Boxing and you

[Menden]

Alrighty folks, with Green arriving soon I wanted to go over boxing. We take this rule extremely seriously and heavily enforce it.

What is boxing exactly? Well, Llandris has it clearly defined in the PNP rules post (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=325349).

6. You may not have more than one client running per real life person playing on Project 1999 (Boxing).

There is no 'boxing' on Project 1999 servers. Boxing is defined as having more than one client running from a single computer, or having more than one client running per person in the same household on different computers. Project 1999 has an IP block on its servers to prevent players from boxing. You may apply for an IP exemption if you have more than one person in your household wanting to play by following the instructions on this forum:

Petition forums. (https://www.project1999.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=25) Be sure to read the announcement sticky prior to posting to ensure all required information is contained within your petition.

Violation of this rule will result in disciplinary action, and you may lose the account(s) involved.

The exception to this rule is having one client running for Project 1999 Red PvP as well as one for Project 1999 Blue. This is allowed.




With that I'll reiterate, the one account per person ratio must be maintained at all times while playing on any of our servers, no exception. This doesn't mean you can't own multiple accounts, this just means you can't use them at the same time on the same server.

We get a disgustingly large amount of folks caught boxing saying things like;


It was only for a second!

I was only transferring an item!

I was only porting myself!



This is still boxing.


Other actions that are heavily frowned upon that we will start to enforce are /quitting to quickly switch accounts or letting a second account sit in character select... yes we can see this.

So, in the future if we see this kind of behavior one of the following may happen.


A warning and a mark on your accounts.

IP Exemptions removed.

Boxing 30 day suspension.

Boxing Ban.



Also, remember that at any point in time while playing on our servers, you may be approached by a staff member for a boxing check. Do not camp out or go LD. The faster you comply with instructions, the faster we can let you return to the game if found innocent. All players are expected to be capable of communicating in English and have basic movement skills.

[baakss]

Is there any word yet on whether we can run a Green character and a Blue character at the same time?

[Baler]

Pras p99
No boxing is one of the reasons I keep coming back.
Every player character in the game is a person in real life.

[Cen]

Pras p99
No boxing is one of the reasons I keep coming back.
Every player character in the game is a person in real life.

Its honestly my pure drive to be here. Its not even the nostalgia anymore. I have more memories of classic everquest in blue now then my original rallos zek and sullon runs. I would even play live, but the fact that everyone plays multiple characters really, really, really, really, really irritates me. I hate boxing more then anything else in any game meant to be played as a single character. Playing in a team is so worthwhile for so many reasons.

[Menden]

Is there any word yet on whether we can run a Green character and a Blue character at the same time?

Yes, you can have single characters on blue, red and green at the same time!

[Kavious]

Is there any word yet on whether we can run a Green character and a Blue character at the same time?

It was in the original announcement: Introducing Project 1999: Green (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=333743)

Boxing
As usual with all Project 1999 servers, boxing will NOT be allowed. However, as is currently the case with Blue and Red, you may play one character per server at the same time.

[Kanuvan]

it is often overlooked by the players but we appreciate the seriousness against boxing, it really is the reason we quit TLP servers and came here

[baakss]

It was in the original announcement: Introducing Project 1999: Green (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=333743)

Ack! Totally missed that. Thanks!

[Swish]

Pras p99
No boxing is one of the reasons I keep coming back.
Every player character in the game is a person in real life.

+1

Also a big shout out to some of the obvious idiots who'll sell high elf guard weapons on a second account and things like that. Shit's obvious and it'll cost you both accounts, why do it? Play properly like the rest of us. In that example, bind at the Steamfont druid rings and run back, takes 2 minutes - invis bank around the wall in Felwithe... its easy <3

How many IP exemptions have been given out since P99 started, I wonder? I bet its almost five figures...there's only so many "brothers" out there :o

[shortshot444]

Imagine if power leveling was as frowned upon as boxing, could argue they both effect the overall experience in a negative way. I agree boxing is bad, but just think how different the environment would be with a anti-power leveling policy . The 4 mob bard limit will sure be a very positive thing off the start, not long before zones are monopolized by power leveling. I know this wont happen but just imagine, earning your levels seems to be the point of playing a 20 year old game.

[Swish]

Imagine if power leveling was as frowned upon as boxing, could argue they both effect the overall experience in a negative way. I agree boxing is bad, but just think how different the environment would be with a anti-power leveling policy . The 4 mob bard limit will sure be a very positive thing off the start, not long before zones are monopolized by power leveling. I know this wont happen but just imagine, earning your levels seems to be the point of playing a 20 year old game.

If its zone disruption, report it.

Example: Soandso the druid has been hired by some low level and has pulled half of crushbone for some fast XP and belts. You went in to get XP and now there's nothing to kill because it's all dead. Tell them you're reporting it, usually they'll move on, but a green tag appearing just adds that certainty so you (and the rest of the zone) can enjoy the session as intended.

[Tethler]

Thanks, Menden. This is exactly what keeps me playing p99. Boxing is a scourge.

[Hoppkins_Wytchfinder]

Live is utterly filled with boxers. Its soul crushingly bad.

You can bet out of every 10 people in sight there is probably 2-3 real people there tops.

[Tethler]

Live is utterly filled with boxers. Its soul crushingly bad.

You can bet out of every 10 people in sight there is probably 2-3 real people there tops.

And then each box with a merc. Nobody needs to interact except for raiding.

[Sinistria]

No boxing = great

This what is makes so special to play here.

It is pure! It is nice people! It is classic!

I think i will get an IP exemption.
Not that i need 2 accounts myself, but i hope i can get a real friend i played UO (OMG so much) with or DAoC on Uthgaard freeshard and recently WoW on a freeshard.

I am not sure if he will ever be willing to give it a chance but if i have a 2. account (i have a gamer hell in my cellar so he just needs to sit down and start) he will probably try it out.

Thank you for taking so much care of this. I am always glad i only meet real people

[zodium]

boxing is the death of emulated servers

[Chortles Snort|eS]

me reaL enjoY taKe elf teaMS to dunGeON victolY
BoO boXinG

[Deathrydar]

As many people already stated, the Boxing rule is one of the main reasons why I love this server! It keeps the population real and I know there is always a real person behind that character.

[Fammaden]

No warnings: immediate ban and delete the characters so green server can have the names.

[Thrombosis]

Agree with no boxing. Totally ruined the experience of other non-P1999 emulators.

[Hoppkins_Wytchfinder]

And then each box with a merc. Nobody needs to interact except for raiding.

There have been reports of one person boxing Yelinak. DOnt even need to interact to raid :|

[Chapelle]

Other actions that are heavily frowned upon that we will start to enforce are /quitting to quickly switch accounts or letting a second account sit in character select... yes we can see this.

Just wanted to clarify that /q from one account to log into another account could result in a ban, even though I would have to wait until the first LD toon to drop from the server before I log into the second account? I see /q being used a lot in these instances as opposed to camping.

[quido]

Just wanted to clarify that /q from one account to log into another account could result in a ban, even though I would have to wait until the first LD toon to drop from the server before I log into the second account? I see /q being used a lot in these instances as opposed to camping.

When you have an IP exemption, you are able to avoid the LD lockout that normally lasts a couple minutes. If you don't have an exemption, you are not able to fast switch using /quit.

[Chapelle]

If we don't have an IP exemption, is /q still going to be prohibited?

[Benanov]

You can still /q to log out quickly. It's the logging back in that is where they get you.

[Menden]

You can still /q to log out quickly. It's the logging back in that is where they get you.

Correct, /q all you want. But using it to quickly switch accounts is where it's a problem.

[loramin]

Alrighty folks, with Green arriving soon I wanted to go over boxing. We take this rule extremely seriously and heavily enforce it.

https://i.imgur.com/xB0md7q.gif

[Awweshux]

/quitting to quickly switch accounts - why is this an issue? Is it that ppl w/ IP exemption are essentially on two accounts at one time on same computer same person when they do that? So it would only apply to ppl who have IP exemption and are abusing it? So that if you /q out WITHOUT IP exemption you'll be locked out for a couple minutes any way so no need to worry if you do NOT have IP exemption and /q then log over to other account? Do I have that correctly?

[cd288]

/quitting to quickly switch accounts - why is this an issue? Is it that ppl w/ IP exemption are essentially on two accounts at one time on same computer same person when they do that? So it would only apply to ppl who have IP exemption and are abusing it? So that if you /q out WITHOUT IP exemption you'll be locked out for a couple minutes any way so no need to worry if you do NOT have IP exemption and /q then log over to other account? Do I have that correctly?

Maybe I'm mis-reading that person's post, but maybe they are asking about what happens if they /q from one account and then go to log in on a different account and get on a character from that one while their /q'ed character from the first account is still temporarily active?

[kylok]

/quitting to quickly switch accounts - why is this an issue? Is it that ppl w/ IP exemption are essentially on two accounts at one time on same computer same person when they do that? So it would only apply to ppl who have IP exemption and are abusing it? So that if you /q out WITHOUT IP exemption you'll be locked out for a couple minutes any way so no need to worry if you do NOT have IP exemption and /q then log over to other account? Do I have that correctly?
Yes

[Canelek]

Switching accounts to ground transfer or just change characters does not take long anyways. May as well camp out then exit to the login screen. I believe it takes ~1.5 minutes at the high end but YMMV depending on your hardware and connection consistency.

[Whirled]

I think I saw someone boxing on Green but I was unsure the rule since it just test atm

[whitebandit]

from what i understand you are allowed to box on the green beta at the moment

[Kavious]

It was in the announcement Rogean posted

Green Beta (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=336043)

Boxing is allowed on the Beta Server.

[Canelek]

The cool part about boxing on beta is that you will probably eventually get caught on Green99 Live. :D

[Tenderizer]

Correct, /q all you want. But using it to quickly switch accounts is where it's a problem.

good to know, ill keep that in mind oct 25

[brokenpromise]

How long has boxing been banned on blue? Asking for a friend

[zodium]

boxing is the death of adventure

[Kavious]

How long has boxing been banned on blue? Asking for a friend

From this poll, looks like from the very beginning

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2738

[loramin]

From this poll, looks like from the very beginning

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2738

Yup! From Nilbog's original announcement of P99 on the EQ Emulator site:

Project 1999 - Legit PVE Classic Progression


Release Date: October 2nd, time TBA.


After many joyful days, nights, and months of development, we are ready to release the server.

Brief description of highlights:

-Progressive through Velious -

- 100% Static Zones - You won't be able to repop an empty zone by zoning.

-Upon release, each RL player is allowed to play 1 client until it is deemed in need of change by the community.

...


Evidently it's never been "deemed in need of change by the community" :D

[Gustoo]

the fact that everyone plays multiple characters really, really, really, really, really irritates me. I hate boxing more then anything else in any game meant to be played as a single character. Playing in a team is so worthwhile for so many reasons.

I agree. It bums me out to be playing the game with a bunch of characters only to find that Fiona is just a useless barely responsive heal bot, and Geralttto is switching between Fiona and the rogue so won't really be doing much talking about what we are doing in /g

Definitely destroys the game.

You're a warrior. You need a healer to heal you and a porter to port you.

VS

You're a warrior and you log into random caster to do all the stuff your warrior can't do.

= no community no communication no everquest no fun

[Nagoya]

i remember my father was boxing some times.
he got fun out of it. didn't want to talk to anyone. thought of EQ as a solo game.
finally convinced him to go on a different server where boxing and soloing is the norm and he enjoys it.
he is not a bad person, just a 60+ y.o. french dude who didn't want to interact in english with many people (just found out in this thread today that apparently speaking english is mandatory to be a player on p99, i cried a little inside :( ) and thought boxing was nice cause he could help himself instead of doing all these things that we all love and protect.

all this to say, i am 100% against boxing and i agree that the hard no-boxing rule is the reason why i'm still here after so many years :)
but all boxers are not abusing assholes. some of them are just foreign grumpy old men.
banning them is still fine.
but don't hate on them. they just play the wrong game.

but please ban them.

[loramin]

i remember my father was boxing some times.
he got fun out of it. didn't want to talk to anyone. thought of EQ as a solo game.
finally convinced him to go on a different server where boxing and soloing is the norm and he enjoys it.
he is not a bad person, just a 60+ y.o. french dude who didn't want to interact in english with many people (just found out in this thread today that apparently speaking english is mandatory to be a player on p99, i cried a little inside :( ) and thought boxing was nice cause he could help himself instead of doing all these things that we all love and protect.

all this to say, i am 100% against boxing and i agree that the hard no-boxing rule is the reason why i'm still here after so many years :)
but all boxers are not abusing assholes. some of them are just foreign grumpy old men.
banning them is still fine.
but don't hate on them. they just play the wrong game.

but please ban them.

That was a really nice post Nagoya!

I wish more people could remember that X might be bad in specific ways for specific reasons, but just because that's true it doesn't mean that anyone who likes X is suffering from a moral failing. People can be different from you, and make different choices, and that's ok (as long as those choices aren't hurting anyone else).

A lot of people could stand to learn that, in a lot of cases besides just 20-year old emulated elf sim boxing.

[Pootle]

I used to box on live... 3 chars + 3 mercs... (unless someone wanted to join my group, then I simply drop mercs/chars)

However, the NoBoxing rule is one of my favorite things about P99.

Keep up the good work!!! :D

[3d_glasses]

Anyone ever suspect it on P99 but felt couldnt think of how to ask? I swear I was hunting gnomes down in Solsek Eye one night and there was a caster duo who joined the group. Felt like they were only acting in tandem and sometimes one would respond for the other with stuff like , " oh he's going to get a drink" I dunno, it was a weird night maybe they were just inattentive players. Well, they were really inattentive players but maybe not one boxer.

[Jlpstrtkng]

Anyone ever suspect it on P99 but felt couldnt think of how to ask? I swear I was hunting gnomes down in Solsek Eye one night and there was a caster duo who joined the group. Felt like they were only acting in tandem and sometimes one would respond for the other with stuff like , " oh he's going to get a drink" I dunno, it was a weird night maybe they were just inattentive players. Well, they were really inattentive players but maybe not one boxer.

They could be playing in the same house. My brother and I live together and when we play he sits behind me so I’ve spoken for him when he’s afk etc in that context.

[Danth]

speaking english is mandatory to be a player on p99

I couldn't let my daughter play on here for effectively the same reason when she wanted to try a couple years ago. She was too young at the time to be able to chat with a GM if she had to for some reason or another. She proceeded to find Minecraft instead, which probably was for the better in the long run.

Danth

[Katran]

Anyone ever suspect it on P99 but felt couldnt think of how to ask? I swear I was hunting gnomes down in Solsek Eye one night and there was a caster duo who joined the group. Felt like they were only acting in tandem and sometimes one would respond for the other with stuff like , " oh he's going to get a drink" I dunno, it was a weird night maybe they were just inattentive players. Well, they were really inattentive players but maybe not one boxer.

Often you have people who use voice chat in addition to talk to each other. So they might communicate in voice and not so much in chat.

[Whirled]

I got trouble enough trying to play 1 character and /pet_000. Kudos to those that can bot army and whatever but it's not on my list of to do. I think I downloaded Discord and it all default settings but typing help while dying just seems more classic to me. Yea man, what he said up there.

[Raclen]

blue server - no real reason to box outside of some nerd dominating a camp that 20 other guys are sitting in line to camp... obviously don't want that going on. Buffs aren't a big deal on a blue server unless you are downing some raid encounter with minimum amount of players.

red server - A different issue, there are a lot of reasons why boxing makes sense and a lot of the boxing issues are solved with pvp anyways. Requiring constant buffs and in a certain order make some classes awful to play without boxing or gives a huge disadvantage to some classes that are helpless without certain buffs. If you come across someone boxing to hold down a camp you can most likely destroy them and fix that issue on a red server.

[Madbad]

blue server - no real reason to box outside of some nerd dominating a camp that 20 other guys are sitting in line to camp... obviously don't want that going on. Buffs aren't a big deal on a blue server unless you are downing some raid encounter with minimum amount of players.

red server - A different issue, there are a lot of reasons why boxing makes sense and a lot of the boxing issues are solved with pvp anyways. Requiring constant buffs and in a certain order make some classes awful to play without boxing or gives a huge disadvantage to some classes that are helpless without certain buffs. If you come across someone boxing to hold down a camp you can most likely destroy them and fix that issue on a red server.

I think we found all three of the people still on red in one post.

[Nirgon]

Pras p99
No boxing is one of the reasons I keep coming back.
Every player character in the game is a person in real life.

If we could only keep it to one account per player and crack down on sharing characters.

When someone gets suspended on one account, they just play a diff character or some shared guild account until free.

Account sharing was an ez way to get a suspension if caught on live.

[Nirgon]

I think we found all three of the people still on red in one post.

If you find the 600+ that left, ask em why :).

[zodium]

If you find the 600+ that left, ask em why :).

better dead than red

[cd288]

(just found out in this thread today that apparently speaking english is mandatory to be a player on p99, i cried a little inside :( )

I don't think English is mandatory to play on P99, just that if you box and get caught, not speaking English isn't going to be something that you can use as an excuse (i.e. because you couldn't read the rules or that because you can't understand English you couldn't comply with the staff's instructions when they investigate you for boxing)

[uygi]

Account sharing was an ez way to get a suspension if caught on live.

Not true. Even eBay/PlayerAuctions RMT, while against the rules, never got anyone suspended that I ever heard about. If you paid your $10/month, you got to log in one toon at a time (per subscription). Their goal wasn’t to have a fair playing field, it was to get more of those $10/month.

It was “common” for “top” guilds on a server to require members to share login info with officers to prove they weren’t up to anything shady. I thought that was insane, but quite a few people seemed to think that was normal. I never shared mine, but I knew a number of people with pocket clerics/enchanters (I assume they bought them on eBay...) that shared info to me. One guy needed help buying subscription one month so he gave me his login, I paid for a month or two and had access to his boxing account for a long time, very convenient.

[uygi]

Along the lines of English being “required”, if you’re sharing an IP with someone (or anything that server staff could possibly interpret as similar) and there are two toons logged in, neither of you can afk or you’ll never pass a boxing test. You have to log one out if either/both of you are afk.

Not entirely “fair”, given that AFKing is perfectly allowed and can be super beneficial (IE friend lets you AFK soak up XP), but if you don’t want a ban, comply!

If my wife is playing and needs me to help her do something on her client, I log out before I’ll touch it. Kinda pisses her off.

[akagami]

+1

Also a big shout out to some of the obvious idiots who'll sell high elf guard weapons on a second account and things like that. Shit's obvious and it'll cost you both accounts, why do it? Play properly like the rest of us. In that example, bind at the Steamfont druid rings and run back, takes 2 minutes - invis bank around the wall in Felwithe... its easy <3

How many IP exemptions have been given out since P99 started, I wonder? I bet its almost five figures...there's only so many "brothers" out there :o

Has this come up in the past? What if you have a second person log in to different level 1 characters just to do sales/transfers etc?

If the second person actually existed but in-game only served to be used for muling/sales/transfers etc would that be considered against the rules since it doesn't serve the spirit of the IP exemptions (ie, actually allowing families/roommates to each play the game)?

[kylok]

As long as it's one human being per character logged in and they're at the computer it should be fine

[Baler]

As long as it's one human being per character logged in and they're at the computer it should be fine

What about human clones? or paid labor...
I know this guy who hangs out at home depot. Considering paying him to play a cleric for me.
You think the staff would be cool with this?

If we could only keep it to one account per player and crack down on sharing characters.

When someone gets suspended on one account, they just play a diff character or some shared guild account until free.

Account sharing was an ez way to get a suspension if caught on live.

I have access to over 40 level 60s in three different guilds. Not even kidding.

[Nagoya]

I don't think English is mandatory to play on P99, just that if you box and get caught, not speaking English isn't going to be something that you can use as an excuse (i.e. because you couldn't read the rules or that because you can't understand English you couldn't comply with the staff's instructions when they investigate you for boxing)

Well, OP clearly said that GM expect you to understand basic English tho?

My wife does not understand "basic English", ergo we couldn't get an IP exemption if she wanted to try EQ (she almost wanted for Green hehe).

It's okay, I understand the abuse if they don't say that.
But it sucks.
It's like when I lived in Japan and couldn't go into onsen cause i had tattoos even tho the rule is clearly for yakuza.

It's an easy fix to a complex problem, hurting people on the way for the greater good.

But as I said, I understand it. No problem.

[Nagoya]

All players are expected to be capable of communicating in English and have basic movement skills.

Sorry, not basic English. Just English.

[Collins5112]

Can this rule also be stretched to apply to account sharing for green? Imagine everyone having to level their own character instead of four or five people on a rotation leveling that same character for some pixels.

[Izmael]

Can this rule also be stretched to apply to account sharing for green? Imagine everyone having to level their own character instead of four or five people on a rotation leveling that same character for some pixels.

I doubt there's a way to police that without triggering way too many false positives.

[Baler]

Account sharing is are the owner's risk. It's a simple as that.

If you share your account with someone who does something stupid with it and it's banned. It doesn't matter if it wasn't the owner. This is the risk associated with sharing accounts.

I think account sharing is in a very fair place at the moment, risk vs reward. There is still risk depending on who you share your info with.
So if you play stupid games you win stupid prizes.

[redhorse]

blue server - no real reason to box outside of some nerd dominating a camp that 20 other guys are sitting in line to camp... obviously don't want that going on. Buffs aren't a big deal on a blue server unless you are downing some raid encounter with minimum amount of players.

I read this and thought it really didn’t make sense. There are a ton of temptations to box either just for a moment, or for an extended period of time. Granted I agree it’s good p99 has no boxing, and enforces the rule. But acting like there is no reason?! Then I read him say “red server” and stopped reading the rest. Sigh.

[redhorse]

If we could only keep it to one account per player and crack down on sharing characters.

This is a logical fallacy known as a red herring argument. The topic is boxing.

[Tobius]

Alrighty folks, with Green arriving soon I wanted to go over boxing. We take this rule extremely seriously and heavily enforce it.

What is boxing exactly? Well, Llandris has it clearly defined in the PNP rules post (https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=325349).





With that I'll reiterate, the one account per person ratio must be maintained at all times while playing on any of our servers, no exception. This doesn't mean you can't own multiple accounts, this just means you can't use them at the same time on the same server.

We get a disgustingly large amount of folks caught boxing saying things like;


It was only for a second!

I was only transferring an item!

I was only porting myself!



This is still boxing.


Other actions that are heavily frowned upon that we will start to enforce are /quitting to quickly switch accounts or letting a second account sit in character select... yes we can see this.

So, in the future if we see this kind of behavior one of the following may happen.


A warning and a mark on your accounts.

IP Exemptions removed.

Boxing 30 day suspension.

Boxing Ban.



Also, remember that at any point in time while playing on our servers, you may be approached by a staff member for a boxing check. Do not camp out or go LD. The faster you comply with instructions, the faster we can let you return to the game if found innocent. All players are expected to be capable of communicating in English and have basic movement skills.

Woah my understanding was that it only counted as boxing if you had two characters in world.

I thought you could have one spinning around on the char select screen as long as the other is camped out before the other enters the world.

But you say it is now/always was a case of just two instances of the 'everquest program' running on the laptop or whatever?

Damn. Well I'm glad I know this. I never used /q unless my character was stuck or had summoned bags or some shit.

Didn't even wanna do transfers with this. Just thought it would be effecient and shit.

[uygi]

It allowed players with exemptions unfairly fast character switch times. This wasn’t always expressly against the rules and a lot of players did it back then, including me. It was definitely possible to die, or burn a disc or whatever on one character and fast log to the other in maybe 10 seconds or less. People/guilds with an army of characters (and there were/are MANY) could do crazy stuff.

Unsure how it’s policed, and I don’t care to find out!