Jade Chokidai Prod Line - How does it work??

[Teluvian]

I have been hearing a lot of rules regarding the Jade Chokidai Prod line from various people, but I have so far been unable to find the official "rules" for this camp after searching the forums a good deal.

Here are the rules I have heard:
- You may choose to get in line behind the last person in line at any point, at which point you claim a time slot.
- You may AFK at the camp until your time slot, but if you go linkdead, you must be back within 20 minutes or you forfeit your spot in the line.
- You must engage the Chancellor within 2 minutes of his spawn time in your allocated timeslot or you forfeit your kill opportunity.

I have also recently heard these rules:
- You may receive NO help from another player unless they were waiting in line with you the entire time. If two people choose to help each other kill the Chancellor, they both fill up one slot in the line and must wait in line again to get a second kill.

I have many questions regarding all of this.

1.) If someone in the camp line goes linkdead and forfeits their spot, or if the person at the front of the line fails to engage or dies fighting the Chancellor, what happens to the line? Does the next person in line have a right to the kill as if they were in the timeslot all along or does he become FFA at that point?
2.) If you are waiting in line and someone in front of you drops out of the line for any reason, do you automatically move into their timeslot without knowing? Can you willingly keep the original time you signed up for no matter what happens to the line in front of you?
3.) If the rule stated above is true and you are not allowed to receive any help from a player who was not waiting with you in line the entire time (to prevent people that are unable to handle the camp from holding spots in line), then what happens if you are fully capable of soloing the Chancellor, but a friend or someone in line wants to help you anyway to speed things up? How does this work?

[Slave]

It basically follows from the logical rules of the server, modified by the special circumstances of the camp.

Early on you saw some rules stating that you had to be at the keyboard for your 4-hour camp so you could maintain the line and rules, but these days so many people have done it, most camps just say you can stay AFK until the moment of the Chancellor spawn. If he's up for more than 2 minutes, then,

1) the next non-AFK person in line may engage.

2) this is tough because of

3) people who are unable to camp the mob taking up spots in line. The server rules state that you are not considered to be holding a camp unless you can kill the spawn when it pops. But a lot of self-entitled people come by and wait, then their alts or friends come by 5 minutes before the spawn to kill it for them. This was kind of a heartbreaker for the rest of the people in line who are there legitimately, and pretty unfair as well as technically not following true server rules. It's pretty obvious when you can or can't kill it by yourself. Melees have it especially rough but that's the game. They are welcome to go kill other camps and sell or trade their items for a prod. If there's any question at all, they should do it solo or with the other people who have camped with them in the same timeslot. (I have never seen 2 people come claim a camp spot so I don't even know if this has ever even happened.)

Really most of the trouble stems from question 2. And that's because of people who aren't really able to DO the camp taking up spots in line, then failing. People go afk here for 8, 12 hours... well, they typically have AFK messages stating that they want their specific time slot if they are unable to do it any other time, in which case you can simply send them tells about their newfound fortune until their modified Chancellor slot spawns, then it goes to the next person in line, and they keep their original spot. It's actually pretty simple if you just proceed logically.

[BlakeR22z]

Really most of the trouble stems from question 2. And that's because of people who aren't really able to DO the camp taking up spots in line, then failing.

Really? I could have sworn most of the trouble comes from the same 4-5 people camping this for weeks on end taking advantage of some made up rules saying they can afk camp this. God forbid someone bring in a character that actually NEEDS a key.

[Teluvian]

GM just ruled in game: NO RULE AGAINST GETTING HELP FROM SOMEONE WHO WAS NOT WAITING IN LINE. If you want proof, PM me and I can send you the screenshot.

[Haul]

Honestly all of this shit is bluebie as can be, and doesn't even remind me of live either (I played pve and pvp). If it was pvp yall could fight for the camp, not horde it. Or least change the rules. If I was someone gunning for this camp I'd be pissed at how its claimed days/weeks in advance and people bull shit with it and bogart. Its a freakin game and people are treating it like something different. Petition/GM interference should only be for the most dire situations not a regular daily tool in a "game" /endrant- You've just been served.

[Slave]

Honestly all of this shit is bluebie as can be, and doesn't even remind me of live either (I played pve and pvp). If it was pvp yall could fight for the camp, not horde it. Or least change the rules. If I was someone gunning for this camp I'd be pissed at how its claimed days/weeks in advance and people bull shit with it and bogart. Its a freakin game and people are treating it like something different. Petition/GM interference should only be for the most dire situations not a regular daily tool in a "game" /endrant- You've just been served.

I cannot possibly agree more. Every camp needs to have the same rules.

Because: GM just ruled in game: NO RULE AGAINST GETTING HELP FROM SOMEONE WHO WAS NOT WAITING IN LINE. If you want proof, PM me and I can send you the screenshot. goes directly against what GM Hobby stated at this very camp.

So now we have GMs ruling against each other. Who has seniority? Because here it seems like they are going against the very rules of the server now: Camps, Defined: "4. In order to hold a camp, the player or group must be able to demonstrate the ability to hold the camp without further help." http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653

I feel it's pretty clear-cut that obviously underpowered characters can't come in and claim a spot, for this exact reason. They cannot possibly kill the mob on their own. If they think they can, let's see them do it. Otherwise, they were not considered to be holding the camp to begin with and cannot attack the Chancellor.

[Teluvian]

I cannot possibly agree more. Every camp needs to have the same rules.

Because: goes directly against what GM Hobby stated at this very camp.

So now we have GMs ruling against each other. Who has seniority? Because here it seems like they are going against the very rules of the server now: Camps, Defined: "4. In order to hold a camp, the player or group must be able to demonstrate the ability to hold the camp without further help." http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2653

I feel it's pretty clear-cut that obviously underpowered characters can't come in and claim a spot, for this exact reason. They cannot possibly kill the mob on their own. If they think they can, let's see them do it. Otherwise, they were not considered to be holding the camp to begin with and cannot attack the Chancellor.

6. AFK camping is not respected and is frowned upon, if caught afk camping you will be booted to the character select screen.

What about this rule at Chancellor? Everyone seems to have conveniently forgotten this one.

[BlakeR22z]

6. AFK camping is not respected and is frowned upon, if caught afk camping you will be booted to the character select screen.

Also from that link. Do you not realize how ridiculous it sounds for you to be quoting one rule and then ignoring one other rule that is obviously being broken at this camp? You come in and play the role of camp nazi and quote all these rules that are supposedly from Hobby but have absolutely no proof (screenshots, forum posts, etc.) to back it up.

[Surfbum]

So if this camp gets 'special rules' then you cannot claim that a low level that has someone 'assist' in the kill is against the original rules. Players that are simply trying to obtain a key to progress to the next area to kill in shouldn't be hassled by people that are farming said key. What you're doing goes against the basic mechanics of the game. Level with friends, progress and enjoy endgame content is what it is about, not camping the same thing days on end and then complaining when other people try to camp it themselves rather then having to buy it from you 'plat farmers.' If a character waits in line then regardless of how he kills the spawn, as long as it is engaged in the first 2 minutes and eventually killed, then he should be fine.

[Slave]

So you both chose a totally irrelevant rule from the camp rules list where I quoted the most significant one with regards to your problem list that basically explains everything logically.

I guess if you want the line to start stretching to infinity, by all means have your level 55+ alts come in 5 minutes prior to the spawn and kill it for your level 24 monk that is camping it while you 2box your main character. Were you joking or what was going on in your heads there?

The mind diarrhea exhibited by Blake and Teluvian is one of the many reasons the camp needs to be reverted to normal rules asap. Because self-entitled individuals like this will come along and attempt to subvert and bend the rules at every opportunity to the detriment of legitimate campers.

Seriously if you can't kill a level 40 mob what business do you think you have in Howling Stones? And if you can't kill the mob why do you deserve the item to sell? I eagerly await your next fallacious leap of faith required to dispel the cognitive dissonance you must now be swimming in.

[BlakeR22z]

So you both chose a totally irrelevant rule from the camp rules list where I quoted the most significant one with regards to your problem list that basically explains everything logically.

I guess if you want the line to start stretching to infinity, by all means have your level 55+ alts come in 5 minutes prior to the spawn and kill it for your level 24 monk that is camping it while you 2box your main character. Were you joking or what was going on in your heads there?

The mind diarrhea exhibited by Blake and Teluvian is one of the many reasons the camp needs to be reverted to normal rules asap. Because self-entitled individuals like this will come along and attempt to subvert and bend the rules at every opportunity to the detriment of legitimate campers.

Seriously if you can't kill a level 40 mob what business do you think you have in Howling Stones? And if you can't kill the mob why do you deserve the item to sell? I eagerly await your next fallacious leap of faith required to dispel the cognitive dissonance you must now be swimming in.

I couldn't agree with you more about just having the camp like everything else in the game. At least it would make people like you stop creating their own rules for the camp.

By all means, please petition that you think someone was 2-boxing earlier. It will only make you look like more of a tool.

And by the way, all of these "low levels" you are claiming are "level 24 alts" are 50+.

[Teluvian]

So you both chose a totally irrelevant rule from the camp rules list where I quoted the most significant one with regards to your problem list that basically explains everything logically.


You quoted a list of camp rules, choosing one to illustrate your point as to why people "cannot" receive help from another player who was not waiting in line. In your post, you tried to show us how receiving help from another player violates a rule in the list of camp rules. Fair enough.

When we found a rule that is completely contradictory to actions that many people choose to do at the camp (AFK camping), you claim that the rule is "irrelevant". How interesting.


I guess if you want the line to start stretching to infinity, by all means have your level 55+ alts come in 5 minutes prior to the spawn and kill it for your level 24 monk that is camping it while you 2box your main character. Were you joking or what was going on in your heads there?


When did two boxing even become a discussion here? Who is "stretching" now?

You talk about a level 24 monk camping the Chancellor. Let's look at it from the other side of things. What if a level 60 monk was camping the Chancellor and a friend of that monk decides to come and join in on the action? No one will challenge the fact that a level 60 monk could handle the fight. Someone waited in line, someone got a prod. It should make no difference to you in the end how that prod was obtained.

Quit looking for rules to apply selectively that fit your needs.

[Lazortag]

Howling stones sure is sweet though. Sometimes I just afk in the zone and think of how happy I am that I didn't have to deal with all of this drama to get my key. Then again, even if I had to deal with this drama, it still would have been worth it. I think I might start camping the prod and buying all the existing prods on the market so that no one else can enjoy the zone.

[BlakeR22z]

Howling stones sure is sweet though. Sometimes I just afk in the zone and think of how happy I am that I didn't have to deal with all of this drama to get my key. Then again, even if I had to deal with this drama, it still would have been worth it. I think I might start camping the prod and buying all the existing prods on the market so that no one else can enjoy the zone.

You would have to get in line behind all the regulars.

[Teluvian]

Howling stones sure is sweet though. Sometimes I just afk in the zone and think of how happy I am that I didn't have to deal with all of this drama to get my key. Then again, even if I had to deal with this drama, it still would have been worth it. I think I might start camping the prod and buying all the existing prods on the market so that no one else can enjoy the zone.

Well played, sir. Well played.

[Slave]

You are both far, far beneath me both in general reasoning ability and server knowledge, so I will make one last post answering all your illogical and ill-concieved notions, and ask you one final question.

You quoted a list of camp rules, choosing one to illustrate your point as to why people "cannot" receive help from another player who was not waiting in line. In your post, you tried to show us how receiving help from another player violates a rule in the list of camp rules. Fair enough.

When we found a rule that is completely contradictory to actions that many people choose to do at the camp (AFK camping), you claim that the rule is "irrelevant". How interesting.

AFK camping is defined as gaining experience while AFK. Regardless, I also stated in my first post how some groups chose to enforce the rule of having to be at the keyboard for your 4-hour shift. It makes no difference to me. Have it any way you want. I assure you I am fully able to endure 4 hours at the keyboard... or 20.

When did two boxing even become a discussion here? Who is "stretching" now?

Two-boxing, high level guy coming in and killing it for you, it doesn't make a difference (except that the first will get you banned). The functional point here is that you were not able to kill the mob in the first place and so were never considered to be holding a camp slot.

You talk about a level 24 monk camping the Chancellor. Let's look at it from the other side of things. What if a level 60 monk was camping the Chancellor and a friend of that monk decides to come and join in on the action? No one will challenge the fact that a level 60 monk could handle the fight.

Thank you for making my point for me.

It should make no difference to you in the end how that prod was obtained.

Isn't this actually what the debate is about? I see now. You want to be able to come in with your character, who HAS NOT EARNED THE RIGHT to camp the chancellor, (because for whatever reason, you are not powerful enough to kill it) and sit there with the big boys who have all put in many more hours on levels and items than you. Well, guess what? This is a role playing game. Time spent on characters matters. Go figure!

Now I will ask you my question: What business do you have in Howling Stones if you can't kill a level 40 mob? You are attempting to take advantage of the GMs special rule on this camp for your own ends.

I believe you are actually afraid of actually experiencing up to a sufficient level to kill it like everyone else that has paid their dues. If you can't kill it, simply have your friend camp it with you and hold a camp slot together. This is the same rule that every camp in the game has. The fact that you think you should be exempt from following it just in this one case reveals nothing but terrible things about your personal character.

[BlakeR22z]

You are both far, far beneath me both in general reasoning ability and server knowledge, so I will make one last post answering all your illogical and ill-concieved notions, and ask you one final question.

Do you read what you typed? Can you even understand how unbelievably douchey you sound?

[Surfbum]

Slave, I hope one day you re-read your posts and notice how completely stupid you come across with your 'general reasoning ability and server knowledge.' I award you no points, and my god have mercy on your soul..

[Slave]

For those keeping score on the actual issue, that is

Slave: 7
Lowbie Prod Farmers: 0 (although the Billy Madison reference is hilarious!)

[Teluvian]

AFK camping is defined as gaining experience while AFK. Regardless, I also stated in my first post how some groups chose to enforce the rule of having to be at the keyboard for your 4-hour shift. It makes no difference to me. Have it any way you want.


Gaining experience while AFK will result in a BAN. That is not frowned upon, that is forbidden. AFK Camping in the "Camps, Defined" thread deals with claiming that you are still holding a camp while AFK.


I assure you I am fully able to endure 4 hours at the keyboard... or 20.


Congratulations!!! :rolleyes:


Two-boxing, high level guy coming in and killing it for you, it doesn't make a difference (except that the first will get you banned). The functional point here is that you were not able to kill the mob in the first place and so were never considered to be holding a camp slot.

Thank you for making my point for me.

Isn't this actually what the debate is about? I see now. You want to be able to come in with your character, who HAS NOT EARNED THE RIGHT to camp the chancellor, (because for whatever reason, you are not powerful enough to kill it) and sit there with the big boys who have all put in many more hours on levels and items than you. Well, guess what? This is a role playing game. Time spent on characters matters. Go figure!

Now I will ask you my question: What business do you have in Howling Stones if you can't kill a level 40 mob? You are attempting to take advantage of the GMs special rule on this camp for your own ends.

I believe you are actually afraid of actually experiencing up to a sufficient level to kill it like everyone else that has paid their dues. If you can't kill it, simply have your friend camp it with you and hold a camp slot together. This is the same rule that every camp in the game has. The fact that you think you should be exempt from following it just in this one case reveals nothing but terrible things about your personal character.

Did you know something about these cool MMORPG games that we play? Different classes function differently. Some classes are better at soloing than others, even at the same level. I know it is hard to understand, but try.

You act like we are discussing level 20 characters camping the Chancellor, when in fact, we are talking about level 50+ characters. Again, I know it is hard to understand, but some classes have trouble soloing, even at high levels. No one claimed that they are getting the Prod to go solo Howling Stones.

Also, it interests me how you have completely sidetracked from the original discussion on rules and resorted to a (quite funny, I might add) personal attack on the contributors of this thread once you noticed that you were completely contradicting yourself.

[BlakeR22z]

For those keeping score on the actual issue, that is

Slave: 7
Lowbie Prod Farmers: 0 (although the Billy Madison reference is hilarious!)

Are you trolling us? Please just say you are.

[Uthgaard]

This isn't R&F, and you all aren't even contributing anything to a discussion of the topic.
Two threads.
One challenge.

This isn't R&F. Keep the 4 letter words in your pants with your source of angst in equal inches, adding those extra equal signs isn't fooling anyone. Besides, you're just mad I busted you using MQ again. Yeah, I know who you are. Are you angered, my brother?

To the actual topic, if you have a complaint about the way the camp goes, your complaint needs to be side by side with a solution, and the solution needs to fit two criteria. It needs to be better than what's in place, and it needs to have fewer gray areas to connive and exploit. That was the original issue.

This has very little room for manipulation, and is very easy to enforce. Instead of wasting hours per day there trying to sift through the madness, the guides spend minutes every so often.

It doesn't take any special talent to whine like a baby. Join the handful of people here who are throwing out constructive alternatives.

Both turned to shit by people acting like children. If you didn't act like children, you wouldn't exhibit the 'special needs' for a special rule just to address your frothing, rabid, downy rage over loot. Wahh. I fucking have to wait for something. It's eq. Get over it.