The role of group wizards while levelling up

[Jimjam]

Am I being a dick if I think a group wizard's job is to root and stun rather than limply attempt to dps with their ticklenukes?

Does this ever change, or are they stuck being a second rate enchanter, helping warriors keep aggro and interrupting the spells of enemy casters with the occasional burn? If it does change, what level does that occur?

[bloodmuffin]

They will always be more effective soloing.

I leveled my wizard solo/grouping from 1-52ish. From 10-30 I spent the majority of my times in groups. My initial job is to just Root CC and finish off a mob so people don't have to snare/chase the mobs.

With Breeze or mana song you should have enough to root/nuke each mob. The downside is resists, you can get super unlucky and have just about every spell resisted on a even/yellow con in the early levels which dumps your manapool leaving you pretty useless. If I get resisted I usually give it another shot then give up and med that back until the next mob comes.

This will remain the same forever. You'll root CC only when needed, wait for the tank to establish agro, the dps put in some work, and then nuke out the final HP preventing running mobs. Occasional stuns for healing/wiz merbs.

[ridiculousmoose]

Thing is most 'group' wizards just do the lame one nuke per mob shit... makes it easier for them to get back to their tv show while getting free xp.

[Ivory]

A good player uses all of their classes abilities.

Paladins should root / heal to control mobs.

Rangers should snare / root / heal.

SKs should have their pets up for extra dps and snare.

So many people just sit down and don't use their full class (like all of the clerics that just sit around...most don't even know they have a lull AND mem blur spell!!).

[Gvelz Underfoot]

Thing is most 'group' wizards just do the lame one nuke per mob shit... makes it easier for them to get back to their tv show while getting free xp.

1 nuke per mob is fine if conserving mana for a boss / healer / nuker mob or in case of evac needed. Furthermore I recall mana regen / mana pool being a bit more difficult in early grouping and sometimes 1 nuke is all there is mana for due to chain pulling. If the wizard is low on mana no one really cares, so we have to wait until the cleric is low for a group to take a short break.

If someone in the group is snaring, and the mob is gonna get 1 nuke, do it so that the mob goes into "flee" mode faster which a) allows the full damage of the nuke to impact the target and b) the melee can finish it off without getting beat on. Waiting until the mob is already in flee mode is typically a waste of mana, especially of it only takes half the nuke to finish it off. The only exceptions are if there is no snare possible, and it's gonna run and agro other stuff.

A good wizard will know when to nuke once, and when to dump nukes at a target. Especially once we have concussion and can tightly control our aggro. Stunning and rooting are great to have but very situational at higher levels, since 2 or 3 hits from a mob will wreck a wizard making the healers job more difficult. I only attempt to stun if the mob is tough and has a Complete Heal, and I only root if the chanter or bard is AFK or dead.

One problem is that many of our stuns and interrupts have a greater chance of getting resisted, resulting in a waste of mana. Another problem is that the casting time on the stun and interrupt spells make it tricky. Thunderstrike at level 29 has a 3.6 second cast time, for example, and Force Strike with a whopping 5.5 second timer. Attempting to time that so that it interrupts a heal is tenuous at best and even if timed right some other class could end up getting it interrupted wasting mana that could have been used for a straight and lower agro nuke. And on top of all of this, the recast timer for these spells is fairly long, anywhere from 12 to 24 seconds for many of our nukes with interrupt / Tishan's & Markar's lineup. So potentially would need 2 spell slots to effectively keep a caster interrupted. Again, great to have but only if there's no one else in the party that can perform these tasks.

[Decad]

Root Snare stun is a wizard job in a group and this is more important then DPS.

[elwing]

A good player uses all of their classes abilities.

Paladins should root / heal to control mobs.

Rangers should snare / root / heal.

SKs should have their pets up for extra dps and snare.

So many people just sit down and don't use their full class (like all of the clerics that just sit around...most don't even know they have a lull AND mem blur spell!!).

The worst I have seen was a bard refusing to twist...

[MavstabYoudead]

Group roles are not static. They change depending on the group composition, so no your assumption may not always be correct.

I've never heard wizards regarded as 2nd rate enchanters. They are the top rate burst DPS class, depending on resistance of mobs.

[Zill]

When I played my wizard in groups I'd usually throw 2 nukes at each mob, which would take close to 40% of their health away while my group finished up. I'd also throw out roots for add management.

Sometimes if we got a lower levelled add I'd just root that sucker and burn it down real quick while everyone else focused on the bigger pull.

Wizards in groups are really damn useful. There are some levels where the mobs HP outscales the nukes we have access to, but past like 34 that's not really an issue.

[Rararboker]

Wizards get more useful when evacing out of dangerous situations becomes more important. Like some end game dungeons.

[Ravager]

People want Wizards in their group for O'keils Radiation.

[Charak]

I used to duo with a wizard with my monk. He would snare and use the staff of temperate flux to hold aggro while he kited the mob around, and I would hit the mob from behind. It worked out well

[Pope Hat]

From an enchanters perspective an extra rooter can be really handy. Also that sks should never use their stupid worthless mez breaking pet.

[Jimjam]

I only root if the chanter or bard is AFK or dead. Why not root in a group with an active enc?

[Sage Truthbearer]

Have evac memmed and know when to use it. I've had Wizards save the entire group when a bad pull went south and a full group wipe was imminent.

[Arclyte]

their role is to sit on their ass and steal exp

[nhdjoseywales]

its rare to be in a group where you as the wizzie are the only form of cc. personally i always found my mana better spent destroying the mob beating on a cleric than trying to root it, getting resisted, rooting again, then seeing that break in 3 seconds cuz rng hates you. there are a shitload of classes that can root/snare/whatever. let the wizzie blast shit to pieces which the other classes cannot do.

[Fame]

Nah you're all good, root and stun is pretty much it, save the burst for need only situations and conserve mana for the potential pvp. Nothin better than havin your local wizard put a would-be PK in check and continuing with your exp session.

[Gvelz Underfoot]

Why not root in a group with an active enc?

There are some situations where that becomes needed, for example mobs that can be rooted but are immune to mez. I find that with a competent enchanter that is concentrating on the role of crowd control, the wizard should not need to use root very often which allows more concentration for well timed nukes.

I definitely see the wizards role as a secondary crowd control when paired with an Enchanter in a group and being aware of when to help and when to stay out of the way and just nuke is important. After all, we both get Fetter which is the best root spell in the game. One trick I learned is I can hit concussion on a mob I root and that helps it to not come right after me.

[Agecroft]

limply attempt to dps with their ticklenukes?

I lol'd

[Troxx]

Wizards just get the short end of the stick. A shaman not focusing on healing or slowing can pump out a lot more damage over time via direct damage nukes alone through the use of canni mana regen.

Druids can't manage more nuking sustained damage, but can group regen, dmg shield, patch heal, and buff ... On top of providing evacs.

Mages? Well their pet alone can sustain 3-5x as much sustained damage as a wizard during an xp session ... not counting the mages nukes.

In classic eq, Wizards are really only raid burn and solo xp artists who don't mind a lot of down time. In this regard I would agree with the OP. A good wizard is one who appreciates that they won't sustain dps for shit and instead plays to their (admittedly limited but someone had to do it) utility capability while keeping enough mana on hand to blow a hard burn or flip a life saving evac that is well timed.

[JackFlash]

Root Snare stun is a wizard job in a group and this is more important then DPS.

[Evia]

Have evac memmed and know when to use it. I've had Wizards save the entire group when a bad pull went south and a full group wipe was imminent.

Seriously this is sound advice. Best wizards or druids know how to evacuation correctly. Too often my group will wipe with a dru or wiz and afterwards their excuse is always "sorry I didn't have evac memmed..."

Can't stress enough how helpful that spell can be in the hands of a good player.

[thufir]

Too often my group will wipe with a dru or wiz and afterwards their excuse is always "sorry I didn't have evac memmed..."
This is probably the saddest thing I've read all day. It's the one thing you add to a group that no other class can...

[JackFlash]

Also know when not to use evac......Like when you finally break into a deep dungeon and get scared the monk pulled too many! EVAC!!!! Oh wait, we had an enchanter. Group = mad (assuming you found a group in the first place....)

[Jimjam]

There are some situations where that becomes needed, for example mobs that can be rooted but are immune to mez. I find that with a competent enchanter that is concentrating on the role of crowd control, the wizard should not need to use root very often which allows more concentration for well timed nukes.

I definitely see the wizards role as a secondary crowd control when paired with an Enchanter in a group and being aware of when to help and when to stay out of the way and just nuke is important. After all, we both get Fetter which is the best root spell in the game. I guess whether to throw some roots on inc is down to taste.

ENCHANTERS: do you prefer to have someone root your mezzed mobs to help keep them locked down, or do you prefer to work without interference?

One trick I learned is I can hit concussion on a mob I root and that helps it to not come right after me.This seems like a really good tip, thanks for sharing. I guess when/if root breaks the mob will often become the healers problem :P.

[Lictor]

I enjoy wizards in groups that burn caster mobs, don't really notice them much besides that

[Daywolf]

I guess whether to throw some roots on inc is down to taste.

ENCHANTERS: do you prefer to have someone root your mezzed mobs to help keep them locked down, or do you prefer to work without interference?

This seems like a really good tip, thanks for sharing. I guess when/if root breaks the mob will often become the healers problem :P.
imo not in a group most of the time. Maybe if the mob can't be controlled in some other way, or a mob breaks and interrupts your enc etc. Prob with roots, it causes most mobs to fight until they drop, which costs extra healing mana, which can slow group exp. Wizards are perfectly fine nuking mobs then conserving mana.

[Arclyte]

Wizards are perfectly fine nuking mobs then conserving mana white quadding solo

fixed

dont join a group as a wizard or you're a turd

[Daywolf]

fixed

dont join a group as a wizard or you're a turd
Well rooting isn't all that useful, not in a fine tuned group. That last % is better taken off than chasing around some retreating mob, or worse if it's rooted and keeps hitting you. If you have a couple dps/melee going, tank, some dd spells other than the wizard, than the wizzy is only taking down their contributed % on the mob like everyone else. That's just the design of them, doesn't make them turds or those that play them by design.

[Decad]

Seriously this is sound advice. Best wizards or druids know how to evacuation correctly. Too often my group will wipe with a dru or wiz and afterwards their excuse is always "sorry I didn't have evac memmed..."

Can't stress enough how helpful that spell can be in the hands of a good player.

Not only is this sound advice but this is pure basics.