Soloing Shaman looking for help.

[Tonden_Ockay]

Hi all

I am looking at getting back into EQ. I used to play it back in the day, but it has been over seven years since I played last. Back then I had all kinds of time to play, however now days I have a lot going on in real life. There for I do not have large amounts of time to be online and any give time. This is why I will mostly be soloing.

I have a friend of mine that is playing an SK and I would like to play a Shaman. I never really played a shaman and it’s been a lot of years since I read much about them.

My goal would be to create a Shaman character like the ones I used to read and hear so much about back in the day. I used to hear that Ogre Shamans could solo things that most other class couldn’t back in Kunark and Velious.

So basically I’m looking for some help in setting my character for success at what I want him to be able to do.

Race: I am going to go with Ogre for the frontal stun and because their starting STA 127 and WIS 77 equals 204 before adding any starting points, which is higher then any other race that can play a shaman.

So I have my class and I have my race. Now I need to know what I should go for more STA or WIS if I want to be like those beastly soloing Shamans of the past (Kunark/Velious days).

Is HP King for a soloing Shaman?
Is AC King?
Where does Wis or Mana fall in the line of things for a Kunark/Velious soloing shaman?

Does it go something like this HP > STA > AC > Mana?

What items should I get or will I need?

Please feel free to post any helpful info you may have to aid me in this.

[Curmudgen]

As I understand it AC is king for the soloing shaman, then HP, then WIS.

[Dirtnap]

As far as I know the frontal stun immunity doesn't work here.

[Psycher]

Ogres cannot get stunned when being hit from the front. But this does not mean you wont get your spells interrupted, there's just a less of a chance.

[vageta31]

Frontal stun immunity does indeed work here.

To the OP:

You chose the correct race, I'd put points into wisdom just to make it easier on yourself during leveling. You already have lots of sta, will no doubt get some in gear form and then with your buff you won't be lacking it. Also I'm not sure if the old rule of having less than 75 agi gives you a penalty, but I usually throw in 5 to get the Ogre to that number. Honestly it's been so long I don't remember what they start with but I'm thinking it's 70.

If you want to be a strong shaman then my biggest suggestion is to play a battle shaman from start to finish. Don't root dot and kite your whole career, learn how to handle fighting a mob that's in your face. It will help greatly down the road for times when things go bad.

If you're poor, just load up on high ac/hp items and fit in mana/wis when you don't lose either of the first two. It's better to get a lot of mana/wis in one slot than it is to spread it. Ie; Better than have 9 wis for gebs versus getting that 9 wis over 3 or 4 slots.

Good items for you to start out with.

Full banded if you're poor.
5ac/55hp rings
glowing bone collar
diamondine earrings
embroidered black cape/sleeves
gatorscale legs
etc...


Anything that gives decent ac and comes with hps is a good piece of equipment for you. Those little 10-15hps per item add up quickly. Grab a big 2h weapon, haste yourself when you get the spell and wade into melee like the big boys.

Whatever you do, don't run around with a book of obulus and a cone... You're not some wimpy caster, you're a GD Ogre Shaman who prefers to settle things with his stick.

[Fate]

I just recently started on this server too and starting to save a bit of money, what weapon should I be aiming for first? I'm using a cracked staff ATM and its pretty lack-luster.

[Tonden_Ockay]

Starting Stats for an Ogre Shaman is

STR: 130
STA: 127
AGI: 70
DEX: 70
WIS: 77
INT: 60
CHA: 42
(with 30 points to spend)

First the AGI is only 70 and you get a nasty negative for having less then 75. However as a Shaman you can and should have buffs to help with this, there for should I spend 5 starting points on taking it to 75?

That said which would be the better way to spend my starting points

Option 1

STR: 130
STA: 127 + 23 = 150
AGI: 70
DEX: 70
WIS: 77 + 7 = 84
INT: 60
CHA: 42

Option 2

STR: 130
STA: 127 + 5 = 132
AGI: 70
DEX: 70
WIS: 77 + 25 = 102
INT: 60
CHA: 42

Option 3

STR: 130
STA: 127
AGI: 70 + 5 = 75
DEX: 70
WIS: 77 + 25 = 102
INT: 60
CHA: 42

Option 4

STR: 130
STA: 127 + 23 = 150
AGI: 70 + 5 = 75
DEX: 70
WIS: 77 + 2 = 79
INT: 60
CHA: 42

Or is there some other combo I should go with?

[Slave]

I made an Ogre Shaman based on the fact that I was going to straight-up solo here with amazing gear, and I had a fungi tunic and superb AC and weapons, etc. I leveled to 54 right around 8 days /played. I went 5 AGI and all the rest into STA, then leftover into WIS.

If I were to do it with a SK friend and no fungi tunic, I would have him be the ogre, and I would be a troll shaman of Innorruk for the snare necklace and regeneration. So pretty much unless you have stupendous gear, it's going to be a very much better bet to make a troll especially because you have a tank friend, rendering your frontal stun immunity useless and leaving you wishing you had regeneration.

[Tonden_Ockay]

I have a friend who is playing an SK but he is a Dark Elf. Pluse for the most part we don't get to play on the same day or at the same time. So I will be soloing (all by my self) most of the time.

[vageta31]

I personally went with option 3 and never regretted it. Even though you can buff agi you still want it to be at least 75 so if you die you aren't penalized when you spawn. Plus its one less buff to keep on you at all times.

You can't really go wrong with either sta or wis but I just chose wis since I played at the early part of the server and free gear wasn't falling off trees like it is now. If I'm not mistaken the highest sta you can possibly get is 255 and with buffs and gear it's not all that hard to hit that number, or at least break 200 if you start at 127.

Either way works. If you're casual then I'd go straight for wis since the extra mana will help you at low levels. If you're a raider then perhaps the wis will be better.

[Tonden_Ockay]

If 255 is max then I would only need 105 more STA (150 unbuffed + 105 = 255) to max it if I put all my starting points into STA.

On the other hand I think a Barbarian Shaman can only have a max of 126 STA (unbuffed) if they put all their starting points into STA. So they would need 179 more STA to max it out. How easy/hard is it to get the 179 STA?

As for Wis I would only have 79 Wis (unbuffed) if I did this so there for I would need another 121 Wis to breake 200. How easy/hard is it to do this?

[Snaggles]

I think ogre is the best choice. Stats are much better and stun immune vs regen is a toss up depending on the situation. Group with a non-uber tank and you will want the stun immune :). Ogres also level a bit faster than trolls/iksars with a lower penalty.

Definitely get 5 agil so you have 75. The rest for most players is better spent in wisdom. Raiders and topor owners get more out of hps but those folks rarely sweat starting points.

Shame your friend made an inky tho, jk.

[mokfarg]

I think ogre is the best choice. Stats are much better and stun immune vs regen is a toss up depending on the situation. Group with a non-uber tank and you will want the stun immune :). Ogres also level a bit faster than trolls/iksars with a lower penalty.

Definitely get 5 agil so you have 75. The rest for most players is better spent in wisdom. Raiders and topor owners get more out of hps but those folks rarely sweat starting points.

Shame your friend made an inky tho, jk.

The cat buff will take care of the agility issue though

As for a 2hdr weapon, I think you will want a gloomwater harpoon, but someone can correct me and I will be okay. :)

[Snaggles]

Yea good point. I was just thinking of avoiding the mana cost at lower levels for dots.

At some point agil will be added randomly. The first 20 levels in banded tho.

[bakkily]

blah ogres...makes good meat to a iksar though =}

ogres make great shamans from what ive seen, no way i can melee on my shaman, but overall on playing alts grouping with a ogre shaman, they're tough! but no matter what for what ever race playing a shaman, the first 20 lvls suck...

[greatdane]

First of all, if a class can do something, they can do it no matter what race they are (excluding shit like tinkering, of course) and your race choice will at most make it a little easier or harder. The legendary guardian wurm-soloing shamans could do so regardless of race, but ogre's frontal stun immunity made it noticeably safer to do so. Play whatever you want, and if what you want is to have a minor edge in the absolute endgame of soloing, go with ogre. For the entire leveling process, troll would probably be a lot easier.

Apart from that, I can't recommend soloing through the lower levels if you're not twinked. The shaman class is pitiful until the 20s and early 30s, and especially awful until level 24. If you can't suit up in top notch twink gear, soloing through your teens is going to be an exercise in frustration. Your dots are almost completely useless, your spells are already expensive even though canni's compensating role isn't available until level 24, and you just suck until you get your key spells at 24, 29 and 34. It was marginally tolerable for me with a full kit of ikky bp, SBS, JBB pieces etc., and I can't imagine anyone starting from scratch will have the sanity to do it. You'll be meleeing most of the way to 20+, and doing that with crap armor and weapons will suck.

As for which stats to focus on, you can almost completely ignore wisdom, especially for soloing. You should never need a full mana pool for a fight, and your mana management is so flexible that sacrificing anything for wisdom is a mistake. Just get it where you can't get AC/HP and you'll be fine. If you're leveling through meleeing, AC will help you the most, and second focus should be HP because it doubles as mana with canni. Getting hit when soloing is unavoidable as a shaman, and you'll simply benefit more from taking less damage than you would from having a uselessly large mana pool

With good enough gear, you can continue to tank when soloing past the point where root-rotting becomes a viable option. My shaman is level 34 and has about 750 AC and 1000 HP unbuffed, so tanking a slowed mob is absolutely trivial. This allows me to solo effectively with just slow and disease dot while my melee and pet kill the mob. It's about as efficient as root-rotting, but it's a lot less annoying because you don't have to deal with as many resists or the randomness of root. Allows me to tab out and browse reddit while grinding, making it tolerable. If you don't have the gear for this, just root-rot, it's a perfectly fine way of soloing all the way. In that case, the only gear that'll make a noticeable impact on your exp rate is regen and, at relevant levels, Jaundiced Bone Bracer. Being a troll helps a lot when root-rotting, not quite so much when tanking. Also, don't use the malo line when leveling. It's for situations where you have to land a certain spell as fast as possible, most commonly slow on raid mobs. When you're just leveling, it's less mana efficient to malo every mob to reduce its resists than it is to just accept the occasional resist. You shouldn't be fighting mobs that are near or above your level anyway, you should be going for the lowest dark blues you can find.

As for Wis I would only have 79 Wis (unbuffed) if I did this so there for I would need another 121 Wis to breake 200. How easy/hard is it to do this?

It doesn't even matter. You shouldn't be trying to reach 200 wisdom, you should just take whatever wisdom comes from slots that can't provide AC, HP, resists or regen. That said, I put my starting points into wisdom because stamina eventually becomes maxable between ogre's extremely high stamina and the huge stamina buffs you can cast later on. Natural starting stamina is 127 and the level 57 buff adds 50, so it certainly becomes maxable in Velious with relatively modest gear, possibly with endgame Kunark gear as well. Mana pool is almost completely useless to classes that have anything else worthwhile to focus on, and especially classes that can manipulate their mana as fluidly as shamans (and necromancers, though they won't get much out of gearing for AC). As a class with almost exclusively high-aggro spells and soloing methods that guarantee getting hit, it's worth gearing for survivability not only because it helps you out more than it would for, say, a wizard, but also because it's a general benefit throughout all aspects of gameplay. Shaman is the only caster that actually can gear to take a thorough beating, so it pays off to do so. Most other caster classes just have nothing else to focus on and go for wis/int because it's the only thing available for most gear slots.

Traditionally, the unspoken rule for shamans has been that around 175 wisdom is all that you need to be able to cast spells unrestrained at level 60, and anything more than that is largely pointless due to how easily you can get mana back. AC and resists make you take less damage, and that translates into mana gained. HP translates directly into mana while also serving as survivability when that's what you need. It was completely common to see fully raid-geared shamans with under 200 wisdom, and if they ended up with more than that, it was because gear eventually came with +20 to all stats and such.

Oh, and put 5 points in agility, you don't want the hassle of keeping your agi buff on yourself every minute of your life. You'll have enough to do buffing other people. I'd put the rest in wisdom, but stamina will be just fine as well, there's no wrong choice there. It mostly depends what you think your final goal will be, and if you don't think you'll ever get great gear, it might be worth investing in stamina. Otherwise go with wisdom since you'll be gearing for other things.

[mgellan]

I can't recommend soloing through the lower levels if you're not twinked. The shaman class is pitiful until the 20s and early 30s, and especially awful until level 24.

Baloney, as soon as a Shaman gets SOW and his DOTs he can solo red mobs - I prefer Barbs so I can easily access Everfrost and BB. Trash til 5, BB til 9, kite mammoth calfs until they go light blue then go right to mammoths until 32. Easy peasy. Go barb!

Regards,
Mg

[mokfarg]

Baloney, as soon as a Shaman gets SOW and his DOTs he can solo red mobs - I prefer Barbs so I can easily access Everfrost and BB. Trash til 5, BB til 9, kite mammoth calfs until they go light blue then go right to mammoths until 32. Easy peasy. Go barb!

Regards,
Mg

But how efficient is that? I could see tons of resist and it taking forever and all your mana to do so

[mgellan]

But how efficient is that? I could see tons of resist and it taking forever and all your mana to do so

Less resists than I expected, and as the reward diminishes the resources expended do also. For example a red calf at level 9 will run you almost dry on mana but also give a ton of xp, at 18 will be 20% of your mana for decent xp.

Regards,
Mg

[Snaggles]

Soloing reds is almost always a horrible exp path. If (big if) you have massive twink gear, a 30ish pt DS, or Regen/Clarity it might make sense.

Low levels your spells flat suck so melee is half or so your damage. Dot/running and hoping not dying isnt as wise as mauling through dozens of blues/black cons. IMHO that is so maybe I don't have the gear or grind spots down to do it.

[Tonden_Ockay]

Question:

Does most of the Kunark HP and AC items that Shamans can wear come with STA on it ?

I ask because if not then it pays to use starting points for STA? If most of the HP and AC items have STA on them that shamans can use then it might be better to go with WIS for your starting points.

[soup]

Question:

Does most of the Kunark HP and AC items that Shamans can wear come with STA on it ?

I ask because if not then it pays to use starting points for STA? If most of the HP and AC items have STA on them that shamans can use then it might be better to go with WIS for your starting points.

There's not tons of STA gear, but the HP returns on STA are very minimal. Many people (myself included) think it's more practical to put starting points in WIS rather than STA.

[Slave]

There's not tons of STA gear, but the HP returns on STA are very minimal. Many people (myself included) think it's more practical to put starting points in WIS rather than STA.

At level 50 I recieved 100 hp for my stamina buff. That's significant.