Newbie question!

[Grod]

Hey, new to the server and I've seen quite a few camp disputes already so hoping I can get some questions answered here (if this is the wrong place I apologize and please move the thread! SORRY!) and avoid bugging the wonderful GM's in game :) Couple quick hypothetical scenarios.

1) A group partially wipes at a camp but several members can feign death and never die. The people that feign can kill the mobs/named by themselves, albeit not as quickly as a group however the majority of the group died. Can another group move in on the camp claiming a wipe or are the 2 people that lived enough to maintain the claim of the camp provided they can actually kill the mobs themselves? I guess there are many variations of this, for example, you could have a cleric that camped out and immediately returned before anyone else got there along with a feign death monk that could kill the camp, albeit slowly. Basically, at what point is a camp considered forfeit.

2) I haven't seen this happen yet but curious anyway regarding camps where casters can bind at the camp or quick recoveries. What happens if a caster is bound at a camp or right nearby and they die, but they respawn and loot their corpse before another person / party gets there or just as another person is getting there. Who gets the camp? Basically a complete wipe of an individual or group as opposed to a partial wipe, but they were bound nearby and got back there before anyone else or right as another person arrived.

Please don't bite my head off for asking!

Your friendly crack dealer (only place I can get away with this lol)
Grod

[who_leo]

Legit question, and I second the request for an answer as I am also a noob. What ARE your rules of camping? Are there rules? Who breaks them and how are they mended? Where is my complimentary t-shirt?

[RKromwell]

If folks lived...it isn't a wipe.

[Grod]

If there are complimentary t-shirts I want one!

[t0lkien]

Are camps forfeited upon wipe? It was never that way on live - not in my server anyway. Camps were considered camped until abandoned. That seems the most civil way to behave IMO.

[DOPE]

Are camps forfeited upon wipe? It was never that way on live - not in my server anyway. Camps were considered camped until abandoned. That seems the most civil way to behave IMO.

Exactly.. Be civil and all will be well ;O~

[Grod]

It wasn't that way on my server either but I've seen disputes on this server where the GM stepped in and told the person who wiped he had to abandon his camp (in this particular case the guy had been there and clearing it for 5 hours). Even though he came right back within a few minutes (before respawns) another person was already there and the GM showed up and gave the camp to the new person over the person who was there for 5 hours so this is definitely different then how it was on my server back on live.

The way it worked on my server was that if you wiped, you could return to your camp. The only time you would actually lose your camp is if the group was wiping and obviously couldn't clear the camp and even then people were courteous about it and communicated about it. Usually the first group would try, fail, and defer on their own. Basically if the group has shown they can handle it and simply made a mistake (maybe an enchanter went linkdead or something) people on my server respected the camp and allowed them to return, even after a wipe. (NOTE: Raid mobs were one and done but group camps were respected on wipes)

Rather then be courteous and use common sense people on this server have been quick to cite the "rules" and petition a GM and then it comes down to silly disputes which is ridiculous and a total waste of time for the GM's. Common sense would dictate if another group had a few deaths but they were right there clearing it before stuff even respawned that you wouldn't bring your group and try to move in over them but that's exactly what I've seen here.

When I was camping the AC in UGuk I was also killing the frogloks that spawn right around the corner (good xp during the 16 minute respawn) and several times had people show up and try to take the spawn from me saying I "wasn't in the room" even though I was 10 feet away right around the corner and the mob was currently dead. That was perfectly acceptable on live, I'm not double camping named mobs I'm simply killing spawns that are right next to the named I'm camping in between respawns for experience. People got quite mad at me, but everyone at least respected my camp and warned me about doing that. I had to come and read the rules and there are quite a few differences from my server to how things are done and contested here. For example, here you have to be IN THE ROOM whereas on my server most people actually camped names in the room next to it, usually a safer hallway, and not actually directly in the room with the spawn. The exception being when people were overpowered for the area in which case they would setup on the spawn but for groups still there for experience they usually setup in safer locations and not usually directly on the spawn (like the hallway in front of the King room in Lguk). The point being that even if you were around the corner people still respected your spawn, even if you weren't directly in the room.

Long story short, I'm finding out very quickly that regardless of the past, you need to educate yourself on the rules of this server otherwise you will probably at some point find yourself on the wrong side of a camp dispute. For some people on this server it seems far more important about getting the camp as opposed to being polite to your fellow player so some people will use the rules to take your camp (I've already seen it) and even though it isn't polite, that's how it goes here and the GM's will enforce the rules posted. That's why I'm really trying to figure out all the rules and interpretations so I know exactly what to expect in the various situations.

[Lagaidh]

Well that went from "hypothetical" to "I saw" in no time flat now didn't it?

[xshayla701]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653&highlight=camps%2C+defined
1. Going forward, if you intend to hold or claim a camp, your group must retain presence at that camp. If you have no competition in the zone, you are more than welcome to hold as many as you like. The moment another party wants to claim a camp and you are "farming" multiple, you must decide which camp you want and forfeit the ones someone else is interested in. We still expect players to use the courtesy camp check before zerging a room. If there is a full spawn of mobs in a camp room up I think that would be considered not camped. How you pull the camp is up to you, as long as you are able to engage the mobs very shortly after they are spawned.

....

3. The efreeti spawn kind of covers both of these situations, with this camp in particular if you are not at the spawn and another group arrives, you lose it.

4. In order to hold a camp, the player or group must be able to demonstrate the ability to hold the camp without further help.
*Example* An enchanter and lvl 40 ranger are in a group. The enchanter leaves to go kill frenzy and the ranger stay at lord. In this instance both camps are not considered held as the ranger could not survive this camp on his own without the enchanter.

....

Failure to comply and respect these rules will be viewed as disruptive behavior and players will be subject to disciplinary action. Please dont let it come to this.

Obviously the .... is where I shortened the post.

If I am correct, if there are people in your group still there (as in the cleric/monk example), you have the camp. However there's always gonna be an asshole who tries to take the camp, and if no one is there when that person arrives I think technically he has the right to it? The nice thing to do, though, would be to give the group the camp back. Generally GMs don't want to be involved in something like this that can be resolved with common courtesy so I would say to try to work it out between players before typing /petition.

[Dr4z3r]

One time here on P99, I was trio-ing the entrance to Paw, but we got overwhelmed and our mage died before he could zone out. With a third of our group gone (and, let's face it, the most OP third of our group in that context), we were obviously unable to keep clearing, and he was bound in Nek for no reason except to aggravate the rest of the world. Anyways, when another group popped in to try and start that camp, I let them know that we were still claiming it, and just waiting on our mage to get back. They obviously weren't happy about it, but they let us have the camp.

Then our Mage LD'd and never came back and I felt bad about it. :(

[Messianic]

This is a lot of text for a rather simple issue.

Plainly, there are no "rules" in the strict sense of the word (a means of enforcement, etc). There are gentleman's agreements that apply to most people on the server because they are self-evident and expedient rules (the ones xshayla posted). But note that there are people who will break them, and they're probably not going to be banned for it unless it becomes wildly excessive.

Beyond that, you need to operate within the frame of practical reason. Anything else will just stress you out and overcomplicate things, and probably eventually lead you into R/F/NSFW, which I don't recommend.

[Henini]

why don't you go do something else instead of staying there waiting for the group to wipe?

That's pretty lame...

and if people are still up and killing mobs... how does it trigger in your mind that it's ok to overtake the camp?

bottom line is. don't be an ass, if you see people somewhere move on to do something else.

there is a big difference between someone asking you to tell them when you are done with the camp and someone sticking there being a vulture just waiting for something to go wrong so they can overtake the camp.

if you are the later, go die. or get banned or something.

[Zarniwooop]

If you have a shred of decency, you let them recover and get back to it.

If you don't, you will justify being a jerk with lots of words and waving of protruding body parts.

Any other answer is a bucket of dung.

[Grod]

Well that went from "hypothetical" to "I saw" in no time flat now didn't it?

They are all different situations. The two examples I posted which are hypothetical are about partial wipes, or quick recoveries whereas the situation I witnessed was when a person died and returned with another player beating him back to the spawn spot.

[Raavak]

Give them a reasonable chance to rez and get setup. Act mature, be an adult.

[Grod]

I will always give people the same courtesy and respect that I want returned to me, at the end of the day this is not a pvp server and everyone is a fellow human being. I just hope that people use common sense and courtesy in their dealings with other players but the few bad apples out there make it so you at least have to be knowledgeable as to what the GM's will and will not enforce in terms of handing a camp over. I would never try to steal another person's camp on a wipe, but there are obviously other players that will do it.

[Trademaster]

Do you really need to check on the letter of the "law" on camps? You don't know how to be an adult and share things?

Sure there are a few highly contested camps, and the people that have them claimed will go nigh insane if you try to move in on them, but for the most part, live and let die. If a camp is taken move on to the next spot, You might find that the "best way to grind" isn't a definitive work and there are other options where you can have fun.

Remember this isn't WoW, where the game doesn't start until you are max level. The fun is right now, max level is actually kind of sparse for things to do.

[Grod]

I have never and will never cite "rules" to try to gain a camp from someone but other people do, and from what I've seen, quite frequently on this server. People need to learn to be respectful of other players and not try to abuse rules to gain an advantage.

[Fourthmeal]

R E S P E C T
find out what it means to me

[karsten]

Act mature, be an adult.

no

[Grod]

I had taco bell tonight, respect!