Starting to question the +/- 8 level dynamic

[mimixownzall]

What's the point? Really?

I get attacked by someone who is 8 levels above me. I spend my entire mana bar and do maybe 30 dmg to them the entire time. I'm easily rooted due to level difference. I'm easily nuked due to level difference. Melee hits are always really high due to level difference.

You guys didn't want it to be SZ rules due to griefing of low levels who had no chance to fight back. Well, it is happening anyways. You got your band of self proclaimed Bballing experts who run around running from blues and higher but feed on the light blues and think they're fucking pros.

I was all for it at first, calling people who wanted the +/- 4 levels pussies. But, after having experienced the 8 level dynamic, I have to say I am starting to lean towards the +/- 4 levels.

Yes, on SZ you had high levels killing you and, no, you didn't stand much of a chance of killing them, or defending yourself with any success. But, at least you didn't have to worry about losing exp and money to these people either. They had to be within 5 levels to lose exp or get coined.

[Syriusly]

I think the answer is in your post, keep +/-8 but lose exp and coin only to +/-4. Although I'm happy with it how it is.

[Cwall]

confirmed mad that he can't kill a shaman with his mage when the shaman has 60% health 60% mana

also mad he can't kill a shaman with 0 mana 20% health with his shaman

also those high melee hits are from my gatorsmash maul bro

[Softcore PK]

What level are you, OP?

[Kungen]

That's life. Sometimes you'll have an advantage and sometimes you won't. That's what makes EQ fun and challenging.

[mimixownzall]

confirmed mad that he can't kill a shaman with his mage when the shaman has 60% health 60% mana

also mad he can't kill a shaman with 0 mana 20% health with his shaman

also those high melee hits are from my gatorsmash maul bro

You further illustrate my point. Yes you had more like 16% hps. I hit you with how many nukes? How much dmg did they do? 10dmg maybe? And you never missed with your maul and hit me for almost max every time. The level difference is huge.


I chose to stop and fight someone red (turns out to be 8 levels higher than me) while you run from blues and higher and only seek out light blues (thus why you turned and chased me). My shaman was close and I could have brought him over and healed my mage, but I wanted to test how I could do against someone who out-matched me in gear and levels. What do you do? Start talking shit like some adolescent who just had their pubes grow in and thinks he's a man.

I was 29 and he was 37. Pretty hard man. Keep up that stellar job of killing light blues. I will be expecting some screens too. Please don't disappoint.

[Softcore PK]

This is very good. I'm really not trying to be mean, but without people complaining about being PK'd it just wouldn't be EQ for me..

[Bockscar]

The level range ensures that people are almost always in range to other players doing the same content. If you're fighting over the rights to some camp or dungeon, it's very unlikely that someone more than 8 levels higher or lower will be trying to claim the same spot. With a 4-level range, that'll happen all the time. Maybe +/- 4 might be decent for the first twenty levels, but after that, it's more trouble than it's worth. The level range is there to prevent PvP only in situations where it serves absolutely no purpose, like a level 50 preventing anyone from leveling in Crushbone.

[Cwall]

You further illustrate my point. Yes you had more like 16% hps. I hit you with how many nukes? How much dmg did they do? 10dmg maybe? And you never missed with your maul and hit me for almost max every time. The level difference is huge.


I chose to stop and fight someone red (turns out to be 8 levels higher than me) while you run from blues and higher and only seek out light blues (thus why you turned and chased me). My shaman was close and I could have brought him over and healed my mage, but I wanted to test how I could do against someone who out-matched me in gear and levels. What do you do? Start talking shit like some adolescent who just had their pubes grow in and thinks he's a man.

I was 29 and he was 37. Pretty hard man. Keep up that stellar job of killing light blues. I will be expecting some screens too. Please don't disappoint.

rofl weren't you the one talking shit in ooc afterward for "almost raping" me?

your mage tried nuking me like 5 times and none of them were whole resists, some were low around 10 damage, others were around 40, and i have 45 fire resist

you could have gated but you got greedy and wanted to kill me because i was already at 60% when the fight started

the only nuke your shaman casted on me hit for 40, which is what, half damage?

i only hit your shaman for max one time(75), 2 of the hits were about 30, and then 3 or so hits were 60.

[mimixownzall]

rofl weren't you the one talking shit in ooc afterward for "almost raping" me?

your mage tried nuking me like 5 times and none of them were whole resists, some were low around 10 damage, others were around 40, and i have 45 fire resist

you could have gated but you got greedy and wanted to kill me because i was already at 60% when the fight started

the only nuke your shaman casted on me hit for 40, which is what, half damage?

i only hit your shaman for max one time(75), 2 of the hits were about 30, and then 3 or so hits were 60.

No, I turned around and saw you were going to attack me. I saw you weren't full hps so I thought I might have a chance if you were only 3 levels above me. I did not know at that time you were a light blue predator. Haha, I got greedy? No. Some people like to face a good challenge. I haven't pvp'd in EQ since 2003 or 04 and am still trying to get my head around it.

You knew weren't in any real danger (though I got you down a lot further than I thought I would); if you had, you would have run. Even with 60% hps I bet you still had more hps than I did - prolly by 200hps.

Like I said, grats on your light blue kills.

[Cwall]

you weren't even light blue

either way the more you bitch about this the more it seems like a pvp server isn't for you

don't say you like a good challenge when you make forum posts crying about there being a good challenge

[JarL]

The fact that you call killing lowbies "PvP" is beyond me and that you downplay the fact that you are 6, 7, or even 8 levels higher than him is laughable. Posts like yours only further illustrate how awful 99% of EQ players are at gaming (as a whole). PvP in EQ is just griefing and that is what the majority of you want to do, any real PvP game that you've played you've probably failed at.

Having said that, I agree with the OP that +/- 8 levels is extreme, but you are looking at it from a 1v1 perspective. Assuming enough people play at launch +/- 8 levels will be just about perfect for open world group PvP that most of us are looking forward to.

[Cwall]

The fact that you call killing lowbies "PvP" is beyond me and that you downplay the fact that you are 6, 7, or even 8 levels higher than him is laughable. Posts like yours only further illustrate how awful 99% of EQ players are at gaming (as a whole). PvP in EQ is just griefing and that is what the majority of you want to do, any real PvP game that you've played you've probably failed at.

Having said that, I agree with the OP that +/- 8 levels is extreme, but you are looking at it from a 1v1 perspective. Assuming enough people play at launch +/- 8 levels will be just about perfect for open world group PvP that most of us are looking forward to.

not sure if you realize that he lost as a mage to somebody with 60% health/mana, then couldn't kill them when they had 20% health and no mana, and then talked shit about it, followed up by a forum post crying about it

[JarL]

Who cares, this post is about the +/- 8 dynamic level range. Whatever sweet whisperings that you two do in your off time is between the two of you. Address the point of his post.

[Tillan]

I agree with OP. +/- 8 levels is too much unless it's a team based server. +/- 4 for an ffa server should be the way it is.

[Cwall]

less pvp is better for a pvp server imo

[Darwoth]

i really hope the developers do not cave and listen to these blue server assholes that will be gone in a month anyway, 8 levels is already tame. sullon had zero, even shitty games like warcraft have no level restriction outside of the level 10 zones, how about pvp enables at level 10 and we have zero level restriction like that instead? stop trying to shit up the server.

i played on RZ until sullon , 4 levels was complete shit for a myriad of reasons.

even if they address the out of range healing issues and so on of the server, nothing is to stop a gaggle of barely out of range players stalking a higher level waiting for them to be low health or coordinating an attack by 3 or 4 players.

the high level has no recourse to protect himself from arising threats in such a system.

you also cant kill annoying jerkoffs that whine about the ruleset attempting to ruin it before it even starts.

[Bockscar]

even if they address the out of range healing issues and so on of the server, nothing is to stop a gaggle of barely out of range players stalking a higher level waiting for them to be low health or coordinating an attack by 3 or 4 players.

I don't think it should be possible to attack someone higher than your range. There should simply never be a situation where one guy can attack the other but not vice versa. It would be retarded to let people follow someone 9 levels higher and just wait until they get low/oom, but it would be just as retarded to openly invite everyone to grief newbies. Simply make the level range absolute except when the dynamic range system takes effect by healing someone or attacking someone within your own range. That'd solve virtually every conceivable problem.

[Billbike]

I agree with OP. +/- 8 levels is too much unless it's a team based server. +/- 4 for an ffa server should be the way it is.

8 level range is proven effective.

Please do not cave to the demands of butt_hurt, shell shocked PvP rookies.

We are only a week or 2 in to beta, the yeast infections will heal themselves through PvP experience and playtime.

[gloinz]

i really hope the developers do not cave and listen to these blue server assholes that will be gone in a month anyway, 8 levels is already tame. sullon had zero, even shitty games like warcraft have no level restriction outside of the level 10 zones, how about pvp enables at level 10 and we have zero level restriction like that instead? stop trying to shit up the server.

i played on RZ until sullon , 4 levels was complete shit for a myriad of reasons.

even if they address the out of range healing issues and so on of the server, nothing is to stop a gaggle of barely out of range players stalking a higher level waiting for them to be low health or coordinating an attack by 3 or 4 players.

the high level has no recourse to protect himself from arising threats in such a system.

you also cant kill annoying jerkoffs that whine about the ruleset attempting to ruin it before it even starts.

this

around lvl 16+ you are gunna do some damage if you dont totally blow to the person who is 8 levels above you (or even higher), you probably won't kill them but you can bug the shit out of them and keep them from pveing since if they hit a mob and you hit them at that time you can probably smoke them

so if they choose war just fight vietcong style, don't go heads up with someone way above you

[Scrooge]

What do you do? Start talking shit like some adolescent who just had their pubes grow in and thinks he's a man.

You just described 90% of the pvp server! Booya haha!

[Aadill]

PvP will solve everything.

[Billbike]

How fun and fair would the PVE server would be, if you could only kill mobs 4 levels above or below you?

Dumb right? Well it's the same concept as this discussion.

[Nerfbat]

The system is fine (minus some oddities where higher level players are being attacked by low levels out of the range and can't fight back). Saying Cwall runs around looking only to fight lowbies is laughable at best. I'm pretty sure every time I've seen him and he wasn't craving my blood he was not only chasing people above his level, but on occasion out of the +8 range (Guk 10/3 never forget the bloodshed...).

-Samwise

[Nirgon]

Wait till the complaints about "they resist everything there should be some kind of risK" shit starts. Or why should a 6 second cast spell do 100dmg where a single 2hander hit does the same?

/roll eyes

4 levels

[mimixownzall]

i really hope the developers do not cave and listen to these blue server assholes that will be gone in a month anyway, 8 levels is already tame. sullon had zero, even shitty games like warcraft have no level restriction outside of the level 10 zones, how about pvp enables at level 10 and we have zero level restriction like that instead? stop trying to shit up the server.

i played on RZ until sullon , 4 levels was complete shit for a myriad of reasons.

even if they address the out of range healing issues and so on of the server, nothing is to stop a gaggle of barely out of range players stalking a higher level waiting for them to be low health or coordinating an attack by 3 or 4 players.

the high level has no recourse to protect himself from arising threats in such a system.

you also cant kill annoying jerkoffs that whine about the ruleset attempting to ruin it before it even starts.

Darwoth, considering your playstyle from the Altergate server, your support of the ability to grief people who don't have a chance of defending themselves successfully is not surprising.

I don't care if they want to keep the 8 level dynamic, hell, just make it no level limit. I only ask they consider making it where you can only coin someone and them lose exp in the +/- 4 range. That is all I am asking.

The bottom feeders can still get their kills on people 8 levels lower than them so they can feel good about themselves while that person doesn't have to worry about losing the coin he is carrying or the level he just gained.

[Yukahwa]

I agree with Mimix or bring the spread down to 4 or 5 levels. One or the other.

Billbike comparing NPC to PC behavior is pointless. Right now it is more like an Ice Giant Magi from perma cruising around Lguk hot spots and wiping out level 40 groups.

[lindz]

Still think it should be Sullon rules - FFA with xp and coin loss with +5/-5 levels.

Yes there is griefing, but you don't lose xp with it.

[Crenshinabon]

ffa lvl range is the most grief oriented thing I have ever heard. Why the hell would anyone want this? Yaaay look another level 40+ chain killing lowbies in Nek Forest.... this is retarded. MAYBE if there were teams to help. FFA and no level range will just be a newbie slaughter grief fest.

Also the +/- 8 lvls is ok. I would prefer 7. Basically if you know someone is 8 lvls above you just run or find friends.
Or just use things you know are tough to resist.

[Darwoth]

Darwoth, considering your playstyle from the Altergate server, your support of the ability to grief people who don't have a chance of defending themselves successfully is not surprising.

I don't care if they want to keep the 8 level dynamic, hell, just make it no level limit. I only ask they consider making it where you can only coin someone and them lose exp in the +/- 4 range. That is all I am asking.

The bottom feeders can still get their kills on people 8 levels lower than them so they can feel good about themselves while that person doesn't have to worry about losing the coin he is carrying or the level he just gained.


lol what was my playstyle? i rarely went seeking lowbs dipshit, and when i did it was because i knew they had a max level main i was hoping they would bring out.

[Billbike]

Yes let's lower the amount of PvP, great idea Yukakawa.

Good job everyone on the QQ, y'all will succeed in turning red a very blue tint.

[Nirgon]

I thought it was a server with the option to pvp not a server that creates every possible incentive to pvp. Let's have pvp gear and ffa ranges. That will certainly be red.

Red, true red, 4 levels. Bud.

Hope your griefing poop socker community turns out for the best. I'm sure it will attract many new players. Cry for grief oriented rule set-> server population dwindles-> cry that server sucks.

[Rushmore]

play better imo

[Galacticus]

Last night at 20 I was stomping level 4s. Ususally as I ran by I just practice my jousting and they die quick.

Dont know why I am able to do that but its not 8+/- range, and there wasnt anyone in zone so I dont think they were attacking anyone to be put in my range lol.

[Palemoon]

That is the danger, that the server just becomes a grief server with a population of 50 instead of a real EQ server with PvP enabled.


I think more of a scaling level range would work better.

+/- 4 levels until 20
+/- 6 levels until 45

and then 8 level spread thereafter

There is definetly a large contingent of people here who play just to grief. They do NOT need to be catered to.

[Crenshinabon]

I like Pale's idea.
or just make +/- 5 and try item loot please =P

[Softcore PK]

Make the first 20 levels VZ and TZ (not VZTZ) rules. Elf, short, human and dark teams. Can group/guild with the other teams, cannot attack own team.

[Pudge]

it is true you dont want newbs getting ganked and discouraged low level.. and here ppl level so slowly it's not like they can say "well i only have to endure this a for a week or two.." like they might on vztz

make it +/- 4 starting at level 1, but at 25 it opens you up to pvp with ppl 6 levels higher than you, and at 35 ppl 8 levels higher than you. it would look like this:


levels 1-24: +4 -4
level 25: +6 -4
level 26: +6 -4
level 27: +6 -4
level 28: +6 -4
level 29: +6 -4
level 30: +6 -5
level 31: +6 -6
level 32: +6 -6
level 33: +6 -6
level 34: +6 -6
level 35: +8 -6
level 36: +8 -6
level 37: +8 -6
level 38: +8 -6
level 39: +8 -6
level 40: +8 -6
level 41: +8 -6
level 42: +8 -7
level 43: +8 -8
levels 44-50: +8 -8

[JarL]

I think most of you are hitting the nail on the head here. The majority of EQ PvP'ers aren't actually looking to PvP - they just want to grief. So lets not cater to them. I like the scaling level range idea.

[Misto]

Said + or - 4 levels b4 this server began.

Unfortunately the overwhelming population of this server is retarded and wants to relive VZ/TZ.

[L1ch]

ITT - WAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[Khurak]

Unsure if this has been said before but can we use ranges similar to what you see on Mobs in PvE?

Ie you can always engage a light blue, deep blue, white, yellow and red mob.
You cant engage a green mob and get exp, loot or anything (kinda like the trivial loot code of the Firiona Vie server).

Would that help in having larger PvP brackets at high level and smaller at lower ?

Mob/Player levels would define color so possibility of PvP.

[Billbike]

Pudge has a good idea.

[Cwall]

bluebies trying to ruin pvp box before it even opens up

[Bockscar]

+/- 8 worked fine on Tallon and Vallon. I suppose the nature of a 4-team server makes it a little less rough, but that's just how it is. Wouldn't bother me if the range was narrower in the low levels, but I don't care enough either way to try and get it changed. As long as it's 8 once it matters, i.e after level 20 or 30. The first 20 levels don't mean enough to warrant pages of discussion imo.

[Tillan]

The first 20 levels don't mean enough to warrant pages of discussion imo.

With the exp how it's going to be, the first 20 levels are making or breaking your server. If people are allowed to grief lower levels, with the ruleset that's in place now, you will see a drastic decline in player base.

Levels 1-20 doesn't take 5 hours like it would elsewhere. That's a 3 week committment to some classes.

Pudge has a great idea.

[Nirgon]

You cant make ranges like -4/+6. -6 / +6, -4/+4.. etc make sense. Being out of range to a higher level until you choose is silly. Either all the way or not at all unless you heal/buff/bardsong a pvp flagged target.

[Bockscar]

Unlike the beta, you won't get a 10 level head start by getting online a couple of hours before the masses. People will level at approximately the same rate except for poopsockers like Salty who won't be seen in PvP until 50 anyway. If you spend any considerable amount of time running around ganking low-levels, you'll get out-leveled yourself. If Rogean cares enough to spend additional time coding a scaling level range, it wouldn't bother me, but I care so little that I'd rather see the server go live a couple of days sooner.

But they should definitely make it so that you can't attack anyone who's outside your range, whether above or below, unless they flag themselves with the dynamic system. And the dynamic system should only apply to heals imo.

[Darksinga]

8 lvls is fine, but attacking a lvl 16 when you're lvl 8 and a lvl 24 being able to kill you is dumb.


Not sure if that's a beta bug or how things are supposed to be, but the custom rule set = dumb imo.

Keep it how it was and just allow it to be a 8 lvl pvp range, why change something that wasn't a part of the game previously? Immy healing/lower lvl bard speed/etc, won't be a problem in reality because there will be no boxing...

Who is going to follow around lvl 50s on a 41 cleric... Come on now...

[lindz]

Who is going to follow around lvl 50s on a 41 cleric... Come on now...


The guilds that keep a bunch of clerics at 41 to give themselves immune healers for raids without a level requirement? Of course it would happen.

[Rust1d?]

So let us have compromise....+/- 5 pvp starts at level 6. Gives people a chance to get a few levels in order to get their feet wet. Not sure what else could be done...

[Yukahwa]

Yeah that is the only situation that OOR stuff really does become an issue, actually.

Level 1-30 are the most important levels if you are talking about creating a server that will actually survive. For these levels 8 level pvp range is no good. Maybe the step to a greater pvp range should be a level 40..or just go simple style and leave it at 4 levels.

[Muaar]

Good thread. I am torn, not sure which option I would like to see. I think that +/-8 killable but only +/-4 can be looted or lose exp would keep the 'fight for camps' dynamic but avoid some exp-griefing that turns people away immediately.

It sucks to have your entire group wiped by another group 8 levels higher that you stood no chance against, but that's everquest. You travel back and fight those bastards. Say you somehow take down a group of players 8 levels higher than you. Does the lower level player get to loot?


4 level range pvp from 1-30, 8 levels after that sounds perfect actually. avoids newbies being griefed and encourages the griefing of established players, something we all love to see. 4 levels might be best.

[Billbike]

The PvP range at max level must be 8+. Anyone who actually played on a PvP server knows this. Otherwise you will have 45 oor clerics healing raids, oor item campers, and most group PvP will have members oor to each other.

If Kunark releases someday. 55 oor to 60?

No.

[mimixownzall]

The PvP range at max level must be 8+. Anyone who actually played on a PvP server knows this. Otherwise you will have 45 oor clerics healing raids, oor item campers, and most group PvP will have members oor to each other.

If Kunark releases someday. 55 oor to 60?

No.

Yes, I agree, that's why I like the idea of +/- 8 levels with the loot/exp loss being in the +/- 4 level range.

[Arclyte]

Why not reduce the penalties/bonuses attributed to level gap vs PCs?

[Yukahwa]

OOR heals are one thing that I think the dynamic pvp range should work really well for.

For levels 1-40 8 level limit is too much. I guess level 50's need to be able to kill level 42's though? Tough call one that one just because 4 level limit works so well otherwise.

[Humerox]

The PvP range at max level must be 8+. Anyone who actually played on a PvP server knows this. Otherwise you will have 45 oor clerics healing raids, oor item campers, and most group PvP will have members oor to each other.

If Kunark releases someday. 55 oor to 60?

No.

This.

If most of you guys complaining had played SZ, you wouldn't be complaining.

:p

[stonetz]

8 is good if xp was faster FFA wouldn't bother me either. At the normal rate it could run everyone off.

[Muaar]

8 level range for sub level 30 with exp loss as a result of pk is asking for people to ragequit the server imo. those people won't be posting on this forum but you probably want them to play anyways.

[Null]

Let us work on the dynamic range a bit more before calling for a different system. It's custom to the server, it has a few quirks but they are being ironed out. Patience dregs!

[Harrison]

i really hope the developers do not cave and listen to these blue server assholes that will be gone in a month anyway

Fact: Most of the whining about anything and everything is from vztzject wannabe "reds" (And subsequently all of the retarded wasted-space bug report posts about shit that is classic that they're too fucking dumb to know about because their entire existence was based on VZTZ)

It isn't the "blues" that will cry their vaginas all over this server in an attempt to get shit changed, it will be the rest that want shit changed in order to better suit themselves and not the whole of the server and its health. I believe a GM from vztz even came in and said this exact thing.

[Envious]

Fact: Most of the whining about anything and everything is from vztzject wannabe "reds" (And subsequently all of the retarded wasted-space bug report posts about shit that is classic that they're too fucking dumb to know about because their entire existence was based on VZTZ)


Truth

[Softcore PK]

harrison why you gotta be all :mad:

[Nerfbat]

Harrison has a script set up where it just clicks on every thread and whines and bitches about people whining and bitching. Then arbitrarily blames VZ/TZ because it helps him sleep at night.

[Pudge]

Let us work on the dynamic range a bit more before calling for a different system. It's custom to the server, it has a few quirks but they are being ironed out. Patience dregs!

most ppl here arent talking about a change to the dynamic range system, just the basic +8/-8 levels of pvp range. as for my own suggestion with the "tiered" level range, i imagined the dynamic system would still be in place as well

[Softcore PK]

The dynamic range system is messed up, though. Needs to be fixed :P

[Rust1d?]

Just make it FFA then.

[casdegere]

I still think thrashing level 3's as a level 10 is pretty lame and cheesy. I Logged on once and made a toon. This one same person was sticking around the newbie area just making life nearly impossible for everyone else starting anew. Laughing, giggling to themselves, building themselves up. Not sure what the point of that is at all. I like the +/- 8 for that reason and perhaps on PVP live this won't happen so much but it does kind of lean to the mentality of the type of players that will be populating RED99. The no-life crowd is going to stock up on cheesy poofs and Dr. Pepper and just grief every lowbie they can, because they can.

However if you get past that and do make a few buds you might win some paypack at some point. The perfect solution should be character based. If you have your toon killing -10s you should be open for +/-10s etc. This would allow for a "laugh" now but QQing later when you, the asshat can't do squat. The good players who go after peeps near their level won't have alot to worry about if they are good.

[Bockscar]

Just have PvP start at level 6. What the fuck is the point of level 2 PvP?

[Lazortag]

Surely it's dumb when a level 10 player griefs a level 2 player, but that should be a reason for the community to police this kind of douchey behaviour, not a reason to come up with some overly complicated system just to prevent this.

I'll play along no matter what system is adopted, but I think +/- 8 is still the best.

[tbox]

2 suggestions

1) make it 4/4 from lvl 1-20 and 20-40 6/6 40-50 8/8

2) make it so there is no coin loot if between more then 4 lvls above victim until lvl 30.


Do we want lvl 10's ganking lvl 3 people who are just trying to buy their first spells but cant because they get ganked over and over?

[Yukahwa]

Anything is better than present. I think it should be 4 levels to 30 if not 40.

[Softcore PK]

Surely it's dumb when a level 10 player griefs a level 2 player, but that should be a reason for the community to police this kind of douchey behaviour, not a reason to come up with some overly complicated system just to prevent this.

I'll play along no matter what system is adopted, but I think +/- 8 is still the best.

this

[Macken]

When i hit lvl 6, i fully intend to kill level 50's or 60s.

I wish anyone being selfish to suggest that i should not be allowed to do this, would consider my feelings.

[Morninx]

When i hit lvl 6, i fully intend to kill level 50's or 60s.

I wish anyone being selfish to suggest that i should not be allowed to do this, would consider my feelings.

second that.. FFA for the win

[gloinz]

Surely it's dumb when a level 10 player griefs a level 2 player, but that should be a reason for the community to police this kind of douchey behaviour, not a reason to come up with some overly complicated system just to prevent this.

I'll play along no matter what system is adopted, but I think +/- 8 is still the best.

this

even though you are against training and using the same reason training should be allowed for why 8 levels should be allowed

[Sorath]

Make pvp ffa and start at level 1 with no safe zones , solves all

[ScaryBadAssholes]

OOR healing is an issue with ANY level restricted pvp.

Anything LESS than 8 levels ensures that people/guilds will frequently have OOR healers present; healers that are almost equal in level to the OOR combatants.

[Harrison]

OOR healing is an issue with ANY level restricted pvp.

Anything LESS than 8 levels ensures that people/guilds will frequently have OOR healers present; healers that are almost equal in level to the OOR combatants.

The dynamic system, when properly done, will deter this. So using it as a reason to not have properly implemented level ranges is not a good argument.

The most sensible way to ensure pvp health(which is very obviously vastly different than it ever was on live because of the manner in which you can already see this "community" handles itself) would be to put in the tiered 4 beginning, 6 mid, and then 8 end-game range.

The people who want FFA, no level range, etc. are just trolling so they can grief. They are terrible and we all know it.

[Yukahwa]

4lvl pvp with dynamic range engaged by heals.

[Softcore PK]

I miss elf team :(

[mimixownzall]

Surely it's dumb when a level 10 player griefs a level 2 player, but that should be a reason for the community to police this kind of douchey behaviour, not a reason to come up with some overly complicated system just to prevent this.

I'll play along no matter what system is adopted, but I think +/- 8 is still the best.

This wouldn't bother me if they didn't take my fkin precious coin while doing it =(

[georgie]

4lvl pvp with dynamic range engaged by heals.

rz style