SK dps - roles

[Brawk]

Do shadowknights put out great dps in the later levels?

I'm curious if they are always viewed as a tank or can also fill in as a dps.

[hablabba]

You don't invite SK to a group for dps. You invite them for their incredible snap aggro abilities and strong tanking / pulling. The dps isn't awful but they can't touch a proper dps class and were never meant to.

[guineapig]

What he said. A level 50 SK can basically dump every single damaging spell and dot on to some mobs to increase their DPS. It would lead to them being out of mana very quickly and and still doing less damage per second than a dual wielding warrior (not to mention the true DPS classes).

[Brawk]

Hrmm. That is concerning. Was hoping to hear they had respectable dps.

I assume paladin dps is about the same as sk then?

[Trimm]

I assume paladin dps is about the same as sk then?

Lower than an SK until they get a Fiery Avenger, then maybe a little higher.

[hablabba]

Hrmm. That is concerning. Was hoping to hear they had respectable dps.

I assume paladin dps is about the same as sk then?

EQ classes are broken down to a few classifications:
TANK: war / pal / sk
DPS: monk / rog / wiz / mag / nec / ranger
Heal: cler / dru / shm
CC: bard / enc

Obviously this is overly simplistic as there is overlap with many of these classes uses (enc can be #1 dps with charm pet, nec can do CC with screaming terror, etc etc.) but when thinking of forming a vanilla group you usually use those archetypes and grab 1 tank, 1-2 healer, 1 cc, and fill it out with DPS.

This said, warrior / pal / sk are almost always brought in to fulfill their tank role. Why would you want them to do dps? They should be properly specced gearwise for massive ac/hp/aggro, eschewing +STR for +STA etc.

If you dont wanna tank, dont play a SK. If you wanna dps, role a mage (most OP dps in classic)

[odizzido]

SK DPS with the same weapon can be quite a bit higher simply because they can pick ogre as a race. The spells they get are also more focused on offense and add more DPS. If you can get a 2hs with enough delay you can cast between swings and while you have mana your DPS will be alright.

Of course if you are spending all your mana doing DPS you won't have enough to fill the main roll of tank so spell DPS only really comes into play on boss mobs or when you solo.

Pallies also look a lot better when they fight undead since they get undead nukes earlier than SKs do, though they end up with the same one at 50. Also the ghoulbane is pretty insane when it first starts proccing. Even in your 40's the proc is still pretty decent damage.

[guineapig]

If you dont wanna tank, dont play a SK. If you wanna dps, role a mage (most OP dps in classic)


I agree with all but the last part quoted above. Rogues are much better DPS than a mage. Also, I dare say in classic... or at least on this server monks are probably the most OP for 4 reasons:

Their DPS is not mana dependent.
Their DPS is not quite so directionally dependent (compared to a rogue).
They have a panic button (get out of death free card).
They can actually solo for EXP (under optimal conditions).

[Estu]

They can actually solo for EXP (under optimal conditions).

Even more so with the recent mend change; saw a monk soloing Misty Thicket guards by just camping a couple times between each pull to mend up. Granted, it's not mage soloing, but it's something.

[hablabba]

I agree with all but the last part quoted above. Rogues are much better DPS than a mage. Also, I dare say in classic... or at least on this server monks are probably the most OP for 4 reasons:

Their DPS is not mana dependent.
Their DPS is not quite so directionally dependent (compared to a rogue).
They have a panic button (get out of death free card).
They can actually solo for EXP (under optimal conditions).

Monks are definitely a phenomenal class with amazing dps. Really any well played monk/rog/mage is gonna fill that DPS spot well.

Just to qualify my statement above, I am in the mid 30s here so perhaps the gap widens at 50 but from what I have seen I've never torn apart more mobs in a chain pulling group than when I had 2 mages as dps (done 1 mage / 1 monk, 1 rog / 1 monk, 2 monks, iirc). Have a semi permanent group of SK/cleric/ench/druid so we just pick 2 dps and go with it.

[guineapig]

Aye, sorry... you never said best DPS, you just said really good DPS and mage is indeed really good DPS..

I kind of got sidetracked. :o

[Brawk]

I do want to play the tank role but was hoping sk dps was decent enough that groups would consider inviting for dps slot as well.

Thanks for the info.

[Nakara]

The dps gap between classes isn't so great in classic that an SK couldn't fit a dps role if needed. This all changes with kunark though.

[audacity]

IMO I would take a tank + an Sk though at certain times, being on +3GMT it's hard as fuck to find one tank...and when I seem to, they generally leave shortly after getting the group.

So you'd kinda be my silver medal, like my wife.

[Messianic]

Even more so with the recent mend change; saw a monk soloing Misty Thicket guards by just camping a couple times between each pull to mend up. Granted, it's not mage soloing, but it's something.

My monk on live soloed just about straight to 60 (grouping for fun). They're probably the only melee class that can solo efficiently, particularly on low dark blues.

[Kaboombastic]

IMO I would take a tank + an Sk though at certain times, being on +3GMT it's hard as fuck to find one tank...and when I seem to, they generally leave shortly after getting the group.

So you'd kinda be my silver medal, like my wife.

+3 GMT!? At least you're probably in a country with cheap, state-sponsored health care. I haven't seen a dentist in a year! lol Thank god for tooth paste.

As for the issue at hand, I'm not sure... I think an SK as DPS would be awesome... In a PvP server, because of all the mean tricks, the pet, etc. For a strictly PvE server, however, I think it's just in your best interest to learn tanking/aggro and learn it well.

[jeffd]

the 'dps' and 'tank' roles in everquest are mutually exclusive.

[Estu]

the 'dps' and 'tank' roles in everquest are mutually exclusive.

A well-geared monk in the lower levels can be an effective tank, I think.

[Taluvill]

Their DPS is not mana dependent.
Their DPS is not quite so directionally dependent (compared to a rogue).
They have a panic button (get out of death free card).
They can actually solo for EXP (under optimal conditions).

Unless it was changed, max your mend and pull to a zone line and constantly mend fight. its got some insane solo on it.

[Nakara]

the 'dps' and 'tank' roles in everquest are mutually exclusive.

not at all, especially in classic where the dps gap is small anyways

[Estu]

not at all, especially in classic where the dps gap is small anyways

I know I made somewhat of an opposing point a couple posts up, but I'd like to dispute this. Take your classic melee DPS king, the rogue. If you remove backstab, a rogue's DPS becomes more or less identical to a warrior's (up to weapon choice; obviously warriors aren't going for DPS weapons as much, but there is some overlap, e.g. SSOYs). So the question is, just how much DPS does backstab add? Well, I've heard from rogues that at level 50, backstab accounts for OVER HALF of your DPS. In other words, with identical gear, a rogue will do double the damage of a warrior. That's not a small gap.

[Silvermink]

While I'm not opposed to a group with 2 tanks I would not stay in a group (or let them stay) if a pally/war/sk insisted they were dps and refused to tank.