Guises and Manastones and puppet strings... Oh, my!

[GnomeLuvr]

It's already obvious that the guise and mana stone camps are going to be a pain in the tush for the GMs, as well as everyone who wants one that is not a part of whatever alliance (whether guilds, group of friends, or whatever) that will have those camps locked down.

What if those items were left out on Green from the get-go? How many people would not bother with green, because their plan for Green is to load up on those items in case Green does merge with Blue at the end of it's timeline?

I hope that if those items are in the Green loot tables, that Green never merges with Blue (which I have never seen anything from the GMs saying that would happen, anyway). I don't have any of those types of high-dollar items, and my play is not negatively impacted in any way by not having them. I would rather see Green drama remain on Green, and not bleed into Blue if/when they're merged.

[Jibartik]

Why do gnomes always ask questions that seem like they are intended to rustle peoples jimmies?

[JayDee]

What if those items were left out on Green from the get-go? How many people would not bother with green, because their plan for Green is to load up on those items in case Green does merge with Blue at the end of it's timeline?

I hope that if those items are in the Green loot tables, that Green never merges with Blue (which I have never seen anything from the GMs saying that would happen, anyway). I don't have any of those types of high-dollar items, and my play is not negatively impacted in any way by not having them. I would rather see Green drama remain on Green, and not bleed into Blue if/when they're merged.

You would think the staff would clarify some of these things. It is almost September

[Taiku]

It's already obvious that the guise and mana stone camps are going to be a pain in the tush for the GMs, as well as everyone who wants one that is not a part of whatever alliance (whether guilds, group of friends, or whatever) that will have those camps locked down.

What if those items were left out on Green from the get-go? How many people would not bother with green, because their plan for Green is to load up on those items in case Green does merge with Blue at the end of it's timeline?

I hope that if those items are in the Green loot tables, that Green never merges with Blue (which I have never seen anything from the GMs saying that would happen, anyway). I don't have any of those types of high-dollar items, and my play is not negatively impacted in any way by not having them. I would rather see Green drama remain on Green, and not bleed into Blue if/when they're merged.

Confused by this mentality, what do you care if someone who has ample time to lock down these time limited items carries them over to blue IF they get merged? They are going to be camped probably non-stop regardless if blue and green merges or not.. This is the second thread saying the same thing (that I have seen, probably been more) and it always just looks like "I don't have the time/intention/allies to camp the items before they are gone, or won't be able to get into the camp cause others are "having fun" camping them non stop, so I don't want anyone else to be able to either"

If they did get merged over to blue, does it matter that there are more manastones on blue?

[Arvan]

Well i mean if green were to keep going like blue instead of merging or ending/resetting then they would end up being worth just as much.

[NegaStoat]

Easy answer to the situation.

Step 1 - confirm that the GM's will enforce player-created server rules involving mob camps on Green like they will on Blue.
Step 2 - encounter a camp such as manastone or guise with a very small group of people wanting to 'lock it' and roate with each other.
Step 3 - gain the support of a substantial amount of people to agree that special item camps should involve lines of characters using a list, and that the campers logging off to log on alts would be prohibited.
Step 4 - get the thumbs up from the GM's that the agreement has overwhelming support.
Step 5 - enjoy classic lines of people waiting for rare drops just like they did back on old retail classic for the Najena Jboots, etc.

Bonus points for asking the GM's to ban accounts linked to the ISP of a person breaking the rule.

[Kennie]

There's no reason to merge the servers after the green timeline ends. Isn't the whole idea behind green to stay true to a eq live timeline? How does merging to an endless timeline at the end support that idea? It doesn't.

It would also flood the blue server with items it shouldn't have anymore. I think the merge thing will never happen and once green is done, so are the characters on it.

[zodium]

As an owner of most no-longer-dropping items, I strongly hope the items carry over. A semi-regular influx of Lockets and other no longer extant items would be very good for Blue server health. Green will be a toxic dump either way, hence the name, I believe. :o

[loramin]

Easy answer to the situation.

Step 1 - confirm that the GM's will enforce player-created server rules involving mob camps on Green like they will on Blue.
Step 2 - encounter a camp such as manastone or guise with a very small group of people wanting to 'lock it' and roate with each other.
Step 3 - gain the support of a substantial amount of people to agree that special item camps should involve lines of characters using a list, and that the campers logging off to log on alts would be prohibited.
Step 4 - get the thumbs up from the GM's that the agreement has overwhelming support.
Step 5 - enjoy classic lines of people waiting for rare drops just like they did back on old retail classic for the Najena Jboots, etc.

Bonus points for asking the GM's to ban accounts linked to the ISP of a person breaking the rule.

It's an answer, but far from an easy one.

I helped try to establish the Shady Goblin agreement, and it was a nightmare. It took weeks, it was frustrating, and it was fragile: if one more Siryado had been there I truly believe we wouldn't have a Shady Goblin agreement today.

What it really boils down to is that player agreements on P99 are consensus-based, and while consensus systems are awesome when you have a group of regulars (my college student government used consensus extremely effectively), they're a nightmare with groups of complete strangers.

It shouldn't take some massive player effort, repeated at every popular camp, just to establish an extremely basic rule that virtually every player on the server would agree with.

Everyone should have to wait in line until it's their turn. No lockouts, and no using relationships with friends or guildies to gain any advantage over other players.

[aaezil]

Soery you wont get guise / manastone

[Taiku]

Make manastone lore and no-drop

Until they don't drop anymore, and then move them back to just magic once they stop dropping. Not classic, but easy enough to implement and would create a situation where if you wanted to hoard them you would have to somehow sneak alts down there one after the other to loot them, might just throw enough of a wrench into the situation to discourage?

I have no stakes in this either way and will probably just ignore the camp/item as a casual p99 player, but I will definitely enjoy the drama!

[Gumbo]

Why not just pre-nerf and ban the items from the start so there isn't any arguments.. Been saying this since day 1 of Green server announcement.

[Cen]

Why not just pre-nerf and ban the items from the start so there isn't any arguments.. Been saying this since day 1 of Green server announcement.

I dont feel like the guise will be as big a deal its very common drop averages 12 per day drops fully camped and 8 month timeline on that

[Thulack]

I dont feel like the guise will be as big a deal its very common drop averages 12 per day drops fully camped and 8 month timeline on that

You underestimate the neckbeards on the server. People will keep camp and just load up accounts full of masks.

[Swish2]

As an owner of 2 prenerf CoS's, I think there's going to be hundreds of guised characters on the server this time around...good luck <3

Dark elf master race anyway, just play one and enjoy the best faces 100% of the time :)

[fadetree]

I never cared about guises on live, and I don't now. Totally useless item. The best way to skip a stupid camp is to not be stupid. Manastones are marginally more useful...but not that much. While you guys are all fighting over those two items, the rest of us will be camping stuff that actually makes a difference. Like an FBSS. Now, that's actually worth a bunch of nerd drama.

[Cen]

I want a dark elf Ranger more than anything but I have a feeling that Rangers are going to be the hardest class to get a mask for

[zati]

Make manastone lore and no-drop

Until they don't drop anymore, and then move them back to just magic once they stop droppin

This is good idea.. creates a line for ppl to loot per toon, maybe make the zone restricted to lvls 25+ to enter to prevent lv1 alts parking there.

[Canelek]

I guess OP is a dildo?

Otherwise I got nothing here.

[JayDee]

I dont feel like the guise will be as big a deal its very common drop averages 12 per day drops fully camped and 8 month timeline on that

It won't be and everyone will have one

[Gumbo]

I dont feel like the guise will be as big a deal its very common drop averages 12 per day drops fully camped and 8 month timeline on that

But the problem is everyone can see all the patch notes and can see when items either got banned or got nerfed. So this will allow players to farm the same camp over and over...

Probably the best thing to come out of it is these items will over flown on the market and won't be worth a damn...

[Shrubwise]

Everyone's operating on the assumption that Green99 will 1. be a new server, 2. be a classic timeline server, 3. have a classic loot table and loot drop timeline

[Mewse]

Everyone should have to wait in line until it's their turn. No lockouts, and no using relationships with friends or guildies to gain any advantage over other players.

Really hope this is how it's handled. The way we did Fabled back in the day was after you won your piece, you dropped from the group and someone else rotated in. Healers or tanks got to cut if their role was going to be left empty, but other than that it was a straight list.

Guise really shouldn't be too bad. Manastone will have its own thread on RnF.

[Daud]

No item/coin roll over onto blue, only character moves on Luclin launch or Sleeper wake.

The less green appeals to pixel hungry neckbeards wanting to stack manastones, guises, lockets, beads, and gnome masks just to sit on until they roll over to blue, the better. I'm not invested into any of those, I don't care about their value. But the fact is no one knew how any of those legacy items were gonna work on launch and an item wipe is the best way to keep it close to classic in that regard. I hope green is made for people who want to be there for that kind of experience, one for the journey and not the destination.

[Danth]

I dont feel like the guise will be as big a deal its very common drop averages 12 per day drops fully camped and 8 month timeline on that

You sure about that? I was here from P99's day 1 and the pre-nerf guise was decidedly rare. The Serrated Bone Dirk was the common drop at the time. Yes, I know that was backwards from correct era-appropriate rates--but that's how it was on P99 at launch. The community would like it if the prenerf guise has its correct drop frequency on "green" but I don't feel that should necessarily be assumed until proven through observation. Might be better to make plans under the assumption of it being rare. Hope for the best, plan for the worst.


Danth

[Ghilran]

Before DBG went on a created a new TLP every other week, a lot of us played them with the assumption that these rare and unique items would be all the rage (at least CoS, Guise and Rubicite to some extent, manastone were never implemented IIRC).

Couldn't be further from the truth. Everyone that wanted a guise got one, and I remember distinctly wanting a CoS and it was easy to get as well, to the point I figured i wouldn't bother because no one gave a shit anyway. And that was in servers where no PNP was enforced and single player controlled mage armys were locking everything they damn well pleased from Runnyeye to plane of hate, with RMT being the clear intent.

I think a lot of players scratched that itch and don't really want to bother with these items. Back in 99 and beyond, there was a clear feeling of "missing out" because people did not have the means nor the informations necessary. On a server were 99% of players know these items, their pending rarity and have ample time to make arrangements, I don't see that becoming a problem.

[DromalPhrenia]

I want a dark elf paladin, but I don't want to:
1. Camp a Guise
2. Level an untwinked paladin
3. Level a paladin with classic exp penalties
4. Play a paladin in the first place
5. Play on Green

Please help

[Worry]

I want a dark elf paladin, but I don't want to:
1. Camp a Guise
2. Level an untwinked paladin
3. Level a paladin with classic exp penalties
4. Play a paladin in the first place
5. Play on Green

Please help Man I was hoping I was only one with this idea :(

[NegaStoat]

I want a dark elf paladin, but I don't want to:
1. Camp a Guise
2. Level an untwinked paladin
3. Level a paladin with classic exp penalties
4. Play a paladin in the first place
5. Play on Green

Please help

Musk was a legend. Honestly though, I think the real customers for a guise will be female Troll shaman players so they are just one click away of pure sexy in Totemic plate while keeping the regen.

[kaizersoze]

What they should do is leave the items out of the game but just blatantly LIE to people saying theyre just ultra rare so the neckbeards who want to camp it 24/7/365 waste all their time for literally nothing.

[Lemonhead]

What they should do is leave the items out of the game but just blatantly LIE to people saying theyre just ultra rare so the neckbeards who want to camp it 24/7/365 waste all their time for literally nothing.

Make them drop 1%. So a few neckbeards do have them. That's so much worse!

[Jibartik]

https://i.imgur.com/cPt03hj.png

:D

[Taiku]

https://i.imgur.com/cPt03hj.png

:D

On bloodsail? I was at the start of that line as it formed, was good times! :)

[Neno]

You sure about that? I was here from P99's day 1 and the pre-nerf guise was decidedly rare. The Serrated Bone Dirk was the common drop at the time. Yes, I know that was backwards from correct era-appropriate rates--but that's how it was on P99 at launch. The community would like it if the prenerf guise has its correct drop frequency on "green" but I don't feel that should necessarily be assumed until proven through observation. Might be better to make plans under the assumption of it being rare. Hope for the best, plan for the worst.


Danth

I think they mistakenly thought it was the rare drop back then. Even when it switched to the Mask of Deception the dirk was still the common drop for awhile until I submitted a bug report for it. If they keep it classic and make it the common drop then 12-15 a day is probably a fairly accurate number which means we are looking at around 2000+ guises before it gets removed.

I'd be surprised if the guise was made a rare drop due to it being pretty well known that it was the common drop now.

[entcid]

This is good idea.. creates a line for ppl to loot per toon, maybe make the zone restricted to lvls 25+ to enter to prevent lv1 alts parking there.

What's up Zati, Beodor here from wayyyyyy back in the day. Thinking about giving P99 another run, not sure I can remember my original username / PW.

[brokenpromise]

Why do people care so much for guise/manastone

[entcid]

Manastones are a god send to enchanters with the right group?

[Sonark]

I think they mistakenly thought it was the rare drop back then. Even when it switched to the Mask of Deception the dirk was still the common drop for awhile until I submitted a bug report for it. If they keep it classic and make it the common drop then 12-15 a day is probably a fairly accurate number which means we are looking at around 2000+ guises before it gets removed.

I'd be surprised if the guise was made a rare drop due to it being pretty well known that it was the common drop now.Divide 2000+ by 8 for the alts for the amount of people who might actually get it.

[Vx36]

Why do people care so much for guise/manastoneI want the benefits of being a troll without looking like one.

[sacman08]

Why do people care
Manastone lets any caster exchange HP for Mana. Not sure about Guise..I thought it was All/All wearable

[Videri]

Why do people care so much for guise/manastone

Manastone lets any caster exchange HP for Mana. Not sure about Guise..I thought it was All/All wearable

I believe only Bards and Rogues can actually equip it, but all can use it from inventory.

But I'm not sure your response answers their questions...not the way they meant it. They know what the items do. It's the "why" that matters.

Why does anyone want to be a Dark Elf?
• Self-shrink, including outdoors, with unlimited charges (so you don't have to chug shaman potions all the time)
• Night vision - Dark Elf form gives Ultravision, best vision in the game
• Faction - allows you to more easily access evil cities on classes/races that otherwise wouldn't be able to.
• Uniqueness - since Dark Elves can't be druids, rangers, paladins, monks, or shamans, having a guise on one of those classes creates a very unusual look.
And lastly:
• Status - some people want it because other people want it.

Manastone requires less explanation, but let me give one anyway. A manastone provides additional mana on any class...but on certain classes/races, it can provide tons of mana. Cleric comes to mind: manastone to 10%, then Complete Heal yourself. Any Iksar or Troll with mana would make good use of it. Maybe shamans I guess; maybe it's easier/lazier than Cannibalizing. And as for wizards, if you click the wizard epic and get the free 800-hp rune, you can click the manastone without losing HP for a while as it will first eat away at the rune. Then once your rune breaks, you can click your wizard epic again for another free rune...so for wizards with epic and manastone, it's free mana. Manastone is clickable in Vanilla zones only.

Did I miss anything?

[zodium]

Did I miss anything?

druids can port to vanilla zones, manastone down and es leg/spring robe up at least starting from Kunark.

[derpcake2]

Cleric comes to mind: manastone to 10%, then Complete Heal yourself.

This really means any caster + clr should come to mind.

Also you can use the manastone on melee classes to damage yourself to train bind wound.

All this while looking awesome.

[Sonark]

For all the people wanting Dark Elf monks for aesthetics...

Only Human and Iksar have the unique "Cured Silk" graphic that most of the monk exclusive gear has.

Other races just look like they're wearing cloth, i.e. nothing.

And if I'm remembering right, or maybe this is different with the old models, humans, iksars and skeletons are also the only ones with a Flying Kick animation, so a dark elf monk wouldn't get that, either.

[zodium]

For all the people wanting Dark Elf monks for aesthetics...

Only Human and Iksar have the unique "Cured Silk" graphic that most of the monk exclusive gear has.

Other races just look like they're wearing cloth, i.e. nothing.

And if I'm remembering right, or maybe this is different with the old models, humans, iksars and skeletons are also the only ones with a Flying Kick animation, so a dark elf monk wouldn't get that, either.

most fancy monks wear robes

[Sonark]

most fancy monks wear robesReally? Over a Fungi?

and Fungi has a plate graphic on Iksar (I like to call old school iksar plate rastafarian) and a chain graphic on Human and so I would assume dark elf, which would also look pretty shitty.

[Danth]

Manastones were kind of necessary in P99's early days when AC didn't work. took two manastone-equipped clerics just to keep my Paladin alive versus Dars in lower guk.

Don't care about 'em this time 'round. If I play on 'green' I'll leave it for others to spend many hours waiting in those lines.

Danth

[zodium]

Really? Over a Fungi?

and Fungi has a plate graphic on Iksar (I like to call old school iksar plate rastafarian) and a chain graphic on Human and so I would assume dark elf, which would also look pretty shitty.

trust me buddy they're all packing that blue vp robe because monks have no fashion game

yeah i went there

[Sonark]

No fashion game and no Flying Kick animation.

[Cen]

No fashion game and no Flying Kick animation.

Dark Elf form from guise does have the flying kick animation. However monk clothes dont show up.. but robes do, so who cares :p

[Sonark]

Dark Elf form from guise does have the flying kick animation. However monk clothes dont show up.. but robes do, so who cares :pI guess Dark Elves sharing the same animations as humans makes sense, since they're just scaled down humans with different textures on older models.

[stewe]

Confused by this mentality, what do you care if someone who has ample time to lock down these time limited items carries them over to blue IF they get merged? They are going to be camped probably non-stop regardless if blue and green merges or not.. This is the second thread saying the same thing (that I have seen, probably been more) and it always just looks like "I don't have the time/intention/allies to camp the items before they are gone, or won't be able to get into the camp cause others are "having fun" camping them non stop, so I don't want anyone else to be able to either"

If they did get merged over to blue, does it matter that there are more manastones on blue?

There was a reason these items were removed in the first place, Sony didnt want a server full of just dark elves running around for example, green should just be deleted or just another server after it hits the end of its timeline not merged with blue

[Videri]

There was a reason these items were removed in the first place, Sony didnt want a server full of just dark elves running around for example, green should just be deleted or just another server after it hits the end of its timeline not merged with blue

Let's see if we can get every single character a Guise so we can all follow this guy around and make sure he sees nothing but Dark Elves throughout Norrath...forever. hehe

WHO'S WITH ME??