The Legacy Problem

[zodium]

What is the Legacy Problem?
I was going to start out this post with some quotes from the wild. But it seems hardly necessary. Anyone reading these forums or Discord has seen that almost half the server states "wanna get legacy item" as a central motivation for their Green excitement. It's obvious. The historicity and practicalities have been discussed to death. Anyone who's done the math knows that those people will be first disappointed, then angry, then demotivated or toxic. This is the Legacy Problem in a nutshell.

Mechanics have been implemented. GM-Cops reportedly stand ready to patrol the legacy camps 24/7, rhythmically spinning their pixelated batons while they whistle a jolly cop tune. This response is reasonable and well considered enough.


Tedious Disclaimers You Won't Read Anyway
Let me preface a few things here. As a vanilla EQ player, I was big time down on Green due to what I saw as an unwillingness to address the one vanilla imbalance that could spoil the whole barrel: insufficient content. Spawn time reduction and List helped show me that unwillingness doesn't exist. No doubt long discussions have been had; positions have been taken; decisions have been made; time has been invested, and a fragile truce seems to exist around List. All the same, I want to make the case to you all, and especially to any staff reading this, that this state cannot last, and we should, in this 11th hour, take a radically different approach.

I am conscious the Green release date looms large, and that this is too long and you didn't read it. And as I know some of my esteemed poster comrades are very concerned with purity of intent (skip this if that's not you), allow me to sound like an insanely huge tool: I am wealthy beyond measure on Blue, and I will do well on Green too. If it's useful or even just mildly entertaining to me, I own it. If it can be killed, I've killed it, probably solo or with a minimally viable crew. If it can be done, I have done it. I like to think the people of P99 know Gatmanno as a force for the joie de vivre of adventuring. I am not mad, bad or sad in any sense of those words. And while I would like to engage with all my poster comrades about the legacy item problem here, if this doesn't insulate me from having my intentions impugned, nothing will. I am not out for anything except freeing people to enjoy the classic experience.


Maybe Shut Up And Get To The Point, Gat?
Every day hopeful greenhorns (that's what we're calling people who joined p99 for Green launch, that's forum canon now) pop in to tell everyone how excited they are to do this and that, and finally get their shot at a Manastone. And of course they do. As a Manastone owner on Blue, I can tell you yes, Manastones are every bit as fun as they look. Regardless of efficiency, it is a very fun mechanic with a very fun visual effect. You'd be crazy not to want one, of course, like a great musician who died too young, they became an iconic item!

I seriously applaud List. It is clever and well thought out, and it will likely be as effective as can be expected in managing camp drama given this situation. But the operative term is "as can be expected" here. And the underlying issue is underestimating how central Guises, Lockets, Rings of the Dead, etc., all these iconic classic items are in the minds of 'people who reminisce about Classic EverQuest and are drawn to be genuinely passionate about the P99 vision'. People can laugh derisively at them, or appeal to reason or purity of classicness, if it makes you feel better. It won't help. In many ways, the perceived possibility of obtaining legacy items is a core part of what defines classicness to many.

Because it isn't just those items-as-items. It's nearly twenty years of people low key, maybe not even with conscious awareness, thinking about that Manastone they never got in Classic, now and then, when they saw an EverQuest thing. You don't need advanced degrees in psychology to work out that if you emotionally dangle a person's childhood dreams, even stupid and trivial ones, just out of reach in front of them, they are going to pursue it with single minded toxicity. And they will culturally transmit that attitude to everyone who didn't play Classic.

List will thus have both foreseeable and unforeseeable consequences for gameplay at large that doesn't really address this problem, not least of which in people picking classes based on aptness for the new mechanic. And when I think about this, I think all the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't keep Humpty from pursuing his deeply entrenched psychological desire for one or more legacy items. I think it's a very humbling, very human thing. As Green 1 becomes Green 2 and 3 and relevant strategies improve, this will only become more pronounced.


Too Long, Didn't Read
And that's it. When we get to the Green 2, Green 3, etc. part, what's when I think, hold right the heck on here. These items are only a problem precisely because they're so fun and iconic and representative of "classicness" that there is no classic without them. Why are we doing all this unclassic work to keep people from having them?

I feel like the community have slowly and very begrudgingly acknowledged the very real psychological importance of legacy items in defining 'classicness' for most people to begin with, and the importance of their equitable availability to a Classic EverQuest project. Then, slowly and begrudgingly talked ourselves into deploying a combination of a custom game mechanic plus heavy manual enforcement to deal with the toxicity we all know will ensue from their scarcity even when they do drop.

We do all this so that we can specifically keep the amount of certain legacy items era accurate? So, here's the punchline:

Announcing a dramatic increase in legacy item influx rates independent of cash or other items the mob has, and adding other minor tweaks like Lore tags, would be simpler, more effective and at least less aesthetically unclassic, with less side effects.

If you're still with me, thanks for reading. Sloths rule, Hail Satan, Hail Santa, Hail Bristlebane.

[Vexenu]

I think the best approach would have been to leave the legacy items out entirely. People cry not classic, but every new server launched post-legacy item nerf was launched with those items removed. So it is classic to launch a new server without them. People would gripe but it would save a lot of headaches for both staff and players. We'll see how the List plays out, though. They put a lot of thought and effort into it, so hopefully it works reasonably well. The eternal neckbeard, however, ruiner of lands and hoarder of pixels that he is, may have other ideas.

[zodium]

I think the best approach would have been to leave the legacy items out entirely. People cry not classic, but every new server launched post-legacy item nerf was launched with those items removed. So it is classic to launch a new server without them. People would gripe but it would save a lot of headaches for both staff and players. We'll see how the List plays out, though. They put a lot of thought and effort into it, so hopefully it works reasonably well. The eternal neckbeard, however, ruiner of lands and hoarder of pixels that he is, may have other ideas.

A sensible, common-sense solution that can never work because

it isn't just those items-as-items. It's nearly twenty years of people low key, maybe not even with conscious awareness, thinking about that Manastone they never got in Classic, now and then, when they saw an EverQuest thing. You don't need advanced degrees in psychology to work out that if you emotionally dangle a person's childhood dreams, even stupid and trivial ones, just out of reach in front of them, they are going to pursue it with single minded toxicity. And they will culturally transmit that attitude to everyone who didn't play Classic.

the community have slowly and very begrudgingly acknowledged the very real psychological importance of legacy items in defining 'classicness' for most people to begin with, and the importance of their equitable availability to a Classic EverQuest project. Then, slowly and begrudgingly talked ourselves into deploying a combination of a custom game mechanic plus heavy manual enforcement to deal with the toxicity we all know will ensue from their scarcity even when they do drop.

in other words, a classic server without these items is, in a deeply entrenched definitional sense, not classic, because "classicness" is in large part defined by the perceived availability of these items.

[Wenai]

I did read your entire post and you touched on what would have been my solution to manastone slightly.

I would have made it Magic Lore No Drop and soul bound (unless there is a way to make it lore across corpses). I would’ve also put a level restriction to looting it. That way you could only get 1 manastone per character above the minimum level. You would need to level an army of characters to get lots of them.

As soon as they no longer drop, remove all of the custom features and restore to its original state.

[Gustoo]

It's classic because sullon zek, firiona vie and like 10 other servers never had them

There is no strict definition of classic here. It's whatever staff feels works best for their vision and there is no hard and fast "must do x because of y" in this project.

For example if they decided the final solution to the classic problem was to remove all manastones and guises they might just do that. I don't think they will. They already decided what they want to do, which is include these items.

I spent a lot of time on the red server. It's the toxic equivalent of a nuclear waste storage casket on a Superfund site. Manastones were there without a list. Server cross trading was legal for a couple of years meaning red and blue economies effected one another. It didn't ruin the world.

Pvp reduced the toxicity of these kind of camps, sure.

But like most people deeply worried about this I think you're more worried about your blue bank account and how you don't want to have to tactically participate in green just to boost your blue riches.

New servers are always a financial opportunity even if it's in game coin only. They always will be. Green will be too.

I read your TLDR and still didn't get what your point was but responded anyways good.luck with your thread.

[Danth]

Every person standing in line for a to-be-removed item that I don't care about is one more person who isn't choking up the stuff I do care about, so I'm fine with the present setup. It'll be interesting to see just how long the lists get.

I'm with Vexenu, if it were up to me I wouldn't have put those items in at all. I don't see the value in trying to replicate the game's entire patch history. Seems like a lot of extra work for little benefit. But then I'd never build something like P99 at all....don't love the game enough to put in that much time. Got to be something of a true believer to do that.

Danth

[phobus]

You would need to level an army of characters to get lots of them.

No need to encourage them.

[Mblake81]

toxic.

toxicity

toxicity

T-T-TRIPLE NEGGED


Hail Bristlebane.

[Cen]

I hate when people put the words mad glad sad dad or bad together in a string, since with my regional dialect they all have seperate a sounds and dont rhyme with each other and everywhere else in the world they rhyme so it sounds silly when I read it.

Its like when people used to say "its on like donkey Kong" and for me on and kong dont come close to rhyming like everywhere else since we have split short o's as well.

Also people read more than you think :p

[zodium]

I did read your entire post and you touched on what would have been my solution to manastone slightly.

I would have made it Magic Lore No Drop and soul bound (unless there is a way to make it lore across corpses). I would’ve also put a level restriction to looting it. That way you could only get 1 manastone per character above the minimum level. You would need to level an army of characters to get lots of them.

As soon as they no longer drop, remove all of the custom features and restore to its original state.

Thank you pal. Lore No Drop Soul Bound with revert after removal is an interesting idea for making life difficult for farmlords. As I am already familiar with numerous deranged individuals and crews planning to powerlevel lootmules for legacy items, I think nothing can probably stand alone without increasing the influx rate, though.

But like most people deeply worried about this I think you're more worried about your blue bank account and how you don't want to have to tactically participate in green just to boost your blue riches.

New servers are always a financial opportunity even if it's in game coin only. They always will be. Green will be too.

And as I know some of my esteemed poster comrades are very concerned with purity of intent (skip this if that's not you), allow me to sound like an insanely huge tool: I am wealthy beyond measure on Blue, and I will do well on Green too. If it's useful or even just mildly entertaining to me, I own it. If it can be killed, I've killed it, probably solo or with a minimally viable crew. If it can be done, I have done it. I like to think the people of P99 know Gatmanno as a force for the joie de vivre of adventuring. I am not mad, bad or sad in any sense of those words. And while I would like to engage with all my poster comrades about the legacy item problem here, if this doesn't insulate me from having my intentions impugned, nothing will. I am not out for anything except freeing people to enjoy the classic experience.

My friend, as someone who already has everything, I promise you my only concern and point is liberating people such as yourself from the need to view Green as "a financial opportunity."

[skorge]

These items are only a problem precisely because they're so fun and iconic and representative of "classicness" that there is no classic without them.

First of all don't be surprised with all the hate you get here...you will receive responses such as "server is launching in 3 days why did you wait so long to talk about this..."

Secondly I would like to mention that Zodium is literally a walking legend within the P99 community...he was a part of Shards of Dalaya which was an amazing EQ emu. When he talks he knows his stuff.

Finally, he is right by stating the above. Ideally the best solution for the staff's sake would be to completely remove these items but then at that point the server is no longer considered classic to many people, which defeats the purpose of P99.

If they were made no-drop it would completely change the population of P99 as well - people would just play classes that could actually use it.

That said, the list may be the best option out there. That's probably the exact thought process that went in on in designing the list, lol

[Cen]

There's no real good reason why they took the guise out anyway. After all, they eventually put it back in the game :p

[pink grapefruit]

It's difficult to understand what this rambling and unnecessarily long post is even saying. You're suggesting that they increase the drop rate of these items and put lore tags on everything instead of adding in "The List"??

Your reasons for suggesting this are convoluted and poorly explained. Wtf does "aesthetically classic" mean, and why is it something that matters to anyone?

All I'm really getting from this post is that green would benefit greatly from pvp camp dispute mechanics, which is something everyone already knows.

[Fammaden]

Add me to the list that thinks the items simply shouldn't have existed, and interesting point that there WERE classic era servers that never had them in the first place. (Incidentally, if you remove them you have to remove hybrid penalties too IMO.)

The lore/nodrop/soulbound until MS is removed is a good plan too, second best idea to me.

Another, very non classic, approach would have been to just say yes they will drop for X amount of time, but not off a specific named with a static PH. They will be .0001% chance drops off any level ____ or higher mob in the game, good luck. Like a WoW style world-drop-epic.

Anyway, as someone who is personally very good at ignoring in game status symbols, power gaming clickies, and wealth hoarding (yet always still manages max levels and raid content participation), I don't really care. BUT its interesting to me that manastone is of dubious usefulness and practicality, guise is wholly cosmetic and flavor based....but the least talked about and lusted over item, quest free jboots, is by far the most versatile and most widely useful across all classes and races.

All because the guise and MS go away and become some sort of mythical white unicorn, yet jboots is one of the most persistently toxic and complained about camps on blue but virtually no one seems worried about how many will drop or what the scene in Najena will be. The majority who complain about potential camp lockdowns or toxic manipultion of the list system, are later content to just turn the world over to greedy profiteers who will keep jboots on lock down in the future because its easiest to just farm your plat and buy jboots like they are on a vendor.

TLDR: Manastone and guise are just mind over matter. I don't mind if I never get one, so they do not matter.

[Daldaen]

Best solution is to launch with classic populations.

If you look at the old server select screenshots which show populations, you see a bunch of 700-1200 populations. Not any 2000-3000s.

If on launch we are seeing 3000, that really should be split into 2 servers for the duration of classic. Splitting the population in half will double the legacy camps available to the total population which will help the most.

Server splits and mergers are very classic.

The problem of course is $. Because additional server hardware costs money.

[Fammaden]

Well, many of us assume that the initial 3k could become 1500 within as little as a week, and could continue to sink lower than that. I think Rogean has made it clear that if we are pushing 3k+ over a longer term then additional hardware is in the conversation.

[Chortles Snort|eS]

TLDR from a wASNt guN leAvE bLuE OP

didn’t read

[zodium]

First of all don't be surprised with all the hate you get here...you will receive responses such as "server is launching in 3 days why did you wait so long to talk about this..."

Secondly I would like to mention that Zodium is literally a walking legend within the P99 community...he was a part of Shards of Dalaya which was an amazing EQ emu. When he talks he knows his stuff.

Finally, he is right by stating the above. Ideally the best solution for the staff's sake would be to completely remove these items but then at that point the server is no longer considered classic to many people, which defeats the purpose of P99.

If they were made no-drop it would completely change the population of P99 as well - people would just play classes that could actually use it.

That said, the list may be the best option out there. That's probably the exact thought process that went in on in designing the list, lol

Wow, um, thank you. Though, as anyone who played SoD during my tenure will remember, I'm not concerned with the amount of hate I receive. :>

As for why I waited, it's because List was only announced recently and it took some time to reflect on what the mechanic entails for gameplay, I guess.



There's no real good reason why they took the guise out anyway. After all, they eventually put it back in the game :p

Add me to the list that thinks the items simply shouldn't have existed [...] All because these items go away and become some sort of mythical white unicorn, yet jboots is one of the most persistently toxic and complained about camps on blue but virtually no one seems worried about how many will drop or what the scene in Najena will be. The majority who complain about potential camp lockdowns or toxic gaming of the systems, are later content to just turn the world over to greedy profiteers who will keep jboots on lock down in the future because its easiest to just farm your plat and buy jboots like they are on a vendor.

TLDR: Manastone and guise are just mind over matter. I don't mind if I never get one, so they do not matter.

Cen essentially makes my point. I think Fammaden takes a very minmaxing-centric perspective in concluding it's "just mind over matter" because the items lack functional utility. We're not talking about impulse controlling your fast food intake here. The items are not particularly powerful. The issues stem from undesirable gameplay arising, paradoxically, from the fact the items are simply very fun to use. What matter are you minding over here, exactly? See:

As a Manastone owner on Blue, I can tell you yes, Manastones are every bit as fun as they look. Regardless of efficiency, it is a very fun mechanic with a very fun visual effect. You'd be crazy not to want one, of course, like a great musician who died too young, they became an iconic item!




Best solution is to launch with classic populations.

If you look at the old server select screenshots which show populations, you see a bunch of 700-1200 populations. Not any 2000-3000s.

If on launch we are seeing 3000, that really should be split into 2 servers for the duration of classic. Splitting the population in half will double the legacy camps available to the total population which will help the most.

Server splits and mergers are very classic.

The problem of course is $. Because additional server hardware costs money.

Yeah, this is the much larger "Classic Problem": shit's just not financially viable. But much like civil war reenactors don't require their armies to grow food using 1850's technology because it would turn the ordeal into a historical farming reenactment, I believe we too can adjust our blind spots. If we stick with List, that's alright too, I just think this would be a win-win-win for everyone.

[skorge]

I personally feel they should have beta tested the list more...maybe bump everyone up to level 50 and give people a reason to actually camp the stone, such as a Giveaway (imagine if they promised to give 1 manastone, 1 guise, and 1 jboots out at server launch - whoever tested the list on beta would be in the roll).

This way they would get a huge pile of people beta testing the list to see how effective it is...it doesn't make sense to launch the new server in just 3 days...but to each their own. I know many people are ready for Friday.

[Izmael]

I've read the OP but failed to understand the point he is trying to make.

Owning a couple legacy items myself, I'm not particularly glad more of these will enter Blue. But I see Green as an opportunity to get some other legacy items I do not own, such as a Guise and maybe some warder loot later on. So it kind of balances things out.

If the OP already owns everything and can't possibly look forward to getting something new on Green - well, I guess he won the game. Maybe it's time to focus on something else than accumulating wealth?

[bubur]

I know you're concerned about me getting my manerstern but the list system is already enough and present flags are okay and you should not worry about me thx op I appreciate ya

[Fammaden]

I've read the OP but failed to understand the point he is trying to make.

His point, once you filter all his pontification out, was that they should greatly increase the drop rate of the legacy items and probably make them lore, because its in the best interest of server health in his opinion to get them in as many different hands as possible while they are dropping.

[pink grapefruit]

"my system way better than list bc ~incomprehensible nonsense~"

[bubur]

if you make it no drop, you're taking away a more reasonable way for some players to obtain them in ec

It's going to be months and months. Yes they're limited but people will get them, reroll melee, and sell their stones for a whole suit of equipment, and many many other transactions will take place. Don't need to mess that up before we even see it pan out imo

[Baler]

List will thus have both foreseeable and unforeseeable consequences for gameplay
very profound

[Tenderizer]

financial gains for blue, lore/no drop items to make it more difficult for others to aquire, farming multiple legacy items plan?

pixels never change.

Just nuke the server after the timeline and give the accounts that made it through green a +1 to all stats charm, second run +2 ect... anything else is just making the crazies think of crazy ways to get crazy items. crazy is as crazy does

[zodium]

Owning a couple legacy items myself, I'm not particularly glad more of these will enter Blue. But I see Green as an opportunity to get some other legacy items I do not own, such as a Guise and maybe some warder loot later on. So it kind of balances things out.

If the OP already owns everything and can't possibly look forward to getting something new on Green - well, I guess he won the game.

Honestly, I think this is depressing. There's so much more to classic EverQuest than character progression. No, I guess my proposal to increase legacy item influxes wouldn't make much sense from this perspective.

His point, once you filter all his pontification out, was that they should greatly increase the drop rate of the legacy items and probably make them lore, because its in the best interest of server health in his opinion to get them in as many different hands as possible while they are dropping.

Yes precisely, thank you.


if you make it no drop, you're taking away a more reasonable way for some players to obtain them in ec

It's going to be months and months. Yes they're limited but people will get them, reroll melee, and sell their stones for a whole suit of equipment, and many many other transactions will take place. Don't need to mess that up before we even see it pan out imo

Yeah that's true, mayhap withdrawing support for NO DROP addition. I think LORE is a small and safe thing at least, soul binding still interesting too.


very profound

Everyone's a fuckin' editor.

[JesterMcgee]

I read the OP and understood it. If you had trouble with that, then you should probably do more reading in your life. I am very smart.

[aaezil]

Sounds like a hobbit wants to hoard

Filed under terrible idea

[Izmael]

At any rate, it's not like they are going to change anything about it 3 days before launch.

[Donkey Hotay]

The longer it takes your example pixel addict to gain his pixels--while under a system that guarantees him those pixels eventually--the better the chances that he'll donate.

[Sheriff_Cockroach]

Im only here to poopsock /lists. Its really honestly part of the appeal, and I just don't think its going to matter too much if I have some competition. I do feel I will eventually get a manastone, cause I can really no life it.

[mattydef]

People are too obsessed with legacy items. Is a manastone useful? Sure. Is a guise on certain classes cool? Hell yea. But once green launches they will no longer hold the same prestige that they have in the past as rare unobtainable artifacts, half the server or more will have them.

[Bazia]

ITT: people who have massive hoards of pixels cry about new people getting pixels

if you make green manastones lore / no drop then make them like that on blue as well or else it's just obvious catering

[Byrjun]

I'm not sure if it really solves anything. When Blue first launched, the manastone was the common drop. There were still lines, and Penoy farmed like 40 of the things.

I don't like /list but I'd prefer the drop rate to be as close to classic as possible.

But once green launches they will no longer hold the same prestige that they have in the past as rare unobtainable artifacts, half the server or more will have them.

Yeah sure, these items had no prestige on Blue either. I sold a manastone for next to nothing, and my DE had a Guise (although it turned out that was useful because the illusion buff would still boost faction for some reason).

Time does crazy things. I couldn't believe how much manastones were going for a year or two later after I sold mine. Admittedly, Blue received a surge of players who never had a chance to obtain those items once the server gained some popularity and word of mouth started to spread.

Green's not going to have this huge influx of players come into the game after the legacy items are removed, so it'll be interesting to see how things play out compare to Blue. Of course there will be people who start on Green late, but for the most part people who care about this stuff are going to know about the launch of Green and they'll be able to obtain these items themselves.

[DromalPhrenia]

Sloths rule, Hail Satan, Hail Santa, Hail Bristlebane.
I read the whole thing and this is the most important part.

I agree with the rest too, I do think the rarity of manastones is going to cause more unhappiness despite the /list system subduing the worst of player behavior around the camp. But not only do I not expect staff to reconsider this so close to Green release (although increasing drop rate doesn't seem like it would take a particularly long time?), I think a huge component of the draw for people is not only that they can have the item they so badly wanted all this time, but that many others WON'T have that item. If they're less rare, they're less special in the eyes of those players.

Personally I don't think it's healthy to cater to that mindset, but being one of the Haves and reveling in the jealousy of the Have Nots is hardly rare in real life or in elf games, so its no surprise that its a common desire for p99 Green.

Hence I only quoted the bottom of the post, because it needs to be emphasized and re-emphasized.
Sloths rule.
Hail Satan.

[Jah]

Remove Lists and make every Legacy item camp an Arena, Allow ninja looting of Legacy Items, and corpse loot of Legacy items from bodies you slay in the arena.

Play Red servers.

[Bazia]

if you think about it this is also a good anti-RMT measure, which was historically a large motivation for assholes to sit on a camp for weeks at a time

[Kapyong]

Hmmm...

I never had a Manastone, have no idea what it does, am not interested.
Don't know what a Guise is either.

Not particularly interested in any specific legacy item.
That's not what makes EQ for me.

YMMV.

[Gustoo]

Remove Lists and make every Legacy item camp an Arena, Allow ninja looting of Legacy Items, and corpse loot of Legacy items from bodies you slay in the arena.

Play Red servers.

Pretty good idea. Would play. Solves all problems.

[Gustoo]

I'm kind of confused as to what your point even is. ...

The only reason anyone would be against the list system is because it decreases their ability to hoard the legacy item.

Agreed even the TLDR part didn't make a point tho I hurt my neck cringing.

[Throatseeker]

I did read your entire post and you touched on what would have been my solution to manastone slightly.

I would have made it Magic Lore No Drop and soul bound (unless there is a way to make it lore across corpses). I would’ve also put a level restriction to looting it. That way you could only get 1 manastone per character above the minimum level. You would need to level an army of characters to get lots of them.

As soon as they no longer drop, remove all of the custom features and restore to its original state.

Yuuuuuuuuuuuup..

[Gustoo]

That is a solid solution too.

[Lojik]

Everyone knows everything about these legacy spawn camps, when they'll stop dropping, etc. You could make these items drop randomly throughout the game with every NPC .001% chance to drop it, with that chance going down each time that same npc is killed. Or (my pipe dream here) you could make the server achievement/content unlock, when specific NPCs are killed then it opens up the next patch/expansion/whatever. When the sleepers woken the server ends (make certain zones battleground zones flagged for pvp so people can stop others) and restarts! That's my pipedream, then people won't know how long a server will be around why bother hoarding manastones, solves the lack of content problem too and adds pvp in for those who want it at the high levels.

I'm pretty happy with the solutions and timeline put forward TBH though.

[cuffed]

I'm happy with every decision the team has made. While it is a mild annoyance that there will be a lack of content until Kunark is out - mostly because it doesn't align to my personal schedule - I can live with it.

I've never had a manastone. I'll try to camp it or buy it. Not fussed if I miss out. I think you are probably overthinking it and making it no trade would kind of suck.

Ill use this as an opportunity to thank the dev team and volunteers. Great work all. Super impressed and thankful for this server. Very professional.

[Bazia]

I'm happy with every decision the team has made. While it is a mild annoyance that there will be a lack of content until Kunark is out - mostly because it doesn't align to my personal schedule - I can live with it.

I've never had a manastone. I'll try to camp it or buy it. Not fussed if I miss out. I think you are probably overthinking it and making it no trade would kind of suck.

Ill use this as an opportunity to thank the dev team and volunteers. Great work all. Super impressed and thankful for this server. Very professional.

here here !!!

[Israel Adesanya]

is there an official timeline for the 3 legacy/list items?

[Nirgon]

/guildwar

[Fammaden]

is there an official timeline for the 3 legacy/list items?

Yes. You're supposedly a scholarly man of letters, consult the known documentation where this data is compiled.

[LiQuid]

I've been on p99 since 2012 and my biggest regret is that I discovered this server after the (very brief) window to get those legacy items closed because it meant I would never be able to get a Guise for Plush. It's the one thing I've wanted the most my entire time here and I'll do anything to get one, including playing on a server I'm otherwise not that excited about

Personally don't really care much about any of the other legacy items, including Manastone, which at best would just be a cute toy to play with. Also I don't really care for how they would effect the economy on Blue, because that economy is already thrashed by being a decade old and full of vaults of plat hoarded by neckbeards that have run the server that whole time. If my time on Green nets me any of that additional stuff by happenstance sure, fine, but the only prize, the only reason I'm there day 1 with bells on is the promise that Plush will eventually get to be a dark elf. Nothing else matters

[yyrkoon]

dont know op but he sounds like a nerd IN PANIC cuz his manastone will be worth less

I haven't cringed so hard since bladefrenzy

[Chortles Snort|eS]

Not sure 🤔 why anyone careS about OPs opinion when he’s staying on blue
QQ mUch?

[gnomishfirework]

I honestly am starting to feel like merging isn't necessary (unless its for cost reasons).

I don't believe there will be any lack of competition at high levels. The only issue I could forsee if barren wasteland of lower level areas with multiple servers, cause when new green comes out, thats three. Ok, I just maybe talked myself out of it.

Im glad im not making these decisions.

[zodium]

given recent history, my heartiest lmaos go out to the negative nancies in this thread

dramatically increased drop rates or barbarism

[M.J.]

I got a manastone on the beta before the /list was implemented, I spent 65 hours on Green Live and didn't get one.

Clearly /list is the issue!

With the drop rate being what it is, there is no realistic way for people to get this item solo without being in the top 3. Malo did it somehow and he is a god among men in my mind now because of it.

The /list system is borked if the intent was to get 1 person a chance at loot by maintaining their place on the list, but only by allowing others to play their character. At present the reality of our Manastone camp on Green Live is that you just take your # on the list and multiply by 24 hours. This is no longer a realistic solo camp item as the /list was meant to make possible for people.

The only way that anyone past # 6 on the list has of reaching #1 in 48 hours and of getting the drop is if others fall out.

If its working as intended because those waiting over 24 hours have just had bad runs, then the reality that everyone on the list suffers the bad run of the person in front of them hasn't been factored in or is considered irrelevant. And anytime a stone doesn't drop for over 24 hours, and people account sharing are in front of you, just log out and try again some other day.

Manastone + /list just doesn't work for the majority of people that have tried it solo now that more than 3 people are lined up at all hours, and those that have had relief from friends have made it. Everyone that have had their drops in under 20 hours, are purely fucking lucky. This was not how the camp felt on Beta as people were consistently getting them through the final week, but who knows, maybe this drop rate was implemented the whole time and I was one of the lucky few.

However nothing would make me happier than maintaining the camp as is while making the sharing of accounts for the camp against the rules. I'd be one of the few able to outlast anyone that can't consistently stay awake for 70+ hours.

I just need to find myself some wooden chests to replace my chair and figure out where Cenobites from Hell Raiser buy furniture.