Abolish Enchantment (Abashi's Rod of Disempowerment)

[Gongshow]

Currently, the Abashi click isn’t functioning as it did on live. It’s close, but not entirely there. The reason Abashi was so deadly in PVP was not only because it was a clicky (no recast delay, unlimited charge), but because of the perfect storm of effects that the Abashi brought forth:


250 Range Dispell Click (This is currently working in game, or at least close enough to 210+, making it the longest dispel click in game – that’s good.)

Dispell Beneficial Only (This means Abashi skips detrimental debuffs like Rapture, Malo, Tash, Dots, etc. This is currently working in game – good.)

Dispell said beneficial buffs, RANDOMLY. (This is currently not how it behaves in game, and Abashi is only taking the TOP 3 beneficial.)

This is how I remember it back in ’01-02 on Tallon Zek. Thanks.

Kidding. Here is a bunch of comments (with sources) – mostly complaining about Abashi. Some of these comments are from longstanding PVP players on the Zek servers – some have even played, or still play here on P99.

1. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/a-needed-nerf.97695/

This rod is more overpowered than Wristband of Secrets was. Abashi's Rod casts a 3 slot dispell which hits random and ONLY beneficial buffs.

Abashi's Rod doesn't compare to any class' spells, not even enchanters'. You know how clickies are important to a pvper? Like we keep the insta-buffs on the top of our bufflist and click our clickies when we get dispelled. Get this : Abashi's Rod dispells 3 r-a-n-d-o-m buffs. It negates all efforts to keep your buffs up by going behind your clicky buffs, do you understand this concept of how clickies work?

There is a big difference between a debuff that takes all your buffs in 20 seconds and a debuff that strips nothing more than your instaclicks no matter how many times it is cast... Most spells are balanced around cast and recast times as well as the effectiveness of the actual effect. Abashi's Rod outclasses every other debuff spell there is in the game by a huge amount due to the combination of low cast time, zero recast time and brutal effect.

Dispells are countered by instaclicks, that's the norm in pvp. Abashi's make instaclicks worthless. Other dispells don't render all your buffs null and void.

Countering dispell with insta-clicks is an exploit. Some smart guy figured out that if you have enough insta-clicks you can bury your real buffs under trash buffs and be immune to one of the primary weapons that certain casting classes bring to bear. It's exploiting the way that the game is implemented, instead of playing the game. Frankly, I'm supprised that they haven't altered dispell to work like abashi's does to stop the exploit. So when someone with an abashi's dispells you, they actually dispell you.

I say, un-nerf the wristband of secrets, make it dispell "any slot" ( that includes detrimental effects as well as buffs ) and re-code pumice stones to work the same.

Here we go again comparing Abashi's dispell to other dispells. Have you not yet understood that Abashi strips 3 random buffs? And does so at an incredibly fast rate, 3 sec cast/zero recast. If you stand and cast your **SMURF**ty annul magic on him you will manage to strip his top slot clicky buffs while he strips you of everything you got. Golem wands are decent but do not compare to Abashi, they don't have infinite charges nor do they dispell random buffs, ie. can be countered by clickies. Bard dispell just takes your two top slots, easily countered by clickies.

This item needs to be nerfed because it is too overpowered. I wouldnt mind it if it didnt skip buffs, but it a 3 beneficial buff dispell. Thats just completely ********.

because it is 3 random buffs . Blubies need to get off these boards!!

As stated above, Abolish Enchantment is only more effective, not better. Pillage is a 4slot dispell while Abolish is only 3. One's random one is semi-random. Yes I've had pillage skip a slot now and then.

Abashi is not counterable by clickies, that's the point and you have to be ******** to not get that by now.

Yes abashi can be countered by clickies. If by countering it you mean make it completely useless and block all it's negative effects then no but about 70% of my buffs stripped by abashi are just my clickies. If the person continues to chain cast it sure I"ll lose all my non-clicky buffs but It isn't very hard to manage myself without buffs.

As for ashobi yes it is overpowered. Like people said earlier instas are used to protect buffs from dispell whlie the rod completely avoids this because of its randomness.

Even if you do compare them its rod 3 slot random dispell no recast to 1 slot dispell 10 sec recast.

Abashi's, same scenerio. You can counter Abashi's as best you can w/ insta-clickies, but eventually you are going to be stuck w/o any buffs except your insta's.

However, for sake of argument, I will use your example. An abashi's only has a "chance" to dispell that HoT buff from you. If you have enough insta-click items, of which you can have 8 minimum readily available to you in inventory plus any insta-click items that are currently equipped, the chances of getting an HoT potion "buff" dispelled right after you click it is very unlikely. If you continue to re-click your insta-clicks after each dispell attempt, the chances of that 1 HoT buff specifically getting dispelled remains very unlikely. That is also called PvP knowledge, and also call odds, just like gambling. The more buffs you have, the less likely that 1 specific buff will get hit.

in you failed "mathematics" you forget that abashi you will take tenacity , focus and brell first , now we need to find instaclick tenacity , instaclick brell and instaclick focus according to you wise "mathematics"

lets see, when i pvp, i keep about 5-6 clicky buffs up then my self shielding, lich and the orb of duskmold. so most of the buffs that are going to be gone are clickies, and i put em right back up

You would still get 3 random buffs dispelled, which may or may not hit your most important buffs. Would you still come and complain even after a recast timer was be put on it? My gut tells me you probably would.

abashi i think needs to be changed a little maybe adding a 15sec cast time for people who need there buffs for example shamans they have no time to re cast clickies thats if abashi even hits clickies it can go straight through

2. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/how-you-lost-me.188646/

Why did you give Abashi's Rod of Disempowerment to classes that were already amazing and well balanced without it? Enchanters are supposed to be the class that is good at dispelling people, but with abashi's rod of disempowerment any berserker, beastlord, monk, or necromancer can dispell people in pvp and mobs in pve better than an enchanter ever could. Enchanters never got a beneficial only dispell. Enchanters never got a dispell that was as random as the abashi.

3. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/nerf-time-again.116210/

That is incorrect. It doesn't just dispell, if that is all that it did, then there wouldn't be any such posts about it. Unlike dispell, Abashi's effect is random and it does not remove detrimental afflictions like your standard dispell does.

If a buff doesnt remove detrimental, it takes the stuff protecting you away and leaves the stuff killing you. This thing grabs good buffs from all over the place. Other debuffs hit the firt slots and most of us use inst-clicks to protect ourselves.

4. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/the-imbalance-of-natures-balance.97644/

if you'd bothered to actually look at my post then you'd know that "Abashi's Rod of Disempowerment" is a 3 slot random BENEFICIAL ONLY dispell with the same effect as the ranger's.

5. http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=1792

I got this for my necro. I tried it on the ranger. It did not dispell the first three spells, rather it seemed to be random as to which three spells went away. I don't know if there is a pattern to what is dispelled, or if it is truly random, but for people who are depending on the top three or four slots to be junk buffs, this clicky will nullify that strategy.

I know it's a lot to take in, but anyone who played on the PVP servers remembered the devastation a few Abashi's would cause. This item is very strong as is, but it would be nice to get the functionality working properly as it was a truly unique monster that was a big part of EQ "mystique". To my knowledge, this item has never really been tweaked or altered outside of the few bumps to Velious items (which we have already come to in our timeline, for the most part), and there is even quotes of people discussing it with Dev's, and the Dev's saying the item was never being touched due to its legacy.

Another thing to note is that a lot of these quotes are from 2006+. While the timing is a bit later, I do not think this hurts the case because this is around when Vulak changed to the scripted event and moved to a 3 day spawn - allowing for much more rampant farming with a group or two due to the massive gear advantages. Prior to this, Vulak was much harder to farm. Add in the fact that the Abashi was extremely rare and each server only had a few until many expansions later, this is why you see the "buzz" about them starting many years after the item was introduced. I highly doubt the item was secretly ninja buffed during Luclin or Planes - it just was always like this and never complained about until many had them almost 6, 7, 8+ years later.

So, based on my anecdotal evidence from when I played, coupled with the overwhelming majority of quotes here, I would like to see the "random" portion of the spell be implemented. How easy or hard is that? Not sure. I hope other knowledgeable bug-questers can chime in and help set this straight.

Thanks again.

[Nirgon]

welp

magic item is magic

I also began researching which spell graphic it should have. I believe it should be the dismiss summoned/undead line. Right now I'm told it has the 8th ring effect.

[Terpuntine]

welp

magic item is magic

I also began researching which spell graphic it should have. I believe it should be the dismiss summoned/undead line. Right now I'm told it has the 8th ring effect.

Does Nizzar know you're hanging around these forums so much?

[Nirgon]

Tell Cyren I said hi lolol

And your lots of other friends too

[Jeni]

If we are fixing game-breaking broken dispels. Golem Metal Wand should be instant cast as well.

On a blue server this is nothing more than a toy but on the PvP servers this item is very powerful. It can be cast on the run and 4 clicks will remove every buff you could possibly have on you...

this item hurts in PvP =( On Sullon Zek lets say you're gettin chased by a rogue and you got sow, so no problem.. then BAM, despelled, like WTF? he got the wand =(

you can also recharge em sorta, sell a wand with 1 charge left in it to a vendor then buy it back.. kinda an exploit or something, but you get wand back fully charged

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3644

I am all for support of this change if we can make sure all other dispels are also in their classic form for game balance.

[Nirgon]

yes pls fix golem wand and all other clickies

[ForesakkenRZ]

Gonna have to agree, you start asking for specific changes , sounding real selfish, if we are gonna keep it classic, lets bring the classic effects to dispel back in, not just your only abashi rod. #keepitclassic

[Gongshow]

Please stop trolling the thread. If you wish to have the Golem Wands, Trak Teeth, etc., reverted - please make your own thread and state your case such as I have. Thank you.

Free bump, though.

[Ragnaros]

Yup if they are going to give you an unbalanced change then bring back golem wands or kick rocks
what a waste of a loot hit though..yikes i cant even be 5 slot pelled

[Doors]

How incredibly angry is ragnaros right now he can't even contain it.

[Gongshow]

Golem Wands are another issue - please make your own thread and lets stay on topic. Thanks.

Free bump.

[ForesakkenRZ]

do not see " random dispel feature " in these notes / description of the spell
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1


just sayin, according to Zam and Lucy, your beneficial only nonsense was put in during 2004.

#keepitclassic

[Ragnaros]

How incredibly angry is ragnaros right now he can't even contain it.

yes i am mad that gongshows abashi rod is completely useless
fuming right now
random dispel was added in 2004 see proof in above post
next

[Gongshow]

Also incorrect. Fading Memories was changed and removed from it multiple times over the course of its existence and to my knowledge has always randomly dispelled. Log on live right now and try it - SPDAT shows Cancel Magic yet it still dispells randomly.

That's why I asked for some true bug report warriors to look into this - not a trail of crybabies that Empire has left in it's wake.

Another issue as well is that this is currently not 250 Range as stated throughout it's entire timeline. It is somewhere around 210 right now. I would like that changed as well for classic purposes.

I am very upset right now because Abashi's is insanely strong, yet it's only running at about 75% of the capacity that it should be. Please help.

Thank you.

[Ragnaros]

Also incorrect. Fading Memories was changed and removed from it multiple times over the course of its existence and to my knowledge has always randomly dispelled. Log on live right now and try it - SPDAT shows Cancel Magic yet it still dispells randomly.

That's why I asked for some true bug report warriors to look into this - not a trail of crybabies that Empire has left in it's wake.

Another issue as well is that this is currently not 250 Range as stated throughout it's entire timeline. It is somewhere around 210 right now. I would like that changed as well for classic purposes.

I am very upset right now because Abashi's is insanely strong, yet it's only running at about 75% of the capacity that it should be. Please help.

Thank you.

Stopped reading right there, enjoy your classic top 3 dispel Abashi (=

[Tune]

lol your reaching budy

As stated above, Abolish Enchantment is only more effective, not better. Pillage is a 4slot dispell while Abolish is only 3. One's random one is semi-random. Yes I've had pillage skip a slot now and then.

you have a bunch of idiotic quotes of people not knowing how buff counters work

[magician]

Thanks we really value the opinion of the servers biggest RMTer (Vaporize), the biggest script botter/exploiter (Tune), and a 17 year old who is currently 100 days through his 365 day OOC ban for being the servers biggest idiot (Rag)

[ForesakkenRZ]

i know you value my opinion, thats why you guys came to me for all my gear remember? please keep the topic on hand in the discussion thanks.

[Tune]

Thanks we really value the opinion of the servers biggest RMTer (Vaporize), the biggest script botter/exploiter (Tune), and a 17 year old who is currently 100 days through his 365 day OOC ban for being the servers biggest idiot (Rag)

LOL so mad

g15 autofire makes me the a coding mastermind, i respect your opinion from your mom's basement

[magician]

Vapo, just let go already. You are irrelevant. Step away from the keyboard, stretch your legs, and go for a nice jog

[Colgate]

everyone needs to just relax, take a step back, stand up, walk around, get out of their mother's basement

just a video game yowl, gongshow's got some compelling prof here

[Ragnaros]

hehe you guys mad and resorting to irl attacks?
please close this thread..
please see http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1

[magician]

Seriously vapo when was the last time you got up and walked outside for a nice fresh jog - I think you need it pal. Ugh..

[snufzaimoverlord]

Remember when Tune played Fallen and would auto camp while exploiting a second ip exemption then got banned?

[Bokke]

do not see " random dispel feature " in these notes / description of the spell
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1


just sayin, according to Zam and Lucy, your beneficial only nonsense was put in during 2004.



Abashi was absolutely not beneficial when I played, I quit before 2004 so this would be consistent.
Not that personal opinions matter, those patch notes are crystal clear.

[shokar]

hehe you guys mad and resorting to irl attacks?
please close this thread..item working as intended
please see http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1

seems pretty clear

[Bokke]

hehe you guys mad and resorting to irl attacks?
please close this thread..
please see http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1



Abashi, as per the notes posted here:

do not see " random dispel feature " in these notes / description of the spell
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live&setcookie=1


just sayin, according to Zam and Lucy, your beneficial only nonsense was put in during 2004.

#keepitclassic

Should not be dispelling beneficial only.

It is not working as it should be if its currently dispelling beneficial only.
Thanks for bringing this to the attention of the developers Gongshow.

[Redi]

yall need to go walk it off

OP is some good research

[Gongshow]

Abashi was absolutely not beneficial when I played, I quit before 2004 so this would be consistent.

It has ALWAYS been beneficial only - that isn't in question. What is in question is whether or not the "randomness" was in yet or not. I posted what I believe to be proof that it should possibly be in, but again - I asked for some help researching as I don't know 100% and never claimed to.

At any rate, the range is currently off too - it is currently around 210 and should be 250. Thanks to Vapo for posting the SPDAT proving that - also for proving that it has always been beneficial only.

So again, back on topic and back to square one - let's get this clicky in the correct state. To recap:


SPDAT shows that it has always been beneficial only - Currently correct in game.
SPDAT shows that it has always been 250 range - Currently it is only about 210 in game - This needs fixed.
Conflicting reports show that there may have been times that it has switched from "top 3 beneficial" to "random 3 beneficial" - In game now it is currently dispelling "top 3 beneficial". Is this correct?

[Tune]

Pillage enchantment:
slot 1 : cancel magic (4)
slot 2 : cancel magic (4)
slot 3 : cancel magic (4)
slot 4 : cancel magic (4)

abolish enchantment:
slot 1 : cancel magic (9)
slot 2 : cancel magic (9)
slot 3 : cancel magic (9)

prob should change all dispells if you want to change abashi

seems pretty cut and dry they should function the same

[Tune]

also

2012-10-12 19:28 Changed Slot 3 from "Fading Memories" to "Cancel Magic - Beneficial Only (9)"

looks like it shouldnt be beneficial only

[ravi]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7008

Not sure what you guys saying - but as far as I know, the effect on this staff is an unlimited right clickable and targetable dispell. And even better, it's my understanding it only dispells "positive" buffs, so you can use it on mobs after other buffs have already been cast, like Malo and Occlusion.

-- Zwoop

[Gongshow]

If you look at the SPDAT and all of the forum posts on the internet, it has been "beneficial only" for as long as anyone remembers - despite the SPDAT showing the actual text of "Beneficial Only" starting in 2012. Please stop shitposting a bug thread to troll.

Back on topic recap:

Beneficial only - check.
250 range - currently only 210 - needs increased.
Random 3 buffs vs Top 3 buffs - need more info - currently is top 3 in game (which may be correct, pending more research.)

[Gongshow]

Big thanks to Ravi for clearing that up even further. Great find.

Looks like the only thing we need to research is the randomness of the effect. Any help is greatly appreciated - let's do this, pals!

[Ragnaros]

take player "quotes" all you want, its not a direct line for proof of anything. its going off 1 random subjects memory. Now, in a real bug thread, you are required to site evidence via patch notes, not peoples quotes. a lot of people say a lot of dumb things... doesn't make them true. However, Zam and Lucy clearly state the spells description. It's far more logical to take Zam and Lucy say so, as opposed to someone's memory of it....

[Doors]

I would definitely listen to the guy who literally lies about everything he says over Ravi who just dropped prof from 2001 in this thread.

[Tomm Selleck]

Last edited by Ragnaros; Today at 11:56 PM..

[Ragnaros]

Here Gongshow,
Recant Magic
1 : Cancel Magic(9)
2 : Cancel Magic(9)
3 : Cancel Magic(9)
4 : Cancel Magic(9)
CURRENTLY 4 TOP SLOT DISPELL on RED99

Abolish Enchantment ( ABASHI EFFECT)
1 : Cancel Magic(9)
2 : Cancel Magic(9)
3 : Cancel Magic(9)
CURRENTLY 3 TOP DISPELL ON RED99

I don't see the issue here?

[Bokke]

If you look at the SPDAT and all of the forum posts on the internet, it has been "beneficial only" for as long as anyone remembers - despite the SPDAT showing the actual text of "Beneficial Only" starting in 2012. Please stop shitposting a bug thread to troll.


Sorry but patch notes trumps forum posts.

Abashi should not be beneficial only. It should be Cancel Magic (9) which is the same Cancel Magic as Recant Magic.

[Ragnaros]

Also, Fading Memories is what the BENEFICIAL ONLY Dispel aspect comes from..
2004-12-15 10:29 Changed Slot 1 from "Cancel Magic(9)" to "Fading Memories"
We are currently not 2004 into the timeline..in fact we are nowhere close to that.
So right now the Abashi should NOT be dispelling ONLY beneficial memories, and should be doing what it says..Cancel magic and should be dispelling everything.
Thanks for comment.
Infact, Im not done yet. Since you want to use personal stories and "memories" as proof..I will use your OWN thread as counterproof
You quoted the thread https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/a-needed-nerf.97695/page-5 as proof, every single quote you are claiming as proof is in that thread. The thread date OP is dated at ARCHIVED-Zymosis, Jul 20, 2006 , THIS date is AFTER 2004-12-15 10:29 Changed Slot 1 from "Cancel Magic(9)" to "Fading Memories" so yes, those people were correct..it was randomly dispelling in 2006 after the patch change from cancel magic( what it was in classic, top 3 dispel )as it originally was in classic.
I just derailed your whole argument, so please. Close this thread

[Tune]

yeah just read all the quotes he had they are all from 2006.

lol get wreckt

[Gongshow]

Recant (Enc) and Abolish (Abashi) are different spell ID's and always have been. Abashi is its own unique dispell, not even sure what you are trying to prove anymore - you guys went way overboard and off topic.

To bring this back on track yet again:


Range on P99 is currently around 210. According to data this should be 250.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently beneficial only. According to data, quotes, anecdotal evidence - this is correct.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently dispelling the top 3 beneficial buffs. Some data and quotes show that the effect should be dispelling random 3 beneficial buffs, as opposed to top 3. Need more research to confirm if this is working as intended, or if it infact should be dispelling a random 3.

Any help clarifying from legit, reputable players would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

[Jeni]

The proc on this weapon dispells 4 of the weilder's buffs each time it procs. Yah, It's uber, but only if you don't need buffs.

This is the earliest quote I can find on the proc and its from 2001. This is the version that should be live on our timeline.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7008 4th post from the bottom

[Ragnaros]

Recant (Enc) and Abolish (Abashi) are different spell ID's and always have been. Abashi is its own unique dispell, not even sure what you are trying to prove anymore - you guys went way overboard and off topic.

To bring this back on track yet again:


Range on P99 is currently around 210. According to data this should be 250.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently beneficial only. According to data, quotes, anecdotal evidence - this is correct.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently dispelling the top 3 beneficial buffs. Some data and quotes show that the effect should be dispelling random 3 beneficial buffs, as opposed to top 3. Need more research to confirm if this is working as intended, or if it infact should be dispelling a random 3.

Any help clarifying from legit, reputable players would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

Sorry that I just completely shat on every piece of evidence that you posted..( Daybreak posts from 2006-2011) What were you thinking?

[Doors]

All the current prof provided by Ravi and Gong is accurate.

Ragnaros is confused about the spells and has them mixed up.

[Gongshow]

To bring this back on track yet again:


Range on P99 is currently around 210. According to data this should be 250.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently beneficial only. According to data, quotes, anecdotal evidence - this is correct.
Abolish Enchantment on P99 is currently dispelling the top 3 beneficial buffs. Some data and quotes show that the effect should be dispelling random 3 beneficial buffs, as opposed to top 3. Need more research to confirm if this is working as intended, or if it infact should be dispelling a random 3.

Any help clarifying from legit, reputable players would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

[Ragnaros]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7008#m100692372131546
From SpDat
Lord Gohda Nov 28 2001 at 12:02 AM
Abolish Enchantment

Cancel Magic + 9 levels
Cancel Magic + 9 levels
Cancel Magic + 9 levels


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Classes: None

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Skill: Evocation
Allowable Targets: All

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Range to Target: 250 feet

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Resistance Check: None

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spell Duration: Instant
Recast Delay: 12.0 seconds

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When someone casts: Soandso arches its back.
Spell cast on you: You feel your skin freeze.
Spell cast on someone: Soandso's skin freezes.

sorry bro, enjoy your shitty item next time don't try and post quotes from 2006-2012 on daybreak forums ( L O L what were you thinking)

[Jeni]

There is 0 evidence provided proving this implementation should be in our timeline. Posts from 2006 don't really help either as the effect changed long before this date. Check Lucy http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=1792&source=Live.

I do however have evidence of my version on our current timeline.
The proc on this weapon dispells 4 of the weilder's buffs each time it procs. Yah, It's uber, but only if you don't need buffs.

This is the earliest quote I can find on the proc and its from 2001. This is the version that should be live on our timeline.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7008 4th post from the bottom

[Ragnaros]

This is the earliest quote I can find on the proc and its from 2001. This is the version that should be live on our timeline.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=7008 4th post from the bottom

Thanks for your accurate input.

[Colgate]

looks like it should be instant cast until no later than november 2001 in the timeline - right before luclin release, according to the allakhazam page:

9/9/2001
Umm, the last i knew the proc was Triggered not random. The cast time was upped from Instant to like 2 - 3 seconds.

9/12/2001
This is a right click dispell that dispells ONE of your buffs. At first it was instant cast and unlimited charges, but it now has a casting time. It was so rediculously overpowered for pvp (and in general) that there was no way they could have left it alone. Still a great beat stick. looks like velium brawl stick.

[Gongshow]

If you look at my OP - you would see that I admitted that the quotes were from 2006+ and onward. You would also see that I asked for help clarifying as I wasn't entirely positive that it should or shouldn't be random. If you would have calmly read through it all instead of rallying a team of server has-beens into a shitpost frenzy, you would have caught that. I wasn't trying to be deceitful in my delivery, but I understand why you would be bitter and try to troll and derail a legit bug thread.

All things considered, and all shitposts aside - I am willing to concede that the random dispell COULD be the Fading Memories. I know for a fact Fading Memories is a random because it is the Monk Anguish BP click on live, and the Ranger Nature Harmony line is similar. That being said, the evidence just isn't as cut and dry - because like I said Abolish has it's own unique spell ID and parameters as evidenced by posts in 2001 claiming beneficial only, yet the SPDAT didn't technically WRITE OUT "Beneficial Only" until 2012. Not to mention they changed it from Fading Memories on live, yet it still strips random buffs. We may never know unless we have some serious backend info to analyze - which we probably never will.

At any rate - it has always been 250 range, and always beneficial only. There is certainly enough evidence for that right now. So as a start, we need to get this range bumped from around 210 to 250.

Thanks for the input, pals!

[Bokke]

If you look at my OP - you would see that I admitted that the quotes were from 2006+ and onward. You would also see that I asked for help clarifying as I wasn't entirely positive that it should or shouldn't be random. If you would have calmly read through it all instead of rallying a team of server has-beens into a shitpost frenzy, you would have caught that. I wasn't trying to be deceitful in my delivery, but I understand why you would be bitter and try to troll and derail a legit bug thread.

All things considered, and all shitposts aside - I am willing to concede that the random dispell COULD be the Fading Memories. I know for a fact Fading Memories is a random because it is the Monk Anguish BP click on live, and the Ranger Nature Harmony line is similar. That being said, the evidence just isn't as cut and dry - because like I said Abolish has it's own unique spell ID and parameters as evidenced by posts in 2001 claiming beneficial only, yet the SPDAT didn't technically WRITE OUT "Beneficial Only" until 2012. Not to mention they changed it from Fading Memories on live, yet it still strips random buffs. We may never know unless we have some serious backend info to analyze - which we probably never will.

At any rate - it has always been 250 range, and always beneficial only. There is certainly enough evidence for that right now. So as a start, we need to get this range bumped from around 210 to 250.

Thanks for the input, pals!

As a start, we should fix it so it is not dispelling beneficials only.
Thank you Gongshow for bringing this to our attention, it would have taken awhile to spot that bug otherwise.

[Ragnaros]

http://i.imgur.com/G2QCt0n.png
I accept your surrender Gongshow, Wise choice.
Lets get this man his 40 added range on his new useless item!

[Colgate]

As a start, we should fix it so it is not dispelling beneficials only.
Thank you Gongshow for bringing this to our attention, it would have taken awhile to spot that bug otherwise.

November 2001 post on Allakhazam:

Not sure what you guys saying - but as far as I know, the effect on this staff is an unlimited right clickable and targetable dispell. And even better, it's my understanding it only dispells "positive" buffs, so you can use it on mobs after other buffs have already been cast, like Malo and Occlusion.

-- Zwoop

the first step is halfway there; it should also be instant cast until november 2001 in the timeline

[Bokke]

November 2001 post on Allakhazam:



the first step is halfway there; it should also be instant cast until november 2001 in the timeline

One forum post is not evidence. The previously posted patch notes are evidence.
Thanks for your input.

[Doors]

Rag's obvious trolling posts make it clear <Friends> is rallying to this thread for a forumquest victory.

If you don't have legit prof or anything substantial to add to the discussion of how this item should function then you need banned from the forums for trolling bug threads.

[Gongshow]

Yep. From the collective research, everything about it is correct right now based on data. 3 Slots. Bene only. We just need the +40 range to be all set on this amazing item. I really do appreciate the hard work the Dev's put in to keep this server as accurate to Live as possible.

As far as the random factor to the dispell - unless we can see some serious backend, I'm not sure we will have the info we need to add that in - hence why I was asking for some veteran bug questers for help. I'll keep my eyes peeled though.

[shokar]

Lucy does not list it as beneficial only until 2012
2012-10-12 19:28 Changed Slot 3 from "Fading Memories" to "Cancel Magic - Beneficial Only (9)"

[Jeni]

Not sure what you guys saying - but as far as I know, the effect on this staff is an unlimited right clickable and targetable dispell. And even better, it's my understanding it only dispells "positive" buffs, so you can use it on mobs after other buffs have already been cast, like Malo and Occlusion.

-- Zwoop

The "as far as I know" is not very convincing. It is most likely that this individual did not understand the dispel counter mechanic.

[Gongshow]

Right - the SPDAT was never written out with the verbiage "Beneficial Only" until 2012 - yet there is mountains of posts from 1 to 11 years prior specifically stating that it is beneficial only. Also Fading Memories was changed back to Cancel Magic in 2012 - yet on Live to this day, Abashi still dispells random buffs. Does that mean Cancel Magic = Random buff slot dispell? No, of course not - but it certainly means that there's much more to the data then most of us know or will ever be able to see.

This item is the single most farmed item on Live PVP, has been for years, and still is to this very day. Do you guys really think people farm(ed) this item religiously for a standard 3 slot debuff? Of course not, Abolish is extremely unique as it outclasses every other dispell in the game.

Please stop trolling, pals - keep it in RNF.

[Colgate]

One forum post is not evidence. The previously posted patch notes are evidence.
Thanks for your input.

last i checked, in-era forum posts are typically considered evidence around here

there isn't a single shred of evidence that explicitly states that detrimental effects are included in the dispel mechanics of Abolish Enchantment, however, the aforementioned in-era Allakhazam post explicitly states that it skips detrimental effects

[krazyGlue]

/popcorn

[Jeni]

Right - the SPDAT was never written out with the verbiage "Beneficial Only" until 2012 - yet there is mountains of posts from 1 to 11 years prior specifically stating that it is beneficial only. Also Fading Memories was changed back to Cancel Magic in 2012 - yet on Live to this day, Abashi still dispells random buffs. Does that mean Cancel Magic = Random buff slot dispell? No, of course not - but it certainly means that there's much more to the data then most of us know or will ever be able to see.

This item is the single most farmed item on Live PVP, has been for years, and still is to this very day. Do you guys really think people farm(ed) this item religiously for a standard 3 slot debuff? Of course not, Abolish is extremely unique as it outclasses every other dispell in the game.

Please stop trolling, pals - keep it in RNF.

? not following this

[Doors]

? not following this

http://i.imgur.com/9G6CKcE.jpg?1

[Star]

I haven't checked entire thread but I don't think a Dev has looked at pvp bug forums in months. I would forward to Ele or Daldean and have them post this in the other big section. I have seen nilbog respond within hours and get something fixed there. Just a tip pal.

[Jeni]

I don't think posting factual proof is trolling. How about post some factual proof for your side of the argument if you want to sway opinion?

[Daldaen]

So, my EQLive memory is hazy, but you're free to confirm this on live at any time.

1. All dispells, Cancel magic and otherwise, were at one point revamped away from the classic version you are aware of, into a beneficial priority dispells. This was done during the advent of "Cure Detrimental" effects such as the Radiant Cure AA and Purification AA.

Basically they wanted you to start removing debuffs which didn't have a counter (like say a snare or a Druid magic DoT), using those AAs, rather than buff stacking and dispelling top.

Dispells would prioritize removing beneficial spells, until every beneficial buff is removed and THEN it would start eating detrimentals. Again, if you believe this is false on live, go ahead and buff up 10 buffs, DoT yourself in 1st slot and spam dispells. Check the results.

2. Dispells changed to be random slot. This was a widespread change to the mechanics of casted dispells (all the player casted ones). I think dragon AEs retained their top-down mechanic, all the other ones got random slots or worked on the counter-system that we have here, I was never clear on that aspect. Should you disagree with this, again, feel free to log onto live buff up 10 buffs and start spamming cancel magic to see what happens.

Abashi's is rough. There weren't a horribly large number of them floating around pre-2002. I'd say evidence from 2002/2003 should be considered, but much past that, I'd say expect to see lots of mechanics changed like I described above.

Now I wasn't able to read through every post you quoted, but the majority seemed to be 2006+ era, which isn't the best time period to gauge the validity of your assertion. Based on a quick Allakhazam review, you've got posts like this:

November 2001:
This is a right click dispell that dispells ONE of your buffs. At first it was instant cast and unlimited charges, but it now has a casting time. It was so rediculously overpowered for pvp (and in general) that there was no way they could have left it alone. Still a great beat stick. looks like velium brawl stick.

It would be useful if someone can pull up the January/April 2001 spdat info on Abolish Enchantments to see if there is more specific data there.

I'm pretty sure this quote is incorrect, not much reason for the dispell to be single slot, though if it was ever flagged instant, that is possible I suppose. If no one checks the Velious spdat I can when I get home later tonight.

[Gongshow]

Thanks Daldaen.

Yeah, I'm pretty convinced at this point after the trolling and additional research that the "random" part was due to the Fading Memories change. At least I'm willing to accept that because I'm too lazy to dig further. It still leaves a few questions unanswered but like I said, yeah, too lazy. So that would mean 2004 was the earliest documented definitive change to "random".

The beneficial only part of the Abashi has been the selling point for as long as I can remember and as long as I can see - which wasn't quite rivaled until the release of Nature's Balance line, and even then until the Anguish Monk BP with 1 slot Fading Memories. The trolling notion that it was never beneficial only until 2012 is pretty comical because it's based on the verbiage of the SPDAT (which never explicitly said the words "Beneficial Only"). An analogy I can think of would be trying to say the spell "Fear" never made you run away because the SPDAT never had the words "Run Away" recorded.

I'm pretty pleased with the accuracy of the Abashi click in it's current form right now after a bit more research - I think it is pretty close and spot on as we will ever get for the era. The only thing I can see as a glaring flaw is that it is definitely not 250 range (tested by a ranger with 50 Range Arrow and 200 Range Bow). It is more like 210 (just outside the range of a Forged Javelin).

[Nirgon]

Need a mod to cleanup in here (the Doors post for example)

[ducktv]

this is the most garbage post I have ever read. fix the range, that's all that has to be done here. not like Gongshow is ever going to pvp anyway.

[Gongshow]

this is the most garbage post I have ever read. fix the range, that's all that has to be done here. not like Gongshow is ever going to pvp anyway.

Agreed. Range and done.

[Redi]

Weren't all dispels recently changed on our p99 servers to "bounce around" based on counters/strength aka being classic to not only do top slots? I know I've experienced this, but it's hard to say if it was a result of buggy buff stacking (known bug) or actually bouncing on counter strength.

[Llandris]

Need a mod to cleanup in here (the Doors post for example)

To clean up in here, the entire thread needs to be deleted. This is why red can't have nice things

[Doors]

To clean up in here, the entire thread needs to be deleted. This is why red can't have nice things

Or instead of just throwing the entire server under the bus you could spend a whopping 10 minutes reading the entire thread to realize it was a handful of people that derailed it.

Yikes where did they find this guy?

[Llandris]

Or instead of just throwing the entire server under the bus you could spend a whopping 10 minutes reading the entire thread to realize it was a handful of people that derailed it.

Yikes where did they find this guy?

You're right, see you next week

[ducktv]

You're right, see you next week

Thank you. Please clean up the posts I've gathered below, or just close this fucking thread.

Does Nizzar know you're hanging around these forums so much?
Off topic
Tell Cyren I said hi lolol

And your lots of other friends too
Off topic
yes pls fix golem wand and all other clickies
Off topic, make new thread
Yup if they are going to give you an unbalanced change then bring back golem wands or kick rocks
what a waste of a loot hit though..yikes i cant even be 5 slot pelled
Off topic
How incredibly angry is ragnaros right now he can't even contain it.
Off topic
Thanks we really value the opinion of the servers biggest RMTer (Vaporize), the biggest script botter/exploiter (Tune), and a 17 year old who is currently 100 days through his 365 day OOC ban for being the servers biggest idiot (Rag)
Off topic
Thanks we really value the opinion of the servers biggest RMTer (Vaporize), the biggest script botter/exploiter (Tune), and a 17 year old who is currently 100 days through his 365 day OOC ban for being the servers biggest idiot (Rag)
Off topic
LOL so mad

g15 autofire makes me the a coding mastermind, i respect your opinion from your mom's basement
Off topic
__________________________________________________ _____________________
Vapo, just let go already. You are irrelevant. Step away from the keyboard, stretch your legs, and go for a nice jog

yall need to go walk it off

OP is some good research

everyone needs to just relax, take a step back, stand up, walk around, get out of their mother's basement

just a video game yowl, gongshow's got some compelling prof here

Seriously vapo when was the last time you got up and walked outside for a nice fresh jog - I think you need it pal. Ugh..
^The above posts are REAL LIFE ATTACKS on a member of our red99 community with a disability. This is distasteful, disgusting, and we're allowing this toxic behaviour to continue without any punishment to their in game accounts, or their forum accounts.

http://mlkshk.com/r/EVUW
Off topic
Remember when Tune played Fallen and would auto camp while exploiting a second ip exemption then got banned?
Off topic
I would definitely listen to the guy who literally lies about everything he says over Ravi who just dropped prof from 2001 in this thread.
Off topic
All the current prof provided by Ravi and Gong is accurate.

Ragnaros is confused about the spells and has them mixed up.
Off topic
Rag's obvious trolling posts make it clear <Friends> is rallying to this thread for a forumquest victory.

If you don't have legit prof or anything substantial to add to the discussion of how this item should function then you need banned from the forums for trolling bug threads.
Off topic
/popcorn
Off topic
http://i.imgur.com/9G6CKcE.jpg?1
Off topic