AOE in Skyfire

[mwatt]

This post is a combination warning and complaint about how AOE groups in Skyfire can affect an unsuspecting player.

The other day I zoned into SF and ran to the mouth of BW zone area, recalling from Live that this was a good place to pull too, there being plenty of mobs and a few nameds that wander near by. I wasn't there more than a couple of minutes before I was instantaneously being whomped on by a plethora of Wurms, Chromodraks and Wyverns. Needless to day death was swift.

At first I thought, what the heck? Is this a train? I didn't even see it coming. It turns out that it was the result of an AOE group doing it's thing at the BW zone line. I had heard a couple of people say that SkyFire was "no good" because of AOE groups pulling almost the entire zone. At the time, I had mentally written this off as hyperbole.

Now, having had the experience (or the lack thereof, heh) described above, I can see their point. The BW zone line and the area leading to it is a prime experience area for SF. The decision to do massive AOE fighting at this particular point within the zone seems somehow dicey to me. It isn't so much the fact that so many mobs at once are being pulled from the general surroundings, as it is the inherent danger in this type of fighting to passers by and other unsuspecting players.

I could wish that AOE groups would not set up right there and also that they would warn the zone before each mega-pull. As it stands, I actually have trepidation about simply approaching this area of the zone. For this to be understood, perhaps you'd have to have experienced what the experience was like. One moment, it was blue sky and a sunny day - the next moment, without any sort of visual or textual warning was: "WOMP WOMP WOMP WOMP ... loading...".

To be fair, a cleric from the group (groups?) involved did give me a 96% rez, which was nice. On the other hand, that is a 4% experience loss and a helping of aggravation that I don't feel like I had coming.

[Xaleban]

I think pretty much everyone knows this goes on. However 99% of the time there are plenty of mobs left to kill. I would recommend setting up at the OT zone. There is no other safe place in the zone to setup AoE so it wont change. Also I would recommend invising before zoning in as no mobs see invis.

[Pescador]

Actually, many mobs in the zone have a chance to see invis.

Also, SF aoe is the best exp in the game for a wizard and cleric at the mid / high 50s, and unfortunately the BW zone is the only place to set it up.

[Slave]

There is no other safe place in the zone to setup AoE so it wont change.

So what is wrong with setting up an AoE group at the OT zoneline? Since you just suggested someone else could level there. It seems safe to me.

[YendorLootmonkey]

Actually, many mobs in the zone have a chance to see invis.

Also, SF aoe is the best exp in the game for a wizard and cleric at the mid / high 50s, and unfortunately the BW zone is the only place to set it up.

I have never encountered a mob in SF that sees invis, even the guardian wurms/ancient wyverns. Which mobs have a chance to see invis that you've noted?

[Pescador]

I know that while pulling for aoe groups, I usually run song of travel, and every now and then I'll get hit by a chromo dispel or a melee. I'm assuming the highest level of drac / wurm / drake has a % chance to see invis. The invis breaks are almost certainly not caused by social aggro since I run way ahead of the train. I might swing by SF sometime to test this for sure, though.

[Wiz]

QQ elsewhere dum dum

[YendorLootmonkey]

I know that while pulling for aoe groups, I usually run song of travel, and every now and then I'll get hit by a chromo dispel or a melee. I'm assuming the highest level of drac / wurm / drake has a % chance to see invis. The invis breaks are almost certainly not caused by social aggro since I run way ahead of the train. I might swing by SF sometime to test this for sure, though.

I've never had an issue with anything seeing thru Superior Camo in there. However, you have spent considerably more time in SF than I have, so I defer to your experience.

[Tiggles]

Seriously if the group can handle 80% of the zone and you where standing in there camp you deserve to die.


Go root rot somewhere else if there camping the zone.

[Frieza_Prexus]

The BW zone line is the only flat area where you can reliably AE without forcing something under the world. It also has no roamers and gives the puller plenty of room to circle and do his thing.

I've never once been in an AE group that refused to rez and/or buff bystanders. I suspect with C2/haste and other buffs from the group you'd actually level more efficiently than if you had not crossed paths with them.

-Xasten

[Nivar Quartz]

Discussed it with several players now and I played a wizard on live in this timeline, this AE spot was not doable in classic/kunark. Funny how chanters and pet classes ect get the nerf soloing 1 mob at a time, but resists in SF are fubar and AE groups are pulling 5% exp per pull. Guess it really doesnt matter this late after the kunark release.

[Motec]

Resists are fine. It's the fact seb and hs pathing is fu so you have to ae skyfire. When there I'll rez and buff anyone who asks and so will every chanter. What's the problem? Once every 20-30mins there is 40 seconds of risk at bw zone? Compared to every dungeon zone thats good odds.

[Xaleban]

So what is wrong with setting up an AoE group at the OT zoneline? Since you just suggested someone else could level there. It seems safe to me.

Because they go underground and warp thru walls etc.

[Messianic]

This post is a combination warning and complaint about how AOE groups in Skyfire can affect an unsuspecting player.

The other day I zoned into SF and ran to the mouth of BW zone area, recalling from Live that this was a good place to pull too, there being plenty of mobs and a few nameds that wander near by. I wasn't there more than a couple of minutes before I was instantaneously being whomped on by a plethora of Wurms, Chromodraks and Wyverns. Needless to day death was swift.

At first I thought, what the heck? Is this a train? I didn't even see it coming. It turns out that it was the result of an AOE group doing it's thing at the BW zone line. I had heard a couple of people say that SkyFire was "no good" because of AOE groups pulling almost the entire zone. At the time, I had mentally written this off as hyperbole.

Now, having had the experience (or the lack thereof, heh) described above, I can see their point. The BW zone line and the area leading to it is a prime experience area for SF. The decision to do massive AOE fighting at this particular point within the zone seems somehow dicey to me. It isn't so much the fact that so many mobs at once are being pulled from the general surroundings, as it is the inherent danger in this type of fighting to passers by and other unsuspecting players.

I could wish that AOE groups would not set up right there and also that they would warn the zone before each mega-pull. As it stands, I actually have trepidation about simply approaching this area of the zone. For this to be understood, perhaps you'd have to have experienced what the experience was like. One moment, it was blue sky and a sunny day - the next moment, without any sort of visual or textual warning was: "WOMP WOMP WOMP WOMP ... loading...".

To be fair, a cleric from the group (groups?) involved did give me a 96% rez, which was nice. On the other hand, that is a 4% experience loss and a helping of aggravation that I don't feel like I had coming.

I hate to be insensitive (since there are like 500+ other people to be that way on these forums), but QQ more. All I see is that you died once (not twice, not 5 times, not wherever you tried to solo - only in one spot in the zone) - and you got a 96% rez. This is an MMO - if you didn't want to be involuntarily affected by others' actions, you really shouldn't play MMOs like EQ.

Was that really worth your massive wall of text? I really don't think so.

[Dr4z3r]

If you got beat down by the group's train, they probably fucked up & wasted 20 or 30 minutes of their own time, so don't give them any extra guff, eh?

Also, I've never seen a mob of any sort see invis in Skyfire, but I haven't exactly looked for it. Maybe it's just a small-ish % chance.

[quido]

The one mob that I've noticed sees invis several times is an old wurm.

[Ele]

The bard needs the ability to zone and aggro dump the cleric, which in conjunction with the flat ground makes the BW zoneline the only effective area to AoE.

[Nirgon]

Chromodracs I believe see invis and will stomp you out son.

I'd never aoe there. Only time I ever went there was farming spells in front of VP.

[Messianic]

Chromodracs I believe see invis and will stomp you out son.

I'd never aoe there. Only time I ever went there was farming spells in front of VP.

Every Chromadrac i've seen has not seen through invis, even the mature ones.

[Ele]

Chromodracs I believe see invis and will stomp you out son.

I'd never aoe there. Only time I ever went there was farming spells in front of VP.

Every Chromadrac i've seen has not seen through invis, even the mature ones.

It would truly suck if Chromadracs saw invis. :eek: Thank goodness they do not.

[Atmas]

Sorry to downplay your frustration but numerous people AoE group or not fight at zonelines and in most cases that can really only support one person/group anyway. Imagine if you and just one other guy were there and if your pull agroed the other guy or you had to zone a mob and it agroed the other guy.

You also can only be so mad about getting killed if you got a rez and likely buffs immediately afterwards.

[Anger]

Why didn't you just zone out if you were so close to BW?

[Ele]

Why didn't you just zone out if you were so close to BW?

If an AE pull fails, there is no real chance to zone once aggro transfers to you if damage has been dealt to the bunch. Chaining summoning by 50-100 mobs = you don't get far.

[Dantes]

Were you AFK? How did you NOT see a massive gaggle of wurms and simply just get out of the way?

[Bubbles]

Did your train kill a FD class? + 10 pts.

[Messianic]

Did your train kill a FD class? + 10 pts.

+1

[baalzy]

This is basically the only area in the game a wizard is going to find a group 50+ (or to be honest, 10+).

Don't take that away from them.

[Messianic]

This is basically the only area in the game a wizard is going to find a group 50+ (or to be honest, 10+).

Don't take that away from them.

PLEASE, THINK OF THE WIZARDS!

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSLhEo1Q-V2usLxJtoiD358v8nlHU9urkeP0MSmKcRqARLPBglO

[azeth]

^ Harry Potter legos? The owl gave it away, but I originally thought that crystal ball was a SPACEMAN!

[Friday]

As a wizard I politely refuse your request to hinder my xp.

Go group somewhere else and if you ask nice...I'll port you there.

[SupaflyIRL]

^ Harry Potter legos? The owl gave it away, but I originally thought that crystal ball was a SPACEMAN!

No, I'm at work.

[Nocte]

To be fair, a cleric from the group (groups?) involved did give me a 96% rez, which was nice. On the other hand, that is a 4% experience loss and a helping of aggravation that I don't feel like I had coming.

I think you need to investigate how death and rezzes work. You didn't lose even CLOSE to 4% of your total exp.

[SupaflyIRL]

I think you need to investigate how death and rezzes work. You didn't lose even CLOSE to 4% of your total exp.

Yeah with a 96% res you lose 4% of 10% of the exp it took you to gain the previous level; so .04% of your previous level not 4%.

I.e. If it took you 100k exp last level and 110k exp this level you would lose a total of 40 exp in a level that takes 110,000.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here.

[Hamahakki]

Yeah with a 96% res you lose 4% of 10% of the exp it took you to gain the previous level; so .04% of your previous level not 4%.

I.e. If it took you 100k exp last level and 110k exp this level you would lose a total of 40 exp in a level that takes 110,000.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here.

You'd lose 0.4% (not 0.04%) of 100k, or 400 exp. Still a tiny amount.

[Messianic]

You'd lose 0.4% (not 0.04%) of 100k, or 400 exp. Still a tiny amount.

But I was inconvenienced omg

[SupaflyIRL]

You'd lose 0.4% (not 0.04%) of 100k, or 400 exp. Still a tiny amount.

My arithmetic sucks but my theory is strong!

[azeth]

My arithmetic sucks but my theory is strong!

true for 99% of us.

[Nirgon]

It would truly suck if Chromadracs saw invis. :eek: Thank goodness they do not.

99.99% sure they did on live. Porting into Skyfire was a death sentence via the Wizard portal.

[YendorLootmonkey]

99.99% sure they did on live. Porting into Skyfire was a death sentence via the Wizard portal.

Probably because no one invis'd the wizard, and the chromadracs AE dispelled the wizard instantly, and since you're all huddled together for the port, the AE dispell tagged you as well and broke your invis.

[Werlop]

99.99% sure they did on live. Porting into Skyfire was a death sentence via the Wizard portal.

it still is if you don't have a bard to selos you out / train away.

[SupaflyIRL]

true for 99% of us.

OP is in that 1%.

[mastagee]

well, Talendor sees invis, but he doesn't stay alive very long. I believe there is one named mob other than Talendor that sees invis. I'm not sure which one it is though.

[Zarniwooop]

Nm, this doesn't add to the discussion.

[Raavak]

This is basically the only area in the game a wizard is going to find a group 50+ (or to be honest, 10+).

Don't take that away from them.

This is right on. PBAE is a rare case of a wizard actually being "needed".

[Dr4z3r]

I think you need to investigate how death and rezzes work. You didn't lose even CLOSE to 4% of your total exp.

I think you need to investigate reading comprehension. The guy never said "4% TOTAL xp."

[Kassel]

I think you need to investigate reading comprehension. The guy never said "4% TOTAL xp."

You are dumb.

[Dr4z3r]

You are dumb.

no u

[mwatt]

My rejoinder to some of the replies and questions follows.

First of all, regarding the term "QQ". If my post is to be considered QQ then your calling my post QQ is QQ. Users of the term seem to think that just using it makes you cool or gives your statements additional authority. It doesn't. Give me a break. This kind of an attempt to pidgeon-hole an entire post is not even valid argument.

Second, my post was not just a complaint it was also meant to be a warning for others who might inadvertently undergo a similar mishap. I 99% doubt that 99% of people know about the AOE kiting in SF. I 100% doubt that that most know just how quick and unexpected and unavoidable it can be at any given time. The only way to avoid is is not to experience in that general area - and nobody shouted or OOC'd regarding any mass AOE efforts.

To further define what I mean by general area, I reiterate, I do not mean right at the zone line. I mean much further into the zone, where the corridor to the BW zone line widens out into a mouth, and you are almost in the body of the SF zone proper.

To the persons that said I should have known better than to stand with the group or that I should have zoned when I saw the mobs coming:
I wasn't standing with the group nor could I see them from where I was. I wasn't at the zone line and I didn't even see the mobs coming.... I still don't know if they came from behind me or what. I was out in the "mouth" of the corridor to BQ, more into the zone than the group, who apparently were all the way back at the zone line.

Regarding my not alleged stupidity or ignorance because I supposedly thought that the 4% left over from a 96% rez means 4% of total experience. Really? You REALLY thought that was what I meant? And you imply that I am dense.

To the person who claimed my first post was a wall of text:
It was maybe half a page at most and well broken up by paragraphs and white space. There was reasonable sentence structure including capitalization and a period after each sentence. If this is a "wall of text" to you, you must have real problems reading a book.

In the end, although I still consider it a rather selfish over-use of resources, I can live with it, and probably will have to. But I really think it should be announced up front. Just because someone sees a group of people in the zone, it does not mean that said group is doing AOE work.

[Felwithemagi]

I do thank you for the warning. When I reach that level I will be cautious entering that zone. Still think your post was QQ-ing tho.

[fishingme]

way to go, mwatt. You just made every single person who said QQ look like an idiot

[Werlop]

My rejoinder to some of the replies and questions follows.

...and nobody shouted or OOC'd regarding any mass AOE efforts....


In the end, although I still consider it a rather selfish over-use of resources, I can live with it, and probably will have to. But I really think it should be announced up front. Just because someone sees a group of people in the zone, it does not mean that said group is doing AOE work.

[/QUOTE]

Nobody groups there if they aren't doing AE pulls.
That said, most AE groups I've been in will announce pulls so people know 1. not to head their way and 2. that the huge empty areas will be respawning in about 6 minutes.

That said, trains happen all the time. If you have never zoned into a train in Sol B, you're pretty lucky.

Also, an easy way to know if you're going to zone into an AE train in skyfire is to watch for naked people bound outside the skyfire zl in BW. Most groups will persuade the cleric to bind there, and the wizards like to bind nearby so they can port to sell trash loot.

[gprater]

Nobody groups there if they aren't doing AE pulls.
That said, most AE groups I've been in will announce pulls so people know 1. not to head their way and 2. that the huge empty areas will be respawning in about 6 minutes.

That said, trains happen all the time. If you have never zoned into a train in Sol B, you're pretty lucky.

Also, an easy way to know if you're going to zone into an AE train in skyfire is to watch for naked people bound outside the skyfire zl in BW. Most groups will persuade the cleric to bind there, and the wizards like to bind nearby so they can port to sell trash loot.[/QUOTE]

My nightly group has camped there 3-4 times, but we also got trampled a time or 2 by the AE groups. I'm not going to wade in too deep about wrong or right, but it seems that there are many spots near zone walls(not at a ZL) that have the characteristics mentioned in above posts. If you want the big reward of AE grouping then you should take the risk included. About how long does it take to kill a swarm of mobs like that?...why not just do it in the middle somewhere flat....you've rounded them all up anyway...shouldn't be adds.

AND there is HUGE difference in a train in Sol B or anywhere for that matter and purposely pulling mobs to the zone line and potentially through others camps. Back when i played live it was an unwritten rule that you didnt pull through others camps for obvious reasons.

Just my 2c

[Dr4z3r]

It's not possible to kill the mobs anywhere other than the zoneline. The bard must leave SF in order to transfer aggro to the cleric, who holds the mobs in place for the chanters to stun.

[SupaflyIRL]

First of all, regarding the term "QQ". If my post is to be considered QQ then your calling my post QQ is QQ.

Ah yes, the pee wee herman defense.

[Motec]

most peeps doing AE now fail so I dont bother.

That whole risk v reward thing means now people who cant do it, dont have computers for it, or dont have connections for it fuck it for the rest of us sadly :(

[Nedala]

Everybody has the computer for it, if you do the correct changes in your settings b4 you start. Nobody has the right computer for it, if they don't do the correct changes.

[Motec]

I can do it with everything maxxed out just perfectly actually.

Most people dont filter off spells etc though and fail.

[Alarti0001]

Discussed it with several players now and I played a wizard on live in this timeline, this AE spot was not doable in classic/kunark. Funny how chanters and pet classes ect get the nerf soloing 1 mob at a time, but resists in SF are fubar and AE groups are pulling 5% exp per pull. Guess it really doesnt matter this late after the kunark release.

We absolutely could and did do this aoe on live.
The ppl you talked to were misinformed QQ