Quick bard question before I dump 1000+ bone chips on her.

[Sicc]

Hey guys. I'm going to bone chip a bard right into crushbone, but wanted to verify the starting stats. I've seen some debate but just wanted one last check up.

Right now my half elf bard has 10 into dex, rest into cha. Playing an enchanter, I know what its like to try to max cha. I was wondering if 25 into cha was really the most effective I could place the points.

I'll probably start with lambent set, 55 hp rings, mistmoore drum and lute. Somewhere around that range of twinking. I intend on grouping mainly, and swarming as a last resort, or to blow through hell levels.

So 25 cha min/max? I don't know how difficult it will be to gather str or dex gear up to respectable amounts, while maintaining great cha.

Thanks

[branamil]

CHA is barely important for Bard. Do not recommend putting starting stats into into it. You will only need it for lulling and charming, which are pretty minor parts of barding. You can easily pump up your CHA with gear much later when if you really need to.

[Sicc]

Would you suggest mostly dex with some str? All dex? I was under the impression that charisma was very important for bards. Thanks for responding.

[MiRo2]

You will only need it for lulling and charming, which are pretty minor parts of barding.

Bard charm relies on MR resist checks, not CHA. Lulling is a major part of barding. A class that can get to mobs fast, single pull, mez/charm/snare on critical resists to stagger mobs into camp, pretty much the best thing since sneak pulling. The bottom line however, is that stats do not matter on a bard.

[Sicc]

Alright I suppose I'll just stick with 10 dex 15 cha. I realize the importance of lull on bard. Just wanted to make sure the missing 10 points aren't a crazy loss.

[Tupakk]

STA and STR. The rest of the stats are easy to g eat with gear. It really depends how you want to play your bard though.

[Sicc]

Group support mostly. Pulls, buffs, etc. I don't want to solo much in this game; not on bard.

[Tupakk]

Then STA all he way. More Hp equals more life.

[Arkanjil]

I would also recommend all in sta. Any leftover should go to dex.

[branamil]

lull is not nearly important enough to prioritize with starting stats.

*you can just keep a Crude Stein handy if for some reason you find yourself lulling a lot.

*monks usually insist on pulling anyways, bards need to stay at camp for mana song

*I had to lull 276 times while leveling, and I had to mez 3504 times.

*because you only need to lull on a full spawn, after that the spawns are staggered.

*cha is something like 5% of a lull check, its mostly level and MR.

*shamans, enchanters, and yourself can buff you with more 40 or 50 cha if you really need, more than you could hope to make a difference with in starting stats

[Sicc]

Compelling arguments for more survivability. Now I'm leaning towards stamina and dexterity.

I had considered carrying around spare charisma gear around for pulling, like those earrings from unrest, but I believe bards already have so much gear with songs on them, different weapons and instruments, I didn't want to be a walking bank.

I'm probably way overthinking this but I'm glad to have had some input from others. I'll probably reroll my bard in a few days. I have to finish farming the rest of the lambent set and I still gotta find some decent weapons.

[Xap]

I would just keep a Crude stein, +7 CHA wrists and a Squad ring (misty guards) in your bag for when you need them. That cheap (like under 50pp set) will give you a +34 CHA boost. Put the points in STA/STR and DEX.

[Amyas]

Dex/STA/CHA

[Legidias]

You dont need dex at all as a bard, other classes might care about fizzles, but we have 0 recast time and no mana cost so idgaf if missed notes.

Pure CHA gear is cheap (relatively). Kobold crown is like +30 cha for usually 200-400p.

STA all the way.

[MiRo2]

The bottom line however, is that stats do not matter on a bard.

50 Stamina at 60 is only 200hp. I've literally never been in a situation while leveling on any of my 4 bards where an extra 20 points somewhere would have a made a diference were it stamina, charisma, or dexterity. If you were asking what to put it into on a brand new sever in classic I would say strength all the way, bronze and lambent can get heavy with only 70str, but on a late velious server none of it really matters.

Min/Max'ing on a bard isn't about gear(except epic) or stats, its about playing the right songs in the right situation.

[Sicc]

Okay I can just balance out my starting stats then between Sta/Str/Dex I suppose. Maybe 5/10/10. With crude stein, that 30 cha helm, wrists, and a buff, that should be plenty fine I assume. Maybe I did over think it, just wanted to be sure.

With everyone saying different things, it seems subjective. Had everyone piled onto me repeating the same thing, I would've seen a definitive answer that maybe I hadn't known about before posting.

[Legidias]

Why do you keep goin back to dex lol. Its the most worthless out of the four options.

[Samoht]

50 Stamina at 60 is only 200hp.

That's not how this works. 200hp is actually a huge amount. HP grows in small increments, so you want to get it from every source possible.

Max STA and dump any remaining points in STR. STR because all of the races that can play bard have shit-for-stats at the start and you need the extra strength to be able to wear plate.

[MiRo2]

I'm not saying that 200hp isn't a big increase for hp. I'm asking what is the real difference between a bard with 4000hp and one with 4080hp? When I'm tanking on my bard, the healer can either keep me up or can't, a couple hundred hp doesn't really make a difference; and I'm rarely the best choice to tank in a group.

Stats don't matter on a bard, don't let a dilemma of where to put your points on creation delay you from playing the most fun class in EQ.

[Samoht]

I'm not saying that 200hp isn't a big increase for hp. I'm asking what is the real difference between a bard with 4000hp and one with 4080hp? When I'm tanking on my bard, the healer can either keep me up or can't, a couple hundred hp doesn't really make a difference; and I'm rarely the best choice to tank in a group.

Stats don't matter on a bard, don't let a dilemma of where to put your points on creation delay you from playing the most fun class in EQ.

HP on a Bard has nothing to do with tanking. You're going to need to survive AoEs, and if the extra HP can keep you up one more tick before the next group heal goes off, then it is well worth it.

[Legidias]

Not to mention free 80 hp to any melee class is always good. How much do you think a +80 hp option on an item would make it worth?

EQ stats arent about significant 1 single item boosts for the most part, its about cumulative shits from a ton of sources.

[SiouxNation]

You will only need it for lulling and charming, which are pretty minor parts of barding.

Lulling and Charming are big factors for group bard.

[Triiz]

Lulling and Charming are big factors for group bard.

I'm close to certain CHA has no impact at all on high level bard charming duration. In my experience, it either lands and lasts for max duration or it gets resisted. If it has any difference on charm resist rate or not, it's negligible.

Maybe it was different on live or years ago on this server, but semi-recently on P99 I leveled a bard 55-60 charming with around 120 CHA in normal gear and never had charm break the first tick like it does on my 255 CHA Enchanter sometimes. Either I've just had the luckiest RNG streak ever and my low CHA never caused an early charm break over thousands of charms of lvl 45+ mobs, or bard charm doesn't check against CHA for duration.

CHA gear for lulling is easy to come by and most of it is really cheap.

[Sicc]

Bard is still level 1. Has a few bags of bone chips but I have bags on alts I need to transfer to her as well.

Need the lambent pieces from Sol A and Lower Guk. Then need to get another bracer, which was pretty easy to get the drops from. Then I need to run the lambent stones back and forth. Still need weapons, too.

I rolled my bard with 5 in STR, 5 in CHA, and 15 in STA. So I still have time to reroll. Would just need to move the bone chips off again, which is no big deal.

What are some good earrings to twink with? Orc fangs?

[dafier]

I dumped as much STA I could in my woodelf bard.

You get STR + haste from almost all attack songs. Maybe put 5 in STR. A lot of gear has STR so that's why I dumped everying in STA.

If you can land Thurg armor for cheap, especially chest and legs, those give nice stats.

[MiRo2]

HP on a Bard has nothing to do with tanking. You're going to need to survive AoEs, and if the extra HP can keep you up one more tick before the next group heal goes off, then it is well worth it.

Maybe on how you play your bard. Personally the only time I find my self needing buffs on my bard is during a couple VP fights, or difficult duo/trio content. That's a difference of 2600hp and 4400hp, that I need for about 10% of what I actually do on my bard, the other 90% it literally couldn't matter less what my max hp is. That encompasses VP, all velious targets, group content, solo content, farming, and PvP.

HP is not the be all end all for bards, and not dumping creation points in STA doesn't make or break your character.

[Peacocky]

I would put it all on Sta.

Any left over, put it in Str.

Dex and Agi doesn't work on bard in p99.

As for Cha, you're better off being an Enchanter for charming.

https://i.imgur.com/6nFaTfY.jpg

[Samoht]

Maybe on how you play your bard. Personally the only time I find my self needing buffs on my bard is during a couple VP fights, or difficult duo/trio content. That's a difference of 2600hp and 4400hp, that I need for about 10% of what I actually do on my bard, the other 90% it literally couldn't matter less what my max hp is. That encompasses VP, all velious targets, group content, solo content, farming, and PvP.

This is just not true.

not dumping creation points in STA doesn't make or break your character.

This might be true... However, STA is the only useful stat to put starting points into, which answers the question that was asked. Your opinions don't really contribute to the conversation and might be confusing for someone who is just starting or new to raiding.

[Legidias]

The arguement that small accruement of hp from w/e source is negligible comapare to a big differeence (50hp from an earring or starter stats vs total hp diff of like 2600 to 4400) is stupid and doesnt work in EQ.

Try applying this logic to a war or knight class. Sure 50 hp isnt as significant as say a 1k hp difference, but theres a reason you hog as much +hp gains as possible even when its only like +20 or +40 hp. This game is based on building up stats from multiple sources so its stupid to only look at a single source of hp (in this example) and say its "worthless" when at 60 it gives like +50 hp.

And back to original topic of what the best starter stat is, to tide you through levelling up to 60 (cause starter stats are so important when youre raid geared and buff, you know?) is going to be mostly STA / some STR simply to live longer while levelling and be able to carry plate armor as an inherently low str class. If you can afford WR bags, ignore str altogether and get only sta because its the only stat that actually helps you out early - mid game of the ones you can dump.

Even if you want to take the negative approach and say how stats in general dont matter to a bard (which, yes they do matter), then simply go through which ones matter the very least and eliminate them.

Cha helps lulls, but it really shouldnt have much impact if youre lulling at a lower lvl vs other lower lvl mobs. By the time you actually need high CHA to lull youll have CHA gear up the ass.

Dex / agi is worthless

Int? lol

[Pindrought]

Dex / agi is worthless

wut

[MiRo2]

If you were asking what to put it into on a brand new sever in classic I would say strength all the way, bronze and lambent can get heavy with only 70str, but on a late velious server none of it really matters.

Starting stats don't matter for a bard on a server with an abundance of cheap decent gear. 2600 to 4400 is what my bard goes from unbuffed to fully buffed, scale it to whatever level range you want, but it's not necessary for 90% of barding, and only then at the end game.

Dump it all into charisma if you want, I'm not convinced any of them make a pratical difference while playing a bard; and I leveled a bard to 50 on blue during classic, another in the 40s recently, two on red, one 60 another 49. I've grouped a ton, solo'd at all levels, swarmed, raided; the only thing that matters is the right songs, for the right situations.

[indiscriminate_hater]

Jesus, lots of bad information in this thread. Most people posting have either never played a bard or have stopped after swarm kiting becomes hard at 55.

The most important stat is DEX, since, aside from twisting songs, the most important job a bard has is generating weapon procs. I usually finding myself starting a fight with double tash sticks so that the shaman can pull off a critical slow.

CHA is very easy to come by with gear, and you usually only need that in situations when you're charming - i.e. when you probably don't need the other stats. STA is always useful but the group utility lost between you eating 60 more hp worth of aoe and your tank eating extra rounds of mobs quadding in the 250s is huge.

Put 20 into DEX and 5 into STA and don't look back.

[MiRo2]

The most important stat is DEX, since, aside from twisting songs, the most important job a bard has is generating weapon procs.

If only bard stacking worked here like it did on live, DEX would be the be all end all for bards.

[Yasi]

I wouldn't put anything into melee stats, bc bard melee is crap anyways. You'll pull a lot, mez a lot (which means switching between targets a lot). I'd go CHA and STA. STR is Handy for looting a lot. Otherwise, I'd even consider INT for skill-ups, but I am not 100% sure that INT increasese skill leveling Speed. If it does, do it for wind/brass. Saves you hours.