Stormfeather -- Policy Incorrect?

[Rerfu]

https://i.imgur.com/SGEp6sd.png

I'm all for rules and policy, but a sleeping player holding a camp over someone who's actively playing the game. What does the server think? this seems like a bad joke.

[Synthlol]

You can AFK between spawns of your camp.

This has always been a rule, and you haven't presented any convincing argument for why Stormfeather should be any different. You're just whining that someone else has a camp you want, and that's why Menden got sick of talking to you.

[Leiker]

Seems fair to me.

Sounds like you are just upset you couldn't camp Stormfeather at your convenience.

[Baler]

Menden seems legit, good guy in my book.

@OP never publicly post interactions with staff. If you felt it was unjust, you should have only filed a petition on the forums in a polite manner.

[skarlorn]

sunds like he's making gainz in his sleep.

maybe you should take a leaf out his book!

[Rerfu]

I've never camped SF, I just saw it as a weird rule to a contested mob. I'm not whining I just think its very strange.

Edit: Also I'm streaming so my interactions with staff are never private. I don't see this as impolite.

[Leiker]

Then why are you petitioning guides and wasting their time?

[Rerfu]

Because I was questioning whether this was just a rumor or BS, or the actual policy. I've never heard of an AFK player holding a camp in an MMO let alone EQ.

[skarlorn]

because a guide telling you the rule means it's "probably just a rumor or BS"

wow dude smart!

[Synthlol]

Because I was questioning whether this was just a rumor or BS, or the actual policy. I've never heard of an AFK player holding a camp in an MMO let alone EQ.

Why is there a problem with a player leaving their keyboard when their mob is dead?

Do you really want to play an EQ box where you aren't allowed to leave your keyboard when your camp is clear?

[skarlorn]

i'd also appreciate a guide changing OP's in character name and surname which is a clear violation of naming conventions.

Thanks for posting!

[Rerfu]

No Skarlorn, I had heard of this policy from other players and petitioned the guide to confirm its authenticity.

Edit: Feel free to change my surname, yes I've heard about all the drama over names lately.

[Mauricio]

FYI - If someone is camping it for an alt, they forfeit the loot rights when they swap characters. Source: Sirken ruled this against me.

So opportunists out there, if you see someone camping for an alt, make them race you to the loot!

[Rerfu]

I've heard and seen similar things to that Mauricio. I guess the solution there is to level your alt to be strong enough to complete the camp.

[aMindAmok]

So, how long after it spawns before it's fair game? 5 seconds... 10seconds... 1 minute? What's the rule here. Just sitting there shouldn't be enough to claim a camp.

[Kaight]

So you sitting there, waiting for a spawn is "actively playing the game?"

[Rerfu]

As opposed to sleeping with the game open? yeah.

[Pokesan]

ya this quest sounds like a hoot!

[Kaight]

As opposed to sleeping with the game open? yeah.

Okay but REALLY, what are you doing? Watching TV? Bullshitting with people in tells? Staring mindlessly at the screen waiting for a cluster of pixels to appear? Is there really a difference if the "sleeping" camper is there to attack when it spawns?

[aMindAmok]

Also, lets say you are "camping" the spawn (aka sitting in the general vicinity of the spawn location) and I stroll up and try to talk to you. You ignore me (presumably because you are afk getting food or something). Time goes by. I try to engage you for the next 2 hours with no response. I now assume you are not even playing the game. The spawn pops and you don't move right away (presumably knowing full well that I am there for said camp) and I take the mob. Am I at fault for "camp stealing" or is it the camp holders responsibility to make others aware they are camping it?

[Leiker]

So, how long after it spawns before it's fair game? 5 seconds... 10seconds... 1 minute? What's the rule here. Just sitting there shouldn't be enough to claim a camp.

This question is not specific to Stormfeather camp though.

Any camp is forfeit if you do not engage the mob within a reasonable time.

I guess its up to GMs to define reasonable time.

[Rerfu]

Amind.. Its considered camp stealing for Stormfeather specifically. That's why I'm posing the question.

[aMindAmok]

I see. So Stormfeather is special.

[Rerfu]

I don't know if there is a set timer to engage a mob before the camp is forfeit. All the responses are reasonable amount of time.

[Phenyo]

Also, lets say you are "camping" the spawn (aka sitting in the general vicinity of the spawn location) and I stroll up and try to talk to you. You ignore me (presumably because you are afk getting food or something). Time goes by. I try to engage you for the next 2 hours with no response. I now assume you are not even playing the game. The spawn pops and you don't move right away (presumably knowing full well that I am there for said camp) and I take the mob. Am I at fault for "camp stealing" or is it the camp holders responsibility to make others aware they are camping it?

Yes. Players are not obligated to respond to you.

[Mauricio]

I've heard and seen similar things to that Mauricio. I guess the solution there is to level your alt to be strong enough to complete the camp.

I used druid (RIP Winchester) to camp it, because funny guys can't "accidentally" drop cougars on him, since druid isn't KOS.

Character I was camping it for was 58. Just didn't want to deal with trolls.

[Leiker]

What Phenyo said...

Furthermore, some people on this server do not speak a word of English.

Its not a requirement to speak English to play on P99

[Rerfu]

So essentially what we're saying is first character at a camp, or whatever list is made holds the camp AFK or not, responsive or not?

Edit: Yes most of us are aware the language barrier is real.

[Rerfu]

And if the consensus is my previous post then you come to the issue of gaining progression while AFK. You're holding a camp and you're sleeping. This is why its complicated.

[skarlorn]

it's not complicated.

as long as you keep the spawn point down, it's your camp.

[Kaight]

So essentially what we're saying is first character at a camp, or whatever list is made holds the camp AFK or not, responsive or not?

Edit: Yes most of us are aware the language barrier is real.

https://imgur.com/hE5r54n.jpg

[paulgiamatti]

Also, lets say you are "camping" the spawn (aka sitting in the general vicinity of the spawn location) and I stroll up and try to talk to you. You ignore me (presumably because you are afk getting food or something)... is it the camp holders responsibility to make others aware they are camping it?

No. The camp holder does not have to talk to you, or anyone. Let's be clear about that. Keeping a camp list is a courtesy, not a requirement.

Time goes by. I try to engage you for the next 2 hours with no response. I now assume you are not even playing the game. The spawn pops and you don't move right away (presumably knowing full well that I am there for said camp) and I take the mob. Am I at fault for "camp stealing"?

If you engaged, killed, and looted the item right away, then yes, because you didn't allow the camp holder to engage their own spawn even if they were present. Give them a minute or two. If I were in this situation, I would just send the camp holder a tell saying, "Hey, I'm going to kill this thing if it spawns, but I'll hold the corpse for you in case you come back before it rots." I have actually done this at Stormfeather, because some other shitheel was poised and ready to steal the spawn because he was angry that the camp holder was AFK. Sure enough, the camp holder came back about a minute after Stormfeather spawned, and I gave them the loot, and then the camp was mine and I got the next one. Let's apply the golden rule here, folks. What kind of server do you want to play on? Do you really want to be required to sit at the screen for 70-80 hours for fucking Stormfeather? Let's create the server that makes us all a little less insane, not more.

[aMindAmok]

Just trying to get a picture of said camp. Camping sucks. I get it. So, as long as I give a couple minutes, have logged my attempts to get their attention, and likely recorded the whole thing I would be good. Im not trying to find a way to steal a camp. Im just curious.

[paulgiamatti]

I wouldn't go so far as to say run fraps, but run logs and take some screenshots if you end up in that predicament, be honest, and don't be a dick. Your questions were clarifying; I'm actually responding to the OP.

[Rerfu]

I mean I posed the question mainly because I'm an officer in DB which is a giant leveling guild as you guys know.

So for the guys in my guild first time playing EQ, we just operate on: If someone is at the spawn AFK or not, just leave it alone?

Edit: And how do you get on the list for such a camp if the guy there is sleeping?

[paulgiamatti]

You're certainly welcome to wait around and see if they actually engage it, which in some cases could be expedient - if there isn't a camp list, you can ask them to start one, and if they aren't keeping one then you can make yourself next in line. In the case of Stormfeather, doing this is almost a requirement considering how the spawn mechanics work - you need to record a time of death in order to track each spawn window, which is why people opt to AFK at this spawn. The only time you actually need to be present at Stormfeather is during its 2-hour spawn window, which can be tracked if you know its previous time of death.

[Llandris]

Players will usually put the list in their AFK message as well.

[Maliant]

This guy sounds like this enchanter RockG that pestered me two nights in a row when I was camping A Frenzied Velium Broodling. Both times he showed u between spawns and asked me if I was camping said mob. I came back to my monitor before mob spawns to him telling me in broken English that I was AFK and had lost camp qualification. I politely told him to fuck off. He then tried KSing Frenzied when she spawned but failed miserably.

Eventually Llandris showed up and banished him from zone. One spawn cycle later he came back to my camp...

[Phenyo]

This guy sounds like this enchanter RockG that pestered me two nights in a row when I was camping A Frenzied Velium Broodling. Both times he showed u between spawns and asked me if I was camping said mob. I came back to my monitor before mob spawns to him telling me in broken English that I was AFK and had lost camp qualification. I politely told him to fuck off. He then tried KSing Frenzied when she spawned but failed miserably.

Eventually Llandris showed up and banished him from zone. One spawn cycle later he came back to my camp...

RockG does that to me all the time, guy needs a restraining order from velks

[Rerfu]

In response to the OP's name. There you go.

https://i.imgur.com/IYNs6Tk.png

[skarlorn]

you've gained my respek m8

[Fragged]

Should be moved to RNF so OP can learn what people think of them.

[Rerfu]

We're at about half information half RnF, I guess it will degrade to RnF once the forum trolls get home from work.

[Maliant]

Well at least you know how Stormfeather works now.

[Rerfu]

No doubt. Its legit info.

[Toomuch]

So, I can totally agree with how you can afk at a camp if you're the Camp Holder. It's kind of like waiting in line at your favorite Big Box Store for Black Friday - you're first in line, and you get first dibbs (usually ends up being a voucher for the big deal you want, handed out right before doors open). I agree with that because you put in the time, and you were physically there. This is similar to the "...a player should maintain a presence at or very near the spawn of the camp they are intending to hold..." portion of P99's Rules/Policies (see https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2651)

What I do NOT agree with is how lists are apparently enforced.

Apparently, if you so desire, you can be in line for camps, but not be there, as long as there is a Camp Holder that is holding the camp, and has stated what the list is when someone asks. And when it's time to hand the camp off, as long as the next person in line that list makes it back by that time, they are the new campholder. And here's the REAL kicker - that new campholder can decide/declare right then and there what the new list is, no matter who is present or not. GM's will only enforce the handoff to the official "next in line" at the time of handoff.

That's like a group of 10 friends/family waiting in line for Black Friday, 9 of them leaving to go get food and sleep in warm beds for the night, and having only 1 of them come back before Deal A opens up to get vouchers, and, get this, THEN they literally get to decide who is behind them in line, in whatever order they want, so they decide that the first 9 people behind them are the other friends/family, who again are not even there, followed by all the other people that are standing there in line, in the cold. Come time for Deal B's vouchers to be handed out, this group of friends/family just needs 1 of that declared group to be there, and they can rinse/repeat.

I shit you not, this is how it works right now. I logged in to Stormfeather camp today, to have the campholder be afk. Took him 3 hours to respond, which is fine, he was present. However, he then said that the list, according to him, had 2 other people on it in front of me, who were not in zone (meaning, they did NOT adhere to the "a player should maintain a presence at or very near the spawn of the camp they are intending to hold" rule). These 2 other players did show up about 4 and 5 hours later, respectively, and are currently in front of me in line. I went from "if Stormfeather spawned right now, it's mine, because this dude is obviously asleep," to being 4th in line, all without moving. I DO agree with being moved to 2nd in line, but not bumped to 4th. Those people left the zone, left the camp, did not "maintain a presence", and therefore they got out of line, and should not be considered in line, period.

In my opinion, two things/rules need to change, and be enforced:
1. If someone on the list leaves the zone for any reason, they are no longer on the list.
2. At the point of camp hand-off, the order of the list (those present only) does not change, it remains a "line", and nobody "cuts".

Even if GM's don't choose to be the ones to enforce this, this needs to be the new player agreement. Allowing A: people to be on the list and not present, and B: the new camp holder to decide a new list when they take over camp, that is simply a recipe for monopolizing the camp and manipulating the good intentions of the server staff.

These good intentions I bring up were to try and "help the little guy" be able to get on the list in order to obtain something they couldn't get otherwise, because they have a job/obligations/etc. With the twist on the specifics, it instead it makes it so that they get completely locked out, because an inner circle can control camps indefinitely. That is just absurd, is it not?

[Kaight]

We're at about half information half RnF, I guess it will degrade to RnF once the forum trolls get home from work.

"work" haha

good one

[fastboy21]

The handing off the camp off rule has always seemed like a scammers holiday to me.

So many ways that someone could abuse this policy if they wanted to be dishonest.

[aMindAmok]

The handing off the camp off rule has always seemed like a scammers holiday to me.

So many ways that someone could abuse this policy if they wanted to be dishonest.

Hint (its usually dishonest)

[Toomuch]

Hint (its usually dishonest)

EXACTLY! It's complete garbage! SO shady, inconsistent, drama-prone, etc. I bet GMs have gotten (and will get) more petitions because of this, than if it was fixed and enforced based off those 2 rules.

How can we go about legitimately trying to update/fix this? Honestly, is there a way to officially propose this?

[Runningfish]

Might seem dumb to you if you just got to the camp and learned this is the rule but when you've been there for 36 hours and SF just skipped again your going to be happy that you can sleep while you wait for the next window.

As far as the list goes. I go by the same thing you do. If someone asks me to put them on the list when they aren't actually at the hill and I'm holding the camp I just wont do it. In my opinion if you want to be on the list you need to actually be at the camp.

[Toomuch]

Might seem dumb to you if you just got to the camp and learned this is the rule but when you've been there for 36 hours and SF just skipped again your going to be happy that you can sleep while you wait for the next window.


Oh, I'm not saying you can't AFK and sleep - you totally can AFK and sleep, just like my analogy of being in line at the big box store on Black Friday. At the store, you bring a sleeping bag/tent, and sleep right there. In EQ, you leave your character afk and logged in, and you go sleep in your nice warm bed in real life. If you want to be extra good/nice, you can AFK with the message that you're camping Stormfeather, and maybe even include the list as it was at the time you went AFK.

The thing people really want to be OK is for them to not actually wait in line. They want to go DO other things in game, and pretend like they were also camping it, and come back and have 0 penalty for having gotten out of line. That's just dumb, mostly because it's unfair to the people who, like you, have put a lot into it.

In other words, someone who has been waiting at the spawn for 36 or 54 hours straight just to be next in line should not be able to be beaten out by someone who has been logged in a total of 2 hours during that time, or maybe not even logged in at all, let alone hasn't been in the zone at all. The fact that someone who isn't putting in the work/time can just do whatever and then be on top of the list, it just makes zero logical sense. If you don't put in the work, you don't get the reward.

I mean, I don't know how else to say it at this point. Should I walk up to Walmart on Black Friday, right before they open the doors, and be like "hey dudes, sorry, I was here earlier this week and got on the list, back off. Thanks for holding down the fort though!"

[paulgiamatti]

There are no server rules that dictate how camp lists should be enforced, so your gripe is entirely with the P99 playerbase. I'm sure it's been done before, but if I were holding a Stormfeather list I would simply say that you must be at the spawn in order to be next in line. When adding subsequent people to the list, I'd inform them that if they become runner-up (in the case that the current runner-up leaves or logs off), they must then be present at the camp or forfeit their spot. Any disagreement means they don't get to be on the list.

As long as it's consistent, and you're giving each player the exact same opportunity, it should be kosher under server law. The problem is getting this system accepted as server protocol, which probably couldn't happen without some kind of GM enforcement because most P99ers generally don't do things that require slightly more than minimal effort.

[Rang]

Instead of crying about the camp/list mechanics, how about just be glad it’s not an FTE rule mob so you don’t have anon A/A alts with auto fire on selling the LR every spawn?

[Lhancelot]

I am just glad I don't "need" this item.

Seems like a lot of drama over nothing tbh. So many other things in the game to do instead of get rustled over something like this.

Oh well, whatever floats ya'lls boats I guess. :p

[Wfrench1234]

No one “needs” it, but it sure is nice.

That being said, I just ignore it’s existe because I am not in a place where I can be available at the drop of a hat to check spawns

[Teako]

You are incredibly lucky that you did not get suspended for snarking off at Menden.

[fastboy21]

Good luck staying awake and never afking for 72 hours. Honestly, it's people like you that make that camp a living hell - having to take naps with one eye open to stave off the constant barrage of the clueless.

Learning how to sleep at your keyboard in a semi-functional state IS the game of EQ.

Classic.

[katrik]

This has been going on for years at AC. Whoever's camp it is can hand it off to whoever they want as long as the next person is there before respawn. If you think the list is bullshit, don't use the list, and when it is your camp give it to the next guy waiting there, or whoever you want. That's what I did at AC. Lists exist to enlist random people to help the cartel members get top priority. Don't use the list.

^this.

I think certain camps need certain rules. The amount of abuse I’ve seen @ AC is disgusting.

[loramin]

^this.

I think certain camps need certain rules. The amount of abuse I’ve seen @ AC is disgusting.

They actually had staff-enforced rules on live. If someone was camping X, and wouldn't give it up after they got their desired item (ie. not after they'd farmed ten copies of it over 20 hours) the GMs would intervene and force them to give the camp up to the next person on the list.

Many people aren't aware of this because of the general good etiquette of the population back then, athe lack of neckbeards monopolizing camps, and the variance between how different GMs handled things on different servers. However if you read the guidebooks written by Verant for GMs in that era stuff like that was clearly covered.

[fastboy21]

the problem is that some of the "problems of camping" are part of classic EQ.

The only way to really fix these issues would be to dismantle the mechanics and hardcode solutions into the game. Like adding first to engage messages to raid mobs as a solution. There could be a hardcode solution to policing lists at camps, announcing the loot a player got off a mob (signalling that his ownership of the camp was over), etc.

The obvious trade off is that hardcode solutions (i.e. changing the game) have consequences in their emerging play on the game itself --- when the mission of the server is to recreate classic eq (not fix classic eq) it becomes an situation where you have to trade off between fixing the game and recreate the classic one.

[Foxplay]

Lol this thread

[Lulz~Sect]

This thread reminds me how evil this game is.

[Lhancelot]

Lol this thread

[Ciksharn]

^this.

I think certain camps need certain rules. The amount of abuse I’ve seen @ AC is disgusting.

I've watched people corpse 5+ rings in one session. You can swim offshore of the island and see a pile of naked bodies just under the waterline

[Foxplay]

I've watched people corpse 5+ rings in one session. You can swim offshore of the island and see a pile of naked bodies just under the waterline

This would be because people rely on the honor system too much and never physically check in on the camp to the person holding it

[NachtMystium]

what was that word again...First To Engage.. I think that's all that matters, who cares what you're doing in between that time.

If I was jacking off or sleeping in between a mob spawn what does it matter if I come back in time to engage it?

[KENAK]

These people also used to kite SF around for however long it took to find a buyer for loot rights.

I personally think everything should be FFA. Highest dps wins and if you don't loot by the time lockout elapses, it's up for grabs. Only rules should be against harassment and training
Menden told me today that kiting/stalling non-raid mobs has a limit, in the range of 10 minutes or so. Another guide (Cylok? I'm bad with names) told me that someone can stall Lodi indefinitely if they'd like, so who knows I guess.

Great guy, by the way.

[Bristlebaner]

Guide 1, Mcafx 0

[thebutthat]

God damn it, Mcafx. Less forum bitching, more paying nybras back.

[Troxx]

Camps I've run with a list have operated under one basic principle:

If you fail to maintain a presence in the zone (preferably main), you forfeit your spot on the camp. For a camp like Stormfeather, that would mean that nobody is on the list unless physically (both in zone and NOT afk) at the time that the camp is ready to be turned over.

Ie those that want to be on the list cannot be logged in elsewhere for any reason. Otherwise those willing to forfeit right to play in other capacity are hosed.

For a camp like SF that has 36hr spawn + chance to skip? Going afk to sleep or do whatever else is A-ok in my book ... as long as you are at keyboard and ready when it pops.

[skarlorn]

dald i worry about you man

[SiouxNation]

dald i worry about you man

[TimTheToolmanTaylor]

i like how he gets his answer in one sentence and proceeds to complain to a guide about it. he doesn't agree with the rule, therefore everyone must change. lol.

[NegaStoat]

I just read the OP's post, not the pages of replies that followed. All I can say is, previous to Luclin or PoK dropping on Brell Serilis no one held an AFK camp while asleep of any sort. Like, anywhere. It was common policy to stroll up to a camp and if a player was there, folks would send them a /tell and timestamp it with a screenshot. Then they would try again after time passes, etc. Then if the mob popped they would just kill it. Or if it was a camp with multiple spawns the new player to the scene would wait for full respawns and then just kill them, and claim the camp.

On a single outdoor or indoor target, if you were AFK for over an hour you can bet your boots that the new player would wait to kill it and contest you for the KS, and let the chips fall where they may if a petition happened. This is P1999 though so guides make up whatever rules they have to with this max level heavy cancerous server.

[aaezil]

^ if you arent killing the mob you are camping immediately after it spawns on p99 then the camp is no longer yours

[Goodest]

So, how long after it spawns before it's fair game? 5 seconds... 10seconds... 1 minute? What's the rule here. Just sitting there shouldn't be enough to claim a camp.

[Legidias]

inb4 hadden thread

[Menden]

For the most part, a camp is yours as long as you have presence at that camp. If you die, go LD or leave the zone you can lose the camp if another player calls you on it. SF, AC, Lucan are no exceptions.

Staying awake for the duration of SF spawn is dumb and bad for your health, think about it.

Players can absolutely go AFK while camping SF, but they must engage within a reasonable amount of time. I would say 5ish minutes for this encounter. This mob is soloable so no real force is needed. With that, if Player A was camping SF, SF pops, Player A is throwing some buffs on and it takes 5 minutes and 10 seconds to do this(plus med time), I wouldn't advise Player B to attack SF, that'd be a douche move. If SF pops and Player A attacks SF and obviously kiting(delaying), then use your best judgement. But if you are going to step in and nab someone's SFs, there's always a chance you will be suspended so don't cry to me, be damn well sure you are in the right because if that kiting player is trying to slow/snare/gain mana/whatever and you use this post as an excuse to attack SF, I will come down on you hard.

Also with SF, there's no PHs or guards to keep down. It's no different than AFKing between spawns for any other camp like Ass/sup, oot AC, frenzy, ect...

Responding to a CC is not a requirement, but it's a nice thing to do.

These people also used to kite SF around for however long it took to find a buyer for loot rights.

Selling SF loot rights, this is a douche move, I will suspend you for it under PNP.

They actually had staff-enforced rules on live. If someone was camping X, and wouldn't give it up after they got their desired item (ie. not after they'd farmed ten copies of it over 20 hours) the GMs would intervene and force them to give the camp up to the next person on the list.

Many people aren't aware of this because of the general good etiquette of the population back then, athe lack of neckbeards monopolizing camps, and the variance between how different GMs handled things on different servers. However if you read the guidebooks written by Verant for GMs in that era stuff like that was clearly covered.

I've watched people corpse 5+ rings in one session. You can swim offshore of the island and see a pile of naked bodies just under the waterline

Corpsing AC rings, We've started handling lore camps differently lately due to the abuse. Corpsing AC rings is a douche move, get your ring and pass the torch. I haven't seen any petitions lately complaining about AC abuse, the price is dropping also which is nice. If you are a player waiting for this camp and see someone corpsing a ring, let us know, be sure, don't waste our time. SOW pots are better anyway :P

Menden told me today that kiting/stalling non-raid mobs has a limit, in the range of 10 minutes or so. Another guide (Cylok? I'm bad with names) told me that someone can stall Lodi indefinitely if they'd like, so who knows I guess.

Great guy, by the way.

Delaying a kill(kiting), 5-10 minutes is fairly reasonable, it all depends on the situation. Like I said before, don't kite a mob around waiting for your raid force for more then 5-10 minutes if you get FTE, be ready to engage. And if you are watching someone else do this, be sure they are truly delaying, don't let the pixelfever get the best of you.

Camps I've run with a list have operated under one basic principle:

If you fail to maintain a presence in the zone (preferably main), you forfeit your spot on the camp. For a camp like Stormfeather, that would mean that nobody is on the list unless physically (both in zone and NOT afk) at the time that the camp is ready to be turned over.

Ie those that want to be on the list cannot be logged in elsewhere for any reason. Otherwise those willing to forfeit right to play in other capacity are hosed.

For a camp like SF that has 36hr spawn + chance to skip? Going afk to sleep or do whatever else is A-ok in my book ... as long as you are at keyboard and ready when it pops.

Unofficially speaking, AC camp, sure. If you are next at the list I would stay near by so the trade off can happen quickly. If the list keeper gets his spawn and leaves and you are not there, you can lose the camp. For SF, I find it dumb to have to stay in the zone for that long. But if you wish to keep your spot it's in your best interest to be there during the spawns.

The thing is, lists are really driven by the players, if you are the list keeper it's in your rights to tell people if they want on the list, they must stay in the zone.


Here's the thing folks, we want people to have fun, but there are lots of players who like to abuse what we say and what few rules we have out there. If we suspect you are lawyerquesting or being a dick, we have no issue suspending you for PNP. If you feel I'm not being fair, go speak to Llandris, Braknar or Sirken. Don't be a jerk to me, I'm really here to help you guys enjoy the game.

If you ever need help understanding how a camp in particular works, don't be afraid of posting in the petitions / exploits forums asking a question, I'm happy to work it out with you. But keep in mind, we don't have solid rules written down for specific camps because every situation is different, but we do state guidelines here and there.

[Splade]

5 minutes is NOT a reasonable amount of time to wait for any non raid mob in the game. You might as well ask someone trying to contest said mob to call them on the phone to ask if it's okay to kill the mob they aren't caring enough about to pay attention to.

I've waited a minute at most for everything I've killed, including SF. I have not yet been banned in this game, period.

1 single minute is all anyone needs. Camping a mob SHOULD require at least the diligence of an alarm clock. Its called preparation. Buff before the mob spawns. If you don't know the timer, then you shouldn't be truly AFK to begin with and the whole waiting nonsense is moot point (at least in my book).

If someone's holding a camp and starts buffing shortly after it spawns, kudos bro its yours. If a minute passes without a single move from the camper? Shit is fair game.
GM said 5 minutes the fair amount of time so it doesn't fucking matter what you think. Enjoy eating a ban next time you want to be a dick

[fastboy21]

5 minutes is NOT a reasonable amount of time to wait for any non raid mob in the game. You might as well ask someone trying to contest said mob to call them on the phone to ask if it's okay to kill the mob they aren't caring enough about to pay attention to.

I've waited a minute at most for everything I've killed, including SF. I have not yet been banned in this game, period.

1 single minute is all anyone needs. Camping a mob SHOULD require at least the diligence of an alarm clock. Its called preparation. Buff before the mob spawns. If you don't know the timer, then you shouldn't be truly AFK to begin with and the whole waiting nonsense is moot point (at least in my book).

If someone's holding a camp and starts buffing shortly after it spawns, kudos bro its yours. If a minute passes without a single move from the camper? Shit is fair game.

I think the 5 minutes isn't just a reaction time, its the amount of time someone can reasonably have to prepare for the fight (medding, waiting on a pather, etc.). Some camps, especially when held at the zone appropriate level, five minutes isn't an unreasonable amount of time imo.

I also wouldn't support a high level sitting at the spawn with a stop watch and engaging at 5:01 when their is a group actively clearing, medding, etc. towards their named spawn. Kinda falls into the category dick baggery.

[loramin]

though I do not see that changing anytime soon unless you make that a sticky or really follow through with some suspensions. Easy to claim ignorance when it's one line in a sea of posts.

I've been trying to archive relevant staff responses on the wiki on this page: http://wiki.project1999.com/Rulings. It's a work in progress, and I doubt anyone knows to check it since I haven't publicized it at all, but hopefully it's a small step toward solving the more general problem that you raised (a staff member says something here and then it gets lost/forgotten because no one knows about it).

[gkmarino]

FYI - If someone is camping it for an alt, they forfeit the loot rights when they swap characters. Source: Sirken ruled this against me.

So opportunists out there, if you see someone camping for an alt, make them race you to the loot!
Firstly:
I thought if you didn't own the kill you don't have any rights to the loot on the corpse. I remember hearing that you can't loot any corpse even if it is about to rot if you don't have permission from whomever owned the kill.

Secondly:
What if you are on an alt, camping this for a main? As long as you haven't looted one already whilst taking your turn at the camp. I understand not wanting jerks to camp it for their low level alts or monopolize lore items. However, hear me out.

What if you are on a main which is a class that risks dying when AFK? If I want to camp this on my 60 warrior and "sleep" which Menden says is healthy. What's to say that midnight doesn't eventually find me and kill me. What if someone trains midnight way past me to align the path-back on to me, that could make it harder to prove that you were trained. Many times I've died to midnight while trying to maintain presence at SF camp.

Am I being unreasonable here?

[gkmarino]

That's the best you could come up with? Go back to the drawing board
Seriously i've never heard of people being able to loot npc corpses that they haven't killed.

[Tupakk]

For the most part, a camp is yours as long as you have presence at that camp. If you die, go LD or leave the zone you can lose the camp if another player calls you on it. SF, AC, Lucan are no exceptions.

Staying awake for the duration of SF spawn is dumb and bad for your health, think about it.

Players can absolutely go AFK while camping SF, but they must engage within a reasonable amount of time. I would say 5ish minutes for this encounter. This mob is soloable so no real force is needed. With that, if Player A was camping SF, SF pops, Player A is throwing some buffs on and it takes 5 minutes and 10 seconds to do this(plus med time), I wouldn't advise Player B to attack SF, that'd be a douche move. If SF pops and Player A attacks SF and obviously kiting(delaying), then use your best judgement. But if you are going to step in and nab someone's SFs, there's always a chance you will be suspended so don't cry to me, be damn well sure you are in the right because if that kiting player is trying to slow/snare/gain mana/whatever and you use this post as an excuse to attack SF, I will come down on you hard.

Also with SF, there's no PHs or guards to keep down. It's no different than AFKing between spawns for any other camp like Ass/sup, oot AC, frenzy, ect...

Responding to a CC is not a requirement, but it's a nice thing to do.



Selling SF loot rights, this is a douche move, I will suspend you for it under PNP.





Corpsing AC rings, We've started handling lore camps differently lately due to the abuse. Corpsing AC rings is a douche move, get your ring and pass the torch. I haven't seen any petitions lately complaining about AC abuse, the price is dropping also which is nice. If you are a player waiting for this camp and see someone corpsing a ring, let us know, be sure, don't waste our time. SOW pots are better anyway :P



Delaying a kill(kiting), 5-10 minutes is fairly reasonable, it all depends on the situation. Like I said before, don't kite a mob around waiting for your raid force for more then 5-10 minutes if you get FTE, be ready to engage. And if you are watching someone else do this, be sure they are truly delaying, don't let the pixelfever get the best of you.



Unofficially speaking, AC camp, sure. If you are next at the list I would stay near by so the trade off can happen quickly. If the list keeper gets his spawn and leaves and you are not there, you can lose the camp. For SF, I find it dumb to have to stay in the zone for that long. But if you wish to keep your spot it's in your best interest to be there during the spawns.

The thing is, lists are really driven by the players, if you are the list keeper it's in your rights to tell people if they want on the list, they must stay in the zone.


Here's the thing folks, we want people to have fun, but there are lots of players who like to abuse what we say and what few rules we have out there. If we suspect you are lawyerquesting or being a dick, we have no issue suspending you for PNP. If you feel I'm not being fair, go speak to Llandris, Braknar or Sirken. Don't be a jerk to me, I'm really here to help you guys enjoy the game.

If you ever need help understanding how a camp in particular works, don't be afraid of posting in the petitions / exploits forums asking a question, I'm happy to work it out with you. But keep in mind, we don't have solid rules written down for specific camps because every situation is different, but we do state guidelines here and there.

Ummm I don’t have to time to camp a potential 72hr spawn so when I finally get to this quest I will pay for it. You can’t penalize someone for trying to make a dime for waiting and camping something that is a good 70% of how the p99 economy works.

I don’t like to disagree with y’all but on this one I would fight for my seller til the cows came home if someone wanted to play the petiton game cause I looted the corpse that I paid for.

Sorry

[Nixtar]

Ummm I don’t have to time to camp a potential 72hr spawn so when I finally get to this quest I will pay for it. You can’t penalize someone for trying to make a dime for waiting and camping something that is a good 70% of how the p99 economy works.

I don’t like to disagree with y’all but on this one I would fight for my seller til the cows came home if someone wanted to play the petiton game cause I looted the corpse that I paid for.

Sorry

That would be a very one sided fight though.

Also, I don't have the money for this kind of camp. Having people sitting around it perma-camped means I can't enjoy content because the fat cat squad sells/buys MQ/loot rights among themselves.

[Tupakk]

That would be a very one sided fight though.

Also, I don't have the money for this kind of camp. Having people sitting around it perma-camped means I can't enjoy content because the fat cat squad sells/buys MQ/loot rights among themselves.

Not to be rude but sorry get more money. You might want to sit at a camp for 72 hours but I don’t.

You’ve been here for 3 years if you haven’t accquired enough plat to pay for a time sink camp maybe you should rethink how you make plat.

I for one would rather pay for this camp versus doing it because of how long it takes to get the mob to spawn.

[Jimjam]

Not to be rude but sorry get more money. You might want to sit at a camp for 72 hours but I don’t.

You’ve been here for 3 years if you haven’t accquired enough plat to pay for a time sink camp maybe you should rethink how you make plat.

I for one would rather pay for this camp versus doing it because of how long it takes to get the mob to spawn.

Acquiring plat is only really relevant if you want to spend plat, which from Nixtar's previous post appears not to be the case. He seems interested in doing the camps himself, and seems frustrated that players can circumvent 'no drop' restrictions through MQ/loot rights.

[Tupakk]

Acquiring plat is only really relevant if you want to spend plat, which from Nixtar's previous post appears not to be the case. He seems interested in doing the camps himself, and seems frustrated that players can circumvent 'no drop' restrictions through MQ/loot rights.

That’s classic. If he wants the camp then he will have to wait for it to open and he can get it.

If he chooses to be a little petiton bitch and QQ because I paid for it then he will get my full wrath.

[paulgiamatti]

I think what Menden is referring to is the douchebags who kill SF and then try to auction off the loot rights in /ooc to the highest bidder, which would potentially end in a rotted map piece if they don't find a buyer. That shit should absolutely be punished. Having a prearranged deal set up where you pay to come and loot the map piece and no one's the wiser should be kosher.

[Maliant]

DAP Black-list?

[Jimjam]

That’s classic. If he wants the camp then he will have to wait for it to open and he can get it.

If he chooses to be a little petiton bitch and QQ because I paid for it then he will get my full wrath.

Don't you think that you're having it both ways by suggesting it is classic to camp the piece, but also that petitioning makes him a little bitch?

I never heard back from a petition during classic, but I believe that was a time zone issue. For people who had play times matching CSR, I'm pretty sure petitioning was a thing?

[Teako]

It is not against the rules to buy loot rights. People have been selling epic fight loot rights for 5 years, and have never been punished.

Guilds have sold rotting raid loot rights since VP days.

There is 2 threads selling lodi map loot rights. There is 3 threads open selling Neriad Shawl loot rights. People sell +6 loot rights all the time.


Looks like you have a LOT of work to do Menden. TONS of people are selling loot rights, and have been for years.

[Alanus]

Considering how long of a spawn stormfeather is, that's fair. Otherwise people would have to stay up several days in a row. That's not fair

[d3r14k]

DAP Black-list?

When someone is put on the DAP Blacklist and is forced to walk:

Edit: I'm kidding of course. This rarely happens in my experience.

[Puluin]

That’s classic. If he wants the camp then he will have to wait for it to open and he can get it.

If he chooses to be a little petiton bitch and QQ because I paid for it then he will get my full wrath.

I normally don't chime in on stuff like this, but seriously tupakk, you are the little bitch by not rightfully earning what you loot. If you want stormfeather you better be willing to put in the effort for it. Paying for instant gratification is the same as acting like a little self entitled kid.

[d3r14k]

I normally don't chime in on stuff like this, but seriously tupakk, you are the little bitch by not rightfully earning what you loot. If you want stormfeather you better be willing to put in the effort for it. Paying for instant gratification is the same as acting like a little self entitled kid.

By this logic, does this extend to every twinked character who has not "earned" what they have looted? Are people guilty who have spent hours via alternate means of accumulating platinum versus spending hours camping something highly contested?

Is everyone who doesn't adhere to the Auld Lang Syne playstyle simply HEATHENS!?

Or does this only apply to NO DROP / highly contested items?

This is a slippery slope line of thinking, in my opinion. I believe if you've got the platinum and someone is willing to give you the loot rights, there is no problem with that. Situations like these is what makes the economy relevant. The downside being that this could encourage neckbeards to farm the hell out of camps like Stormfeather, but I'm with Tupakk in the sense that I don't really want to sit at a camp for 72 hours either.

[Puluin]

In regards to twink toons, I feel most of those lower priced easy to aquire items from the ec tunnel are considered "hand me downs" after getting new gear you gotta clean out your bank somehow. It's just a matter of are you a jerk and expect top dollar on that sale? Or are you a more reasonable person and will pass on the item to someone who will use it for avg or lower price or even for free. This feeling applies to tradeable items. In regards to no-drop items, yeah you damn well better be willing to put in the time and effort to get that drop. Even if all that effort is just sitting at the camp. It shows you really want that item. I firmly do not agree with MQ sales just for the sake of earing plat. However if you honestly have a left over whatever from times past and need to get rid of it, that's fine! Just don't perma camp the same mob over and over and over just for plat. ( I consider this duchebaggery) i.e. all those people trying for lodi just to sell the item for plat should go find something better to do.

[Tupakk]

I normally don't chime in on stuff like this, but seriously tupakk, you are the little bitch by not rightfully earning what you loot. If you want stormfeather you better be willing to put in the effort for it. Paying for instant gratification is the same as acting like a little self entitled kid.

When you do as much as I do you come back to me and tell me if you got 72hrs to sit and stare at snow. It’s not about being entitled it’s the sheer fact of I just don’t have that kind of time to sit.

[Puluin]

, but I'm with Tupakk in the sense that I don't really want to sit at a camp for 72 hours either.

then you obviously don't need stormfeather that bad.

[Puluin]

When you do as much as I do you come back to me and tell me if you got 72hrs to sit and stare at snow. It’s not about being entitled it’s the sheer fact of I just don’t have that kind of time to sit.

And that's why the afk thing is allowed.... *facepalm* if you really don't want to put forth the effort to get it done, you really don't need the item. Park your toon at the camp, stay logged in, set an alarm, and go do something else outside the game! Read a book! Work on guild stuff! Plan raids! Bullshit with friends via tells... there's a ton of things to do while waiting for your pop.... don't forget about /gems

Edit: as an after thought, you could be a real nice guy and buff / help lower levels kill cougars while waiting... I feel this choice best shows the PNP spirit.

[Tupakk]

And that's why the afk thing is allowed.... *facepalm* if you really don't want to put forth the effort to get it done, you really don't need the item. Park your toon at the camp, stay logged in, set an alarm, and go do something else outside the game! Read a book! Work on guild stuff! Plan raids! Bullshit with friends via tells... there's a ton of things to do while waiting for your pop.... don't forget about /gems

You are very much right or I could just swing around with the plat I’ve been earning for this camp and buy it from the person that wants to sit there non stop to sell it to me.

What’s the point in making all this plat if I can’t spend it. It does no good sitting in the bank unless they want to implement interest saving accounts. I’m sorry you don’t have plat to spend but I do and I value my time into plat.

As I’ve said I don’t have 72hrs of my life to give up. You might and gratz sell me the LRs or gtfo so I can find someone more willing.

[Puluin]

BUT.... you are NOT giving up 72 hours of your life.... the window is 2 hours, if you set an alarm.... oh look! you only need to pay attention for 2 hours... for the rest of the time figure out something positive to do.

[NegaStoat]

GM said 5 minutes the fair amount of time so it doesn't fucking matter what you think. Enjoy eating a ban next time you want to be a dick

This. If it's a camp with multiple mobs and all mobs are fully respawned, take it all. Maintaining a presence and all of that, as per the rules. For a single target mob, /con, /time, /tell the camper "clock is running", screenshot, and drop the nuke on the mob at 5:30 if stalling is happening with a fresh /con, /time screenshot taken. My policy on the subject from here on out.

[Nixtar]

Time = money

This simple statement is true inside and outside of p99, I suggest you accept it or quit worrying about how others choose to spend their time.

That is soulcrushingly depressing to hear though but sure if people approach P99 the same way as wasting away in an office cubicle they are of course free to do so. I mean, shit, to approach a game with the mentality "time is money."

I guess I should stop enjoying the game and focus on upping my plat farm. lolololol.

[Puluin]

Puluin is living in a world that is not p99. Its fine to take this approach but don’t expect everyone to agree with your choice.

Time = money

This simple statement is true inside and outside of p99, I suggest you accept it or quit worrying about how others choose to spend their time.

More like I'm a decent person that understands greed doesn't bring joy or happiness.

[Legidias]

The argument you have to earn it yourself and that you want others to do the same is ridiculous. Look at this situation if it was in real life.

You have a job. You work in an office, or in a factory, or whatever. After your work day of 8 hours (or so), you go to the super market on the way home to grab some food. This trip takes about 30 minutes. When you park, suddenly some crazy ass hippies ambush you and yelling how you aren't earning your food and that you have to spend the time to farm and hunt it yourself.

If they want to live on a farm and spend ALL their time just growing food to eat, thats fine and its their way of life. But its ridiculous to try and push their niche way of life n the vast majority of people.

Just because they're not spending 72 hours at a camp, doesn't mean they're not "earning" it. They've earned it (via paying plat for LR) by earning money doing something else. Its not like they just started the game and on their level 1 get loot rights.

The ALS playstyle is fine, but dont try to push that onto other players. I don't even like the MQ economy in general (shoot, I dont even get JBoots, I just get sow pots or traveler's boots on my chars) cause it breeds toxicity, but fair is fair in a buyer / seller market.

[Puluin]

The argument you have to earn it yourself and that you want others to do the same is ridiculous. Look at this situation if it was in real life.

You have a job. You work in an office, or in a factory, or whatever. After your work day of 8 hours (or so), you go to the super market on the way home to grab some food. This trip takes about 30 minutes. When you park, suddenly some crazy ass hippies ambush you and yelling how you aren't earning your food and that you have to spend the time to farm and hunt it yourself.

If they want to live on a farm and spend ALL their time just growing food to eat, thats fine and its their way of life. But its ridiculous to try and push their niche way of life n the vast majority of people.

Just because they're not spending 72 hours at a camp, doesn't mean they're not "earning" it. They've earned it (via paying plat for LR) by earning money doing something else. Its not like they just started the game and on their level 1 get loot rights.

The ALS playstyle is fine, but dont try to push that onto other players. I don't even like the MQ economy in general (shoot, I dont even get JBoots, I just get sow pots or traveler's boots on my chars) cause it breeds toxicity, but fair is fair in a buyer / seller market.

Why are you playing everquest if you treat it like a job? I feel that completely defeats the purpose of a video game.

[Legidias]

Why are you playing everquest if you treat it like a job? I feel that completely defeats the purpose of a video game.

I guess the reading comprehension is lost on you, and you can't relate similar matters without them being exactly the same.

Why would you spend your time in a game, on something boring, monotonous, and not making any money or benefits (until the end), when you could have fun doing something else, which in the long run, nets you enough money to buy the item you would have had to camped like a job, plus you have profits from xp/farming for 72 hours instead of sitting on an island catching snowflakes on your tongue.

If anything, you earn it more by actively making plat than just sitting in a pool of ice and water for hours on end.


(also, in terms of previous post about afk camping, thats for when you're actually killing / looting / doing something in the game while YOU do not make any input. Just holding a spot with timer for you to check in and press auto attack is fine. What would not be fine is having a third party macro that spams a pet attack on a mob which would kill mob for you while youre afk.)

[Nixtar]

Look at this situation if it was in real life.


It isn't. Stop.

I mean, let's look at real life as if it was Everquest. If you walk up to someone and kill them and start shouting loudly if anyone want to buy their stuff before the corpse rot you'd go to jail or worse.

Also, if you want to gain the affection of someone do not try and start killing people who might not like them for faction.

Also, do not try and feign death at banks to improve your chances.

[Legidias]

Stuff

I guess the reading comprehension is lost on you, and you can't relate similar matters without them being exactly the same.

[Nixtar]

Someone does not agree with me / think my shitty analogy is shit. Must struggle with reading comprehension.

[skarlorn]

this is hilarious

pls elaborate on PNP while allowing people that are asleep to claim camps

5-star thread



copy/paste from: https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132299

this is why i don't play on this server anymore, i don't feel its being taken serious anymore

Gosh your volunteer staff of a free emu server of a game you beat ten years ago isn't serious enough for you...?

SE k help

[bum3]

Isn't that what guides are for? I mean, it isn't a classic live rule. At least not when I was a guide on Tunare. And it is very confusing considering some camps are who ever tags it first. Some are camps that you claim. Some can't be claimed.

I used to send a camper a tell. Wait 15 minutes. Send another tell. If no answer, new person got camp. The amount of players who fell asleep at keyboard or went to work was crazy.

[Leiker]

It's not really confusing except if you want to be obtuse on purpose.

Also, guides told you in this thread that if you have any questions, you are welcome to petition and ask for a clarification.

[bum3]

It's not really confusing except if you want to be obtuse on purpose.

Also, guides told you in this thread that if you have any questions, you are welcome to petition and ask for a clarification.

Maybe not to a poopsocker. But to us that can only play a couple times a week and haven't memorized an invisible list, it's not clear.

Guide also told OP to post here in Server Chat. Maybe the guide knew the fanboys would get triggered and treat OP this way. Maybe it was a trap. Or maybe OP was just being an ass.

[Rerfu]

I wasn't trying to be an ass. Many players in our guild are first time Everquest players.. I know hard to believe right? And I was asking for a rule clarification. All of this has been resolved yet the thread continues.

[Valrok]

I have successfully camped the stormfeather map piece twice on this server. What that GM is saying is exactly how it works. If a druid or anyone else that didn't wait (sometimes days or a week) to get the spot, then he needs to get in line.

Once it is your camp, it is up to you to hold it. If you log out or disconnected for any long period of time, it can be taken. What you do not do though is start sending tells to flopped monks to see if they are afk or not in an attempt to hijack their spawn.

[aaezil]

So for lucan you need to be not afk and actively killing the guards in his room (or an aftermath will come and take the camp from you) but for stormfeather you can afk flop right up until spawn happens and nobody else can contest the camp...

Can we get some consistency with the server rules anytime? Thanks!

[Itap]

What NPCs are you gonna clear at SF camp?

[aaezil]

Why does that matter at all? I assure you 100% of the time the people camping lucan are after a single spawn, the lucan spawn, which the guards have nothing to do with. There is no reason you should have to even kill them at all.

[Wfrench1234]

So. Damn. Convoluted. The camp is intimidating because of the time involved, the mixed up rules...and now I find out loot rights are illegal to sell?

Cue the losing trombone sound from Price is Right.

[aaezil]

players should really rally and demand more clear and consistent rules

[loramin]

players should really rally and demand more clear and consistent rules

I completely agree: we should DEMAND stuff from our totally free server staffed entirely by volunteers.

[Ciksharn]

I completely agree: we should DEMAND stuff from our totally free server staffed entirely by volunteers.

^^^ forget demanding stuff let's strike. We can all go play on live. Level 60 in a week with a free epic

[Rerfu]

Change week to a few hours if we're talking about live. but zzzzzZZz

[aaezil]

I completely agree: we should DEMAND stuff from our totally free server staffed entirely by volunteers.

Theres no server to "volunteer" for if theres zero happy players left anymore, genius. TY for the terrible input, however.

The sim repops did a lot to tide over discontent but theres still things glaringly evident such as the constant threads/petitions like this one.

[Pokesan]

Theres no server to "volunteer" for if theres zero happy players left anymore, genius. TY for the terrible input, however.

nilbog doesn't care if you play. it's a museum.

Mind your GODDAMN manners.

[aaezil]

nilbog doesn't care if you play. it's a museum.

Mind your GODDAMN manners.

Your caps lock nerd rage warmed my heart tonight. For that i thank you

[Zalora]

I would just like to add that I have read through this entire thread... and I still have no idea what the rules are for this camp.

I think the GMs have intentionally made the rules ambiguous because they don't exactly know how to handle it either. :p

[aaezil]

Its needlessly convoluted which is why theres so many threads/petitions about this stuff. for one camp you can AFK 16-17 hours and hold the camp FD and have immunity to camp steal but on another camp if you are afk more than 2 minutes you get brute forced out by someone who claims killing the guards that have nothing to do with the spawn you're camping is the only way to "claim the camp"

Consistency very much needed

[Kaera]

There is only one way to stop all these. Ban mq (if you can disable the turn in game) and ban selling loot rights. Then there will no inventive to farm beyond equipping your own character.

[Alanus]

There is only one way to stop all these. Ban mq (if you can disable the turn in game) and ban selling loot rights. Then there will no inventive to farm beyond equipping your own character.

It'd be just as bad still. Just instead of people doing it to sell MQs, they'd be doing it to equip their chars/alts.

[Pokesan]

It'd be just as bad still. Just instead of people doing it to sell MQs, they'd be doing it to equip their chars/alts.

it would be slightly less bad if people only had to equip their own characters

some would consider this an "Improvement"

yours in Christ

[Tupakk]

There is only one way to stop all these. Ban mq (if you can disable the turn in game) and ban selling loot rights. Then there will no inventive to farm beyond equipping your own character.

Lol this wouldn’t stop it at all. You would just hire people to help you farm it for your toon.

[Kaera]

I do disagree politely. There is a distinction between getting players to help and players actively selling mq

[Pokesan]

Lol this wouldn’t stop it at all. You would just hire people to help you farm it for your toon.

that's way more player interaction than mq sales and loot rights involve

let's do it

[Rainik Stormseeker]

@OP - why were you "there 6 hours at the keyboard" when it wasn't even your camp?

[Neno]

GM said 5 minutes the fair amount of time so it doesn't fucking matter what you think. Enjoy eating a ban next time you want to be a dick

lol

[Ket]

This thread funny. Much funny.

You got people complaining about 5 minutes being too much time. You got people complaining about not having enough time in their lives to camp, while playing an EQ emulated server. You got people telling GM's they're wrong. You got people suggesting that the people who play here actually have jobs.

Just don't be a dick. Ain't hard.

[Valrok]

Just don't be a dick. Ain't hard.

[Menden]

So for lucan you need to be not afk and actively killing the guards in his room (or an aftermath will come and take the camp from you) but for stormfeather you can afk flop right up until spawn happens and nobody else can contest the camp...

Can we get some consistency with the server rules anytime? Thanks!

For Lucan, you must show you are actively killing Lucan's guards to claim the camp, that's pretty simple. Hell, he has a much shorter spawn time so there's plenty of lucans to go around. It's been this way for a long long time.


For SF, would the community honestly want us to switch the way we judge this camp and say you must actively kill cougars(or whatever, with lack of guards) within the range of the spawn location? That's one long camp. Pretty dumb.

Selling SF loot rights, this is a douche move, I will suspend you for it under PNP.

So. Damn. Convoluted. The camp is intimidating because of the time involved, the mixed up rules...and now I find out loot rights are illegal to sell?

Cue the losing trombone sound from Price is Right.

Yeah sorry. That wasn't fair and a pretty BS response from me. Let me elaborate.

Ultimately we want to prevent is a player camping SF, selling loot rights then not giving up the camp.

So if you want to sell loot rights, that's fine I guess. But you must follow the "kill in a reasonable amount of time" guideline. And give up the camp to the next person on the list. This same thing goes with AC camp or any lore items.
If you are the buyer or seller, I encourage you to screenshot all conversations so it doesn't look like you ninjalooted.


I want to bring up one more point because it's come in up in game a couple times. If you are camping SF and you are AFK during the time it spawned. Another player grabs FTE prior to the 5ish minutes(so it doesn't path too far away), I would tag it asap. This will show us in our logs that you were active. If we see you didn't tag it till after that 5ish minutes, you will probably be SOL.

It's usually best to leave SF be till after that 5ish minutes, but I can understand you are trying to prevent a wandering SF so the camp holder will see it. If you are camping SF, be at your computer during the window, makes things easier and it's the right thing to do.


This thread funny. Much funny.

You got people complaining about 5 minutes being too much time. You got people complaining about not having enough time in their lives to camp, while playing an EQ emulated server. You got people telling GM's they're wrong. You got people suggesting that the people who play here actually have jobs.

Just don't be a dick. Ain't hard.

lol

[aaezil]

Menden - Sure - i can see why it would be dumb to ask people to kill cougars for 3 days to claim a sf camp. Just like its dumb to ask people to kill lucans guards for 8 hours to claim the camp - since Lucan is in no way tied to their spawns or the quest. Just inconveniences people that might want to claim the camp while keeping their faction intact.

The main issue i have is this is not written in server rules anywhere besides hidden in gm responses in 50+ page threads. If you are new to either of these camps and alone you just might just assume the rules are the same for any other named camp youve ever been at and then someone walks up and bullies/rules lawyers you out of the camp. Is that really the server environment we all want?

I dont have the golden solution but i do think a policy that could stay consistent would go a long way. Call me crazy if you want

[oqrelord]

Whats the reasoning behind it not being FTE?

[Legidias]

Player agreement

[loramin]

Yeah sorry. That wasn't fair and a pretty BS response from me. Let me elaborate.

Wait, the staff are human and make mistakes? :eek:

... AND they have the balls to admit as much and correct those mistakes? :eek::eek::eek::eek:

https://i.imgur.com/1SAKQBD.gif

[Veleria]

I thought the server rules were everything belongs to AM until they get banned then its FFA?

[Xaeophi]

Stormfeather just spawned for me. Took Exactly 75 hours to the minute.

[Amyas]

i'd also appreciate a guide changing OP's in character name and surname which is a clear violation of naming conventions.

Thanks for posting!

:cool:

^_^

[Gozuk]

Now you have 20 HPs and 5 dex more than another competing melee - and to think people might say you literally completely wasted 3 days on this Earth.

Competing melee? Who is he competing against? Can't he just get it because he wants it for his character? If your only motivation for playing is telling people your max hp/ac/mana you may wanna take a break or move on imo

[mefdinkins]

Now you have 20 HPs and 5 dex more than another competing melee - and to think people might say you literally completely wasted 3 days on this Earth.

and 20% haste homie!!!

[Raavak]

and 20% haste homie!!!
And spell haste, without an enchanter or shaman around!

[skarlorn]

Now you have 20 HPs and 5 dex more than another competing melee - and to think people might say you literally completely wasted 3 days on this Earth.

[Xaeophi]

Now you have 20 HPs and 5 dex more than another competing melee - and to think people might say you literally completely wasted 3 days on this Earth.

We might be talking about two completely different items miss spyder. This mask gave me a ton of resists close to 80 more hp then my old mask some dex and whatever else the hell it gives! All it took was me parking a character there and check back every window! Yes mam you are absolutely right about the three days though! I couldn't play Everquest for three whole days! What a drag huh? Thanks for your interest!

[Xaeophi]

And spell haste, without an enchanter or shaman around!

Woah rakpartha you still play???!! Outstanding!