post-epic weapon choices and bag space, oh my bag space

[Videri]

I just got my warrior epic. Then, as one does, I combined a Summoned: Sword of Runes in the Scabbard, creating Blade of Strategy and Blade of Tactics. I've now banked the Scabbard. I was hoping I could get rid of some other items and free up bag space, but I dunno...see what you think.

Current aggro setup:
MH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_Strategy
OH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_the_Black_Dragon_Eye

Current ramp tank or DPS setup:
MH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Dagas
OH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_Tactics

Now, what can I get rid of, or bank?

1. Can I get rid of my trusty Infestation? https://wiki.project1999.com/Infestation
I intend to use Blade of Strategy mainhand and Blade of the Black Dragon Eye for aggro. Or is Infestation worth keeping around for its stellar low delay and/or 20 PR? Or is Infestation+Red Blade even better? :grimacing:

2. Can I get rid of my Culler? https://wiki.project1999.com/Culler
I have been using it for "DPS" mode, when a mob is being tanked by someone else and I don't want to pull aggro, but I do want to help kill it. Perhaps now I can use Dagas 11/21 + blue blade 14/24 for no-proc, minimal-aggro, maximum damage mode; and bank my cool Culler for ceremonial occasions. Thoughts?

3. Can I get rid of my Bladestopper? 25ac 15sta 50hp shield (secondary only)
I had been using it for rampage tanking. Can I use Dagas + blue blade instead now? Or should I keep Bladestopper because it is, in fact, a shield, and therefore not subject to the AC cap?

4. Can I get rid of my Idol of the Thorned? 10ac 7str 10sta range slot
With red blade equipped, I'm at 211 Stamina unbuffed, so I can hit 255 sta with a shaman buff.
And what HP item should I aim for for the range slot? I have my bow there 99% of the time for pulling/tagging, but after the mob is in melee range, I should swap in something more tanky. I actually have an extra Ball of Everliving Golem, which has 15 hp and 2 resists...maybe I wear that??

5. bonus question: is 2-handed war epic any good for main tank duty? Or only on VS and certain other things? Is the 2-handed damage bonus in play on Green yet or naw?

ty for input, and yes this helps

[Allishia]

Epic 2hand is probably your best agro / surving tank wep. I use it on hard mobs like aow etc, less repo. And it is really good agro. Whenever disc is fading I always swap to epic 2hand.

Infestation is probably better primary and red blade offhand for general agro/tanking. Fast delay weps are awesome for pulling agro and the actual damage doesn't matter, it's swing based agro.

Shield ac matters, keep it for ramp tank with dagas.

Eye of narandi is 40 HP and cheap range.

Hope this helps, have a great day! :)

[bobjonesp99]

the above poster has more playtime and better gear than i do by a country mile, but here is my take:

1) infestation is a great agro weapon and is especially a great weapon for trak. since you are asking about bag space limitations, i would say its time to bank it. id much rather have a spare utility weapon like silken whip of ensnaring / spear of constriction, journeyman's walking stick, truncheon of doom, etc. while the white damage agro on infestation is superior to the red blade (and equivalent BoBDE), it is NOT better than either of those weapons in total agro generation when considering procs; at 255 str/dex and 100% haste the red blade and BoBDE are #3 and #6 agro weapons at the end of the timeline.

2) kinda the same situation as above, i.e. its a decent weapon (staff of battle with stats) and will definitely have less agro (and damage output) then your dagas+blue blade, but you probably should bank it. 10/21 primary and 14/24 secondary with no procs is not excessive threat and you either went in to early or the main tank needs to up his agro setup.

3) even when rampage tanking, i never use a shield /shrug. if i carried a shield, it would probably be one with high resist like shield of rainbow hues for the utility to swap for aoes. your blue blade has better resist and equal hp; even if you arent stamina capped without red blade, you will be soon enough.

4) as the above poster said, eye of narandi is 40 hp and the 4 stamina will take you from 211 - 10 + 4 = 205 which is what you need to hit 255 with riotous health. ive also seen castle at ring wars so its within reach. once your shamans get PE hammers, youll be able to get another 20 stamina. even though its classic, there is no shame in carry a runed bone fork for resist until you get something nicer.

5) the warrior 2h epic is good for something.... it looks cool! really its definetly a space waster 90% of the time. its got a mediocre ratio (lets be honest, its downright bad in velious) and mediocre threat. despite this, for mobs like VS and Draco, who proc lifetaps... its suitable. i feel like it has some utility and the fact that its your epic means you can make an exception and spare the slot.

grats on the epic.

[wagorf]

I am not a fan of destroying, even if I don't use anymore.

1. bank/destroy infestation. while it may be true infestation MH generates better aggro due to lower delay, the difference isn't game changing. Are you really going to dump your precious Blade Black Dragon Eye for some low tier DN weapon that has a piercing animation? i banked mine after i got shissar sword from vp.

2. bank/destroy

3. bank: 25ac is not game changing, it doesn't determine whether i will die or not as RT

4. listen to alli

5. 2h epic is great. it's best 2h aggro and it looks good. listen to alli

[Videri]

Thank you, mighty warriors, for these wise words. And yeah, no destroying Infestation

1. I will indeed keep the Infestation in the bags to use alongside the red blade for Trakanon. And I won't destroy it ever. It will be good for my bank set.
2. I'll bank the Culler. No destroying. Bank set.
3. I'll keep the shield around for now. I'm at 288 worn AC, and the softcap is 289, so that shield AC might matter!
4. Great tip. I would have overlooked that because usually my interaction with Ring War side loot is "TRY TO PICK THE GOOD ONESSSS"
5. Thanks.

And yeah, of course the Runed Bone Fork will stay in my bags. I swap it in frequently, especially after the baddies are within swinging range. Plus, what's a Halfling to do when hungry in the field??

[Jimjam]

If you do have a bunch of items you think you may want to get rid of, instead of destroying thwm you may consider corpsing them. If you have second thoughts you can loot them again for a week, or even get a gm corpse restore if you have later regret?

[Samoht]

Red blade isn't going to be a good offhand because offhand weapons have a 50% proc rate compared to main hand, and the ratio isn't close to the best. Infestation and BotBDE are going to have the same problem.

Red blade is best main hand for end game not just for the hate but for the stats + the hate.

Try researching weapons that have a better ratio with a hate proc and stats for your offhand to go with red blade.

[eisley]

Just get a Willsapper and... whatever and you'll be fine. They kinda made all Warrior weapons really boring for some reason that was never made clear.

Frankly, Jaelen's or Essence Mace or Vyemm Whip probably provide the most eHP and this is a world where offhand aggro isn't going to make or break you at that tier. Just don't fall into the trap of using bad two handers. Herbalist's Spade, though, is amazing.

[Allishia]

Agro definitely matters in raids, not sure on group content since can root most things.

Bis agro that still attainable today is feverblade primary and red blade offhand...on silence mobs bis agro is krezian flame and lady n horn.../nod

Feverblade destroys epic on agro, not even comparable imo and I swore by epic / trident for years till I tried the fever one., It's just that much better in primary whether it procs or not, the white agro is great cause delay

Bis bis agro is scepter of destruction x2.

But if I get lucky on a string of procs lot of times will put jaleen offhand for stat boost :p

[enjchanter]

The best aggro weapon is scepter clicks
Go next

[Ripqozko]

The best aggro weapon is scepter clicks
Go next

yup, hoocars what you have, get in vanquish and have them farm you a scepter to click.

[remen]

I just got my warrior epic. Then, as one does, I combined a Summoned: Sword of Runes in the Scabbard, creating Blade of Strategy and Blade of Tactics. I've now banked the Scabbard. I was hoping I could get rid of some other items and free up bag space, but I dunno...see what you think.

Current aggro setup:
MH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_Strategy
OH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_the_Black_Dragon_Eye

Current ramp tank or DPS setup:
MH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Dagas
OH: https://wiki.project1999.com/Blade_of_Tactics

Now, what can I get rid of, or bank?

1. Can I get rid of my trusty Infestation? https://wiki.project1999.com/Infestation
I intend to use Blade of Strategy mainhand and Blade of the Black Dragon Eye for aggro. Or is Infestation worth keeping around for its stellar low delay and/or 20 PR? Or is Infestation+Red Blade even better? :grimacing:

2. Can I get rid of my Culler? https://wiki.project1999.com/Culler
I have been using it for "DPS" mode, when a mob is being tanked by someone else and I don't want to pull aggro, but I do want to help kill it. Perhaps now I can use Dagas 11/21 + blue blade 14/24 for no-proc, minimal-aggro, maximum damage mode; and bank my cool Culler for ceremonial occasions. Thoughts?

3. Can I get rid of my Bladestopper? 25ac 15sta 50hp shield (secondary only)
I had been using it for rampage tanking. Can I use Dagas + blue blade instead now? Or should I keep Bladestopper because it is, in fact, a shield, and therefore not subject to the AC cap?

4. Can I get rid of my Idol of the Thorned? 10ac 7str 10sta range slot
With red blade equipped, I'm at 211 Stamina unbuffed, so I can hit 255 sta with a shaman buff.
And what HP item should I aim for for the range slot? I have my bow there 99% of the time for pulling/tagging, but after the mob is in melee range, I should swap in something more tanky. I actually have an extra Ball of Everliving Golem, which has 15 hp and 2 resists...maybe I wear that??

5. bonus question: is 2-handed war epic any good for main tank duty? Or only on VS and certain other things? Is the 2-handed damage bonus in play on Green yet or naw?

ty for input, and yes this helps

1) I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the infestation is better agro than the Blade of the black dragon eye. Epic in your main hand and infestation offhand is the best threat set up out those 1 hand weapons.

2) Yes get rid of the culler, it is terrible. The blue blade + dagas will do ok dps due to the worn effect of the blue blade being so good. Long term though, you will want to pick up something with a better ratio and lower delay to put in the main hand. For example, Kreizenn's Flame + blue blade is the best dps set up in the game for warriors.

3) You want to keep a shield, however if you can hit the stamina cap without the sta from the bladestopper you could sell it and use https://wiki.project1999.com/Clay_Guardian_Shield instead.

4) Definitely replace idol of the thorned once you no longer need the stamina. The Eye of Narandi mentioned is a good option, and as a cheaper option there is https://wiki.project1999.com/Sandwich_of_Foul_Smelling_Herbs . It has 10hp more than Eye of Narandi, but in exchange for the AC and other stats narandi eye has. If the sandwich is in your ranged slot you will never eat it so it's safe there.

5) Epic 2h is excellent for main tank duty. The threat it generates is on par with or even better than most 1 hand combos. Additionally, it has great stats with the 100hp, resists, etc. And as mentioned by others, you take less ripostes using a 2h weapon so your damage taken will be reduced by using it.

Hope this was helpful and best of luck!

[Jimjam]

Does a sandwich in ranged slot protect against hunger?

[Videri]

1) I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the infestation is better agro than the Blade of the black dragon eye. Epic in your main hand and infestation offhand is the best threat set up out those 1 hand weapons.

2) Yes get rid of the culler, it is terrible. The blue blade + dagas will do ok dps due to the worn effect of the blue blade being so good. Long term though, you will want to pick up something with a better ratio and lower delay to put in the main hand. For example, Kreizenn's Flame + blue blade is the best dps set up in the game for warriors.

3) You want to keep a shield, however if you can hit the stamina cap without the sta from the bladestopper you could sell it and use https://wiki.project1999.com/Clay_Guardian_Shield instead.

4) Definitely replace idol of the thorned once you no longer need the stamina. The Eye of Narandi mentioned is a good option, and as a cheaper option there is https://wiki.project1999.com/Sandwich_of_Foul_Smelling_Herbs . It has 10hp more than Eye of Narandi, but in exchange for the AC and other stats narandi eye has. If the sandwich is in your ranged slot you will never eat it so it's safe there.

5) Epic 2h is excellent for main tank duty. The threat it generates is on par with or even better than most 1 hand combos. Additionally, it has great stats with the 100hp, resists, etc. And as mentioned by others, you take less ripostes using a 2h weapon so your damage taken will be reduced by using it.

Hope this was helpful and best of luck!

Food for thought! Helps a lot. And man, on our most recent HOT raid, I tried Red Blade mainhand / Infestation offhand; versus Red Blade mainhand / BOTBDE offhand, and I have to say...the Infestation really locked in aggro. :eek:

Smash shared some aggro research/testing results and apparently offhand swings benefit from the "mainhand damage bonus" when it comes to aggro. So that's news to me. So apparently fast weapons are good aggro in the offhand as well as in the mainhand. Less damage, but same "swing" aggro potential. Wow.

And great tip about downgrading my shield. One of my guild's other tanks can get more use out of my Bladestopper, and I can have a Clay Guardian shield as an option for rampaging mobs.

I'm probably not going to have access to Kreizenn's Flame anytime soon. What are some runner-ups for non-aggro high-DPS weapons to pair with Blue Blade?

[Samoht]

I'm probably not going to have access to Kreizenn's Flame anytime soon. What are some runner-ups for non-aggro high-DPS weapons to pair with Blue Blade?

With DPS Procs: Jaelen's Katana, Essence Mace, Dagarn's Tail

No DPS Procs: Dragonrib Club, Silver Whip of Rage, SBoZ, Katana of Pain

[Allishia]

Tradeable one would be swiftblade of zek or blade of carnage.

[remen]

For ideas for a main hand dps weapon, it really depends on your budget and what type of raid items you have access to. In general though, you want something with a good ratio and low delay.

[Philistine]

I see mentions of using Red blade in primary and Infestation in offhand.

Wouldn't Frostbringer be better in offhand? Seems like a better ratio and stronger proc?

To be clear, I'm genuinely asking as I'm looking to dial in my best agro setup too...still trying to figure out how to get the 2hander to perform as advertised! I need to give it a better shot.

[Jimjam]

It is said that even though the off hand doesn’t benefit from damage bonus for damage purposes, it does benefit from damage bonus for aggro purposes.

Perhaps this is why infestation is suggested over frost bringer for offhand. It is faster so applies that damage bonus aggro more often.

[Philistine]

It is said that even though the off hand doesn’t benefit from damage bonus for damage purposes, it does benefit from damage bonus for aggro purposes.

Perhaps this is why infestation is suggested over frost bringer for offhand. It is faster so applies that damage bonus aggro more often.

Thanks for the reply!

Man, that is so weird. Looking at both agro charts I have (which I know are to bw taken with a grain of salt), I do see that Infestation in offhand is slightly better than Frostbringer in one of them. I'll have to give it a go! I really dislike the look of Frostbringer, and would love to be done with it :p

[Keebz]

It is said that even though the off hand doesn’t benefit from damage bonus for damage purposes, it does benefit from damage bonus for aggro purposes.

If true, that might explain why nev's horn is supposedly an amazing off-hand. Do you have a source for that or is it just something you've heard?

[Philistine]

I feel like this kind of thing would have to be parsed really carefully to confirm.

Have someone without procs do X damage, then have tank do damage without procs until the mob turns. Subtract out the white damage and you should be left with misses. Subtract out the base damage of each weapon (do i have that right?) and you should be left with only bonus damage. Subtract out the bonus damage threat from the primary misses and you should be left with any offhand bonus threat.

Would probably need different weapon types in the primary vs. Secondary to be able to distinguish them.

Sounds like a lot of work :p

[Keebz]

How about this for a simpler approach. You could take 2 warriors with the same attack power, have them dual wield identical non-procing weapons, with a slow offhand say a 14/28 Etched Steel Baton. They both auto attack a mob at the same time. The mob should be ping ponging back and forth. Have one tank equip a 9/18 jade mace in the offhand. That tank should eventually take over exclusive aggro if the invisible offhand damage bonus is a thing.

[Philistine]

An interesting idea! Could get a quick idea of whether it seemed accurate. Would need a mob with tooooons of HP to try to overcome sheer RNG.

[Jimjam]

If true, that might explain why nev's horn is supposedly an amazing off-hand. Do you have a source for that or is it just something you've heard?

Just some hearsay. I can’t even remember which server I heard it, but the person that made the claim said someone in their guild tested it.

TBH I wouldn’t be surprised if it were just someone trying to sell that mossy twig offhander telling porkpies to push a sale.

[Allishia]

They did tons of testing on that green turtle with lots of HP...tested all the weps and it was found the nev horn was best offhand agro because white agro from delay...krez flame + nev horn is crazy agro especially on silencing mobs /nod

[Philistine]

Update! Have given the 2hander more of a go and it's worked well! The main challenge I've had with it is that others doubt it and I get a lot of people asking what 1handers I have available (in a kind and well intentioned way, dont get me wrong) :p

It DID do me dirty in a HOT and not proc for like, 4 mobs in a row. That was agonizing.

[Allishia]

Update! Have given the 2hander more of a go and it's worked well! The main challenge I've had with it is that others doubt it and I get a lot of people asking what 1handers I have available (in a kind and well intentioned way, dont get me wrong) :p

It DID do me dirty in a HOT and not proc for like, 4 mobs in a row. That was agonizing.

Ya bug shammy for avatar, helps a lot with procs ;)

[Philistine]

Ya bug shammy for avatar, helps a lot with procs ;)

Thanks for the tip! I had DEX + FOS so I was maxed out on DEX and it was STILL a jerk! Avatar would be nice for buff slots and that attack bonus /drool

[Stonewallx39]

It is said that even though the off hand doesn’t benefit from damage bonus for damage purposes, it does benefit from damage bonus for aggro purposes.

This is super interesting I’m going to set up some testing.

I think beyond Warrior aggro this has implications for offhand weapon choice for classes who are trying not to snag aggro (rangers and rogues) as a slower equivalent ratio weapon in the offhand could substantially lower risk of accidentally grabbing aggro.

[Naethyn]

HP > Weapon Delay > Haste > Rest

[Deadfather]

So if offhand lower delay weapons generate more raw aggro naturally whats better than frostbringer offhand ? Anklesmasher ? (Besides VP and ToV)

[bobjonesp99]

im not sure anyone is really certain unless they can show with some kind of proof that weapon bonus is applied to the offhand as well.

what does APPEAR obvious is that agro is not strictly related to damage done, but more closely related to number of swings. the original white damage agro forumla i have seen is weapon_damage + bonus_damage / hasted_delay regardless of hit or miss.

this is different then the damage formula which is ( weapon_damage * damage_modifier + bonus_damage ) / hasted_delay and generally suggest that weapon delay is more important than weapon damage for generating agro... the same would be true if the damage_bonus applied to the offhand as well (i.e. lower delay is more important than weapon damage).

however, i have never seen any definitive proof that this is the case however (either via code formula or clear cut empirical evidence). like i said, in my experience, i notice that faster weapons seem to generate more agro than equal or slightly better DPS slow weapons.

[Ripqozko]

just get a scepter of forlorn, hoocars what you equip. hope that helps.

[Troxx]

I have seen it mentioned a few times in this thread that warrior epic is the highest threat 2hander for tanking.

I am inclined to disagree.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Frostreaver

Vs

https://wiki.project1999.com/Jagged_Blade_of_War

Both procs are wicked albeit the JBoW is a bit stronger. At 60 with triple attack the white threat generation is huge for good 2 handers and Dain’s axe is quite a lot better on that front. Stats on epic are clearly better … but if your primary goal is aggro my bet is on the Axe. Procs evened out and equal over time I still think the Axe wins and either of them way more than ‘get the job done’ when procs are rolling. Where 2hand tanking can get dicey is when procs elude you for a stretch or roll in late. In those circumstances dain axe will handily outpace 2h epic from the superior ratio.

I dumped my infestation + other proc dual wield combination a long time ago for Dain axe. Much much much better dps and aggro than what I had before all in one package. I knew it would be at least ok for aggro but it blew my socks off just how good it was and have used it as the MT for high end velious targets (Kael/NToV) many times. Best use of dkp ever … scooped it up cheap. Threat was strong enough I would never (ever) get away using as a dps assist weapon on heavy hitting named.

I do not have epic (yet or ever) so I cannot directly compare the 2. If I’m wrong please educate me on the why (axe vs 2hand epic).

If I did have epic I would be very interested to head to head trial red blade and infestation vs Frostreaver.

But yes … I LOVE using a 2h weapon tank setup. DPS is superior, fewer ripostes, strong white damage aggro when procs are stingy and aggro lock when procs are rolling.

[eisley]

So, I think I have what are considered the highest dps setups

Kreizenns flame + blue blade
Jaelens + blue
Gaudralek
scepter of destruction+blue
kreizenns+jaelens

in group content, 2h crushes. not even close. over 10 hours of fighting, gaudralek smokes even SoD.

in raid content, any of the 1h + blue blade seems to win. i think this one is obvious, blue blade gives like 100 atk and these mobs have big ac. Kreizenns flame seems to have a slight edge.

Avatar of course. 255 dex. 4x aob, dain ring.

Most interesting thing I learned is how little of percentage procs make up total damage. Need to test discs more, but with Precision I parsed 87 dps on Brother Zephyl with 2h, 101 with Kreiz+Blue.

need more testing.

also, did some testing of efreeti standard offhand. expect a bug report.

As for 2h aggro... I can't explain it, but Garzicor and Tantor's tusk, after 300 seconds of battle, won every time. Garz proc is odd. Seems inconsistent. Banked all but Gaudralek for now. and Fangol.

[Troxx]

As for 2h aggro... I can't explain it, but Garzicor and Tantor's tusk, after 300 seconds of battle, won every time. Garz proc is odd. Seems inconsistent. Banked all but Gaudralek for now. and Fangol.

??

[Allishia]

So, I think I have what are considered the highest dps setups

Kreizenns flame + blue blade
Jaelens + blue
Gaudralek
scepter of destruction+blue
kreizenns+jaelens

in group content, 2h crushes. not even close. over 10 hours of fighting, gaudralek smokes even SoD.

in raid content, any of the 1h + blue blade seems to win. i think this one is obvious, blue blade gives like 100 atk and these mobs have big ac. Kreizenns flame seems to have a slight edge.

Avatar of course. 255 dex. 4x aob, dain ring.

Most interesting thing I learned is how little of percentage procs make up total damage. Need to test discs more, but with Precision I parsed 87 dps on Brother Zephyl with 2h, 101 with Kreiz+Blue.

need more testing.

also, did some testing of efreeti standard offhand. expect a bug report.

As for 2h aggro... I can't explain it, but Garzicor and Tantor's tusk, after 300 seconds of battle, won every time. Garz proc is odd. Seems inconsistent. Banked all but Gaudralek for now. and Fangol.

Ive been using krez flame + katana. Imo it's better dps then blue blade or equal to it. About to bank blue for more bag room lol.

But yes in group content gaudralek is nuts /nod

[Ripqozko]

Roll a paladin and be better in every way, hope that helps. Sorry you don’t got sods, consider yellow.

[Allishia]

Roll a paladin and be better in every way, hope that helps. Sorry you don’t got sods, consider yellow.

Sorry you don't got
https://i.postimg.cc/59sbkC9Y/allinew.jpg

Bahahaha finally got to get you :p