Necro Feign death not working all the time, whats up?

[Topgunben]

about 10 mins ago i was running from Lguk to Innothule and i picked up about 12 trash mobs on my run. I cast FD, but i didnt lose aggro. so i did it again, and still no loss of aggro. 2 more times trying after that and i finally died. i am level 51, so most of these guys were only hitting me for about 10 to 30 hp, but they wore me down.

Anyway, this has happened to me before a couple times where no matter how many times i cast feign death, i cant shake the aggro. Specifically one time in LoIO in the sarnak fortress throne room. there are a ton of trash mobs in there, and i just wasnt able to drop aggro after casting FD 3 times.

hopefully someone can shed some light on what i am doing wrong.

[Topgunben]

possibly found the answer to my own question. if mobs are currently casting a spell on me and then I FD, if there spell lands after I FD then it will break my FD.

does that sound right?

[Nitsude]

Yes. If a spell hits you after casting FD it will break it.

[Topgunben]

Yes. If a spell hits you after casting FD it will break it.

thank you for confirming

[Phantasm]

Worth noting that if a mob is casting any of the dispel line the cast will not break your FD and you will be successfully FD.

[Llandris]

60% of the time, it works every time.

[Swish]

Yes. If a spell hits you after casting FD it will break it.

unless it resists, right?

[Kiwix]

unless it resists, right?

Regardless since a patch a while back.

[Kiwix]

60% of the time, it works every time.

=P

[Necrostoner]

Don't have auto attack on is another good point for FD success.

[Varren]

I always keep a piece of yarn tied around my right pinky toe, which since a recent patch is supposed to help prevent FD fails. Can find in old patch notes or at monklybusiness

[koros]

I think they nerfed fd success rate in a recent patch, and jboot runspeed too.

[kotton05]

Before velious at some point wandering mobs pretty much would never forget you. Currently as a monk you can sneak them off or as a necro without sneak just after they mostly reset. Stand up from fd click your pre nerf cos. Most the time you'll be clear if not just repeat. /q'ing is still safest bet but I never use it anymore. I think they increased the mem blur rate at some point. Just a small fd rant.

[GinnasP99]

Worth noting that a level 35+ mob usually wont lose aggro until it has fully reset at its spawn point, or after a few successive FDs/successful monk sneak

[Night Shade]

Also note, if you a trying to FD off lots of mobs like 20 and FD fails on only one , that one mobs will re-transfer its hate to any mob close by.

So If you Have 20 mobs the systems checks each mob in your swarm and if only one fails and does not get its hate wiped all mobs close in the swarm will re aggro you.

[EQBallzz]

Sounds like spells were interrupting you. You have to time FD in such a way that nothing is already casting when you FD. If you FD before something starts casting and FD doesn't fail on it's own..it should work. However, if something starts casting just a tiny bit before your FD it will break even a successful FD.

I think 99% of the time this is what kills monks pulling. I know that's my biggest issue. If there are 2+ casters in a pull and they alternate casts in such a way that there is not enough break to get off a successful FD or it causes you to fail FD and it goes on CD while getting clobbered. This is where using LOS can help. I always try to pull around corners/obstacles to break LOS and help me get off a successful FD. Keep in mind that LOS works the same as FD. If a mob starts casting before you break LOS the spell will still land.

[dude]

Are we ever going to get revers kiting back? I would really like to play my necro again someday.

[Topgunben]

Also note, if you a trying to FD off lots of mobs like 20 and FD fails on only one , that one mobs will re-transfer its hate to any mob close by.

So If you Have 20 mobs the systems checks each mob in your swarm and if only one fails and does not get its hate wiped all mobs close in the swarm will re aggro you.

thats what i figured, so if the success rate is 90% for FD per 1 mob, the success rate on 20 mobs would be 12.15%

however this doesnt seem to always be the case, because i can pick up hundreds of mobs in Overthere and as long as i have a 4 seconds of space between me and them, I can FD and lose them all. I think distance might have something to do with success rate, but IDK?

[Bubbles]

Also, us necros don't get to use the broken sneak mechanic with our feigns.

[kotton05]

Also, us necros don't get to use the broken sneak mechanic with our feigns.

But you can basically wipe aggro with your pre nerf cos as you stand it seems

[Night Shade]

thats what i figured, so if the success rate is 90% for FD per 1 mob, the success rate on 20 mobs would be 12.15%

however this doesnt seem to always be the case, because i can pick up hundreds of mobs in Overthere and as long as i have a 4 seconds of space between me and them, I can FD and lose them all. I think distance might have something to do with success rate, but IDK?

Mobs in OT are not social to other mobs types. So a tiger is not social to a rhino, so they don't transfer hate to each other and cactus are not social at all.
Also, yes in an open zone there is a bigger chance of mobs not being close to each other. Unless you are trying to gather them together by moving in a circle.

Your level VS the mob level also determines mob aggro range and hate transfer range, also line of sight and if your are in sneak mode or if the mobs can no longer see you (invis.) all effect aggro and hate transfer range.

[Morbo the Annihilator]

Also note, if you a trying to FD off lots of mobs like 20 and FD fails on only one , that one mobs will re-transfer its hate to any mob close by.

So If you Have 20 mobs the systems checks each mob in your swarm and if only one fails and does not get its hate wiped all mobs close in the swarm will re aggro you.

What is this?

Are you referring to when you actually execute a FD?
or when you are trying to get up again?

there is no mechanic that allows FD to be a success against one mob but fail against another. FD either fails (falls to the ground message) or it succeeds (no message).
this is the same regardless of monk, necro or SK.

If you're trying to get up again though, there are more factors involved around clearing agro.
but OP was just referring to getting a successful FD off, and the only thing that will break a successful FD is a spell landing on you.


however:
Don't have auto attack on is another good point for FD success.
This is also something I've noticed.
FDing whilst autoattacking seems to cause problems, but i think that's more of a bug than anything to do with FD mechanics.

[EQBallzz]

What is this?

Are you referring to when you actually execute a FD?
or when you are trying to get up again?

there is no mechanic that allows FD to be a success against one mob but fail against another. FD either fails (falls to the ground message) or it succeeds (no message).
this is the same regardless of monk, necro or SK.

If you're trying to get up again though, there are more factors involved around clearing agro.
but OP was just referring to getting a successful FD off, and the only thing that will break a successful FD is a spell landing on you.


however:

This is also something I've noticed.
FDing whilst autoattacking seems to cause problems, but i think that's more of a bug than anything to do with FD mechanics.

Bug or not it does break FD. Should make a macro that turns attack off and then does FD to prevent this issue.

[Jorgam]

Same tragedy for monks. Oh how I miss you stonewall!

[Night Shade]

What is this?

Are you referring to when you actually execute a FD?
or when you are trying to get up again?

there is no mechanic that allows FD to be a success against one mob but fail against another. FD either fails (falls to the ground message) or it succeeds (no message).
this is the same regardless of monk, necro or SK.

If you're trying to get up again though, there are more factors involved around clearing agro.
but OP was just referring to getting a successful FD off, and the only thing that will break a successful FD is a spell landing on you.


however:

This is also something I've noticed.
FDing whilst autoattacking seems to cause problems, but i think that's more of a bug than anything to do with FD mechanics.

When you are trying to get up. As you said when you FD it works or it says you fell to the ground. like said before if it works and a mob was casting a spell it will still cause you to fail if you get casted upon.

[Night Shade]

I find it weird no one has mentioned the fact that a necromancers FD has a chance to automatically fail, as opposed to a monks FD, which will never fail.

Test it. Shit is classic.

Not true , Monks also get fell to the ground message, and can fail FD

[stormlord]

Regardless since a patch a while back.
So if you resist it, it'll still break FD? That's how it was originally? Ouch.

[stormlord]

Mobs in OT are not social to other mobs types. So a tiger is not social to a rhino, so they don't transfer hate to each other and cactus are not social at all.
Also, yes in an open zone there is a bigger chance of mobs not being close to each other. Unless you are trying to gather them together by moving in a circle.

Your level VS the mob level also determines mob aggro range and hate transfer range, also line of sight and if your are in sneak mode or if the mobs can no longer see you (invis.) all effect aggro and hate transfer range.
I don't think you addressed what Topgunben said? Topgunben said if FD success was calculated per mob in the swarm--like 90% chance to succeed each--then the more the mobs the less likely it'll succeed. Yet Topgunben might have 100 mobs in OT and consistently make a successful FD. So either FD success isn't calculated on a per mob basis, or it's much easier to FD in OT per mob.

Per mob checks go like this for a 1-mob swarm and 70% success rate:
1) 70% chance to succeed

2-mob swarm:
1) 70% chance to succeed
2) .49% chance to succeed

3-mob swarm:
1) 70% chance to succeed
2) .49% chance to succeed
3) .343% chance to succeed

Are you saying instead of doing a success check per mob it's adding up the "aggro threat" of the swarm? The way it might create the aggro threat is by summing up these factors:
1) Your level versus the average level of the swarm
2) The average social-ness of each member of the swarm to the other members
3) The average proximity of each member of the swarm to other members in the swarm

Once it creates the aggro threat, it compares this to the overall FD success rate (based on FD skill and class). This is similar to comparing the level and class of a npc caster to a player's level and resists to compute a hit.

When you get up after a successful FD, you might still get aggro:
4) LOS to the swarm, player sneak mode or player invis effect(s), proximity of swarm members to spawn point

[Night Shade]

I don't think you addressed what Topgunben said? Topgunben said if FD success was calculated per mob in the swarm--like 90% chance to succeed each--then the more the mobs the less likely it'll succeed. Yet Topgunben might have 100 mobs in OT and consistently make a successful FD. So either FD success isn't calculated on a per mob basis, or it's much easier to FD in OT per mob.

Per mob checks go like this for a 1-mob swarm and 70% success rate:
1) 70% chance to succeed

2-mob swarm:
1) 70% chance to succeed
2) .49% chance to succeed

3-mob swarm:
1) 70% chance to succeed
2) .49% chance to succeed
3) .343% chance to succeed

Are you saying instead of doing a success check per mob it's adding up the "aggro threat" of the swarm? The way it might create the aggro threat is by summing up these factors:
1) Your level versus the average level of the swarm
2) The average social-ness of each member of the swarm to the other members
3) The average proximity of each member of the swarm to other members in the swarm

Once it creates the aggro threat, it compares this to the overall FD success rate (based on FD skill and class). This is similar to comparing the level and class of a npc caster to a player's level and resists to compute a hit.

When you get up after a successful FD, you might still get aggro:
4) LOS to the swarm, player sneak mode or player invis effect(s), proximity of swarm members to spawn point

No I am not saying that, I am saying that once you get up , if a mob has hate and another one is close by that one mob will transfer its hate to another if it is social. Same way as if you pull a mob. If you pull a plant in OT they don't transfer hate because they are not social to each other, but in the case of a bird that did not get its hate 100 percent wiped and there is another bird close when you get up. The bird that still had some hate will transfer its hate and re agro the other close by that got wiped and both will come to you.

[stormlord]

Is hte tactic to FD multiple times to ensure none of them have hate anymore--so they won't surprise you?

In the case of OT, I understand they're less likely to transfer because it's a large zone and they're not usually social with each other, but wouldn't they still come back by themselves after "topgunben" gets up from feign death? Or is it the case they won't come back if they fail to transfer hate to something nearby? Something else?