Egg-shaped pumice, chipped bone rod.

[Vohl]

I'm not able to find these on merchants. Anyone know where I can get my hands on 'em?

[fiegi]

did you try the bazaar?

[Vohl]

They're original content as far as I can tell. Thanks, anyway.

[fiegi]

oh sorry n/m

[Vohl]

Evidence of egg-shaped pumice being in early EQ:

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3641

Note one post dated December, 2000 stating that appeared to have been removed from merchants. I recall a nerf on the pumice to add a casting time as well -- it used to be instant-click. This was part of classic monk PvP survivability gear. Pre-Kunark, monks were decent DPS and AC, but lousy resists.

[Lasher]

Doubt you will see egg-shaped pumice but thats just my opinion.

Looks like the direction this server is going is for it to be classic but with removal of stuff that was considered game breaking or OP.

Anyways just my opinion.

Dont bann me

[Cwall]

Considering Rogean mentioned that legacy items would be in(manastone, lustrous russet, etc.), I would imagine egg-shaped pumice would be in for at least a little while.

[lethdar]

Hopefully its not, egg-shaped being everywhere makes pvp garbage.

HURRRR SPAM OFF ALL OPPONENTS BUFFS. Autoattack until they lose their 800 unbuffed hp or 1 shot them.

[Toomuch]

Lethdar (or anyone) do you remember Herb, the evil gnome rogue on SZ? He ran around with like a bag full of golem wands, a fungi, and epic, back when those were all by far Best in Slot? Yeah that guy was stupid. As I recall, he quit playing when they nerfed golem wands, either the recharge or the cast time (or both, don't remember). It was a testament to how freaking OP instacast debuff is. I vote for no, because if they are in, how about just disable buffs on the server? Obviously, that's retarded, and so is allowing people instacast full debuffs. They were nerfed/removed for a reason.

Then again, along that logic, manaburn, 30 minute super-harmtouch, and lifeburn were all ADDED. Meh.

Classic (version Intelligent.0) ftw.

[Sorath]

pumic needs to be in game, obviously your choice in drugs in bad.

[Envious]

Egg shaped was one of the things that made classic PvP so fun.

Easy counter for it is jboots. /shrug.

[lethdar]

Obviously the counter to instacast 2 slot dispells that you can carry backpacks of around is a 1 slot instaclick that only works outdoors.

Moron.

[Mardur]

Devs know egg-shaped pumice is classic and left it out intentionally. I hope it stays this way as that item is broken from a PvE standpoint and COMPLETELY broken from a PvP standpoint.

Make sure you're checking the right vendor in regards to chipped bone rods, those should be in afaik. If you find a bug, search the PvP bug forum and then report it.

[fiegi]

Egg shaped was one of the things that made classic PvP so fun.

Easy counter for it is jboots. /shrug.

Hope this is a troll. If not - Fishbait material, wheres salty

Egg Shaped Pumice takes a lot of strategy out of pvp - keep it out

[Darksinga]

So you can leave out egg-shaped pumice, yet make it so every time a sk dies his harm touch refreshes?

Can't pick and chose what you like and don't like and base that how the server will be... damn QQing noobs

BTW, if the "nerfed" version of the egg-shaped pumice is in game, the version with a cast time, it is practically the same thing as http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3644 ... not sure why all these kids are crying

[lethdar]

Totally right darksinga, I mean, we do need to go full retard with everything being 100% classic right? Necro pets need to be unstoppable gods, prenerf treant fists must be in with instaclick heals, players should be kicked to login screen instantly when fear/charm lands, dragons should suicide when hit by melee, and so on.

Moron.

[fiegi]

Pretty sure 75% of the time darksinga ends up with his foot in his mouth after posting.

[georgie]

someone fill me in what is the difference of said pumices

[lethdar]

Egg shaped has no cast time, meaning you can spam it over and over to remove all of a players buffs and there's nothing they can do about it. See a bard outdoors? Remove all his buffs then click it once every 3 seconds when selos refreshes and melee him down. Pretty awesome when rogues who know what they're doing will kick the ass of bards in outdoor zones amirite? Very popular with brain dead morons.

Crystalized has a 3 second cast time. This still gives you the option of dispelling dots on yourself and allows you to dispell players, but is somewhat counterable should you go through the effort of getting instant cast junk buffs. There's also several more complexities that are added in via pumice/buff management and intelligent play that stems from using these that rewards good players and punishes bad ones (Lachius, Darksinga).

[Sniperfire]

i dont personally like them deciding one thing HAS to be a certain way cause it was classic and then deeming other things classic but game breaking so leaving them out seems like a slippery slope

[Envious]

Lethdar too hardcore for Pumice.

This shit should be in game. Was part o classic PvPs.

Eh, forgot... Sullon wasnt classic PvP.

[Toomuch]

All I have to say is, if this shit's in game, I'm rolling bard, and I'm getting a group of melee's and a druid/wizard, and we're just going to run around ganking the absolute shit out of people all day. Everybody clicks once, no buffs, GG we win.

Matter of fact, keep it in. All you turds cheering for it be ready.

[Envious]

I spent years playing with it.

Lethdar wants it out of game, and Golem wands in game, because he is willing to spend hours camping a dispel clickable. Then will excuse it as being "developing his characters ability" or something similar. That farming gear is part of the game, but buying items off a vendor that was part of classic EQ, is not.

Guy is a heterosexually challenged person. (That ok for forums? Dont wanna use the bad word.)

Toomuch, did you play classic EQ PvP? And no, Sullon does not count.

[Envious]

http://youtu.be/_6wzsIh93qc

[Toomuch]

I started EQ late, admitedly. I started when kunark was the current xpac, a couple months later Velious came out, but I was bouncing around servers as a newbie with friends. Spent a little time on TZ, Terris-Thule (hated blue), then found Sullon Zek, and it was home.

So no, I missed that phase. Maybe I'm just bitter because I was on good team and never had easy access to golem wands, so I was only ever getting shit on with spam insta dispells, but seriously... that shit is imbalanced. It ruins people's fighting chances. I don't want golem wands in either, because it's stupid. No matter if it takes time to farm or not, it's OP as hell and doesn't belong on something they are trying to make into a decent server. Yes, they are going "classic", but there's plenty of sploits and broken shit that they aren't reverting to, simply because it's not in the best interest of the server.

Insta click spammable dispell is NOT in the best interest of the server, in my not so humble opinion.

[Envious]

It ruins people's fighting chances.

Makes everyone chances more equal imo... you get jumped with pants at ankles by someone that spent 15 minutes buffing... blow 3 or 4 pumice and its all equal.

Above post was edited about 15 times trying to get it to embed... then found out only RnF... then failed to get it to work there. Anyway. Good shits.

[Vohl]

The current state of the game is pretty biased toward casters. A root or snare landing means game over for any monk, rogue or warrior. Pumice was the classic answer to that tactic. The classic answer to any warrior, monk or rogue was to strafe three steps as they run at you. Keep in mind that this server is pre-Kunark. Weapon drops that make melee truly dangerous in PvP are largely missing from red99.

[Bockscar]

Crystallized pumice does the job of giving everyone access to a dispel. Unlimited storebought insta-click dispel is so gamebreaking that I fully expect the server to launch without Egg-shaped pumice. Insta-pumice would basically remove the concept of duration-based spells from the game, especially at this point in time where, unlike back then, everyone knows everything and is prepared to rake in every conceivable advantage. I'm not a huge fan of golem wands either, but the important difference here is that they're not sold with unlimited supply in every town all over the game world. Anyone can and will run around with two bags full of pumice. They won't have two bags full of golem wands.

[Darwoth]

costs 300p to buy back a wand, so minimum of 600p each time you blow one if you are reacharging them.

this is largely different than a 15p instagib for all buffs/dots/snare/roots, i played during egg shaped pumices and the playerbase was different back then, in spite of being freely available maybe 1 in 8 people had them and the majority who did would only have one or two.


13 years of playerbase evolution would completely change the dynamic of combat into a shitfest with what amounts to free instant dispel.

[Envious]

Insta-pumice would basically remove the concept of duration-based spells from the game

Not really, play in groups, learn cast times, bury duration magic spells, watch them strip their own buffs.

You guys are going to be upset with the no-lifers like Lethdar having a golem wand EVERY TIME YOU FIGHT them. While your stuck trying to channel a 3 second cast through a quadding pet, perhaps 3 pets, with no skill while being nuked.

[Darwoth]

Not really, play in groups, learn cast times, bury duration magic spells, watch them strip their own buffs.




lol, if i can drop 100p and have 35 instant cast charges of nullify magic it will take me all of about a half a second to burn one and fully strip whoever i am fighting, now since i have 2 slots open if someone dots me i can hit my instant cast telescope and then blow one charge of instant pumice and you just wasted a few hundred mana without even slowing me down.

sure i guess we could all "play in groups" and just zerg everything in sight, but i dont find that enjoyable and neither does anybody who does not suck asshole, and whether in groups or not is completely irrelevant to the argument that 3p a charge instant nullify removes duration effects from pvp..

[Envious]

I dunno, its something I enjoyed during classic.

Maybe I used it better? Or was able to take advantage of it? You sound like you were on the receiving end of the pumice. /shrug.

Btw, 2 ppl = group =/= zerg. Can theory craft all day, I think Rogean has already stated it wont be on server. Doesnt mean it shouldnt be.

[Darwoth]

i can deal regardless of what they do, did fine while it was in and did fine after it was removed. however on a server 13 years later and with this community it would simply ruin the entire pvp dynamic.

[Rust1d?]

Things like the Guise (which is not game breaking) should be fine for the game. Insta-click dispells/gates are just too much IMO. I would take pre-nerf necro pets over insta click debuffs.

[Lasher]

the 1k gate pots i dont have an issue with, i will enjoy see someone clikc a 1k potion

[Rust1d?]

If they are that much, I do not see a huge issue with it. Keep it expensive.

[Gnar]

This shit should not be in regardless of whether it was stated or not. 6 people in a group click once and totally strip someone, snare, melee assist and its over and the fight took no time OR skill. Make people camp wands and ct pots, it adds for some fun pvp in CT.

[Gnar]

the 1k gate pots i dont have an issue with, i will enjoy see someone clikc a 1k potion
yeah lol i think those should be in too

[taakyn]

^^^^ would be foolish to allow egg shaped pumice in game. Shit is way op. I have no problem with golem wands as they have been on every version of the box and while they do make huge differences in big guild battles they have to be camped and I believe they are lore?? Anyway having an endless supply of insta click dispell is ridiculous.

[Juugox2]

all those posts are near kunark release on zam

[Vohl]

Right. The posts talk of egg-shaped pumice being removed right around Kunark launch. This is pretty good evidence that the stuff was original content.

[Sorath]

Changing somthing from classic because it is deemed uncool or unfit is all based on opinions, how can you mold classic to your liking?
do it the old way, haters gonna hate regardless.

[Massive Marc]

I'm sure I'll get raged on, but you could

A: add a cast time or cooldown on it ?
B: make it lore ?
C: Make it expensive to buy from the vendor ?

Are any of those options viable ?

[dusk883]

egg shaped pumice availability is something we need a decision on. This determines my class in game IMO.

It's a retarded item in the end, takes any thinking out of the game and shouldn't be in game. However, I couldn't care less if it's in or out...but it's need to know info IMO.

[Envious]

So funny the ones that want it out the most are the same ones that will be farming golem wands for days on end.

[Massive Marc]

So funny the ones that want it out the most are the same ones that will be farming golem wands for days on end.

I dont see this as being a bad thing.

Farming for items that give you an advantage in PVP seems logical.
Buying vendor items that create imbalance in game is a problem.

When it comes down to it, I'll play by whatever rules. I'll have to adapt.

[Bockscar]

So funny the ones that want it out the most are the same ones that will be farming golem wands for days on end.

So stop them, using PvP. You can't stop them from buying a thingy from a vendor that never runs out.

[dusk883]

BTW, if the "nerfed" version of the egg-shaped pumice is in game, the version with a cast time, it is practically the same thing as http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3644 ... not sure why all these kids are crying

^ weak argument, IMO. Timed pumice is nowhere near the same as an instant clicky. The whole pumice thing changes pvp dynamics entirely. Gotta get a decision from management if it's in or out.

[Gnar]

So funny the ones that want it out the most are the same ones that will be farming golem wands for days on end.

agree with chuck, get this guy hooked up with salty ASAP. perfect fishbait material

[Gnar]

I'm sure I'll get raged on, but you could

A: add a cast time or cooldown on it ?
B: make it lore ?
C: Make it expensive to buy from the vendor ?

Are any of those options viable ?

Adding a cast time would only turn it into regular pumice. Making it lore would still make group PVP useless, everyone hits the bard and then its game over. C would be the only viable option, but more people would just camp CT wants for the fun PVP that would ensue for basically the same item. Keep it rare to have, and reward those who fight for it. Its better just to keep it out, farm and fight for your PVP gear that is really what EQ is all about.

[Massive Marc]

Its better just to keep it out, farm and fight for your PVP gear that is really what EQ is all about.

Thanks for breaking down my question. It makes sense. I agree 100% with the statement above.

[Darksinga]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

2. I just don't get how GM's can make some ridiculous shit in game while not put other ridiculous shit in. For instance, SK Harm Touch refresh on death?

3. Why is fear/charm not in game for the benefit of CC classes yet SK's get a free refresh timer instead of waiting it out? I see major exploitation here. Kill Group A, die at your bind to fresh HT, go pwn Group B with the same Harm Touch... Umm?

4. Pure melees are going to receive it in the butt to a single earth elemental pet because they can't channel. Come on guys, you all have seen how earth pet root lasts 18-24 seconds, GG.

5. Solution: Make the pumice one charge, pillage enchantment, instant cast and lore. If a pet is on you, you can pell your root and maybe get away with some jboots and strafing.

6. This also adds more dynamic to DOT classes, remember these before you could have a million fukn pumices to pell all their dots?? Maybe druid/necro damage will be viable for once and you actually have to use STRATEGY to determine when you want to burn your pumice. Or hey maybe you actually have to mem the cast version of dispell instead of going to your 24 pumices in Bag 1,2, and 3???

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?

8. For the sake of Classic, let it be classic. Get rid of this "dynamic pvp system," let immy healing/bind rushing/corpse camping/etc etc be in the game because they were in on live and they added their OWN dynamic.

9. QQ Less, L2P Better.

[fiegi]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

2. I just don't get how GM's can make some ridiculous shit in game while not put other ridiculous shit in. For instance, SK Harm Touch refresh on death?

3. Why is fear/charm not in game for the benefit of CC classes yet SK's get a free refresh timer instead of waiting it out? I see major exploitation here. Kill Group A, die at your bind to fresh HT, go pwn Group B with the same Harm Touch... Umm?

4. Pure melees are going to receive it in the butt to a single earth elemental pet because they can't channel. Come on guys, you all have seen how earth pet root lasts 18-24 seconds, GG.

5. Solution: Make the pumice one charge, pillage enchantment, instant cast and lore. If a pet is on you, you can pell your root and maybe get away with some jboots and strafing.

6. This also adds more dynamic to DOT classes, remember these before you could have a million fukn pumices to pell all their dots?? Maybe druid/necro damage will be viable for once and you actually have to use STRATEGY to determine when you want to burn your pumice. Or hey maybe you actually have to mem the cast version of dispell instead of going to your 24 pumices in Bag 1,2, and 3???

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?

8. For the sake of Classic, let it be classic. Get rid of this "dynamic pvp system," let immy healing/bind rushing/corpse camping/etc etc be in the game because they were in on live and they added their OWN dynamic.

9. QQ Less, L2P Better.

Sounds like your are QQ'in up a storm here. Practice what you preach and you might be taken serious son.

[Darksinga]

Sounds like your are QQ'in up a storm here. Practice what you preach and you might be taken serious son.

Why don't you quit trolling and post some viable feedback/opinions?

You and your band of pals do nothing but cry about how this server shouldn't be classic.

Also, I play a bard, pumice doesn't affect me too much and in fact makes it HARDER for me to fight people. Instead of QQing about it, I support it because it was classic and added a great dynamic to pvp.

[fiegi]

Hope this is a troll. If not - Fishbait material, wheres salty

Egg Shaped Pumice takes a lot of strategy out of pvp - keep it out

No trolling going on in here chief. Theres my advice/feedback. Learn to read idiot.

[Darksinga]

No trolling going on in here chief. Theres my advice/feedback. Learn to read idiot.

So saying "Leave it out" is really a valid point? Are you that stupid that you can't defend your opinions?

[fiegi]

So saying "Leave it out" is really a valid point? Are you that stupid that you can't defend your opinions?

What part of "takes a lot of strategy out of pvp" did you not understand? You are a waste of my time and talent goodbye.

[Mardur]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

Let's not limit our view of this issue to only the first week or two of launch.

2. I just don't get how GM's can make some ridiculous shit in game while not put other ridiculous shit in. For instance, SK Harm Touch refresh on death?

Insta-cast pumice cheapens every single PvP fight every time everywhere. You're not going to be guaranteed of a SK HT bind rushing you down every single time you engage in PvP. That said, I wouldn't mind making HT timer persist after death. No one's really arguing that so I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up.

3. Why is fear/charm not in game for the benefit of CC classes yet SK's get a free refresh timer instead of waiting it out? I see major exploitation here. Kill Group A, die at your bind to fresh HT, go pwn Group B with the same Harm Touch... Umm?

Hey man you can't make #3 just a rewording of #2, you're breaking the rules of ordered lists! See above.

4. Pure melees are going to receive it in the butt to a single earth elemental pet because they can't channel. Come on guys, you all have seen how earth pet root lasts 18-24 seconds, GG.

Get resists, play better, etc. There's solutions to this but no solution to the cheapness of insta-pumice.

5. Solution: Make the pumice one charge, pillage enchantment, instant cast and lore. If a pet is on you, you can pell your root and maybe get away with some jboots and strafing.

I don't care if egg shaped pumice is lore and 1 cast, but now we're entering the territory of completely altering items just for the hell of it. There's no point in putting a custom item in when you can just go camp golem wands.

6. This also adds more dynamic to DOT classes, remember these before you could have a million fukn pumices to pell all their dots?? Maybe druid/necro damage will be viable for once and you actually have to use STRATEGY to determine when you want to burn your pumice. Or hey maybe you actually have to mem the cast version of dispell instead of going to your 24 pumices in Bag 1,2, and 3???

This is where it gets interesting because you're starting to argue against your own stance on insta-pumice.

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?

Sure, because he just wasted at least half a minute doing that.

8. For the sake of Classic, let it be classic. Get rid of this "dynamic pvp system," let immy healing/bind rushing/corpse camping/etc etc be in the game because they were in on live and they added their OWN dynamic.

If you don't like the dynamic PvP system, there's a thread for that, and this one isn't it. Try to stay on topic with your inane rambling.

9. QQ Less, L2P Better.

Good advice.

[Sorath]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

2. I just don't get how GM's can make some ridiculous shit in game while not put other ridiculous shit in. For instance, SK Harm Touch refresh on death?

3. Why is fear/charm not in game for the benefit of CC classes yet SK's get a free refresh timer instead of waiting it out? I see major exploitation here. Kill Group A, die at your bind to fresh HT, go pwn Group B with the same Harm Touch... Umm?

4. Pure melees are going to receive it in the butt to a single earth elemental pet because they can't channel. Come on guys, you all have seen how earth pet root lasts 18-24 seconds, GG.

5. Solution: Make the pumice one charge, pillage enchantment, instant cast and lore. If a pet is on you, you can pell your root and maybe get away with some jboots and strafing.

6. This also adds more dynamic to DOT classes, remember these before you could have a million fukn pumices to pell all their dots?? Maybe druid/necro damage will be viable for once and you actually have to use STRATEGY to determine when you want to burn your pumice. Or hey maybe you actually have to mem the cast version of dispell instead of going to your 24 pumices in Bag 1,2, and 3???

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?

8. For the sake of Classic, let it be classic. Get rid of this "dynamic pvp system," let immy healing/bind rushing/corpse camping/etc etc be in the game because they were in on live and they added their OWN dynamic.

9. QQ Less, L2P Better.


I have to agree 100% with Darksinga and anyone who does not agree disagree's and is unagreeable to my degree of agreeing.

IT SEEMS THERE ARE UNKNOWN FORCES AT WORK HERE BENDING THE WILL OF THE CLASSIC EVERQUEST RULEST,ITEMS CLEARLY, FEAR CLEARLY, CHARM CLEARLY.

[Darksinga]

Let's not limit our view of this issue to only the first week or two of launch.



Insta-cast pumice cheapens every single PvP fight every time everywhere. You're not going to be guaranteed of a SK HT bind rushing you down every single time you engage in PvP. That said, I wouldn't mind making HT timer persist after death. No one's really arguing that so I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up.



Hey man you can't make #3 just a rewording of #2, you're breaking the rules of ordered lists! See above.



Get resists, play better, etc. There's solutions to this but no solution to the cheapness of insta-pumice.



I don't care if egg shaped pumice is lore and 1 cast, but now we're entering the territory of completely altering items just for the hell of it. There's no point in putting a custom item in when you can just go camp golem wands.



This is where it gets interesting because you're starting to argue against your own stance on insta-pumice.



Sure, because he just wasted at least half a minute doing that.



If you don't like the dynamic PvP system, there's a thread for that, and this one isn't it. Try to stay on topic with your inane rambling.



Good advice.

Thank you for some viable feedback unlike the other trolls in this thread.

First off, however, I have to disagree with some of your points. Your main argument is that an egg-shaped pumice is "cheap." You stated that because of the "cheapness" of an egg-shaped pumice it shouldn't be in game. First off, Everquest was NEVER a game of balance, that's what made it good and retarded as hell at the same time. If we were arguing for the sake of "Cheapness," MANY and I mean MANY things shouldn't be in the game. For the sake of how things ran on classic, however, I have to argue that it should be in game. Shouldn't we be able to feel true nostalgia when playing EQ pvp? As others have stated, there are many great memories with "Cheap," things like egg-shaped pumice, charm, and fear. One of the stories that stood out most was charming some one and putting them under the water.

I don't think egg-shaped pumice should remain in the game for the entirety of the server, but at least should be a viable part of the game for a few months, I think the devs should just follow a SoE timeline, put in changes over time, a true progression server. Some things are just dumb about EQ, but a lot of it made it so there was strategy required. EQ pvp was almost never what you fools got used to on VZTZ. It was never having full raid buffs and ROFLstomping, it was strategy. And if egg-shaped pumice will combat those gank squads rolling with full raid buffs I say leave it in for now, you can always take it out later.

[Sorath]

bicker about balance, whine about op items, bicker about balance, basically haha,,,basically,,,hahaha...... Why even play this retarded game, I hear wow is still running?

[Lazortag]

Why not just keep Egg-shaped pumices in, but don't allow them to be recharged (similar to Ivandyr's Hoop)?

[Knuckle]

People are simply mentally retarded, nothing more, nothing less.

Why was egg shaped pumice removed from live? Not because it was overpowered, because it was overpowered and people became aware of it.

Knowledge on classic EQ was a rare commodity.

classic EQ emu has the entire community aware of what can be abused in pvp and what can't. the golem wand has the same function as egg shaped, is lore, and requires a time commitment to acquire, that's called balanced. Powerful items shouldn't be a cheap purchase off a vendor.

If people can't use their brain to understand that the world is not cut in black and white then you need to die in a fire.

[Lasher]

Why not just keep Egg-shaped pumices in, but don't allow them to be recharged (similar to Ivandyr's Hoop)?

it cost what like 6p from a vendor? wont matter if you can recharge for a good amount of time if they were to be put and follow nerf time line

[Mardur]

Thank you for some viable feedback unlike the other trolls in this thread.

First off, however, I have to disagree with some of your points. Your main argument is that an egg-shaped pumice is "cheap." You stated that because of the "cheapness" of an egg-shaped pumice it shouldn't be in game. First off, Everquest was NEVER a game of balance, that's what made it good and retarded as hell at the same time. If we were arguing for the sake of "Cheapness," MANY and I mean MANY things shouldn't be in the game. For the sake of how things ran on classic, however, I have to argue that it should be in game. Shouldn't we be able to feel true nostalgia when playing EQ pvp? As others have stated, there are many great memories with "Cheap," things like egg-shaped pumice, charm, and fear. One of the stories that stood out most was charming some one and putting them under the water.

I don't think egg-shaped pumice should remain in the game for the entirety of the server, but at least should be a viable part of the game for a few months, I think the devs should just follow a SoE timeline, put in changes over time, a true progression server. Some things are just dumb about EQ, but a lot of it made it so there was strategy required. EQ pvp was almost never what you fools got used to on VZTZ. It was never having full raid buffs and ROFLstomping, it was strategy. And if egg-shaped pumice will combat those gank squads rolling with full raid buffs I say leave it in for now, you can always take it out later.

The problem though is that egg-shaped pumice totally negates an integral part of the game (buffs). Everything you've been comparing this to has just not been a fair comparison. For example, I'm totally cool with allowing charm and fear, because you have something you can do about it: resists, los, or interrupt. If you get charmed or feared it's because either your resists were lacking, you failed to interrupt a crucial spell, failed to get away, or you just got an unlucky resist roll. This is, in my opinion, in the spirit of the game. Landing a charm, being near water, and having the game prescience to /pet sit someone under water to drown them, although extremely powerful, is tactical. The person you charmed COULD have prevented their demise. But fear/charm isn't the topic of this thread, egg-shaped pumice is.

The problem is that egg shaped pumice completely removes any duration effects from the game. And there's nothing you can do about it. If you enter pvp with buffs, they're gone, instantly, guaranteed. Now, I know classes aren't balanced in PvP, but egg pumice throws the balance even more out of whack. When clerics / enchanters / shamans / any class that highly relies on duration effects were being conceptualized, the developers weren't thinking "well egg shaped pumice is in the game so we need to give these classes something to balance that out."

Example: If you roll a cleric, spend the time to level her up to 44, pay 12 platinum for a peridot, and expend 315 mana, you can bestow upon someone an additional 525 hp. This can be countered by any level 1 toting an egg shaped pumice, and they'll have charges left to spare.

Try to reason how that should be on this server.

Just because "EQ was never a game of balance" doesn't mean we have to put all kinds of crazy shit in that makes it less enjoyable for the vast majority.

[Sprinkle]

dunno why people yap about egg shaped pumices

golem rods were overpowered by alot more : )

but you newbs dont even know what those are do you

[Sprinkle]

and whats with you 2 losers having celebrities as your avatars , are you guys groupies or just wanna-bees

if that pic isnt you , dont use it as your avatar , and while im not a cat , its just a cat as my pic

look at knuckles pic , him and his whole crew picked megaman chars , very cute

thats what your supposed to do

[Massive Marc]

You must suffer from a mental deficiency ?

Your comments are adding nothing to the current conversation (which is interesting btw)

People are aware of golem rods (if you read the thread, you'd know)
Worry about people avatar somewhere else.

Pretty much everything you typed is dumb and useless.
Try to be productive.

[Sorath]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=3641

http://emu.pwned.com/showthread.php?2282-Bring-back-Egg-Shaped-Pumice


http://mqemulator.net/item.php?id=14513

http://eq.magelo.com/item/14513

[Sprinkle]

You must suffer from a mental deficiency ?

Your comments are adding nothing to the current conversation (which is interesting btw)

People are aware of golem rods (if you read the thread, you'd know)
Worry about people avatar somewhere else.

Pretty much everything you typed is dumb and useless.
Try to be productive.

hey look another idiot with someone elses pic in his sig , maybe you posted to tell me you are a groupie for the guy with the gun

do you have a gun? i do : )

[Massive Marc]

Please, stick it in your mouth and pull the trigger.

[Sprinkle]

said nullify on those sites , if it was pillage on super super classic , i never saw it

golem rods were standard in kunark and im pretty sure it was nerfed by then , so asking devs to add the super classic stuff probably wont work , cause the 2 classic servers arent classic at all

they are just old world era eq servers ( Which im cool with )

[Lazortag]

it cost what like 6p from a vendor? wont matter if you can recharge for a good amount of time if they were to be put and follow nerf time line

Why wouldn't it matter? Eventually the server would run out of them unless Salty find a way of duping them.

[Sprinkle]

salty duping stuff , basically hahahaha

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/6316/funnypicturesyesiknowyo.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/11/funnypicturesyesiknowyo.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

[dusk883]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

As a casual player, I'll have 100pp before I hit level 5. Not being able to afford multiple pumice isn't going to be an issue for most.

[lethdar]

Why wouldn't it matter? Eventually the server would run out of them unless Salty find a way of duping them.

Yeah, I'll run out of them once i burn through loading entire accounts filled with 16 backpacks of them... 1024 per account.

[lethdar]

1. No one is going to have 100 plat to blow on multiple pumices, most likely you will have around one, and you won't be able to even get one till around level 30 with you blowing all your money on spells, armor, etc...

2. I just don't get how GM's can make some ridiculous shit in game while not put other ridiculous shit in. For instance, SK Harm Touch refresh on death?

3. Why is fear/charm not in game for the benefit of CC classes yet SK's get a free refresh timer instead of waiting it out? I see major exploitation here. Kill Group A, die at your bind to fresh HT, go pwn Group B with the same Harm Touch... Umm?

4. Pure melees are going to receive it in the butt to a single earth elemental pet because they can't channel. Come on guys, you all have seen how earth pet root lasts 18-24 seconds, GG.

5. Solution: Make the pumice one charge, pillage enchantment, instant cast and lore. If a pet is on you, you can pell your root and maybe get away with some jboots and strafing.

6. This also adds more dynamic to DOT classes, remember these before you could have a million fukn pumices to pell all their dots?? Maybe druid/necro damage will be viable for once and you actually have to use STRATEGY to determine when you want to burn your pumice. Or hey maybe you actually have to mem the cast version of dispell instead of going to your 24 pumices in Bag 1,2, and 3???

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?

8. For the sake of Classic, let it be classic. Get rid of this "dynamic pvp system," let immy healing/bind rushing/corpse camping/etc etc be in the game because they were in on live and they added their OWN dynamic.

9. QQ Less, L2P Better.

1) You're a moron, plat is ridiculously easy to get on p99, anyone who cares can have 1000s by lvl 10.

2) Prenerf treant fists must be added for classic immersion sake! Also, every dupe that existed at the time. Got be 100% classic ya dig?

3) Again, make sure i can dupe all my gear and crash zones at will, gotta be 100% classic, no room for anyone to make intelligent choices on what is or is not healthy for the server amirite?

4) You're really really fucking dumb.

5) That you even think pets are an issue at the high end is mind boggling. Seriously, how bad are you? You think root is going to land once people have gear? You expect GMs to make custom items based upon your droolcup retard views on how the server will pan out?

6) Egg shaped pumice... cheaper and better at removing dots, add strategy how?

7) Yes, because any competent player, which you've again clearly displayed that you are not, will have instaclicks to stop that scenario from happening. Clearly what you'd prefer is having monk/rogue/sk rule the server killing anyone/anything with bags full of egg shaped. Let me know how much you enjoy playing a bard when any sk with half a brain figures out he can just click it every 3 seconds when your selos lands and autoattacks you to death.

8) It's buggy now, but guess what? It's beta. Deal with it. GMs are fixing it as they go along on their free time.

9) You're the guy who posted about how experience was too slow on beta while playing a bard. Once you're level 2 you can straight up ding lvl 10 in one pull.

You're that bad.

[Gnar]

7. Nullify Magic pumice is in fact more stupid because it has 5 charges, is super CHEAP, and you can have as MANY as you want. So let me get this straight, you guys would rather have a bard cast x10 nullify magics on you on the run rather than one pillage enchantment? Dumb much?


no wonder you have a shit reputation and get pooped on every box rev.

[Darksinga]

1) You're a moron, plat is ridiculously easy to get on p99, anyone who cares can have 1000s by lvl 10.

5) That you even think pets are an issue at the high end is mind boggling. Seriously, how bad are you? You think root is going to land once people have gear? You expect GMs to make custom items based upon your droolcup retard views on how the server will pan out?

6) Egg shaped pumice... cheaper and better at removing dots, add strategy how?

7) Yes, because any competent player, which you've again clearly displayed that you are not, will have instaclicks to stop that scenario from happening. Clearly what you'd prefer is having monk/rogue/sk rule the server killing anyone/anything with bags full of egg shaped. Let me know how much you enjoy playing a bard when any sk with half a brain figures out he can just click it every 3 seconds when your selos lands and autoattacks you to death.



1. If you have 1000s of plat at level 10, GMs should have you under the radar.

5. Pet's aren't a problem at high end, but considering it will take the average player at least a month to get 50, we're obviously not talking about high end.

6. I was stating that IF it was ONE charge then you'd have to use strategy in determining when you want to blow your pell. For instance, if you get heat blooded and cast pell on yourself, your gonna get hit with a few more dots immediately after and won't have dispell.

7. If you actually read you'd see that I said make it one charge/lore, how will they spam pell on me?

[Darksinga]

no wonder you have a shit reputation and get pooped on every box rev.


Who are you?

And I've been in the top guild on every pvp box that I've played. I was one of the guys who started Heresy on Daxum Box 1.0 and we destroyed every other guild.

Only other box I played on VZTZ was I think 2.0 and that was very briefly, had lambent gear when Kunark was out so that says a lot.


PS, didn't realize shit reputation meant being in the top 5 on pvp leaderboards as a bard. Hmm.

[Combobreaker]

Why not keep pumices in, but price them accordingly?

[Bockscar]

I'm in favor of keeping things as simple as possible. Making up new mechanics for broken stuff is not as simple as removing broken stuff. Removing egg pumice is kinda half-classic because they were removed fairly early on live. Making them lore, one charge, super expensive or neon green is far less classic.

[Rust1d?]

Will sow pots be makable?

[Mardur]

1. If you have 1000s of plat at level 10, GMs should have you under the radar.

On beta, my mage had about 100 plat by level 10 and that was from exp mobs, wasn't even really farming for cash. That would have been over 1000 plat with 10x less exp.

A level 4 enchanter can run stein of moggok 3 times and have over 1000 plat.

I'm sorry you're bad.

Will sow pots be makable?

Yup.

[Envious]

Lethdar and Co. just want pumice out of the game so they can farm more pixels (Golem Wands), then get raid buffed, and go around ganking fools 6v2.

Imo, pumice makes the shit more fair.
Guy with raid buffs jumps you. Roots pet, DoTs you. You blow 1 pumice ripping snare off pet, DoT off yourself. Then 2 or 3 more on him. Suddenly its even, you vs him w/o any buffs.

God forbid people have to change their games accordingly.

[Harrison]

It's pretty generally accepted that instant pumice ruins pvp, and that's why they were removed.

[Vohl]

From the lively discussion, it's pretty apparent in this thread that it isn't generally accepted.

[Envious]

From the lively discussion, it's pretty apparent in this thread that it isn't generally accepted.

Generally accepted has nothing to do with whether or not it should be in game~

Bending to the will of forum trolls does not improve gameplay.

[Vohl]

Actually, I think we're on the same side, Envious. I was (badly) stating that pumice ruining pvp wasn't generally accepted.

[Chronoburn]

Siding with the trolls, insta-cast pumice pels are lame.

[Vohl]

I'd invite GMs to host some duels between PCs of various classes both with and without either variety of pumice to get an objective feel for how this affects PvP balance. My own belief is that it makes the PvP game far more level, and therefore fun, for PCs without mana bars and channeling skill. PCs who use blue kool aid can still nuke, debuff and DoT using poison and disease effects. The primary use of this item is 1) Stripping off root and snare effects that completely screw over melee classes; and 2) Stripping off SoW, allowing melee characters to actually close and attack.

Casters can still re-buff SoW, use jboots, etc. to renew movement buffs, as well as spam low level root and snare spells. They simply won't lead to an easy win as they currently do against melee classes.

Also keep in mind that resist gear and weapons available in Kunark will never be available on red99. Fungi and T-Staff and Epic PvP tactics will never enter play.

[georgie]

Egg shaped has no cast time, meaning you can spam it over and over to remove all of a players buffs and there's nothing they can do about it. See a bard outdoors? Remove all his buffs then click it once every 3 seconds when selos refreshes and melee him down. Pretty awesome when rogues who know what they're doing will kick the ass of bards in outdoor zones amirite? Very popular with brain dead morons.

Crystalized has a 3 second cast time. This still gives you the option of dispelling dots on yourself and allows you to dispell players, but is somewhat counterable should you go through the effort of getting instant cast junk buffs. There's also several more complexities that are added in via pumice/buff management and intelligent play that stems from using these that rewards good players and punishes bad ones (Lachius, Darksinga).

isn't there a golem wand or some shit that does the same

[lethdar]

I'd invite GMs to host some duels between PCs of various classes both with and without either variety of pumice to get an objective feel for how this affects PvP balance. My own belief is that it makes the PvP game far more level, and therefore fun, for PCs without mana bars and channeling skill. PCs who use blue kool aid can still nuke, debuff and DoT using poison and disease effects. The primary use of this item is 1) Stripping off root and snare effects that completely screw over melee classes; and 2) Stripping off SoW, allowing melee characters to actually close and attack.

Casters can still re-buff SoW, use jboots, etc. to renew movement buffs, as well as spam low level root and snare spells. They simply won't lead to an easy win as they currently do against melee classes.

Also keep in mind that resist gear and weapons available in Kunark will never be available on red99. Fungi and T-Staff and Epic PvP tactics will never enter play.

This poster has never played everquest on a pvp server. This little thing called resist gear is what allows melee to close and attack, you're not suppose to wear your pve gear in pvp bro.

ps, stop making the erroneous assumption that melee are gimped on classic pvp servers. Melee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Casters for group fights, guild fights, and even solo even at max preplanar gear. Shit man, look at vztz where MR based CC spells landed at a much higher rate than they will here. Despite all the bitching by mippo, wehrmacht, etc, guess what guilds won fights for vox, naggy, etc. It wasn't the guild of druids and mages, it was the melee heavy rape trains in resist gear (just like on live).

Your arguments involving melee needing instant pumice or only applicable towards people who are:

a) retards that refuse to bank their hero bracers because they think ac is more important that 7mr (insert x piece of pve gear for y piece of resist gear).

b) retards that think because at early levels pure melee have a rough time fighting casters with CC they should allow items in that completely break pvp

c) and retards like lachius who know that they only way they can compete is by100% stripping off opponents buffs so that they can hope for a 1 shot lavabolt kill or a double attack and harm touch.

[lethdar]

1. If you have 1000s of plat at level 10, GMs should have you under the radar.

5. Pet's aren't a problem at high end, but considering it will take the average player at least a month to get 50, we're obviously not talking about high end.

6. I was stating that IF it was ONE charge then you'd have to use strategy in determining when you want to blow your pell. For instance, if you get heat blooded and cast pell on yourself, your gonna get hit with a few more dots immediately after and won't have dispell.

7. If you actually read you'd see that I said make it one charge/lore, how will they spam pell on me?

1) Everquest isn't hard, im sorry you think it is, platinum is easy to farm on p99.

5) Instill doubt, intimidate, blind, root, snare, fear, farming resist gear to the point of ignoring them, etc etc etc. Pets are trash, breaking pvp because lvl 20 naked pure melee have a hard time against a root pet? Good logic.

6) Won't have dispell... because crystalized pumice vanishes?

7) Congratulations on agreeing with me that egg shaped is OP btw, though I am again stunned at your arrogance in thinking that GM's should introduce a completely custom item that has no history in everquest and is also easy to abuse rather than just eliminate the problem.

[tmoneynegro]

Shit man, look at vztz where MR based CC spells landed at a much higher rate than they will here. Despite all the bitching by mippo, wehrmacht, etc, guess what guilds won fights for vox, naggy, etc. It wasn't the guild of druids and mages, it was the melee heavy rape trains in resist gear (just like on live).

Many people such as myself don't want to play on a "forced grouping" server that rewards anyone walking around in a group attacking solo players with free kills. This is what happens when you let MR spells land with ease.

Your example above is a poor example of game balance because you're talking about fighting in shoebox size battlefields like the entrance of permafrost or tiny halls in SolB. If casters were actually good in that situation, they would probably be extremely overpowered in all other situations.

If you fight some place like fear or dreadlands, you'll be chasing around levitating casters for hours and never kill them. Balancing the game around where specific pieces of loot are just doesn't work.

[SoulLeech]

Hilarious thread.

All these bullshit propped up arguments and boasts of balance, skill, tactics and what was or wasn't intended as if EQ PVP was some thoughtful, finely tuned, precision shit to be proud of and not a damn "Friendly Fire: ON" flag in a PVE game.

Fact is, just about every damn thing anyone considers skillful about EQ PVP is just an exploitation of or another broken aspect of the game.

The argument divides along the lines of whichever set of nonsense one group or another is most comfortable exploiting and few have the objectivity to admit that.

[Sorath]

there are evil forces at work in this thread....

[dogbarf]

Mods should ban anyone who thinks Eggshape pumice, Fear, or charm should be usable in pvp. These people are either trolling or full retard.

[Zalaerian]

raid buffed, and go around ganking fools 6v2.

I also plan having full shaman alch buffs good sir.

If you guys even think for a second that casters will be able to compete at 50 in any form of group PvP just shows how clueless and ignorant you are to the melee assist rape train.

If you fight some place like fear or dreadlands, you'll be chasing around levitating casters for hours and never kill them. Balancing the game around where specific pieces of loot are just doesn't work.

1) Like our melee wont be lev'd + targets getting spam dispelled. 2) Outside a rare channel that a wiz gets off, caster damage is a joke.

[Envious]

Hilarious thread.

All these bullshit propped up arguments and boasts of balance, skill, tactics and what was or wasn't intended as if EQ PVP was some thoughtful, finely tuned, precision shit to be proud of and not a damn "Friendly Fire: ON" flag in a PVE game.

Fact is, just about every damn thing anyone considers skillful about EQ PVP is just an exploitation of or another broken aspect of the game.

The argument divides along the lines of whichever set of nonsense one group or another is most comfortable exploiting and few are have the objectivity to admit that.

[Envious]

A few things are obvious.

1. Lethdar has not casted many bolt spells on this server.

2. Some people are going to need to figure out a way for target rings. (Melee assist train harder without knowing which of the 30 is target).

3. Chasing someone levi'd, with movement buffs and expecting spam dispels is making the assumption of (X+1) vs. 1.

4. I just want some classic PvP. You want a box tailoring to crying to GMs when shut isn't what you want (training), and a way to maintain a gap over most if not all players (hours invested for wand vs buying off vendor).

And before you go retard, no, it's not a FPS, time invested = advantage. I just want the old school advantages, you want VZ/TZ + Rogean coding. Again, part of, if not all, the greatness of EQ PvP is how open and abusable it is.

Dunno WTF you are even arguing this anymore, fairly certain it's been stated by Rogean as not going to be on server.

Unwad your panties, wash the sand from your vagina. It's all ok.

[Envious]

About #2, forgot most of your melees will be using /stick. So nix that one.

[SoulLeech]

1) You're a moron, plat is ridiculously easy to get on p99, anyone who cares can have 1000s by lvl 10.

2) Prenerf treant fists must be added for classic immersion sake! Also, every dupe that existed at the time. Got be 100% classic ya dig?

3) Again, make sure i can dupe all my gear and crash zones at will, gotta be 100% classic, no room for anyone to make intelligent choices on what is or is not healthy for the server amirite?

4) You're really really fucking dumb.

5) That you even think pets are an issue at the high end is mind boggling. Seriously, how bad are you? You think root is going to land once people have gear? You expect GMs to make custom items based upon your droolcup retard views on how the server will pan out?

6) Egg shaped pumice... cheaper and better at removing dots, add strategy how?

7) Yes, because any competent player, which you've again clearly displayed that you are not, will have instaclicks to stop that scenario from happening. Clearly what you'd prefer is having monk/rogue/sk rule the server killing anyone/anything with bags full of egg shaped. Let me know how much you enjoy playing a bard when any sk with half a brain figures out he can just click it every 3 seconds when your selos lands and autoattacks you to death.

8) It's buggy now, but guess what? It's beta. Deal with it. GMs are fixing it as they go along on their free time.

9) You're the guy who posted about how experience was too slow on beta while playing a bard. Once you're level 2 you can straight up ding lvl 10 in one pull.

You're that bad.

http://i.imgur.com/lXQ5Z.jpg

[Knuckle]

http://i.imgur.com/lXQ5Z.jpg

EQ SO HARD ROOTED HALP
PLZ ADD EGG SHAPED PUMICE SO ROOT GOWAY

[fiegi]

Envious has quite a few Ian Ziering qualities to himself

[Envious]

EQ too yard with egg shaped pumice, don't make my buffs and roots go away!

Pretend it's caps locked.

LAN zeirings? You posting from a phone too?

[Scribbles]

haha are ppl actually trying to seriously argue that egg shaped pumice should be in?? u ppl dum?

[Nirgon]

VZ/TZ + Rogean coding


We shall call the server "VZTZ 2012 Custom Classic".

[fiegi]

EQ too yard with egg shaped pumice, don't make my buffs and roots go away!

Pretend it's caps locked.

LAN zeirings? You posting from a phone too?

nope.

ian ziering.

[Envious]

Scribbles, I almost always argue as the devils advocate. It was classic, part of the PvP experience for all those that played classic EQ. I think the server should emulate the classic experience as closely as possible. And should not deviate from that.

I looked up the Ian Zeiring guy, still don't get it. Lol

So, what's the point? Rogean has already spoken on this. Unless he posts something otherwise, egg shaped won't be in game. Just golem / red wood / PoF wands. Cause those are legit for the PvPs.

[Vohl]

This poster has never played everquest on a pvp server. This little thing called resist gear is what allows melee to close and attack, you're not suppose to wear your pve gear in pvp bro.

ps, stop making the erroneous assumption that melee are gimped on classic pvp servers. Melee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Casters for group fights, guild fights, and even solo even at max preplanar gear. Shit man, look at vztz where MR based CC spells landed at a much higher rate than they will here. Despite all the bitching by mippo, wehrmacht, etc, guess what guilds won fights for vox, naggy, etc. It wasn't the guild of druids and mages, it was the melee heavy rape trains in resist gear (just like on live).

Your arguments involving melee needing instant pumice or only applicable towards people who are:

a) retards that refuse to bank their hero bracers because they think ac is more important that 7mr (insert x piece of pve gear for y piece of resist gear).

b) retards that think because at early levels pure melee have a rough time fighting casters with CC they should allow items in that completely break pvp

c) and retards like lachius who know that they only way they can compete is by100% stripping off opponents buffs so that they can hope for a 1 shot lavabolt kill or a double attack and harm touch.

None of the discussion here is the least bit objective. I'd like to see some actual testing in PvP settings to see whether this stuff breaks EQ as badly as some claim. It is undeniably classic content, much like manastones. People debating that it shouldn't be included because it "breaks pvp" are conveniently ignoring the fact that it's already broken. The question is, is it better with egg-shaped pumice?

Answering that objectively will require DM help -- at least making the item available in beta.

[Envious]

The question is not if it breaks PvP.

The only relevant ones are:
Is it classic?
Will it help or hurt pop?


The second question is debatable. The first is not.

[Sorath]

pumice stone eq2


http://eq2.zam.com/db/item.html?eq2item=4287eb4ad813e4898d7f40f03b4f1ea3

[Xantille]

As someone whose been the main assist during PDM mass pvp on TZ, and emperor of all iterations of VZTZ, I can safely say you do not want egg shaped pumice in the game, regardless of how classic it is. Unless you want melees to run high end mass PVP more than they already do, this is not a good idea. People will die instantly.

At least with golem wands, the camp itself is a bottleneck that encourages PVP, and they are rare as shit. Insta pumice buyable off vendors is not remotely the same.

PS how did Envious/Lachius get circumcised? Someone punched his sister in the jaw.

[Envious]

As someone whose been the main assist during PDM mass pvp on TZ, and emperor of all iterations of VZTZ, I can safely say you do not want egg shaped pumice in the game, regardless of how classic it is. Unless you want melees to run high end mass PVP more than they already do, this is not a good idea. People will die instantly.

At least with golem wands, the camp itself is a bottleneck that encourages PVP, and they are rare as shit. Insta pumice buyable off vendors is not remotely the same.

PS how did Envious/Lachius get circumcised? Someone punched his sister in the jaw.

The warrior that is behind the monks in tank order has spoken. Don't mind he was lower than MoZ in classic EQ.

As for my sister, hard to circumcise with only gums.

[Harrison]

I don't even know who Xantille is and his opinion is already worth more than yours on this, Envious lol

[Envious]

I don't even know who Xantille is and his opinion is already worth more than yours on this, Envious lol

Your fat.

Xantille is the Lane Kiffin of Everquest.

[Sarkov]

Oh cool, didn't know we were removing things that were classic just because we don't like them.

Can we get rid of hybrid & race XP penalties too?

Oh and we should add Jedi as a new custom class, that would be totally sweet. *wrrrrr**lightsaber noise**wrrrrr* Can you imagine it? I have *such* a boner right now. This new custom content emu server is going to be awesome!

[fiegi]

Your fat.

Xantille is the Lane Kiffin of Everquest.

Are you calling my pal a sleeze ball ?????????

[Amuk]

If rogean gets trolled into keeping insta pumice in that'll be pretty funny.

[Harrison]

Oh cool, didn't know we were removing things that were classic just because we don't like them.

Can we get rid of hybrid & race XP penalties too?

Oh and we should add Jedi as a new custom class, that would be totally sweet. *wrrrrr**lightsaber noise**wrrrrr* Can you imagine it? I have *such* a boner right now. This new custom content emu server is going to be awesome!

By your, ahem, reasoning...

Rogues should be able to pickpocket dragons clean.
Fish rolls should sell for more than it costs to make them from 100% vendor sold materials.
etc. etc.

Classic != 100% right

And....shut the fuck up.

[Sorath]

I don't even know who Xantille is and his opinion is already worth more than yours on this, Envious lol

[Nirgon]

What is that on the right sir

[Sorath]

some sort of blue ant species I just created lol basically hahahaah basically

[Knuckle]

someone stab this motherfucker

[Bockscar]

Anything that was changed on live within the scope of this server's lifespan (i.e up to and including Velious) should be fair game if it obviously helps PvP. They don't need to make very many of these changes, it's not as if the game won't be recognizably classic. If they take minor liberties with just the few things that are truly horribly broken, such as unlimited insta-pumice and charming/fearing players, it can only benefit the server.

[Sarkov]

*Such* a slippery slope when you start trying to justify not-classic things on a classic server. I enjoy watching the mental gymnastics; it's pretty comical.

*everything up to Velious is kosher for classic now guys! as long as it helps the server!*

Yeah, too bad your opinion of what "helps" is almost never the same as anyone else's.

Is there a good argument for keeping in hybrid XP penalties other than "its classic, deal with it"? Sure sounds like a fine reply to removing egg-shaped pumice too. Lets try it.

"Its classic, deal with it."

I'm all for sticking to the timeline and removing pumice around the time Kunark rolls out. I don't think there's defensible logic to any other course of action that doesn't also justify a whole slew of other changes.

[Harrison]

I partially agree with you. Experience penalties and bonuses are a bug, and admittedly so by Verant. But, that will not be changed here and has been stated countless times.

Comparing instacast pumice to experience penalties is a laughable exercise though. Don't do it.

[Amuk]

I feel blessed when intellectuals like Sarkov and Rust1d share their wisdom.

[Sarkov]

To be clear - I am not actually arguing in favor of doing away with hybrid/race xp penalties. I am saying that the logic used to justify removing egg-shaped pumice before it was removed in the classic timeline could also justify a lot of other changes, including removing the hybrid/race xp penalties.

The only "logic" I can see to defend one and not the other is "overlord rogean wants it that way." Well, fine. Can't really argue that point. But lets not try to pretend we are being anything other than hypocrites supporting that view.

<3 Amuk

[lethdar]

To be clear - I am not actually arguing in favor of doing away with hybrid/race xp penalties. I am saying that the logic used to justify removing egg-shaped pumice before it was removed in the classic timeline could also justify a lot of other changes, including removing the hybrid/race xp penalties.

The only "logic" I can see to defend one and not the other is "overlord rogean wants it that way." Well, fine. Can't really argue that point. But lets not try to pretend we are being anything other than hypocrites supporting that view.

<3 Amuk

Pretty sure you're being hypocritical bro, I don't see you clamoring for rogues to pickpocket dragons clean, dragons to suicide when attacked, monks soloing planes with broken treant fists, and all of the classic dupes to be in game. All of that is 100% classic as well, which was fixed later. Should these game breaking things be in as well?

[Sarkov]

bugs != features. Or, did you think it was a bug that pumice was on vendors?

(I am for 100% of classic features to be implemented btw)

[Harrison]

Okay guys.

Treant fists going in
Fish rolls sell for more than they cost to make
Pickpocket dragons, camps in every zone, etc. clean
Train planes with a level 5 bard

[Sarkov]

Yes. A rational discussion of what constitutes a bug and what constitutes a feature is impossible.

"Reduce debate to the level of shouted rage".

[Amuk]

This isn't jew logic class. If you can't understand what a group of melee can do with instant pumice assist training people with 0 buffs, even spamming selos/jboots over and over, then GTFO the thread fag. Original timeline or not is fucking insignificant, they found extremely broken items and removed them - only a FUCKING RETARD would put them back in just to follow a timeline.

[Lasher]

Didnt Abashi nerf pumice and say it wasnt intended for it to be that powerful

[Vohl]

Offensive junk.

Learn the difference between discussion and RnF.

[Amuk]

The kid was comparing hybrid exp penalties to instant dispell pumices, pretty sure it wasn't a discussion just someone trolling the original timeline bullshit argument again, if you're that easily offended then GL pal btw.

[Nirgon]

Hence the abashi rod from tov.

[tmoneynegro]

I have to agree that since the server is in fact going to Velious, there is no conflict of interests by implementing PvP fixes up to that expansion.

[Vohl]

The kid was comparing hybrid exp penalties to instant dispell pumices, pretty sure it wasn't a discussion just someone trolling the original timeline bullshit argument again, if you're that easily offended then GL pal btw.

I can weather name calling just fine. Keep your trashy hatred of jews and gays in RnF.

[Juugox2]

lol i noticed 90% of the server crys alot

[Palemoon]

I have to agree that since the server is in fact going to Velious, there is no conflict of interests by implementing PvP fixes up to that expansion.

I kinda agree. No need to start off with grossly broken pvp mechanics.

[lindz]

I dislike the picking and choosing of which mechanics are classic enough and what they decide to do away with. I understand getting rid of bugs (things that were never meant to be in the game and are harmful to the playerbase) but the server is supposed to be classic, not custom. Keep it that way. If the range they want to use is straight up classic through Velious, fine. If it is just classic and they nerf/change things when expansions are released, cool. Just stick with one method and don't make a custom server.

[Sniperfire]

Who are you?

And I've been in the top guild on every pvp box that I've played. I was one of the guys who started Heresy on Daxum Box 1.0 and we destroyed every other guild.

Only other box I played on VZTZ was I think 2.0 and that was very briefly, had lambent gear when Kunark was out so that says a lot.


PS, didn't realize shit reputation meant being in the top 5 on pvp leaderboards as a bard. Hmm.


confirmed keyboard turner and alt tabber in pvp

[fiegi]

confirmed keyboard turner and alt tabber in pvp

lol

[SoulLeech]

Pretty sure you're being hypocritical bro, I don't see you clamoring for rogues to pickpocket dragons clean, dragons to suicide when attacked, monks soloing planes with broken treant fists, and all of the classic dupes to be in game. All of that is 100% classic as well, which was fixed later. Should these game breaking things be in as well?

Continuum fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuum_fallacy).

[Sarkov]

I can respect the pov of "server will go to velious, so net-positive feature changes up to that point can go in at launch". That same logic probably justifies things like temple of sol ro, removal of manastone/guise etc, but at least you leave yourself the out of qualifying things as a "net-positive." Unambiguously not a classic server at that point, but at least there is some defensible logic behind your proposed changes.

For my part, pvp in EQ is so grossly imbalanced that I don't really care whether we have pumice for a few months. The vast majority of pvp during classic is either going to be large-scale guild v guild "territory control", for which I hardly think pumice is game-breaking (since golem wands will be in, you arent exactly championing dispels as the purview of enchanters or anything like that), or gank-squads rolling around killing people 8 levels lower than them, again for which pumice makes effectively no difference.

[Gnar]

Who are you?

And I've been in the top guild on every pvp box that I've played. I was one of the guys who started Heresy on Daxum Box 1.0 and we destroyed every other guild.

Only other box I played on VZTZ was I think 2.0 and that was very briefly, had lambent gear when Kunark was out so that says a lot.


PS, didn't realize shit reputation meant being in the top 5 on pvp leaderboards as a bard. Hmm.

Thanks sniperfire for reminding me about his awful videos. All you basically said here was that you played 2 boxes (there were only three) and only one of those you were in the top guild, Heresy 1.0. Guess who else was? Skunky and crew,lol. Heresy 1.0 was full of shit players and it means nothing. I was also in that guild and in Undisputed before we formed heresy. Everyone decent from heresy formed up with my guild No Homo, and we became the top guild on the server, and the best Emu PVP has ever seen / will see. We called ourselves the dream team for said reasons. The Dream Team members,whatever we end up calling ourselves will dominate red99. That is all. You are shit.

[Sarkov]

There are people who play pvp servers to roll hard and smoke bitches, and there are people who play pvp servers because they like disputes between raid guilds to be settled by large-scale pvp instead of crying to GMs.

I dont think these two sides understand each other very well :(

[Cymbal]

I gotta agree with lethdar on this one.

I also gotta say there needs to be a casting time placed golem metal rod. I dont care if u have to farm them. I dont care if they are more expensive to recharge. Fact = there will be tons of them and they are way worse than egg shaped pumice. Your also making the enc more obselete bc that spell is their specialty.

[Silikten]

Thanks sniperfire for reminding me about his awful videos. All you basically said here was that you played 2 boxes (there were only three) and only one of those you were in the top guild, Heresy 1.0. Guess who else was? Skunky and crew,lol. Heresy 1.0 was full of shit players and it means nothing. I was also in that guild and in Undisputed before we formed heresy. Everyone decent from heresy formed up with my guild No Homo, and we became the top guild on the server, and the best Emu PVP has ever seen / will see. We called ourselves the dream team for said reasons. The Dream Team members,whatever we end up calling ourselves will dominate red99. That is all. You are shit.

Hah, you aren't that good Gnar lol. The "Dream Team" was Me, Xant, HPT, Bribo, and Harazz. That was, and is, the best group that ever played the box, period.

Your so called "Dream Team" was probably 1-3 good players that called the shots and the rest (people like you) just assist and look good. If you claim you were a shot caller, i feel really bad for that guild.

I can't wait til this box goes live and you guys actually get competitive fights and begin to realize that you aren't really that good.

[Dontmez_Mebro]

I can't wait till some of you figure out being the best at EQ isn't a life accomplishment and commit seppuku to save face.

[Silikten]

seppuku (sɛˈpuːkuː)— n another word for hara-kiri
[from Japanese, to cut + bowels]


Btw, I'm not all about boasting, but some people just really suck and think they are good. That's when I need to intervene. Not saying I am good, but I don't suck. I just need to say, "look, you really aren't any good" to those who think they are (Gnar, and most of that "basketball" team).

[Envious]

Lol Gnar.

GSG was prolly the best PvP guild on any of the VZ/TZ boxes.

Harazz was not that good, he rode Bribo's (Touch) coat tails.

The CN crew was the best to grace the VZ/TZ box by far, problem is in the few weeks they played they had found so many exploits they all quit. Like having 30k plat by lvl 12 etc etc.

You guys are so cute. Silikten, you cant ever claim skill playing an SK. Sorry. =/

[Chronoburn]

you cant ever claim skill playing an SK.

What class takes skill?

[Scribbles]

cleric

[Scribbles]

also silikt10 was a goog ranger and an eh wizard

[Envious]

Eh... maybe a good jousting rogue? Lol

Bard is kind of rough.

Enchanter.

Most classes are: assist key, melee on / pet attack + spam nuke.

I think jousting rogue, bard, and enchanter would be the only real skill classes.

[Chronoburn]

I was just curious because I played rogue/bard on live and I want an ez mode class this time around! Hope my selection of SK or shaman will pan out.

[lethdar]

chronarrrrrr

[Sarkov]

You probably notice the difference between a good player and an average one most for Bard and Cleric, but all classes have some pretty substantial skill checks. General stuff that applies to being a good pvper of any class (buff slots/clickies, dispels/cures, resist gear, crimson pots, situational awareness, ability to follow/assist, etc), and a lot of class specific stuff.

Pet control in particular stands out as an area where average players are outclassed by good ones, both keeping your own pet free of cc and controlling other players' pets.

Jousting (really just minimizing the amount you get hit vs. the amount you hit them) is another obvious one applicable to any melee, as is disc usage once Kunark rolls around.

[lethdar]

You probably notice the difference between a good player and an average one most for Bard and Cleric, but all classes have some pretty substantial skill checks. General stuff that applies to being a good pvper of any class (buff slots/clickies, dispels/cures, resist gear, crimson pots, situational awareness, ability to follow/assist, etc), and a lot of class specific stuff.

Pet control in particular stands out as an area where average players are outclassed by good ones, both keeping your own pet free of cc and controlling other players' pets.

Jousting (really just minimizing the amount you get hit vs. the amount you hit them) is another obvious one applicable to any melee, as is disc usage once Kunark rolls around.

Was about to type out something similar, but may as well just quote and be lazy!

But yeah, it's extremely obvious when a bard is terrible, and in many situations pet classes as well. Bad bards (see dojii) get owned very early on in any group encounter or panic when they're targeted and run off, leaving the rest of their group to get mowed down without selos. Bad mages don't stack their pets buffs and remove CC properly, getting terribly owned (see, envious).

[Chronoburn]

chronarrrrrr
Beast Bard.

[Scribbles]

ranger aka pumicebot