Character Question

[Curmudgen]

I am trying to see if there is any consensus on the boards for a shaman question. I will list what he will do, and trying to find out which race best fits.

Suppose this shaman will group, but solo alot. This shaman will reach 60 eventually, but not soon. This shaman will maybe get torpor someday, but maybe not as it's rare. This shaman will have no interest in soloing dragons. This shaman expects to join a guild some day and eventually raid. This shaman will be equipped with at most EC bought items way later after he farms somewhere.

Is this shaman an ogre or a troll?

[Kope]

Is this shaman an ogre or a troll?

Yes :D

Best answer!

Whatever the shaman wants to be, the shaman is.

[baub]

Sounds to me like that shaman is a troll ~

[Rainflush]

I'd say it's a primarily cosmetic decision, which race do you prefer appearance-wise? From what I understand ogres make the most melee-capable shamans, so if you enjoy fighting with weapons that seems like logical choice, trolls of course regenerate their health faster than any other race, the value of which should be obvious. In my opinion the practical advantages of one race over another aren't so significant as to be the determining factor in character creation.

[Excellio]

It doesn't really matter what race you make him, as long as you name him "Dontsqueeze". Because then you'd be "Dontsqueeze the Shaman".

[Galacticus]

Ogre. Anyone who rolls a troll does it for the regen. You wont need it if you aint soloing.

[Taketz]

I'd say it's a primarily cosmetic decision, which race do you prefer appearance-wise? From what I understand ogres make the most melee-capable shamans, so if you enjoy fighting with weapons that seems like logical choice, trolls of course regenerate their health faster than any other race, the value of which should be obvious. In my opinion the practical advantages of one race over another aren't so significant as to be the determining factor in character creation.

Wait, Trolls regen faster than iksar?

[Curmudgen]

Thanks for the replies so far! I am interested only in troll or ogre

[Excellio]

Thanks for the replies so far! I am interested only in troll or ogre

Name him "Dontsqueeze". It will be worth it when people refer to you as "Dontsqueeze the Shaman".

[nalkin]

for shaman you almost have to go ogre, unless you want to be gimp.

[Rainflush]

Wait, Trolls regen faster than iksar?

That is my understanding.

[Rainflush]

for shaman you almost have to go ogre, unless you want to be gimp.

Can you articulate on this? I understand that the accelerated regeneration trolls possess becomes negligible when a shaman learns the Torpor spell, and that an ogre's frontal stun immunity gives them a certain melee advantage and the ability to defeat some powerful enemies (such as the dragons in Western Wastes) by themselves, does the ogre's alleged superiority extend beyond these things?

[nalkin]

Can you articulate on this? I understand that the accelerated regeneration trolls possess becomes negligible when a shaman learns the Torpor spell, and that an ogre's frontal stun immunity gives them a certain melee advantage and the ability to defeat some powerful enemies (such as the dragons in Western Wastes) by themselves, does the ogre's alleged superiority extend beyond these things?

Not really, though ogres have amazing starting stats as well. If those don't matter to you then it shouldn't really matter.

[vageta31]

Can you articulate on this? I understand that the accelerated regeneration trolls possess becomes negligible when a shaman learns the Torpor spell, and that an ogre's frontal stun immunity gives them a certain melee advantage and the ability to defeat some powerful enemies (such as the dragons in Western Wastes) by themselves, does the ogre's alleged superiority extend beyond these things?

Ogres are truly the best shaman. Between original classic and other emu servers I've tried all the classic races. Ogre wins hands down, troll comes in 2nd then it comes down to Barb or Iksar depending on your criteria. Ogre gets by far the best stats (127 sta at creation), and their wis is still higher than a Trolls. Barbs get chosen because they're the only good race and people like their looks. Otherwise they are the weakest.

Even casual players have a chance at a JBB and Iksar's can't use them. Troll's get access to snare clicky necklace, but it's not all that great honestly but it can help at low levels.

However it just comes down to what you like. People will defend their "favorite" Shaman with their own reasons, but subjectively Ogre wins hands down. Only those who've played them will understand. Frontal stun immunity is better than it sounds. The less you're stunned, the more DPS you'll do in a fight. The less times you'll be interrupted during that heal or root. The more str/hps you have without even having to buff with those sweet Ogre stats.

[soup]

I have a high level shaman that is not troll or ogre or iksar, and let me tell you that I would MUCH rather have the stun immunity than the regen.

[XiakenjaTZ]

ogre, no frontal stun also if i remember.

[Kevlar]

barb female.

at least if you want to trade cyborz for all the good raid loots. stun imm means jack squat on raid boss while big barb hooters can sway loot awards.

[bakkily]

i personally enjoy my iksar, but before i played the iksar i was playing a barb shaman, i really do wish i never sold the account to restart a iksar, for one, be 60 now, but iksars arent a bad route, besides we're evil to every race and we hate every race so its sorta fair

i'd say barb or iksar

[isoka]

Go for troll, and worship Innoruuk for the snare necklace.

If you solo or if you group, you will want the hp regen in order to gain more mana. The true shaman power isn't really in its mana pool but his way to regain mana faster than other classes.

For those saying that the stun front immunity means more dps, it's true. But I would say it's casually true. If you are tanking as a shaman because you dps, you are doing it wrong. You'd better root it for 30 mana and avoid the hits (remember, hp = mana), rather than losing potential mana tanking a mob.

So far, I have yet to die due to a front stun.

[vageta31]

For those saying that the stun front immunity means more dps, it's true. But I would say it's casually true. If you are tanking as a shaman because you dps, you are doing it wrong. You'd better root it for 30 mana and avoid the hits (remember, hp = mana), rather than losing potential mana tanking a mob.

So far, I have yet to die due to a front stun.

I'd argue that you're doing it wrong, but since we all have our own playstyle neither of us would be correct.

The true power of the Ogre is that he CAN tank throughout most of his career and it IS better than pure root dotting. Think about the Shaman's powers, he can debuff a mob, buff himself(including haste), has dots and a dog. All of that equals increasing his DPS and decreasing the mobs.

I found that without a doubt it was far more mana efficient to simply slow a mob, throw on a Dot while you tank it with dog helping out. Because you use less mana per fight with this method, and mobs go down way faster, you get far more exp per hour that burning all your mana to kill fewer mobs then medding/canni dancing back to full.

Besides it's kind of embarrassing playing a Shaman that fights like a Druid. Shamans with a huge 2h weapon and lots of hp items can rip it up. If you can hit for 50-60 while hasted, then yes your DPS actually helps out a lot. You hitting for that much, along with dog hitting, along with a DoT.. mob won't survive long enough to do much damage. Especially if it's slowed.

[Extunarian]

I found that without a doubt it was far more mana efficient to simply slow a mob, throw on a Dot while you tank it with dog helping out. Because you use less mana per fight with this method, and mobs go down way faster, you get far more exp per hour that burning all your mana to kill fewer mobs then medding/canni dancing back to full.


I like tanking while soloing as a shaman, and tried to find ways to make it more effective, but the HP's lost - and thereby mana regen lost - never made it more effective than letting the dog tank. Plus once the JBB enters the picture you're only swinging once every 8 seconds at most.

Now, for the most part, the only time I tank is when I get summoned.

[Mardur]

Turgur's + Torpor = more efficient to just tank than waste mana on root / healing pet.

And Troll/Iksar regen is exactly the same.

[Extunarian]

Turgur's + Torpor = more efficient to just tank than waste mana on root / healing pet.

And Troll/Iksar regen is exactly the same.

Yeah...torpor certainly changes the game, when/if you get it.

[vageta31]

I like tanking while soloing as a shaman, and tried to find ways to make it more effective, but the HP's lost - and thereby mana regen lost - never made it more effective than letting the dog tank. Plus once the JBB enters the picture you're only swinging once every 8 seconds at most.

Now, for the most part, the only time I tank is when I get summoned.

My Shaman hit 50 long before Kunark came out so there was no JBB and many things were different back then. However with all the new Kunark items I'd have to think it'd be even easier to use this method than it was before. I mean if I could tank all the way to 50 in pure classic, then with new gear it should be even easier.

I guess the biggest part of all of this is the fun factor. Root dotting is pretty boring... Meleeing with a Shaman is just fun and it never failed to peak people's interests back then. Seeing an Ogre shaman with an FBSS and big 2H going up against Hill Giants in Rathe Mountains was just too fun.

I cringed when I used to see shamans running around with nightshade wreaths, plat arm bands, 6 wis ring, and *gasp* Paw of opolla and CGS with no weapon. At least nowadays most Shamans have weapons in their hands hehe.