Whats the difference between earthquake and word aoe spells?

[Drueric]

They both do a small aoe around the caster but earthquake/tremor cost alot more mana, why should I use earthquake for anything? What is the difference that Im missing?

[Jimjam]

Different cool downs, some are cast off items.

[Drueric]

All the aoes have different cooldowns, but earthquake costs more mana and does less damage. I would have though it had some big difference over word spells, like maybe farther range or something, but it doesnt. I see no benefit to using earthquake or tremor in any situation over word aoe spells. Is there something I am missing?

[loramin]

First off, the real answer here is that Clerics only (realistically) use AoE spells during faction pulls, when the damage doesn't matter, or in trash clearing groups (eg. in Plane of Fear) ... where you'll have other real AoE casters like Druids and Wizards (so the Cleric's damage contributions aren't that important).

(Historical Note: AoE experience groups used to be a (huge) thing here on P99. Countless Blue toons "leveled" to 60 by paying to sit in a Chardok AoE group ... back when AoE groups monopolized that zone ... but the staff changed the rules to make such groups impractical.)

However, to answer your question, yes, Earthquake is less mana efficient ... but mana efficiency isn't always your priority. Let's say you're a 44 Cleric, and you just cast Word of Souls. Great, now you're sitting on your hands doing nothing for nine seconds while you wait for the gem to refresh ... or you can cast Earthquake.

If your goal is to be as mana efficient as possible, you'll skip the Earthquake, but if you just want to burn down a mess of mobs as quickly as possible, you're going to cast Earthquake.

[kjs86z2]

faction tagging spell only

[Eagish]

...
(Historical Note: AoE experience groups used to be a (huge) thing here on P99. Countless Blue toons "leveled" to 60 by paying to sit in a Chardok AoE group ... back when AoE groups monopolized that zone ... but the staff changed the rules to make such groups impractical.)...


iirc aoe groups were pretty huge on live in the kunark/velious era. I'm probably misremembering, but seems like there were lots of arguments about how overpowered wizards were because aoe spreadsheets, one mage might be ok to have, and you just need an enchanter for the crack. Maybe don't waste the group space on them, just have them drive by to refresh and stuff.

[loramin]

iirc aoe groups were pretty huge on live in the kunark/velious era. I'm probably misremembering, but seems like there were lots of arguments about how overpowered wizards were because aoe spreadsheets, one mage might be ok to have, and you just need an enchanter for the crack. Maybe don't waste the group space on them, just have them drive by to refresh and stuff.

They happened during the classic era, but were not at all common on most servers (eg. I know some people on Bristlebane did them occasionally in Sebilis in the wee hours of the morning).

But certainly they were nothing like the old P99 Chardok AoE, where the entire zone was (literally) monopolized by AoErs 24/7.

[Drueric]

First off, the real answer here is that Clerics only (realistically) use AoE spells during faction pulls, when the damage doesn't matter, or in trash clearing groups (eg. in Plane of Fear) ... where you'll have other real AoE casters like Druids and Wizards (so the Cleric's damage contributions aren't that important).

(Historical Note: AoE experience groups used to be a (huge) thing here on P99. Countless Blue toons "leveled" to 60 by paying to sit in a Chardok AoE group ... back when AoE groups monopolized that zone ... but the staff changed the rules to make such groups impractical.)

However, to answer your question, yes, Earthquake is less mana efficient ... but mana efficiency isn't always your priority. Let's say you're a 44 Cleric, and you just cast Word of Souls. Great, now you're sitting on your hands doing nothing for nine seconds while you wait for the gem to refresh ... or you can cast Earthquake.

If your goal is to be as mana efficient as possible, you'll skip the Earthquake, but if you just want to burn down a mess of mobs as quickly as possible, you're going to cast Earthquake.

Actually I will just cast another word spell instead of earthquake. I think earthquake was different in classic, but Im not sure. It sounds like you are saying that these spells were nerfed because of an exploit a long time ago.

Earthquake just isnt a little mana inefficient, its ALOT inefficient. Its more efficient to just cast another word spell of a different level. They are on different cooldowns so u can spam it. I can just cast word of spirit and word of souls or whatever back to back and conserve alot of mana.

So basically, there is nothing special about earthquake/tremor types spells. They just plain suck and there no reason to use them, ever.

[Jimjam]

Actually I will just cast another word spell instead of earthquake. I think earthquake was different in classic, but Im not sure. It sounds like you are saying that these spells were nerfed because of an exploit a long time ago.

Earthquake just isnt a little mana inefficient, its ALOT inefficient. Its more efficient to just cast another word spell of a different level. They are on different cooldowns so u can spam it. I can just cast word of spirit and word of souls or whatever back to back and conserve alot of mana.

So basically, there is nothing special about earthquake/tremor types spells. They just plain suck and there no reason to use them, ever.

Your conclusion doesn’t fit your discussion as your discussion fails to address Loramin’s point that sometimes dps is more desirable than dpm.

[Goregasmic]

iirc aoe groups were pretty huge on live in the kunark/velious era. I'm probably misremembering, but seems like there were lots of arguments about how overpowered wizards were because aoe spreadsheets, one mage might be ok to have, and you just need an enchanter for the crack. Maybe don't waste the group space on them, just have them drive by to refresh and stuff.

Chanter isn't for crack, it is for chain stunning the mob pack so casters could not get insta gibbed when the pull came in. At least that's how it was done on live. You kinda need two of them because mobs 50+ start resisting stuns and with one chanter, one resist could wreck your pull. Even with 2 chanters some broke free sometimes. Shitty internet made things worse.


They happened during the classic era, but were not at all common on most servers (eg. I know some people on Bristlebane did them occasionally in Sebilis in the wee hours of the morning).

But certainly they were nothing like the old P99 Chardok AoE, where the entire zone was (literally) monopolized by AoErs 24/7.

I did a couple AE groups on live back in velious/luclin. Mostly chardok and fungus grove(?). The ones I did was usually 2 chanters, 2 wiz, a healer and a puller.

It didn't happen often because it was hard to find 2 chanters and a puller that wasn't ass. That and it was a late night thing because zones were a lot more busy in general so nothing to AE. Easier during luclin because it had more dead zones at that point.

Never did it on p99 so I'm not sure if the technique evolved.

[Drueric]

Your conclusion doesn’t fit your discussion as your discussion fails to address Loramin’s point that sometimes dps is more desirable than dpm.

Yea so, this was my topic and that is my conclusion after hearing the points made. Yea he said that, but didnt give any example. I know it might be desirable to blow all your mana for a hail mary, but you arent gonna have the spell loaded for a "just in case" so any example he would give wouldnt convince me to ever do it. It will always be better to cast back to back word spells. There will never be any situation where earthquake would be preferred.

I also asked what as special about earthquake to justify its ridiculous mana cost and no one said anything, so I can only conclude... nothing. My question has been answered. Thanks all.

[sammoHung]

Earthquake can be used by druids also. For clerics, the Word spells are superior. If you were gathering 12 clerics to PBAE mobs down, you'd use both - but that doesn't happen, so Earthquake sucks for clerics.

[loramin]

Yea so, this was my topic and that is my conclusion after hearing the points made. Yea he said that, but didnt give any example. I know it might be desirable to blow all your mana for a hail mary, but you arent gonna have the spell loaded for a "just in case" so any example he would give wouldnt convince me to ever do it. It will always be better to cast back to back word spells. There will never be any situation where earthquake would be preferred.

I also asked what as special about earthquake to justify its ridiculous mana cost and no one said anything, so I can only conclude... nothing. My question has been answered. Thanks all.

Your conclusion remains incorrect ... although you've mostly got it right.

Maybe it wasn't clear from my post, but while AoE groups are no longer a thing here, AoE in general still happens. A simple example is Plane of Fear: when you want to do Cazic Thule you have to kill everything else first (except charm pets and such). Most guilds use AoE groups to do this, and often Clerics participate.

Now, if you're doing CT, odds are good that you have a lot of folks and are competent. Your pullers probably aren't bringing too many, and you have enough Wizards, Druids, etc. that Clerics aren't necessary (or if they are, Upheaval isn't).

But, raid attendance fluctuates, and if a guild happens to have a low number of AoErs, or pullers who bring mobs too quickly, Upheaval could still be needed to kill the pulls quicker.

P.S. Another example would be faction pulls. Usually you only need one AoE spell to target everything, but sometimes the mobs get spread out, and it can be useful to have secondary AoE options (that you can cast quickly after the first AoE ... before the spread out mobs die).

[WarpathEQ]

Earthquake is a shared spell for druid and cleric so it wasn't being optimized to use for just one class. Its not uncommon to see similar spells where one is far superior to the other, its also an effect on several items.

Use cases were already provided in the thread so no need to repeat them.