Lower Guk

[maultar]

I'm looking at the eqatlas map http://www.eqmacwiki.com/eqatlas/lgukdeadmap.html
and is there a nice way to get to the lower end where the frenzy/hand/etc is without having to drop down by ritualist? I never really spent a lot of time in this zone on live. Thanks

[nilbog]

That is the best way to get there.

[maultar]

How many things will try to eat you once you drop down? And will pet drop down with you or train?

[Cars]

lol are you running your lvl 5 wizard there to get his staff of the wheel?

[Kruel]

there is the long way were u dont drop down. But either way if you drop down or not nothing past BR bats see through invis to undead up to frenzied

[Cars]

Yeah you will need to have both invis and ivu up to make it to the room.

[maultar]

OK thanks, nah its for exping and checking stuff out. So you ITU drop down and under the GIB room is a "safe hall"? To fire up the pet and buff up etc? I duo with my wife. If I get her killed she will smack my balls.

[Kruel]

hopefully one of you guys have a lull spell, so you dont get a whole room =P

[nilbog]

OK thanks, nah its for exping and checking stuff out. So you ITU drop down and under the GIB room is a "safe hall"? To fire up the pet and buff up etc? I duo with my wife. If I get her killed she will smack my balls.

Gotta be careful with the gargoyles around the bridge area. They see through invis to undead.

hopefully one of you guys have a lull spell, so you dont get a whole room =P

Lull needs nerfing. And by nerfing I mean.. making it as useless as it was prior to 2002.

[Cars]

Lull needs nerfing. And by nerfing I mean.. making it as useless as it was prior to 2002.

Thats how I remember it too! I thought I was either trippin balls or that my memory had completely failed me when I started on this server. I was very shocked to see how useful my pally's lulls were. But please don't nerf them, so handy haha

[Brambletoe]

yea lull never worked this well. I hardly ever remember using it with my cleric back in the day but on p99 it seems like its a clerics 2nd job.

[Fourthmeal]

lullz

[Hobby]

Lull needs nerfing. And by nerfing I mean.. making it as useless as it was prior to 2002.

Leave our paladins alone!

[Mcbard]

People probably just use it better now and know room layouts/mob counts etc.

[ziggyholiday]

People probably just use it better now and know room layouts/mob counts etc.

This

People are just much more savvy when it comes to EQ and MMOs in general now.

[Messianic]

Lull needs nerfing. And by nerfing I mean.. making it as useless as it was prior to 2002.

Are you referring to Lull the spell, or the lull effect in general? I always remember harmony being really awesome...

[nilbog]

I'm referring to lull, which people are purposely forgetting. This really deserves its own thread, I just hate to see lull being abused :T

Harmony was an entirely different case. It would *not* cause aggro, as it was flagged unresistable, it just didn't always activate.

Lull/pacify line etc was always terrible. It resisted 95% of the time. Anyone saying otherwise doesn't know wtf they are talking about, or is purposely mis-remembering so we do not nerf it.

Anyways, here's a discussion from lead designer Rich Waters, in 2002.


I've been following the threads here and on the Ranger's Glade about Harmony today and wanted to give some more information on the reasoning behind the change.

Harmony is the druid and ranger version of the lull line of spells. Several classes get these types of spells, with enchanters, bards, and clerics being the best at it overall. Lulls work by lowering the range at which monsters will attack you, allowing you to pull a single monster out of a group by lulling it's companions.

Traditionally, most lull spells haven't really worked very well. Lull had a high resist rate and wasn't very reliable. We've recently looked at lulls and improved the way they work to make them more useful to players. You should find that the lull line of spells works more often than it did, though it will still fail some of the time.

Harmony was unique in that when you cast it on an NPC, it never failed. This essentially means that Harmony could be used for risk-free pulling every time. All other lull spells have a resist check, allowing a monster to not be affected by them. The fact that Harmony can't be resisted made it the very best of the lull spells - which is an odd thing to happen to a level 5 spell.

We've had the ability for awhile now to make it so certain monsters were totally immune to being lulled. This is especially common in higher level outdoor zones such as Cazic-Thule, since Harmony would take any challenge out of splitting groups of monsters. Having a such powerful game dynamic with no risk of failure made these encounters too easy, so we were forced to make many monsters totally lull immune to compensate. With this change to Harmony, we'll now be able to remove the lull immunity from many monsters, and turn this ability into a useful spell line that gives great benefits, but with some risk that your spell may be resisted.

This week, we'll be adding an upgrade to Harmony that works on higher level monsters. We'll also be removing the lull immunity from many higher level monsters in outdoor zones, to accommodate the new spell. The higher level version of Harmony will have some chance of being resisted, but will be a fairly reliable way to split up groups of outdoor monsters. We do want this spell line to be a useful tool for you at all levels, but as with all other forms of crowd control there needs to be some chance that it won't always work. Druids and rangers should get a excellent outdoor lull, but a level 5 spell probably shouldn't be the best it ever gets.

- RichAnd...discussions about this:

http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1116&view=next

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=12697

http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?t=627

[Shiftin]

can't you just change the resist modifier in the spell file?

[SirAlvarex]

If you really want to change it, and have for a long time, what's keeping the change from happening?

Obviously the resist rates aren't classic, so shouldn't that be enough?

[Icaro]

Lull working = not classic

[nilbog]

Just explaining how it should work, for those who never used it pre-luclin.

I don't play on the server. I would hope that it would have been addressed by the playerbase.

When I saw how it was working, I was like wtf, /sad. So, yeah, that's enough evidence for me personally.

Uthgaard is working on the spells file; not me. Expect lots of spells to be returned to their classic state. Some better, some worse!

[Icaro]

Just explaining how it should work, for those who never used it pre-luclin.


I played only pre-luclin, and it makes a HUGE difference.

I remember perfectly that back in times at the appropriate levels you could not even think to go past Sebilis entrance or Karnor's moat without an Enchanter or a Bard to break the spawn in the classic way (hmm...mez?).

[maultar]

So back in the day harmony was the only good thing? Even enchanter lulls and paci's sucked? Only thing good about ench was mez or charm?

[Ralexia]

So back in the day harmony was the only good thing? Even enchanter lulls and paci's sucked? Only thing good about ench was mez or charm?

Yeah, lulls sucked. Ench still has slow, haste, mez, charm, color stuns(whirl stuns should get nerfed soon too), tash, clarity. Probably some more I forgot.

[nilbog]

So back in the day harmony was the only good thing? Even enchanter lulls and paci's sucked? Only thing good about ench was mez or charm?

Harmony is only used outdoors. Lull/pacify not working actually makes enchanters more useful, because mez should be a necessity at times.

[fischsemmel]

So back in the day harmony was the only good thing? Even enchanter lulls and paci's sucked? Only thing good about ench was mez or charm?

Is it just me, or should everyone in the game be forced to play an enchanter for however long it takes them to realize all the freaking amazing things enchanters can do?

[Henini]

classic requires tank cleric chanter as base of any group. that's how I remember it.
bard could kind of take the sport of the chanter but was a bit more gimp.
I never heard of people lulling stuff inside, only of harmo outside by druids. and the places where harmo is needed are very few.

Bracer quest in WW, other then that what? don't say karmors because that's always over camped and hard to find mobs up in there.