SK ... ogre vs SK

[Troxx]

Damn ... title should have read Ogre vs Troll.

Those of you who have made the hard choice, what choice and why?

Regen?
FSI?
Better stats?
Not being ogre?

Pros and cons, discuss. I have a level 1 ogre sk ... but part of me wants a troll.

I know that the best min/max is ogre, i just want personal opinions from others why they chose what they chose. Part of me wants a pretty dark elf, but the terrible starting stats and lack of slam is off-putting. At this point, however, not having an xp penalty at all is enticing.

Discuss!

[Jaleth]

There are many good reasons why people choose their SK. Some like the regeneration, frontal stun immunity, higher intelligence, higher stamina, green skin, scales, Greenmist or whatever floats their fancy. I personally like the versatility of humans, and hell I even spec'd dex. Do what you like, if you prefer to view your SK as a dark elf, pick your drow.

If I ever re-rolled my shadow knight, I'd go dark elf just for aesthetics, regardless of pros or cons. Roll what you will be happy with.

[Troxx]

If I ever re-rolled my shadow knight, I'd go dark elf just for aesthetics, regardless of pros or cons. Roll what you will be happy with.

I appreciate the input :)

[Danth]

If I was picking between Ogre and Troll I'd pick Troll every time. That regeneration would be nice when I find myself feigned somewhere at low health, while in more than four years of playing my SK I can't recollect encountering a situation where being stunned from a bash made any significant difference (oh no, I re-cast a spell, big deal). Large races start out with better stats--a legitimate advantage--but in the long run gear can eventually make up for most of that as well. The experience penalties carried by the large races mean that a level 53 Dark Elf is still stronger as a tank than the level 51 Troll for the same number of hours invested in the character.

Of course I'm not a Troll, I'm a Human, so I don't get either of those benefits. In the end it doesn't matter overmuch. My SK (its named Andoric, I think you know him) still does everything I reasonably expect it to do. Dark elves would give fine service as well. Pick the race you like because if you don't you won't like the character anyway.

Danth

[Mudson]

As a 60 DE SK I have always regretted not rolling ogre. Frontal stun immunity trumps all while raiding. Mana + gear for high end SKS are easy to obtain STA+ HP is not.

[Jfertal]

As a 60 DE SK I have always regretted not rolling ogre. Frontal stun immunity trumps all while raiding. Mana + gear for high end SKS are easy to obtain STA+ HP is not.

On live i play a dark elf sk strickly for the looks. I love dark elf. I love dark elf lore all that shit.


But min maxing, i love good ole fattyfatty, that stamina bonus is so nice, frontal stun. Slam when im using 1handers.

Even the facial features of ogres just crack me up. Now with velious there are a lot more stamina/hp options out there..

In the end this is a character you be looking at and shit, so it might as well come down to what you find more appealing.

Once you get your agro in that mob getting stunned once during a cast isnt going to fuck you over that bad.

[Ronnie328]

My advice, does the world really need about ogre or troll tank? Live a little a little. Boldly be something else. Skill matters more than anything. Play a dark elf or erudite. You might actually like casting several spells instead of being hampered by stupidity (lack of int).

[Froakula]

Well considering you already have a troll alt shaman, why not ogre for variety?

[Samoht]

Iksar.

[holsteinrx7]

ogre. stun resist plus fd/tap are really imperative. ogres have better stats. the troll regen is alright, but high lvls its not noticable. also trolls have -25 fire resist, which is a total killer. for this reason, and that iksar get ac bonus and a racial epic, the iksar is better than a troll, even.

ogre.

[Pyrocat]

Iksar or Troll. Too many ugly ogres, and regen is grrrrrreat. Only problem with Iksar is the travesty of a 2hs animation, so either promise yourself to always use 2hb or 1hs, or roll Troll.

[Ennewi]

well I mean, judging by your sig, you've already played troll a shitton. might as well switch gears and go ogre to have a different feel altogether.

[gildor]

OR go Erudite, perhaps Human?

[Dumesh Uhl'Belk]

the troll regen is alright, but high lvls its not noticeable.
At 60, Troll/Iksar regen 8/tick more than others standing, 9 more feigned, and 11 more while sitting.

People still pay 60k+ for fungi tunics for 15/tick regen. It is certainly noticeable. In fact, when I sit down after a fight solo to regen up, my health comes back as fast as my mana.... faster than my mana when I have my fungi tunic on my SK. When you solo as an SK at 50+, it takes 45 sec to 2 min to complete a kill depending on how high level the mob is. That's 64 to 160 more effective hp you have than a non-regen race during the fight. It also means you can take more damage in the fight without slowing down your overall kill rate because you will get the health back while you are medding up anyway at 110 more hp per minute.

FSI is great. It really is. I think Ogre shaman has a clear advantage over non-ogres for this reason, but for SKs, I don't see it. FSI might save you a few deaths when pulling in tight quarters, but I haven't had much trouble working around that, and I have found the regen makes soloing for xp efficient enough to be bearable.

[Uomanrotyr]

Troll all the way. FSI is cool, but not game changing. Iksars are also nice, but until you get high end Velious gear, you give up mitigation.

By the end, regen will give you the biggest bonus. FSI still allows you to be interrupted and stunned from any other angle and by spells. Unless you plan on running backwards while pulling, it's not that big of a deal then either. Most other stats balance out in the end, but more regen is always nice.

[Izmael]

What the two above said. FSI is key for shamans, not so much for SKs (unless maybe some particular situations...). It all boils down to the looks. I liked DE and Troll, went Troll because of DEs are too small. A shadowknight must be BADASS, not a wimpy, fragile elf who you could step on and crush.

Trolls look badass for that class (evil, asshole look), the regen is like having an innate half of a fungi worn forever, slam is a big plus.

The only downside is that you're big and in tight spaces it's a pain to pull, but you have the same issue with ogres, and shrink potions / AoN's do exist.

[OfftuneRZ]

My Ogre SK is lvl 39 currently. The entire time leveling up I thought in my head "Boy I wish I had troll regen, this is slow" until last night. I had to train out of mistmoore and I got to the point where I knew I was a goner and was going to die until at 5% hp I realized "HEY! I have FSI!!" So I turned to face the 8 mobs beating on me and casted FD. Guess what! I didnt get stunned and survived....Chalk this one up for FSI.

[Gilder]

The first character I ever saw in Everquest was my brother's Troll. Ever since then, I've thought they were just one of the coolest, funniest races of Everquest. It was a no-brainer for me to make my Shadow Knight a Troll.

That said, if we could make gnome SK's in project 1999, I would have done that. If only for the ridiculous factor of a little evil gnome.

[Izmael]

I love Gnome as race choice for necros. Cute little thingie who smiles at everyone and runs around wiggling these short legs... than freaks out and rises the dead from hell and kills everything.

[Jaleth]

What the two above said. FSI is key for shamans, not so much for SKs (unless maybe some particular situations...). It all boils down to the looks. I liked DE and Troll, went Troll because of DEs are too small. A shadowknight must be BADASS, not a wimpy, fragile elf who you could step on and crush.

Trolls look badass for that class (evil, asshole look), the regen is like having an innate half of a fungi worn forever, slam is a big plus.

The only downside is that you're big and in tight spaces it's a pain to pull, but you have the same issue with ogres, and shrink potions / AoN's do exist.

Not sure if you have yet, but you should check out any R A Salvatore novels regarding drow (dark elves), they truly are one malevolent, evil and cunning race. I used to think they way that you do, but if I had to re-roll, it would definitely be a DE, because although they a small, role play wise I rather be on the bad side of an ogre or troll than a dark elf. =)

[Troxx]

I've read all of Salvatore's drow/drizzt books.

It's a shame that DE have such poor starting stats, the lack of stamina I could live with but having to fight being encumbered while wearing plate isn't fun. At high end gear levels this is a non-issue, but you spend a lot of time leveling prior to this. On the flip side, being able to dungeons and not needing a shrink is enticing.

DE looks so much better in plate though, especially with Velious graphic. Leveling 15-20% faster is also pretty enticing.

Intelligence low or high is a non-issue. At level 1 my ogre sk has nearly 120 int with the sentient suit of armor - and I put no int into him at creation. That same suit on a dark elf would be pretty funny, he'd have higher int than most casters for a big part of his career.

[CrazyHorse]

Who the fuck are you talking to

[Tuljin]

Human if you want to be a real bad ass

[newagemystic]

Ogre is best due to stun immune, raiding or just tanking in groups, being able to reliably cast in corners with multiple mobs hitting you (FD in particular) is great.

I'd tag Iksar as the 2nd best, their Regen is better than Troll, but they also get a nice AC boost, and with velious plate being open to Iksar, it's pretty nice once you get to the high end.

Human is the best looking imo, never cared for dark elf horn helm.

[Colgate]

I'd tag Iksar as the 2nd best, their Regen is better than Troll

there is no difference between troll and iksar regen

[Qtip]

I went troll on my sk. Fungi+ regen is really nice. Bash with 2hd weapon is what put troll over iksar for me(play on red). I would go troll or iksar.
Only thing I hate about troll is the size when your fighting in solb or dungeons and you cant stand to attack.

[Izmael]

My 55 SK is Troll and I can't think of a situation where FSI would have made a difference (granted, getting to 55 is quick on Red so I might just not simply have played him enough).