Does Double Attack, Riposte, etc affect weapon procs?

[Ransurian]

This is probably a noob question, but...

Aside from PPM and such, I haven't been able to find a whole lot of information on how weapon procs actually work. Does anyone actually know whether events like Riposte or the "free swing" from Double Attack can cause weapons to proc?

I guess it boils down to whether or not the game considers the "free attack" from the above abilities to be a normal weapon swing. Is this the case, or does the game ignore those "free attacks" when it comes to weapon procs?

[Ransurian]

Good to know. ^^ Thanks. Hopefully my venomous axe of the velium brood won't be quite as underwhelming on my Warrior once I get Double Attack and skill it up.

[Tecmos Deception]

You cannot proc from a riposte, but you can from a double attack.

But does the PPM formula consider your double attack (and dual wield?)?

If 255 dex is 2.0 procs per minute... a chanter swinging his OT hammer will proc it twice per minute on average, regardless of his haste level.

But does a warrior with the same 255 dex proc more times per minute on average due to double attack? Or does each individual swing from the warrior, at a given haste level, have a lower proc chance such that his PPM remains 2.0 even though he has between 0 and X extra attacks per minute due to double attack firing off?

[Baler]

Also you can proc on a miss. How or why this is possible I do not know.
at least SK's can that I know of personally with vampiric embrace for example.

[Nibblewitz]

You cannot proc from a riposte, but you can from a double attack.

NPCs proc on riposte all the time.

[Jimjam]

Hackattack: Do you have logs showing a double proc with a double attack?

OP: You might be interested to know the off hand can proc even when duel wield fails to produce a swing. This is more important at low levels where duel wield is at a much lower skill.

Nibblewitz: NPCs cheat! I can confirm (at least for Furious disc) ripostes will not generate procs (earthshakers would be incredible if they did)... indeed (under furious disc) ripostes don't even seem to generate any aggro!

[Trazic]

Good to know. ^^ Thanks. Hopefully my venomous axe of the velium brood won't be quite as underwhelming on my Warrior once I get Double Attack and skill it up.

That weapon will not get better as you level. It will never be better than it was at level 1. Other weapons with much better ratios will surpass it.

[skarlorn]

NPCs proc on riposte all the time.

Npcs can proc on riposte but not players. Fact.

[Baler]

I'm pretty sure some if not most or all procs have a hidden cooldown. So you cant get procs back to back.
Just like how Mage pet's procs have a hidden cooldown before they can proc(cast) again.

So you can't get two procs because of a double attack. Two separate procs can proc back to back or even at the same time however. Such as Boon of the garouu and vampiric embrace. I've seen them both proc at the same time on 1 hit.

Inb4 this thread somehow get's proc's nerfed. >_<

---
And yes NPCs 'cheat'. Suspiciously coded for extra challenge.

[Jimjam]

That weapon will not get better as you level. It will never be better than it was at level 1. Other weapons with much better ratios will surpass it.

It get's 'better' when duel wield is first trained as proc:melee damage is initially heavily skewed in favour of proc at low skill... But it's still not amazeballs, as proc rate in secondary is half that of primary.

Npcs can proc on riposte but not players. Fact.

I've seen people advise using evasive on Venril Sathir and similar NPCs. The reasoning I saw is it reduces his proc rate. Can NPC's only proc on hits? I'm sure I've had sonic bats proc on me when they miss while under evasive, but I haven't looked at this in detail.

[Baler]

Can NPC's only proc on hits? I'm sure I've had sonic bats proc on me when they miss while under evasive, but I haven't looked at this in detail.

That's an interesting question. What if the npc in question isn't 'procing' and is actually using an instant cast spell that has a cooldown? :eek:

[Ransurian]

Hackattack: Do you have logs showing a double proc with a double attack?

OP: You might be interested to know the off hand can proc even when duel wield fails to produce a swing. This is more important at low levels where duel wield is at a much lower skill.

Interesting. So it's not true that double attack increases proc rate? That's a bit of a bummer. However, it's interesting that a weapon can proc in the offhand slot even when the weapon doesn't swing.

So, if I'm level 15 and I have a venomous axe and a Lammy, would it be more beneficial to have Lammy in my main hand and the axe in my offhand, or should I keep the axe in my main hand for more procs? They have a pretty similar ratio, but I think Lammy edges it out just a bit.

[Jimjam]

At that level stick best ratio in primary, which is lammy anyway. When the axe in off hand swings or procs that's just a bonus. If it swings and proc you won the lottery :P.


Also, on the double attack thing I don't know. I didn't ask for logs because I think it can't be proved, but rather because I don't know either way.

[fadetree]

The amount of swings, riposte or otherwise, do not affect the proc rate. It's based on time duration, and the rate or amount of swings do not matter.

[aaezil]

lots of random opinions in this thread and no proof of anything given yet...

[Jimjam]

Off hand proc on delay elapsing even when no swing produce is well documented.

Here are a few excerpts from a low level warrior off handing a polished granite tomahawk.

[Wed Mar 29 19:48:13 2017] A deepwater caiman tries to bite YOU, but misses!
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:15 2017] You crush a deepwater caiman for 30 points of damage.
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:16 2017] Your muscles bulge with berserker strength.
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:16 2017] A deepwater caiman tries to bash YOU, but misses!
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:16 2017] A deepwater caiman tries to bite YOU, but misses!

[Wed Mar 29 19:48:56 2017] Your will is not sufficient to command this weapon.
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:56 2017] You crush a deepwater caiman for 3 points of damage.
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:56 2017] Your muscles bulge with berserker strength.
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:56 2017] A deepwater caiman tries to kick YOU, but YOUR magical skin absorbs the blow!
[Wed Mar 29 19:48:56 2017] A deepwater caiman tries to bite YOU, but misses!

[Fri Mar 31 15:55:39 2017] Auto attack is on.
[Fri Mar 31 15:55:39 2017] You crush a deepwater crocodile for 28 points of damage.
[Fri Mar 31 15:55:39 2017] Your muscles bulge with berserker strength.
[Fri Mar 31 15:55:40 2017] A deepwater crocodile tries to kick YOU, but misses!
[Fri Mar 31 15:55:40 2017] A deepwater crocodile tries to bite YOU, but YOUR magical skin absorbs the blow!

[Fri Mar 31 16:01:19 2017] You are unstunned.
[Fri Mar 31 16:01:19 2017] A caiman tries to bite YOU, but misses!
[Fri Mar 31 16:01:19 2017] Your muscles bulge with berserker strength.
[Fri Mar 31 16:01:19 2017] You kick a caiman for 1 point of damage.7

And just to show it still works after the most recent patch:

[Mon Jul 17 10:55:35 2017] You crush a forest giant evergreen for 32 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:35 2017] You try to crush a forest giant evergreen, but miss!
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:35 2017] Kynzo strikes a forest giant evergreen for 6 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:36 2017] Your muscles bulge with berserker strength.
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:37 2017] Vonarn tries to crush a forest giant evergreen, but misses!
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:37 2017] Vonarn tries to crush a forest giant evergreen, but misses!
[Mon Jul 17 10:55:37 2017] You crush a forest giant evergreen for 29 points of damage.


I'll try capture a double proc on double attack too now, but I haven't had any luck yet.