Frustration over lack of clarity from CSR on contested Epic mobs. Solve before Green

[Khaleesi]

Aside from the inconsistency of what is Classic here, there is one issue that I am particularly displeased about, where between players and staff it has never been properly agreed or communicated. And that is Verina Tomb and Drozlin have always fell into a grey area concerning whether they are camps or FTE.

The general consensus and approach has been leaning more towards whomever attacks first ala FTE regardless of whether they have a shout message.

Regardless, in EverQuest classic, the understanding for any mob is that should someone else attack it, then you stay off of it until a condition applies :


The person dies/their group dies
The person zones
The person goes link dead


Threads on these NPCs led on to discussion, rants, complaints and arguments over :

1. Whether it was ok to 'stall' after attacking

The view by players has been yes, despite being somewhat 'cheese' it is ok, after all you tagged it.
This allowed people to claim the mob until you could obtain reinforcements.

The only caveat(player agreed?) was that the tag had to be an offensive spell and/or the damage had to be continuous. E.g. you could not simply root it until help arrived.

This was met with some rebuttal that the same could be said for a camp such as Ancient cyclops. Yet in that situation and any other camped mob, that the agreed approach is if you cannot handle the mob after five minutes you should concede(player agreed?)

2. Whether it is actually a camp and what defines a camp

I've never treated anything as a 'camp' unless it has a forced trigger, such as a PH which required you to produce an action to obtain a reaction. If this was not the case, then no one would ever contest camp presence, and there would be no need for rules such as only being allowed to 'hold' one camp at a time.

Additionally, FTE would have never been introduced for high value targets.



If Verina and Drozlin is a camp, then we have potential issues:

It is virtually perma camped by level 1 face trackers. Is the idea that we just let them log in while at work, leave Gina running and hold the camp for four days and not maintain any active presence? Effectively AFK camping?


Additionally, the view has always been was that if you brought your own level capable character, you had a much better opportunity to not only engage, though also win the race.

Which leads on to what made Verina and Drozlin not a camp :


It's openly contested
Players race to it to be the first to attack it
There's no place holder or trigger


These should be hints, and furthermore I cannot find any Enchanter (except those that would benefit from calling it a camp, when it suits them) whom has ever treated these mobs as camps. We know this because the majority of threads on them are complaints of the way the mobs are setup as contested. And comments made in discussions are of the sentiment of how in their view it would be more fair to be a camp. The pain of face tracking wouldn't be as bad, as you wouldn't have to worry about being beaten to the mob despite you putting in the five/seven days of effort.

While I don't have to personally worry about these monsters any longer, I do sympathize with others and after nearly nine years, I am continuously aggravated by the lack of clarity and consistency about these and similar NPCs.


Now there's been murmurs that the new generation of staff are treating this as a camp, where the majority of players are(were? did this conveniently change recently to suit one group?) not.
What they don't then reiterate is that even if it was a camp, if you attack a mob first, persons should not be attacking your mob, that is in itself simple kill stealing - this is not a grey area.


Whatever the ruling is can we have an official decision, communication and a new sticky on the forum that lists these and every other mob with their CURRENT camp/FTE status in black and white.

Now would be a grand time to establish this ahead of the release of Green, for what should be obvious reasons.

[jmclark3592]

I’ve been putting in countless hours camping for my enchanter epic. I need clarity NOW please.

[DiogenesThaDogg]

I received a ruling directly from a Senior Server Guide that Verina Tomb and Vessel Drozlin are campable targets just like Sir Lucan and Hadden. It stated they are not FTE and have apparently never been FTE.

[Dolalin]

Tbf a clearer policy on this would result in fewer staff petitions.

[Bazia]

verina has been the same for like 8 years dude, come on now

[DromalPhrenia]

I received a ruling directly from a Senior Server Guide that Verina Tomb and Vessel Drozlin are campable targets just like Sir Lucan and Hadden. It stated they are not FTE and have apparently never been FTE.

No longer relevant to me, but do you happen to have a screenshot or log of this? Lucan is a fixed spawn and has two mobs nearby that must be cleared to be "holding" the camp. Verina and Vessel do not have mobs to clear and their spawn time varies considerably.

[DiogenesThaDogg]

No longer relevant to me, but do you happen to have a screenshot or log of this? Lucan is a fixed spawn and has two mobs nearby that must be cleared to be "holding" the camp. Verina and Vessel do not have mobs to clear and their spawn time varies considerably.

https://i.imgur.com/YoA3B1D.png

[Argh]

Both of those bozos have always been FTE, and I've never seen someone try to say either was a camp.

[18120]

As any enchanter who has ever even considered obtaining their epic, both Verina and Drozlin have been understood to be FTE and to my knowledge it has always been that way. People make tracking characters, prepark friends and batphone guildies just like any other FTE situation.

It seems that the only argument that she's not FTE is that she doesn't have raid-mob status and emit a zone-wide emote. The argument that "she doesnt scream FTE, therefore shes not FTE" is pedantic at best and miserably short-sided at worst.

If she is in-fact a camp, several questions really need to answered explicitly or risk torrents of petitions every spawn.

-When can you start "camping?" Can you start your camp when she's not even in her window?

-Can you camp her on a level 1 alt? What level can you start camping her?

-Can you kill her and choose not to relinquish the camp...just like any other? If so, how many cycles can you camp? Can you have characters devoted to selling looting rights and never intending to leave the camp...in essence cutting off that piece from anyone who doesn't pay?

Those questions must be answered explicitly if she is not FTE, otherwise the future of blue/green only holds misery for enchanters.

[Siberious]

As any enchanter who has ever even considered obtaining their epic, both Verina and Drozlin have been understood to be FTE and to my knowledge it has always been that way. People make tracking characters, prepark friends and batphone guildies just like any other FTE situation.

It seems that the only argument that she's not FTE is that she doesn't have raid-mob status and emit a zone-wide emote. The argument that "she doesnt scream FTE, therefore shes not FTE" is pedantic at best and miserably short-sided at worst.

If she is in-fact a camp, several questions really need to answered explicitly or risk torrents of petitions every spawn.

-When can you start "camping?" Can you start your camp when she's not even in her window?

-Can you camp her on a level 1 alt? What level can you start camping her?

-Can you kill her and choose not to relinquish the camp...just like any other? If so, how many cycles can you camp? Can you have characters devoted to selling looting rights and never intending to leave the camp...in essence cutting off that piece from anyone who doesn't pay?

Those questions must be answered explicitly if she is not FTE, otherwise the future of blue/green only holds misery for enchanters.

I think them being treated as camps opens up all sorts of issues like you mentioned, however to help cover one of those, you can't hold a camp you are unable to contest/kill the ph/mob when it spawns. So camping lvl 1 alts would not secure the camp. You'd need to have level appropriate toon(s) to engage asap on spawn, with the intent of killing the mob. Now yes, enchanters can solo VT, so it could be considered camped in that case, or if 2+ people are there, etc.

Best of luck, camping with lvl 1 alts and going FTE route seemed clearer, not looking forward to enchanters having to pay camp hoarders to get their epic, since so many people are willing to sit AFK with GINA triggers to tell them when it spawns.

[Amyas]

Red

[Mead]

GoT names cool

[Littlefinger]

As an enchanter nearing the end of their epic I really hope a clear rule is made in regards to these mobs. I really don't want to camp these mob for 2-5 days days and then not be sure how to properly engage them.

Everything I've read on the forums and heard from other enchanters in game is that these mobs are FTE.

[DromalPhrenia]

https://i.imgur.com/YoA3B1D.png

Thanks for posting this! I'm surprised, but it sounds pretty official to me.

Someone is probably going to have to put a petition thread in again to clarify this, but I imagine a level 1 camping at VT/VD will not qualify. I can't think of any camps where you can say you're holding the camp with a character that cannot possibly kill the mob

[elwing]

To me pretty much anything not on the GM list or covered by player agreement or with special FTE added (lodi/kozz...) can be claimed as camp, including VT, VD, SF and such... Obviously you can't claim to hold a camp with a lvl1 "verinatombspy", you need a kill force for that...

[aaezil]

Staff ruling on if you can “camp” vt/vd with a lvl 1 bot?

[Coridan]

Selling "loot rights" should just be a bannable offense. MQing should be banned too, would make it far less desirable for people to lock down camps they don't personally need.

[Sacer]

Yeah what do you actually need to claim the camp then? Can you track with a level one, then when it pop take 30 min or more to find people to help you kill it?
Not many enchanters are able to solo that fight from what I've seen. That ruling will bring a lot of drama.

[18120]

What level do you have to be to claim the camp then? A lvl 57 enchanter really has no way of soloing Verina but that is not an unreasonable level to be looking for epic pieces. Do you need more than 1 person to claim the camp? How long do you have to gather people after a spawn?

[Hibbs]

What level do you have to be to claim the camp then? A lvl 57 enchanter really has no way of soloing Verina but that is not an unreasonable level to be looking for epic pieces. Do you need more than 1 person to claim the camp? How long do you have to gather people after a spawn?

I got my epic when I was 54. I had help with VT from a 60 enc buddy, we Duo'd. I also had help with VD from a cleric buddy who was 54ish also. I 100% felt I could have solo these camps at 54 if I had a CH clicky. On the attempt we killed VD cleric casted 1 CH and my charmed guard never got dispelled.

I'm surprised to see that GM ruling on this. From everything I've ever read it always seemed like whoever got to VT/VD first and engaged had rights, and because they are not "raid" targets (as stupid as it is) stalling was okay as long as you didn't die, zone, or LD. I camped these 2 for at least 5-6 months and I NEVER heard anyone say "I have this camp". This is just my thought, but what GM's say go. /shrug

I definitely think a clear cut rule should be posted somewhere. Having these two as a camp sounds like such a headache.

[18120]

If you're holding the VT camp solo claiming that you are able to solo her..do you have to attempt a solo kill when she spawns?

Both have them have been understood to be FTE and it has been fine. And I dont think anyone will believe me if I go there and say "sorry, VT is camped"

[Swish2]

Sounds like we need more rules so people can lawyer harder and make the place way more fun to play <3

[Karthil]

I'm surprised to see that GM ruling on this.

Yep. After camping both of these myself over many spawns, I never once encountered anyone who considered it a camp. We were all operating under the impression that we were competing for FTE.

[18120]

Well, I am currently claiming the VT camp. Goodluck everyone else next spawn.

[Hibbs]

Well, I am currently claiming the VT camp. Goodluck everyone else next spawn.

Lmaooooo. Got emmm

[Menden]

Hello,

The recent call that involved DiogenesThaDogg never felt 100% right to me, a lot of arguments could be made for FTE or campable. I compared VT/VD to Hadden and SF, but Llandris made a very compelling argument which I'll list below.

I brought the topic up with other Senior Staff and we combed through countless past calls relating to these two spawns. The overwhelming majority is that it's FTE, not campable.

I put non-raid, single target, no PH spawns into two categories.

1. Campable, but must keep guards clear.
Sir Lucan
Drusella Sathir

2. Campable, but must get FTE within a reasonable amount of time.
Hadden
Stormfeather

I originally put VT/VD into this category but because they are generally killed with 2+ players, this makes it really hard.

Llandris: A player "camping" must have friends with characters camped near by or get players
mobilized to this remote zone pretty quickly. Or if it was a solo, a skilled enchanter would have to abandon the camp to grab a pet.

As we see it this goes against the "stalling" or "kill within a reasonable amount of time" guideline we
have stated countless times for other camps. So I can understand the confusion among players(and staff apparently).

So, we're making this official. A third category.

3. FTE, let the race begin.
Verina Tomb
Vessel Drozlin

I'll see if I can talk Nilbog/Rogean into putting a FTE emote on these two mobs which would make it pretty clear what kind of encounter this is and stop any confusion that may come up in the future.

I apologize for any confusion I may have caused, but going forward you have this post to go on as a concrete guideline backed up by the Server GM and other Senior Staff.



If anyone has shared the screenshot that DiogeneThaDogg has posted, please remove it or edit the
post stating the call has been reversed.

[18120]

Thank you for this clarification and the addition of the FTE emotes should make it very clear.

[Siberious]

Hello,

The recent call that involved DiogenesThaDogg never felt 100% right to me, a lot of arguments could be made for FTE or campable. I compared VT/VD to Hadden and SF, but Llandris made a very compelling argument which I'll list below.

I brought the topic up with other Senior Staff and we combed through countless past calls relating to these two spawns. The overwhelming majority is that it's FTE, not campable.

I put non-raid, single target, no PH spawns into two categories.

1. Campable, but must keep guards clear.
Sir Lucan
Drusella Sathir

2. Campable, but must get FTE within a reasonable amount of time.
Hadden
Stormfeather

I originally put VT/VD into this category but because they are generally killed with 2+ players, this makes it really hard.



As we see it this goes against the "stalling" or "kill within a reasonable amount of time" guideline we
have stated countless times for other camps. So I can understand the confusion among players(and staff apparently).

So, we're making this official. A third category.

3. FTE, let the race begin.
Verina Tomb
Vessel Drozlin

I'll see if I can talk Nilbog/Rogean into putting a FTE emote on these two mobs which would make it pretty clear what kind of encounter this is and stop any confusion that may come up in the future.

I apologize for any confusion I may have caused, but going forward you have this post to go on as a concrete guideline backed up by the Server GM and other Senior Staff.



If anyone has shared the screenshot that DiogeneThaDogg has posted, please remove it or edit the
post stating the call has been reversed.

Thanks for quick response about how the camp will be ruled/escalation for figuring it out.

[Madbad]

Respect

[ralyn]

So, we're making this official. A third category.

3. FTE, let the race begin.
Verina Tomb
Vessel Drozlin

I'll see if I can talk Nilbog/Rogean into putting a FTE emote on these two mobs which would make it pretty clear what kind of encounter this is and stop any confusion that may come up in the future.

I apologize for any confusion I may have caused, but going forward you have this post to go on as a concrete guideline backed up by the Server GM and other Senior Staff.



If anyone has shared the screenshot that DiogeneThaDogg has posted, please remove it or edit the
post stating the call has been reversed.

Thank you for conferring and looking into this deeply, as I agree, this was a very "grey" area. However, since the call was reversed, and moving forward this is a FTE mob, officially, is there going to be a reparation for the group that had FTE in the first place? This isn't a simple spawn, it is and has always been highly contested and the window is quite large, sitting around stinky Dark Elves.

Any chance there is a "good-will" gesture to the players involved that, in the end, were correct? Whatever your answer is fine, but I do feel like I need to ask as I have had 2 lvl 60 Enchanters and camped this spawn for I don't even know how many hours. I was there to help a guildmate kill her, with FTE in mind. I am not saying any bans or disciplines should be assessed, because as it seems, it was cloudy. However, through all the posts, it is quite obvious it has always been understood to be a FTE.

Any leniency on this, given the outcome the staff and GM's determined is correct, would be greatly appreciated.

[Menden]

Thank you for conferring and looking into this deeply, as I agree, this was a very "grey" area. However, since the call was reversed, and moving forward this is a FTE mob, officially, is there going to be a reparation for the group that had FTE in the first place? This isn't a simple spawn, it is and has always been highly contested and the window is quite large, sitting around stinky Dark Elves.

Any chance there is a "good-will" gesture to the players involved that, in the end, were correct? Whatever your answer is fine, but I do feel like I need to ask as I have had 2 lvl 60 Enchanters and camped this spawn for I don't even know how many hours. I was there to help a guildmate kill her, with FTE in mind.

Any leniency on this, given the outcome the staff and GM's determined is correct, would be greatly appreciated.

That is between us and the parties involved. If they wish to share the outcome, that's up to them.

edit:words

[Khaleesi]

Thank you for conferring and looking into this deeply, as I agree, this was a very "grey" area. However, since the call was reversed, and moving forward this is a FTE mob, officially, is there going to be a reparation for the group that had FTE in the first place? This isn't a simple spawn, it is and has always been highly contested and the window is quite large, sitting around stinky Dark Elves.

Any chance there is a "good-will" gesture to the players involved that, in the end, were correct? Whatever your answer is fine, but I do feel like I need to ask as I have had 2 lvl 60 Enchanters and camped this spawn for I don't even know how many hours. I was there to help a guildmate kill her, with FTE in mind. I am not saying any bans or disciplines should be assessed, because as it seems, it was cloudy. However, through all the posts, it is quite obvious it has always been understood to be a FTE.

Any leniency on this, given the outcome the staff and GM's determined is correct, would be greatly appreciated.

That is between us and the parties involved. If they wish to share the outcome, that's up to them.

edit:words

That is between us and the parties involved. If they wish to share the outcome, that's up to them.

edit:words

Considering you've - intentional or not - made a fairly significant mistake here, and given the nature and scope if the issue, it would be more appropriate that staff indicate whether they in fact will act ethically.

There's three objectives to be achieved here :

1. Confirm the ruling of the mob mechanics - I suppose this is now done
2. Award the item to the rightful Enchanter
3. Take the item from the persons in the wrong

2. Needs to happen because it's the right thing to do.
3. Needs to happen to send a message. As far as I am concerned every player whom acted in bad faith on this, did knowingly. Regardless, they (according to your final ruling of FTE) KS'd the mob and they should be disciplined.


It's also exacerbated by the fact that in this scenario, it went from FTE to camp to FTE. That means that the individuals in question whom were transgressed, now have a harder time of doing it over again should there be no ruling to award them the items.
They have to effectively give up the camp, and let it become a race again. At least for that brief moment, they had the advantage of holding the camp.

[DromalPhrenia]

Thank you very much for the update, Menden! I've already completed the Enchanter epic (and dont envision doing so again) but the prior decision seemed to run counter to everyone's experience on the matter.

Now I have to find any posts where I referenced it and edit them :mad:

[TrendyDru]

Selling "loot rights" should just be a bannable offense. MQing should be banned too, would make it far less desirable for people to lock down camps they don't personally need.

This a thousand times over.

[jmclark3592]

its Not easy to admit you’re wrong so I appreciate the reverse ruling . But Khaleesi is right again- the poor guy who originally lost his petition has been camping VT nonstop based on the original ruling that it’s a camp. Also Menden even says it’s always been treated FTE - everyone seemed to know it but him. It needs to get corrected.

[Erati]

This a thousand times over.

Offer the seller more theyll sell to you.

[TrendyDru]

Offer the seller more theyll sell to you.

Is this RnF? Or is your reading comprehension just that bad?

[Erati]

Is this RnF? Or is your reading comprehension just that bad?

? You were wanting people to be banned for doing what they choose w loot theyve earned.

[Siberious]

its Not easy to admit you’re wrong so I appreciate the reverse ruling . But Khaleesi is right again- the poor guy who originally lost his petition has been camping VT nonstop based on the original ruling that it’s a camp. Also Menden even says it’s always been treated FTE - everyone seemed to know it but him. It needs to get corrected.

Nothing "needs" to happen, the guides/GMs don't "owe" players anything. It's these and some of the above types of entitled posts that don't help at all and deter guides from helping or responding quickly, because they get shit on for it anyways, even in this case where Menden provided a very helpful/timely response.

[TrendyDru]

? You were wanting people to be banned for doing what they choose w loot theyve earned.

Because it's a fucking monopoly. And to get certain things you're forced to buy it instead of camp it like in classic. Your point is invalid, and I choose option 2 from my last post.

[Erati]

Because it's a fucking monopoly. And to get certain things you're forced to buy it instead of camp it like in classic. Your point is invalid, and I choose option 2 from my last post.

Buying loot rights is classic as fuq.

[TrendyDru]

Buying loot rights is classic as fuq.

As an option, not forced because a bunch of neckbeards on a locked server figured out how to create a forced monopolization of items. It's greedy as fuck and you know it. Why create that just because you can. And force others to go along with it when we're all here for the same reason.

[Nirgon]

Wait till I roll up on green. Better have my 400k (or 1.2million on blue).

[ralyn]

Please close this thread. So many squirrel moments that are irrelevant to the topic

[Jimjam]

Buying loot rights is classic as fuq.

As a young teen @ 1999 I can confirm fuq not classic, though.

[Nirgon]

Hope you realize if you thinks it's rough here now that the most brutal pixel barons have moved on and are waiting for green.

[mizzbiscuits]

Seeing threads and drama like this over and over makes me question why the GM’s even bother with trying to manage this. I can’t imagine the man power it takes to police all of these competing guilds in the raid scene. I would have given up a long time ago.

[DiogenesThaDogg]

Seeing threads and drama like this over and over makes me question why the GM’s even bother with trying to manage this. I can’t imagine the man power it takes to police all of these competing guilds in the raid scene. I would have given up a long time ago.

I definitely respect the hell out of the people who put in the time and effort to keep P99 running

[Pan]

When you make a ruling like this, please roll it into the ruleset somewhere so it's accessible and doesn't age off.

[isiah]

When you make a ruling like this, please roll it into the ruleset somewhere so it's accessible and doesn't age off.

Please.

Ditto with raid dispute decisions and rules that are often only found in the Skype/Discord netherworld.

[P99Druid]

As an option, not forced because a bunch of neckbeards on a locked server figured out how to create a forced monopolization of items. It's greedy as fuck and you know it. Why create that just because you can. And force others to go along with it when we're all here for the same reason.

Please tell me how you're forced to buy your epic. I'm the only person the sells them, and I ONLY camp it when someone is paying me to. You act like someone is there at every spawn killing the mob and demanding plat before anyone can loot it, this is far from the case. I killed the last Verina and Vessel, they were the first I have killed in over a month and a half, but people are totally forced to go through me to get their snake. You sure have it figured out bud!

[Rader]

Please tell me how you're forced to buy your epic. I'm the only person the sells them, and I ONLY camp it when someone is paying me to. You act like someone is there at every spawn killing the mob and demanding plat before anyone can loot it, this is far from the case. I killed the last Verina and Vessel, they were the first I have killed in over a month and a half, but people are totally forced to go through me to get their snake. You sure have it figured out bud!

Seriously? Are you that retarded? Of course epics are bottlenecked by neckbeards who force players to pay for MQ rights. Your attempt to justify your A-hole-ness is rejected

[P99Druid]

Seriously? Are you that retarded? Of course epics are bottlenecked by neckbeards who force players to pay for MQ rights. Your attempt to justify your A-hole-ness is rejected

It's still giving someone an epic, just someone who chose to pay me to camp it for them rather than spend the days there themselves. I also don't force anyone to pay for loot rights, people choose to come to me because they either don't have the time to camp it themselves leaving me as their only option, or they don't feel like spending the time camping it, again leaving me as their only option.

[TrendyDru]

It's still giving someone an epic, just someone who chose to pay me to camp it for them rather than spend the days there themselves. I also don't force anyone to pay for loot rights, people choose to come to me because they either don't have the time to camp it themselves leaving me as their only option, or they don't feel like spending the time camping it, again leaving me as their only option.

You are a special kind of stupid. I have no problem taking the time to camp things that need to be camped. My problem is neckbeards like you that are doing it to make money. As soon as it pops you are in camp killing it under a minute later. To SELL. Your ass is whats wrong with this community.

[Castigate]

I personally don't think that it'd be appropriate for CSR to start handing out clarity even if you are trying to get an epic mob

[P99Druid]

Because it's a fucking monopoly. And to get certain things you're forced to buy it instead of camp it like in classic. Your point is invalid, and I choose option 2 from my last post.

It's not a monopoly. I don't kill every spawn and force someone to pay to loot it. If no one pays me for my services, then you won't find me there camping the mobs. I don't get where the monopoly on the mob is in this scenario.

[Dillusional]

Sirken always treated them like FTE mobs from what I remember. 5 day variance is uncampable. There is no way one person can stay up and at the keyboard for 2-7 days straight. They have lower variance now though right? New sheriff in town?

[P99Druid]

Sirken always treated them like FTE mobs from what I remember. 5 day variance is uncampable. There is no way one person can stay up and at the keyboard for 2-7 days straight. They have lower variance now though right? New sheriff in town?

They have been ruled as FTE again, the camp ruling was retracted

[Hibbs]

Sirken always treated them like FTE mobs from what I remember. 5 day variance is uncampable. There is no way one person can stay up and at the keyboard for 2-7 days straight. They have lower variance now though right? New sheriff in town?

Yea pay attention!:p

[Jimjam]

Blue server is really great for CSR to play around with policy in anticipation for green.

I wonder if they have set any plans for how they will manage legacy items?

[Psyborg]

They have been ruled as FTE again, the camp ruling was retracted

The petition answered last week says otherwise. Was told if someone was at VT before me with a player able to kill it (ie not a level 1 tracker) then I can't engage. Do you have this in writing somewhere for clarification?

[18120]

The petition answered last week says otherwise. Was told if someone was at VT before me with a player able to kill it (ie not a level 1 tracker) then I can't engage. Do you have this in writing somewhere for clarification?

Yes. In this post you can see the official ruling on them being FTE now.

[Psyborg]

Yes. In this post you can see the official ruling on them being FTE now.

Perfect, thanks!

[loramin]

The petition answered last week says otherwise. Was told if someone was at VT before me with a player able to kill it (ie not a level 1 tracker) then I can't engage. Do you have this in writing somewhere for clarification?

For future reference I started this wiki page (http://wiki.project1999.com/Camp_Rules) to be a convenient "one stop shop" for all questions about special camp rulings (and it also has all the generic camp rulings that apply across the server at the bottom).