Merging Made Sense Then COVID-19 - Unmerge

[turbosilk]

It's rough trying to find places to group 40+ with my friends. Everything is camped by exp groups or solo level 50s plat/item farming. Nilbog, this isn't the classic experience where hordes of 50s have nothing else to do because everyone is at home.

Seems reasonable to split again until summer is over and it appears COVID-19 is passed and everyone isn't sheltering at home.

[Albanwr]

Lower Guk is far from camped. Sure, the main named camps are camped, but plenty of other places to form camps and exp.

[turbosilk]

When we checked it out the camps for ppl in 40s were all camped. Looking for an open camp to take pre-made groups to was impossible today. We roam to many places on a regular basis but today was a an especailly bad day.

Mabye our timing in each zone was just bad rng.

[cd288]

Already discussed and multiple other threads on the topic. Moved to resolved

[Visual]

Moving back to unresolved. Resume as you were

[El-Hefe]

It really is rough if you have friends and you want to find a camp for 4 to 6 people.

If you’re a loner it is pretty easy to get into a group after visiting a dozen camps and getting on lists.

Personally I think a second server makes a lot of sense in these crazy times.

[Seetherrr]

The bs thing is level 50s camping every named spawn in guk. This isn't how it was in classic. In classic there were exp groups camping level appropriate spawns. When I saw how Lguk was on this server I was pretty disappointed as it had been my favorite place to level on classic but its an abomination on this server. Somehow a single level 50 has as much right to a spawn as 6 people. Even if you were to form a group to camp the old school camps as soon as a bored level 50 came they would be able to take one of your named camps.

[Phaezed-Reality]

shoulda been good at the game and leveled to 50 in the first 3 weeks, avoided the casual scrubs that clog the pipes of EQ.

[turbosilk]

Oh Phaezed you'll need to try harder with uninformed insults.

[Phaezed-Reality]

not an insult, its the reality. im not trolling. With high pop, you needed to blaze through the levels as fast as possible early on. If you didn't you are now stuck in the slog of casual and bad players. it's seriously awful.

[Jimjam]

If you have the pixel thirst, you need to strive hard. The other option is to slum it, enjoy the low levels, waste time and plat on the fulfilment of tradeskills and not lust after wealth or objects of obscene power.

Half arsing the quest for power ends only in disappointment.

[Phaezed-Reality]

Half arsing the quest for power ends only in disappointment.

this is absolutely true, if i cant play 8 hours a day of EQ. I won't play. Because I know im not going to get what i want out of this game. Everquest is a sockers game, anything less is just. You arn't going to get what you want out of it.

[Nirgon]

697 on green atm

looks fine

[cd288]

Less than 1k on right now a couple hours later.

At any rate, what none of these complainers seem to be able to articulate is, if they essentially want instancing or pick zones (and make no mistake, that’s in essence what opening new servers so you don’t have to wait for a camp would be), why they didn’t just go play the TLPs? If that’s so critical for them, why come play P99 at all when you know content is limited pre-Kunark? There are plenty of TLPs that would provide the experience these people are looking for...

[Bigsham]

i disagree, if you play more then 2 hours a day you are playing too much

[Baler]

Sorry you didn’t get legacy’d

*taps manastone hotkey*

[Dolalin]

In classic under PnP no one could hold a camp and simultaneously exclude others. If a level 50 were camping frenzy and a group of 6 showed up, they would make the level 50 and the group of 6 alternate spawns, or /random for the mobs. Point was, if you wanted to camp it you could, they would make the person share with you.

Source: was a guide on Mith Marr in 2000/2001.

[Vizax_Xaziv]

The bs thing is level 50s camping every named spawn in guk. This isn't how it was in classic. In classic there were exp groups camping level appropriate spawns. When I saw how Lguk was on this server I was pretty disappointed as it had been my favorite place to level on classic but its an abomination on this server. Somehow a single level 50 has as much right to a spawn as 6 people. Even if you were to form a group to camp the old school camps as soon as a bored level 50 came they would be able to take one of your named camps.

WOW largely solved these problem. I know the EQ purists absolutely HATE instancing but it was an inevitable end result.

Something like WOW Classic combining instances with open world rare spawns and quest rewards is ultimately the best compromise. Vanguard did this very well also.

[Izmael]

~60 per zone is classic af.

deal with it.

[Jimjam]

Very few Everfrost tundra nor Permafrost zone in groups happening yet. I suggest turning the population slider up even higher.

[Bigsham]

In classic under PnP no one could hold a camp and simultaneously exclude others. If a level 50 were camping frenzy and a group of 6 showed up, they would make the level 50 and the group of 6 alternate spawns, or /random for the mobs. Point was, if you wanted to camp it you could, they would make the person share with you.

Source: was a guide on Mith Marr in 2000/2001.

There were no rules of any kind like this on classic, everything was enforced randomly and no posted rules were anyplace.

[cd288]

There were no rules of any kind like this on classic, everything was enforced randomly and no posted rules were anyplace.

Er that’s definitely not true. Within a few months of launch the PnP was in place. Was part of CSR at the time and I remember it.

[strongNpretty]

this is absolutely true, if i cant play 8 hours a day of EQ. I won't play. Because I know im not going to get what i want out of this game. Everquest is a sockers game, anything less is just. You arn't going to get what you want out of it.

Gross.

[turbosilk]

~60 per zone is classic af.

deal with it.

Yes but they were grouped. 30 of them being 50 and holding exp camps solo is not classic. It's not in the spirit with classic recreation either.

[aaezil]

this is absolutely true, if i cant play 8 hours a day of EQ. I won't play. Because I know im not going to get what i want out of this game. Everquest is a sockers game, anything less is just. You arn't going to get what you want out of it.

Seek help, seek employment, etc etc

[strongNpretty]

Seek help, seek employment, etc etc

For real, what the fuck...….

[cd288]

Yes but they were grouped. 30 of them being 50 and holding exp camps solo is not classic. It's not in the spirit with classic recreation either.

What do you mean? Pre-Kunark in Guk for example the valuable spawns were always perma camped quite often by higher level soloers. Now, I will say that didn’t start happening quite as quickly as it did on Green, but we’re past that period of time and into the part of the timeline where it was definitely happening on many servers on classic. There were constant complaints and petitions about it.

[turbosilk]

What do you mean? Pre-Kunark in Guk for example the valuable spawns were always perma camped quite often by higher level soloers. Now, I will say that didn’t start happening quite as quickly as it did on Green, but we’re past that period of time and into the part of the timeline where it was definitely happening on many servers on classic. There were constant complaints and petitions about it.

Not on my server. And if this was an issue on a server they spun up new servers to reduce the congestion. Spinning up new servers due to congestion is classic AND precedent has already been set in classic and in P99 for spinning up another server to deal with congestion.

[Jordanya]

Coming in here after reading quite a bit. I do agree with both sides.
Side 1 - if you play enough you will eventually get the gear you need (not necessarily the camp)
I have almost 3 level 50s and they are severely under geared as I tend to not buy gear for sake of playing the game. I have been out for the last 3 weekends trying to find that dick Bilge... which isn’t usually camped. So there are those certain camps that are not consta-camped. And if you have the time as a solo player (I think someone mentioned 12 hours a day) you're sure to get in a group for at least an hour of that 12.
Side 2 - Every zone with any gear is camped. and 50s are camping the gear solo.
Yes. that is happening. Why? because 50s cant get into a group when the named is level appropriate because its perma-camped and they suddenly see that they can get in on their own not needing a group. Why not? So the issue built itself.

However, I feel that with everyone now staying home and the world forced to live in a different reality to survive... not being able to get a group with friends or being forced to sit and wait for a group for 11 hours... just to get 1 upgrade you’ve needed for 6 months, doesn’t seem like the spirit of the game is still intact. Sure I have 1 twink that is probably better geared than my 50s because I bought it all. That toon has played a total of 2 hours.

So, I agree with the person that started this post. It’s one thing to have to wait your turn for other dicks like Stormfeather. But hours upon hours of hoping you find a roamer that’s not affiliated with a camp (god forbid) in hopes to get a good spot, could be helped (not rectified, but helped) with unmerging the servers... at least for a short time.
Remember, it’s a game not a job. If people aren’t having fun….

[cd288]

Not on my server. And if this was an issue on a server they spun up new servers to reduce the congestion. Spinning up new servers due to congestion is classic AND precedent has already been set in classic and in P99 for spinning up another server to deal with congestion.

When they spun off new servers pre-Kunark it was when those servers were well over 2k population. So this whole argument is basically moot since we aren’t even close to that.

As for the precedent on P99, Teal was created as a temporary measure to help with having 300+ people in all the newbie zones. Highly doubt they’re going to create another server just because you don’t like having to wait in line for a popular camp so that you can farm some loot or plat. Sounds like the TLPs may be the best choice for you since you essentially want pick zones or instances.

[Bigsham]

bet theres no one in permafrost bear pits but plenty sitting at AM lord and frenzy

[Enme]

Since When Is The Obvious Answer Wrong?

Bring Back Teal /end of discussion

Harms
Blue/Green/Teal

[Bigsham]

not happening

[magnetaress]

just start on aradune, u got 1 more week

[Bigsham]

cringe

[turbosilk]

When they spun off new servers pre-Kunark it was when those servers were well over 2k population. So this whole argument is basically moot since we aren’t even close to that.

As for the precedent on P99, Teal was created as a temporary measure to help with having 300+ people in all the newbie zones. Highly doubt they’re going to create another server just because you don’t like having to wait in line for a popular camp so that you can farm some loot or plat. Sounds like the TLPs may be the best choice for you since you essentially want pick zones or instances.

I don't solo farm and have a group of RL friends and family that group up and play. I won't make false assumptions here and hope that you too have RL friends and family you group with. Otherwise I don't see the point of playing.

[Jordanya]

Just walked through Najena. Not a single mob up. 24 in zone. Just walked through Sol A, I crossed paths with one mob... that was running with no health. I killed it. 30 minutes in zone. 49 players in zone.

This is what i was saying. its not only that there aren't any camps. There aren't any mobs. It's literally not possible to play during normal play hours.

[turbosilk]

Just walked through Najena. Not a single mob up. 24 in zone. Just walked through Sol A, I crossed paths with one mob... that was running with no health. I killed it. 30 minutes in zone. 49 players in zone.

This is what i was saying. its not only that there aren't any camps. There aren't any mobs. It's literally not possible to play during normal play hours.

This...on a Tuesday...

[Albanwr]

I was in lower guk earlier. Plenty of mobs up. Sure, the main named camps are camped, but lots of side areas with mobs to kill.

[cd288]

Just walked through Najena. Not a single mob up. 24 in zone. Just walked through Sol A, I crossed paths with one mob... that was running with no health. I killed it. 30 minutes in zone. 49 players in zone.

This is what i was saying. its not only that there aren't any camps. There aren't any mobs. It's literally not possible to play during normal play hours.

“Impossible to find mobs to kill in major dungeons = need new server because I only want to XP in those places”

[cd288]

I don't solo farm and have a group of RL friends and family that group up and play. I won't make false assumptions here and hope that you too have RL friends and family you group with. Otherwise I don't see the point of playing.

Don’t play then. If it’s so terrible for you, take a break until Kunark. Or switch your static group to the TLPs. Fact of the matter is, EQ pre-Kunark has always been a tough game for a full group to play because unless the server has really low population there will be groups in places and those groups will just be replacing single people as they leave. It’s just a fact of EQ life. IMO it’s a pretty ridiculous argument to demand a new server because you have a full group and don’t like that you can’t just slide into the camp with your full group all at once. Expecting that to be the case in pre-Kunark EQ was and is simply unrealistic on your part.

[turbosilk]

When they spun off new servers pre-Kunark it was when those servers were well over 2k population. So this whole argument is basically moot since we aren’t even close to that.

As for the precedent on P99, Teal was created as a temporary measure to help with having 300+ people in all the newbie zones. Highly doubt they’re going to create another server just because you don’t like having to wait in line for a popular camp so that you can farm some loot or plat. Sounds like the TLPs may be the best choice for you since you essentially want pick zones or instances.

Please post your proof of servers were and had to be over 2k population. I'm interested in seeing that.

Please follow that up with proof that server raids, which were all open server on my server Tunare, had 300 people raiding in Fear and 150 people show up to Vox at 4:30 AM ET.

[cd288]

Please post your proof of servers were and had to be over 2k population. I'm interested in seeing that.

Please follow that up with proof that server raids, which were all open server on my server Tunare, had 300 people raiding in Fear and 150 people show up to Vox at 4:30 AM ET.

Did you not play pre-Kunark? For example, when they split Fennin Ro it was like 2.3k.

At any rate, again, expecting to come to a classic server with a pre-made static group and easily slide into camps is unrealistic on any server except that with very low population. Again, sounds like the TLPs would be what you guys are looking for since you can pick zone or instance. I’m not sure why you would play here if another populated server (the TLPs) has what you need

[turbosilk]

Did you not play pre-Kunark? For example, when they split Fennin Ro it was like 2.3k.

At any rate, again, expecting to come to a classic server with a pre-made static group and easily slide into camps is unrealistic on any server except that with very low population. Again, sounds like the TLPs would be what you guys are looking for since you can pick zone or instance. I’m not sure why you would play here if another populated server (the TLPs) has what you need

Again, you can keep making false assumptions on my play history to make your case. Not sure why you aren't showing proof of your facts that servers were and had to be over 2k population. And the open server raids were over 100 people.

I don't recall the Tunare population but the raids were open server raids. I used to lead the Vox raids which were never more than 9 groups of people. Usually it was 7 to 8 groups and we needed a minimum of 7 to have a good shot at success. We couldn't scrape together that number of people serverwide until primetime so Vox would stay up until the evening CST. Here at 4:30 AM 150 people show up for an open server Vox raid. This would indicate that the server has more than triple a classic experience number of players. 300 people in fear indicates that the server has over 5x a classic experience number of players.

Back then my group of RL friends and family couldn't easily get into any camp. But the zones most certainly weren't singles and duos holding down the premier camps. Froglok king was always a full group. Frenzied was a full group. Lord was a full group. Efreeti was a full group and some. Stone spider was a full group. Singles and duos farming the 45+ content for 12+ hours and passing it to the next single/duo is not classic no matter how much you insist it is.

We're here for the classic experience we remember from Tunare. It was probabably as close as it was going to get before COVID-19 happened and a huge number of people are working from home and going to be working from home the rest of the year. Teal was temporarily stood up because of unclassic #s at the low end. Teal should be stood up again temporarily because of unclassic #s at the top end due to COVID-19.

[charliedoogan]

In my case I am not looking for an experience group. I am only looking for named groups because I need gear not exp. I have not been able to get Gear on the way up because I could only find experience groups. So what now?

I either get up at 4 AM and hope that my level 50 cleric can solo a camp, or buy the gear in EC. Which then... why play. I agree with turbo that level 50s handing off to level 50s is definitely an issue because even though I have been sitting in a camp for 5 to 6 hours waiting for a spot it’s simply not available because “my friend or guildie is coming to replace me”

And I totally agree that an extra server should not be a permanent thing. I just happen to see and I am reaping the detriments of this global pandemic

[cd288]

Again, you can keep making false assumptions on my play history to make your case. Not sure why you aren't showing proof of your facts that servers were and had to be over 2k population. And the open server raids were over 100 people.

I don't recall the Tunare population but the raids were open server raids. I used to lead the Vox raids which were never more than 9 groups of people. Usually it was 7 to 8 groups and we needed a minimum of 7 to have a good shot at success. We couldn't scrape together that number of people serverwide until primetime so Vox would stay up until the evening CST. Here at 4:30 AM 150 people show up for an open server Vox raid. This would indicate that the server has more than triple a classic experience number of players. 300 people in fear indicates that the server has over 5x a classic experience number of players.

Back then my group of RL friends and family couldn't easily get into any camp. But the zones most certainly weren't singles and duos holding down the premier camps. Froglok king was always a full group. Frenzied was a full group. Lord was a full group. Efreeti was a full group and some. Stone spider was a full group. Singles and duos farming the 45+ content for 12+ hours and passing it to the next single/duo is not classic no matter how much you insist it is.

We're here for the classic experience we remember from Tunare. It was probabably as close as it was going to get before COVID-19 happened and a huge number of people are working from home and going to be working from home the rest of the year. Teal was temporarily stood up because of unclassic #s at the low end. Teal should be stood up again temporarily because of unclassic #s at the top end due to COVID-19.

“You have to offer proof from a direct in era source or your claim isn’t relevant, but I’m going to make all these claims without offering proof and they must be taken as fact unless someone can offer proof to refute them.”

I was CSR in era. I can tell you things were packed because the complaints were constant and people were perpetually fighting over camps and spawns.

[cd288]

In my case I am not looking for an experience group. I am only looking for named groups because I need gear not exp. I have not been able to get Gear on the way up because I could only find experience groups. So what now?

I either get up at 4 AM and hope that my level 50 cleric can solo a camp, or buy the gear in EC. Which then... why play. I agree with turbo that level 50s handing off to level 50s is definitely an issue because even though I have been sitting in a camp for 5 to 6 hours waiting for a spot it’s simply not available because “my friend or guildie is coming to replace me”

And I totally agree that an extra server should not be a permanent thing. I just happen to see and I am reaping the detriments of this global pandemic

I mean, EQ has always been a game where you’re more likely to buy the gear than farm or craft it...

[kjs86z]

Blue server is great for a group of static friends!

[Tuljin]

In my case I am not looking for an experience group. I am only looking for named groups because I need gear not exp. I have not been able to get Gear on the way up because I could only find experience groups. So what now?

I either get up at 4 AM and hope that my level 50 cleric can solo a camp, or buy the gear in EC. Which then... why play. I agree with turbo that level 50s handing off to level 50s is definitely an issue because even though I have been sitting in a camp for 5 to 6 hours waiting for a spot it’s simply not available because “my friend or guildie is coming to replace me”

And I totally agree that an extra server should not be a permanent thing. I just happen to see and I am reaping the detriments of this global pandemic

What has happened on Green is that all the people that "went hard" since server launch have amassed piles of plat and continue to bogart the...3? named cash camps on the server 24/7. All the nubs to the server are completely broke and can't afford to buy gear. They join ~~~rAiD~~~ guilds and invest in DKP instead, where they can just sit with 100 people on a ~~~~~rAiD~~~~~ and get planar drops. The server fat cats (and ~~~~~~~rAiD gUiLd~~~~~~~ cabal) continue to sit on their piles of plat and gouge each other on prices of droppable gear, which is what they have been doing since the launch of the server.

A large issue is that nubs don't really understand the "fine steel game" while leveling - going to find mobs that drop items that vendor for a good bit of plat. There is no other way to generate plat while leveling. Even still, you can sell a ton of fine steel while leveling and you won't have enough money to spend 15k+ between 3 pieces of black sapphire jewelry after you've gotten all the other gear you need.

If you want to upgrade? Specifically for a Cleric? Go to Kedge and kill some stuff with a buddy. You can get an Abalone Gorget and you can also get a Prayer Shawl. The Kedge drops are very difficult to get however, and they do not sell. People have been trying to sell the rare Kedge caster/priest drops for insane amounts of plat because the mobs can't necessarily be soloed and they require a lot of time investment. Still, you never get the "payout" that comes with the "efficient" 24/7 cash camps that continue to churn out droppables yet the prices continue to plummet (Efreeti, Guk King, Guk Lord, and Guk Frenzy). Can be soloed and has items for melees that always sell.

Also, Kedge comes with a massive caveat - - you have to be "good" at EQ to kill the mobs. There's a reason why Kedge isn't farmed 24/7. I quit the Kedge farm game a while back because there is simply no "payout." There certainly wasn't when i was doing it several months ago. Maybe the same people who had piles of plat then and have even bigger piles of plat now are paying 30k for Squallsurge and Prayer Shawls, but I highly doubt it. The Wiki price logs are completely fucked. New players certainly don't have that kind of plat for a minimal upgrade. They never will.

Really to answer your question of what to do at 50? Honestly? And not to be an asshole? Roll an alt. Also, you need to realize that gear isn't important. You don't need to go buy a Pearl Kedge Totem. You don't need Black Sapphire ears. Go get a Skull Shaped Barbute, its really good and really cheap now.

The issue is is that the min/maxers and perennial server assholes have anything "valuable" on this server 24/7 rotated camped, including green mobs that drop anything halfway decent. There's a reason clickies were nerfed. There's a reason the highest value droppable item only sells for 10k now. There's a reason that Mithril 2handers went from 30k when they were first dropping (Nub Team price gouging their own guildies) to 7500 today, barely.

If Teal is relaunched it will just be the same shit, different server. And it will be the same people that are on Green doing the same camps and they will be two-boxing. Levels and toons are far more valuable than gear. When Kunark comes, and it will be a complete and absolute shitshow, things will open up a bit as far as gear availability is concerned. Between getting levels, getting keys, getting the necessary droppable upgrades, still attempting to bogart every single pop, not having Chardok AOE to crank alts to 60, and squabbling with other people the ~~~~~~~~~~~rAiDeRs~~~~~~~~~~~ have their work cut out for them.

[Rick Sanchez]

This is what made the original project 1999 release the closest thing there was to reliving the EQ experience. The population probably had something to do with it as hovered around the 500 mark, with initially having trouble breaking 200. It wasn’t 100% classic per say(getting full mana and health when you leveled etc) but the community was classic, everyone helped everyone, wasn’t toxic and the boards we’re memorable instead of filled with stay at home son’s that play this game like it’s there real life career. Some may argue that old servers back on live had thousands of people, yes that may be true but the entire population didn’t know what the fuck they we’re doing. This population knows everything there is to know about classic. Having another server was a good thing, I’d rather have two healthy servers then one toxic sewer. If for some reason (which highly unlikely, looks at red server still running) it’s a money issue I’m sure people wouldn’t mind donating to give themselves a much more authentic classic experience. Those two servers would fill out nicely, moving forward I don’t think population would ever be an issue. In the long term you wouldn’t have all the petitions about insignificant things and it would honestly lighten the load of the staff.

[charliedoogan]

Tulgin, While I agree with most of your thoughts... I have 1 level 50 and 2 level 49s. So the alt path has been taken. I have over 30k in the bank because I do understand the fortune of the fine steel. I make about 2k a day without thinking.

What I’m trying to say is that I want to play. I’m not a fan of sitting EC waiting for someone to have the piece I want or getting in 75+ person guild raid where my only relevance is to roll a high number or bid DKP more than someone else.

So yes I agree with your kedge sample, but when I have everything I want from there (which now I do)....

Again, I get the wait. I get the camped camps. I get that this will always be. It just seems in the last month that once every blue moon open camps have turned into perma-camps.

I still think that opening a new server would help with this over abundance of people playing for the interim. just for the interim.

And someone else said it... when Kunark comes out.... sure. So merge back the servers when that happens. Or when this virus BS is over.

[Tuljin]

. What I’m trying to say is that I want to play. I’m not a fan of sitting EC waiting for someone to have the piece I want or getting in 75+ person guild raid where my only relevance is to roll a high number or bid DKP more than someone else.



Well my dude you hit the nail on the head and it's a much bigger problem than simply opening another server - the culture of P99 has shifted so much since launch that nobody wants to "just play."

People came from WoW to this game now years ago and their only understanding of Everquest is what you have very accurately and succinctly pointed out as ~~~~~rAiDiNg~~~~~. They just get in line and bid DKP with no second thought. That is "playing" to them.

To a lot of old school EQ players who are excellent players and have encyclopedic knowledge yet don't have the same time they used to and/or don't give a shit about poopsocking dragons for DKP this is -not- their idea of "playing."

So idk, it's a tough situation really. Splitting and merging again won't happen and it would create a ton more toons for the ~~~~~rAiDeRs~~~~~ to have for their ~~~~~~~cOmPeTiTiOn~~~~~~~

I want to "just play" too and I do my best to do so. Which is why I have a pulse on how broke the "hoi polloi" is as well as the painfully evident shift in server culture. It's a tough spot man, the problem won't be "solved" because the average player on this server is fundamentally different not only than in 1999 but also in 2009.

[Castle2.0]

There's a thread where you can vote to reopean Teal. Currently 470 YES votes.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=353144

[cd288]

As Tuljin said on page 5, relaunching Teal will just be the same shit on a different server. If you’re trying to farm, those things will be perma camped on both servers. That issue is not going to go away. The people will multiple high level characters will simply transfer one of their characters to Teal and leave another high level on Green and farm both camps simultaneously on two computers. This is a bit of a unique issue in modern day since back in 1999 people didn’t commonly have multiple computers with VPNs and multiple paid accounts; so it wasn’t an issue you had to worry about when splitting servers. Today, a server split won’t solve the valuable camps being perma-camped.

If it’s XP you’re looking for, there are plenty of XP spots. I haven’t had an issue XPing on Green since COVID. But if you’re trying to level in popular dungeons because you want a ZEM etc. then yes it’s going to be crowded and you might have to wait to get a spot in a group; that’s just a fact of life (if you’re a caster, bind there and then go solo some random stuff somewhere else and Gate back when your spot opens up).

What people really should be asking for instead of another server is for Kunark launch to be moved up to sometime in the summer instead of the fall.

[Lampolo]

I understand why poeple would want a new server. I dont understand why people would not want them to have a new server. Cd288 you and people like you are ill. Why are you so bent on pixel blocking others? A new server would mean a lot to some people. I dont see how it matters to someone who does not care for one. It maybe Narcissism. Do you feel threatened by others pixels?

[galach]

One of the reasons the server was merged was due to the amount of petitions and lack of CSR support to handle the workload. The number of petitions was reduced when the merge was done, but it has doubled over the last two months with this situation.

I understand some of you guys want a less populated temporary server, but I don't see it happening because I doubt we will be in lockdown for another couple months.

[cd288]

I understand why poeple would want a new server. I dont understand why people would not want them to have a new server. Cd288 you and people like you are ill. Why are you so bent on pixel blocking others? A new server would mean a lot to some people. I dont see how it matters to someone who does not care for one. It maybe Narcissism. Do you feel threatened by others pixels?

Has nothing to do with this term pixel blocking. If I was someone who liked to monopolize valuable camps, I would be all for the server split because then I could farm those camps on two servers at once (similar to OP’s reasons for wanting a second server). So your argument/implications simply don’t make sense.

We come to P99 because it’s classic with no instances or pick zones or any of that nonsense. We start creating more servers (with a population below what classic servers usually had I might add) because people don’t like having to wait in line and just want to do whatever they want the second they log in, then we are creating what is in essence a pick zone or an instance. I don’t think that is a path we should start down and creates a bad precedent. There are plenty of times where I haven’t been able to do things in game or have to wait in a line...would it be nice to be able to do whatever I want whenever I want? On its face, sure...but then this wouldn’t be classic EQ and we’d be going down a path of being more like the TLPs for which the negatives outweigh the benefits. It also annoys me that people come here and demand the server cater to them by creating a new server when there are available options, such as the TLPs, for them to achieve what they want. Why don’t you just go play the TLPs if P99 is too crowded and you essentially want pick zone or instances so you can do whatever you want? They are there, they exist. Why come to P99 and demand it change for you when you have an available alternative? It's like if I ran a pizza shop and you wanted a cheeseburger, would you come into my pizza shop and demand I make you a cheeseburger? No, you'd go to the burger joint down the street. Go play the TLPs if pickzones and instances are what you need to enjoy the game.

[aaezil]

Sorry you aren’t getting scrawny gnolls

[turbosilk]

One of the reasons the server was merged was due to the amount of petitions and lack of CSR support to handle the workload. The number of petitions was reduced when the merge was done, but it has doubled over the last two months with this situation.

I understand some of you guys want a less populated temporary server, but I don't see it happening because I doubt we will be in lockdown for another couple months.

Not less populated. More of a classic experience. The classic experience was good post merge and pre-COVID19.

I laud your optimism but a heightened number of people are going to be working from home well beyond 2 months. One of my friends company sent out policy that the majority of the workforce isn't allowedback to work and is teleworking until Dec 31.

[Bigsham]

Tulgin, While I agree with most of your thoughts... I have 1 level 50 and 2 level 49s. So the alt path has been taken. I have over 30k in the bank because I do understand the fortune of the fine steel. I make about 2k a day without thinking.

What I’m trying to say is that I want to play. I’m not a fan of sitting EC waiting for someone to have the piece I want or getting in 75+ person guild raid where my only relevance is to roll a high number or bid DKP more than someone else.

So yes I agree with your kedge sample, but when I have everything I want from there (which now I do)....

Again, I get the wait. I get the camped camps. I get that this will always be. It just seems in the last month that once every blue moon open camps have turned into perma-camps.

I still think that opening a new server would help with this over abundance of people playing for the interim. just for the interim.

And someone else said it... when Kunark comes out.... sure. So merge back the servers when that happens. Or when this virus BS is over.

I bet this kid has NOTHING in the bank LOL

[turbosilk]

Has nothing to do with this term pixel blocking. If I was someone who liked to monopolize valuable camps, I would be all for the server split because then I could farm those camps on two servers at once (similar to OP’s reasons for wanting a second server). So your argument/implications simply don’t make sense.

We come to P99 because it’s classic with no instances or pick zones or any of that nonsense. We start creating more servers (with a population below what classic servers usually had I might add) because people don’t like having to wait in line and just want to do whatever they want the second they log in, then we are creating what is in essence a pick zone or an instance. I don’t think that is a path we should start down and creates a bad precedent. There are plenty of times where I haven’t been able to do things in game or have to wait in a line...would it be nice to be able to do whatever I want whenever I want? On its face, sure...but then this wouldn’t be classic EQ and we’d be going down a path of being more like the TLPs for which the negatives outweigh the benefits. It also annoys me that people come here and demand the server cater to them by creating a new server when there are available options, such as the TLPs, for them to achieve what they want. Why don’t you just go play the TLPs if P99 is too crowded and you essentially want pick zone or instances so you can do whatever you want? They are there, they exist. Why come to P99 and demand it change for you when you have an available alternative? It's like if I ran a pizza shop and you wanted a cheeseburger, would you come into my pizza shop and demand I make you a cheeseburger? No, you'd go to the burger joint down the street. Go play the TLPs if pickzones and instances are what you need to enjoy the game.

I don't get your venom or agenda or your logic. My stance allows for a more classic experience. Nilbog is recreating the classic experience not the letter of the law.

I hope you understand why the TLP servers aren't a good option. I can explain if you need. MS, rubi, jboots camps are gone. It's all about the experience now and less about the pixels. 300 people in hate, 150 ppl at vox very early AM, I can go on., has drifted from the classic experience.

Tell me about your classic experience playing with friends and family you're recreating here. If you are a solo player that doesn't play with friends and family I recommend retail WoW or TLP.

[charliedoogan]

I bet this kid has NOTHING in the bank LOL


Let me know what you want to wager and when you’re ready I’ll gladly take that money from you.

[charliedoogan]

I understand why poeple would want a new server. I dont understand why people would not want them to have a new server. Cd288 you and people like you are ill. Why are you so bent on pixel blocking others? A new server would mean a lot to some people. I dont see how it matters to someone who does not care for one. It maybe Narcissism. Do you feel threatened by others pixels?

Exactly. The only people it may hurt would be the GMs having to “monitor” another server.

My guess (with no evidence) is that petitions would go down as well.

[cd288]

Exactly. The only people it may hurt would be the GMs having to “monitor” another server.

My guess (with no evidence) is that petitions would go down as well.

Did you not read Galach’s post?

[cd288]

I don't get your venom or agenda or your logic. My stance allows for a more classic experience. Nilbog is recreating the classic experience not the letter of the law.

I hope you understand why the TLP servers aren't a good option. I can explain if you need. MS, rubi, jboots camps are gone. It's all about the experience now and less about the pixels. 300 people in hate, 150 ppl at vox very early AM, I can go on., has drifted from the classic experience.

Tell me about your classic experience playing with friends and family you're recreating here. If you are a solo player that doesn't play with friends and family I recommend retail WoW or TLP.

I love when people throw the “classic experience” thing out there because it means they don’t actually have anything to back up their argument. You said you showed up on the server with a full group of people and because you can’t take a full group to camping spots that another server is needed. I think you had unrealistic expectations because it’s always been hard to slot a full group into a camp. I’m guessing you guys also don’t really go off the beaten path and have mostly been focusing on high ZEM zones/dungeons. I’ve leveled multiple chars on Green and have not had an issue getting XP, especially if you’re willing to level out in random zones/areas of the world instead of only the popular places...

At any rate, Galach just said he doesn’t see a second server happening. So I think we can move this to resolved as you got your answer

[charliedoogan]

Did you not read Galach’s post?

Yes. Did you?

“The amount of petitions has doubled in the last 2 months”

[charliedoogan]

At any rate, Galach just said he doesn’t see a second server happening. So I think we can move this to resolved as you got your answer

No offense to Galesh, but I don’t think it’s up to him. So this isn’t resolved. Also, you’re still missing... a single character can’t get a group either without sitting there for hours. Many hours.

In hopes that they don’t get replaced with a friend or a Guildie.

[TheSurgeon]

Knowing the majority of the P99 playerbase, I doubt any Corona Stay At Home orders have changed their lives at all.

There was a beard on that neck preCorona. Check

UberEats and DoorDash were the most used apps preCorona. Check

The sun and outside was a distant friend preCorona. Check

The W-2s looked the exact same. Only source of income was RMT. Check

Diabetes. Check

Ghoulish skin. Check

50% chance of being either an Incel or a Cuck. Check


Everything would have happened regardless of Corona. A documentary could be made about Corona 10 years from now and they would ask how everyone's lives changed. EQ people... Not at all.

[Tuljin]

Knowing the majority of the P99 playerbase, I doubt any Corona Stay At Home orders have changed their lives at all.

There was a beard on that neck preCorona. Check

UberEats and DoorDash were the most used apps preCorona. Check

The sun and outside was a distant friend preCorona. Check

The W-2s looked the exact same. Only source of income was RMT. Check

Diabetes. Check

Ghoulish skin. Check

50% chance of being either an Incel or a Cuck. Check


Everything would have happened regardless of Corona. A documentary could be made about Corona 10 years from now and they would ask how everyone's lives changed. EQ people... Not at all.

Rofllllllllllllllll

[cd288]

No offense to Galesh, but I don’t think it’s up to him. So this isn’t resolved. Also, you’re still missing... a single character can’t get a group either without sitting there for hours. Many hours.

In hopes that they don’t get replaced with a friend or a Guildie.

So in your post before this one you conveniently ignore his comment that the reason they don't have two servers is they don't have a sufficient amount of staff to manage both.

Also, you're right I'm suuuuure the head GM of the server has no say in whether they split the servers or not. In reality, I think that would probably be the primary person Nilbog and Rogean would consult with since they don't want their volunteer GM to be overwhelmed by having two servers to have to monitor. We've already seen what the Teal/Green split did to the economy BEFORE there were as many higher level characters as we have now...can you imagine what would happen allowing all those high level people to farm items and plat on more than one character and more than one server simultaneously and then have them re-merge? I also am always surprised by how many people are so against boxing, but seem totally fine with the idea that we would have two servers where people would be leveling two characters at once at the same time.

As for your waiting in line for a group, the only places where I've experienced that are the most popular dungeons/high ZEM zones. Maybe you should try going off the beaten path. Or maybe classic pre-Kunark just isn't for you (I'm guessing you didn't play pre-Kunark back on live or you would remember that content is limited in this era), or maybe classic EQ isn't for you in general and something with pick zones would be more your speed to ensure that you can start doing whatever you want right when you log in.

[Bigsham]

Knowing the majority of the P99 playerbase, I doubt any Corona Stay At Home orders have changed their lives at all.

There was a beard on that neck preCorona. Check

UberEats and DoorDash were the most used apps preCorona. Check

The sun and outside was a distant friend preCorona. Check

The W-2s looked the exact same. Only source of income was RMT. Check

Diabetes. Check

Ghoulish skin. Check

50% chance of being either an Incel or a Cuck. Check


Everything would have happened regardless of Corona. A documentary could be made about Corona 10 years from now and they would ask how everyone's lives changed. EQ people... Not at all.

I like this kid, but you forgot hormone pills !

PS Charlie is dirt poor

[turbosilk]

I love when people throw the “classic experience” thing out there because it means they don’t actually have anything to back up their argument. You said you showed up on the server with a full group of people and because you can’t take a full group to camping spots that another server is needed. I think you had unrealistic expectations because it’s always been hard to slot a full group into a camp. I’m guessing you guys also don’t really go off the beaten path and have mostly been focusing on high ZEM zones/dungeons. I’ve leveled multiple chars on Green and have not had an issue getting XP, especially if you’re willing to level out in random zones/areas of the world instead of only the popular places...

At any rate, Galach just said he doesn’t see a second server happening. So I think we can move this to resolved as you got your answer

The only thing that is clear is you continue to twist my words to fit your agenda. You appear to make as many false assumption as Bigsham and troll as much as him, you're just more articulate than him.

I did not state the classic experience was being able to roll into any camp we wanted. That is you projecting. We would have to move around but we would have decent success moving around and finding desirable camps for upgrades about 50% of the time for a group of 50s. That isn't the case now due to COVID-19 work from home crowding.

You're projecting again stating we don't go off the beaten path and focus on high ZEM zones/dungeons. I'm well known for taking our group everywhere to experience the game and having strangers join us for making new friends but the available places are limited at 50.

How do you play again to bring back the classic experience?

PS Galach seems like a great guy but he's not the decision maker just as I'm not the decision maker. Sorry not resolved. Troll on.

[turbosilk]

So in your post before this one you conveniently ignore his comment that the reason they don't have two servers is they don't have a sufficient amount of staff to manage both.

Also, you're right I'm suuuuure the head GM of the server has no say in whether they split the servers or not. In reality, I think that would probably be the primary person Nilbog and Rogean would consult with since they don't want their volunteer GM to be overwhelmed by having two servers to have to monitor. We've already seen what the Teal/Green split did to the economy BEFORE there were as many higher level characters as we have now...can you imagine what would happen allowing all those high level people to farm items and plat on more than one character and more than one server simultaneously and then have them re-merge? I also am always surprised by how many people are so against boxing, but seem totally fine with the idea that we would have two servers where people would be leveling two characters at once at the same time.

As for your waiting in line for a group, the only places where I've experienced that are the most popular dungeons/high ZEM zones. Maybe you should try going off the beaten path. Or maybe classic pre-Kunark just isn't for you (I'm guessing you didn't play pre-Kunark back on live or you would remember that content is limited in this era), or maybe classic EQ isn't for you in general and something with pick zones would be more your speed to ensure that you can start doing whatever you want right when you log in.

Don't allow boxing characters on Green and Teal2.0. Problem solved.

Remove MS, Rubicite, JBoots drama camps. Problem solved.

Remove need for 300 people to raid fear and 150 people raiding Vox at 4:30 AM. Problem solved.

[cd288]

Don't allow boxing characters on Green and Teal2.0. Problem solved.

Remove MS, Rubicite, JBoots drama camps. Problem solved.

Remove need for 300 people to raid fear and 150 people raiding Vox at 4:30 AM. Problem solved.

I believe the staff previously stated during the time Teal was around that it’s not easily feasible to prevent people playing on both. So now you’re demanding they pay for a new server for you to play on for free, and also take on the burden of trying to prevent people from playing on both simultaneously. Got it.

[turbosilk]

You and your projection that I play for free and the rest of your projections surprise me. Please tell me why you aren't supporting P99?

[cd288]

You and your projection that I play for free and the rest of your projections surprise me. Please tell me why you aren't supporting P99?

Tells me I’m projecting and then projects/assumes something about me. Dude your comments are getting amazing

[Lampolo]

You sound clever to your self but your arguements are aloof. You are projecting maximum. Putting groups together and xping where you need stuff is classic. Grinding shit zem and no loot spots when you know better is not classic. Comparing server pops as a measure of classic experience is not logical. Numbers can be misleading

[charliedoogan]

You sound clever to your self but your arguements are aloof. You are projecting maximum. Putting groups together and xping where you need stuff is classic. Grinding shit zem and no loot spots when you know better is not classic. Comparing server pops as a measure of classic experience is not logical. Numbers can be misleading

And nay sayers always say nay.

[charliedoogan]

Why is this still a discussion? The majority of posters in this thread after that bringing teal would enhance their experience. The poll to bring back teal is overwhelmingly in favor.

Thankfully this isn’t the Olsen days or game of thrones where 2 people decide the fate of the world. The masses have spoken.

Now it’s up to the GMs to decide to do it or not.

[cd288]

You sound clever to your self but your arguements are aloof. You are projecting maximum. Putting groups together and xping where you need stuff is classic. Grinding shit zem and no loot spots when you know better is not classic. Comparing server pops as a measure of classic experience is not logical. Numbers can be misleading

Ah so the real issue comes out. It’s not that everywhere is too crowded, it’s that you don’t want to play in a place unless it’s going to be min maxing your XP and providing you with good loot. Sounds like a real good reason for them to open another server /eyeroll

[cd288]

Why is this still a discussion? The majority of posters in this thread after that bringing teal would enhance their experience. The poll to bring back teal is overwhelmingly in favor.

Thankfully this isn’t the Olsen days or game of thrones where 2 people decide the fate of the world. The masses have spoken.

Now it’s up to the GMs to decide to do it or not.

Except you just said in another comment that the GM’s view (Galach) doesn’t matter...

[charliedoogan]

True. I don’t think it is solely up to him. And as I said before it may not be at all.

My guess is that it is up to Rogean.

So.... done posting except maybe to bump.

[kjs86z]

consider blue

[ravinz]

The famers just want to be able to lock down camps on two servers again.

[drackgon]

Just don't allow duel boxing.

[turbosilk]

Just don't allow duel boxing.

Yes.

And for me the core issue is my wife, a friend and another friends son are boycotting me continuing to take our group to kedge for level 50 group content.

That's not the classic experience my wife remembers or wants and the friends son hates watery deaths I guess because he's under 20.

My half elf warrior wife likes shinies and remembers camping the frenzied, king and efreeti with full groups and she would like that classic experience again. Farming plat and buying it in EC isn't enjoyable. If you're not playing the game as intended and in groups and with friends and family slaying monsters and getting upgrades from them then what are you doing?

[turbosilk]

Ah so the real issue comes out. It’s not that everywhere is too crowded, it’s that you don’t want to play in a place unless it’s going to be min maxing your XP and providing you with good loot. Sounds like a real good reason for them to open another server /eyeroll

That's not what he said.

[drackgon]

"My half elf warrior wife likes shinies and remembers camping the frenzied, king and efreeti with full groups and she would like that classic experience again. Farming plat and buying it in EC isn't enjoyable. If you're not playing the game as intended and in groups and with friends and family slaying monsters and getting upgrades from them then what are you doing?" Agreed this game is bout community and going on adventures with your friends. Tubosilk people like cd288 are just red dead players who are now stuck forum questing. Just dont reply to em its a waste of time.

[turbosilk]

"My half elf warrior wife likes shinies and remembers camping the frenzied, king and efreeti with full groups and she would like that classic experience again. Farming plat and buying it in EC isn't enjoyable. If you're not playing the game as intended and in groups and with friends and family slaying monsters and getting upgrades from them then what are you doing?" Agreed this game is bout community and going on adventures with your friends. Tubosilk people like cd288 are just red dead players who are now stuck forum questing. Just dont reply to em its a waste of time.

Good point on trolls. Added him to ignore with bigsham

[cd288]

Just don't allow duel boxing.

Ideally this is what you would do, but I believe when everyone was complaining about this happening back when Teal existed the staff said it's not really easily feasible to do.

I mean think about it, even if there was some easy way to try and initially block people from doing that, how do you prevent workarounds? People will just VPN into one of the servers.

Monitoring it in person and applying a boxing test to the player would be a pretty difficult mechanism to have be effective as well. When you don't have someone playing two characters at once in the same place at the same time, how would you confirm they're boxing? I.e. when you watch someone boxing now, what you look out for is potential flags in terms of what the two characters are doing together (e.g., auto-following, only one character moving at a time, etc.). When you don't have the second character for reference, it would be very difficult to confirm if that person is playing another character on another server. You wouldn't even be able to apply the current boxing test to that person because you'd have to be able to ID their character on the other server first, which would be virtually impossible to do if people were using VPNs, different computers, etc.

Saying don't allow boxing is all well and good (and I would certainly love it if that was a rule if they had two servers), but in reality it's not really easy to prevent it.

[magnetaress]

I am pretty sure millenial kids under the age of 40 don't respect boxing rules or personal boundaries and like to overshare so, good luck with that.

[cd288]

Yes.

And for me the core issue is my wife, a friend and another friends son are boycotting me continuing to take our group to kedge for level 50 group content.

That's not the classic experience my wife remembers or wants and the friends son hates watery deaths I guess because he's under 20.

My half elf warrior wife likes shinies and remembers camping the frenzied, king and efreeti with full groups and she would like that classic experience again. Farming plat and buying it in EC isn't enjoyable. If you're not playing the game as intended and in groups and with friends and family slaying monsters and getting upgrades from them then what are you doing?

So, again, the issue is that you want to be able to take your full group and camp a spot. That's not really realistic in classic EQ, or at least it's not a realistic expectation for those super popular camps you mention. You have to be willing to wait your turn.

I'd also add that if you think splitting the server will suddenly allow you to take a full group to the camps you named and expect it to be empty, you are in for a seriously rude awakening. Those camps will always have groups (or a soloer) at them due to their value, and you'll need to be prepared to surrender your static group in order to play at those camps because people will need to wait on the list to join. I played on both Green and Teal and once people got to sufficient level I saw those spots perma-camped on both servers...two servers will not suddenly cause very popular camps to be vacated. This is, yet again, why I suggested that a group of several people all wanting to play together and camp the very popular spots may be better suited for the TLPs where there are pick zones and instances.

[drackgon]

Will say when the split happen.. omg yes camps were open. My first day on teal I went from spending hours finding a group on my SK, to it took me 20 mins / Lfg tag on 2 find a group. Second day On teal, I met Lineage-_-, but still group in less then 30 mins. 3rd day I was in kingdom, and had camps/groups leveling fun with friends nonstop until remerge.

Now I log on try and level some alt in sro(20 others in zone plus a few lvl 50s farming DF belts), I move to Oasis(60+ in zone), move to WC, 50s farming Orcs, Devs camped. move to HHP(1 person farming idol at orcs), the 1 group in zone at gnolls full.. Wow, I just had tons of fun. Time to start running to EK.

[cd288]

Will say when the split happen.. omg yes camps were open. My first day on teal I went from spending hours finding a group on my SK, to it took me 20 mins / Lfg tag on 2 find a group. Second day On teal, I met Lineage-_-, but still group in less then 30 mins. 3rd day I was in kingdom, and had camps/groups leveling fun with friends nonstop until remerge.

Now I log on try and level some alt in sro(20 others in zone plus a few lvl 50s farming DF belts), I move to Oasis(60+ in zone), move to WC, 50s farming Orcs, Devs camped. move to HHP(1 person farming idol at orcs), the 1 group in zone at gnolls full.. Wow, I just had tons of fun. Time to start running to EK.

As far as the orcs go, often if you ask the person farming if you can kill the mobs for EXP they will usually agree. So both parties win.

[drackgon]

Duel boxing servers. As in on my same account I can play on green, and blue(lol red...)
Is annoying if bc they allowed it on green/teal

[Nirgon]

Good thing this sham of an economy closure is almost over then. /thread

[Sabin76]

As far as the orcs go, often if you ask the person farming if you can kill the mobs for EXP they will usually agree. So both parties win.

Been my experience as well. If they are just farming faction, they just need to get one hit on em and you do the rest... will probably even let you loot everything because what the hell do they need < 1pp vendor trash for?

[drackgon]

Df belts to pl their alts.

[Sabin76]

Df belts to pl their alts.

Wouldn't a level 50 have a much easier time just getting a couple hundred plat and buying them than sitting at the camp long enough to get those belts one by one?

[DMN]

Wouldn't a level 50 have a much easier time just getting a couple hundred plat and buying them than sitting at the camp long enough to get those belts one by one?

Unfortunately the supply isn't unlimited. You have to wait for someone to sell them to you. additionally, it really depends on the class, both for determining how easy it is to farm them on your own versus farming plat to buy them.

[Sabin76]

Unfortunately the supply isn't unlimited.

Seemed like it when I was trying to sell them, lol. But your point is taken.

[turbosilk]

Checked out paw as I was looking around for some places to exp. Was there about 10 min and had to bail because there are so many people there mobs aren't up anywhere. People ks'ing mobs off of each other and screaming at each other constantly in OOC.

2nd server not needed due to the server being top heavy with levels, increased population due to COVID-19, not enough high level zones to support the top heavy population. Move along nothing to see here.

[Fammaden]

Paw has become an xp highway hot zone since the ZEM changes were announced and its design doesn't lend itself well to crowding. There are nice camps but a competent six man group can quickly run short of mobs at any of them. This is a cherry-picking argument, I promise you Paw right now would be overcrowded on Teal as well.

[turbosilk]

It was overcrowded before this is another level. You can't compare people ks'ing mobs off of each other. And it's not even one of the top 2 ZEM zones.

[cd288]

Paw has become an xp highway hot zone since the ZEM changes were announced and its design doesn't lend itself well to crowding. There are nice camps but a competent six man group can quickly run short of mobs at any of them. This is a cherry-picking argument, I promise you Paw right now would be overcrowded on Teal as well.

Yeah for sure. All of turbos examples have centered around either high ZEM zones or very popular camps (or both). And somehow he thinks splitting the server is going to mean he can roll into frenzy or efreeti or high ZEM zones with a static group and have free claim to those camps. Always seems to be the way with a lot of these people that the “server is too crowded” when they can’t immediately claim an extremely popular/lucrative camp or immediately find an open camp in a high ZEM zone...

[Fammaden]

All of turbos examples have centered around either high ZEM zones or very popular camps (or both). And somehow he thinks splitting the server is going to mean he can roll into frenzy or efreeti or high ZEM zones with a static group and have free claim to those camps. Always seems to be the way with a lot of these people that the “server is too crowded” when they can’t immediately claim an extremely popular/lucrative camp or immediately find an open camp in a high ZEM zone...

Half the time I see him referencing "300 people in fear and 150 killing Vox at 4AM pop time" or something, which makes me think he's in Kingdom or Seal Team and just wants uncontested raid targets back.

[cd288]

Half the time I see him referencing "300 people in fear and 150 killing Vox at 4AM pop time" or something, which makes me think he's in Kingdom or Seal Team and just wants uncontested raid targets back.

Lol yeah that’s another good example. Based on all of his arguments, I really don’t understand why he doesn’t go play the TLPs. He really seems like he needs instances or pick zones

[turbosilk]

Ok we're in the always high ZEM zone LGUK. Why lguk? Because we're ZEM whores. looking for content for our upper 40's and 50 group. Frenzied being solo'd, AM being solo'd, lord camped. Good news king not called.

We all run to king, oh wait. 50 ench soloing king but not responding. Guess we'll go check out Efreeti next.

[turbosilk]

We only have 5 tonight so room for one more in our group. We've done a lot of grouping for exp in the high zem zones lguk and solb cuz my wife playing her half elf warrior is a serious min/maxxer.

[turbosilk]

49 people in solb. Everything camped.

If I was a solo player I'd have it made. Because I'd play a game like retail WoW designed for antisocial solo'ers instead of a game meant to force people to group and socialize and have fun with their friends.

Do I mention the last level 50 zone available, Kedge, to my wife yet again and piss her off because that's where I always end up making us go because there is nothing else? She loathes that zone.

[turbosilk]

Only 13 people in Kedge. This is the top ZEM zone in EQ for level 40+ groups why isn't it brim full of peeps? We're here because that's how us min/maxxers roll. Dunno why we didn't start here.

2 friends conveniently found chores to do at home for a while once we had to decide on Kedge. Maybe I can talk them back into group later.

Dangeres, Kanthela and Menderz have room for more in Kedge. Min/maxxers only obviously because that's what we are.

[cd288]

Idk about the rest of you guys and girls, but I think this guy Turbo might have some unresolved issues

[jackd104]

The merge was shit. I stopped playing after that and haven’t come back. Although life is better now, so I guess thank you for the shitty merge.

[ravinz]

Welcome to the Twilight Zone, where people dream of things that will never come...

[billwilliams]

Why does this "play nice policy" allow things like 1 single level 50 to hold down mobs/camps meant for 6 person groups? Or even a duo of high level 40s/50s? How stupid is that? If the rules had any sense or logic to them the GMs/Guides would have probably 50% less interactions with anyone and you wouldn't need to unmerge if camps were being held by actual groups and not 90% 1-2 people at most. Duh duh duh duh should be obvious, especially to 20 year+ vets running this whole thing, but NAH lets instead dedicate n most our time enforcing made-up libtard speech rules and make sure no one is cursing or talking about politics or doesn't have the name Cornhole Butthole than actual solutions to what players have been bitching about on this server since day 1 opening.

[turbosilk]

Why does this "play nice policy" allow things like 1 single level 50 to hold down mobs/camps meant for 6 person groups? Or even a duo of high level 40s/50s? How stupid is that? If the rules had any sense or logic to them the GMs/Guides would have probably 50% less interactions with anyone and you wouldn't need to unmerge if camps were being held by actual groups and not 90% 1-2 people at most. Duh duh duh duh should be obvious, especially to 20 year+ vets running this whole thing, but NAH lets instead dedicate n most our time enforcing made-up libtard speech rules and make sure no one is cursing or talking about politics or doesn't have the name Cornhole Butthole than actual solutions to what players have been bitching about on this server since day 1 opening.

That's what im talking about with the classic grouping experience. Some rules should be changed because they originated in blue and don't work in the spirit of greens classic experience.

I propose that in dungeons no one is allowed to solo camp a camp. Whoever is there has to invite people wanting in the camp until the group is full.

[Fammaden]

That's what im talking about with the classic grouping experience. Some rules should be changed because they originated in blue and don't work in the spirit of greens classic experience.

I propose that in dungeons no one is allowed to solo camp a camp. Whoever is there has to invite people wanting in the camp until the group is full.

Great solution, force people to invite randoms no matter what. That'll surely "fix" the server...

[astuce999]

I think the biggest issue with this discussion, and with a lot of discussions today in general whenever the topic is about making things “better” for a group of people (in this case players in a 20 year old elf-sim game) is the amalgamation of two contradictory concepts when it comes to equality.

There is equality in opportunity:

I want a shot at getting pixels.

There is equality in outcomes:

I am entitled to pixels.

Let’s use a familiar model to illustrate how this quickly becomes an impossible debate. Equality in opportunity is Apples, equality in outcomes is Oranges.

So on one side you have people arguing that we should let people have Apples, and on the other side you have people arguing that we shouldn’t let people have Oranges.

And both sides get angry.

Cheers,

Astuce

[jerryR]

Only responding because I started back on green during the height of the cov19 lockdown.

I get the vibe that a lot of people that use the "casual" argument really are still spending 4+ hours a day, every day playing this game. Casual seems to more synonymous to being a lower level character (< level 35) than hours played per week when you dig deeper.

If you're actually a casual player and have one or two nights a week you can play at length: even if you got the best xp camp in the game for your level every time you log on, it's going to be a long road. So why stress - give the server a few more weeks when burnout, Aradune and the lock down ending takes some peeps off. There still are plenty of spots to get good cash and XP on this server regardless of the amount of people playing. It is not nearly as dire as some people suggest. And honestly.. your time budget really doesn't support min/maxing or pining over some item that will make you ever so subtly better.

To the some of those people complaining: I really have no faith in your altruism should your timing be right or you finally get to a level where you can capitalize on a good item/cash camp yourself. You would do the exact same thing that these other people you seem to despise are doing. It's the greed and entitlement that is making you angry - even if the person camping is essentially in the same boat as you but just had more time (or better timing) to get the spot you've been wanting.

I've had people like billwilliams message me and accuse me of things when I don't even have a guild or a close group of friends that play - I just put the solid time in to get the camp via a list. So do some self reflection. I'd suggest finding more balance in your life. It's super frustrating that your itemization progress is gated by someone else, but if you're truly in the server for the long haul and not just racing to your next burn out.. maybe you can learn some patience and perspective.

Failing that, you can easily still make progress towards 50 and get money to buy items while sitting on a list (which being higher level will make you way more efficient to camp the item anyway).

As far as new server: I say wait it out til the fall and see how the numbers look rather than splitting the population (again only to have it drop). If the population is still this high all summer.. then maybe look at spinning up another server around Kunark launch. Though I agree with the sentiment you're going to still see the same competition in the higher end camps eventually there too, regardless.

[turbosilk]

Only responding because I started back on green during the height of the cov19 lockdown.

I get the vibe that a lot of people that use the "casual" argument really are still spending 4+ hours a day, every day playing this game. Casual seems to more synonymous to being a lower level character (< level 35) than hours played per week when you dig deeper.

If you're actually a casual player and have one or two nights a week you can play at length: even if you got the best xp camp in the game for your level every time you log on, it's going to be a long road. So why stress - give the server a few more weeks when burnout, Aradune and the lock down ending takes some peeps off. There still are plenty of spots to get good cash and XP on this server regardless of the amount of people playing. It is not nearly as dire as some people suggest. And honestly.. your time budget really doesn't support min/maxing or pining over some item that will make you ever so subtly better.

To the some of those people complaining: I really have no faith in your altruism should your timing be right or you finally get to a level where you can capitalize on a good item/cash camp yourself. You would do the exact same thing that these other people you seem to despise are doing. It's the greed and entitlement that is making you angry - even if the person camping is essentially in the same boat as you but just had more time (or better timing) to get the spot you've been wanting.

I've had people like billwilliams message me and accuse me of things when I don't even have a guild or a close group of friends that play - I just put the solid time in to get the camp via a list. So do some self reflection. I'd suggest finding more balance in your life. It's super frustrating that your itemization progress is gated by someone else, but if you're truly in the server for the long haul and not just racing to your next burn out.. maybe you can learn some patience and perspective.

Failing that, you can easily still make progress towards 50 and get money to buy items while sitting on a list (which being higher level will make you way more efficient to camp the item anyway).

As far as new server: I say wait it out til the fall and see how the numbers look rather than splitting the population (again only to have it drop). If the population is still this high all summer.. then maybe look at spinning up another server around Kunark launch. Though I agree with the sentiment you're going to still see the same competition in the higher end camps eventually there too, regardless.

Good post but Green is here to recreate the classic experience. Join my groups if you mistrust my altruism. I also don't solo camp at 50. Wrecks the classic experience.

If you want to solo to victory and be antisocial I recommend TLP or retail WoW.

[turbosilk]

Great solution, force people to invite randoms no matter what. That'll surely "fix" the server...

You have to admit forcing people to group is what made EQ great. Social forcing mechanisms are good for MMOs. Which is also why boxing is anathema.

[jerryR]

Good post but Green is here to recreate the classic experience. Join my groups if you mistrust my altruism. I also don't solo camp at 50. Wrecks the classic experience.

If you want to solo to victory and be antisocial I recommend TLP or retail WoW.

Was more of a general statement, not specifically to your situation. Though I still think there's plenty of camps you can bring your group to get XP - might not be in your top 5 but it's possible. Hopefully summer will make it easier for your group going forward though, wish you luck.

Your second point I don't really understand though. It's the game mechanics and timeline that make it classic ? If the server is mechanically classic than however someone decides to play is irrelevant, no ? The idea that I'm somehow unwittingly playing the game 'unclassically' is a bit nuts to be honest. That is where you lost me. Enforcing a play style mechanically or otherwise seems more like WoW to me than EQ, which adds to the irony of your statement

[turbosilk]

Was more of a general statement, not specifically to your situation. Though I still think there's plenty of camps you can bring your group to get XP - might not be in your top 5 but it's possible. Hopefully summer will make it easier for your group going forward though, wish you luck.

Your second point I don't really understand though. It's the game mechanics and timeline that make it classic ? If the server is mechanically classic than however someone decides to play is irrelevant, no ? The idea that I'm somehow unwittingly playing the game 'unclassically' is a bit nuts to be honest. That is where you lost me. Enforcing a play style mechanically or otherwise seems more like WoW to me than EQ, which adds to the irony of your statement

This is I think were we have to keep in mind that Rogean and Nilbog are here recreating the classic experience not the exact mechanics. A prime example of this is not allowing boxing. Boxing is classic but it was highly unlikely a person could/would be running 6 computers. 1 person holding a camp by themselves while 2-6 boxing wrecks the classic experience. And 1 person holding a camp by themselves period wrecks the classic experience.

Solo camping was an outdoors thing not a dungeons thing.

[jerryR]

And 1 person holding a camp by themselves period wrecks the classic experience.

Solo camping was an outdoors thing not a dungeons thing.

But it was possible to do it in classic same as now, no ? I just don't see how your idea could possibly come to fruition without a mechanical intervention that would be equally un-classic. Splitting the server again is clearly not going to address this issue, so what are you actually suggesting is the solution ?

The only way to achieve a classic experience like you want is probably to buff mobs, modify spawns and pathing etc to make locking down camps solo a bit more inconvenient and other fundamental changes to make up for the fact it's 2020. And even then it's guaranteed the meta will swing and there will be some other way to accomplish the same thing just in a new way.

[turbosilk]

But it was possible to do it in classic same as now, no ? I just don't see how your idea could possibly come to fruition without a mechanical intervention that would be equally un-classic. Splitting the server again is clearly not going to address this issue, so what are you actually suggesting is the solution ?

The only way to achieve a classic experience like you want is probably to buff mobs, modify spawns and pathing etc to make locking down camps solo a bit more inconvenient and other fundamental changes to make up for the fact it's 2020. And even then it's guaranteed the meta will swing and there will be some other way to accomplish the same thing just in a new way.

Possible an commonly occurred are 2 different things. Rogean and Nilbog are recreating the classic experience not the exact classic mechanics. There are tons of changes to classic mechanics to maintain a classic experience.

[jerryR]

Possible an commonly occurred are 2 different things. Rogean and Nilbog are recreating the classic experience not the exact classic mechanics. There are tons of changes to classic mechanics to maintain a classic experience.

So why suggest splitting the server that does nothing to address your concerns ?

[turbosilk]

So why suggest splitting the server that does nothing to address your concerns ?

First, the server is overpopulated on the top end harming the classic experience. There is already precedence set for a temporary server to address unclassic populations (in live if populations were too large servers were added). It would help splitting out the top end population for high 40s and 50s group camp accessibility.

Would be great if my other suggestions were implemented but all I can do is make suggestions.

PS Are you shaping up to be another troll that restarted an account with 13 lifetime posts because your other forum accounts are ignored by too many people? Not saying you are yet but you only have 13 posts.

[cd288]

So why suggest splitting the server that does nothing to address your concerns ?

If you read back through this guy’s posts, he’s upset that he has a static group and can’t easily roll into very popular camps and hold them down instead of having to wait for a spot in the group that’s there to open up; he doesn’t want XP he wants specific popular camps (I’m not sure if he ever actually played classic, because if he had he would know that it’s not realistic to expect to take your own full group to popular camps). He’s also upset that he can’t use that static group to take a very popular camp because someone is soloing it (which literally happened all the time on EQ - his suggestion that somehow back then people didn’t know how to solo a spawn is just nuts lol). He is also upset that Naggy and Vox are as contested that they are (probably is in one of the raiding guilds and doesn’t like missing out on targets).

Usually people use the “classic experience” argument when they don’t really have any solid points and want to make some vague amorphous claim without any real evidence. I was CSR at the time and I can 100% tell you that many of these valuable camps were frequently soloed (I remember all the petitions from them lol). By 6-7 months in, the online resources had come out and people knew where a lot of these great items were. People like Turbo who claim there weren’t many high level players just weren’t high level at the time themselves and so they didn’t actually see that it’s not far off from what it was like back then.

He also disregards the fact that in 1999 we split servers when they were well over 2k after a few months...not when they were 1400 at prime time lol. As you see from his last response to you, if you don’t agree with him he calls you a troll and criticizes your post count (kind of reminds me of a Trump supporter basically deflecting your valid argument and just criticizing you personally to downplay your point); for example, he said he put me on his ignore list simply because I continue to debate his baseless points which makes me a “troll” because I don’t agree with him.

What he needs, in essence, is instancing or pick zones like the TLPs offer because it’s clear he wants to be able to do whatever he wants whenever he wants which is not what classic EQ is.

[jerryR]

PS Are you shaping up to be another troll that restarted an account with 13 lifetime posts because your other forum accounts are ignored by too many people? Not saying you are yet but you only have 13 posts.

I tried blue a long time ago ? Came back to give green a shot around a month ago because like many people, I have a surplus of free time at the moment. Generally I don't post on forums and only posted because of what Billwilliams said. Not not trying to engage you at all and certainly not trolling.

[turbosilk]

I tried blue a long time ago ? Came back to give green a shot around a month ago because like many people, I have a surplus of free time at the moment. Generally I don't post on forums and only posted because of what Billwilliams said. Not not trying to engage you at all and certainly not trolling.

Welcome back.

PS AC list 30 ppl long atm.

[jerryR]

Welcome back.

PS AC list 30 ppl long atm.

Shrug.. it's a long weekend for some and we can't drink with buddies and aren't supposed to go to the cottage. So for me I'm sitting here getting xp just fine at level 42 and talking on a forum.

[cd288]

Welcome back.

PS AC list 30 ppl long atm.

As usual with Turbo, his complaints revolve around popular camps/items being crowded lol

Also, the list may be long but at least there’s a list as opposed to specific people/persons holding down the camp on Blue in perpetuity and selling the MQs

[turbosilk]

Shrug.. it's a long weekend for some and we can't drink with buddies and aren't supposed to go to the cottage. So for me I'm sitting here getting xp just fine at level 42 and talking on a forum.

It's ok for me too. I'm not really an outdoor zone player.

[turbosilk]

Shrug.. it's a long weekend for some and we can't drink with buddies and aren't supposed to go to the cottage. So for me I'm sitting here getting xp just fine at level 42 and talking on a forum.

It bring up the good point though. There is precedence for a list force function at AC along with having to leave the camp once you get the drop. If you are forced to list for AC, there is precendence.

Why is it ok for AC to have rules preventing a single person from monopolizing the loot and continuing to farm the drop over and over but it's not ok elsewhere?

[CatanMowse]

First let me assuage Turbo's fears towards anyone that doesn't have a gazillion posts -- this is my one and only account and I don't intend to troll, but I did find this thread interesting enough to decide to weigh in.

I find myself having a difficult time understanding CD288's position, as his view seems to only be to refute anything Turbo has to say against the splitting of servers without providing any value for keeping things combined.

JerryR, I enjoy your posts as they seem more nuanced and inquisitive without being antagonistic. I also appreciate Turbo's position, and like most who have expressed a view, either on this thread or by way of the server split poll, find myself preferring a split in the servers.

As a non-port class player who does like grouping, I often end up paying for ports to multiple zones before I'm able to find an interesting camp. I'm not as excited about pixels as I am about exploring the content - but to be honest, some content is better than others, which is why server populations tend to gather in a few zones. Since the server combine, I have found the amount of time I waste trying to move between zones and find a group has grown - both from the server merge and from the increasing number of level 50 players having to share a diminutive number of zones. Besides the time commitment, it becomes expensive to travel around looking for a camp. I'll start out hoping to find something in SolB, or LGuk, or Paw... having to travel to my second, third, or fourth choice has a not-insignificant financial impact -- being poor does feel pretty classic, though.

Simply put, I found fun places easier on Teal, and I haven't reaped many benefits from the merge. I would love to see the server split again, or at least hear some good arguments for why we should all stay together. If it is all GM logistics, I understand. Are there no player benefits to combined servers?

[drackgon]

Ill just be like some and give no reason. Bring back teal, just to troll those who want only green to protect their Plat horde, and afraid that double the pixels..

But for real "The essence of a role-playing game is that it is a group, cooperative experience." Gary Gygax. I won't judge those who enjoy solo play, but this is an MMORPG.

And my exp on Erollisi Marr(different for others), was very very very rare did we see solo players farming high end camps in classic.

We are trying to relive the classic exp, for me that is grouping and having fun, even when my group fails and wipes, dust yourself off laugh and enjoy the adventure. Sadly this game is 20 years old, and with Wiki power, players have the knowledge and technology(cable vs dial up), to be super efficient at EQ. (not judging).

Mainly why deny fun for others.. If there is a strong(almost 500 1/3 pop) who wants teal. Why be a jerk and hate on them for it, let them take their friends and go on adventures.

[cd288]

Ill just be like some and give no reason. Bring back teal, just to troll those who want only green to protect their Plat horde, and afraid that double the pixels.

Except plat horders and loot farmers loved Teal because they could play on both at the same time and farm double the stuff. No one with a plat horde would think Teal was a bad thing, quite the contrary.

[drackgon]

Dbl the pixels means half the prices so let them farm double. ^-^https://www.reddit.com/r/project1999/comments/gm7ngu/lf0m/

[cd288]

Dbl the pixels means half the prices so let them farm double. ^-^https://www.reddit.com/r/project1999/comments/gm7ngu/lf0m/

You would think, but it doesn't seem to be the way things go on P99. Most of those farmers will then just become tunnel questers who don't need to go do anything else so they aren't motivated to sell quickly and cheaply in order to get out of the tunnel. That's why if you go sit in EC for multiple days you'll see people selling the same item for really high prices and refusing to come down...they aren't trying to get back to XPing so they're happy to wait because eventually someone will buy it. Not to mention that those tunnel questers own the bulk of the item in question in existence on the server so they can control what the market price is. This has been an ongoing issue on P99n since before Green.

Plus, then you have double the plat coming into circulation which also inflates the price. If what you're saying is what happens, we would've seen that on Blue with people farming items like crazy 24/7; we would've seen it on Green when Teal merged. But we didn't. Those items are all still going for, and selling at, absurd prices.

[Albanwr]

I could understand the people not wanting another server if the population was low on Green, its not. People simply dont want another server open, because others do. There is nothing that would be harmed opening up another server for the players. Go if you want, stay if you don't.

Arguing against another server is simply arguing for no reason.

Don't open another server because twice as much loot? 99% of the loot will be worthless come Kunark and beyond, so that is not a good argument now that the /list items are gone.

[drackgon]

Prices are not abusrb atm. if anything prices have dropped insanly. Can get M2hd for what 4k if u shop around Fbss down to 14k? 12?K. Gebs 6-7k? Only thing gone up is cost of reapers lol. Maybe tranix crown but of course that will always be high. When we remerged M2hd was 22k..Gebs like 20k...yeah ABSURB!!!.....

[cd288]

Prices are not abusrb atm. if anything prices have dropped insanly. Can get M2hd for what 4k if u shop around Fbss down to 14k? 12?K. Gebs 6-7k? Only thing gone up is cost of reapers lol. Maybe tranix crown but of course that will always be high. When we remerged M2hd was 22k..Gebs like 20k...yeah ABSURB!!!.....

Lol you think 14k isn't absurd for an FBSS??

[drackgon]

god no. 14k for pretty much BIS from day1 until Sky...dude your bad if you cant manage 14k after a good week of just messing around.(unless ur w awarrior/rogue)

[drackgon]

heck go farm like 10 reapers... gg.. And thats farming a lvl 20 mob..

[Bigsham]

i hear rogues make great money pickpocketing in rathe mountains

[cd288]

god no. 14k for pretty much BIS from day1 until Sky...dude your bad if you cant manage 14k after a good week of just messing around.(unless ur w awarrior/rogue)

I mean I guess. 14k for an item that we know won't be BIS sometime in like the next few months is pretty high IMO. If we didn't know what items were coming in the expansions, then sure.

[Strifen]

I really enjoy how lively green is right now, tons of groups and people LFG too. Splitting the server would do more harm in the long run.

Once covid lockdown is over and summer in full swing, numbers will go down.

Dev's don't listen to these complaints please.

[turbosilk]

Would be even further proof of the need for a server split if the speculation that GMs are spawning ACs because the list is 40 people long.

[cd288]

Would be even further proof of the need for a server split if the speculation that GMs are spawning ACs because the list is 40 people long.

Lmao this is as insane a conspiracy theory as Obamagate. You actually think P99 would do that?