charm breaks on an otherwise 'charm friendly' mob don't really give any indication of anything in particular going wrong. It has the same chance to break the first tick as it does the 150th tick. And because time is linear, it just seems like bad luck.

[Rael]

Whether it is bugged on this server or not, did Druids ever use charm often in classic? I can't ever remember using it, nor can I remember seeing anyone use it.

[Malrubius]

Yeah, Druids charmed all the time in classic (or at least some did). I have a friend who primarily soloed only in zones that had animals for just this reason.

[Nizzarr]

I remember.. I used to charm griffins in east commons.. invis/sow the griffin and camp near newbie orc groups! LOL good times!

[lyyfeleech]

As I posted before I have bought just about every piece of char gear i can get minus the tranix crown(but have siryn hood). My cha does not make it to 160. Necos start with something like 60 cha. I have never ever been able to hold a charm more than the initial tick on this server. I dont know if the formula's are different for the classes, but tho unreliable(as charm should be) it was still a useful spell line. Here that is certainly not the case at least for necros.

[CoolStoryBro]

I remember.. I used to charm griffins in east commons.. invis/sow the griffin and camp near newbie orc groups! LOL good times!

dirtbag

[karsten]

nizzarr's like super nice and helpful, y u gotta hate penoy?

[Auvdar]

Charming became huge in Kunark with druids. EJ was just a playground for us with the gorillas.

But even with my live druid, I still had to work +cha a bit to make it usefull. Can't say it had to be 200+, but I know I had to work it some,

[aresprophet]

Charming became huge in Kunark with druids. EJ was just a playground for us with the gorillas.

But even with my live druid, I still had to work +cha a bit to make it usefull. Can't say it had to be 200+, but I know I had to work it some,

With a total lack of CHA gear I used to charm kill stuff reliably in West Wastes. It didn't seem to have any bearing on resists or duration.