This mob AEing through walls thing is bullshit

[Abacab]

I'm sorry man but getting wrecked by AoE from groups two or three rooms away is frankly retarded, especially when I'm just sneaking through dungeons and it breaks my hide and causes a train.

For the visual:

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/6493/froooak.jpg (http://img408.imageshack.us/i/froooak.jpg/)

I'm the blue dot no where near the yellow dots (players fighting) and even further from the red dots (wizard mobs) and I can be sitting in a safe hall and out of nowhere I get:

You have been wracked by static winds you take 79 pts of damage!

Which is followed by a long line of "Frrrrooooooooak"

It seems like any mob that can cast can nail you through several walls, doors, floors, ceilings as long as they are within spell range and frankly it's just annoying when you're not even engaging said mobs.

Seriously though fix that shit, even on live I can LoS spells but here if it's going off within the radius of it's cast EVERYONE is going to get nailed, and there is no point in running cause it's going to

A) train

B) continue nuking me down from the lord area all the way to the god damn gargoyles without moving an inch.

[Hasbinbad]

Bug section imo.

Really this is fucked up. To my understanding they had to change the way ae's work because certain guilds would "corner" a boss to use geometry to avoid ae. They changed the mechanic of AE in order to fix that (non-classic, but addresses the problem), but this situation is definitely a non-classic side effect.

Please find another way to deal with "cornering" so that the kind of situation Aba presents doesn't happen. This is extremely non-classic and makes life extremely difficult for small rogues trying to sneak through packed dungeons.

[Abacab]

Bug section imo.

Really this is fucked up. To my understanding they had to change the way ae's work because certain guilds would "corner" a boss to use geometry to avoid ae. They changed the mechanic of AE in order to fix that (non-classic, but addresses the problem), but this situation is definitely a non-classic side effect.

Please find another way to deal with "cornering" so that the kind of situation Aba presents doesn't happen. This is extremely non-classic and makes life extremely difficult for small rogues trying to sneak through packed dungeons.

Well even in live during classic people would wall Nagafen for example to keep the DPS from being mowed down by his AE's and feared off, you can wayback machine old strats and positions and they'll all point to using geometry to negate AE

[Rhalous]

Yes, but solB is an inside zone. So is lguk for that matter. From my understanding, AE should be checking line of sight inside, but not checking line of sight outside. I have no proof of this being classic except from what I remember. I will see if I can find something.

[Finawin]

AEs did NOT go through walls in Classic. That's the whole point of moving mobs to places you could put healers around the corner.

[Uaellaen]

yes i have to side with this post, AEs did not go trought walls in classic, ever ... we always used geometry to protect healers and casters from getting hit ...

[karsten]

yeah, indoors mobs ought to be able to be walled, outdoors not

i do believe rogean has mentioned that he's working on causing it to be such, and in the meantime he's put it as both indoors and outdoors do not check for walls. it's not permanent though JUST HANG IN THERE LITTLE BUDDY

[Abacab]

Can we get a rogue EVADE fix too?

"You have ducked away from combat"

127
128
114
27

LOADING PLEASE WAIT

/g WTF!?

[Abacab]

AEs did NOT go through walls in Classic. That's the whole point of moving mobs to places you could put healers around the corner.

Remember that Dozekar fight in NTOV?

Basically you HAD to wall that motherfucker to kill him

[TheDudeAbides]

I made a post about this a month ago

Pulling as a monk because of this can be a nightmare

I was told it was 'classic"

[Abacab]

I made a post about this a month ago

Pulling as a monk because of this can be a nightmare

I was told it was 'classic"

How is it classic?

Like I said wayback old school nagafen/vox strats or old Dozekar fights and you'll see the placements for non-tank classes are behind walls

[Murferoo]

Bug section imo.

Really this is fucked up. To my understanding they had to change the way ae's work because certain guilds would "corner" a boss to use geometry to avoid ae. They changed the mechanic of AE in order to fix that (non-classic, but addresses the problem), but this situation is definitely a non-classic side effect.

Please find another way to deal with "cornering" so that the kind of situation Aba presents doesn't happen. This is extremely non-classic and makes life extremely difficult for small rogues trying to sneak through packed dungeons.

Maybe Aba should do his research more before eh, Hasbinbad? Oh, sorry, wrong thread. /duck

[Aeolwind]

2 things to remember that emulators don't have that live does: Pushback and solid walls. As a 2nd side note, I killed Nagafen an ass ton, post hate/sky. And not a single wall in solb blocked Nagafen's AE, we even tried pulling him to the bridge once above stone spider... This wasn't an issue on Vox cause if you tried to pull her out of the lair she would glitch, fall into the basement and rape everyone. Same for Innoruuk, VP, & Trak. This wasn't a change I called for without some consensus among sources.

Most AE's in Velious were blockable with the exception of Zlandicar & Yelinak who used a non-LOS ae's. I tried healing Yelinak from the other side of the wall where the golem stood and received a very rude realization.

[Kuld]

People used to wall that shapeshifter fight in Kunark (the dude in ChardokB) to avoid his ae also, I think. Though I don't know if that was avoidance via Z-axis or otherwise.

Mob was called Korucust.

edit: When I did it we'd stick casters downstairs by his guard spawn points, IIRC. In range of the AE but they didn't get hit because of the wall.

[Finawin]

Lol ChardokB isn't Kunark

[L0stman]

The overking's AE did not go through walls. He was original Kunark.

I have absolutely no doubt about this - used to act in a group that farmed him for singed scrolls. The only question I might have is if this was changed - we farmed him nonstop from PoP onward. I assume his AE behavior was the same in Kunark but I cannot state that as a fact.

--edit--

In case someone asks, we were farming the overking for the singed scroll multiquest sale rights.

[Kuld]

I was unsure when CharB came out, that's the only example I could remember from Kunark. I know VS in Karnors had an AE but don't recall if it was avoidable via walling or not (though its an outdoor zone I think so maybe it wasn't).

[Hasbinbad]

How is it classic?

Like I said wayback old school nagafen/vox strats or old Dozekar fights and you'll see the placements for non-tank classes are behind walls
Post said evidence please.

[Reiker]

AEs did NOT go through walls in Classic. That's the whole point of moving mobs to places you could put healers around the corner.

Not completely, in outdoor zones mobs could AE through walls and indoor they could not. This is why raid bosses in outdoor zones were a little more tricky. The problem is that this distinction doesn't work on Emu. I believe before they had it so that mob AEs were blocked by walls in any zone, which made fights like Dracolich much much easier than they were in Classic, as you couldn't wall the AE like you could here. I believe they just reversed this and allowed mobs to AE through walls anywhere.

[Gwence]

Most AE's in Velious were blockable with the exception of Zlandicar & Yelinak who used a non-LOS ae's. I tried healing Yelinak from the other side of the wall where the golem stood and received a very rude realization.

I think you're right on zlandi, however I remember being able to block yelinek ae, their's a spot in back of lair where we would place rotation clerics since he was on a risen platform of some kind their was a dropoff and you could place clerics over the ledge and not get hit with ae. It was a very long time ago and it may have only worked once they put in the extended range focus but I definitely know yeli ae is avoidable.

[zel]

lol Aba Dozekar was not classic, and he wasnt NToV! HoT HoT HoT baby!

[ooantipostoo]

Bug section imo.

Really this is fucked up. To my understanding they had to change the way ae's work because certain guilds would "corner" a boss to use geometry to avoid ae. They changed the mechanic of AE in order to fix that (non-classic, but addresses the problem), but this situation is definitely a non-classic side effect.

Please find another way to deal with "cornering" so that the kind of situation Aba presents doesn't happen. This is extremely non-classic and makes life extremely difficult for small rogues trying to sneak through packed dungeons.


This is classic in my opinion, We would also corner things regardless to avoid AOE, or dealing with a rampage.. This should be fixed.

[Uaellaen]

rampage? i was under the impression the rampage target is always the second person on the hate list and it doesnt require LoS? fuzzy memory thou ><

[Ferok]

rampage? i was under the impression the rampage target is always the second person on the hate list and it doesnt require LoS? fuzzy memory thou ><

A few mobs in velious AOE rampage. Avatar of war comes to mind.

[Gwence]

A few mobs in velious AOE rampage. Avatar of war comes to mind.

That's wrong, on both statements. Avatar uses flurry on his target, I dont think he even has a single target rampage.

[Excision Rottun]

That's wrong, on both statements. Avatar uses flurry on his target, I dont think he even has a single target rampage.

Maybe he meant Vindi?

But he only has single-target rampage, not AoE.

[Gwence]

yea vindi is ST ramp, i cant think of any velious bosses that have ae ramp. In fact Im pretty sure the ae rampage mechanic wasnt introduced at all until Planes of Power expansion. At least I cant remember from my memory any Luclin or Velious mob that ae rampages, if their is one tell me which Im interested!

[Ferok]

That's wrong, on both statements. Avatar uses flurry on his target, I dont think he even has a single target rampage.

Perhaps AOE rampage was later on. You're right about AoW, dunno what I was thinking. Probably getting confused with RZTW or something.

Pretty sure Tormax and Vindicator were both single target. Statue by all accounts was AoW but slowable. I don't recall anything from ToV with a memorable melee other than Vyemm, and Vyemm was only difficult because of the fear.

Edit: Now I'm just wracking my brain trying to remember why "max melee" range was important on any of the giants. I can only remember that being important on a few dragons who had a closer-range aoe and the AE ramp mobs. Perhaps that was just my guildleader forcing us to practice.

[Aeolwind]

Perhaps AOE rampage was later on. You're right about AoW, dunno what I was thinking. Probably getting confused with RZTW or something.

Pretty sure Tormax and Vindicator were both single target. Statue by all accounts was AoW but slowable. I don't recall anything from ToV with a memorable melee other than Vyemm, and Vyemm was only difficult because of the fear.

Edit: Now I'm just wracking my brain trying to remember why "max melee" range was important on any of the giants. I can only remember that being important on a few dragons who had a closer-range aoe and the AE ramp mobs. Perhaps that was just my guildleader forcing us to practice.

Vyemm didn't use fear, he used AE directional knockback & was unslowable till POP and disease slow came out. Vyemm was difficult because of him knocking all your clerics up in the air mid way through a quad and then dropping the hammer on your tank with 6 straight hits + AE damage and making his face explode.

No dragon cept maybe occasionally Lady Mirenilla used fear in North, and her simply cause she was an SK.

Max melee was important due to the fact that some of their hitboxes were so large that you could get the range aggro reduction and literally unload with abandon.

[Aeolwind]

yea vindi is ST ramp, i cant think of any velious bosses that have ae ramp. In fact Im pretty sure the ae rampage mechanic wasnt introduced at all until Planes of Power expansion. At least I cant remember from my memory any Luclin or Velious mob that ae rampages, if their is one tell me which Im interested!

I seem to recall one of the blobs in ST using an AE ramp or a resetting ramp, but I quit raiding for a while around that time. Mainly though it didn't get big play until DON/DOD.

[Aeolwind]

the extended range focus but I definitely know yeli ae is avoidable.

This was the winner. Yeli's AE only reached the doorway in, and the radii went that full distance to his "south" as well. His hitbox was so large you could reach the tank from the gate and be out of AE range.

[Aeolwind]

rampage? i was under the impression the rampage target is always the second person on the hate list and it doesnt require LoS? fuzzy memory thou ><

Classically, rampage targetted the 2nd person to get on the hate list as long as they weren't the first & Only person on the list. Tested and confirmed hundreds of times. FD monks could "mess up" rampage though if they popped up before getting full aggro clear. If the RT died it would go with a random 2-5th-ish person on the hate list (possibly deeper, no threat meters) that was within melee range. If 2-5 were out of melee range(Ranger/Caster) it would recalculate every tick or so and you would see rampage "bounce".

Rampage requires Melee range, LOS was irrelevant.

[Gwence]

North dragons were also not permanently rooted originally, which added to their difficulty quite a bit.

[Ferok]

Vyemm didn't use fear, he used AE directional knockback & was unslowable till POP and disease slow came out. Vyemm was difficult because of him knocking all your clerics up in the air mid way through a quad and then dropping the hammer on your tank with 6 straight hits + AE damage and making his face explode.

Ahh whatever, i just remember it being annoying as hell. There was also a snare or something involved that made running back pretty damn annoying as a melee. I can remember being frustrated with that fight because I spent so little time getting to hit the mob (after he was rooted, anyway.)

Thanks for the clarification on max melee. Good to know.