Fate of P99 blue

[wehrmacht]

After P1999 PvP launches and dwarfs the population of P99 blue, what should happen to the blue server?

[naez]

my poll derp'd out

http://imageshack.us/m/542/6746/pollderp.jpg


edit: woah, refreshing page din't fix but posting the derp image did

[Misto]

This poll makes no sense.

You said: After P1999 PvP launches and dwarfs the population of P99 blue, what should happen to the blue server?

One of the options says Wipe it and use it as a login server for P1999 Zek.

So you're saying we should have 2 red servers.

Warning: You just experienced a logic bomb.

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0812/confused-demotivational-poster-1228332800.jpg

[wehrmacht]

Dwarfed
http://imageshack.us/m/64/7231/70250306.jpg

[Doors]

It should stay up, because whenever red99 eventually fails, you nerds will need somewhere else to play.

[Knuckle]

Doors- mad since 99.

[Doors]

Bro I just have foreskin - I know whats going to happen before it actually does happen.

Prophet Doors of p99

[Lazortag]

polls on eqemu show that pvp is less popular than pve anyway - this was always the case on live and so the hit to p99's population would be negligible. To say that anything seriously bad will happen to p99 in the long term is nonsense. P99 is one of the most popular emu servers ever, it's the most popular everquest one and easily the most well-coded. At its prime it has a higher population than every other eqemu server combined. No other server can compete with such a giant. Anyone predicting otherwise is a fool.

[Dantes]

... or a troll.

[Knuckle]

wehrmachts trolling skills are a bit weak, but goes to show how gullible p99 posters are.

[Messianic]

There's an incredible amount of interest in EQ pvp. That's why VZ-TZ is still going strong.

[Deathrydar]

I don't even know why I voted. Must've been a bad day at work.

Hopefully the pvp server fails!

[naez]

There's an incredible amount of interest in EQ pvp. That's why VZ-TZ is still going strong.

Maybe because they wiped it thrice and had the failest staff ever outside of Sirken. Still the longest running emu ever besides like KMRA

[Knuckle]

VZTZ was the number one server for a long time. I still keep a poster of my monk doing a flying kick on my wall.

[naez]

^5

[Doors]

I think the bigger question is, what is everyone going to play in 6 years when red99 opens

[Lazortag]

wehrmachts trolling skills are a bit weak, but goes to show how gullible p99 posters are.

He's hardly trolling, and if he is, it's not exactly clear - he's said several times both here and on IRC that he thinks red99's population will outnumber blue99. He's also made similar claims about PEQ and other servers.

[Dantes]

Or they will both have a large audience. That seems more likely.

[stormlord]

Since red99 is never going to dwarf blue99 then I am not worrying about it.

If you want red99 then make it. But don't expect it to be as popular.

Generally sheep don't run to the slaughter. That's why their hearts are blue.

Nongamers > Casual > Hardcore > Pvper in terms of market share. Get used to it already.

[Eldaran]

Judging from these forums i bet 100 people will be on the 99red server. There was over 900 on P99 blue last night. I can't see it having that much of an effect on the current server. Plus after people actually remember what EQ PvP is like, half of them will go back to WoW Arenas.

[Knuckle]

Judging from these forums i bet 100 people will be on the 99red server. There was over 900 on P99 blue last night. I can't see it having that much of an effect on the current server. Plus after people actually remember what EQ PvP is like, half of them will go back to WoW Arenas.

umm granted there was twoboxxing, but i saw vztz topping 300 players online when 1.0 was wiped and we had 2.0 come out. This is going to be about 3x more epic. I expect to see 300 one boxxers ezpz during first few weeks.

[Eldaran]

I really enjoyed the Race War rulesets but if it's FFA i'm prob not gonna be interested.

[Deathrydar]

Plus after people actually remember what EQ PvP is like, half of them will go back to WoW Arenas.

[Knuckle]

Judging from these forums i bet 100 people will be on the 99red server. There was over 900 on P99 blue last night. I can't see it having that much of an effect on the current server. Plus after people actually remember what EQ PvP is like, half of them will go back to WoW Arenas.

umm granted there was twoboxxing, but i saw vztz topping 300 players online when 1.0 was wiped and we had 2.0 come out. This is going to be about 3x more epic. I expect to see 300 one boxxers ezpz during first few weeks.

[Eldaran]

umm granted there was twoboxxing, but i saw vztz topping 300 players online when 1.0 was wiped and we had 2.0 come out. This is going to be about 3x more epic. I expect to see 300 one boxxers ezpz during first few weeks.

Deja Vu, but do we know what the ruleset will be for Red99? Everyone FFA RED or will it be Good Vs Evil, or Racial Pairings?

[Knuckle]

Deja Vu, but do we know what the ruleset will be for Red99? Everyone FFA RED or will it be Good Vs Evil, or Racial Pairings?

It's 90% likely to be a FFA set up like on VZTZ. You can bash the coding, playerbase, and GMs on vztz all you want, but almost everyone agrees the FFA ruleset used makes the most sense with a smaller playerbase on EQ PVP.

[Salty]

FFA REULSET IS ONLY REULSET


pals can't hit guildies, AND those in the same group (imo).

[naez]

always fun to drop group and lifetap ks the tank when a pull goes sour

"i just saved u xp hit stfu thx4pp"

[Haul]

Doors- mad since 99.

hahaha best post of the week, +1

[Extunarian]

always fun to drop group and lifetap ks the tank when a pull goes sour

"i just saved u xp hit stfu thx4pp"

hahaha...the image of seeing your group members drop out to kill you reminds me of those gangster/mobster movies where someone who is about to get killed looks around the once bustling store only to realize the place is suddenly empty.

[mwatt]

It's a good poll. The only problem is that it's ass backwards.

So what should we do with the red server when it starts out at not so popular and then trickles to virtually nothing after the first three or four months?

[wehrmacht]

almost everyone agrees the FFA ruleset used makes the most sense with a smaller playerbase on EQ PVP.

The Searyx poll was around 50/50 FFA vs Teams.

The lasher poll was 55% vs 45%
http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=31344

So it's more like 1/2 of people think that.

Most people asking for a new PvP server on EQ Live boards seem to want a team based PvP progression server:
http://forums.station.sony.com/eq/posts/list.m?topic_id=163160

[mimixownzall]

It's 90% likely to be a FFA set up like on VZTZ. You can bash the coding, playerbase, and GMs on vztz all you want, but almost everyone agrees the FFA ruleset used makes the most sense with a smaller playerbase on EQ PVP.

And by 'everyone' he means his group of chronies.

You guys will gay the server up and you know it.

You will invite some guy into your group.. inspect him.. then kick him from group, kill him and loot what you want.

This type of behaviour will kill the server.

If you want longevity, teams is the only way to go. I suggest all teams have all classes, though. Altergate has a huge problem now with the way the classes were distributed.

[Doors]

Agreed. Too many morons are gonna be on red99 hacking it to death anyway, don't give the minority of losers FFA. The only reason these social failures want FFA is to grief with it, If this is going to be any type of successful with a decent playerbase it should be team.

[Eldaran]

Agreed. Too many morons are gonna be on red99 hacking it to death anyway, don't give the minority of losers FFA. The only reason these social failures want FFA is to grief with it, If this is going to be any type of successful with a decent playerbase it should be team.

I agree. Teams is the best PvP experience and was why I enjoyed Vallon Zek so much back in the day.

[Doors]

Like I'm not even trolling at this point, you're basically retarded if you think FFA will work.

Only reason vztz crew wants FFA is because they have cliques already established, which is whatever. Everyone else thats going to come from p99 won't and will create, hit 10, get shit on, and go back to p99.

Wormchecks basically been established as a dumbass around here so anything he says about ffa can be instantly ignored.

[wehrmacht]

If you want longevity, teams is the only way to go. I suggest all teams have all classes, though.

Best teams setup for both sides to have all classes:


Dark Elf Alliance (evil)
--------------------
Dark Elf
Troll
Iksar
Ogre
Half Elf
Erudite


Human Alliance (good)
---------------------
Human
Dwarf
Gnome
Halfling
High Elf
Barbarian
Wood Elf

[Knuckle]

If you don't make it FFA here is what happens:

VZTZ 'clique' rolls one team.
You guys get facefucked 10x harder making team imbalance 10x worse.

-or-

you leave it FFA, VZTZ rolls its own guild. Any and all comers can have a shot at us, with no chance for coattail riding pvp immunity bullshit because your the same race/diety.

Knuckle spitting the truth. FFA = Server Longevity

[Knuckle]

You know what, im getting mad.

FUCK TEAMS. I am not fucking arguing with a GM over raid mob rotation because two different same team guilds are at the mob.

ITS A FUCKING RED SERVER

Get in the clan, or get your own, im not sharing shit if you arent repping the tag. And actually, I was nice to new players or loners a lot of the time if they werent twinks or an obvious spy. We want new players as much as anyone else.

All this bullshit talk about griefing, is actually done by the bitch guilds who get shit on 90% of the time because that's the only way they can win at pvp is bullying newbies.

Knuckle the Prophet.

[Doors]

umad?

Bullying newbies? Fucktards from garage box are going to form up and rapesquad the entire red99 playerbase. I don't even blame them because it would be hilarious, but nobody is going to play if its like that.

[Knuckle]

well assuming salty forms up his own squad, we will be hard pressed against fish bait sized guilds regardless of skill. also, you can bet we will be spending our time reaching the top first, the best items aren't found at level 10 or 20. Granted we may have to fight for control of the best leveling/farming areas, but that's the point. There is no gang of elite guildplayers rolling around crushing peoples souls. We focus on winning.

[fiegi]

umad?

Bullying newbies? Fucktards from garage box are going to form up and rapesquad the entire red99 playerbase. I don't even blame them because it would be hilarious, but nobody is going to play if its like that.

50% of the VZTZ community can't stand the other 50% of the VZTZ playerbase. Considering we had maybe 70 players last box, I hardly see a rapesquad of 30 ppl max ruling the entire box if the population is even close to what its assumed to be at.

Teams would suck, arguing who has the rights to kill a raid mob is lol's, isn't that the reason why its a pvp server to determine who's mob it really is?

[wehrmacht]

well assuming salty forms up his own squad

<Too Big to Fail> would be the best choice

If you don't make it FFA here is what happens:

VZTZ 'clique' rolls one team.
You guys get facefucked 10x harder making team imbalance 10x worse.


It's the exact opposite. Whoever starts with a guild of 30 people on day 1 automatically wins the server under FFA. FFA is easy mode for zerg guilds.

If you level a bunch of people to 50 real fast and run to do Nagafen, on a FFA server you might have to fight one other guild at the most before you kill it. On a teams server, you would have to kill multiple guilds and also random stragglers in zone from that team as well. Everything is easier for zergers under FFA.

[Prince]

except that killing nagafen once doesn't equal winning the server

[Doors]

I kind of agree with dumbass worm, another solid point about how shitty FFA is.

[pasi]

A lot of the VZTZ people seem to think that no matter what type of server is launched, there is going to be a large, steady population. Neither teams nor FFA rule type will straight up result in the server dying, but with FFA - you can count on (for the most part) very few 'new' people playing the server.

Solutions to team based servers have been addressed a bunch of times - hardcoded no x-teaming, FFA PvP in zones with raid targets/peak-level interest, all classes available to BOTH teams, etc.

Admittedly, there's still some issues such as zones adjacent to raid targets and a potential lopsided population balance, but the gains outweigh these.

For what it's worth, I don't plan on playing on the server anymore as playing EQ for a week reminded me of how slow the PvP and game in general are.

[wehrmacht]

This server is taking forever. What do we pay Null for around here:confused::confused::confused:

[Doors]

Heres a scenario thats basically guaranteed to happen if red99 is faction-team based:

Guild A is good
Guild B is good
Guild C is evil

Naggy spawns. Guild A and B arrive at the same time.
Neither guild will agree to work together to down naggy as both think they can do it alone.
Guild A moves out, telling guild B to fuck off and letting guild C know they're clear to shit all over guild B.
Guild C moves in, wipes guild B out, guild A moves back in and finishes off guild C as they regroup.
Guild A downs naggy. Great forum reading material appears on p99 boards for the next month.
-----

Theres a hundred different ways you can deal with same faction bullshit on a team based box. FFA, yeah, you can just kill whoever, but realistically everyones going to mass in one guild and run shit a year at least. That and you'll get people from p99 who aren't pvp savvy like myself, will get camped and ragequit ---> back to p99 they go.

Faction based is the shit, and will make red99 awesome. Either way, if red99 does happen, we should all just be happy regardless. Judging by the success of p99, a pvp box hosted by the same devs has a good chance to be really successful, and a red box is better than no box. amirite.

[mimixownzall]

If you don't make it FFA here is what happens:

VZTZ 'clique' rolls one team.
You guys get facefucked 10x harder making team imbalance 10x worse.

-or-

you leave it FFA, VZTZ rolls its own guild. Any and all comers can have a shot at us, with no chance for coattail riding pvp immunity bullshit because your the same race/diety.

Knuckle spitting the truth. FFA = Server Longevity

Team imballance? You're stupid.

Here is how it will go: Look! We are on the same team as those douchebags, lets reroll to the other team!

Happened a lot on SZ.

Or, it will be like this (on FFA): Man, Heresy (just using heresy for this example) is owning, let's all join up and make a super competing guild and call it Orthodoxy! Sweet! Heresy sees Orthodoxy's numbers and starts beefing up its numbers to match them. Now we have 2 major guilds making up a total of 90% of the server population! Well, shit... THIS MIGHT AS WELL BE A TEAMS SERVER!

One difference: Instead of people guild hopping (which could cause some unforseen drama), they would just re-roll to the other team, which, in turn, would bolster the lower level population helping newcomers.

I mean, think about it. If p99 were a PVP server (please, keep the bluebie noob bullshit comments out), the smaller raiding guilds wouldn't exist. Guilds like Dozekar, TMO, VD, BDE and such would have to consolidate their forces to compete with TR. You might get 3 total big-number guilds. And that is on a server that will probably have at least twice the population as red99.

Believe me, I WANT red99 to succeed and teams is the best way for that to happen. You guys know that you will need people to stay on the server who aren't as 'hardcore' as the VZTZ guys seem/claim to be, and teams is the best way to keep these people on the server.

[Haul]

50% of the VZTZ community can't stand the other 50% of the VZTZ playerbase. Considering we had maybe 70 players last box, I hardly see a rapesquad of 30 ppl max ruling the entire box if the population is even close to what its assumed to be at.

Teams would suck, arguing who has the rights to kill a raid mob is lol's, isn't that the reason why its a pvp server to determine who's mob it really is?

+1

[Knuckle]

Team imballance? You're stupid.

Here is how it will go: Look! We are on the same team as those douchebags, lets reroll to the other team!

Happened a lot on SZ.

Or, it will be like this (on FFA): Man, Heresy (just using heresy for this example) is owning, let's all join up and make a super competing guild and call it Orthodoxy! Sweet! Heresy sees Orthodoxy's numbers and starts beefing up its numbers to match them. Now we have 2 major guilds making up a total of 90% of the server population! Well, shit... THIS MIGHT AS WELL BE A TEAMS SERVER!

One difference: Instead of people guild hopping (which could cause some unforseen drama), they would just re-roll to the other team, which, in turn, would bolster the lower level population helping newcomers.

I mean, think about it. If p99 were a PVP server (please, keep the bluebie noob bullshit comments out), the smaller raiding guilds wouldn't exist. Guilds like Dozekar, TMO, VD, BDE and such would have to consolidate their forces to compete with TR. You might get 3 total big-number guilds. And that is on a server that will probably have at least twice the population as red99.

Believe me, I WANT red99 to succeed and teams is the best way for that to happen. You guys know that you will need people to stay on the server who aren't as 'hardcore' as the VZTZ guys seem/claim to be, and teams is the best way to keep these people on the server.

that drama just doesnt happen in the sort of guilds we roll in, thats what makes us so successful. so basically what happens is as 'heresy' rapes 'good team' a bunch of good team players reroll dark toons thus turning red99 into a glorified p99 server as competition dwindles. you have no choice but to compete and knock down the top guild on FFA. and our guild wont crumble or whatever you think it will, alot of us have been playing together for over 3 years, it just wont happen.

[mimixownzall]

that drama just doesnt happen in the sort of guilds we roll in, thats what makes us so successful. so basically what happens is as 'heresy' rapes 'good team' a bunch of good team players reroll dark toons thus turning red99 into a glorified p99 server as competition dwindles. you have no choice but to compete and knock down the top guild on FFA. and our guild wont crumble or whatever you think it will, alot of us have been playing together for over 3 years, it just wont happen.

First off, I never mentioned anything about your guild crumbling; only the server crumbling.

Second:

as 'heresy' rapes 'good team' a bunch of good team players reroll dark toons thus turning red99 into a glorified p99 server as competition dwindles. you have no choice but to compete and knock down the top guild on FFA.

False. You might have a very few bandwagon jumpers, but this would be very few. People would know the only real way to compete is to PVP to do so. This means that as FFA, other guilds would have to consolidate to compete. As teams, they would have to join a different team. Either way the result is the same: Two (which is what the server will prolly wind up having due to population) top guilds competing for the top lewts.

My whole point is that anyone outside those top guilds would be better supported by teams.

Smaller guilds will stay around.
Unguilded people can group without worrying about showing up to an exp group and getting ass-raped by assholes (the group who invited person) and losing items.
People can ask for help without worrying about getting backstabbed.

I just think most people like to know who their enemies are. They want WW2 (discernable enemies), not Iraq.

[Doors]

Yeah item loot isn't gonna work either. Shits gay, money loot is fine. vztz loot system was OK in my opinion, made for some funny ass fights around rivervale.

[Lazortag]

If a clique of 40 people all swarm into one guild, on an FFA server they will be unstoppable, because their size relative to their competitors is far larger than on a teams-based server. On a teams-based server if 40 people all swarm into one "team", then that team is still beatable, because their size has only increased by a small percentage over their competitor(s?).

I think the setup should be teams and should not allow every class available to every team. This could actually deter people from mass-joining one of the teams since they may not be able to play their preferred class if they do that. It also takes away the advantage that one team gets from having higher numbers to start with, as people will often bandwagon and join the already-stronger team - but if they can't always choose their preferred class, then this won't happen as often.

Also, the teams should be sort of realistic and flavourful - sorry wehrmacht but the idea of Half Elves being on the evil team is just silly.

[Justown]

Lameish PvP Rule set server with pop of 500+ > Good PvP rules with pop of 100ish being completely dominated by 1 guild.

[JayDee]

I don't agree with your assumption, but I do concur that the decision should be based on what will ultimately lead to the best overall experience for the players which translates to higher population #s

[wehrmacht]

If a clique of 40 people all swarm into one guild, on an FFA server they will be unstoppable, because their size relative to their competitors is far larger than on a teams-based server.

Yep. This is the motive for everyone voting FFA. They want the server as easy mode as possible for their zerg guild. The others that want FFA are people that want to walk around in a group of 6 mages and attack solo players which is easier to do on FFA than teams.

You also end up with less PvP in general since nobody will attack the larger guilds on a FFA server unless they're in a zerg guild themselves.

[Knuckle]

Yep. This is the motive for everyone voting FFA. They want the server as easy mode as possible for their zerg guild. The others that want FFA are people that want to walk around in a group of 6 mages and attack solo players which is easier to do on FFA than teams.

You also end up with less PvP in general since nobody will attack the larger guilds on a FFA server unless they're in a zerg guild themselves.

lol zerg guild... teams turns the server into....2 giant zerg guilds omg..

also, FFA means only ONE GUILD, the guild that can rule by right of might, gets the raid mob. No one should be given immunity because of their race and feel that they have equal rights to a raid mob. That's bullshit, if you can't beat the other guild for it than you don't get it. This is not blue 99 with a dash of red. It's mothafuckin red99.

[Justown]

lol zerg guild... teams turns the server into....2 giant zerg guilds omg..

also, FFA means only ONE GUILD, the guild that can rule by right of might, gets the raid mob. No one should be given immunity because of their race and feel that they have equal rights to a raid mob. That's bullshit, if you can't beat the other guild for it than you don't get it. This is not blue 99 with a dash of red. It's mothafuckin red99.

Pretty easy for someone to say that has a group of like 40 people waiting in anticipation for the server to come up so you can power game it then rape everyone into submission. Im sorry but if you had any outside perspective here you'd see what everyone else is saying.

I do understand the fact that half of our fun (or more) is ruining other peoples fun. Problem with that is if you go about it this time the the way the TZ/VZ shit was ran with constant hacking / complete domination of ONE guild, the population WILL suck and the server WILL die. No one cares to run around and get killed / kill the same 50 people, well for longer than a week or two anyways.

[Doors]

Knuckle you'll probably be the first to join up with a fucking zerg guild, stop trolling for ffa its fail like U.

[Jigga]

vztz had on average 80-120players but that was two boxing so its 40-60 actual people. Usually around 20 in top guild 20 in 2nd guild and other 20 casual players. Vztz saw higher peaks at start of server but number dipped down fast.

Ive seen 52 people in fear working together on p99 and CT wasnt even up. I heard first few trak raids had higher, but i only heard that so maybe a lie
The heresy crew is probably around 25 crew if all come back and play. Unless they decide they want to guild with people they had shit stomped or take in people from p99 i see the a p99 guild being a bigger force than heresy/tdt or what ever.

How many show up for Trak and kunark dragon raids? 20,30,40,50? I havent payed attention. Im asking because i dont know and havent been on in a while to see and only hear rumors

[Prince]

im super glad we have a bunch of ppl that have never played on a pvp server declaring that they in fact know for sure what is best for the upcoming pvp server

[Knuckle]

Knuckle you'll probably be the first to join up with a fucking zerg guild, stop trolling for ffa its fail like U.

Yeah that sounds like me always joining up with the zerg guilds :rolleyes:

I MADE a zerg guild once, spent the majority of my time playing in small elite guilds thanks.

[Knuckle]

vztz had on average 80-120players but that was two boxing so its 40-60 actual people. Usually around 20 in top guild 20 in 2nd guild and other 20 casual players. Vztz saw higher peaks at start of server but number dipped down fast.

Ive seen 52 people in fear working together on p99 and CT wasnt even up. I heard first few trak raids had higher, but i only heard that so maybe a lie
The heresy crew is probably around 25 crew if all come back and play. Unless they decide they want to guild with people they had shit stomped or take in people from p99 i see the a p99 guild being a bigger force than heresy/tdt or what ever.

How many show up for Trak and kunark dragon raids? 20,30,40,50? I havent payed attention. Im asking because i dont know and havent been on in a while to see and only hear rumors

exactly. our reputation proceeds us, i think red99 will be the biggest challenge the vets from vztz have ever seen.

[Justown]

alot of <Defiant> and <Torrent> in Heresy from VZ? i was in <Aduentus> for awhile and i kno there is one or 2.

[Lazortag]

lol zerg guild... teams turns the server into....2 giant zerg guilds omg..

also, FFA means only ONE GUILD, the guild that can rule by right of might, gets the raid mob. No one should be given immunity because of their race and feel that they have equal rights to a raid mob. That's bullshit, if you can't beat the other guild for it than you don't get it. This is not blue 99 with a dash of red. It's mothafuckin red99.

Two (or three? Since you could always have a neutral team..) giant zerg guilds is better than one giant zerg guild and a whole bunch of small guilds plus unguilded people. When people organize under one enormous tag on day one, that gives them a big advantage over the many casual players who are likely unguilded, plus the small guilds who don't have the advantage of being part of a larger pre-established clique. On a teams server, the relative advantage of the team with the zerg guild in it is a lot smaller than on an FFA server.

Look at it this way. Say you form a zerg guild of 25 (unboxed) people, while the rest of the server consists of 100 people. Say that those 100 people split off evenly into each team, and so you have 50 people joining the good team, while 50 people go to the evil team. Now the good team outnumbers their only competitor (the evil team) by 3 to 2. This isn't great, sure, but the alternative is even worse. On an ffa server those 25 people outnumber unguilded people by 25 to 1, they'll surely outnumber small guilds by even more than 3 to 2, and if there's another zerg guild with comparable numbers, then it might as well be a teams server since the only meaningful difference is that the big guilds get to grief casual players more easily.

Sure, it's not great when someone is camping an item or engaging a raid boss and you can't kill them because they're on your team. But a small sacrifice to the end-game experience is worth it so that the server's population stays healthy.

[Chanur]

FFA REULSET IS ONLY REULSET


pals can't hit guildies, AND those in the same group (imo).

My buddy and I would use charm on a mob or two then drop group and rape them all. Ah FFA how broken you are. :)

[Knuckle]

My buddy and I would use charm on a mob or two then drop group and rape them all. Ah FFA how broken you are. :)

how is that broken, they agreed to group with you, you maybe got some kills, but you betrayed the people you grouped with to what advantage? FFA ruleset allows people to be people. If you can't function without hardcoded rules or if you choose to go that route more power to you, doesn't mean it works on everyone.

[Chanur]

how is that broken, they agreed to group with you, you maybe got some kills, but you betrayed the people you grouped with to what advantage? FFA ruleset allows people to be people. If you can't function without hardcoded rules or if you choose to go that route more power to you, doesn't mean it works on everyone.

The advantage was we got to exp with a group until we were done, then we got to take the groups coin and 1 item of our choice from everyone. Was awesome for us, and shitty for them.

[mimixownzall]

lol zerg guild... teams turns the server into....2 giant zerg guilds omg..

also, FFA means only ONE GUILD, the guild that can rule by right of might, gets the raid mob. No one should be given immunity because of their race and feel that they have equal rights to a raid mob. That's bullshit, if you can't beat the other guild for it than you don't get it. This is not blue 99 with a dash of red. It's mothafuckin red99.

See? As I have been saying all along. You guys anticipate being top dogs. The thought of some competition frightens you.

This talk of same team shit is dumb and you obviously never played on a teams server (at least not SZ). It is a PVP server. People join to pvp, if not they can stay on p99. People will either join the top guild or form one on a different team to compete.

Think about it. If you were in the other person's shoes, what would you do? Would you continue to be on that team and squabble about rights to raid mobs or would you join the opposing team and duke it out?

The mentality on teams is different too. You work a lot better with others on your team because you might need their help one day, or you might need to join them cause your guild folded or whatever. There is a much larger sense of communion due to pvp.

[Haul]

im super glad we have a bunch of ppl that have never played on a pvp server declaring that they in fact know for sure what is best for the upcoming pvp server

+1

[wehrmacht]

My main problem with FFA is that if you actually play the server the way it's meant to be played and just randomly attack everyone you see, you're not going to make it very far.

It's the people that don't gank others and make a bunch of stupid alliances or just create a giant zerg guild that come out ahead so the "random PK player" is punished while the people playing like women excel.

Rallos Zek was also the biggest joke of all the PvP servers. The only server in the history of Everquest where PvP was frowned upon and every guild on the server allied with each other to go fight the sleeper. Not even blue servers did that.

+1

Knuckle is one of those people. He never played an EQ live server.

[Knuckle]

My main problem with FFA is that if you actually play the server the way it's meant to be played and just randomly attack everyone you see, you're not going to make it very far.

It's the people that don't gank others and make a bunch of stupid alliances or just create a giant zerg guild that come out ahead so the "random PK player" is punished while the people playing like women excel.

Rallos Zek was also the biggest joke of all the PvP servers. The only server in the history of Everquest where PvP was frowned upon and every guild on the server allied with each other to go fight the sleeper. Not even blue servers did that.



Knuckle is one of those people. He never played an EQ live server.

I played eq live for like 5 years???

Also. my pvp credentials on vztz speak for themselves, im a fucking allstar baby.

[fiegi]

My main problem with FFA is that if you actually play the server the way it's meant to be played and just randomly attack everyone you see, you're not going to make it very far.

It's the people that don't gank others and make a bunch of stupid alliances or just create a giant zerg guild that come out ahead so the "random PK player" is punished while the people playing like women excel.

Rallos Zek was also the biggest joke of all the PvP servers. The only server in the history of Everquest where PvP was frowned upon and every guild on the server allied with each other to go fight the sleeper. Not even blue servers did that.



Knuckle is one of those people. He never played an EQ live server.

Maybe this happened when EQ went to shit after Velius...... but classic thru velius on Rallos was far from how you're advertising it. In Velius era alone there were 40 on 40's in plane of fear for CT. I'd agree tho, rallos must of really went to shit to have the entire server ally to kill the sleeper, thats pathetic. But thats far from the rallos i played on for 6 years. Item loot alone on Rallos has to count for something my man.

[Haul]

Rallos Zek wasn't a joke, item loot was hardcore. You're making claims on a server you didn't play or played for a couple weeks where the competition was too much for you man.

[Doors]

Haul - 1
Everyone else - 0

[Jigga]

pvp servers love gear more than pve servers imo. Gear has more importance in pvp at least up to like velious era . Blue servers some classes need very little gear to function. Bard for example doesnt need to be well geared on a pure blue server but on a pvp server they are so soft they gear is more important.

Anyways just my opinion

[fiegi]

pvp servers love gear more than pve servers imo. Gear has more importance in pvp at least up to like velious era . Blue servers some classes need very little gear to function. Bard for example doesnt need to be well geared on a pure blue server but on a pvp server they are so soft they gear is more important.

Anyways just my opinion

this is true

[Pudge]

Lameish PvP Rule set server with pop of 500+ > Good PvP rules with pop of 100ish being completely dominated by 1 guild.

I agree. But it would be great to have both.. Everyone here is arguing over which is better in the long run between FFA and Teams, but maybe if there were creative solutions posted it would help appease both sides.

Pro-Teams ppl want the instant comradery and territorial battles/danger.

Pro-FFA don't want to be restricted to only pvping half the population of the server. They do not want cross-teaming problems to arise (healing isnt the only thing same-team enemies can do.. training and spying are also easy to do). They want to be able to claim a camp by fighting for it, not poopsocking in line (or resorting to training their own team).

Everyone wants a larger population, and because EQ is a very social game and if you have no friends on a pvp server you die, having instant comradery is very good for new players. So teams will likely be better for population at first.

To compromise:

Teams till level 40, after 40, you auto-guild into your "team guild" but the ruleset is FFA - you can attack former team members (but obv not the ones in your guild) and can leave your guild at any time to join another one. Ppl who are 40+ also able to attack levels 1-50 in raid zones (almost like saying FFA in raid zones, except a level 35 in a raid zone will not be able to attack another same-team level 35). Maybe also have a team-wide chat channel, especially as the server matures to where most ppl are 50 (so newbs still have a chance to talk to one another and get together easily).
--this helps new players gain friends, experience some pvp, and level with a bit of safety for awhile before they become "big boys" and move into FFA land, with a transition to a guild that includes their past teammates. I imagine it'd be pretty easy to implement also. Eventually I imagine the conflict over territories will die down as most of the server becomes level 50, but this is also when territories are not as important, b/c it becomes all about raid loot.

[minakto]

Dont think clientside will permit alot of custom style ruleset with out issues being caused. Tz,sz or rz are choices as working as they worked on live as in grouping and healing and buffing. Changing level range for beint attackable and stuff can be done. I could be incorrect but when i viewed it that is what I noticed.

So i think it will have to be TZ and have xteaming healing, RZ FFA, or SZ with howit used to be on live with the good,neut, and evil

[wehrmacht]

Teams till level 40, after 40, you auto-guild into your "team guild" but the ruleset is FFA

This is just a con game into a FFA rule set and does nothing to "appease both sides".



this helps new players gain friends, experience some pvp, and level with a bit of safety for awhile before they become "big boys" and move into FFA land

If you had played EQ live PvP then you would know that Rallos Zek was a joke and Sullon Zek (the teams server) was where the "big boys" played.

[Jigga]

sullon zek wasnt around when i started on a pvp server and when it game out, mid/late velious?, I had friends and a guild i liked. Sometimes i wish i went to sz when it came out, it would of been nice to start over with everyone and have almost 3 years of experience under my belt so that i would not of made the day one newb mistakes and i would know where to go for items and what to kill.

Wehr what class did you play and what team on sz?

[Kika Maslyaka]

After P1999 PvP launches and dwarfs the population of P99 blue, what should happen to the blue server?

It will be shut down and replaced with Asheron's Call 1 server...
I was also told on good authority that Bill Gates himself will be playing...
He might even consider donating if devs replicate AC1 well enough.

[Pudge]

This is just a con game into a FFA rule set and does nothing to "appease both sides".




If you had played EQ live PvP then you would know that Rallos Zek was a joke and Sullon Zek (the teams server) was where the "big boys" played.

heh.. sullon was because of the "no rules", not teams. vallon/tallon were also teams...

and teams till 40 sounds better to the pro-teamers than no teams at all right? to make teams workable you'd have to be able to attack your own team/be able to switch teams even. i tried coming up with a teams idea that would let ppl play both team and FFA style, where you basically got flagged FFA if you killed your team enough/they killed you enough. posted about it somewhere else but no one seemed too interested. most likely because if it's not simple, then it wouldn't happen anyway. teams till 40 sounds like a simple idea that at least gets some of the biggest benefit of having teams - which is fostering some kinship between ppl, who many believe would otherwise automatically be enemies on day 1 (i dont think this is necessarily true but whatever).

I also liked the idea of an auto-guild that every level 1 created would join, so that newbs could be in a guild and connect with eachother. and maybe even some higher levels would remain in the guild to try and help them. suggested this for VZTZ and i believe they were considering just before the server died


just trying to come up with things that make everyone happy, so we can have the most pop. but just having teams as they were on live would not work, it would need some customization and at least FFA zones (raid zones)

[wehrmacht]

and teams till 40 sounds better to the pro-teamers than no teams at all right?

The only rule set that matters is the one at level 50 so your post was nothing but an attempt to con people into FFA.


just having teams as they were on live would not work

Teams wouldn't work? Give up the stupid lies dude. There were multiple teams PvP servers on EQ live and only one FFA because FFA is the one that doesn't work.

Did you even play on an EQ live PvP server? RZ was the trash server with the worst PvP out of them all.

Pretending like FFA is the more viable option is delusional at best and propaganda at worst.

[Jigga]

what class and team did you play wehr?

[wehrmacht]

what class and team did you play wehr?

Fraud <Ruin> - iksar monk

[Eldaran]

It will be shut down and replaced with Asheron's Call 1 server...
I was also told on good authority that Bill Gates himself will be playing...
He might even consider donating if devs replicate AC1 well enough.

I miss Asheron's Call. I would actually play that game right now just for the nostalgia. Too bad it's dead....

[Jigga]

Fraud <Ruin> - iksar monk

during your time how would you rate the teams? Even? Close enough? Very lopsided?

Was there a Team that was the pvp leaders by a good amount?

A team that was taking all the pve targets?

[wehrmacht]

during your time how would you rate the teams? Even? Close enough? Very lopsided?

Sullon Zek - August '02

* Good: 1485 - 33.2%
* Neutral: 1201 - 26.9%
* Evil: 1783 - 39.9%

With 3 teams you get a population disparity between the most and least populated side. With 2 teams the difference is negligible which is why having only 2 is much better for balance.

[Kringe]

Only having 2 Teams is terrible for balance, as proven in the "Horde/Alliance" that WoW has demonstrated...

Teams have never ever been a good idea, as it continues to be proven in every mmo released thats based on teams... IE WoW, Rift, (insert mmo here)
people always flock to the "bad side" causing massive amount of server merges only months after the games have been released (or in Wow's case Server transfers) to balance out the sides.


FFA is the only way to go.

[Eldaran]

Only having 2 Teams is better for balance, as proven in the "Horde/Alliance" that WoW has demonstrated...

Teams have never ever been a good idea, as it continues to be proven in every mmo released thats based on teams... IE WoW, Rift, (insert mmo here)
people always flock to the "bad side" causing massive amount of server merges only months after the games have been released (or in Wow's case Server transfers) to balance out the sides.


FFA is the only way to go.

Dark Age of Camelot remedied this with 3 teams. 2 teams will always be imbalanced and I can't seem to understand why they keep making PvP games with only 2 sides. When 1 gets too big the other have a common enemy.

[naez]

Goods always had more ppl than newts but could never get it together even BC/BP/etc. was fail

outside of Chadlek or Ayanae obv

[wehrmacht]

2 teams will always be imbalanced and I can't seem to understand why they keep making PvP games with only 2 sides.

Most illogical post ever. Will always be a smaller gap in power balance with 2 teams than 3.

[Prince]

phat l00ts no n00ts

[mimixownzall]

Only having 2 Teams is terrible for balance, as proven in the "Horde/Alliance" that WoW has demonstrated...

Teams have never ever been a good idea, as it continues to be proven in every mmo released thats based on teams... IE WoW, Rift, (insert mmo here)
people always flock to the "bad side" causing massive amount of server merges only months after the games have been released (or in Wow's case Server transfers) to balance out the sides.


FFA is the only way to go.

You are fucking retarded. The reason why they keep releasing games with teams is..... (drum roll)

Because it works!!!

Do you really think if it didn't work they would release games that way and continue to? WoW has how many subscribers? MAN THAT SEEMS LIKE A FAILING SYSTEM THUURRR!!

The biggest fail pvp I have run across was FFA. *cough* Vanguard *cough* That PVP server was horrible. You had one large guild steamrolling everywhere. The population dwindled very quickly.

Again, if you want longevity, make it teams. If you want fail numbers with one guild dominating, make it FFA (geee... that said guild all vote for FFA, go figure!)

AO had 3 teams, but the PVP was very limited to certain areas. I would probably still be playing it if it had PVP everywhere.

[Jigga]

sz had the smallest pop of pvp server. I dont care what it is, ill play but teams that i have seen get lopsided,wow,warhammer,everquest

[wehrmacht]

sz had the smallest pop of pvp server.

Pretty sure it had more people online than any other EQ server (blue or red) when it first launched.

Population went down the closer you get to luclin release, back up after PoP release, then of course back down again for GoD release, never to recover again.

[whitebandit]

Red99 being better than P99 is about as possible Ashton Kutcher's 2 and a half men being better than Charlie Sheen

[Jigga]

Pretty sure it had more people online than any other EQ server (blue or red) when it first launched.

Population went down the closer you get to luclin release, back up after PoP release, then of course back down again for GoD release, never to recover again.

SZ released in like june or july of 2001 if i remember right and luclin came out in december, 6 months.

Basing population upon a release of an expansion is always a good way to measure a server, amirite!

Either way ill play team, ffa, or what ever but sz had the lowest average of the pvp server after the novelty of it being new wore off

[JayDee]

Pretty sure it had more people online than any other EQ server (blue or red) when it first launched.

Yeah, for a whole 24 hours.

[Jigga]

SZ released with velious already out. It would be neat to see how an sz style server would do when its only classic then eventually working to kunark then velious

[bakkily]

lets all punch doors in the face? yea! lets do it

[Dekai]

Im all for teams, personally. But the thing that fucking bugs me about two a two team system, is the sort of innate feeling (whether this is ever directly stated or not) that you are enemies with the other team. Even in a game where it's not expressly dictated, that seems to be people's mindset. What was great about VZ, to me, was the dynamic the multiple teams created. You were not necessarily SUPPOSED to attack another team (cept those bastard darkies pre xteaming days =P), but because of guild alliances, personal grudges, or even camp rights, fights or all out wars would break out, and these fights were created and sustained by players and their guilds and personalities. I just feel like the 2 team system is pushing people into the frame of mind where they see someone of the other team an immediately think they're an enemy. Give us teams and let us find out who our enemies or allies might be. And as much as I hated them, bring on some racial pk guilds (HLHF and Illuvitae come to mind). Just more flavor for the server. Anyways I'm not trying to say anyone is right or wrong I'm just super pumped for red99 and wanted to add my 2cp. Hope it made sense im tired!